Soho House Founder: How I Built The World’s Most Exclusive Club: Nick Jones | E163

1. 0:00 – 1:29

   Intro

   1. NJNick Jones0:00

      I wasn't experienced enough. I was too young. You were just branded thick.

   2. SBSteven Bartlett0:04

      Nick Jones, the founder and CEO of Soho House.

   3. NJNick Jones0:06

      With an empire of private clubs around the world.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett0:09

      It's the most see-and-be-seen type of place. Not everyone gets in. Your upbringing is particularly compelling to me, because you were somewhat counted out.

   5. NJNick Jones0:19

      I'm hugely dyslexic. People didn't understand it then. You were just branded thick.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett0:24

      Wow.

   7. NJNick Jones0:24

      There was not much choice for me.

   8. SBSteven Bartlett0:27

      You've created a business which brings a lot of people joy. That first Soho House on Greek Street, why did it work?

   9. NJNick Jones0:33

      I wanted to prove that hospitality could be done differently. I can't think of a time where I was thinking about making an aspirational brand. I've always been obsessed about the member, and that was always my number one thing. They've created that. If you don't make mistakes, you're not pushing yourself. You're not taking yourself out of your comfort zone. Maybe I was trying to prove to my family that I- I could do this, and I think that's an invaluable lesson.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett0:59

       At what point does that desire to prove something need to be contained because it might come at the expense of, like, life balance?

   11. NJNick Jones1:08

       Um, a very good question, and I think...

   12. SBSteven Bartlett1:13

       So without further ado, I'm Steven Bartlett, and this is The Diary of a CEO. I hope nobody's listening, but if you are, then please keep this to yourself.

2. 1:29 – 5:45

   Early years

   1. SBSteven Bartlett1:29

      Nick, thank you for being here. Um, I have to say, I'm a big fan of the- the business you've created and the- and the, I know you don't like the word, but the brand you've built, um, for- for many, many reasons that I'm excited to get into, maybe because I'm a marketeer, but maybe also just because I'm a- I'm a customer, someone, and someone that loves the- the Soho House, um, brand. But where I wanted to start with you is where I always start, and your- your, um, your sort of origin story, your upbringing is particularly compelling to me, because, um, by many accounts and even your own, you were somewhat counted out. Is that true?

   2. NJNick Jones2:04

      Well, my childhood was... Well, I- I don't think I'd say I was counted out. I- I was, you know, in a nice middle class family where I had two older brothers and a sister, younger sister, mum and dad. Um, but my two older brothers, um, were, you know, they were the- the sort of stars. They were the... (clears throat) They- they were great at school, they were good at sport, and I was a bit not so good at sport and not so good at school. And it was a sort of different sort of, um, sort of childhood that than... I suppose that they had. And, um, yeah, I think it probably put- put me in good stead, but at the time, it was probably quite tricky.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett2:46

      When you say not so good at school, what do you mean specifically?

   4. NJNick Jones2:49

      Well, just really bad at exams. You know, I'm- I'm hugely dyslexic and, um, so I find spelling really difficult, I find pronunciation difficult. I find, um, you know, all sorts of things difficult at school. I mean, I've since learned that dyslexia is the greatest thing to have, and... (laughs) But at school, it isn't. But I was lucky enough, um, that my mum was all over it, and it was discovered that I was dyslexic at the age of 12, which is very young for a lot... People are still discovering, you know, contemporaries of mine are still discovering I'm dyslexic right now at- at- at the age I am, which is 58. So I- I was- I was lucky and I got support and I sort of got through school by weird things, like they- they'd give you extra hours on your exam, but I didn't need that. I- I- I only needed half the amount of time anyway to fill up the paper because I didn't have enough information. (laughs)

   5. SBSteven Bartlett3:51

      Mm-hmm.

   6. NJNick Jones3:52

      So to get another hour was just another hour of just fiddling around with your pencil. So, um, yeah.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett4:00

      The perception towards dyslexia today is, is it's quite a common thing and people understand it a bit better, but back then, I'm assuming people didn't really understand what it was or-

   8. NJNick Jones4:09

      Mm-hmm.

   9. SBSteven Bartlett4:10

      ... there was a stig- Was there more of a stigma?

   10. NJNick Jones4:11

       Yeah. Yeah, I think so. You're just branded thick and, you know, because if you couldn't read or you couldn't, um, write properly... I mean, my handwriting is still very not... I try and avoid handwriting at every possibility, so it's still, um, really bad. And I've, I think yes, people... Because people didn't understand it then, but people understand it now and people talk about it and they should talk about it. And it's... To me, it's, you know, if you have dyslexia, you look at things very differently because you have to look at things differently. You have to simplify things, and by simplifying things, I think that gives you a- a different perspective on things.

   11. SBSteven Bartlett4:54

       When I say counted out, I mean more in the sense of, um, you didn't believe that you would be a success when you were older because of the... Because especially when you're at that young age, you assume that those that are getting the best grades and spell the best and do math the best are going to be rich and successful, and then there's us, there's everyone else. So at that young age, you didn't see... You didn't envisage you would be a "success".

   12. NJNick Jones5:18

       I- It didn't- I didn't think either way. I was just sort of thinking of just getting through school and- and- and I wasn't really planning if I was going to be a success or not a success, and I- I think that's interesting, um, how you define success. Um, and I don't think success is just being successful, you know, running a business or creating a business. I think it- it touches all sorts of things.

   13. SBSteven Bartlett5:43

       Was there, um...

3. 5:45 – 9:24

   The first inspiration for soho house

   1. SBSteven Bartlett5:45

      When I was reading about your parents' dinner parties, that seemed to be the first, uh, inspiration for what you would later do in hospitality and restaurants and- and creating experiences for others. Was that the first sort of spark of inspiration for you?

   2. NJNick Jones5:58

      Yeah. Um, I- I- I was... While my brothers were on the sports field, I-... weirdly liked doing the supermarket shop, uh, with my mum. You know, I, I found supermarkets fascinating, I found food fascinating. I then found the whole preparation of how to give people a good time, you know, fascinating. And, you know, I loved watching how you, how you could create an environment where people had a laugh and fun.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett6:26

      And was that what your parents were doing?

   4. NJNick Jones6:27

      Well, yeah. They've, um, not all the time. I mean, occasionally they did it. But, um, but when they did do it, it was, it, you know, I loved to be part of them trying to create s- a fun evening. And I think that's probably where I suddenly realized that, you know, hospitality was the, the route for me, um, because I, you know, we, we're going back a long, long time, um, you know. This was, (laughs) you know, I'm 58 now and I was sort of 13 at the time. And, and I was, I used to, you know, go to the local sports club and work behind the bar, you know, as a ... Clean the glasses. And weirdly, I enjoyed that. I enjoyed the interaction with people, I enjoyed seeing people just have a, have a nice time. And, and back then, people were not going into hospitality. I mean, it was really at the bottom of the ladder of, of industries that people went into. So, I thought that was an opportunity.

   5. SBSteven Bartlett7:21

      It, it's funny 'cause I've sat here with, um, Jimmy Carr and lots of comedians. And when I hear about their sort of ins- in- inspiration for becoming a comedian, it, it tends to root back to them being younger and it being the thing that they would see create the most joy in their home. So, h- in the case of Jimmy Carr and Russell, um, Russel Howard, and a few of the other comedians I've sat with, they tell me this story about like, "The thing that would make my parents the happiest was when I would tell jokes. So, that was this sort of psychological reinforcement that led me to be a joke teller for the rest of my life." And when I was reading about those, those dinner parties that your parents had, I was, I was ... And also confounded by the fact that you, you know, you said in your own words, um, you didn't feel like there was a lot of conventional operate, um, avenues available to you because of your dyslexia. That that was the, the combination of factors that caused you to ...

   6. NJNick Jones8:08

      Well, and, and, and I really had to ... I mean, when I was at school, I ... 'Cause I wasn't good at getting exams, so I had to rule university out. I had to, um ... There was, there was not much choice for me, you know. There was a person with very few O levels, as, as they were called then, and I think I got an E and an A level. I scraped through on economics, I think (laughs) .

