How treating your voice like an instrument shapes reality

1. 0:00 – 2:15

   Intro

   1. VGVinh Giang0:00

      You have this ability to become confident in every single area of your life. It's about us just learning a new series of behaviors. For example, there's something called a siren technique. In three, two, and one. Now he goes, "I'm crazier than usual." (explosion)

   2. SBSteven Bartlett0:13

      (laughs)

   3. VGVinh Giang0:13

      Fantastic. That's fantastic. You did a great job, all right?

   4. SBSteven Bartlett0:15

      Okay.

   5. VGVinh Giang0:15

      And then this next one is volume. So critical, because if I just increase my volume and I talk like this, I sound a little bit aggressive, don't I? But with volume, to highlight something, you could go very quiet. So it's about waking people up to the power of their voice. And we all have access to these tools. Let's go through all five.

   6. NANarrator0:31

      Vinh Giang is the award-winning speaker and communication expert who helps people harness the power of their voice and body language in all areas of their life.

   7. VGVinh Giang0:38

      Just so overwhelming of how many people are suffering with not being able to communicate. They're asking, "I'm introverted. Does that mean that I'm doomed? How do I become more confident? How do I speak on the spot?" And we think there's no way for me to ever change this. It's super sad because I lived a massive part of my life like that. I was the awkward kid. I couldn't communicate with anyone. I moved schools so many times because I was bullied, but then I broke the mold, and then I just learned all these new behaviors, which has completely changed me. And anyone can do this in three to six months, and I'm going to teach you. So the first thing that really matters is a three-step process I call a record and review. It's gonna dramatically change the way you talk and the way you show up.

   8. SBSteven Bartlett1:10

      But how do we start a conversation with another human being?

   9. VGVinh Giang1:13

      (laughs) I've got a simple game called high, low buffalo, and it gives you three opportunities for a conversation to spark, and we'll play it in a second. And then there's hand gestures to level up your physical presence and then a simple framework that helps build connection. There's so many other things we could talk about.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett1:24

       And we are gonna go through them. But some people do have severe social anxiety. What do you say to those people?

   11. VGVinh Giang1:28

       The first thing I would do is...

   12. NANarrator1:30

       (instrumental music)

   13. SBSteven Bartlett1:33

       This has always blown my mind a little bit. 53% of you that listen to this show regularly haven't yet subscribed to the show. So could I ask you for a favor before we start? If you like the show and you like what we do here and you wanna support us, the free simple way that you can do just that is by hitting the subscribe button. And my commitment to you is, if you do that, then I'll do everything in my power, me and my team, to make sure that this show is better for you every single week. We'll listen to your feedback, we'll find the guests that you want me to speak to, and we'll continue to do what we do. Thank you so much. (upbeat music) Vinh, if you had to summarize what it is you do fundamentally and why you do it, how would you summarize it?

   14. VGVinh Giang2:13

       I help people learn that they have access

2. 2:15 – 4:01

   Why Do You Do What You Do?

   1. VGVinh Giang2:15

      to one of the most beautiful instruments in the world that can help them negotiate whatever reality they desire. And I learned this through my first ever vocal teacher, Ms. Stanley. And I'll, I'll never forget this experience. (laughs) There's a dingy music corner, um, in South Australia, and I would go there for lessons. And the first time I met her, I walked into the room, she's an old lady, and she says nothing to me except the words, "Sit down, young man." So I sit. It feels super awkward, it feels super weird. And then she plays one key nonstop on the piano for two minutes. It's literally, I was like, "Oh shit, this is like something out of a horror movie." And then she turns around and she goes, "How do you feel?" I said, "Nothing, weird, awkward. What?" And then she goes, "Good." Turns around, plays this beautiful song called Marriage D'Amour, goes over for two minutes, and then she turns around, she goes, "How do you feel?" And I said, "Uh, weirded out from before still, but I feel, wow, that song had love, there was lust, there was romance, there was excitement, there-" And she goes, "Good. Honey, most people, most people go through life speaking like this. I'm going to teach you how to speak like this." And that's, to me, at the time, I remember thinking to myself, "That is the greatest sales pitch I've ever heard in my life because I'm now going to sign up for 12 classes with you because you've just helped me realize something I've been struggling with my entire life. I haven't been thinking about my voice as an instrument. I thought it was a tool." What do you do with a hammer? You use a hammer. What do you do with a screwdriver? You use a screwdriver. What do you do with a piano? You play with it. What do you do with a violin? You play with it. And she started to teach me that I have this instrument that depending on how I play it, it changes and shift how others feel.

3. 4:01 – 6:18

   How Much Will This Information Change People's Life?

   1. VGVinh Giang4:01

   2. SBSteven Bartlett4:01

      How much do you think that will change the trajectory of someone's life? Like, what is the impact? If I get really good at communication, d- why does it matter?

   3. VGVinh Giang4:09

      I was invisible my entire childhood. I was invisible. I wasn't the cool kid. I wasn't the good-looking kid. I wasn't the charismatic kid. I wasn't the funny kid. I wasn't the anything kid. And by learning this skill, I've been able to negotiate an incredible reality. And that's why I love Tim Ferriss' quote so much, "Reality is negotiable." Cool. Well, what skill do we use to negotiate the reality we desire? It's our ability to communicate. Teaching that to others has been one of the most fulfilling things I've ever done. And I, I genuinely believe that makes the world a better place. And I almost sometimes feel like I'm just here to tune pianos. I'm here to help people tune and fix and learn how to play, and, and, and I get so much fulfillment from that. My parents have this fundamental belief, it's so beautiful, they, they believe every child is born with a diamond, with a gift, with a, with something in them. So I found one of my diamonds early on. It was magic, right? So I was really good at magic. They hoped it was medicine, accounting, you know, the Asian prophecy. So when I found that diamond, being magic, I thought that all I had to do was get really good technically as a magician 'cause that's what I was taught at university, being an accountant. Oh, if you become really technically proficient as an accountant, you'll become an amazing accountant. You'll, you'll be successful. You'll get the BMW, you'll get everything, get partner. So I thought, "Okay, magic, same thing. Get really good technically." Spent thousands of hours in my bedroom by myself in front of a mirror practicing magic. Got nowhere because I was missing an ingredient. Magicians call it showmanship. Fancy word for communication skills, right? One of, we, we are both inspired by the same person, I believe. One, one of the people we're inspired by is Derren Brown.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett5:51

      Mm-hmm.

   5. VGVinh Giang5:51

      Impeccable showmanship, impeccable technical skills. So when you pair technical skills with great communication skills, that's when you thrive, I believe. Because let's say, for example, you're technically brilliant, you're a 10 outta 10 technically, but you're three outta 10 with your communication skills. Do you think people perceive you to be a 10 outta 10 or a three outta 10?... and you know this, hearing so many different pitches. Some of the greatest ideas have flown under your radar without you noticing, because the founder didn't do it justice.

4. 6:18 – 9:06

   The Importance of Communication in Your Life and Career

   1. VGVinh Giang6:18

   2. SBSteven Bartlett6:18

      It's an interesting idea to think that we might rise or fall to the level, not of our technical ability, but our communication skills, as it relates to how the world perceives us.

   3. VGVinh Giang6:26

      And it's both, the importance there is both. Whereas I feel like we get stuck into this world where we think, "Oh, it's one or the other." And all my students always ask me this, "W- which one should I focus on, Vinh?" I say, "W- well, the reality is both."

   4. SBSteven Bartlett6:37

      Mm-hmm.

   5. VGVinh Giang6:37

      It's, it's not as simple. It, it, it's both. Because if I have great showmanship, and then when it comes to do, doing sleight of hand, I suck, (laughs) that's not gonna work either. The people that I've been able to help the most in my career so far are the people who are technically so amazing at what they do, and they've been hidden away in the back office as a technician. And then bloody Brad always gets the promotion, right? Brad always gets it. "Oh, damn it, Brad got it again. Brad's not smart as me, Brad is not as good as me." Right? And, and it's because Brad talks better. He's more visible in the work environment.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett7:10

      You really think it often comes down to just how we speak and communicate?

   7. VGVinh Giang7:14

      Our value, yes. Because if you can't communicate your value in a way that is clear and concise, people... It's, it's not their responsibility to see the brilliance that exists within you. It's, I believe, your responsibility to learn how to shine your light brightly. It's super sad, because I lived a massive part of my life like that. English is my third language. Uh, first language I learned is a Chinese dialect. Not that impressive, my wife speaks five, but thank you. The first language I learned was a Chinese dialect called Teochew. All right, so a bit of Teochew for you. 我 是 teochew 男 。 Second language I then had to learn fluently is Vietnamese. Vẫn là người Việt Nam. Tôi là Vincent ở nước Úc. So I had to learn all these different languages growing up, and these were my first two core languages that if I wasn't proficient in it, grandma would be pissed off, mum would be pissed off, so we had to study it. And then I went to school and had to learn English. So I went to school, I was completely invisible. I couldn't communicate with any other kid, they couldn't communicate with me, so what do kids do? "Oh, well, it's too hard, I'll just ignore you, then."

