Josh Peck: The Surprising Truth Behind The 127lb Weight Loss | E238

1. 0:00 – 2:02

   Intro

   1. JPJosh Peck0:00

      With Drake & Josh, I felt pissed that I ... that started this whole mess. (bell rings)

   2. SBSteven Bartlett0:06

      Josh Peck, ladies and gentlemen.

   3. JPJosh Peck0:07

      He's an actor, comedian, one-half of Drake & Josh. A staple of my childhood. Hug me, brother! The headline of the first 10 years of my life was single mom, never knew my dad, didn't have enough money for a slice of pizza.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett0:21

      15 years old, Drake & Josh, one would assume that you'd be, like, set for life.

   5. JPJosh Peck0:25

      There was no residuals, and I'm as worried about next year's financial status as anyone else. I don't have that security, and I- I do want to say that I was not properly appreciated for my work. If I wanted to, at will, I could blow that up. (blowing)

   6. SBSteven Bartlett0:40

      18 years old, you lose 127 pounds.

   7. JPJosh Peck0:43

      Yeah.

   8. SBSteven Bartlett0:44

      One would assume that dropping 127 pounds would make you feel different about yourself.

   9. JPJosh Peck0:48

      I dealt with the effect, but I didn't deal with the cause. It was anger at my dad. It was anger at my circumstance. Everything was going right, and I still didn't feel like enough. Substituting what I used food for, with drinking and, and with other substance, at 21, it all came barreling down on me. I- I hurt relationships and work, I worried the people that love me, and I realized that I needed to do something. And what you do in that moment decides what's gonna happen next for you. You cannot think your way into right acting. You have to act your way into right thinking.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett1:21

       Is there anything that's really helped you that you might recommend to someone listening at home?

   11. JPJosh Peck1:25

       Yes. So ...

   12. SBSteven Bartlett1:30

       Before this episode starts, I have a small favor to ask from you. Two months ago, 74% of people that watch this channel didn't subscribe. We're now down to 69%. My goal is 50%, so if you've ever liked any of the videos we've posted, if you like this channel, can you do me a quick favor and hit the subscribe button? It helps this channel more than you know, and the bigger the channel gets, as you've seen, the bigger the guests get. Thank you, and enjoy this episode. (music) Josh,

2. 2:02 – 10:38

   Single parenting and your dad leaving you

   1. SBSteven Bartlett2:02

      having read through your story extensively, it's quite clear to me that the, the most pertinent part of your story, and really, like, the through line begins, the sort of dot in that through line begins with this dynamic your parents had when you were very, very young. Can you take me back to 1980s in New York to give me the context that I'll need to understand to understand the things we're gonna talk about today?

   2. JPJosh Peck2:31

      Sure. I, uh, I was born in 1986. I, uh, was born to a single mom, and I never knew my dad. I was sort of the result of a, I guess what you would call a fling. Um, my mom always says, "You were a surprise, not an accident," so I like the way she, the messaging she's attached to that. But basically, my mom and dad knew each other sort of through business. They had a night, um, and nine months later came me. So, sort of so many different, especially now having two kids of my own, knowing how the process of creating life can be, uh, tenuous and random and arbitrary, and it can be incredibly easy or incredibly hard, to know that they were together once, and it just sort of happened that way is, uh, kinda crazy. It makes you believe, like, "Oh, maybe I'm meant to be here," or at least that's what I tell myself. But yeah, I, uh, I was the result of that, and my mom, who was 43 at the time, knew that she'd always wanted to have a child, but wasn't sure if she ever would, and immediately took it as sort of this gift. And my father who was in his 60s at the time and had a whole other family looked at it differently and decided not to be in my life, and I wound up never meeting him. And so, my origins were very much my mom and I sort of, uh, navigating the world together.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett4:05

      Uh, at an early age, did you get a feel for what your mom's, your mother's perspective was on your father? Did you, did you feel the emotion of that? How- w- what, her perspective on him?

   4. JPJosh Peck4:18

      My mom was weirdly unemotional about my dad. I would say it was almost like the fog of war, or I remember when I, I interviewed Laird Hamilton and I asked him the very corny, cliché question of, "When you're on a 90-foot wave, what's going through your head?" And he's like, "You know, your body will sort of give you a bit of amnesia, so I really can't tell you." When you're in extreme circumstance, your body has a way of, like, washing your memory, and we see that phenomenon too with, like, childbirth, right? Because if those hours during childbirth really were as strong as, as they are when you are experiencing it, we'd all be only children, right? But the brain has a wonderful way of washing that away. So, my mom did a really good job of presenting all the good qualities of my dad, that he was a great business person, that he was charming, that he was handsome. I, uh, you know, he was like the Jewish James Bond walking the streets of New York, this handsome raconteur. I, I say in my book that, you know, he seemed pretty sterling. His only sort of negative was that he really didn't want anything to do with me. So, I think it wasn't until I got older that my mom sort of elaborated a little bit more with details.

   5. SBSteven Bartlett5:40

      What was the, what was the emotion between you and your mother, o- a- and the emotion in the household at the time? Growing up, I know money was tough and-

   6. JPJosh Peck5:48

      Mm.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett5:48

      ... things were slightly difficult, especially because your father had chosen not to be part of your life, but what was the emotion in your h- household, uh, you know, below the age of 10?

   8. JPJosh Peck5:57

      The emotion in my household growing up, i- if I had to...If I had to find a headline, right? Because sure, if you zoomed in on any moment, I could have been bullied at school, or feeling insecure, or feeling less than than my friends who had traditional family systems, or how come I don't get to experience that? Surely, there, there was plenty of that. But if we're talking about a headline of the first 10 years of my life, it was a ver- extremely loving childhood. Um, not without its challenges and we would sort of vacillate between moments of, of being extremely middle class and then having not enough money for a slice of pizza between us. But inevitably, even through the struggles, we were... There was a level of, of comedic relief. You know, we were always taking the piss out of ourselves. My mom's a natural comedian. Her being a self-made businesswoman, especially in the '70s and '80s when she had to be, uh, forced her to be extremely funny and extremely savvy and, um, sort of puckish about the way in which she navigated the world and men and institutions. And so I would say that, um, most of the time we were laughing and there were certainly times where we were, we were crying. But, but it was mostly laughter.

   9. SBSteven Bartlett7:24

      When you, um, when you talk about your mother, it's, the words you use almost make it sound more like a partnership than a mother-son relationship. It sounds like you were like, yeah, partners.

   10. JPJosh Peck7:36

       Certainly. We were partners. I mean, a single mom and an only child, you are immediately elevated to co-pilot, whether you like it or not. I always say that traditional families growing up were more like, I viewed them as closed corporations and the kids were employees and the parents were upper management. And the upper management was sort of beckoning down orders from the top and maybe there was seniority because there was an older sibling, but inevitably everyone sort of had the same pay structure. And then for my mom and I, we were more like a startup.

   11. SBSteven Bartlett8:06

       (laughs)

   12. JPJosh Peck8:07

       Right? So one day I was pitching the clients and she was sweeping the floors, and uh, most days it was the other way around. So yeah, I was, I was the man in my mom's life. Yeah.

   13. SBSteven Bartlett8:22

       Did you have any, um... You know, when you start talking in your book about the pain that you were experiencing that led you to, to food and that, you know, ultimately led to bullying and all of those things. What was that pain?