   7. SBSteven Bartlett8:30

      Right.

   8. NJNick Jones8:30

      And, you know, with that, there, there was, there, there w- there was really not a lot of choice. And, you know, my careers master at school sort of said, "Is, I think it's catering, Nick" (laughs) .

   9. SBSteven Bartlett8:42

      Really?

   10. NJNick Jones8:43

       You know. So, when my, when my careers master said that, I've, I, I sort of thought ... And a- and also the fact that I thought there was real opportunity in this. And my, my dad owned a small, um, insurance broking company, and my brothers went in to work there. And (clears throat) I think my dad was keen for me to go and work there, but I, I didn't find insurance very exciting.

   11. SBSteven Bartlett9:05

       (laughs)

   12. NJNick Jones9:05

       I still don't (laughs) .

   13. SBSteven Bartlett9:07

       Oh, no.

   14. NJNick Jones9:07

       And, and, and I didn't find that world of working in the city and insurance and being a insurance broker interesting at all. So, I, I did have that as an opportunity, but I really felt I wanted to try hospitality and catering.

   15. SBSteven Bartlett9:23

       As

4. 9:24 – 13:40

   What did you have that others didn’t?

   1. SBSteven Bartlett9:24

      you, as you started your journey into hospitality and catering, did you start to, at any point, figure out that you were, you had some kind of area of brilliance? There was something you were good at compared to others?

   2. NJNick Jones9:34

      Uh, no. I remember clearly, the first ... No, I d- I di- ... The answer to that was, is definitely no. Um, I, my, f- my, my first day, I, I, I worked for Trusthouse Forte. I was a, a, a management trainee, and it was a five-year course. And I, I, I applied to the Savoy management, um, training course to start with. And they, I, I, I remember it to this day, the interview I had. Um, and I just froze. I couldn't speak. I was so nervous. I, I absolutely froze. And 'cause I was a pretty shy kid. And, you know, I, I was shy at 17 when I was going for these interviews, and I just was ... It, I, I just got stage fright. I just couldn't ... My mouth ... No words came out my mouth. And I didn't get into the Savoy management course. But then I applied for Trusthouse Forte, and luckily when I went for the interview (clears throat) I was able to talk. And (laughs) I got onto a, a, a, a, a, a five-year course. And my first part of the course was a year in the kitchens. And it was at St. George's Hotel in Langham Place, which is just here in London, um, off Oxford Street. And I arrived and the chef looked me up and down. And he, he, he, he, he called me a nickname, which I'm not gonna say (laughs) on, on this.

   3. SBSteven Bartlett10:56

      With a C in it, isn't it?

   4. NJNick Jones10:56

      It re- began with a C. And, and, um, he threw a sack of potatoes at me, which sorta landed in my belly, and he said, "Peel them." And so I went off to the, the area where you peel the potatoes, and I hadn't really ever used a knife before. And, uh, the first one, the first potato I cut, my, my, my, my finger, and I thought, "Oh, God. How do I hide th- uh, hide this?" And the water I was putting the potatoes in was getting redder and redder and redder. And I, and I thought, "Oh, no." (laughs)

   5. SBSteven Bartlett11:23

      (laughs) .

   6. NJNick Jones11:23

      "This is my first day." And the nickname stuck. Um, and I, I, I was really sort of learning on the job, which I think is a really great way to learn anything. And I kept making mistakes but I ke- ... I was determined to, to sort of fit into the kitchen because it was an environment. You know, 'cause I came from this sort of cotton wool, um, middle class background, and then going into the kitchen into the, uh, early '80s where, where, you know, it, it, it, it, they ... It was long hours and, and, and they, they ... You know, someone who comes in with a slightly posh accent.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett11:58

      (laughs) .

   8. NJNick Jones11:59

      And, you know, they, they, they, they, they ... It was, it ... But it was a, it was a good moment. It was a good moment for me.

   9. SBSteven Bartlett12:05

      Was it, um ... What was it about that? 'Cause that sounds pretty horrific. Sound- and I've, having worked in a kitchen, my, my mum had a restaurant at a very young age, I started working there at seven, super high stressful, people are always complaining it's hot in there. Um, that, and I mean, people weren't throwing things at me and calling me the C-word, but it wasn't, it was really unpleasant. So I'm wondering what, in that context, like, despite of all of that, tickled your fancy?

   10. NJNick Jones12:30

       Well, do you know what it w- was? It was, I was coming out my shyness. I was learning how to get on with people. And, you know, I was, I went to a private school. I was surrounded by people who went to private school, which is 7% of the population.

   11. SBSteven Bartlett12:45

       Mm-hmm.

   12. NJNick Jones12:45

       And by going into the, the, the, the, um, kitchen, you, you really learnt to really get on with everyone and, uh, and I think that's an invaluable lesson. And I really became friendly with a lot of the chefs and would go out with them at night, and I just enjoyed it and even though it was hard, I just enjoyed the environment, I enjoyed creating food, I enjoyed the buzz, I enjoyed ... I didn't mind the heat, I didn't mind the fact that it was, it was, it was long hours. I just enjoyed it.

   13. SBSteven Bartlett13:20

       If I'd spoken to maybe your colleague or someone that was maybe above you in ... a line manager at that time and said, "What is Nick good at?" What would they have said to me?

   14. NJNick Jones13:28

       I, I'd like to think, um, not peeling potatoes or making porridge.

   15. SBSteven Bartlett13:32

       (laughs)

   16. NJNick Jones13:32

       But, you know, getting on with people and being part of a team and, and getting s- stuck in.

5. 13:40 – 15:30

   Why dyslexia is a great gift

   1. NJNick Jones13:41

   2. SBSteven Bartlett13:41

      You said earlier that dyslexia was, um, is actually a great gift. Can you explain why, um, why you've now come to believe that it, that is a real, sort of, superpower for you?

   3. NJNick Jones13:51

      Well, I, I, I wouldn't say it's a superpower but I, I, I talk a lot about dyslexia 'cause I really want people to feel that if they have, if they, if they get the test and they're dyslexic, I don't want them to ever feel bad. I want them to feel good and go, "Well, this is a huge opportunity." Because I think when you look at things differently and the rea- one thing, being dyslexic, I have to simplify everything all the time. I have to, I have to ... I, I want something on one sheet of paper, I don't want it on four sheets of paper. I want, I, I, I want everything to be scaled down and simplified and I think we live in a world where everyone's over-complicating things always and, and, you know, and it, it doesn't matter what area of a business I work in now, whether it's the designers or the chefs or the tech people, you know, th- it's all over-complicated and I spend a lot of my time just editing down and, and, and simplifying it. And I think dyslexic, being dyslexic has made me do that, you know, 'cause it's the easy route 'cause complication panics me and confuses me so I spend a lot of time simplifying, and I think when you do simplify things, people understand it, they get it, they like it.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett15:03

      Yeah, so true. Someone once said to me that ... A phrase I always forget which is, um, if someone's ability to simplify something also correlates their ability to truly understand it and typically when you meet these, like, salesmen that are, um, trying to blag you in some way, they purposefully over-complicate something and sometimes they don't actually understand what they're saying but distilling it to simplicity gets it closer to truth and it's, it's also a sign that the person communicating it really, truly understands the essence of the idea

6. 15:30 – 23:20

   Starting your own restaurant chain at 22

   1. SBSteven Bartlett15:30

      or, or the concept. You, by 22, you started your own restaurant chain, cor-

   2. NJNick Jones15:36

      Well-

   3. SBSteven Bartlett15:36

      Is that correct?

   4. NJNick Jones15:36

      I, I went round lots of departments within Trusthouse Forte from front desk, to bar, to, to, to, to, to housekeeping. I was a housekeeper at the, you know, clean the rooms at the, the Westbury Hotel in Conduit Street. I, I was a barman at Brown's Hotel in Albemarle Street. Um, and yeah, I remember clearly, um, you know, serving, you know, being the barman and I remember making cocktails for George Bess. That was a-

   5. SBSteven Bartlett16:05

      (laughs)

   6. NJNick Jones16:05

      That was a highlight of, of ... He, he was such a nice guy. And, and, and I suppose at that time, I always thought the determination was to open something, to, to open my own restaurant. This is, you know, I, I want to l- learn this and then I ended up doing marketing at Trusthouse Forte and then I was marketing manager at Grosvenor House in, in Park Lane and it wasn't because I was brilliant at it. It was, you know, I was cheap, you know?

