Best Place To BuildThe year 2025 from the Best Place to Build Podcast! Revisiting your favourite moments! | BP2B S2E16
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
50 min read · 9,663 words- 0:00 – 0:48
Intro
- SHSharan
failure and the ability to handle failure. What do I mean by that? Let me split it into two parts.
- SPSpeaker
Wear that failure proudly, and go forth.
- SPSpeaker
We are the world's only satellite company that's mixing what's called the synthetic aperture radar.
- SPSpeaker
And you're mentioning them because Google were PhD students who-
- SPSpeaker
Yeah, so we, we are- we were in the same, uh, co- cohort, uh, in the, in the computer science program with Sergey and Larry and all that.
- SPSpeaker
I think this is around, uh, school time. Uh, I think I got dumped by my girlfriend back then, and I was very angry, and obviously the next logical thing to do is-
- SPSpeaker
If there's a counseling that's done right when students come in to tell them that, "Look, you were sold a lie." [chuckles]
- SPSpeaker
Half-truth.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah, a half-truth.
- SHSharan
So always put the sails out and wait. Wind may come, may not come. How does that matter?
- 0:48 – 1:19
Year-end recap setup: why this is a highlights episode
- SPSpeaker
Welcome to the Best Place to Build Podcast. Today is the last episode for the year 2025, and as you can see, there is no guest. Our plan for today is to take you through some of the best moments, as per us, of the podcast of the last year. One of the first few episodes we did was with Professor Ravindran, and [chuckles] early on, uh, in the episode, I tell him the story about how we gave him a Best Place to Build sticker, and he immediately ripped it off and put it on his laptop, which was, you know, quite cool. And, um, [chuckles] Professor
- 1:19 – 1:33
Prof. Ravindran cameo: the sticker moment and IITM pride
- SPSpeaker
R- Ravindran recounts it in that episode and says, "Yeah, of course. What else will I do?"
- SPSpeaker
I remember that I had given you the Best Place to Build sticker that day, and you immediately put it on your, uh, laptop.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
Yes. That was amazing.
- SHSharan
Because I strongly believe that this is the best place to build.
- 1:33 – 3:39
Prof. Sathya (Aerospace): choosing technical depth over “low attention” assumptions
- SPSpeaker
Immediately after, I think we met Professor Sathya from the Aerospace Department. And I have a note here. Um, at the time, we were very early in that podcast and, um, we were also trying to figure out how much do people want to listen to, and, you know, this is the low-attention generation. So should we keep it very light? Should we keep it more conversational, or should we actually go into the technical depth? And I think in Professor Sathya's episode, he goes in. He doesn't sugarcoat it, he just goes in. He- whether it's the economics of what he's doing or the technology of what he's doing, or the battery of what he's doing, or bunch of other things, he just, um, got into it, and I appreciated that. He didn't treat me like, um, a podcast host, [chuckles] and he didn't treat you like the podcast audience.
- SPSpeaker
And the tech is, you know, crafted for the best business case. That's a, that's a, that's a paradigm. So, uh, if you look at Galaxay, we are the world's only satellite company that's mixing what's called the synthetic aperture radar, that can cut through cloud cover or image during nighttime when there is no solar illumination, as well as a, a multispectral or a hyperspectral camera that will image in the visible spectrum that our eyes can see, and juxtapose them, uh, with deep learning algorithms to figure out if I don't have the illumination or if I'm seeing through cloud cover and there is an obscuration of the visible spectrum camera, um, how can I actually render the, uh, SAR images as if they are visible?
- SPSpeaker
He assumed that we are science-curious, which is what I think this podcast is about and our relations is about. I'm science-curious, I'm curious about technology, and I assume that you are. Uh, and that's why we listen to these things. We listen to these entrepreneurs or these builders talking about their work. That sort of set the tone. Every podcast after that was, "Let's go into the technical depth of it. Let's go into what you're doing, and let's not assume that this is a low-attention generation." Sharan's episode. So Sharan's episode kind of was
- 3:39 – 4:39
Sharan on building chips: ‘you have to be crazy to build silicon’
- SPSpeaker
one of the first episodes that got a lot of views for us. Um, while recording it, we didn't think that it will. Uh, some key moments in that episode was very interesting. He- at one point, he says, "You have to be crazy to build silicon." I agree, by the way. [chuckles] But he says it very candidly, and he's smiling and he's laughing. And that was a recurring theme later also that, of course we are building crazy, difficult things, and that's why we are doing it. Um, and Sharan said it so beautifully.