   14. JPJosh Peck8:39

       Well, I think I could make it... Uh, I'm gonna speak generally as a, uh, reflection of something specific that went on with me. But I, I, dare I project that we're all in a certain level of, of pain. Um, the veil of adolescence falls for, for all of us at different times in our lives where we realize that the world is unfair or we become more attuned to where we are not enough in certain areas and the universe having a beautiful level of balance. It's, it's inevitable, right? I don't know of any of Tom Brady's shortcomings, but he's gotta have one. He's probably hiding it from the world. But, um, there's always something that, that for, for us is, is a challenge or something that's uncomfortable and I think you'd be hard-pressed to zoom in on any kid, and especially pre-teen and teen, who doesn't feel like ultra-sensitive, that the world is unfair, wrestling with their place in this world, their identity, forming their identity. So for me, I just feel like that was impressed upon me at a really young age. If... What's particular to me is I was really young and, uh, I think that was because of the dad stuff. I think that was because I was overweight. So I just knew that life was going to be more challenging with these set of circumstances that were, at that point, felt like sort of thrust upon me. I didn't know that I was sort of eating in a, in an unhealthy way. I just felt like I eat fruit snacks like every other kid. I just, you know, do it, um, in an excessive way. So I think that pain was just born out of what we all feel is that it hurts to be different and it hurts to know that life is go- going to be challenging.

3. 10:38 – 14:13

   How comedy changed my life

   1. JPJosh Peck10:38

   2. SBSteven Bartlett10:38

      You, earlier on you said the word comedic relief when you were talking about the relationship with you and your mother. Comedic relief. The word relief almost makes it sound medicinal.

   3. JPJosh Peck10:48

      Mm.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett10:48

      Like some kind of medicine in your household. What, what, what role did comedy play in your, your early years?

   5. JPJosh Peck10:55

      Uh, comedy is, for my mom and I, it's, it's everything. It's everything. We loved watching movies and television together, sitcoms and standup comedy. It was a release, it was a superpower, it was something that came to both of us naturally. I'm sure as, as a byproduct of my mom's rearing and upbringing, and she even talks about her, her dad, who I didn't know, my grandfather, who sounds like a pretty deeply imperfect guy but was a showman and did love to tell jokes and be funny and a bit of the center of attention. And so for us it was, uh, it was a currency. It was something that worked immediately and it could control the energy of a room. It could endear people to you. So you could really use it to your advantage, but if anything, it was a wonderful distraction.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett11:55

      The other thing you describe as a distraction is, um, is TV.

   7. JPJosh Peck11:59

      Yes.

   8. SBSteven Bartlett12:00

      You refer to it as an escape.... for you at that time in your life. Um, and you said in your book, Happy B- People Are Annoying, um, that sitcoms were your favorite.

   9. JPJosh Peck12:11

      Mm-hmm.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett12:12

       Why were they your favorite?

   11. JPJosh Peck12:14

       Well, sitcoms especially at that time, I talk about how my best friends growing up were The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air and Billy Madison and Happy Gilmore and, um, uh, sitcoms, uh, had some universal sort of qualities in my experience. It projected a healthy family, right? So it was Family Matters, it was, I guess Full House was sort of, was a healthy sort of, um, non-classic family, right? 'Cause there was the dad and the uncles. But these were people that, these were families that I, I wanted to be a part of. And then there was a justice to the comedy in the sense of you didn't have to interpret it. It wasn't objective. Or I'm sorry, it wasn't subjective, it was objective, it was clear what worked and what didn't. It got a laugh, and at that time it was a live studio audience so you know something got a laugh.

   12. SBSteven Bartlett13:10

       (laughs)

   13. JPJosh Peck13:10

       And, uh, and I would just lose myself in hours of watching these television shows, and I was absorbing the rhythms and the qualities through osmosis. I didn't even know it at the time. But it also served as this wonderful escape. And I say that becoming an actor was like, for me, going to work for the hospital that cured my disease. You know? It felt like my way of saying thank you for taking care of me during that time.

   14. SBSteven Bartlett13:41

       What was the disease?

   15. JPJosh Peck13:43

       Well, I, I, I-

   16. SBSteven Bartlett13:44

       I know it's a metaphor, but... yeah.

   17. JPJosh Peck13:46

       Yeah, it's just like sort of a metaphor for my discomfort, for, um, having a lot of time on my hands because I was an only child, um, because my mom had to work a lot to support us, because there was some financial insecurity. Just sort of all of the discomfort going on in between my ears, um, was sort of muted when I was losing myself in those shows.

4. 14:13 – 21:32

   Food addiction to mask my problems

   1. JPJosh Peck14:13

   2. SBSteven Bartlett14:13

      One of the other things that we- we've touched on briefly that you describe in a medicinal manner, um, I think the quote in your book is actually, "I didn't know it at the time, but obviously I was definitely medicating something deep within. For me, when I think about my childhood, the singular powerful and all-consuming memory that comes to mind is being fat. It wasn't a habit. It was a love, my first love," when you're talking about food.

   3. JPJosh Peck14:38

      Oh yeah. Well, that's how you put on the weight. (laughs) Yeah. Food is great. I mean, you're a very fit person, but I imagine you're, you're, you're a fan of food.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett14:47

      I love food.

   5. JPJosh Peck14:48

      Everybody does.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett14:49

      Yeah.

   7. JPJosh Peck14:49

      The whole world does.

   8. SBSteven Bartlett14:51

      Yeah.

   9. JPJosh Peck14:51

      You know who's not like the biggest food guy?

   10. SBSteven Bartlett14:53

       Who?

   11. JPJosh Peck14:54

       John Stamos. And I don't mean to drop names here. (laughs)

   12. SBSteven Bartlett14:57

       (laughs)

   13. JPJosh Peck14:57

       But we did a show together and he's like, "You know, I could eat a turkey sandwich and be okay with it. Like, uh, most days." And he's like, "Sometimes I'll forget to eat and yeah, I like a nice meal here and there but I'm not too absorbed with it." And I'm like, "I don't identify with this."

   14. SBSteven Bartlett15:13

       (laughs)

   15. JPJosh Peck15:13

       You and I are, are built differently, John. Well, we know, he- we know John Stamos is built different. Um, but yeah, I mean, the whole world's obsessed with food. I was obsessed with it in a way that led to me being very overweight.

   16. SBSteven Bartlett15:30

       When you say very, very overweight, how, how much is that in, I guess the metric here is pounds, isn't it?

   17. JPJosh Peck15:35

       I can give you kilos. No I can't-

   18. SBSteven Bartlett15:37

       Okay. Okay.

   19. JPJosh Peck15:37

       ... but what's kilos, about two and a half pounds?

   20. SBSteven Bartlett15:40

       You're asking the wrong person, yeah.

   21. JPJosh Peck15:41

       2.2. Um, do you wanna do stones? I know you're from the UK. I'll do stones there.

   22. SBSteven Bartlett15:45

       Pounds, let's do pounds. (laughs)

   23. JPJosh Peck15:48

       14, 15 stones. Yeah, I think, well, like basically it's funny because I was just kind of like a normal sized human till around eight or nine, and then I got kinda chubby, and then I put on a lot of weight, but it was only from about 13 to 18, uh, where I was about, uh, 100 pounds overweight. I was about 290 pounds.

   24. SBSteven Bartlett16:09

       Okay. Which is 130 kilograms.

   25. JPJosh Peck16:12

       Probably.

   26. SBSteven Bartlett16:13

       And you were, you were, you were nine or 10 you said.

   27. JPJosh Peck16:16

       Uh, uh, no.

   28. SBSteven Bartlett16:17

       Or-

   29. JPJosh Peck16:17

       I really put that weight on probably-

   30. SBSteven Bartlett16:18

       Yeah.
5. 21:32 – 31:37

   Starting your standup career

   1. JPJosh Peck21:32

   2. SBSteven Bartlett21:33

      It's pretty crazy that at like eight years old you were already doing standup.

   3. JPJosh Peck21:37

      Yeah.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett21:38

      That's- that's- that boggles my mind. At eight years old I was doing nothing productive.

   5. JPJosh Peck21:42

      I bet you were doing something.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett21:43

      Ah. Hmm.

   7. JPJosh Peck21:44

      Probably the things eight-year-olds should do like times tables and-

   8. SBSteven Bartlett21:47

      Yeah.