   7. SBSteven Bartlett16:30

      (laughs)

   8. NJNick Jones16:30

      I, I just was, I was ... I didn't just cost a lot of money and they could ... Th- that's what they were looking for at that precise moment and ... But I always, when I was working there, I was always working on a plan to, to, to, you know, not work for Trusthouse Forte which was a big, big hotel company and I was thinking, you know, "I want to get out of this at some stage. I don't want to keep going on the ladder when, you know, you keep getting prom- ... You know, hopefully I would kept being promoted into other jobs but ... And then it would have been too difficult to leave so I thought, 'I want to go when I'm still relatively at the bottom'."

   9. SBSteven Bartlett17:03

      Mm-hmm.

   10. NJNick Jones17:03

       And then I, I went and tried working in fast food restaurants or, sort of, casual restaurants. You know, so I went to work to Maxwell's in Covent Garden-

   11. SBSteven Bartlett17:12

       Mm-hmm.

   12. NJNick Jones17:12

       ... as a night manager. I then, I then went, um, to work at Pastamania as a, sort of, junior manager and then during that time, I was building my plan to open my first restaurant which was called Over the Top and that opened in 1988 and it was, you know, it was ... I was too young, I wasn't experienced enough. Um, it was, it was terrible. (laughs) It ... The, uh, the design, which is something I'm obsessed with now and I love design, you know, and I ... That was my first design outing and it really was terrible. Um, the food was, you know, really bad. You know, my friends had to come-

   13. SBSteven Bartlett17:55

       (laughs)

   14. NJNick Jones17:55

       ... you know, and that, that, that showed ... I really knew who my friends were (laughs) 'cause they would-

   15. SBSteven Bartlett17:59

       Mm-hmm.

   16. NJNick Jones18:00

       ... come and support me in the restaurant but it was, uh, it was, it was, it was, it was a, a good experience of getting something really wrong.

   17. SBSteven Bartlett18:07

       It's not cheap to open a restaurant.

   18. NJNick Jones18:09

       (clears throat)

   19. SBSteven Bartlett18:09

       How did you, how did you fund that at 22?

   20. NJNick Jones18:10

       Well, I, I...... my, my dad put a bit of money in, family friends put a bit of money in, and I got the bank to put some money in. Um, so I was lucky. You know, I was given that chance to be able to open my first restaurant. Um, and it's something, you know, I want- you know, we, we do a lot now. I, I love people doing that. When anyone comes to me and wants to be an entrepreneur and start something up, I really make time to see them and help them. And, you know, I was lucky. I was given an opportunity, um, and, you know, I, I learnt a lot.

   21. SBSteven Bartlett18:47

       That, I guess, would increase the pressure if you've got family betting on you.

   22. NJNick Jones18:53

       Y- yeah. I, I, I think it ... I, I've, I, I never, they never made me feel like that. Um, you know, my dad, you know, um, I think he was proud that I was trying to do something, I was trying to do something on my own 'cause he had his own small business. Um, but he never made me feel like that. And the other shareholders, you know, I think in their head they really, when they first came and tried the restaurant, they sort of probably knew that it wasn't gonna lead anywhere. But actually, you know, the, the, the company's still the same company as it is today. It's, uh, it, it never went, it never went bu-, it never went bust. We, we, we, we've, we, we hang on in there and, um, you know, eventually opened Cafe Boheme in '92, um, with which was really all the experience of getting Over The Top so wrong. And, uh, let me explain what Over The Top was. It was, it was, it, it ... you either chose a burger, a piece of chicken, a bit of lamb, or a steak, and over the top of it, you could choose one of 10 sauces.

   23. SBSteven Bartlett19:51

       Right.

   24. NJNick Jones19:51

       But the sauces were terrible.

   25. SBSteven Bartlett19:53

       (laughs)

   26. NJNick Jones19:53

       (laughs) And, and, and it was just, it was just bad. And, um, you know, uh, it, it, it just sort of taught me, you know, how to manage a business with little cash and with no cash, how to pay the staff every week, how to use initiatives to try and get more customers in. And I think it taught me v- at a very early age, you know, marketing restaurants is not the way to solve a restaurant. You just have to make the restaurant good, 'cause the customer is so clever. They know what good is, and they know what bad is. And it taught me that very early on. There was no way that you could ... you don't, you can't fool a customer. They, they, they, they, they know. And you could walk into Over The Top, and you could s- sort of feel, you know, you could sense that it wasn't, wasn't, wasn't, wasn't good enough. But what I learned at that time was it, it's sort of, it, y- I didn't feel it was a failure. I just thought it w- I was on a, a, a journey of learning. And I really even now encourage all our people that making a mistake is not a problem. You know, if you don't make mistakes, you're not pushing yourself, you're not trying, you're not, you're not, you're not taking yourself out of your comfort zone. And so, you know, I really encourage people to think that, you know, failure is n- not what it sounds like. You know, it's, okay, it's just part of the journey.

   27. SBSteven Bartlett21:23

       What did, what did that process teach you about feedback? I, I ask that because in my first business, I was, I had this ... it was a tech business, and I was very romantic about this hypothesis about the way that I thought my customers would behave and about the solution that I thought that they would care about, and I spent too long not listening to their feedback. And ultimately, that w- was pretty fatal. And I just wish earlier I'd been less romantic and stubborn, almost, about what I thought the customer would want and, and, and listen. But I'm wondering what that first failure taught you about the importance of what feedback you listen to and how you listen to it.

   28. NJNick Jones21:57

       Well, I think feedback's key. Um, and people be no- o- oh, uh, it's funny being, being a Brit, people are funny about complaining, aren't they?

   29. SBSteven Bartlett22:05

       Mm-hmm.

   30. NJNick Jones22:05

       They're, they're, they're ... in restaurants, they, they, they think it will offend you. They, they, they think, "Well, I'm not gonna ... I can't complain to Nick about, 'I had a bad meal last night,'" 'cause he, he might be, you know, that might upset him. But to me, you know, you can only get better by getting really honest feedback. And I'm lucky now 'cause I have members who all have my email address, and, and (laughs) , and, you know, if they're, they're, they, if they're not happy, they, they email me. So I think listening to feedback is super, super important.
7. 23:20 – 28:29

   The best marketing tactic

   1. NJNick Jones23:20

   2. SBSteven Bartlett23:20

      I, I was so, um, really inspired by you saying that the customer is smart, and also you, you alluded to the fact that the best marketing is word of mouth.

   3. NJNick Jones23:29

      Yeah, absolutely.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett23:31

      That, that really is at the heart of what you even do today, is, is-

   5. NJNick Jones23:35

      I-

   6. SBSteven Bartlett23:35

      ... a belief in the customer's own-

   7. NJNick Jones23:36

      Yeah, I, I'm very lucky that we have fantastic members who are loyal and, and, you know, they, they, you know, I, I ... If anyone says that we done okay or I done okay, it's for thanks to our members. And, um, you know, our members are the people who pushed me from doing Soho House, you know, the original Soho House on Greek Street, where, you know, it worked. There were hairy moments, you know, when I thought it really wasn't gonna work, um, and, you know, it, it would go quiet, or it would go, you know ... It's, I, I remember the first year we opened in m- in May, it'd suddenly gone quiet, and we'd opened in January. I thought, "Oh, God, that ... I thought it would last a bit longer than this." And, you know, a member turned round to me and said, "Well, well, Nick, they're all down at the Cannes Film Festival."... you know, that's where your members are.

   8. SBSteven Bartlett24:29

      Mm-hmm.