- SHSharan
See, making silicon is hard.
- SPSpeaker
Okay.
- SHSharan
You have to be a special, uh, grade of mental-
- SPSpeaker
[chuckles]
- SHSharan
... to, to be, to able, to be able to want to make silicon in today's world. Who else makes silicon? Think about it. Let's see. NVIDIA. What's their market cap again?
- SPSpeaker
[chuckles] I don't know. A few trillion dollars. Um-
- SHSharan
Largest company in the world.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SHSharan
Done. Who else makes silicon? Apple. Whole different league.
- SPSpeaker
Right.
- SHSharan
Who else makes silicon? Intel.
- 4:39 – 5:08
Sharan’s origin story: ‘It will come when you make it’ (Shakti to product)
- SPSpeaker
Uh, there's a point where he talks about why they got into it, and his, uh, PhD advisor is Professor Kamakoti, who is now our director. Um, that d- that story was also quite, quite nice.
- SHSharan
So we went to professor, who he was not yet director at that point, and we were like, "So when can we get Shakti processor as a chip?" And-
- SPSpeaker
For your, uh-
- SHSharan
Yeah
- SPSpeaker
... product that you had imagined.
- SHSharan
Exactly. And just signing a bunch of papers, and then he was like, "It will come when you make it." [laughing]
- 5:08 – 10:14
Failure as strength: Sharan’s exams, grit vs knowing when to stop
- SPSpeaker
At one point, he also talks about his personal failures, um, exams he has failed or, uh, things like that, and how failure is something that has made him a much stronger person. That, that was also really nice. [chuckles]
- SHSharan
Failure and the ability to handle failure. What do I mean by that? Let me split it into two parts. The ability to recognize failure, there are people who are extremely stubborn. Stubbornness is not a bad thing. Stubbornness will make you keep trying over and over and over and over again, and the difference between success and failure is, is one more attempt.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SHSharan
Right? So that stubbornness in that perspective, in that context, is a huge asset. But your greatest asset is also your greatest weakness. You never know when to stop. Some things are not meant to be. You just have to accept that they don't work.
- SPSpeaker
I could call them gritty people also.
- SHSharan
Yes, grinders.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SHSharan
The gaming terminology is grinding.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SHSharan
And-... grinding is good.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah. I mean, Rahul Dravid is a gritty guy.
- SHSharan
Yeah, absolutely.
- SPSpeaker
Stubbornly at his crease. [chuckles]
- SHSharan
Absolutely. I remember one cricket, one test match, where he took 92 balls to get off the mark-
- SPSpeaker
Yeah
- SHSharan
... to score one run. He scored 92, the entire stadium applauded, and he raised his bat as if he scored 400 runs.
- SPSpeaker
He weathered the storm.
- SHSharan
The ecosystem is set up to f- for you to fail safely.
- SPSpeaker
Mm.
- SHSharan
Are you willing to accept that failure?
- SPSpeaker
Right. Okay, understood.
- SHSharan
I was one of those people. I couldn't... I, I have only had two failures, uh, in my student life, and that, too, uh, it'll sound really silly, but in my eighth standard, m- my maths annual exam paper, I think, I got 59 out of 100. I hadn't got anything under 95 in any course until that point in time.
- SPSpeaker
Right.
- SHSharan
I thought I was the world's- a world-class failure.
- SPSpeaker
Class eight, it'll feel quite-
- SHSharan
Right? When I was doing my master's degree, I had this one course that was a bachelor's course.
- SPSpeaker
Where did you do your master's?