   9. JPJosh Peck21:48

      ... uh, geography (laughs) . And-

   10. SBSteven Bartlett21:49

       Yeah, stuff like that. Or like kicking a ball against a wall.

   11. JPJosh Peck21:52

       Yeah.

   12. SBSteven Bartlett21:53

       On my own or with a friend. You were doing standup at eight. You know, I had a, I had a f- I had a couple of comedians on this podcast and they all, there's this ongoing kind of like stereotype that like a comedian is depressed or something.

   13. JPJosh Peck22:03

       Hmm.

   14. SBSteven Bartlett22:03

       And one, and one of the comedians said to me that, um, a better question to ask, I think it was Jimmy Carr, he said a better question to ask is like which one of your parents were you trying to make happy?

   15. JPJosh Peck22:12

       Ah. Jimmy Carr is so funny.

   16. SBSteven Bartlett22:14

       He's funny, isn't he?

   17. JPJosh Peck22:14

       What a super h- like he's like a Jedi.

   18. SBSteven Bartlett22:17

       Mm-hmm.

   19. JPJosh Peck22:17

       He's on another (laughs) level. Sure. What parent are you trying to make happy? What girl are you trying to impress? I just think that we know that most assets are born out of feelings of being not enough. You know, uh, how many great athletes were, were created because they were trying to impress their fathers, right? Admonishing fathers help make very ambitious young men, you know? And- and young women. It, I don't mean to gender it. Um, the problem is, uh, is the duality of that, because inevitably once hopefully you've achieved that, you realize that there's no there there, that there's no perfect moment that's going to heal that relationship with that parent. Or worse, you don't, you don't attain those things and then you're left to wonder, well, what- what could it have been? And I fell short. I wasn't enough. But comedy is one of those more specific things 'cause there is, there's a justice to it. Um, it's n- there's not a lot up for interpretation. It's clear. Uh, it's more like boxing. I think Chris Rock akinned, akinned it to boxing which is why they call it a punchline, and you know it's on the cards. That punch connected, that one didn't, you get a point for that, you don't get a point for this. And yeah, I think it's just born out of, you know, being funny usually comes from very unfunny reasons.And, uh, you know, growing up, and I- I don't mean to say this, even now, like, when I'll- I'll meet someone who's, like, really, uh, I'll- I'll just name names. It's like, and he is funny, but it's like sometimes when I watch, like, Ashton Kutcher go, like, r- in a really hard comedy, and he's done some really, really funny things. I know this is what you're gonna clip, me, like, trashing ... I, I wanna be Ashton Kutcher. I look up to him. I love you, Ashton. I'm available for friendship, and I love your wife. I love them both. But it's like, it's, sometimes it's hard for me to reconcile how someone can be that gorgeous and handsome and al- and also funny, right? Like, sometimes I do feel like, no, funny's gotta be reserved for us, you know, who- who- who weren't necessarily that, because yeah, it was used as a- a defense mechanism.

   20. SBSteven Bartlett24:47

       Did you know you wanted to be a comedian or an actor? A- and if so, when did you, when did that idea become cemented in your brain that that's the path you were gonna pursue?

   21. JPJosh Peck24:57

       Being an actor, uh, professionally didn't seem like a- a reasonable career path. Sometimes it still doesn't. But here I am (laughs) . Um, it- it was ridiculous. I grew up in New York. I'm not a nepo baby. I have no connection to show business other than a very shticky mother. Do you know this word, shtick?

   22. SBSteven Bartlett25:15

       Yeah.

   23. JPJosh Peck25:16

       Okay (laughs) . Like-

   24. SBSteven Bartlett25:17

       (laughs)

   25. JPJosh Peck25:17

       ... I l- I have a mom who loves a bit and she's a natural performer, has a beautiful singing voice, but no, literally no connections to show business in any way. So it was not reasonable to think that there would be any opportunity to do it professionally. And then I was in sixth grade and my mom and I were having a really tough moment financially. We were living in an apartment on the East Side of Manhattan. It was, like, a studio apartment, and we would sorta switch off between the bed and the couch. One night I'd get the bed, one night I'd get the couch and, and I remember my mom saying, "You know, there's a performing arts high school that you should audition for." And I said, "But I'm gonna go to the high school in my district," like where my elementary school was. She goes, "You don't have a district anymore. We don't live there anymore." And I realized, okay, well, yeah, maybe I'll give this- this school a shot, 'cause I'm not gonna be in high school now with my friends who I grew up with. And I auditioned and I went and I got in, and suddenly I'm walking the halls of this school, the Professional Performing Arts School, which is in the theater district in New York near Times Square, and they had alumni like Alicia Keys and Jesse Eisenberg and Claire Danes, and they were all old- older than me, but all of a sudden I'm seeing kids who are in Broadway shows, TV shows, and they're studying, but they're also successful on this, like, grownup level, and it seemed possible that you could make a living doing this thing that I loved. So I remember that was the first time where I had a suspicion, like, oh, this- this might be a long term gig. And eventually then once I ... basically once it became a way out of my circumstance and it allowed me to sort of contribute to the family financially, I was- I was all in. It just seemed like an escape.

   26. SBSteven Bartlett27:17

       And you were what age then, like 12, 16 maybe?

   27. JPJosh Peck27:20

       I think I was 12, yeah.

   28. SBSteven Bartlett27:21

       12. And then by 16, a chance meeting with someone from Nickelodeon sends things in another direction.

   29. JPJosh Peck27:29

       No, that was 12.

   30. SBSteven Bartlett27:30

       Oh, when you were 12?
6. 31:37 – 39:23

   People assume Drake & Josh set me for life

   1. SBSteven Bartlett31:37

      It's so interesting, but it makes so much sense. You know, that circumstance and struggle are factors that orientate us towards, um, towards our mission, and it's so, it's so, you know... I, I, I think we often understate how, like, trauma and things we'd never wish on a child end up creating that brilliance.

   2. JPJosh Peck31:58

      Mm-hmm.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett31:58

      You think about, like, the, the brilliance you've created, the work you've created that is brilliant, so much of it has a through line way back to things that you would never wish on your kids.

   4. JPJosh Peck32:07

      Yes.

   5. SBSteven Bartlett32:07

      Right? 15 years old, you start, um, filming the pilot for Drake & Josh. One of the things I found really interesting when I was reading through your book is, one would assume that such a hit show, a show that we all knew very, very well in the UK, off the back of it, one would assume that you'd be, like, set for life financially.

   6. JPJosh Peck32:27

      Yeah.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett32:27

      And you write about how that's, like, that's, that's, that was certainly not the case.

   8. JPJosh Peck32:33

      Yes. And, uh, I do wanna say that my first Kids' Choice Award was won at the UK Kids' Choice Awards-

   9. SBSteven Bartlett32:42

      There you go.

   10. JPJosh Peck32:42

       ... in London. Now, I had been nominated a lot. Uh, it's not sour grapes, but allow, allow me to continue. I was not properly appreciated for my work in the American Kids' Choice Awards, but it took you brilliant people in the United Kingdom to appreciate my, my, my overweight, but wonderfully comedic work as a young actor. (laughs)

   11. SBSteven Bartlett33:06

       (laughs)

   12. JPJosh Peck33:06

       So I, I wanna thank you. Um, yeah, I, I think, look, I'm so pleased to talk about this stuff with you, someone who's, like, has wonderful insight into the book and, and is interested. And it felt like the book for me was sort of like, I don't, uh, I, I really, I, I don't do a lot of this anymore, in, because the book felt like sort of a chapter ending in my life.

   13. SBSteven Bartlett33:37

       Mm-hmm.

   14. JPJosh Peck33:37

       It was me editorializing my life. It was commenting on the things that I felt were perhaps misunderstood or didn't have enough clarification or description. And also in an effort, unknowingly, to sort of say like, "And now I'm not, I'm gonna talk about it less."