   9. NJNick Jones24:30

      So I suddenly thought, "Well, next year, I'm going to go down and create a pop-up down there." And this was pre-pop-ups. (laughs) You know, this was in '96. And so we rented a boat, um, uh, in the harbor, and I remember... (clears throat) In fact, I remember clearly 'cause there was, there was a, a lady who, who still works for us to this day, Veronique. And, (laughs) and her and I had to fill up this lorry full of stuff in London to, to drive down to... I didn't drive the lorry 'cause I couldn't drive a lorry. But to go down to the South of France, Cannes, and we opened this boat and it was like a temporary club for the 10 days of the Cannes Film Festival.

   10. SBSteven Bartlett25:08

       (laughs)

   11. NJNick Jones25:08

       And members, you know, if they weren't in London, they could come to the club in, in the, the, the, the, the boat in the harbor. And that, we did that for a f- lots of years and it was, I think our members really enjoyed that, and that sort of taught me again, where- wherever the member is going, go. So, you know, 'cause if I hadn't, you know, I was, I, I didn't understand the film business or the media business. I was in catering, hospitality. So I was, I was, I was sort of n- new to this. And, you know, when I first, uh, first created the first ever committee at Soho House, you know, I was really knocking on doors and, and phoning people, cold-calling them, saying, "Do you mind?" And, and you had to sort of explain what you were trying to do to get them to come on the committee, and that was where our first 500 members came from. And, and I think there, I've always just listened to the member, you know? They, they kept saying, "Well, Nick, it's great, this one. Why don't you do one in the country?" And I go, "Ooh, let's do one in the country, then." So off I go. (laughs) I phone Savills up and I say, "Any, any hotels for sale?" I didn't have any money, but I thought, "Well, I'm gonna go on that route and see how I could, I could, um, get, get, get somewhere in the country." And I remember stumbling ac- across Babington House, and, and I remember it was, it was on the market for, um, you know, a million, million and a half pounds. Um, this was back in, in-

   12. SBSteven Bartlett26:36

       Yeah. (laughs)

   13. NJNick Jones26:36

       ... a long time ago. And, and, um, I remember driving up the drive and as, soon as you d- drive up the drive at Babington, you sort of fall in love with the place, and I fell in love with the place and I thought, "Oh, my God. How, how, how am I gonna get planning permission to turn this into a hotel, and how am I gonna have enough money to buy it?" I had just a small amount of money just to put the deposit down, and luckily, um, the people who were selling it, um, they, they, um, they said, "Well, we want to stay here for the summer. We, you know, we want to, we, we want to exchange and then we will complete in nine months' time." And I thought, "Yes."

   14. SBSteven Bartlett27:18

       (laughs)

   15. NJNick Jones27:18

       You know? And then it gave me nine months, um, um, to, um, to find the money and get the planning permission and raise the money with our members to, to, to pay for the completion-

   16. SBSteven Bartlett27:30

       Mm-hmm.

   17. NJNick Jones27:30

       ... and also to pay for the refurbishment, and I, I, I sort of just remember even before we exchanged, the agent phoned me up and said, you know, um, "A higher offer's gone in." So I was sort of being gazumped, and I thought, "Well, I don't have the money anyway, so I can put another couple of hundred grand on it," 'cause I've, I... And so I, I increased my offer.

   18. SBSteven Bartlett27:56

       (laughs)

   19. NJNick Jones27:56

       I, I got Babington House, and, um, you know, I was able to raise the money. We, and we raised the money through our members, you know, uh, lots of members put sort of f- five grand in, um, and that's how I was able to get the money to open Babington House. So it was, uh, it was, uh, led by our members, sort of the-

   20. SBSteven Bartlett28:17

       Crowdfunding.

   21. NJNick Jones28:17

       ... the, the, the members helped invest in it, you know? They, luckily they've all got their money back, plus, plus, and, um, you know, then that was the second thing we opened.

8. 28:29 – 35:44

   Why did the first SoHo House work?

   1. NJNick Jones28:29

   2. SBSteven Bartlett28:29

      That first Soho House on Greek Street, why did it work?

   3. NJNick Jones28:35

      You know, I was running the restaurant downstairs, Cafe Boheme.

   4. SBSteven Bartlett28:38

      Yeah.

   5. NJNick Jones28:38

      That was my survival. Cafe Boheme was, you know, it was the same company as Over The Top. It was, it was, it was me doing everything totally different to what Over The Top was. So, the food was edible and nice.

   6. SBSteven Bartlett28:52

      (laughs)

   7. NJNick Jones28:52

      The, the service was good. The atmosphere, you know, and in fa- I was in there last night, and it was, you know, it, it made me very happy 'cause it was packed and it was fun, and when the building came up, u- uh, available above Cafe Boheme, which is on Greek Street in London, um, I, the landlord phoned me up, um, and they said, "Well, do you fancy taking the space above?" And I go, "Well, what on earth for?" You know, there was no plan to do a private members club. My plan was just to survive and make Cafe Boheme work after four years of attempting Over The Top, and I still do this today. I always look at everything. I, when people phone me and say there's an idea, I always go and have a look. And so I, I said, "Okay, well, I'll go and have a look." So I wandered around the offices and it was a small door, you know? Um, on G- on Greek Street, 40 Greek Street, and, and I thought, "Mm. Mm." And I hadn't been to a private members club, you know? I wasn't, I wasn't part of a Groucho club. I wasn't, (laughs) I wasn't, I wasn't part of that, that, that... Well, it was only the Groucho club or there were all those clubs down in Pall Mall. I wasn't part of that. Um-

   8. SBSteven Bartlett30:01

      Maybe that's a good thing. (laughs)

   9. NJNick Jones30:02

      Yes, and I, and I, I looked round it and I thought, "Well, God, this is like a home away from home," and, and, and, you know, "God, this is, this could work. How could I m- how... You know, this, this, this is an idea, so..." But I didn't have any money. So, um... Again. And, um, I went to see, um, my landlord, which was Paul Raymond. Um, and I, I went to see him and he said, "Well, well, you, do you want to take it?" And I said, "Well, yeah, I'd love to take it, but what c- would you invest? Because w-... the family investment and for Over the Top, they had had totally enough. (laughs) They- they- they- they were out, you know, the banks were trying to pull out of, you know, trying to get their loan back. It was... Th- that bit of it was, you know, just... It was, it was, it was... That bit of the family help was done, finished. And so I thought, "Well, how am I going to raise the money for this? Because it's going to be separate. I'm going to have to do this separately to what Cafe Boheme is." And so I went to see Paul Raymond. He said, "I'm not investing. I don't invest in other people's businesses." And then it, it was when I was leaving, he said, "Well what happens if I put the money in, but just added it to your rent, so you ended up with a higher rent?" You know-

   10. SBSteven Bartlett31:18

       Hmm.

   11. NJNick Jones31:19

       ... a percentage of the money he put in was added to my rent. And I thought, "Well..."

   12. SBSteven Bartlett31:26

       To do the fit-out?

   13. NJNick Jones31:27

       To do the fit-out. Um, and I thought, "Okay, well that sounds like it can work." So I set up Soho House. It was, it, it was simple to come up with a name. It was a house in Soho. The logo was pretty simple. It was-

   14. SBSteven Bartlett31:39

       So the disconnect there. (laughs)

   15. NJNick Jones31:39

       (laughs) It was, it was so simple. It was three buildings, three floors. Um, and, and I... And, but I owned 100% of it because the Cafe Boheme lot... You know, my, my family didn't want anything to do with it and, and the other investors. And I thought, "Well, you know, when Soho House works, I'm going to transfer everything back to the, you know, the same percentages as it was as when it was the Over the Top." So I merged the two companies. So I didn't want, um... I didn't want to be a success on one hand in, on, on Soho and, and they were suffering on Cafe Boheme and Over the Top, so we merged it all together. And, and we found the members and, and, and... You know, a lot of the people who opened Soho House in '95 still are part of Soho House, still work. You know, the, the guy, Pierre, who was a server in (laughs) in, in, um, the Blue Dining Room, the, the, the Blue Room in the, in the restaurant now runs North America for us. And, um, Marcus Anderson, who, uh, runs our membership, part of our membership team, who was a server in one of the dining rooms. Uh, the guy, Marcus Barwell, was a barman in The Circle Bar. Now he's managing director of Soho House Design.