- SHSharan
Uh, ETH Zurich in Switzerland. And their system is such that you are allowed to fail in a course only once. If you fail a course twice, you are debarred from taking that course. The logic there is, it is not for you. There's a-
- SPSpeaker
... loose
- SHSharan
- whole bunch of other thing else, so you go take something else. But for me, unfortunately, it was a bachelor prerequisite course, and I had to pass it. Right? If I don't pass that course, my master's program will be canceled, and I'll be sent out of Switzerland. I'll be de- sent back to India, and my father's health was declining at that point. Guess what happened? First time, fail. Okay, and then I take, retake the exam.
- 10:14 – 11:15
Behind the scenes: the Gallaxay episode saved after a camera failure
- SPSpeaker
Yeah. Late last year, we have- we released an episode with Suyash Singh. He's the CEO of a company called Gallaxay. [chuckles] So in that episode, what happened was one of our cameras failed, and, uh, Suyash had taken a lot of trouble to come here to IIT Madras, he's Bangalore-based, to come here for the podcast, and, uh, we noticed it a little late. We have a three-camera setup, and one of our cameras sort of gave up, went away, and the editing room panic in that episode was quite intense. They go, "What do we do? We can't call the guest and tell him that, 'Look, we need to reshoot.'" At the same time, the conversation was quite good, so we had to really work hard around our constraints, and I think the editors pulled it off. We had an editor called, uh, Pracheta at the time, and he's really good. He, he was involved, um, in the conceptualization of the podcast, and, uh, ho- and the setup that we use. Um, unfortunately, he has left the team, but shout-out to Pracheta. Soon after, we had Anand Rajaram, who was the founder
- 11:15 – 13:18
Anand Rajaram (Junglee): naming a startup and the pre-Google Stanford era
- SPSpeaker
of, uh, Junglee, which he sold to Amazon, and then another company, which he sold to Walmart. So here's an entrepreneur who has sold a company to Amazon and to Walmart, and then later on, he had gone on to build, um, a bunch of other things, and, and now he's a VC, um, running this global VC fund called Rocketship VC. So we met him, and [chuckles] the most interesting part of that episode was actually a very silly part where he talks about how Junglee was named, and he says, uh... I mean, you should just hear it from him.
- SPSpeaker
So there were some potential investors, uh, that we had to pitch the next day. Um, um, and so the four of us, uh, you know, we were sitting together, and we were coming up feverishly with the, with the investor pitch, uh, at Ashish's house. Um, and, uh, but, you know, we came up with the pitch. You know, we, we had the PowerPoint slides and all that, but we didn't have a name for the company. He said, "Hey, we have to come up with a, with a name for, uh, for the company, uh, but we, we, we need one where we can- where the .com name is available, and it's a cool name," and all that stuff. Um-... and, you know, we were thinking, you know, um, what do we, you know, one of the interesting, uh, things that, uh, you know, many of them-- we tried many names because the dot-com was, was kind of taken, and it was just even, even back then, a lot of dot-com names were taken, right? So, um, so there was only one company that had been started before us, uh, by students. So y- remember, Google has not been started yet. Google started in ninety-eight, yeah?
- SPSpeaker
Right.
- SPSpeaker
After we were acquired. So there was only one-
- SPSpeaker
And, and you're mentioning them because Google were PhD students who-
- SPSpeaker
Yeah, so we, we, uh, we were in the same, uh, c- cohort, uh, in the, in the, in the computer science program with Sergey and Larry and all that. Uh, but they, they ended up starting in ninety-eight. We had started in, in ninety-six. But, but at that point, uh, no other students had started companies except for one, uh, pair of students who started Yahoo! Okay, so, uh, so Yahoo! was the one company that was ahead of us.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
Uh, right? And then was... Some- somebody remembered this, uh, song that goes: "Yahoo!
- SPSpeaker
[chuckles] Nice.
- SPSpeaker
So what comes after Yahoo!? Junglee.
- SPSpeaker
Nice.
- SPSpeaker
Right? So that is a great story.