   15. SBSteven Bartlett33:53

       Mm-hmm.

   16. JPJosh Peck33:54

       And if someone is interested, like, they can, you know, read the book and it's, it's now, you know, in the, the Library of Congress, but-

   17. SBSteven Bartlett34:02

       Mm-hmm.

   18. JPJosh Peck34:02

       And so to that point, I felt the need because over the years people would either say it in a cheeky way like, "Oh, well you don't have to worry because of the residuals," or they would say just something random like, uh, you know, it would actually be part of decision-making or something that it would apply to me, they're like, "Well, Josh doesn't have to worry." And I was like, "Well, I'm not complaining, but I'm, I'm as much, you know, worried about next year's financial status as anyone else, because I don't have that security." So yeah, with Drake & Josh, there was no residuals and KidsTV didn't have that at that time and I got really honest and I sort of broke it down because Ryan Holiday, my friend and sort of advisor on the book, was like, "If you don't..." It's, he's like, "It's gross to talk about money, but if you don't actually give a, a, uh, sort of exact picture of what it was, then people won't understand." And so I sort of talk about that, you know, while doing the show we made about $100,000 a year for the four years we were making it, which is great money and a lovely middle class lifestyle, but no one would assume that once you stop working that you never had to work again.

   19. SBSteven Bartlett35:17

       Mm-hmm.

   20. JPJosh Peck35:17

       So I just wanted to give some clarity to that to sort of explain the choices that I made after and why I was so passionate about finding more work, 'cause I, um, I had some people to take care of.

   21. SBSteven Bartlett35:30

       That makes perfect sense, and I think it's really important context because, um, you're right, it's very easy when you don't know entertainment contracts, especially for a, for a young person that's 15 odd years old, to assume that they made millions and millions in perpetuity from that piece of work, and then a lot of the, the, the decisions and the choices thereafter don't have, are lacking in context.

   22. JPJosh Peck35:51

       Yes.

   23. SBSteven Bartlett35:52

       So when I read that, it was like I understood. Of course if you make $100,000 in the United States, you're living in California or whatever it is, for five years in a row, um, you do need to go back to work. And, uh, a- after Drake & Josh ended, was there, was there, like, a pivotal moment where you realized that that show was big?

   24. JPJosh Peck36:11

       It, um, t- it wasn't till much later, funny enough. I, um, I think because when we were making it, it was only popular with kids who were sort of younger, who I didn't... Other than if I was at a mall or at a theme park, I didn't have a huge amount of rea- uh, interaction with. And then I would say that the, the power of the show, to its credit, was that it was slightly timeless 'cause it had a very sort of classic through line of any sitcom. It was about a family. And a lot of kids shows can be more fantastical and have more of a sci-fi bent or something more fantasy or, or whimsical. This was just like very straight down the line, two brothers who are very different trying to get along, uh, and an evil little sister.

   25. SBSteven Bartlett37:02

       Mm-hmm.

   26. JPJosh Peck37:02

       So because of how much it was rerun, more generations would come to the show, and these people grew up. So it wasn't as though it was this moment in time. It was that every year-

   27. SBSteven Bartlett37:15

       Mm-hmm.

   28. JPJosh Peck37:15

       ... we were picking up new fans.

   29. SBSteven Bartlett37:18

       'Cause th- there was what? 60 episodes or something?

   30. JPJosh Peck37:20

       Yeah, just 60.
7. 39:23 – 43:18

   Losing a lot of weight

   1. SBSteven Bartlett39:23

      (page turns) After Drake & Josh ended and y- as you go into your like, y- you know, the next chapter of your life, 18 years old, you lose a lot of weight.

   2. JPJosh Peck39:32

      I do.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett39:33

      A lot of weight. (laughs) 127 pounds.

   4. JPJosh Peck39:38

      Yeah.

   5. SBSteven Bartlett39:39

      H- how, how does... That's not an easy feat. How does that happen?

   6. JPJosh Peck39:45

      I certainly made a decision that I was ready to do it. Um, I think I just, I always knew that I was going to do it. And also in writing the book, it's... When you put pen to paper, and I know you're a writer yourself, it's amazing how these... I feel as though we make these, um... Everything in our brain is sort of shorthand, right? It's like these picture memories that are connected, uh, and sometimes they're connected by these really strong connections and sometimes it's just like short little hits. But when you're forced to actually explain it on a page, it makes you look at it differently. And I was like, "Wow, I was only heavy from like 13 to 17." Of course, they're the years that have been enshrined in television history forever, so it feels much bigger. But had I just been like a normal kid, I would have burned my yearbooks and sworn my family to secrecy and I'd never bring it up.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett40:43

      Mm-hmm.

   8. JPJosh Peck40:44

      So I think it was a number of things. I was ready. I think naturally like my body was ready to let go of it. And I just knew that I... I felt like because I was so insecure, I had missed out on a lot of my teenage years. Um, it wasn't without lack of opportunity to go out and, and be a knucklehead and experience life. I just didn't want to do it 'cause I didn't love the body that I was in. So I felt like if I didn't, if I didn't act now, I was gonna lose some really important years.

   9. SBSteven Bartlett41:22

      Is there, is there a process that helped you? 'Cause I'm thinking about how you referred to it as being like medicinal-

   10. JPJosh Peck41:28

       Mm-hmm.

   11. SBSteven Bartlett41:28

       ... your relationship with food, and that's like deeply psychological. So to like upend that deep psychological force or that relationship with food is no easy feat. So like what, what's the process? Is it therapy? Is it what, that, that makes your, that kind of upends that psychological force or replaces it or...

   12. JPJosh Peck41:45

       I think it was... I, I had been... I- I've, I've had a therapist that, that I've gone to since I was 15 and, and I still see here and there. So my mom kind of knew. I think she saw it in me early on that there was just a lot going on, be it my dad or the weight stuff. And then I think I would just... Uh, i- in the way that, that change is born, you know, pain is a great motivator. I was sort of sick and tired of being sick and tired, and I, I knew that I had to let go of something. I don't think I knew exactly what it was, but if I'm looking back at it now, it was like, it was this anger. It was anger at my, my dad. It was anger at my circumstance. And-I just remember I was 17 years old. My mom and I would drive back to New York every year for, like, two months, and we would just go and see family and hang out in the city. And I just started to walk. And up until then, I would do these really intense, you know, attempts at keto or these extreme diets on a Monday, and I would fail by Wednesday morning, and then I, it would be back on again. But this time I said, "I'm just going to try to make a small change every day." And I would walk the city for miles, and I would listen to, to music, and I would dream of what my life could be. And I started eating better, and slowly but surely that summer I lost like 40 pounds, and then over the next year I lost another 40, and then over the next year I lost another 40.

8. 43:18 – 54:01

   Drink and drugs

   1. JPJosh Peck43:18

   2. SBSteven Bartlett43:18

      In chapter five of your book you say you had a new body but the exact same self-hating mind.

   3. JPJosh Peck43:22

      Mm-hmm.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett43:26

      One would assume that, you know, dropping 127 pounds, one would naively assume that dropping 127 pounds would, would make you feel different about yourself.

   5. JPJosh Peck43:36

      Yeah. Well, it's, um, sort of the themes that you've mentioned throughout this interview, it's, it's cause and effect, right? Like, I dealt with the effect but I didn't deal with the cause, and unfortunately there were some issues at play. There was some, um, unresolved pain and work that needed to be done that I wasn't even aware of, but it was all at play under the surface. So when I no longer had that thing that was helping to sort of keep those feelings at bay, they reared their head, and I needed to find something else. I didn't know that it was gonna be in the form of, uh, you know, drinking and, and sort of, uh, alcohol's cousins.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett44:19

      (laughs)

   7. JPJosh Peck44:19

      But I, uh, I just knew that when I finally did find those things and I did sigh that bit of relief that I'd been looking for, I, I think there was even a moment in that first night when I went out with some other kids my age and really tied one off and thought I was having, like, a proper teenage time, I remember this, this voice in my head being like, "Oh, this is it. Like, this is what we've been looking for." Um-

   8. SBSteven Bartlett44:49

      Drinking.