   8. SBSteven Bartlett8:16

      They bully you.

   9. VGVinh Giang8:17

      Oh, yes. I didn't even know it was bullying because I couldn't understand them. Right? I could kind of read what they, they seemed to mean, but I had no idea what they were saying. So I spent so much of my childhood, especially in those single digit years around five, six and seven... This is super sad, but I, I just spent a lot of time in the toilet, 'cause I didn't wanna deal with the shame of being seen by myself, so I just hid. I just found a corner somewhere, and no one... And then gradually I started to learn English, but even when I learned English, I sounded funny because I had an accent, so then they called me FOB. F-O-B, fresh off the boat. Yeah.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett8:50

       Mm-hmm.

   11. VGVinh Giang8:50

       And they just kept calling me, "Oh, there's the FOB, there's the FOB." "Oh, he's so FOBy." So, and then, so then even though I learned the English language now, I'm scared to speak it because I don't wanna sound like a FOB. And there were all these challenges, and so I know what it's like to feel invisible. I know what it's like to be ignored

5. 9:06 – 10:46

   How Easy Is It to Make a Radical Change in Your Communication Skills?

   1. VGVinh Giang9:06

      and...

   2. SBSteven Bartlett9:07

      That was a long time ago-

   3. VGVinh Giang9:09

      Yeah. (laughs)

   4. SBSteven Bartlett9:09

      ... and I guess the question that it leaves me with is-

   5. VGVinh Giang9:10

      Yeah.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett9:10

      ... how easy is it for someone to learn? Like, what is the time span that it would take, from the experience you've had with teaching people-

   7. VGVinh Giang9:16

      Mm-hmm.

   8. SBSteven Bartlett9:16

      ... to, to make a radical change in your communication skills?

   9. VGVinh Giang9:21

      It depends on your level of desire and motivation.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett9:23

       If you really want it.

   11. VGVinh Giang9:25

       I'd say s- three to six months.

   12. SBSteven Bartlett9:27

       You think you can change your-

   13. VGVinh Giang9:28

       Yes.

   14. SBSteven Bartlett9:28

       ... communication skills in a radical way in three to six months?

   15. VGVinh Giang9:30

       I've seen it. I've seen students do it. It's when instead of just thinking about, "I'm trying to learn a new habit," it's what James Clear says, you, you a- adopt a new identity-

   16. SBSteven Bartlett9:39

       Mm-hmm.

   17. VGVinh Giang9:40

       ... where they adopt that new identity. Because one of the things I do is I share that story about my schooling experience at the beginning of my in-person classes, and I say, "I want you all to imagine now you're at a new school. No one here in this room with us right now has any preconceived idea of who you are. Break the mold. Break it." And then you see grown adults do things they wouldn't normally do, break out of their... play with their voice, be a little silly, reconnect with their inner child. And then in that moment, they fall so deeply in love with that version of them because of the reactions they've been able to get from all these strangers around them, that they commit to it. It's when you experience that change in the moment, it usually leads to a fairly profound desire after that. "Oh, I wanna become this now." But then they make a big mistake, and the biggest (laughs) mistake they make is they'll go home to their partner and, who has no context of the experience they've been through, and they've just went, "Oh, I've been quiet with my, my voice my entire life." And they'll go home, they're like, "New me. New year, new me, honey." And, and then their, their, their, their partner goes, "Oh, why are you doing that with your voice? Oh, you learned that from Vinh? What? That's gross. Why are you doing that? It's so fake, it's so inauthentic."

   18. SBSteven Bartlett10:42

       Mm-hmm.

   19. VGVinh Giang10:42

       And then they revert back to who they have always been their entire life.

6. 10:46 – 11:45

   What's the Biggest Change People Experience?

   1. VGVinh Giang10:46

   2. SBSteven Bartlett10:46

      What areas of one's life have you seen in those examples change when someone learnt communication skills? 'Cause we, we have t- the examples you've given so far are just, like, work.

   3. VGVinh Giang10:57

      Yeah, yeah, yeah. With their children. This has been the coolest part, 'cause I'm a dad. I, I get... I, I, I teach a concept called, uh, vocal foundations, which we can dive into later, and there's these beautiful five core vocal foundations that people can learn. And I love it when parents go through it, 'cause I always see these comments where they said, "Oh, my goodness, just read to the kids. They've never reacted to me in that way before." The moment, the one night I go home and I read to my kids, and I do it in a boring way, they'll go, "Dad, don't read it like that."

   4. SBSteven Bartlett11:29

      (laughs)

   5. VGVinh Giang11:30

      "Do it the fun way."

   6. SBSteven Bartlett11:32

      (laughs)

   7. VGVinh Giang11:32

      And, and what they're asking for is they're asking for that vocal variety. They're asking for that inner child, for that playfulness. And I think that's one of the greatest... I think that's one of my greatest superpowers, is the ability to be playful, and the willingness to

7. 11:45 – 12:48

   How Cracking Your Communication Will Change Your Life

   1. VGVinh Giang11:45

      be playful.

   2. SBSteven Bartlett11:45

      So you're gonna help me in work, you're gonna help me be a more entertaining, engaging parent. Are there any other areas of one's life that improve when they crack communication?

   3. VGVinh Giang11:55

      Yes, there is an area, and the area (laughs) is improv. Learn improvisation. People all wanna get better at communication, often it's because they wanna get better at conversations. What is a game of conversation? What are we doing right now?

   4. SBSteven Bartlett12:09

      Mm-hmm.

   5. VGVinh Giang12:09

      What are we doing? This is a game of improv. I don't know what you're gonna say.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett12:11

      Yeah.

   7. VGVinh Giang12:12

      You don't know what I'm gonna say. And then based on what I say, you improvise and you say something. So even though I know you've never done improv before, you are amazing at improv, because that's a skill you had to have developed to become the incredible podcaster that you are right now.... right? So that, to me, is such an important skill when you're playing with your kids, too. It helps you with all areas of life. It's the tide that lifts all boats. Because kids love to play. They, they'll say something like, "Oh, and then the, then the cow now is an astronaut." And most parents will be like, "Oh, that's cool honey. That's cool." No, play. Now it's also fighting zombies that exist on the moon and you didn't know about it-

   8. SBSteven Bartlett12:42

      Mm-hmm.

   9. VGVinh Giang12:43

      ... and you play with them. And when you're playing, what are you using? You're using your ability to communicate.

8. 12:48 – 18:36

   Why Should People Listen to You?

   1. SBSteven Bartlett12:48

      And how many people have you taught, in person and/or online?

   2. VGVinh Giang12:52

      Oh, over 70,000 now.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett12:54

      Wow.

   4. VGVinh Giang12:55

      Yeah.

   5. SBSteven Bartlett12:56

      You have millions and millions and millions of followers online as well-

   6. VGVinh Giang12:58

      Yeah.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett12:58

      ... that tune in to learn communication skills from you, from all around the world. A- and if, and if I was to zoom in on the DMs that you get-

   8. VGVinh Giang13:06

      Mm-hmm.

   9. SBSteven Bartlett13:07

      ... the things that people are struggling with when they message you, w- the reason why they watch your videos, what is it?

   10. VGVinh Giang13:14

       The most common message that we get when people type a comment and leave it on our videos is, "Is it possible for me to change the sound of my voice?"

   11. SBSteven Bartlett13:23

       Really?

   12. VGVinh Giang13:24

       Well, because you think about it, right? Nobody likes the sound of their own voice. The first time you heard yourself on a podcast, were you like, "Oh, no," or did you say, "I love it. Look how sexy I sound"?

   13. SBSteven Bartlett13:33

       No. When I was younger and I w- you, like c- cassette recorders, and I heard my voice, I thought, "Fucking hell. Who's that?"

   14. VGVinh Giang13:37

       Yeah, me too.

   15. SBSteven Bartlett13:37

       Mm-hmm.

   16. VGVinh Giang13:38

       Right? So that is the biggest insec- one of the biggest insecurities for most people when they c- first become problem-aware with their communication skills is, "Oh, is it possible for me to change the sound of my voice? Is it possible? Is it possible?" And, and, and when you reflect upon this, even when you reflect af- reflect upon this, most people in their entire life will never change the way they sound. They will never change the way they communicate. They'll change the way they dress, they'll change their hair, they'll change their glasses, they'll change their what... They'll change all these things about themselves, but the way they communicate and the way they sound stays consistent generally.

   17. SBSteven Bartlett14:09

       Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

   18. VGVinh Giang14:11

       It's because there are a lot of psychological blocks that keep us sounding the same. We keep ourselves sounding the same. You know, there's... I'll share with you a few of these, okay?

   19. SBSteven Bartlett14:21

       Mm-hmm.

   20. VGVinh Giang14:23

       With my vocal teacher, at the beginning of my journey when she got me to do things with my voice where she said, "All right. Let's do a really high voice. Ha- have a bit of a play, Vinh, and you know, go into falsetto." And she would make me do things like this. I'd go red, because I'd go, "Oh, that feels so weird. Oh, now I'm becoming so deep with my voice. This feels so fake and it feels phony." I immediately came up with those objections, as I'm sure you would feel that too-

   21. SBSteven Bartlett14:46

       Mm-hmm.