- 13:18 – 15:52
More standout guests: cryptography passion, Cluezo branding, Swiggy coordination
- SPSpeaker
Um, maybe sometime during the beginning of this year, we, uh, we interviewed a professor called Shweta Agarwal from Computer Science. What I liked about that episode was that her passion for her work really came through. Uh, cryptography is not an easy subject for her to explain to me or to anyone, and, uh, she did a fantastic job, and we, we, we did, uh, see that the audience appreciated it. Our team was also happy about it. Um, I think almost after that, we had, uh, Prajwal, who, who is the CEO of Cluezo, young entrepreneur doing really well. I was a little surprised about that video because it didn't get as much attention as we thought it would get. We thought that, um, maybe people will want to watch younger entrepreneurs, which is why we had called him. Um, anyway, it's okay. As, uh, his company does better and better, maybe, uh, people will be more interested in what he has to say.
- SPSpeaker
Cluezo is the detective in the Pink Panther movies, if you've ever seen.
- SPSpeaker
Right. Right.
- SPSpeaker
Oh, yeah. And it also has clue in its name, 'cause we, like, give clues about your product, essentially. So, like, a lot of little things click. We liked that it was pink, and we got to stand out from, like, the general blues and all-
- SPSpeaker
Which is like OC and SAS.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah. So yeah, it kind of fit. Aakash designed the logo. It's like the little, uh, mustache-
- SPSpeaker
Right
- SPSpeaker
... it's like the detective mustache, the monocle.
- SPSpeaker
I can't even tell if he... Is he looking on, onto the logo, right?
- SPSpeaker
Yeah, he has two eyes. One of them is the magnifying glass.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
So now we've just made an animation where he winks. I really like that animation. [chuckles]
- SPSpeaker
Yeah. After that, we met Fani, who is the co-founder for Swiggy, who's a co-founder for Swiggy. So he has three co-founders. So Fani's, uh, interview went great. I mean, it, it's a good recording. I- if you haven't watched it, you should watch it. But what was interesting for us was everything that happened around the recording. Now, because Fani is part of Swiggy and a co-founder, um, and Swiggy is a listed company, we had to really work with the brand team. Because if the guest is from a really large company, uh, then the company's policies, um... The company may have policies around who can speak what, and how is the interview being channeled, and so on. So we had to reach out to the Swiggy brand team, and, and the Swiggy brand team was very cooperative, surprisingly cooperative. And, um, yeah, we got it done. It, it took a while to schedule because Fani had to come here, and, uh, somebody from his brand team also had to come here. So we had some guests from Swiggy on that day at- on set, but good interview. I'm happy. Um, at some point, we interviewed
- 15:52 – 18:24
Prof. Mohan Shankar (HTIC Brain Centre): tech must follow India’s real constraints
- SPSpeaker
Professor Mohan Shankar from HTIC Brain Centre. He's an electric engineering prof, who's done a lot of work in the last ten, fifteen years. Shockingly high amount of work. Um, at one point in his podcast, he talks about his early career, and he talks about, um, how he sort of was, uh, informed about the socioeconomic context of cataract surgery in India. Now, I know it sounds simple, but what was interesting about that, and the point he was making, is that as technocrats, we sometimes think of the technology part and sort of miss the bigger picture. Uh, and so he was talking about how the bigger picture should influence the technology more than the technology influencing the bigger pic- which, which never happens. It's, it's the context of where we live in, which, uh, requires a particular technology to solve a particular problem.