   9. JPJosh Peck44:51

      Yeah. The drinking and, and drugs, and I, I, I, I think I say something in the book of, like, if you've been carrying this invisible bag of stones around your whole life, a weight vest with 50 to 100 extra pounds, I mean, I quite literally was, but let's just say it's, like, emotional weight vest, and eventually you almost forget that it's on. You just know your knees hurt, and you know you're exhausted. Just like, "Why am I so tired? Why do, why does, the, why do things feel tougher for me than it does for my friends?" And then if in an instant that weight vest is lifted off of you and your knees hurt less and you're walking around and you're like, "Oh," y- you wouldn't question it. You'd just be like, "Whatever just took that weight vest off, I'm in." And that's, that was the reaction that I had.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett45:44

       That's such an interesting analogy. The, the weight vest, you know, you said the term self-hating mind. For someone that hasn't experienced a self-hating mind, what is, what is that like in detailed reality? Is it literally thoughts that you can recall that are saying, being pessimistic?

   11. JPJosh Peck46:04

       Hmm. I, I, I probably if I could, um, edit my book now, I would be probably less, um, I'd be less revealing. No, I would be less-

   12. SBSteven Bartlett46:16

       (laughs)

   13. JPJosh Peck46:18

       (laughs) I would be less, um, I, I would be a little harder on myself and say it, uh, it's self-centered if we're talking about the root of it. I remember when I got in, when I got sober, people would say, "You're self-centered." And I would say, "Self-centered? That's reserved for people who think highly of themselves. That's reserved for the quarterbacks, the models, the good-looking, the self-absorbed people," to me felt when you would see that in movies it was someone who was staring in the mirror and, and per- perfecting their hair, and they would say, "No, if you spend all your time thinking about how great you are or how shit you are, all you're thinking about is you, and you are self-centered. It doesn't matter whether it's great or bad." So I would, yeah, I would substitute self-hating with self-centered. I was obsessed with self. My trauma was real. My challenges were real, and that played a part in it, but I was just so wrapped up in my feelings of feeling less than and uncomfortable and not proverbially not at the cool table that, um, I, you know, found myself in a place to numb my, my feelings because those thoughts were, were unrelenting.

   14. SBSteven Bartlett47:44

       Nothing in life, nothing in life is free, and so even a temporary lifting of the weight vest-

   15. JPJosh Peck47:49

       Mm-hmm.

   16. SBSteven Bartlett47:49

       ... comes with a l- a long-term cost as we talked about with food. What was that, that long-term cost of temporarily getting to lift the weight vest once in a while?

   17. JPJosh Peck47:59

       I just became a cliche quick. I, I hurt relationships at work. I worried the people that love me. I, I just started to accrue a lot of wreckage quickly. It's, it's funny, I interviewed Hilary Duff on my podcast, um, Good Guys, th- the other day, and we made a joke. I was asking her about, like, um, uh, we were, she brought up something about, like, "Oh, I love an alcoholic beverage," and she kind of looked at me and said, "Sorry, Josh." And I was like, "No, I love an alcoholic beverage too. Unfortunately,"... whenever I drink, it leads to my other favorite beverage, Percocet (laughs) , which is a very popular painkiller in this country. Um, and I remember people sort of saying, like, they were so sort of, th- they just didn't know sort of my, um, they, they didn't know that part of my history, right? So, it was something that I, it was this, this thing that I was sort of navigating and balancing kind of, how much I would sort of talk about it and, and, uh, and reveal, and then also sort of this, this balancing of, like, the things that I also wanted to keep private.

   18. SBSteven Bartlett49:14

       When did you realize that it w- that you had a, a problem with alcohol, or an unhealthy relationship with alcohol and drugs? Was there a... 'Cause-

   19. JPJosh Peck49:23

       Oh.

   20. SBSteven Bartlett49:23

       ... at the time, I imagine you don't, the first time you do it, you don't know. It's, it's not a problem then, is it? But at some point, you must have s- maybe got some feedback or something indicated that this was not...

   21. JPJosh Peck49:33

       Oh, uh, and I'm sorry. I, I forgot the point I was trying to make with the Hillary thing. But, oh, someone wrote a comment on that clip, on that video that said, "Damn, Josh Peck got sober at 21. He really went for it." (laughs)

   22. SBSteven Bartlett49:44

       (laughs)

   23. JPJosh Peck49:45

       So, uh, to answer your follow-up question, yeah. I mean, I think that I basically was substituting what I used food for with these, you know, with, with drinking and, and with other substance. But it was all sort of connected, so it wasn't this four-year run. It was really, like, since I was nine or 10 years old, it just was, again, validating and reconfirming this idea of, like, you overdo things. And nothing is gonna fill up this hole in the soul, no matter what you try to fill it with. And even, like, the things that our, um, world tells us is of value, even success isn't gonna do it. Even if girls like you, it's not enough. And so, I remember at 21 having a moment like that when it all sort of came sort of barreling down on me, and I realized that I needed to do something. Now, I think people have those moments and they don't do anything, and it, they lose another four years or five or 10 or 20. Um, but I do think the world and life catastrophe, challenging circumstance, some version of a bottom, whatever you're going through, being fired from something, uh, a health scare, has a way of temporarily waking you up. And what you do in that moment, um, decides what, what's gonna happen next for you.

   24. SBSteven Bartlett51:22

       You said that happened for you at 21 years old. Was that, was that in the wake of the film The Wackness?

   25. JPJosh Peck51:26

       It was. Yeah, that was certainly a moment.

   26. SBSteven Bartlett51:30

       Tell me about that moment.

   27. JPJosh Peck51:31

       Well, again, I, I had accrued plenty of wreckage. But I remember I, I had done this movie The Wackness that I was extremely proud of with my favorite actor, Sir Ben Kingsley, you know, and I mean, literally my favorite actor. Like, getting to, you know, have my rookie season with Michael Jordan. And it went to the Sundance Film Festival, and I was so proud. We got a standing ovation, and it just felt like such a confirmation for me as an actor that there was gonna be, that, that there was gonna be opportunity and there was, there was more to come for my career, that it wasn't just this sort of anomaly that I did this one show and that that was sort of gonna be it. But I remember in that moment, all those similar feelings, that mind that had gotten me in trouble so many times before was still yelling at me, and all those feelings were flooding in. They weren't there the night we got the... They weren't there during the 90 seconds of the standing ovation. They weren't there, you know, when I was smiling in front of the camera. But they were there when I got home. They were there when I got in bed. They were there when I was waiting in line for a coffee the next morning or whatever else I was doing. So it was, like, so short-lived, and it just confirmed this idea of like, oh, like, even at your best, even when everything's kind of going right, 'cause it's easy to use when, when life throws you challenges as a reason to sort of, you know, cosign your bad behavior. But everything was going right, and I still didn't feel like enough. And I knew at that point that I needed to make a change or, or I might never do it.

   28. SBSteven Bartlett53:13

       That next day after the standing ovation at the Sundance Film Festival, you talk about, you know, how you might have felt standing in the coffee line or the next day when you woke up, et cetera. Is this, are those, are they specific thoughts or is it just a, an emotional state? You know what I mean?

   29. JPJosh Peck53:28

       Yeah.

   30. SBSteven Bartlett53:28

       Is it just, like, a loneness, anti-climax?
9. 54:01 – 56:28

   Getting sober

   1. SBSteven Bartlett54:01

      you, your solution to that feeling appears to be, you know, when, when you hit that proverbial rock bottom moment, um, to be getting some help.

   2. JPJosh Peck54:09

      Mm-hmm.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett54:10

      And that's where you turned to AA, Alcohol, Alcoholics Anonymous.

