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Jay Shetty PodcastJay Shetty Podcast

This is How to Use Spirituality To Help You with Confidence and Self-Doubt!

Today, Jay sits down with longtime friend and Grammy-nominated devotional artist Jahnavi Harrison for a deeply personal conversation about faith, creativity, and living a life of service. Together, they reflect on spiritual grounding as a daily practice, not rooted in perfection but in the ability to remain steady through uncertainty and change. Jay and Jahnavi explore the often unseen journey behind purpose-driven work, how passion gradually becomes discipline, and discipline shapes a life of devotion. They unpack the courage it takes to walk a less conventional path, especially in a world that often values conformity and external validation. Through stories of growing up between two worlds, wrestling with self-expression, and finding healing through music and mantra, they invite us to reconsider success not as achievement, but as alignment. As the conversation unfolds, their focus turns to prayer, service, and staying connected when you feel lost. Jay and Jahnavi share why speaking to God, serving others, and creating space for vulnerability can become powerful anchors during difficult seasons. Ultimately, this conversation reminds us that spirituality isn’t about having everything figured out, it’s about showing up with sincerity, listening deeply, and choosing to give, even when the path ahead is unclear. In this interview, you'll learn: How to Find Peace Through Sacred Sound How to Stay Grounded When Life Feels Overwhelming How to Turn Doubt Into a Deeper Faith How to Express Yourself When You Feel Invisible How to Trust Your Intuition Over External Pressure How to Integrate Spirituality Into Everyday Life How to Reconnect With Purpose Through Service How to Talk to God in Your Own Way You are allowed to take your time, to find your voice in your own way, and to choose a path that feels meaningful rather than impressive. Healing and purpose don’t come from perfection, but from showing up sincerely and trusting that what you offer with love will return in its own time. Check out Jahnavi’s Grammy nominated album Into the Forest here. With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty Join over 750,000 people to receive my most transformative wisdom directly in your inbox every single week with my free newsletter. Subscribe here. Check out our Apple subscription to unlock bonus content of On Purpose! https://lnk.to/JayShettyPodcast What We Discuss: 00:00 Intro 04:06 What Truly Defines Who You Are 06:06 Are You Actively Seeking Truth? 08:54 Where a Love for Music First Began 10:31 Understanding Devotional Mantra Music 13:31 Growing Up With an Unconventional Education 21:35 Navigating Identity and Belonging 24:27 Learning to Trust Your Inner Confidence 25:27 When Parents Are Doing Their Best 27:49 Questioning Life Within a Spiritual Community 31:02 From Curiosity to Creative Mastery 34:51 Experiencing the Divine Through Sound 36:43 Creating Space for Others to Feel Free 39:39 When Music Becomes Healing 41:35 Turning Personal Prayer Into Shared Experience 45:23 The Biggest Misconceptions About Spiritual People 49:17 Growing Up Surrounded by Spiritual Validation 51:05 Holding a Safe Space for Spiritual Exploration 54:22 Navigating a Crisis of Faith 56:45 What It Feels Like to Lose Faith 59:35 Using Meditation to Access Stillness 01:03:09 Asking Yourself, “Am I Being of Service?” 01:09:20 Jahnavi on Final Five Episode Resources: https://www.instagram.com/jayshetty https://www.facebook.com/jayshetty/ https://x.com/jayshetty https://www.linkedin.com/in/shettyjay/ https://www.youtube.com/@JayShettyPodcast http://jayshetty.me

Jahnavi HarrisonguestJay Shettyhost
Dec 26, 20251h 21mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

  1. 0:00 – 4:06

    Intro

    1. JH

      There's so many different ways that people pray. For some people, it's very spontaneous. Some people have a very ritualized way of placing their, their body in a certain position or doing certain actions. I think all of those things are designed to bring us into a certain s- state of mind and of being that allows-- can allow you to express some of these deepest sentiments that are otherwise quite hard to access.

    2. JS

      Hey, everyone. Welcome back to On Purpose, the place you come to become happier, healthier, and more healed. Today's guest is one of my dearest friends of the last twenty years, but she's also one of the most talented musicians. She uses music not just to entertain, but to heal. Jahnavi is a devotional singer, writer, and artist whose voice has become a refuge for people searching for peace and spiritual grounding. Through her performances, recordings, and global workshops, Jahnavi has devoted her life to helping people experience the power of mantra, meditation, and sacred sound. Her work invites us to pause, breathe, and reconnect with our inner life. And she's also been nominated for her very first Grammy. If you're part of the Academy, this is my personal request. Go and vote for her.