- SPSpeaker
And I still remember this conversation about, uh, two thousand and nine, ten, mm, late two thousand and nine, early two thousand and ten. Uh, I had, uh, you know, worked in US, where I was very fortunate to develop some really cool cutting-edge ophthalmic devices to restore vision in blind patients by electrically stimulating the retina, so the back of the eye. Yeah. So, you know, here I am, this young, uh, sort of idealistic, sort of naive, uh, professor. I'm in Dr. Padinath's office, and he's like: "Oh, Professor, you've done all this, uh, you know, complex medical devices. Congratulations! Uh, but do you know what are the leading causes of blindness in India?" Mm. And uh, obviously, I know where this is going, right? He's going to just literally dunk me. And, uh, I said, "Diabetic retinopathy," because, you know... He said, "No, it is refraction and cataract." Like, people are still blind with cataract. Because cataract is essentially, it's a normal aging process that happens-
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
... uh, and the lens becomes opaque. And actually, I was quite shocked that... I was actually feeling a little bit ashamed that I didn't know this, that cataract is a leading cause of blindness in India. Yeah. And then he explained it to me as to why it is, right? The cataract surgery costs in India are some of the lowest, and many of our eye institution do it at free of cost for people who cannot afford it, so the cost problem has gone away. So now it's very interesting, right? If I take the cost out, so you should be wondering, like, "Oh, where is the problem?"
- SPSpeaker
... the problem is one of access.
- 18:24 – 19:49
Building an institution: Prof. Preeti on starting IIT Zanzibar from scratch
- SPSpeaker
Then we interviewed, uh, Preeti ma'am, who was the director in charge at IIT Zanzibar, and she took us through, uh, what it takes to start up an IIT, and I found it fascinating. Like, we're talking about startups, we're talking about enterprise building. These guys are building an education institute. So how does that come about, and, uh, what laws and policy and, uh, you know, w- what, what are the infrastructure elements that had to be built? And it was fun talking to Professor Preeti. Professor Preeti is also very warm and very candid, opens up and says her mind. Very loved by her students. The first question that comes to mind is: What does it take to start a new IIT? [chuckles] Can you break it down into steps for us?
- SPSpeaker
So I think we can write a book about this. So you wanted me to break it down into steps. I think the first is for the two governments, wherever we are going, to have a very, uh, good, strong, possibly a strategic kind of bilateral relationship. That is, uh, very important. Nothing would happen without that. And the second would be that, uh... and of course, IIT Madras always raises its hand first for all these things, want to do this, want to pick up on this, uh, challenge and go over there, and you have to set up everything from scratch, right? Every chair, every blackboard, every single student, faculty, that is their staff member, etcetera.
- 19:49 – 21:31
Srinath (Agnikul): storytelling, luck, and ‘put up the sails’
- SPSpeaker
We had the episode with Srinath from Agnikul. Um, his company makes rockets that go to space. Um, I- what I liked about that episode is that you meet Srinath, and you think about, um... We have this ima- image of engineering company heads and CEOs being, um, very, uh, technical, but he's such a good storyteller, so I think that really came across, a bunch of stories he told a- around his own journey, and why Agnikul exists, and what is the problem they're trying to solve. So it is all really good. Very, um, very good storyteller, CEO of an engineering firm.
- SPSpeaker
So when my... all my bosses in Wall Street were very rich, right? And, uh, they used to go sailing, right? And they used to tell me this general thing, not about life and all, but what sailing like: You always put up the sails, wait for the wind. That wind is that luck element, right? It will come. It will blow. You can't control the wind. It'll blow, but if your sails are not up, you'll lose the opportunity, right? So all you can do is put up the sails. I literally heard this exact story from, uh... and he's still a very close mentor of mine, and I- whenever I go to New York, I still visit him. Like, uh, he literally did that [chuckles] like, because he used to sail, and I, I didn't make enough money to go sailing. Uh, but he used to tell me this as in something there left is like, it is almost... it's a very humbling thing, right? You're just waiting for nature to help you, but if your sails are not up, it's over. So always put the sails out and wait. Wind may come, may not come. How does that matter?
- SPSpeaker
But as you're saying this, I'm j- I'm getting goosebumps because this is literally what happened with Agnikul, right? Like, you already had your company running, and then, uh, the, the, the space sector in India opened up, and it's such a big win, right?
- SPSpeaker
Yeah, yeah. Exactly, exactly.