   4. JPJosh Peck54:14

      Mm-hmm.

   5. SBSteven Bartlett54:15

      What, what is that pro- Like, what is, what is Alcoholics Anonymous and, like, wha- how d- how did it help you turn things around and get sober?

   6. JPJosh Peck54:24

      Well, you know, it's sort of in the name Anonymous that there's, there's an a- anonymity portion to it. So I, I, I always wanna make sure it's said that I'm in no way sort of a representative or ambassador for it in, in any way. It's just how I have found a way in which to get and stay sober over the last 15 years, is through, through a 12-step program and...It's just a way, it's, it's ancient truths, um, repackaged to make sense to a guy like me. It's the best way. It helps to mitigate the worst of my character defects and it's just age-old, um, it's just a sort of, for me, an age-old way of, of cleaning up your past and, and looking at bad patterns and habits in my life. And making amends and trying to implement things that through history we have known to work; gratitude, surrender, acceptance. If you want self-esteem, do esteemable acts.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett55:30

      Hmm.

   8. JPJosh Peck55:31

      Restraint of pen and tongue. You know, just like, um, you know, it's not, you know, your higher power is up to you as long as you know that you're not God. That one's, uh, that, that one's helpful. It just presented some ways in which for me to, to apply things to my life that helped me to, to get and stay sober. So I think if, if the efficacy wasn't there, if I didn't see quickly that I started to feel better then maybe I would've sought a different way. This w- this was a way that happened to work for me.

   9. SBSteven Bartlett56:02

      And you've been sober for some, what, 13, 13 years?

   10. JPJosh Peck56:04

       15.

   11. SBSteven Bartlett56:05

       15 years.

   12. JPJosh Peck56:05

       Recently, yeah. Just, uh, February 15th.

   13. SBSteven Bartlett56:08

       Congratulations.

   14. JPJosh Peck56:09

       Thanks. It works for me, you know?

   15. SBSteven Bartlett56:11

       Yeah. It's, uh, uh, incredible, incredible, um-

   16. JPJosh Peck56:14

       (laughs)

   17. SBSteven Bartlett56:14

       ... achievement. You know, everyone's got their own relationship with, with alcohol and whatever else, but it's always incredible to hear, um, someone being able to turn a corner in the direction they wanted to turn it. That's the best way I can describe it.

10. 56:28 – 1:04:38

    Trying to understand your father

    1. SBSteven Bartlett56:28

    2. JPJosh Peck56:28

       Thank you.

    3. SBSteven Bartlett56:29

       2013, you kind of start, from reading your book, it sounds like you start on a new, a new journey and that's the journey to understand who your father is. You're 27 at this point.

    4. JPJosh Peck56:40

       Mm-hmm.

    5. SBSteven Bartlett56:41

       So almost 30 years old and your father passes away, um, and you make the decision at that point, having not met him before and having not seen a picture of him until you were 24 years old, to figure out who he was.

    6. JPJosh Peck56:53

       Hmm.

    7. SBSteven Bartlett56:53

       What did you learn about him and how did that change your perspective of him?

    8. JPJosh Peck56:58

       Well, I remember I had always sort of toyed with this idea of meeting him, and yet I think I knew deep down I, I never would because my creation of him in my head, the way that I sold him to my friends or, or the way I would portray him to people felt like my weird cosmic consolation prize. Like, I don't get to have him in any way, but I can present him to people in the way in which I choose. Not that I was telling people that my dad was, you know, the first man on the moon or anything like that.

    9. SBSteven Bartlett57:33

       (laughs)

    10. JPJosh Peck57:33

        It just was like l- you know, uh, my mom knew that he was a s- w- that he was Jewish and that he was Sephardic which is, um, a type of Jew that tends to be from either the Middle East or from Morocco or, or French or, or it can be South America, Mexican. And, and so for me, I would just like ping pong where he was from, you know? Sometimes he was from Spain, sometimes he was from Israel, sometimes he was from Morro- Like, I just would kind of present it a- as I saw fit. And, and it felt like if I ever met him, well then I, I lost even the illusion or this creation of my dad that I wanted to make. So I, but when I found out that he passed away, it also felt like a little bit of this thing that I'd been carrying around, this emotional grenade that I could e- y- you know, I had the power in the sense that I could show up and he had this whole other family and these grown kids and a wife, and if I wanted to, at will, I could blow that up for him, if in theory he never had told them anything. I was never gonna do it, but it was nice to know, right?

    11. SBSteven Bartlett58:44

        Mm-hmm.

    12. JPJosh Peck58:45

        Like whatever version my head was telling me, like to keep me warm at night. So when he passed away, I was like, "Oh, damn. He won." Right? Perfect record. (laughs) Like he set his mind to something and he stuck to it. He's like, "I'm never gonna meet that kid," and he didn't. And I never got that moment to sort of say like, "How dare you." I don't know if it would've been that. Probably wouldn't have been. It probably would've been like, "Hey, I'm your kid. What's up?" Like, "Do you wanna get a coffee?" Um, but, you know, all of that was sort of taken away from me. So I felt, I felt pissed that I had to mourn this guy that I never knew and that I was mourning, like mourning is the, in theory sort of the worst part of... Uh, it's sort of the other side of love, right? It's that the gift is you get to love in the embrace of someone and then what comes with that is that eventually if they're not here anymore, you have to mourn them, you have to mourn what was. And I was like, "There was nothing." (laughs) Like-

    13. SBSteven Bartlett59:46

        Hmm.

    14. JPJosh Peck59:46

        ... and I still have to get the crappy side of this? Doesn't seem fair. But it forced me to do something that inevitably led to my amends and my amends that I gave myself which was I randomly looked up, uh, his kids on Facebook. My friend figured out a way to b- my friend, a buddy of mine basically was looking with me and was like, "Oh, I..." There was a connection between him and my sister. They had attended a similar like workshop or some kind of like education program. He's like, "Maybe under the guise of that I could become her friend and like then, you know, I could see if on her profile she has any photos of your dad." I had never seen what he looked like. She accepts it and I am immediately given this like treasure trove of photos of his life. And I'm seeing him at their bar mitzvahs and, and weddings and all these events and I'm seeing these beautiful tributes that his friends and family are making to him after he passes away.And it made me realize that, like, what my dad was for me wasn't the only part of him, you know? It- it certainly was a real part of him, but he also was this great dad, just not to me. And that's not, uh, valid. There are... That's not not valid. That's, um, that's, uh, a part of this imperfect man. So it, like, gave me a little bit of forgiveness for this guy, and it made me realize that he was probably scared, and he had probably had this great perfect record with his family, and then this blemish occurred, and he did the best that he could. So in a weird way, seeing that he was good to them made me a little more okay that maybe he wasn't great to me. And, and then of course having a son of my own and being the dad to my two boys now, uh, that I wish my dad was for me was sort of like the ultimate amends to eight-year-old Josh.

    15. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:01

        What's that journey been like, you know, from... I almost view it as like a- an emotional journey on, like, some kind of, like, graph or something, almost like a roller coaster, from when you were young to where you are now in terms of the perspective of your father and their relationship. You know, was there, was there resentment at one point? You seem to have gotten to a better place with it now.

    16. JPJosh Peck1:02:19

        Yeah.

    17. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:20

        But what's that journey like?

    18. JPJosh Peck1:02:22

        The resentment, I think, at its- at its highest is, uh, showcased in me being 100 pounds overweight.

    19. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:29

        (laughs) Right.

    20. JPJosh Peck1:02:29

        Or, you know, my struggles after that. I- I think that was certainly, um... It was all that resentment and anger and frustration and unexplored feelings presenting itself as- as whatever that was, as those addictions, right? They were the manifestation of a deeper issue. They were a symptom of a deeper issue.