   16. SBSteven Bartlett33:02

       Mm-hmm.

   17. NJNick Jones33:02

       So it's lovely seeing, you know, people who were right there at the beginning still be part of the company now. And it, it... But it was, it, it was a journey as well. It was... We were moving into this sort of new area of membership, understanding membership, understanding looking after people, and, and just listening to your members, because I'm sort of going back to your original sort of feedback question. So the feedback and... Which comes from our members has sort of really helped us where we are today.

   18. SBSteven Bartlett33:34

       Was Cafe Boheme successful when you embarked on the Soho House journey upstairs?

   19. NJNick Jones33:39

       Yes.

   20. SBSteven Bartlett33:40

       Okay.

   21. NJNick Jones33:40

       (clears throat) But it was having to be on top of the disaster of Soho House, so it was, uh, quite a lot of... (laughs) There was a lot of sort of, um... It was the same company and, and so yes, it worked. Cafe Boheme worked. It gave me the confidence to do something else. It, it worked because, um, it, it... You know, it wa- it was 30 years ago, so... And there weren't many places... I don't think there were many places which were open to 8:00 in the morning and closed at 3:00 in the morning, and you could go in there and eat whatever you wanted or just have a coffee or just have a drink. It... It... The kitchen was always open. You could, you know, drink jugs of beer or you could have a steak frites or... And we had jazz in the afternoons. It was really creating... It, it sort of really created a real regular following within Soho, and it was the, the turning point really of the disaster of Over the Top.

   22. SBSteven Bartlett34:41

       (laughs) Over the Top. (paper rustles) I had a few words to say about one of my sponsors on this podcast. For many years, people have been asking for a coffee-flavored Huel, and quite recently, Huel released the iced coffee caramel flavor of their, um, ready-to-drink Huels. And I've just become hooked on it over the last couple of weeks. I've been on a really interesting journey with Huel, which I've described and talked about a little bit on this podcast. I started with the berry ready-to-drinks. Then I moved over to the protein salted caramel because it's 100 calories-

   23. NJNick Jones35:09

       Mm-hmm.

   24. SBSteven Bartlett35:09

       ... and it gives you all of your essential vitamins and minerals, but also gives you the 20-odd grams of protein you need. And now, I'm balanced between them both. I drink mostly the banana flavor ready to drink. I've got really into the iced coffee caramel, um, flavor of Huel's ready to drink, and now I'm drinking that as well as the protein. Make sure you try the new ready-to-drink flavors. The, the caramel flavor is amazing. The, um, new banana flavor as well is amazing. And obviously, as I said, the iced coffee caramel flavor has been a real smash hit. So check it out. Let me know what you think on social media. I see all of your tags and Instagram posts and tweets about Huel. Back to the podcast. (paper rustles)

9. 35:44 – 45:57

   the factors that made SoHo house what it is today

   1. SBSteven Bartlett35:44

      So when you look back then on that Soho House, um, a lot of people, I'm sure, started very similar style businesses around the time. I'm trying to figure out why Soho House went on to become what it is today. What were the, the factors that, in your view? You s- talked about customer feedback shaping everything, but-

   2. NJNick Jones36:01

      Well, I would... I, I would give that accolade to our members. I would, I would say it was the members who pushed me and, and, you know, when they... When we opened in New York, you know, they... Uh, uh, because we... I think we'd opened the Electric House. We'd... We were about three then, and, and someone said, "Well, you should open in New York. They'd love this." And I thought, "Ooh. Yes, maybe." So off I go to New York and, and, and determined to open a Soho House in New York. First of all, look... In the region, district of Soho, um, and...... couldn't find something going, came close. It was difficult learning permitting. It was, it was just difficult. And, um, I remember we found the warehouse. It was an old electrical warehouse, a meat packing. Yeah. Meat packing was a very different place to what it is now. Um, it was run down, it was, you know, it was, it was full of, sort of (laughs) , it was f- full of really interesting life. (laughs) And, and, and, uh, I remember we found this, this, this, this, this warehouse and I thought, "Okay, I'm gonna get, get the warehouse." And again, we had to raise money to do it, so it was a question of trying to, um, how do you get, raise money in New York, 'cause we, we, you know, the... It was, it was sort of bad time in the UK. It was s- I, I think there might have been a recession going on, so the, the banks were, "No, you're not gonna, we're not lending you money in New York." So I thought, "Okay, well, I gotta start raising money again from our members and from people in New York to put money into the Soho House in New York." And, um, I, I, I, it was, everything was nerve-wracking. You know, the, the, the week I was flying out there to try and get the permit to be able to allow to open a club in the, in a warehouse was 9/11. So I arrived on, uh, I think it was a Monday evening, and I was nervous 'cause I, it was this big, big meeting on the Thursday where in, in front of a local community board to see whether we'd get permission to be able to open up a club and have a license in th- in this premises. And I was having breakfast, um, on the Tuesday morning of, um, when it would be 9/11, um, and I was having a boiled egg. I remember it. And as I was hitting my boiled egg, I heard this big bang, and, and I thought, "What is that?" So I, I ran out on the street, and I looked up and I could see one of the Twin Towers with smoke coming out of it. And I asked, um, there was a guy sweeping the street and I said, "What happened? What..." He said, "Well, a plane went into the side of it." And I said, "Well, was it just a... What did it look... Was it..." He said, "It was an airliner. It was a, it wasn't like a private plane." And I thought, "Oh my god." So the first thing I did was phone Kirsty, my wife, um, 'cause she was in news then. She was a news presenter on ITN. And I said, "I think, think maybe you should get into work." (laughs) "There's something going on here." And, and then, and then I was still out on the street and I saw the second plane go in. You saw it come in? Yeah. Well, you, it was coming in from the, the river so you didn't actually see it coming in, but you saw the impact of it coming in. And, and then, you know, that day was, it, it made me really fall in love with New York. It's sort of the re- resistance of the people, uh, how, how they cope with it. How they... It was, it was, it was amazing, the people of New York that day, um, and that, that week. And, and anyway, weirdly, the community board still happened on the Thursday. And I went up and did my presentation and I said, "I, I, I don't know why I'm doing this. It seems irrelevant. It seems, uh, not, (laughs) not something we should be doing, but, you know, you're, you're running the meeting." There was a lot of other points on the agenda, so I was just one of them, and we got our permission. Um, and that's how New York started, but it was a big, big, sort of, um, race to find the finance. And I was calling everyone. I was, I was calling every... I did more show rounds of that, that, that, that warehouse building, you know, running up and down the stairs, showing people around, trying to be enthusiastic. And then, you know, I, I was sort of getting to know people in New York and I put together this hard hat dinner, um, where I, I, I don't know how it happened and I don't know, um, why it happened, um, but, you know, the really well-known people turned up to this dinner. And we had just had a six burner on the sixth floor and we cooked some chicken, and we laid out the table in the building site on, with a white tablecloth, so it was real grit and glamour. (laughs) And it was, it was... And, and these people just turned up and I remember David Bowie being there. Uh-huh. And I'm going... And I, I remember I was so nervous. I was, I, I, I, I, and I, and I, I started talking to him, and he said, "This is a great idea. Can I buy it?" And I said, "Well, there's nothing to buy at the moment, but can you invest in it? Yes." And, and so he was one of, he was one of the investors of, of, of Soho House New York, which was fantastic. And, and, and then momentum came and we rose, raised the money. Everyone sort of before that was saying a private member's club wouldn't work in New York, you know, it, it, the, the, it, people wouldn't pay a membership fee. People treat their restaurants like private members clubs and the velvet rope was the big thing in New York. Um, and I wobbled so often about should we charge for membership? And, and every, uh, I was so nervous opening Soho House New York. And I remember the opening party, um, and it was raining and they hadn't finished putting the roof on. (laughs) And, and people were staying in the hotel and there was no water, so we had to borrow the showers at the local gym. People had to go down- (laughs) ... to the local gym, um, for hot water. We had water but there was no, uh, hot water. And it was just this rollercoaster of an experience opening in New York where we didn't quite have enough money, um, and, you know, the team-... you know, my- we were carrying shee- sheet rock. Or it's plaster board over here and sheet rock over there-

   3. SBSteven Bartlett42:51

      Mm-hmm.