    3. JH

      [laughs]

    4. JS

      I'm so excited to welcome to On Purpose my dear friend, Jahnavi Harrison. Jahnavi-

    5. JH

      Thank you

    6. JS

      ... it's so wonderful to have you here.

    7. JH

      I just got a massive confidence boost [laughs] listening to that.

    8. JS

      [laughs] You-- I mean, I just wanna let people know. So I've known you now for, like, twenty years.

    9. JH

      Twenty years.

    10. JS

      And I met you through our temple and spiritual community-

    11. JH

      Mm-hmm

    12. JS

      ... in London-

    13. JH

      Mm-hmm

    14. JS

      ... which is where we first met.

    15. JH

      Yeah.

    16. JS

      And we would've both been at college or something-

    17. JH

      Yeah

    18. JS

      ... like that.

    19. JH

      Yeah.

    20. JS

      And I am so fortunate and so excited about this because sometimes I post these pictures of me on the, on social media, which are, like, how it started, how it's going.

    21. JH

      Yeah.

    22. JS

      And all of those how it started, so many of them were with you.

    23. JH

      Yeah. [laughs]

    24. JS

      So me and Jahnavi, for everyone who doesn't know, what we would do is we would do events together-

    25. JH

      Mm-hmm

    26. JS

      ... where I would speak, and Jahnavi would lead a mantra meditation, and we would like, uh... That was, like, our duo.

    27. JH

      Tag team.

    28. JS

      Our tag team.

    29. JH

      Yeah, yeah. [laughs]

    30. JS

      Yeah, exactly. And we'd travel all over England. We did events in London. We did events in Weymouth. We did events-

  2. 4:06 – 6:06

    What Truly Defines Who You Are

    1. JS

      You know what? It's, it's really interesting because obviously I've seen you grow and, you know, you, you tour the world, you do retreats, uh, you know, you made an album with our dear friend Willow-

    2. JH

      Yeah

    3. JS

      ... who you came on the podcast with last time.

    4. JH

      Yeah.

    5. JS

      It's been amazing to watch, but I almost... This is really exciting for me because even when you know someone, when I get to sit in the interview with them, I'm always thinking, "I'm actually gonna get to know them in a way that I don't before."

    6. JH

      Yeah.

    7. JS

      So I wanna go back to your childhood.

    8. JH

      Yeah.

    9. JS

      And I wanna ask you, what is a childhood memory that you have that you feel defines who you are today or embodies who you are today?

    10. JH

      Wow. Well, I know with these kind of things, you're, you should, you're supposed to say the very first thing that comes into your head. [laughs]

    11. JS

      [laughs]

    12. JH

      And I'm seeing myself in a field near my house. Um, you know, I grew up outside of London, but it's not that far from the city, but it's an area that there's a lot of protected farmland and stuff, so there's a lot of fields and forest, and it really feels quite rural. And these fields were, um, close to my house. So I used to love walking, cycling there, and just being in nature. And, uh, yeah, they, they would rotate the, the crops and the things that were grown in the field. And certain years there would be these incredible, um, yellow flowers, rapeseed flowers, or sometimes called mustard flowers, and you could just kind of walk amongst them and be completely engulfed by these yellow flowers, yellow as far as the eye could see. So I don't know why that came to my head, but yeah, that's, I guess that's something that's defined, um, who I am, connection to nature, and just, yeah, finding a lot of inspiration in that.

    13. JS

      Do you still spend a lot of time in nature?

    14. JH

      I try to, yeah.

    15. JS

      Yeah.

    16. JH

      Yeah, I do.

    17. JS

      In-- Where-- Do you-- Is it where you are now or when you go back home? Because I know you don't live in London anymore.

    18. JH

      Yeah, yeah. I mean s- wh-For the last, um,

  3. 6:06 – 8:54

    Are You Actively Seeking Truth?

    1. JH

      you know, almost three years we've been living in the Bay Area, so that's, that's famous around the world for the incredible nature. So now we've got the redwood trees and, you know, the incredible, um, California coast. So yeah, we try to be out in that environment as much as possible. But I love to, like, uh, you know, I, I consider myself a bit of a, a tree nerd. [laughs] So wherever I go in the world, I'm always trying to learn about what trees are around and yeah, it's just something that inspires me a lot.