    21. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:55

        I was just pondering, 'cause I've- I know people that haven't had a relationship with their father. Obviously, nothing is definitively causal. Like, doesn't necessarily mean you're gonna turn out any other way, but, um-

    22. JPJosh Peck1:03:04

        Yeah.

    23. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:04

        ... one of the- the trends you tend to hear about is when... Is that connection between not believing you're enough and your father not being around?

    24. JPJosh Peck1:03:12

        Hmm.

    25. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:13

        A- are they connected for you? Like, the- the... Do you know what I mean? I'm saying, does- does the absence of your father, did that ever leave a thought that said, "He left be- you know, that means I'm not enough because he chose not to be here."

    26. JPJosh Peck1:03:26

        It must.

    27. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:27

        Right.

    28. JPJosh Peck1:03:27

        I- I- I don't see how it couldn't be.

    29. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:29

        Right.

    30. JPJosh Peck1:03:29

        But what we... What I've also learned in being sober this long and hearing a lot of other people's experiences that my, um, my story, my feelings are not rare, but they're not a monolith. They're not singular.
11. 1:04:38 – 1:07:12

    Becoming a father yourself

    1. SBSteven Bartlett1:04:38

       when you're younger. Um, y- and then you, as you say, you had your own boy.

    2. JPJosh Peck1:04:42

       Yes. Now two boys, crazy.

    3. SBSteven Bartlett1:04:46

       Two boys?

    4. JPJosh Peck1:04:47

       You have kids?

    5. SBSteven Bartlett1:04:48

       Not yet.

    6. JPJosh Peck1:04:49

       I can tell, 'cause you're in such good shape. (laughs)

    7. SBSteven Bartlett1:04:53

       (laughs) Were you scared to- to become a father for your- of your own?

    8. JPJosh Peck1:04:57

       Terrified, because I- I just didn't... I didn't have any work life experience. (laughs)

    9. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:03

       Yeah, sure.

    10. JPJosh Peck1:05:04

        Um, I just didn't know... Look, I'm- I'm a mu- I'm a- I'm a formerly chubby musical theater kid from New York. Like, I don't... I never thought w- Anything that was masculine, I never thought I had the prerequisites for that, that was, like, inherently dude-ish. Like, I've always been, like, a guy. Like, I love boxing. Like, I've always bro'd down. I've always, you know, had all those inherent qualities. But those things that felt- felt, like, presentationally macho or dude-esque, I was just like, "Oh, I don't- I don't have that." And, uh, and so yeah, I wanted to have a girl. And then when my son was born, my wife and I didn't find out the sex. And so, you know, at nine month and... Nine months and a couple days when the doctor was like, "What is it, Josh?" And I got to announce to the room, like, "It's a boy," I was like, "Oh, of course," because it was required for me... You know, my life turned into man school, you know? Especially in sobriety, I had to learn... M- And- and I don't mean to make it this blanket of definition. Uh, for me, what it meant to be a man, and the qualities that I had- had to sort of accrue, the things that, no matter how great my mom was, couldn't give me, 'cause she was just limited by what one person can do. The things that I learned from my big brother, Dan. I've had a Big Brother... In- in the States, we have the Big Brother Foundation.

    11. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:37

        Yeah.

    12. JPJosh Peck1:06:37

        I've had a Big Brother since I was eight years old, and things that I learned from him, and then eventually my father-in-law, who I really look up to, and all the great men in my life.

    13. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:46

        Yeah.

    14. JPJosh Peck1:06:46

        And all these- these assets, these tools that I had learned, you know, when I had my son, Max, I was like, "Okay, here's my opportunity now to implement that and see everything that I've collected, what I can give him." And, uh...It just felt perfect. It felt like God's way of, like, having a laugh and being like, "You- you knew this was gonna happen, right?"

    15. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:10

        (laughs)

12. 1:07:12 – 1:13:09

    Your relationship style

    1. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:12

       You married Paige.

    2. JPJosh Peck1:07:14

       Yes.

    3. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:15

       You had the two chil- wonderful children.

    4. JPJosh Peck1:07:17

       (laughs)

    5. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:17

       Um, I had a guest on the podcast quite recently who said, who described somewhat of a similar upbringing where the father wasn't around and him and his mom acted almost like pilot and co-pilot.

    6. JPJosh Peck1:07:29

       Mm-hmm.

    7. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:29

       And he, one of the terms he said to me, I can't remember, it was something a, something ancestral something. I know that sounds strange, but it was something to do with the fact that when you have such a close relationship to your partner, to your mother, and they end up indirectly or inadvertently offloading some of the emotional energy around the parent that's not there, it can make your own personal relationships difficult.

    8. JPJosh Peck1:07:53

       Yeah.

    9. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:53

       Can you relate?

    10. JPJosh Peck1:07:56

        I can, except that I think that everyone is bad at relationships.

    11. SBSteven Bartlett1:08:00

        (laughs)

    12. JPJosh Peck1:08:00

        And I think, eh, just s- like, I believe that even if you have a perfect parental structure, we will self-parent. There's always going to be gaps in our rearing. There's always going to be, eh, spots that were missed as a result of your upbringing and your circumstance and the way in which you've experienced life up to a certain point, and it's incumbent on you to fill in those gaps. That's growing up, right?

    13. SBSteven Bartlett1:08:28

        To even know what those gaps are-

    14. JPJosh Peck1:08:29

        Yeah.

    15. SBSteven Bartlett1:08:29

        ... first, right? What- what, for you, what were those gaps you had to fill in?

    16. JPJosh Peck1:08:33

        Well, I think it was, with the dad stuff, it was about, in relationships up until my wife, I had this, like, I would call it, like, the Tony Montana approach to life, which was, like, if anything went wrong, if there was any sort of adversity or any kind of... I mean, eh, at this point, right, like, I'm, I've dealt with the dad stuff and then I've been in showbiz till, you know, since I was 10, right, which is the ultimate rejection, right? You're- you're being, you're going on a job interview, at best, even if you're on a TV show, you're interviewing for a job once or twice a year, and if you are an out of work actor, you're, uh, you're interviewing for a job four times, five times a month. Sometimes more during pilot season, right? So you really have to calcifi- or, uh, calcify, yeah, like, you have to become, uh, callous to rejection. It's like, if you've ever talked to a doctor, like, about death, they- they have a very interesting bent on it because they can't be overly emotional about it 'cause it's a part of their job. So until this point, in relationships, if anything went south, I just would go, "This is a preview of more bad to come. This isn't natural growing pains. This isn't natural, um, discourse or- or- or just, like, the natural arguments that you get in and then you get through them and you become closer." I would just go, "This was great. I'll be fine without you. Thanks." And I would just go, leaving people in my wake to feel like, "What the hell happened?"

    17. SBSteven Bartlett1:10:09

        How did you reverse that to the point that you were able to find someone and get married?

    18. JPJosh Peck1:10:12

        Luckily, I was in a state of doing the work. I was willing to be... I was not doing that specific work, but in general, because I was in a recovery program, because my mom had put good people around me, and because I had done therapy since I was a kid, I, like, knew, I was self-aware enough to know, like, "Oh, there's- there's certainly work to be done here." But it wasn't until I had a woman like my wife in my l- my life who taught me a better way, who came from a family that doesn't leave, and she reiterated that. So when we'd get in these fights and I would look at her and be like, "So I guess we should call it. Like, this was great. Right?" (laughs) She'd be like, "What? Like, no. Like, I'm not going anywhere and neither are you. We can be mad at each other. We can be mad. We can go to bed mad." I love that. When people go, "Oh, you don't go to bed mad." I'm like, "I don't know. Not in my experience." Like, you can go to bed. You can be mad for a couple of days. It usually doesn't last that long. No one wants to be that pissed that long. But it's like, "But when we work this out, I'll be here 'cause I'm not going anywhere 'cause my siblings never went anywhere. My mom and dad never went anywhere. Like, we stick around through the good and the bad." And that was a revelation for me.