   22. VGVinh Giang14:46

       ... if I got you to do that, right? And when I do it with my students, that's the immediate thing that comes up. They go, "It's fake. It's phony. That's not me." And then now, just like my vocal teacher, she would always challenge me, she goes, "Well, if you could make the sound and you played the key on your piano, you describe to me then how is it fake? How is it fake? If you are able to make that sound, that is you. That is your instrument. That is just you playing with keys you're unfamiliar with. That's it. You've gone through this entire life being so familiar with this key that anytime you pressed any other key, you go, 'Oh, it's not me.' No, no, no. You're just familiar with this key, and you're unfamiliar with the others." That alone helped me understand that, oh, wow, it's not fake. Because for the longest time, I thought it was fake, and because I thought it was fake, I never changed the way I talked.

   23. SBSteven Bartlett15:35

       And, and why is it that we don't want to play with those other keys? Is it because we've got so used to playing with a, a particular set of keys and-

   24. VGVinh Giang15:43

       Yeah, you're so familiar with it.

   25. SBSteven Bartlett15:44

       ... playing the other keys comes at a cost, a perceived cost?

   26. VGVinh Giang15:47

       Well, i- i- it goes deeper than that. It goes even deeper than that, because where did you get your voice from? Who did you learn it from? There's an idea that people have in their minds about this thing called a natural voice, okay? This is another objection my students give me. They go, "Oh, that's not my natural voice." And speech pathologists will tell you this. The voice you have right now is not your natural voice. You lost access to your natural voice when you were two or three. Question. If I asked you to scream at the top of your lungs right now-

   27. SBSteven Bartlett16:14

       Yeah.

   28. VGVinh Giang16:14

       ... for about 10 minutes-

   29. SBSteven Bartlett16:15

       Yeah.

   30. VGVinh Giang16:16

       ... what would happen to your voice?
9. 18:36 – 20:17

   Three Ways to Change How You're Perceived by Others

   1. VGVinh Giang18:36

   2. SBSteven Bartlett18:36

      Volume, melody, and hand gestures.

   3. VGVinh Giang18:39

      Yeah, I was thinking to one example of one of my students who, uh, a female, Rachel, who, who felt like she didn't have great executive presence, and it was because she became, she, she labeled herself as being shy. And I, I like to break these things down for my students too. I'm like, "The, the reason you're shy and the reason you're really good at being shy is because you've been repeating the shy behaviors for the last 25 years. So you're really good at it. And that's all right. It's because you've been practicing shy for 25 years. Being more confident, it's about us just learning a new series of behaviors. Let's, let's try a larger gesture." L- I've seen this on multiple podcasts now, "Just try a larger gesture, try a stronger volume, try being more melodic with your voice." And then she was practicing that, and immediately the feelings of, "Oh, it feels fake, it feels phony," but I go, "Oh, no, it's just unfamiliar." And the moment she makes that reset, she goes, "Oh, I'll continue to explore, then." Whereas if she thinks it's fake, she will revert back to being who she was before. So how do I speak impromptu? How do I be in the moment and come up with a good answer? Another one is, "I'm introverted. Does that mean that I'm doomed?" (laughs)

   4. SBSteven Bartlett19:48

      Okay.

   5. VGVinh Giang19:49

      Yeah. And another really common one is, "I don't have much connection in my life. I wish I felt more connected to the people that I'm around. Why is it that I can't get past the, the, the, 'Good day, mate, how are you?' 'Yeah, I'm good. How are you?' 'Yeah, I'm good.' 'All right, cheers, mate. Have a good one.'"

   6. SBSteven Bartlett20:07

      Oh, the small talk.

   7. VGVinh Giang20:08

      Yeah, yeah. This is a big topic, right? So a- again, it's just how do we, how do we get to these conversations li- that you get to have on so many of these wonderful podcasts that you do? So I reckon you would have insights here

10. 20:17 – 22:49

    What Is Vocal Image and How Does It Help Us?

    1. VGVinh Giang20:17

       too.

    2. SBSteven Bartlett20:17

       There's like s- I was looking earlier, there's almost like a billion search results on Google for people trying to figure out, um, or trying to provide answers to how to communicate successfully.

    3. VGVinh Giang20:26

       Mm-hmm.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett20:26

       So let's get into it. So I-

    5. VGVinh Giang20:28

       Okay.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett20:28

       ... you use this term vocal image.

    7. VGVinh Giang20:30

       Yeah.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett20:30

       What does vocal image mean?

    9. VGVinh Giang20:32

       It came about when I realized I spend, and, and I think most of us spend a lot of time on our visual image, right? How, how we look, our body language, the way we dress.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett20:40

        Mm-hmm.

    11. VGVinh Giang20:41

        But very rarely do people spend time on their vocal image. Now, I'll make it make sense. When people see you and you reveal your visual image, they make assumptions about you pretty quickly.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett20:50

        Mm-hmm.

    13. VGVinh Giang20:50

        So they form assumptions, "Oh, this person seems friendly. Maybe they're confident because they've got good posture. Maybe they're smiling, they're friendly." And then all of a sudden, when you open your mouth and you speak, they now turn these assumptions into beliefs, as what may be assumptions before. Now they go, "Oh, you are friendly. You are confident." Right? Or they might think, "Oh, no. Bit of a wanker."

    14. SBSteven Bartlett21:11

        (laughs)

    15. VGVinh Giang21:12

        Right? And, and, and you've had these experiences before, I've had them before, where you assume, you see someone, you go, "Oh, that person's really good." Go meet them, you're, "Ah, not really nice. That's weird." So it's another layer that we don't think about, though, because we, again, think we're stuck with our voice. We think we're stuck with the way we communicate. We think there's no way for me to ever change this.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett21:30

        So let's, let's talk about how one can improve their vocal image-

    17. VGVinh Giang21:33

        Okay. (laughs)

    18. SBSteven Bartlett21:33

        ... so that they're effective across context.

    19. VGVinh Giang21:35

        Sure.

    20. SBSteven Bartlett21:35

        You mentioned melody, volume, hand gestures.

    21. VGVinh Giang21:38

        Mm-hmm.

    22. SBSteven Bartlett21:38

        If we start with melody, what the hell is melody?

    23. VGVinh Giang21:41

        The different notes you can hit with your voice.

    24. SBSteven Bartlett21:43

        Okay, so is that variety?

    25. VGVinh Giang21:44

        Yeah, variety, yeah. Pitch variety. Pitch and melody.

    26. SBSteven Bartlett21:46

        Okay.

    27. VGVinh Giang21:47

        Well, because there's a melody that lives underneath your voice. All right, let's do an experiment. I'm gonna play you a, a piano song.

    28. SBSteven Bartlett21:52

        Mm-hmm.

    29. VGVinh Giang21:53

        And I want you to listen to this and then, you at home right now, I want you to listen to, to the track and see what words come to mind. So we'll just play, we'll play the song. (piano music)

    30. SBSteven Bartlett22:07

        Okay, yeah, um-
11. 22:49 – 27:20

    How Melody Evokes Emotions

    1. VGVinh Giang22:49

    2. SBSteven Bartlett22:49

       Uh, like a horror movie.

    3. VGVinh Giang22:51

       Yes. (laughs)

    4. SBSteven Bartlett22:51

       Scary.

    5. VGVinh Giang22:52

       About to die.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett22:53

       Yes.

    7. VGVinh Giang22:53

       Something bad's about to happen.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett22:54

       Yeah.

    9. VGVinh Giang22:54

       Ominous.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett22:55

        Little, little three-year-old stood on the, the landing of the staircase at nighttime.

    11. VGVinh Giang22:59

        Yes, with long, black hair.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett23:00

        Yeah.

    13. VGVinh Giang23:00

        Yes, correct. So that, that, that, again, all of a sudden paints all these different vivid pictures in your head.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett23:06

        Mm-hmm.

    15. VGVinh Giang23:07

        The reason I did that experiment is there were no words in any of those tracks, yet think about all of the words that rushed to your mind as you were experiencing the melody.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett23:19

        Mm-hmm.

    17. VGVinh Giang23:20

        The different notes. What people fail to realize is that you have a melody in your voice.

    18. SBSteven Bartlett23:25

        Yeah.

    19. VGVinh Giang23:26

        This is why when some people walk into our lives, it, it could drain (laughs) the energy from our lives-

    20. SBSteven Bartlett23:31

        Mm-hmm.

    21. VGVinh Giang23:32

        ... and when they walk in, you feel the impact of them walking in, right, in the negative way or a positive way. Some walk in and you go, "Oh, I feel good. I feel great." What is that? It's the melody in which they come in with.

    22. SBSteven Bartlett23:42

        Can you have a pretty limited range, a, a limited melody, but still hit people with scary, and sad, and inspiring?

    23. VGVinh Giang23:51

        I believe you can.

    24. SBSteven Bartlett23:52

        Yeah.