    2. JS

      Yeah. I mean, I obviously know your parents.

    3. JH

      Yeah.

    4. JS

      Your, your dad actually, uh, was our wedding priest for me and Radhi.

    5. JH

      Yeah. Yeah.

    6. JS

      And so he actually did our wedding ceremony, and, uh, I've known your parents for-

    7. JH

      Yeah

    8. JS

      ... 20 years now as well, and they've always been just so wonderful.

    9. JH

      Mm.

    10. JS

      And, you know, they're so loved by our community.

    11. JH

      Yeah.

    12. JS

      And everyone has such an affinity for them. Like, what, what do you think each of them gave you growing up that you carry with yourself today? Like what-

    13. JH

      Mm

    14. JS

      ... what was a quality or a value or a belief or even mindset-

    15. JH

      Mm

    16. JS

      ... that you think has really stayed with you for all these years?

    17. JH

      They're both truth seekers. That's something that I think brought them together.

    18. JS

      Mm.

    19. JH

      I mean, they both joined the spiritual community for, I think, around a decade before they got married. So they came from their respective religious traditions that they were brought up with, and even countries, you know, my mom's from Canada. Um, and both of them went on a personal odyssey of a sort, you know, searching for truth and meaning, purpose in life. So I think that, um, courage to depart from the script that's been given, which I know a lot of people had in the, you know, the '60s, '70s. A lot of young people felt emboldened to, to take some unconventional steps. Um, but not only did they sort of try that on, but they've committed to that life and, um, to deepening, I think, with every year. And to have parents that are, yeah, they're so committed to a life of service and devotion and community. I think both of them in their own way. My mom's, my mom's the one... I mean, actually both of them [laughs] are-

    20. JS

      [laughs]

    21. JH

      ... are very people people, you know. They, they know a lot of people. They remember people's names. But they really care about people as well. Um, I think in our community, if they walk from point A to point B, you know, like a five-minute walk, they'll be stopping constantly-

    22. JS

      [laughs]

    23. JH

      ... with every person and-

    24. JS

      Yeah

    25. JH

      ... and care about what's going on in their life at the moment. So, um, I think that's something that's made a, a deep impression on me. It's, um, it's hard to follow in, in their footsteps, you know. Um, in, in my life and I guess in the life

  4. 8:54 – 10:31

    Where a Love for Music First Began

    1. JH

      of all of us who have grown up with the internet and social media, we have the ability to be connected to so many more people than ever before, and it's difficult to bring that same quality of presence and attention and care to, to all of our interactions. But, um, it's a kind of a gold standard that I have in my mind. Um, yeah, so much.

    2. JS

      Yeah.

    3. JH

      It's hard to, hard to measure-

    4. JS

      Yeah

    5. JH

      ... all the things you've received from your parents.

    6. JS

      Did, did you always know that you wanted to create music? Did you always know that?

    7. JH

      I didn't know that I wanted to create music in a formal way, but I was always... I think I was always doing it without consciously realizing that was a thing. Like, I just, when I was home recently, um, my mom had some cassette tapes from... That I, I used to record myself, you know. Um-

    8. JS

      At what age?

    9. JH

      Um, like probably seven, eight-

    10. JS

      Wow

    11. JH

      ... nine years old. And I had, uh, one of those keyboards, Casio keyboard, and I would just put on a drum beat.

    12. JS

      [laughs]

    13. JH

      And I would just play. I didn't know how to play keyboard, but I had total lack of, um, you know, inhibition. I would just record myself spontaneously, and I would sing a bit, tell a story, make up the story as I went along. And, um, they were just meant for my sister to hear, like bedtime stories-

    14. JS

      [laughs]

    15. JH

      ... and stuff like that. [laughs] Um, but when I listened back I, I was like, "Oh, I guess I was kind of making up songs and things like that." But yeah, it wasn't-

    16. JS

      Were you any good now when you listen back, like?

    17. JH

      No, it was embarrassing.

    18. JS

      Oh. [laughs]

    19. JH

      It was really embarrassing. [laughs]

    20. JS

      We need to hear them.

    21. JH

      No.

    22. JS

      I need to hear these.