    19. SBSteven Bartlett1:11:35

        I can so relate in so many ways.

    20. JPJosh Peck1:11:37

        Yeah.

    21. SBSteven Bartlett1:11:37

        I have the same avoidant attachment style for various reasons and then I- I met a person, I always say, that, like, got over the wall.

    22. JPJosh Peck1:11:43

        Mm-hmm. Yeah.

    23. SBSteven Bartlett1:11:44

        You know, like, you know, and changed you from the inside. Um...

    24. JPJosh Peck1:11:48

        Definitely.

    25. SBSteven Bartlett1:11:49

        So I can totally, totally relate. Where a-

    26. JPJosh Peck1:11:50

        Well, that's why you have to have a, that's why, if- if it's for you, you have to have a kid because in my experience, and I say it in the book, you don't, we all work on ourselves and especially with incredible podcasts like this and we're in the age of optimization and self-realization and everyone's listening to a dozen podcasts at a time and wants to be their best version of themselves, and that's great, but we can't be Faberge eggs, right? Like, we can't be these perfect, pristine things and then we get jostled around a bit by life and we shatter. And so, to me, I think there's only so much work you can do on your own and then it has to be, like, applied into life. And then you put some skin in the game and you get in a relationship and that forces you to go deeper, and you're like, "I don't want to." (laughs) And they're like, "Well, you better, otherwise this thing's not gonna work." But you meet someone of value and you do the work and it reveals itself to be worth it and it gives you a deeper understanding. And then once you guys get really perfect, you throw a kid in the mix-

    27. SBSteven Bartlett1:12:54

        (laughs)

    28. JPJosh Peck1:12:54

        ... and that little jerk makes you go even deeper and work even harder and become even more selfless, hopefully, and less self-centered. And again, new truths are revealed and- and new ways of living are revealed. So yeah.

13. 1:13:09 – 1:17:25

    Where are you now?

    1. SBSteven Bartlett1:13:09

       On all the things we've talked about today, s- the- the mental talk, the voice in your head, the feelings of, um, you know, quote unquote, self-hatred, self-esteem, happiness, where- where are you as you sit here today on that journey?

    2. JPJosh Peck1:13:24

       I- I'm- I'm in a wonderful place. My life, you know, is a reflection of... How do I say it? My life is- is that of a good man's. Now, I- I say that not in, like, some big self-congratulatory way. But I just did th- the things that I was told to do by people whose life I wanted, you know? I surrounded myself with the people who weren't telling me the things I wanted to hear, but their life looked attractive. And it wasn't because they had a nice car or they had an impressive job. Those things don't hurt, but it was because they seemed deeply decent, that they had a good spiritual life, and that they were good partners, they were good fathers, they were good sons. And that was attractive to me. So I implemented that into my life on a regular basis, and the byproduct of that was a really good life that I'm completely overpaid to have today. Um, and I still, uh, just as much as I say I rarely wake up in the morning in the mood for a salad, I usually want French toast, I wake up in the morning most times... It's usually not the morning. I'm- I am a morning person. It's usually at 4:00 a- 4:00 AM at night or 2:00 AM or 5:00 in the afternoon when I'm overtired and I had too much sugar when my mind starts going, "Just remember, it's all gonna be bad. You know that, right?" (laughs) But I have tools, you know? I have ways in which of dealing with that to get out of those thoughts, to break that bad cycle. Um, so it's just... The voices are never gone, but the volume's turned down.

    3. SBSteven Bartlett1:15:10

       I have to ask you. I've got one last question here in the diary that the last guest has left for you. But w- when you said you have tools, I was compelled because I know that there's someone at home who can completely relate and they're th- sat there thinking, "Josh, what are the tools?"

    4. JPJosh Peck1:15:24

       (laughs)

    5. SBSteven Bartlett1:15:24

       Uh, is there anything that's really helped you sort of turn down the volume on that, that you might recommend to someone listening at home?

    6. JPJosh Peck1:15:32

       I would just say, and, um, my friend John, AKA Wheels, um, his motto was, "Action is the magic word." And you cannot think your way into right acting. You have to act your way into right thinking. And I always felt like I'm reasonably articulate and I've, you know, I've prided myself on having what I thought was, like, a good mind. "I gotta be able to think my way out of this thing. Like, I have to be able to impress my will on this thing and wrestle it to death." Like, I- I just can't believe it. And it's the duality of these things 'cause didn't I get myself this far? Didn't me taking my life and my will into my hands, didn't I get all this success and notoriety and blah, blah, blah? And it's like, well, there was a part of it that that w-... But maybe you got that in spite of it, you know? Maybe the truth is, is that these things, you know, it- they need to be governed. They need to be throttled because inevitably, they'll pervert, they will, they'll ruin, you know, the... I just learned this. They say a couple bad apples, but w- the next part of that is a couple bad apples ruins the barrel, right? So it's like, I have to be careful with those thoughts and those feelings 'cause they can ruin everything. So what I would say is when- when I take the action to get out of self, when I become in service to others, when I do some reading, when I listen to a great podcast like this about people who are seekers, who are trying to better themselves, if you take the action, something will change. If you sit and you try to wrestle it, in my experience, it'll- it'll never work.

    7. SBSteven Bartlett1:17:23

       Amen.

    8. JPJosh Peck1:17:24

       (laughs)

14. 1:17:25 – 1:20:10

    The last guest's question

    1. JPJosh Peck1:17:25

    2. SBSteven Bartlett1:17:26

       H- the question left for you, who is the one person in your life that deserves the greatest thanks? And if you were to give them the thanks today, what would you say?

    3. JPJosh Peck1:17:38

       Well, I, uh, I- I almost don't want to 'cause it- it almost, like... 'Cause she loves- she loves her flowers, but yeah, I gotta give it to my mom. It all starts and ends with my mom. And we have a deeply imperfect relationship 'cause we're two deeply imperfect people. But at its core, she did more than I could've ever imagined. And especially being a father and seeing what it- how challenging it can be with all the help in the world, and she did it all by herself. And I just give her all the credit in the world. So much of why I'm here today is 'cause of her. So, thanks, Mom. I hope you don't watch this, but thank you.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett1:18:17

       (laughs)

    5. JPJosh Peck1:18:18

       I love you.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett1:18:19

       Josh, thank you so much. It's been a- a- an ho- honor to meet you and learn about your story. And, um, I'm a big follower now of your YouTube channel, so-

    7. JPJosh Peck1:18:26

       Aw.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett1:18:26

       ... please do post a lot more 'cause it's- it's enjoyable to watch. You bring, uh, important energy to the world. And your book is one of the m- the most vulnerable, revealing, but wisdom-laced books I've had the privilege of- of reading in my research for a podcast, so I- I recommend everybody to go grab a copy. I love the title, Happy People Are Annoying. Um, it's a truly important book. Thank you, Josh. (instrumental music plays) As you might know, this show is now sponsored by Airbnb. Absolutely love Airbnb, always have. Always been a, you know, saved my life on so many occasions. And my team, when we first got in touch with Airbnb, were talking about how most people don't realize that their place, where they currently live, could become an Airbnb. And I guess the second question there is, how much could your place be worth? And it turns out, you could be sitting on an Airbnb goldmine without even knowing it. Some people Airbnb their entire homes when they're away. That's what I did in New York. Whenever I left New York, uh, my place was on Airbnb and people rented it out. Sometimes for a day, sometimes for two days, sometimes for a week, and it's a great way to cover some of the bills while you're away. So whether you're looking to go on holiday or you just want some extra cash for bills or you wanna buy something nice for a valentine that you love, whatever it might be, head over to airbnb.co.uk/host, and you can find out how much your current property where you live can earn while you're not there. I suspect it might blow your mind, because it certainly blew mine. (instrumental music plays)

Episode duration: 1:20:10