    25. VGVinh Giang23:52

        A- again, because we, we genuinely don't have 88 keys, right? So again, it's one of those... it's a, it's a, it's a metaphor, but I believe that we can create so many different songs with our voice if we learn to treat it as an instrument. And we, we can, we can play with the technique to help you increase your vocal range, if you want.

    26. SBSteven Bartlett24:08

        Sure.

    27. VGVinh Giang24:09

        There's something called a, uh... This is fun. This is a fun one. There's something called a siren technique.

    28. SBSteven Bartlett24:13

        Okay.

    29. VGVinh Giang24:14

        Okay, so a siren technique is when you, you read something with a low voice and then you go towards a high voice, and you go back down to a low voice.

    30. SBSteven Bartlett24:20

        Mm-hmm.
12. 27:20 – 30:44

    How to Know If You're Overdoing It

    1. VGVinh Giang27:20

    2. SBSteven Bartlett27:20

       How d'you know you've not played with it too far? Do you know what I'm saying?

    3. VGVinh Giang27:22

       By playing with it too far and then getting feedback.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett27:25

       Right.

    5. VGVinh Giang27:25

       And people are so afraid of that, though. And they don't realize that they, they don't go too far. They underplay. The risk is not going too far. The risk is-

    6. SBSteven Bartlett27:35

       And-

    7. VGVinh Giang27:35

       ... not going far enough.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett27:36

       Again, at this point when people heard me s-

    9. VGVinh Giang27:37

       Yeah.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett27:37

        ... squeak, squeak-

    11. VGVinh Giang27:38

        Of course, of course.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett27:39

        ... squeaking like Mickey Mouse-

    13. VGVinh Giang27:40

        Yeah, yeah.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett27:40

        ... they're gonna say, "Fuck me." Like, I... You're gonna have to remind me again, Vin, why this is worth it.

    15. VGVinh Giang27:44

        You'll be able to make people feel more connected to you. They'll feel what you're saying, not just hear what you're saying. I mean, do you notice this in some people?

    16. SBSteven Bartlett27:51

        Of course.

    17. VGVinh Giang27:51

        They will say things, but you don't feel it.

    18. SBSteven Bartlett27:53

        Yeah.

    19. VGVinh Giang27:54

        It happens in America's Got Talent, Australia's Got Talent, where Simon Cowell will say, "Right, right. Very good, but I don't feel it." What are they talking about? It's the emotion in their voice. There is emotion in your voice, too. Do you wanna go to the next one?

    20. SBSteven Bartlett28:06

        Please.

    21. VGVinh Giang28:07

        Let's go.

    22. SBSteven Bartlett28:07

        I didn't know there was more.

    23. VGVinh Giang28:08

        There's more. Yeah.

    24. SBSteven Bartlett28:08

        Okay.

    25. VGVinh Giang28:08

        There's five.

    26. SBSteven Bartlett28:09

        Fuck. Okay.

    27. VGVinh Giang28:09

        Let's go through all five. No, ne- next one. I'm just gonna get you to read this one as you would, and then I'll tell you what it is.

    28. SBSteven Bartlett28:14

        Okay.

    29. VGVinh Giang28:14

        Just so you don't get ahead of yourself.

    30. SBSteven Bartlett28:16

        Okay.
13. 30:44 – 34:52

    The Importance of Pauses in Your Speech

    1. VGVinh Giang30:44

       down.

    2. SBSteven Bartlett30:44

       When people are nervous-

    3. VGVinh Giang30:45

       Yes.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett30:46

       ... what, what happens? They-

    5. VGVinh Giang30:47

       They speed up.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett30:47

       They speed up.

    7. VGVinh Giang30:48

       They speed up.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett30:49

       Considerably?

    9. VGVinh Giang30:49

       ... considerably. And-

    10. SBSteven Bartlett30:51

        Have, have they ever measured that?

    11. VGVinh Giang30:53

        Oh.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett30:53

        Does anybody know?

    13. VGVinh Giang30:54

        If you get above 210 words per minute, you're- it'd be a little bit too fast.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett30:58

        And what's the average person speaking at, in terms of words per minute?

    15. VGVinh Giang31:00

        Around 150. You wanna get to around 150, 180. That's very good.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett31:04

        Okay.

    17. VGVinh Giang31:04

        That's a good kind of rate of speech to be at. Whereas if you're slower than that, then again, it just gets a little bit monotonous at times for people. But again, here's what's fascinating. If I... If all of a sudden now I stick to a default melody and then stick to a default rate of speech, notice what's happening in your brain, right? All of a sudden you start to... Again, you'll start to switch off, right?

    18. SBSteven Bartlett31:25

        Mm-hmm.

    19. VGVinh Giang31:26

        Whereas all of a sudden, if I start to vary my rate of speech, the transition from slow to fast is what's hooking people. So if you were to try to read that again now, but I want you to slow, and some bits painfully slow down and play with your voice. And then some bits go quicker. And then the last bit, I'm gonna kill you, slow it all the way down and be playful. It's not about...

    20. SBSteven Bartlett31:45

        Okay, I'm gonna start-

    21. VGVinh Giang31:46

        Yeah.

    22. SBSteven Bartlett31:46

        ... from here.

    23. VGVinh Giang31:46

        Sure.

    24. SBSteven Bartlett31:47

        "If you're looking for a ransom, I can tell you that I don't have money."

    25. VGVinh Giang31:53

        Hmm.

    26. SBSteven Bartlett31:54

        "But what I do have-"

    27. VGVinh Giang31:55

        Oh.

    28. SBSteven Bartlett31:56

        "... are a particular set of skills.

    29. VGVinh Giang31:58

        (laughs)

    30. SBSteven Bartlett31:59

        "Skills I've acquired over a very long-"
14. 34:52 – 36:35

    What Volume of Voice Signals Confidence?

    1. VGVinh Giang34:52

    2. SBSteven Bartlett34:52

       And what signals I'm not a confident person? What side of the scale?

    3. VGVinh Giang34:57

       The lower scale.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett34:58

       Okay.

    5. VGVinh Giang34:58

       On volume.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett34:59

       Okay.

    7. VGVinh Giang34:59

       Because that's one of the default shy behaviors that a lot of people exhibit.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett35:03

       And what about leaders? Where do they land on the scale?

    9. VGVinh Giang35:07

       D- Depends if they're self-aware.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett35:08

        Right.

    11. VGVinh Giang35:08

        Sometimes, if they're not self-aware, they can be on the higher end, and that's, you know, just have someone come across as a little arrogant. Sometimes it's just too much volume. Because too much volume without the other foundations, now you come across arrogant. So again, if I give this back to you, and again, just for fun, like, I, I want you to go loud. I want people to hear outside of this studio what we're doing.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett35:26

        Yeah, fuck.

    13. VGVinh Giang35:27

        Right? So just, just have a go, and just... And give me, and give me a whisper, too.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett35:30

        (laughs)

    15. VGVinh Giang35:30

        At some point, give me a whisper, too.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett35:34

        "Now, if you know what you're worth, then go out and get it."

    17. VGVinh Giang35:37

        Hmm.

    18. SBSteven Bartlett35:38

        "Go out and get what you're worth."

    19. VGVinh Giang35:40

        (laughs)

    20. SBSteven Bartlett35:40

        "But you have to be willing to take the hits and not pointing fingers saying you ain't where you want to be because of him or her or anybody. Cowards do that. And that ain't you."

    21. VGVinh Giang35:53

        Yeah.

    22. SBSteven Bartlett35:53

        "You're better than that."

    23. VGVinh Giang35:55

        Oh. It's amazing.

    24. SBSteven Bartlett35:57

        Yeah.

    25. VGVinh Giang35:57

        What you just did made me feel. Why did I feel? It's... What is a voice? A voice is a series of vibrations. So you just sent vibrations my way that made me feel.

    26. SBSteven Bartlett36:07

        Mm-hmm.

    27. VGVinh Giang36:08

        That's why we say people have good vibes, right? We kind of... We, we, we understand it's happening, but we don't understand at that kind of frequency level, at the vibration level. But it's happening at a physical level-

    28. SBSteven Bartlett36:17

        Mm-hmm.

    29. VGVinh Giang36:18

        ... where depending on how you use your voice, you're genuinely moving people quite physically.

    30. SBSteven Bartlett36:25

        We did rate of speech. We did volume. We did the melody.
15. 36:35 – 37:15

    Create Emotion With Your Voice

    1. VGVinh Giang36:35

    2. SBSteven Bartlett36:35

       "And it's not because I'm lonely, and it's not because it's New Year's Eve. I came here tonight because when you realize you want to spend the rest of your life with somebody, you want the rest of your life to start as soon as possible."

    3. VGVinh Giang36:45

       What we're moving into now is the emotion that exists within your voice, tonality.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett36:49

       Yeah.

    5. VGVinh Giang36:50

       This is the emotion that exists, right? So the way to add more emotion into your voice is to move your face.Because as I eloquently put it at times, your face is the remote control that allows you to add emotion into your voice.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett37:03

       Yeah.