- 21:31 – 23:51
Student wellbeing: Sriram’s ‘Happiness, Habits, and Success’ course
- SPSpeaker
Hands down, my favorite episode was the one we shot with Sriram. Uh, Sriram is a coach, uh, and, uh, and he takes us through various things about the pressures that students are under, the pressure to perform, uh, peer pressure, family pressure, a bunch of things around how students, um, uh, what affects student life. Um, the- he also, with some collaborators, set up a course in IIT Madras called, uh, Happiness, Habits, and Success. Um, and so in that episode, he describes how that came about, why that course exists, who were his collaborators, who were the professors involved, and what is the impact that that course had. It's good to hear it from him. Um, on campus, everybody knows about the course, um, but the alumni and the, and, and general public should know more about it. I think they should be able to replicate that kind of a course in more IITs, uh, and more institutes, and it'll really benefit, uh, students who are in the grind and the moment and, uh, you know, they have all these pressures tugging them, uh, on all directions.
- SPSpeaker
This twofold reason, I would say, of pressure on campus and loneliness in campus, uh, this set up the foundation for why we started the course, Happiness, Habits, and Success, to help give students an- a foundational understanding of what happiness means and what success means, uh, and to find the habits and cultivate the habits that can make you both happy and productive at the same time. Again, research shows that, uh, the more positive-minded you are, the more of a positive outlook you have, the more likely you are to perform and outperform your peers. Uh, salesmen who had a positive outlook outperformed peers by a significant percentage. Doctors who are optimistic treat patients significantly better than pessimistic doctors. So that's the core idea, to tell students that there is a way to succeed, succeed beyond expectation, and that can also be a joyful journey-
- SPSpeaker
Sure.
- SPSpeaker
and that can be done in the company of peers, and family, and a support network.
- 23:51 – 27:40
Failure as a credential & director insights: Prof. Mahesh and Prof. Kamakoti moments
- SPSpeaker
Professor Mahesh... Professor Mahesh, of course, went on to start his own podcast, which such a good podcast, Professor Mahesh's podcast. He interviews, um, a, uh, a different kind of guest and, uh, people who are at the top of their profession, and they have a long conversation about what their- what that career looks like. Um, but we met him before he had started his podcast, and in, in that podcast with Professor Mahesh, I think one of the nicest things he spoke about was about how failure, um, how we view failure, has changed over the years, and now it's almost like a badge of honor. "Of course, I've failed. I've tried something hard, I failed. It's okay."
- SPSpeaker
There's an entrepreneurship, especially a deep tech entrepreneurship, say, engineering entrepreneurship-
- SPSpeaker
... um, avenue opening up for students?
- SPSpeaker
That is, uh, that has, that has been a dimension of the last 10 years, or maybe seven, eight years, that has completely changed the landscape for what students can do. It's a f- it's far more, I'll say, even fashionable to take a, a break from a career-driven thinking for two, three years and try a risky idea. Should that succeed, you know, you have your own launchpad into a, a world that you couldn't have gotten into without that launchpad.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
If it didn't succeed, it was... It is now extremely fashionable on one's CV to say, "I tried this startup, but failed."
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
That actually gives the person a leg up.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
So I think our biggest victory of- India's biggest victory of the last seven or eight years has been this, uh, treating of failure as a, as a credential, as a medal on your chest.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
Wear that failure proudly, and go forth and interview for a job.
- SPSpeaker
Professor Kamakoti's episode, uh, I was quite stressed about that episode. He's, of course, the director, and, um, he funds this project, [chuckles] so I didn't want to disappoint him. He's also very busy, so we had to coordinate with his office and, uh, uh, he came in, uh, maybe, um... And, and we immediately started recording. I liked about when he was talking about Suprabatham class.
- KAKamakoti
Uh, that was very early days, where we really wanted to experiment that, how early can we...? So always I believe that morning 4:00 to 8:00 is the most productive time. Your brain is fresh, provided you have slept well.
- SPSpeaker
[chuckles]
- KAKamakoti
Well, he gets to have this what we call a suprabatham slot.
- SPSpeaker
Suprabatham slot. Okay.
- KAKamakoti
And we start at 7:00 and go up to 8:00, or 6:30 to 8:00. And actually, student enjoyed. I did get good attendance in the morning.
- SPSpeaker
Nice.