   4. NJNick Jones42:52

      ... up to the floors to try and finish them. We're putting the ceilings in, and, and it was a, it was a, it was a, it was a journey. But then eventually we opened (clears throat) and, you know, it worked. And it sort of- people sort of took to it.

   5. SBSteven Bartlett43:07

      Why bother? You know, like, you had a great business here in London. Y- you know, things are going well. Why, why put yourself through all that pain?

   6. NJNick Jones43:15

      Um, a very good question, and I think I could have just carried on doing things in London. But I ... there, there was an ambition in me. There was, you know, there was this, this thing about being a Brit and going to New York, and trying to take the thing which I loved in London and see if it worked in New York. And it was ... and it, and at points it nearly took the whole thing down. And but I really felt at the time that if it did bring the whole thing down, at least I tried. At least I gave it a go, and I wasn't gonna be sitting i- in a rocking chair thinking I didn't give it a go. So, I think there was a sort of inner something in me which wanted to see. And maybe it was sort of going back to my childhood when my brothers were so good on the sports field, or, or good at school. I was trying to prove a point.

   7. SBSteven Bartlett44:12

      'Cause I, 'cause I sensed that a lot. Even when you had this, you know, successful café, for you then to take the risk of taking upstairs with an unknown idea just because someone said it's available, and it's that ... You know, some people are more like the, I don't know, they stay within their zone of comfort and they just harvest. But you have this hunting sort of predisposition as well, even when things are going well.

   8. NJNick Jones44:32

      So, what I ... there's something inside me. Um, maybe I was trying to prove to my brothers, my family, that I, I could do this. And, and, yeah, I ... And I do always look at things in a positive light. I do look at things, like, you know, if I look at my glass of water, I'd say, "That's half full, um, not half empty." And, and th- and, and hospitality. I wanted to prove that hospitality could be done differently. And I think with Café Bohème, where we opened it all day and it was chameleon, it just kept changing to the time of day it was. And putting jazz on in the afternoon, and just sort of making it much more customer-focused, where you would go out 40 years ago and kitchens would close at 2:00 PM and you couldn't eat in the afternoon. And I think that was something. I, I felt I was onto something to be able to make it better for the customer, and that sort of took me back to when I liked helping my mum and dad at ... when they had people round for supper. And I loved seeing rooms full of people having a good time in Café Bohème, and l- I loved laughter. I loved people connecting with each other. I loved people enjoying themselves. And I think ... I just thought, "Why don't I just carry on doing this?"

10. 45:57 – 51:20

    The line between ambition & family

    1. NJNick Jones45:57

    2. SBSteven Bartlett45:57

       At what point does that desire to prove something need to be contained? Because it might come at the expense of, like, life balance. You know, this is a question I've asked myself a lot. It's like, when you are successful in one thing, you have more opportunities to go and do more things, and then you might end up being pulled so much by your ambition and your desire to prove a point, or your insecurities, that you then end up compromising all of these other things like friendships and the other things that make life fulfilling.

    3. NJNick Jones46:26

       Yeah, um, I ... It's a, it's a balance I've never quite got right. And I'm super lucky I have an incredibly supportive wife, Kirsty, and she, she sort of really went on the journey with me. And I know without her, you know, I wouldn't be ... you wouldn't be asking me onto this podcast. And, um, you know, so she's been a great support. Um, and my kids, you know, were sort of part of ... They, you know, they, they had to come to work. They ... You know, when I was doing the rounds on a Saturday morning or during weekends, I'd have pushchairs and toddlers and ... You know, they, they were just part of what was going on. And it had to sort of merge into one thing, and what I've successfully done is try and de-merge it, and have, you know, a ... when I'm at work I'm at work, and when I'm at family I'm with family, and that ... But that's taken a long time. So the, the, the, the, the balance is, is something I think all entrepreneurs s- suffer.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett47:40

       When you say it's a balance you've not got right, what was the indicator that you didn't get it right? How'd you know you didn't get it right? What was the symptom?

    5. NJNick Jones47:47

       I was always knackered. I was always (laughs) sort of pretending not to be.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett47:52

       (laughs)

    7. NJNick Jones47:53

       Uh, I was always sort of ... You know. Um, yeah, it was ... Yeah, I was internally coping with all the pressure where I could, but I wasn't doing that very well. Um, so I think it was sort of a combination of, of, of just realizing that, you know, this was all-consuming. You know, it was, it was, it was really dragging. And, and I was very lucky. I had, you know, great friends who are still my friends from when I was a kid, um, and I didn't see them enough. And you sort of ... In our business, hospitality, it is weekends, it's nights, it's days, it's, it's, it's all the time. And when you take it to a different country, then you have to think, "Well, the day's just got longer." (laughs) And, and, and it's got five y- f- you know, going to New York got five hours longer. And so, yes, it, it does take its toll.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett48:54

       What is that, Tom? You said about coping with pressure.

    9. NJNick Jones48:56

       Well, I, I, I, I think, you know, I, I, I sit here today and I think I'm lucky 'cause I think I got a great, you know, I, I, I have great relationship with my kids. I, you know, it's my favorite thing, is being with the, with the family and being, being, being with them all together. Um, so, um, but I, I think at times when you're trying to prove yourself, I'm trying to prove that I could work in New York and America. I was trying to prove that we could open Soho Houses in other parts of the world. I, I think it, it, it, it, it was hard, but, you know, you suddenly then do realize that you have to sort of balance it.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett49:40

        Is, was there, was there points in your journey that was part- so the pressure becomes so much and you almost feel within your being, whether it's your health gives out or your, your mental health or you get anxious, where you think, "This is not, this is not sustainable."?

    11. NJNick Jones49:55

        I, I, I, I never thought it wasn't sustainable because I'm always such a positive person. But I think, you know, Kirsty was great. You know, she kept saying, you know, "We don't need any more. This is... We don't need another house. The world doesn't need another house, Nick." You know? (laughs) The, the, the, the, you know, you don't need to be on a plane all the time. What, who are you, what are you trying to prove? And, and there was a stage where I was buzzing around everywhere, flying here, flying there and, and thinking it, it was all making a big difference. But really, and I think the pandemic taught me that, was the fact that there's better ways of using your time.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett50:35

        And what are those better ways of using your time?

    13. NJNick Jones50:36

        Well, you know, instead of buzzing around on a plane all the time and spending 12 hours in a city and then going to another city or doing one night and one... You sort of, where, you know, the teams are clever enough to put on a bit of a show (laughs) for that, that, that period of time so you're not actually seeing really what's going on. And, uh, there was just smarter ways of doing it. And, and, and also having a lot more trust in the senior leadership team and, uh, letting them get on with it and thinking that I didn't have to be everywhere for it to work. And actually, often, it worked much better when I wasn't around. (laughs) And, and, and I mean, I, I, I, I... You know, 'cause they were able to just get on with it and not worry about what I was thinking all the time.

11. 51:20 – 54:15

    What do you wish you had known?

    1. NJNick Jones51:20

    2. SBSteven Bartlett51:20

       That sounds like great advice for a younger version of Nick at the start of the Soho House journey. What else would you say, um, now in hindsight you wish someone had... Maybe they said it but you'd wish you had known about how to achieve, get to where you are now or further, um, but in a more effective, whether that relates to health or finance way? What would, what would be that advice you'd give to that Nick starting out on the Soho House journey?

    3. NJNick Jones51:43

       Well, I've always been obsessed about the customer, the member, and that was always my number one thing, or, and the people who work for us. They, they, they were my two obsessions. And I, the advice I think I'd give to a young, young, young Nick would be, you know, let them take more. Don't think that you have to, you know, your team, you know, put it more onto your team to get on with it. And don't try and do everything yourself. And also, you know, there, there's a, there's a point when you have, can prove yourself that you can, these things can work globally. And, you know, there's a time when, you know, you have to really properly delegate and let other people get on with it.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett52:29

       One of the, you know, 'cause one of the things that Soho House is known for is this, quote-unquote, brand. And I know you don't like that word, but this very, um, I think I would say it was an aspirational brand. People want to be a Soho House person. How much in- intentionality, I don't even know if that's a word, has gone into making that brand aspirational?