    7. VGVinh Giang37:04

       So let's play, right? So now, I'll give you different faces to make. I'll tell you different faces to make, and you make those different faces and allow those emotions to come through your voice.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett37:11

       Okay.

    9. VGVinh Giang37:11

       So if it's happy, then I want you to sound really happy. If it's sad-

    10. SBSteven Bartlett37:13

        Mm-hmm.

    11. VGVinh Giang37:13

        ... I want you to sound really sad.

16. 37:15 – 41:21

    Gesticulating With Your Face

    1. VGVinh Giang37:15

       So we, we'll start with... And, and try your best to play with this. I want you to make disgust, like just, ugh, disgust, and let that come through and give me a more volume. Give me disgust in three, two...

    2. SBSteven Bartlett37:25

       And it's not because you're lonely.

    3. VGVinh Giang37:27

       Yeah.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett37:28

       And it's not because it's New Year's Eve.

    5. VGVinh Giang37:29

       Surprised. Really surprised.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett37:32

       I came here tonight because when you realize you want to spend the rest of your life-

    7. VGVinh Giang37:36

       Angry. Give me angry.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett37:39

       ... you want the rest of your life to start as soon as possible.

    9. VGVinh Giang37:41

       Happy. Best day of your life, Stephen.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett37:43

        You want the rest of your life to start as soon as possible.

    11. VGVinh Giang37:46

        That's so beautiful. Y- You know this already. In our brains, there's mirror neurons, all right? And when I see you go through these different facial expressions, I feel what you feel. Even though I know this is a, a situation we've created here for us to experiment and it's a safe environment. But every time you went through any of those emotions, I felt it.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett38:02

        Hmm.

    13. VGVinh Giang38:03

        Because I didn't just see it.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett38:05

        Are men worse at this stuff?

    15. VGVinh Giang38:06

        Yes, they are. Yes. Because I feel... Well, for me, I can only speak personally for me, I was taught to keep my emotions on the inside.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett38:13

        Right.

    17. VGVinh Giang38:13

        I was taught that it's a sign of weakness to show you being sad, you being happy. You should just be-

    18. SBSteven Bartlett38:19

        Composed.

    19. VGVinh Giang38:19

        ... composed at all times. And then that's what I thought, and, and that led me to the behavior of speaking. Whereas I would just always speak like this because I'm a man, and I should always speak like this.

    20. SBSteven Bartlett38:30

        Mm-hmm.

    21. VGVinh Giang38:30

        And I still remember going to one of the concerts and my, my, my wife turns up and she goes, "How do you feel?" I'm like, "This is a really exciting concert."

    22. SBSteven Bartlett38:36

        (laughs)

    23. VGVinh Giang38:37

        And, and, and she goes, "Well, okay, you obviously hate it." And I'm like, "No, no, I love it. I love it." (laughs) And I just, I didn't know how to emote. And again, I thought I was stuck like that because I was stuck like that for years. And that, that damaged a lot of my relationships. Because here's the thing that I think, and it might be helpful for you too. When you're listening to someone talk, you don't have to react with sound, because otherwise you'll be seen as interrupting the other person, right? You can react with facial expressions. And that is one of the most powerful ways to show them you're listening and that you're following along. How cool is that? Because if someone's saying something really bad and you're like... (sighs)

    24. SBSteven Bartlett39:12

        Yeah.

    25. VGVinh Giang39:12

        It shows them you're locked in.

    26. SBSteven Bartlett39:14

        Yeah, you learn it as a podcaster.

    27. VGVinh Giang39:15

        Yes, you do.

    28. SBSteven Bartlett39:16

        Because the audience, they're looking at you for most of the conversation. So 95% of the conversation is on you.

    29. VGVinh Giang39:21

        Yes.

    30. SBSteven Bartlett39:22

        What they don't know-
17. 41:21 – 43:45

    The Storytelling Formula

    1. VGVinh Giang41:21

    2. SBSteven Bartlett41:21

       Do you have a storytelling formula?

    3. VGVinh Giang41:22

       I do.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett41:23

       What is the storytelling formula?

    5. VGVinh Giang41:25

       I think the way most people tell stories is they report stories. So I'll share a story with you. Okay? And reporting a story is, let's say you ask me the question, I... This is one of my favorite stories. It's, let's say you ask me how I met my wife. A reporting a story is just me saying, "Oh, I met my wife at a bar. And I did some magic to her. She didn't like it." And that was cool. And then I gradually was able to woo her in the end, but I met her at a bar. That's me, that's me reporting the story.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett41:50

       Mm-hmm.

    7. VGVinh Giang41:51

       Right? It kind of sounds like a news reporter.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett41:52

       Yeah.

    9. VGVinh Giang41:52

       So if you think about it, again, let me just anchor it with a news reporter. It's like a news reporter saying, "Last night at a bar at 9:00 PM, Vin Jiang went to a bar called Distill and tried to pick up a girl, did a cheesy magic trick. It didn't work. Therefore, he failed. He came back four times again, and then he saw her, and then he succeeded. And now they're married. On to the next news." Right?

    10. SBSteven Bartlett42:08

        Mm-hmm.

    11. VGVinh Giang42:09

        So it's kind of very reportory. Whereas-

    12. SBSteven Bartlett42:11

        Matter of fact.

    13. VGVinh Giang42:12

        Matter of fact.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett42:13

        Yeah.

    15. VGVinh Giang42:13

        Whereas this is the story of how I met my wife. So I, I still remember this because this happened in 2009. I crashed a girl's graduation party named Vivian. It was at a bar called Distill, this beautiful bar called Distill. And there was two levels to this bar, and the bottom was for everybody, and on top was the high rollers and you had to buy expensive drinks to get to the top. And I got to the top and I saw this beautiful Malaysian girl sitting by the bar. So I said to my friends, I said, "Watch this." And I take a packet of cards out of my pants 'cause I'm a magician. So I walk up to her, walk up to her and I say, "Would you be impressed if I transform this king of hearts into the queen of hearts like yourself?" Disgusted. I know, you're making the disgusted face. And, and that's how she reacted. She, she looked at me as if she smelt a bloody fart. She looks at me and she goes, "I'd be more impressed if you transformed into a real man and had a conversation with me." Boom.... and I've never had that reaction before. Normally people say, "Wow, you're amazing." So I said to her, "No, thanks," and I left with my tail between my legs. The boys all teased me and everything. But I was so drawn, her confidence, just, ugh. There was something there. I went back to the bar four times in a row. She wasn't there, she wasn't there, she wasn't there, then she was there. And I walked up to her the second time and I said, "Hey, listen, what if I transformed into a real man tonight and took you out for a coffee?" And we fell in love. You know, and that, that's, that's the story of how I met my wife. Whereas the way I would normally tell that story is just, "Oh, I met her at a bar, I did some tricks, she didn't like it," and then that was that.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett43:41

        Yeah.

    17. VGVinh Giang43:42

        But all of a sudden there was so much life, so much zest in that story.

18. 43:45 – 47:12

    VAKS: Relive a Story, Don't Report It!

    1. VGVinh Giang43:45

    2. SBSteven Bartlett43:45

       I noticed you added so much almost irrelevant detail.

    3. VGVinh Giang43:49

       Ugh.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett43:49

       You talked about the bar having two floors and stuff like that.

    5. VGVinh Giang43:51

       To make it visual.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett43:52

       Okay, so I could picture it in my mind.

    7. VGVinh Giang43:54

       Yes.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett43:54

       And why does that matter?

    9. VGVinh Giang43:54

       I wanted to make it visual. Well, it, it, it's... well... okay, so here's the thing. When you think of the storytelling formula, if you just give the who, what, where, and when, that's the basics people need. But what turns it from reporting to reliving, because that's what you wanna get to, you wanna get to reliving a story, is the ingredients that you just called out. So intuitive of you to call 'em out. VAKS, V-A-K-S, which stands for visual, auditory, kinesthetic, and smell.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett44:19

        Mm-hmm.

    11. VGVinh Giang44:20

        So I'm just describing those few things for you, right? And it doesn't always have to have all the ingredients, but you wanna add some of those ingredients. Right? So the visual, I described to you the visual. The auditory, what I said, I did my voice, I did her voice. I gave you dialogue, right? So all of a sudden you bring those, the story to life. Now it goes from reporting to reliving. So if I, if I told that story, and let's say that now the connection ability is... again, it's to do with improv as well... is instead of just going out and saying, "Here's three ways to show up authentically when you're trying to pick up someone."

    12. SBSteven Bartlett44:51

        Yeah.

    13. VGVinh Giang44:51

        Instead of doing that, I share the story first. I get you to engage, I build rapport, I build chemistry. Now you've heard the story, now you have rapport with me, you feel more relaxed, you feel more creative, right? Then I link that story to, "So the very next time you walk into a girl, if she does say no, she may not be saying no to you. She may just be saying no to your approach. Here are the three ways you can show up more authentically as a man."

    14. SBSteven Bartlett45:14

        Hmm.