- KAKamakoti
The, we, we did twice, uh, twice a week. This is sometime, somewhere in last part of the first decade, like 2010, 2011, and a little bit, 20...
- SPSpeaker
Okay, okay.
- KAKamakoti
We were experimenting that.
- SPSpeaker
Towards the end of the episode, he also talks about, um, uh, IIT Madras' NIRF ranking, and how come IIT Madras keeps hitting that NIRF number one? Uh, he does a excellent job of explaining that. Uh, as a director, I want to ask you, of course, we are talking about students working hard and getting a rank. Uh, IIT has also worked very hard and got the NIRF rank one for many years in a row. Uh, what gives, Professor? How come we end up consistently being on top?
- KAKamakoti
We are aligning ourselves with the national priorities.
- SPSpeaker
Okay.
- KAKamakoti
That's very, very important. And, um, we are constituted, we are working as a very cohesive unit, like, within the faculty, staff. We'll have... See, any, any place will have some difference of opinions-
- SPSpeaker
Yeah
- KAKamakoti
... and other things will be there. But what we do is, any such thing, we try to resolve it at the earliest, and finally come to some consensus, and everybody agrees to that consensus, and put their full heart in it, and that is a semblance of a great institution.
- 27:40 – 51:27
Late-season montage: chasing busy founders, 5G history, quirky builders, and year-end signoff
- SPSpeaker
Pratish runs a company called Sarvam, and the episode went great, and y- you should watch it if you haven't watched. It talks about sovereign AI, and how AI is, um, moving, and what are the cost structures, and what are the problems that we should be solving, and so on. [chuckles] But what I remember about Pratish's episode is how hard it was for us to get him on the podcast because he's so busy. At one point, uh, I had a friend, uh, who was... I had told him: "Listen, Pratish works in this building. Just let me know if he comes." And then he, he texted me saying, "Oh, Pratish just walked down the stairs." And then I was in the next building, so I'm running beyond the stairs, going up and down the stairs, saying, "Where is he? Where is he? Where is he?" I did not get him that day, but, um, we did get him the another day. Daniel's episode. So Daniel runs this company called Detect, and, uh, people on campus sort of know about Detect, and, uh, broadly have a overview of what he does. But because Daniel is a little media-shy, uh, he hadn't really spoken about in many forums. So that episode, for me, it was like really discovering what Detect does in Daniel's words. A lot of new things I learned. I learned about, um, the, the, the how industrial safety has moved from 100 years back to now, and how his company is playing a part in it. Many guests we have, have not, uh, been into podcasts or given interviews earlier. Uh, they're technocrats, so they do their work, and, uh, their work speaks for themselves. So, um, we, we sort of helped them a little bit by giving them questions beforehand, saying, "This is what we're going to talk about. Um, please come prepared." Sometimes we give them instructions on what to wear and, uh, and stuff like that. But it's, it's interesting. That Daniel episode was, um... It came out very well because, of course, he's very well-spoken, and he was able to explain his, what his company does really well. Neel Gala's episode, oh, my God! This was the first episode that cross- crossed 100K views, and we were so excited. It was totally unexpected. Did not see it coming. Um, I think, uh, some things that worked in Neel Gala's episode was, uh, how candid he was, how honest he is, and so on. Um, there was a one moment where he was talking about, uh, a paper shredder moment in his [chuckles] life, and you... I mean, this is such a good story. You have to hear it from him.
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This is while I was working with Professor Kama as a project staff, and, uh-
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That would be what, uh, 2000-
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This was around, uh, 2010, uh, timeframe. I had, I'd graduated in 2010. 2011 is when I was, uh, like any other peer of mine, I was, was behind the American dream. You know, "Let's go do master's there." I started applying. I had this list of, uh, six, seven universities, ambitious, moderate, backup universities. At that time, we had to, you know, write recommendation letters by hand.... and the prof had to sign it, and we had to courier it.