    5. NJNick Jones52:50

       I'd, I, I can't think of a time where we had a time where I was thinking about making an aspirational brand. I think it, that's, and if that's people's perception, great. Um, really gr- I'm, I'm, I'm, uh, that, that sounds good. (laughs) And I, I, all I concentrated on what our members wanted and, um, they've created that. They have created the, the, the, the, the, the fact that, you know, there's a desirability to be part of Soho House. And yes, we, and we h- and we got a brilliant team, brilliant membership teams globally. We got, we got people who really care, people who have been on the journey for a very long time. And I think with their help and with every house, we have a determination to make it better than the last house. You know, we always start with a fresh piece of paper. We don't think, "Well, you know, let's just keep repeat, repeat, repeat." We go new, new, new. How can we make it better? What are we gonna change to make this better? What are we gonna change to make it more efficient? What are we gonna change to make it better for the member? And I think our members really appreciate that and they see that and they talk about that, and that's probably what's created what you have just described.

12. 54:15 – 58:50

    Whats hospitality taught you about life?

    1. NJNick Jones54:15

    2. SBSteven Bartlett54:15

       What has hospitality taught you about life?

    3. NJNick Jones54:18

       Everything. I sort of think, you know, um, it should be the national service. (laughs) You know, people should go and do a year in hospitality. 'Cause I think it teaches you so much. I mean, I spoke earlier about me going into that kitchen and really learning how to get on with people and from different backgrounds, different countries, different, different everything. And I think it really teaches you, you know, to be part of a team, and there's the customer, there's all your, you know, people you work with in the kitchen or the person cleaning the dishes or the person, you know, cleaning the rooms, it, you all have to work together to make it happen. And I think, so...... it really takes the shyness out of you and it get, gives you an ability to get on with people, which I think is a really useful tool. I think it's better than a, a, a master's degree, (laughs) I think, getting on with people. I think, um, you learn, you know, just useful practical things like making a bed, or keeping a place tidy, or clearing a table of plates. And, and, and when you, when you've got a family gathering or something, you can suddenly clear the plates and stack 'em up, or you can, you can, you can make a cocktail, you know, which is really nice. You, you, that doesn't, you don't, even if you're not in hospitality anymore, you can still make a cocktail, you can still make a bed, you can still hopefully get on with people. You can still, you know, clear a table. You're, you, you have to become quite organized in your mind, and I think hospitality is a very rewarding industry for that.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett55:53

       Hospitality's quite a, quite a broad term, but at the crux of it, what do you think it is that you're actually selling to people? What, what are they buying from you?

    5. NJNick Jones56:02

       Well, I think what we want our member to do is flourish. You know, we want them to flourish socially, and we want them to flourish, you know, at work. And I think creating memberships and, you know, that word community, of people who are sort of like-minded and, and they all have a creative soul, and you put them in, in one house, you know, that is like, you know, they, they bump into each other, they talk to each other. I've seen businesses created, I've seen relationships created, friendships created, ideas created. And, and I think when you put people together in a space and, and, and it, that is, that is pretty special. And to see that happen in different countries and different cities, to see members sort of really using the fact that you go into the house, you can just go into the house on your own, just wander down there, and, you know, you'll bump into someone, you'll start having a drink with someone or a cup of coffee with someone, or you... And you're sort of, you're, you're in the house, you're part, part of a, that membership. And I, and I, you know, people do it, you know, a lot now. And, you know, you can do it digitally and they use algorithms and they use all sorts of things. And I think, you know, being part of Soho House and, you know, those 500 members I talked to about earlier, you know, they're still part of us. They still pay their membership. They're, they're still here. They're still part of it. They don't give it up. And, and so you have on one hand the, the original founder members of 27, 28 years ago, and then on the other hand you've got, you know, huge under-27 membership going into our houses. You know, huge, you know, it accounts for 22, 23% of our overall membership, you know, under-27s. And it, it's, it's seeing in a room, you know, the most successful script writer in one corner and, um, in another corner there might be the struggling script writer who's still trying to write, you know, their first script, or, you know, the ar- a really well-known artist or an artist who hasn't sold... a, a, a, a new painter who hasn't sold their first bit of work. And, you know, and taking that, and, and trying to think, well, how can the person who's done it help the person who wants to do it? And y- you know, that's why I'm so passionate about our mentoring scheme, where, you know, there is so much creativity in the world, and there's so much creativity, you know... And, and creativity is not owned by the middle class (laughs) . It's, it's everywhere. And to, to be able to offer mentoring,

13. 58:50 – 1:04:11

    Are you shy?

    1. NJNick Jones58:50

       um, to people who are less fortunate, who might b- not be able to afford a, a membership or might not know what door to knock to get that opportunity is sort of one of the favorite things that we're doing at... my favorite things I'm doing at the moment, is seeing it happen. So, going back to what you were saying about creating people in a room who all help each other, they all feel like they're looking out for each other, they all want to help the person who, who's down on their luck or who is, is, is, is, is, is starting out, or they wanna help the, the, the, you know... they want to create an idea with another bunch of members. And I think that, that, that is, that is special, and it goes back to seeing people in a room having a great time. And, and if our members can flourish in, in their lives, if, if Soho House can just make their lives just a little bit better, then I think that's a good thing.

    2. SBSteven Bartlett59:50

       Are you naturally a shy person?

    3. NJNick Jones59:52

       I think so.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett59:53

       'Cause it's funny, 'cause when I, I meet entrepreneurs there's various different types of entrepreneur and, um, s- once in a while I meet, uh, an entrepreneur and a founder that's created a really great business but is quite, I think the word is unassuming. As in, they're not very self-promoting. You know, you ask them certain questions about what their brilliance is, for example, and they, they don't necessarily point it themselves, they tend to defer it to others. So, it just made me... it's, it's, it's, it's curious 'cause it's kind of unconventional to meet an entrepreneur that's so... that feels so unassuming, in a sense, uh, uh, in terms of not having a huge ego (laughs) , I guess. Um, 'cause, 'cause the question I was gonna ask you, and in my head I was going, "He's probably not gonna, gonna, gonna... he might defer this to some- something else," is, you've created such an amazing business, and it's such a, a wonderful brand and it's, it's a- admired by people that are customers and that aren't customers, just for, for the business, but I can't seem to get you to tell me, um, why you, out of everyone else that was trying to do this, were successful. Because I got the ambition piece, I've got that persistence and that r- that persistence that comes from that childhood sort of maybe chip on your shoulder, but, but, but I know there's more.

    5. NJNick Jones1:01:07

       Well-I'm- I can only tell you what I'm- I, I think. And I-

    6. SBSteven Bartlett1:01:14

       Yeah.

    7. NJNick Jones1:01:14

       ... what I, I, I do think is, you know, uh, I, I love what I do. I'm lucky. I get up every morning. I have a skip in my sticks ... Uh, you know, I'm skipping around. I'm, um, I'm looking forward to getting to work. I, I, I have a fantastic team around and, um, you know, I care deeply. And if that all adds up to it working, that's the reason why.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett1:01:40

       Mm-hmm.

    9. NJNick Jones1:01:40

       'Cause it was never, for me, a money play. It was more a, a, a, a thing that I wanted to try and make hospitality, you know? And I ... That is a ... I, I used to say catering, but, uh, I've upgraded it to hospitality.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett1:01:57

        (laughs)

    11. NJNick Jones1:01:57

        And, (laughs) and to make hospitality a sort of area where you can change it. You can. You know, when we opened Babington House, you know, it was the first country house hotel where you could get breakfast when you wanted, when there was no rules. It was, it was, it was, you know, your, your bedroom at Babington House was probably nicer than your bedroom at home. So people would come down and go, "Well, Nick, you know," um, you know, "'Where'd you get that TV? Where'd you get Sky? That's new. Wher- I'm gonna put Sky in my houses." Or, "I'm gonna ... Where'd you get those sheets?" And, and s- so I'm not trying to avoid your question here.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:34

        Mm-hmm.