    15. VGVinh Giang45:15

        I believe that is a much more powerful way to then go into the three tips. Whereas I, I feel that because of the world now with social media, we just... we, we, we've lost the art form of storytelling. It's just, "Give me the three tips now."

    16. SBSteven Bartlett45:29

        I've heard you talk about these four elements to a great story, which is the hook, the struggle, the breakthrough, and the application, which is kind of what you just displayed there.

    17. VGVinh Giang45:38

        Well, the, the importance of application, I think, is something that I really focus on with my students.

    18. SBSteven Bartlett45:43

        The... and by application you mean the lesson or the big takeaway from the story?

    19. VGVinh Giang45:46

        Yeah.

    20. SBSteven Bartlett45:46

        'Cause sometimes people tell stories and they go nowhere.

    21. VGVinh Giang45:48

        Well, it's also what you do after.

    22. SBSteven Bartlett45:50

        Okay.

    23. VGVinh Giang45:51

        Because I can, I can share a story, but if I... one of our videos went viral, and, and I don't claim to be an expert on social media, okay? So I don't... I still don't understand how some of these things work. Even though we've been able to grow all of our social channels quite quickly, I, I don't understand how it works. It... to me, I'm like, "Oh, wow, I can't believe that worked last time. Oh, it doesn't work anymore. Huh? That's weird." So to me it's... what people love is when you give them a really simple, pragmatic takeaway that they can go and actually do. Like, "Go do it now."

    24. SBSteven Bartlett46:20

        Mm-hmm.

    25. VGVinh Giang46:21

        Where- whereas we, we don't apply knowledge. We just keep consuming and go through knowledge acquisition. There's, there's a cycle of doom that we go through. There's just this cycle of... I mean, this is the cycle my students go through. "Oh, job promotion. Oh, crap, I need to work on my communication skills." What's the first thing they do? They go to Google, and then they Google, "How do I improve my interview skills, my communication skills?" Then they get back 10.6 million results. They go, "Ah, this is too crazy. Surely someone's created a YouTube video." Then they go to YouTube, they type in "how to improve communication skills." (laughs) They get three million videos, right? And they go, "Oh, this is too... ChatGPT. I'll go to ChatGPT now. How do I improve communication skills?" And it gives you these generic answers from blogs that have no relevance to you. And then after that you feel so overwhelmed, you do nothing with it. But it's just this cycle we all fall victim to over and over and over again. We just keep consuming knowledge and nothing actually changes because we're not applying it.

19. 47:12 – 50:20

    Run These Techniques in the Real World

    1. SBSteven Bartlett47:12

       So the, the key is to get out there and start running some of these techniques in the real world?

    2. VGVinh Giang47:17

       And just pick one. Pick one and just try it. It's like we are going through all these different things. Right after this episode, go out and just try tonality with your kids, and read them a children's book, because those books are naturally emotive. And if you don't have kids, borrow a niece or a nephew, and just watch the impact on the other human being as you play with your instrument. Watch them smile, watch them giggle, watch them react to the way you play your instrument, because then it wakes you up to the fact that you've got access to this and that "I can change the way someone feels." What power. Yet we don't use it.

    3. SBSteven Bartlett47:53

       I've just realized that there's one more left.

    4. VGVinh Giang47:54

       There is one more left, yeah.

    5. SBSteven Bartlett47:55

       Okay. I know what... I know what this one is.

    6. VGVinh Giang47:56

       Yeah, yeah, of course. If you didn't, I'd be-

    7. SBSteven Bartlett47:58

       Yeah.

    8. VGVinh Giang47:58

       ... quite deeply offended.

    9. SBSteven Bartlett47:59

       Yeah.

    10. VGVinh Giang48:00

        I'll get you to read this (laughs) and we'll play with the last one.

    11. SBSteven Bartlett48:02

        Okay.

    12. VGVinh Giang48:02

        Yeah. Okay.

    13. SBSteven Bartlett48:04

        "My name is Maximus Decimus Meridius-"

    14. VGVinh Giang48:07

        Correct.

    15. SBSteven Bartlett48:08

        "... Commander of the Armies of the North, General of the Felix Legions, loyal servant to the true emperor, Marcus Aurelius, father to a murderous son, husband to a murdered wife. And I will have my vengeance in the life or the next."

    16. VGVinh Giang48:21

        Perfect. Now we're gonna read it again-

    17. SBSteven Bartlett48:23

        Mm-hmm.

    18. VGVinh Giang48:23

        ... except the final foundation here with the voice is pause. Whatever emotion comes before the pause, once you pause, it intensifies that emotion. So if you've got the feeling of anger and you pause, well, that is a pause of anger. But if all of a sudden I'm sad and, and then I pause.

    19. SBSteven Bartlett48:40

        You prolong the sadness.

    20. VGVinh Giang48:41

        It's a pause of sadness. And think about how important the pause is in music. And I love the world of music. I love listening to orchestral music. And when you think about it, what happens right after a crescendo? It's a pause.

    21. SBSteven Bartlett48:53

        Silence.

    22. VGVinh Giang48:54

        The most important note that they play during that piece, yet we barely use it. And what else does the pause do? When you pause, you give me time to process what you're saying.

    23. SBSteven Bartlett49:04

        Mm-hmm.

    24. VGVinh Giang49:04

        Yet we are so afraid of the pause.

    25. SBSteven Bartlett49:07

        My name is Maximus Decimus Meridius, commander of the Armies of the North, general of the Felix Legions, loyal servant to the true emperor, Marcus Aurelius. Father to the murdered son, husband to a murdered wife, and I will have my vengeance in this life or the next.

    26. VGVinh Giang49:39

        Oh, beautiful. When you paused, you gave me time to, to process the weight of what you're saying.

    27. SBSteven Bartlett49:47

        Mm-hmm.

    28. VGVinh Giang49:48

        The first time you read it, you rushed through it, just like that nervous employee in front of their leaders who just rushed through it. You may have just shared the most brilliant plan for a marketing campaign, but because you rushed through it, I didn't feel the weight of how profound the strategy is.

    29. SBSteven Bartlett50:01

        There's something when you pause. You almost... You tell the person, don't you, ac- almost inexplicitly that they should really give a fuck about the thing you just said.

    30. VGVinh Giang50:09

        Yeah.
20. 50:20 – 52:48

    Is There a Voice Tone That Makes People Dislike You?

    1. VGVinh Giang50:20

       Clarity.

    2. SBSteven Bartlett50:21

       Do you think there's a certain set of those tools that when applied... Or a certain sort of style of speaking that makes people dislike you? Is there a certain one that just doesn't make them warm to you? Is it the low pitches? Is it the fast speaking?

    3. VGVinh Giang50:36

       The, there's sounds that people don't like. For example, have you ever called... I don't mean to pick on real estate agents, but it happens a lot to me in Australia. When you call a real estate agent, it's, "Hello, this is James from XY Real Estate." And when you hear that sequence of melody, "No worries, I'll put you onto the next person," and you hear... You switch off. You just go, "Ugh, this person just, like just... I'm not really connected to that person." And all you have to do is you just tell them to switch the melody and just don't use that sing-song voice, and they call that a sing-song voice in the world of vocal training, right? You've got a sing-song voice, and if you keep following the same rhythm, you have a sing-song voice. So instead of doing that, just go, "Hey, it's James. How can I help, mate?" You said the same thing, you just switched up the melody. That sounds a little more sincere.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett51:17

       'Cause it was a bit more varied, or...

    5. VGVinh Giang51:19

       Ex- exactly right, and it's not what everybody uses, because once everybody uses the same thing, all of a sudden it, it now sounds like a script. That's why people are so afraid when they're creating content online. They go, "I, I don't wanna sound scripted." There's a sound to it, and it generally follows that... That's why newscasters, they... there's a sound to it.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett51:38

       Yeah.

    7. VGVinh Giang51:38

       "Last night at 9:00 PM." There's that, there's a rhy- and then they keep using the same rhythm over and over and over and over again, the same melody sequence over and over and over and over again.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett51:46

       And am I right in thinking if I wanted to be really boring, I should just kill all variety?

    9. VGVinh Giang51:50

       Kill all the foundations. Nothing.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett51:52

        Okay.

    11. VGVinh Giang51:52

        Give me nothing. And, and it's what happens when people... Again, the people that I serve, it's what happens is because they go, "I'll let my work speak for itself." And, and I say, "That's great. That means you do great work, but why not speak for your work too?" Why can't we do both?

    12. SBSteven Bartlett52:08

        Mm-hmm.

    13. VGVinh Giang52:08

        Why does it have to be one or the other?

    14. SBSteven Bartlett52:10

        Yeah. It's a shame not to do your work justice, you know, 'cause you can do a disservice just by delivering it without the foundations, as you've said.

    15. VGVinh Giang52:17

        Yeah.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett52:18

        And, and then other people, as you said, they can have the, half the idea but double the...

    17. VGVinh Giang52:23

        Double the showmanship.

    18. SBSteven Bartlett52:24

        Yeah.