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Yeah, and Professor Kamakoti's recommendation letter carries a lot of-
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Oh, definitely. Yeah, it was, uh... And I was, you know, I would do anything to get that letter. So I, I- one fine day, I had two more universities, which were my backup universities, and, um, I was waiting for him, uh, in his office. He comes out of his office at, uh, close to 8:00 p.m., right? And he tells me, "Neel, what's up?" And I tell him, "You know, I have these two universities. You've sent six. Why don't you send these two? These are my backup." "Then why are you going there? I mean, these are backup. These are even worse than doing a master's in IIT Madras. Why do you want to go there? Uh, why, do you want to abandon your parents?" I think, "No, no, I will come back for sure." Uh, he's like, "Nah, if you want to come back, then why go at all? Maybe what can I not give you that these universities are giving you?" And that made me realize, uh, this is, this is a prof I spent 18 months with. Uh, he sees a potential in me. He believes that I can do much better here, and yet I'm on this, uh, wagon to go try my luck out in a foreign land, with foreign people, with, uh, zero idea of where my future is. And, and that very instant, uh... He always keeps a shredder because he does a lot of, uh, confidential stuff there. Uh, he signed the docs, and he said, "If you truly believe in what you're saying, you shouldn't be applying to these universities." And right then and there, uh, you know, that's where I shred those documents.
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Mm.
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I stopped applying. Uh, fortunately, his recommendations gave me, uh, access, or gave me admissions to an Ivy League school as well. Uh, but Professor Kama is a force of nature, right? It's, it's impossible you walk out of his room with less patriotism, I mean-
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Yeah, he's very inspiring.
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You have- you're just filled with heart of patriotism, and it would be very tough to, you know, wean that off. And, uh, that day forward, I, I think we were aligned on, you know, the belief that India has to create and not just consume.
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We met, uh, Victor. Victor Senapathi is the CEO of Propelled, co-founder, CEO of Propelled. And, uh, I, I think, uh, yeah, a nice episode. Uh, he explains his segment and what he does. Uh, there was one time where he was talking about how JEE coaching, um, and is quite stressful, uh, and but you end up thinking that JEE is the last milestone, and uh... But it's not. It's you, you either get into IIT, or you get into NIT, or some engineering college, and that's really the beginning of your life, um, because after that, you have to become that engineer that you prepared to become. And so he talks about how people end up thinking that that's the end, but that's actually the beginning.
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Like, the mental relaxation, uh, that I was looking for, at least in my case, it was not like I was mentally overwhelmed after preparing so much for IIT. It's more about, uh, uh, you know, an idea that I am right now, uh, you know, at the pinnacle, and there is nothing... What else is there to go?
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Mm.
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I think if that would've been shown a lot more, that, "Look, you're, you're at a great stepping point now-
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Mm.
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- and from here, there are great, awesome places that you can get to, uh, awesome things that you can build," I think things would have been a little more different.
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But you eventually started building. So what was the change in you from the, say, the first year, uh, Victor, to the, to the Astroworks Victor? What changed that you decided to build?
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That, uh, that was just a self-realization that hit me when, uh, I sat for placements in college. That's when I realized that, "Whoa! People have actually done, uh, done things. They've actually, uh, you know, improved a lot. They've, you know, explored many avenues, and, um, I could have also done the same." Uh, so that's when I decided that, uh, okay, so wherever I go next, whatever I else I do in life, I'll sort of understand that, you know, I'm only at a stepping point, and there are a lot more, you know, great places to get to.
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Uh, very interesting. I think in JEE coaching days, this idea gets sold to you that, uh, the end goal is admission.
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Yes.
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Uh, but you are saying that there's- the end goal is not admission at all. Like, there's always something more and, and a further distance to go.
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Yeah, of course. I can understand why that end goal is sold at that point of time.
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Mm.
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At that point of time, people want you to put your 100%-
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Yeah
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... in that. But then, even after that, I feel like if there's a counseling that's done, right when students come in, to tell them that, "Look, you were sold a lie." [chuckles]
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Half-truth.
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Yeah, half-truth-
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[chuckles]
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... uh, in nicer words.
Episode duration: 51:32
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Transcript of episode B5hfHaGLcpI