    13. NJNick Jones1:02:34

        But I'm just trying to, again, answer how I feel and-

    14. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:38

        I w-

    15. NJNick Jones1:02:38

        ... why I do it.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:39

        I did get something more from that, which is just your care.

    17. NJNick Jones1:02:41

        Yeah.

    18. SBSteven Bartlett1:02:41

        How much you care. And your passion and your care, uh, seem to have a, a relationship together. But ... And that's, that's so important because a lot of people would be launching it for money, and then therefore they don't care about something else, whereas you really seem to care essentially about the customer experience more than anything else.

    19. NJNick Jones1:02:56

        Well, I, I, I think I always say to our team, as sort of a, if, if, if our people are happy and the s- the members are happy, then sort of everything else will look after itself-

    20. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:05

        Mm-hmm.

    21. NJNick Jones1:03:05

        ... 'cause your places will be busy. And if you-

    22. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:07

        Mm-hmm.

    23. NJNick Jones1:03:07

        If you're smart on your cost control, it, it, it, it ... Everything else should be fine.

    24. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:13

        Do you think you're a success?

    25. NJNick Jones1:03:17

        I ... Well, I, I, I think I said earlier, but success, you can judge success in lots of ways. Um, you know, I'd much rather be judged as a father than as (clears throat) someone who runs a business. And, you know, I suppose you'd have to ask my kids that.

    26. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:32

        Professionally, do you think you're a success?

    27. NJNick Jones1:03:34

        I ... People tell me a lot, and I've, I suppose I have to listen to them.

    28. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:39

        (laughs)

    29. NJNick Jones1:03:39

        In, in, in, in, in, in, in, in their eyes, I'm, I, I, I've, I've done all right.

    30. SBSteven Bartlett1:03:46

        In your eyes?
14. 1:04:11 – 1:05:51

    Whats next?

    1. NJNick Jones1:04:11

    2. SBSteven Bartlett1:04:11

       And so what's next then for, for, for you? I mean, tremendous business all around the world, and it's becoming so much more than just houses. What is the big next mental challenge, ambition, excitement?

    3. NJNick Jones1:04:25

       Well, we're recently public.

    4. SBSteven Bartlett1:04:27

       Yeah.

    5. NJNick Jones1:04:27

       Um, and, you know, we went public during the pandemic. I'm enjoying that challenge.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett1:04:33

       Really?

    7. NJNick Jones1:04:33

       Yes, I'm enjoying it. I'm enjoying dealing with, you know ... And I view all the analysts as smart, and, and I think it's making us a better business. And I think, um, you know, so there's a journey on that. You know, it's, we're only 12 months into it, and people understanding that it's subscription, recurring income, that, um, you know, a third of our revenues come from membership. And our, our hotels, our bedrooms are always (clears throat) nicely full, and we don't have to use what other hotels have to use to fill their hotels, like booking engines, et cetera. Um, I, I ... S- so I, I think that is a, a, a, a, an interesting future on how to be properly successful on the, on, on, a- as a public company. Um, and there's so many more places we can open houses. You know, we, we haven't even touched Africa. We've only dipped our toe into Asia. We, we, we got ... We're going to Latin America later this year, um, to open in Mexico. So, there's a, there's a, there's a lot of exciting new houses opening. Um, and being a public company, and just trying to get better every

15. 1:05:51 – 1:10:39

    The last guests question

    1. NJNick Jones1:05:51

       day.

    2. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:51

       We have a closing tradition on this podcast where the previous guest, uh, leaves a question for the next guest.

    3. NJNick Jones1:05:56

       (clears throat)

    4. SBSteven Bartlett1:05:56

       And, um, the previous guest has left you a question. They have written ... They don't, obviously don't know who they're writing it for, but here we go. Um, "If you could go back in time and change one specific moment in your life, what would that be and why?"

    5. NJNick Jones1:06:12

       Ooh. Um, I would definitely have come up ... I definitely would still would have done Over the Top.

    6. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:20

       (laughs)

    7. NJNick Jones1:06:21

       (laughs) Yeah. I, I, I would have done that. Um, one specific thing, um, I, I, I think I would have, I would have tried to get my life, uh, my, the, the balance between life and, and, and family a bit better.

    8. SBSteven Bartlett1:06:40

       Why?

    9. NJNick Jones1:06:43

       Because, you know, running at a hundred miles an hour all the time doesn't always sort of, you know, a- a- achieve everything. So I think, I think ... And I, and I've, I've talked on the behalf of many entrepreneurs and many CEOs and ... who just get a bit obsessed and, and about their, their, their world, their business. And I think, you know, you, you're slightly better of it if you're not so abs- if you, if you have a more balanced view.

    10. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:11

        Yeah. I was actually talking to one of my friends about this last night that you all know, um, that runs one of the big, big, uh, companies in this country that's a billion-pound company, and he was ... We were having the same conversation about just trying to remember amongst all of this ambition that the, like, the actual most important question is like, are you happy?

    11. NJNick Jones1:07:26

        Yeah.

    12. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:27

        And, and that's one that, um, I've definitely l- lost sight of for many, many years of my life in the pursuit of building more and more and more.

    13. NJNick Jones1:07:34

        Yeah.

    14. SBSteven Bartlett1:07:34

        And then eventually loneliness or some other kind of consequence will show up and remind me that I've misprioritized.

    15. NJNick Jones1:07:41

        But it's a, it's a, it's a great subject now, isn't it? And I think people come out of the pandemic and they think, "There is, you know, um, we want our lives to be slightly more balanced." And I think, I think, you know, that wasn't the case 25 years ago or 15 years ago or when you started your business. It was, it was, you know, it was that mission. And I think balance is good.

    16. SBSteven Bartlett1:08:05

        Well, thank you, Nick. Thank you so much for your time, the generosity with your time. And, uh, thank you for creating a business that I love and that I s- uh, that I'm probably at every week uh, at, at current rate. Um, and now-

    17. NJNick Jones1:08:14

        Well, thank you for being a member.

    18. SBSteven Bartlett1:08:15

        Yeah. (laughs)

    19. NJNick Jones1:08:15

        A loyal member.

    20. SBSteven Bartlett1:08:16

        Yeah. (laughs) Uh, and, you know, w- I think most, a lot, most of our team as well, I bought memberships for them as well. And, um, you've created a business which brings a lot of people joy. But, uh, but the thing that I actually love the most about your business, which is, I think is a bit of a dying, um, human Maslovian need, is community. And everything, whether it's the industry I worked in, social media, or whether it's other things, or even rem- remote working now seems to be taking community away from us, which seems to be so integral to like hu- the hu- being a human. And so Howes, uh, and the brand is bringing that back. And I think that's why I would personally bet on that, because I think, um, regardless of how the world change and technology and all of that, we're still gonna always, um, love and have a desire for community. So-

    21. NJNick Jones1:08:57

        Yeah. I, I agree. I agree. Uh, the, the human connection and people getting together and laughter and ideas and not doing it digitally, doing it in a physical space is, is great to see.

    22. SBSteven Bartlett1:09:09

        Thank you. (instrumental music plays) Quick one. As you might know, Crafted are one of the sponsors of this podcast, and they make really meaningful pieces of jewelry. This lion piece they've made, I wear all the time, along with the little time piece, the sand timer that I wear often. And the lion piece, you might've seen Conor McGregor has a similar piece, which was custom made for him. For me, it represents courage. And if you walk through my house, the house that I'm in right now, if you walk six feet in that direction, you'll see a huge lion portrait. If you go upstairs, you'll see a lion portrait. If you look behind me on the shelf, near the top there, you'll see a lion as well. The reason my house and my life is surrounded by lions is because they represent courage, calmness, and that tenacity that I've applied to my business success, to my professional life, and to everything in between. For me, the lion has always been an animal that can be almost a bit of a contradiction. They are so loving and so caring of their own, and can be powerful and courageous when necessary in order to achieve what they wanna achieve. So if you, like me, are a big fan of courage, bravery, ambition, while also being calm and composed, check out this lion piece and let me know if you get it. (instrumental music plays)

Episode duration: 1:10:39