    19. VGVinh Giang52:24

        And that happens too. That happens too, right? So to me it's about helping those who they've, they've got something amazing. You've got a story you need to share. You've got an idea you need to pitch. You've got incredible technical skills that you've worked on for the last 15 years and you're thinking, "Why am I still stuck in this position?" It's, well, hey, let's, let's do great work and let's, let's allow ourselves to build the ability and grow the ability to

21. 52:48 – 57:24

    Practical Steps to Know If You're Good at Speaking

    1. VGVinh Giang52:48

       shine.

    2. SBSteven Bartlett52:49

       How does one increase their self-awareness as it relates to their communication skills? Is there a, is there a practice I can do-

    3. VGVinh Giang52:55

       Yeah.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett52:55

       ... to understand if I'm good, bad, or ugly at this?

    5. VGVinh Giang52:58

       If you are problem unaware of communication, and right now you just go, "Oh, this is something I need to work on," then this is the three-step process you have to commit to. And just by doing this, it's gonna dramatically change the way you talk, it's gonna dramatically change the way you show up. I call it record and review, and I learned this as a magician, and it's so practical when it comes to magic and communication skills. First step, record a video of yourself speaking for five minutes.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett53:25

       Mm-hmm.

    7. VGVinh Giang53:25

       A full five minutes. And people always immediately say, "Oh, what do I say though?" Google or ChatGPT, great conversational starters, and then use those for yourself and just talk. But it has to be impromptu, because I'm trying to tease out core behaviors. I don't want you to give me a pitch that you've delivered 20 times already. I want you to just, in the moment, speak. I'm trying to tease out some non-functional behaviors. So once you've recorded that video of yourself for five minutes, leave it for a day. (laughs)

    8. SBSteven Bartlett53:49

       Video or just audio?

    9. VGVinh Giang53:50

       Video. You want video, you wanna be standing while you're doing this. Okay? Once you've got that video recorded, leave it for a day, because when you watch it straight away, "I'm fat, I'm ugly. I don't like myself. I hate the way I sound." You leave it for a day, you're thinner, you're better looking, you love yourself more. Time and space. It's amazing. So leave it for a day. Then when you watch it back, you review it in three different ways. The first time, so you record it on your phone, you turn the sound all the way up, press play, turn your phone over, just listen. Here you're doing an auditory review, and just listen to your voice. And now because you've listened to this podcast, you also have five vocal foundations you can think about. So now auditorily, think about, "How's my rate of speech? How's my volume? Oh, my default rate is around a three. Oh, I speak really s- and I stick to that. Oh, my default volume is, oh my goodness, it's a one. Oh wow. I, there's no tonality. There's no emotion in my voice. There's no pitch vari- oh, I am not pausing." You'll be able to take so many notes and you'll be able to hear things you've never been able to hear before because most people avoid filming themselves because, "I hate the way I look and I hate the way I sound." Right?

    10. SBSteven Bartlett54:56

        Mm-hmm.

    11. VGVinh Giang54:56

        So to me, once you do that, you'll have a, you'll have a page of notes and a whole new level of awareness on your auditory communication skills. So the next step is now you turn your phone back around, you turn the sound and put it on mute. You press play and you just look at yourself.... and then as you're watching yourself, because most people don't do this, unless they're creators, you don't do this. That's why creators are such great communicators, is because they do this. That's why you're a- a great listener on a podcast, because you watch yourself back. So now as you just watch yourself back without the auditory feedback, all of a sudden now, you'll see things you don't normally see. "Oh, wow, I'm swiveling a lot on my chair." "Oh, wow, I don't use my hand gestures ... Oh, w- I put my hands behind my back." Oh, and this is my big tick, I keep touching my gla- I can't help it. Oh, I need to work on that. But, eh, you keep touching your glasses, right? I keep touching my face. I keep touching my mouth. I keep fiddling with things. You'll see a whole bunch of non-functional behaviors that you've never seen before because you've avoided it, and also because you have this idea in your head that you're stuck.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett55:53

        Mm-hmm.

    13. VGVinh Giang55:53

        You're not. It's just a series of behaviors. Right? And then afterwards, the final form of review, don't listen to it and don't watch it. Get it transcribed. Because now you'll see the way you communicate from a different perspective. And you go, "Oh, my goodness, I ramble. I tal- I talked about the same thing over." Yo- because you see it from a different perspective. Sometimes you don't hear that. It's easier to see it, and then you see it, and I can see you reacting. Right? But that's- that's what people do, is they- they go, "Oh, not only do I ramble..." Because when you get it transcribed, leaving all of the non-words and the filler words. Non-words being the sounds we make to fill the silence, filler words being the words we use to fill the silence, and, so, like, do you know what I mean? This transcription is immediately gonna reveal to you all of your auditory clutter. The things that you say, again, non-words and filler words, auditory clutter. That's the, again, the and, so, like, do you know what I mean, um, uh. Highlight it with a red highlighter, because it might not just be those. One of my big ones was "okay." I taught online during COVID. As a result of that, because I didn't get the in-person feedback from my students, I would always say "okay" at the end of my sentences because I wasn't getting any feedback. So I say, "That's the vocal foundations, okay? All right. Now, that's body language, okay? Okay? Okay?" And I didn't even notice I was doing it, but that process revealed to me immediately, oh, wow, I didn't know that. I was able to remove that 'cause it didn't serve.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett57:23

        Why

22. 57:24 – 1:02:27

    Remove the Clutter Words From Your Speaking

    1. SBSteven Bartlett57:24

       does it matter to remove th- the clutter words? You know, the like, as, um, mm? Why does it matter?

    2. VGVinh Giang57:29

       I'll give you an example of it. You know, like, um, if I, you know, was, uh, taking you through, like, the, um, core, uh, you know, vocal foundations, you know, like... Uh...

    3. SBSteven Bartlett57:42

       Mm-hmm.

    4. VGVinh Giang57:42

       It decreases the clarity of the message. It's okay to have some. Be human. I get it. It's not about none, but it's about having some and not have your speech littered with it.

    5. SBSteven Bartlett57:53

       Is it easy to overcome that?

    6. VGVinh Giang57:56

       Yeah, it is, because to get rid of that bad habit, you just need to learn a new habit, and the new habit is pause. So, the very moment you feel like saying "um," we're not lagging, we're just pausing. Right? You pause, and that's why as part of the vocal foundations, you have to learn to be comfortable with what we're doing right now, just pausing, and it's okay.

    7. SBSteven Bartlett58:24

       So, I've got my three sheets of paper there.

    8. VGVinh Giang58:26

       Mm-hmm.

    9. SBSteven Bartlett58:26

       I've- I've done the auditory assessment, I've done the visual assessment, I've looked at a transcript, and I've seen the words. And again, is it repetitions from thereon after? To, like-

    10. VGVinh Giang58:37

        Step before that.

    11. SBSteven Bartlett58:37

        Okay.

    12. VGVinh Giang58:38

        Because no- normally what happens after you do that, and I know, because my students have done it, and then what happens is overwhelm. Because they go, "Oh, my goodness, there's, like, 26 things I have to improve. That's ... What- which one do I pick?" And then they'll have to DM me on social media, "Which one do I pick then?" And then analysis paralysis. And to me is, it doesn't matter. Pick one. So, what you do is you create yourself a little 12-week plan, and you plan it one week at a time. So, first week, rate of speech. Great. So, you ... The whole week, you- you- you just look at rate of speech. Oh, yeah, yeah. At the end, what do you do with that week? Record and review again. Did it change? No. Guess what you're doing next week? Rate of speech. And it's that commitment, and I love this ch- Japanese word called kaizen, relentless improvement, and y- you all do this here amazingly. That's what you gotta commit to, and you focus on rate of speech until you see change. And I used to do coaching. I don't do it anymore 'cause I've got two kids, and I ... you know, they're- they're the most important people to me right now. But I used to coach CEOs, and they would see my plan to help them improve their communication skills, and they'd get pissed off. 'Cause they go, "Uh, I'm just doing rate of speech?" I'm like, "Yeah, because your default is so slow, you're putting everyone to sleep, and if you don't change it after week one or week two, I'm still going to get you to do the same thing." And just by increasing rate of speech alone, they became so much more dynamic. Took a month.

    13. SBSteven Bartlett1:00:03

        We all know people that over-talk.

    14. VGVinh Giang1:00:05

        Hmm.

    15. SBSteven Bartlett1:00:05

        And over-explain.

    16. VGVinh Giang1:00:07

        100%.

    17. SBSteven Bartlett1:00:07

        Like, how does one know if they're doing that and how to change it?

    18. VGVinh Giang1:00:10

        By being able to record yourself while you're in conversation with someone.

    19. SBSteven Bartlett1:00:13

        Okay.

    20. VGVinh Giang1:00:14

        And Zoom is amazing now. So, all of a sudden now, if you want awareness on that, record yourself. And- and the beauty of recording yourself on something like Zoom is all of a sudden now, you can (laughs) you can watch yourself and you see the other person too.

    21. SBSteven Bartlett1:00:28

        Do you recommend someone like me, if- if we're trying to improve the communication skills of everybody in a company-

    22. VGVinh Giang1:00:34

        Mm-hmm. Okay.

    23. SBSteven Bartlett1:00:34

        ... to record our meetings and to send it after?

    24. VGVinh Giang1:00:36

        100%. Review it. And- and- and you- you may not get reactions when people say things, because most people, the only thing they'll give you feedback on with your communica- this is the only feedback anybody will ever give you on your communication. "I felt like you talked a bit too fast."

    25. SBSteven Bartlett1:00:51

        Mm-hmm.

    26. VGVinh Giang1:00:51

        They'll never say anything else, because anything else is an attack on your personality. Right? So, people are very afraid to give you feedback, right? Especially you being the big boss, no one's gonna give you feedback, right? So, all of a sudden now ... Well, maybe they do. I feel like your team do.

    27. SBSteven Bartlett1:01:03

        (laughs)

    28. VGVinh Giang1:01:04

        (laughs) What I'm trying to get at is, all of a sudden now when you watch yourself back on those videos, you now will see their facial reactions. People are very honest with their body language. You've had body language experts on here. People might be able to lie with what they say, but all of a sudden, they tell the truth with their body language. You will see people do the silent yawn.... right? You'll see people, th- they'll just do the silent yawn, right? They keep their mouth closed, but they're yawning. You will see these things if you start to reflect and review. And you go, "Oh, I shouldn't have said that. I took too long. I lost them." Like, you can see it. I do that with my classes. When I record... When I used to do my keynotes, I had a whole career as a keynote speaker, so when I did that, I used to duct tape two GoPros together, and I would duct tape the little red recording button so the audience doesn't know, like, that I'm, I'm recording myself and I'm also recording the audience only for my purpose, right, as I review, uh, my speeches. And I would watch back-to-back the audience faces and my keynote. And I could... You, you can see where you lose people, because at a conference, their faces light up with their phone. You can literally see when you're losing them in the talk. And when you watch those back-to-back, it is so humbling, because you go, "Wow, did I go on for..." Why I thought it was a fun tangent, it wasn't. And then I kept that tangent in for bloody six months, because I thought it added so much value. It did not add value. So the only way to get that awareness is you have to find opportunities where you can record yourself.

23. 1:02:27 – 1:03:22

    Ads

    1. VGVinh Giang1:02:27

       (page turns)

    2. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:27

       Do you mind if I pause this conversation for a moment? I wanna talk about our show sponsor today, which is Shopify. I've always believed that the biggest cost in business isn't failure, it's the time you waste trying to make decisions, time spent hesitating, overthinking, or waiting for the right moment. (page turns) When I started my first company at 20 years old, I had no experience and no money. What I did have was an idea and the willingness to move fast, and that made all the difference. If you've been thinking about starting your own business, Shopify makes this entire process so much easier. With thousands of customizable templates, you don't need coding or design skills. You just need a willingness to start. Shopify connects all your sales channels from your website to social media, and it handles the backend payments, shipping, and taxes too so that you can stay focused on moving forward and growing your business. If you're ready to start, visit shopify.com/bartlett and sign up for a one pound per month trial period. That's shopify.com/bartlett. (page turns)

24. 1:03:22 – 1:05:10

    What to Do Before You Go on Stage

    1. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:22

       And when you went up on stage as a keynote speaker, was there anything that you did before you went on stage to make sure that you performed optimally? 'Cause you were speaking, what, 80 times a year or something?

    2. VGVinh Giang1:03:30

       Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it got pretty full on. Yes. Have a way to calm your mind, calm your body, and get really focused. And the way I do it is the first thing I would do is Wim Hof, the guided bubble breathing, (breathes rapidly) 30 times, and then hold your breath, and then a deep breath in (inhales deeply) , hold for 15, and then release. Three cycles of that, "Oh, Stephen, I'm... My mind is relaxed. My body is relaxed." And then the next thing I do is I just do a little bit of brisk walking, do maybe 10, 20 pushups. Why? Because I'm getting rid of the adrenaline that's building up in my body. Because if you don't get rid of the adrenaline, you'll go on stage and you'll start pacing the stage. And I've seen speakers do this, where they pace. There's no reason for their movement, but they're moving because there's so much adrenaline in me, right? Nonfunctional movement. Nonfunctional. So get rid of the adrenaline. So a little bit of brisk exercise gets rid of that adrenaline that you don't need. So I do those two things. (laughs) And depending on how nervous I am, I may have to do a mindset shift. And the mindset shift is... The only way you can become self-conscious and nervous is if you're thinking about yourself. So if you're not thinking about yourself, and you have no cognitive capacity to think about yourself, then how can you be nervous? So think of the audience, right? Before coming to this, I felt a bit nervous. I thought, "You know what? I'm just gonna think about Stephen, and I'm gonna think about his audience. How can I add the most value possible in this podcast as we talk?" And the moment I thought about you and your audience, I, I don't have any cognitive capacity left to think about me.

    3. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:00

       Mm-hmm.

    4. VGVinh Giang1:05:01

       So when you kind of think about this act of service, it, it shifts where you are. You're not in your own body anymore. You're not self-conscious. You're audience-conscious. Helps.

25. 1:05:10 – 1:06:09

    Warm Up Your Mouth and Tongue

    1. VGVinh Giang1:05:10

    2. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:10

       And is there anything you do with your mouth and your tongue? 'Cause sometimes-

    3. VGVinh Giang1:05:14

       Yeah.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:15

       ... especially if I've woken up early in the morning and I'm, like, jumping on a Zoom call with some foreign timezone-

    5. VGVinh Giang1:05:19

       Yes.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:19

       ... like, it feels like my mouth isn't quite, like, there yet.

    7. VGVinh Giang1:05:22

       Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:22

       But I also feel as though my brain's not connected to my mouth.

    9. VGVinh Giang1:05:25

       So first thing is lip trills. Have you ever done lip trills before?

    10. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:28

        No.

    11. VGVinh Giang1:05:28

        Okay, lip trills are this (lips trilling) .

    12. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:31

        (lips trilling)

    13. VGVinh Giang1:05:31

        Perfect. And a lot of people won't be able to do that, so all you do is get your two index fingers, push your cheeks together, and you can go (lips trilling) .

    14. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:37

        (lips trilling)

    15. VGVinh Giang1:05:38

        Do your favorite song. So you think of your favorite song, and you just, you know (lips trilling) .

    16. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:44

        Mm-hmm.

    17. VGVinh Giang1:05:44

        Funnel Countdown, one of my favorites right now. Do that for an entire song. So do that for your favorite song, and once you've done that, if you do that for two to three minutes, now all of a sudden your articulators have woken up. You've also woken up your vocal cords. And your lips now, being the main articulators we use to shape the words that we say, it's awake. The Soren technique is another way, great way to wake up your voice. And you've done the vo- the Soren technique, which is read low and then go high, read low and then go high.

26. 1:06:09 – 1:13:23

    The Power of Body Language

    1. VGVinh Giang1:06:09

    2. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:09

       The other thing that I learned from s- studying your work is this idea of the power sphere when you're on stage.

    3. VGVinh Giang1:06:14

       Ah.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:15

       This power sphere. I've got a picture here.

    5. VGVinh Giang1:06:16

       You got a picture of that. I, I learned this from Mark Bowden. Mark Bowden is an incredible body language expert, and I was lucky to do some coaching with him when I lived in the US. And he taught me this concept of the area between your belly button and your eyes.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:27

       Yeah.

    7. VGVinh Giang1:06:28

       And that's the power sphere. So when you're gesturing to people, a lot of people who are shy, they gesture below the power sphere.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:34

       What, just like the hands to the side?

    9. VGVinh Giang1:06:35

       Yeah, yeah. So, so again, they're doing all these different things, but they're doing this. They're like, "Oh, hey. Great to see you. Oh, I'm so excited to be here. I'm..." It's great, right?

    10. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:41

        And why are they doing that? Because they're...

    11. VGVinh Giang1:06:43

        Because they're playing small.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:44

        Okay.

    13. VGVinh Giang1:06:44

        Scared to take up space, right? So a- and again, uh, I get a lot of my female students ask me this question. They say, "Oh, Vin, I feel like I don't have enough presence." And I'll get the feedback, "I don't get executive presence." What is this elusive thing called executive presence? It's simple. It's two things. It's vocal presence and physical presence. And how you use your hand gestures allows you to level up your physical presence. So if you've got better physical presence because you're using your hand gestures within the power sphere, all of a sudden you've got that executive presence that they're talking about.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:11

        So you need to get your elbows off your sides.

    15. VGVinh Giang1:07:13

        100%, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Again, I think of myself as having this sphere around me, the way that I remember Mark sharing this with me, and not be afraid to go to the edges of the sphere.... don't be afraid to go to the edges of the sphere. Otherwise, we tend to, a lot of people T-Rex it, right? They T-Rex it, right? Don't T-Rex it, just have your arms nice out and big. Don't be afraid to take up the space. And, and then there are foundational gestures you should learn paired with this. The first one, which you're doing already, this is, uh, Virginia Satir came up with these and she was a family therapist. And she came up with the foundation to hand gestures. This is placator. Try.

Episode duration: 2:26:48