    23. JH

      I, I think I'm gonna, I'm gonna digitize

  5. 10:31 – 13:31

    Understanding Devotional Mantra Music

    1. JH

      them just so I can listen back and be like, "Wow, I've come a long way." But, um, I, I mean, I love to sing. You know, I grew up surrounded by music. My dad and mom both love singing. Um, my dad was really well known for his voice and, um, yeah, we, we sung as a family together, so I think it was just always around me.

    2. JS

      Yeah.

    3. JH

      But I'm, you know, quite introverted by nature, so I was never like, "I wanna be a singer."

    4. JS

      Yeah. What do you, what do you think... What's the difference, for someone who doesn't know-

    5. JH

      Yeah

    6. JS

      ... what's the difference between devotional mantra music-

    7. JH

      Yeah

    8. JS

      ... and popular music, or music in general? Like, how would you differentiate them?

    9. JH

      I think there's a few key differences. One is, one is the most obvious, which is, which is the lyrics. Um, with, with mantra music specifically, a mantra is, um, you know, a sacred word or phrase, um, often containing names that refer to the, to the supreme being. Um, and it's repeated, so, you know, people's first reaction is, like, often, "What? Oh, why is that... Why are you saying the same thing over and over again?"

    10. JS

      [laughs]

    11. JH

      Um, but the idea is that it's a type of, um, purifying. Like, I always think of a washing machine. You know, if you had clothes that were really dirty, you'd, you put them in the washing machine a few times or something like that. Um, so it's, it's sound vibration that is intended to, to clarify, purify the heart and mind. Um-But I think the other key difference is the intention of the music. So the intention is often prayer, is to connect, like you were saying at the beginning, to that sacred space within. Whereas I think, you know, music can have all kinds of intentions. There can be the intention of the artist just to express something, to c- just to connect with the listener, or just to entertain. I don't mean just in a, you know, to minimize what that is. But, um, yeah, the quality of it is different. You can, you can encounter that. You can feel it.

    12. JS

      Hmm. Yeah, no, it's, uh... I remember when I first got exposed to it, it was addictive and intoxicating in, in a way-

    13. JH

      Yeah

    14. JS

      ... that was something I hadn't experienced before.

    15. JH

      Yeah.

    16. JS

      I remember my, my friends and I would love going out to parties and clubs and-

    17. JH

      Yeah

    18. JS

      ... things like that, and then when I heard devotional music for the first time, I was ... I was like, "Wait, why do I like this?"

    19. JH

      Hmm.

    20. JS

      Like, you know, but it felt familiar, and it felt, it felt like it, I don't know, connected with a part of me that had been buried for some time-

    21. JH

      Hmm

    22. JS

      ... or, or not, you know, not awakened. And yeah, it has a really special quality. And now, obviously, years later, it's, it's one of my favorite things to experience, especially when-

    23. JH

      Yeah

    24. JS

      ... when you're chanting. But-

    25. JH

      Did you feel that straight away? Do you remember if you-

    26. JS

      Um-

    27. JH

      Did it take a while to-

    28. JS

      Oh, no

    29. JH

      ... appreciate it? Or, or immediately-

    30. JS

      I felt it-

  6. 13:31 – 21:35

    Growing Up With an Unconventional Education

    1. JS

      ... you know, it's such a celebration.

    2. JH

      Yeah.

    3. JS

      It's so-

    4. JH

      It's not always just sitting-

    5. JS

      Correct. Yeah, yeah

    6. JH

      ... med- in med- meditation.

    7. JS

      Exactly.

    8. JH

      Yeah.

    9. JS

      It's so festive.

    10. JH

      Yeah.

    11. JS

      So I think there's a part of that.

    12. JH

      Mm-hmm.

    13. JS

      But there were, there were certain people and, um, yeah, I'll tell you later of who specifically. But, like, yeah.

    14. JH

      Mm.

    15. JS

      There were, there were just, there were just specific... There, there were definitely experiences I had very early on that made me very convinced that the practice made sense-

    16. JH

      Yeah

    17. JS

      ... and it was beautiful and-

    18. JH

      Yeah

    19. JS

      ... and special. But, um, but yeah. How... So if you were... So you were always artistic, as in you were always playing around.

    20. JH

      Yeah.

    21. JS

      Talk to me about the discovery, because so much of our community and our audience-

    22. JH

      Yeah

    23. JS

      ... is always in the pursuit of their passion.

    24. JH

      Mm-hmm.

    25. JS

      And obviously you're doing something you love.

    26. JH

      Yeah.

    27. JS

      You're doing something that's more niche.

    28. JH

      Mm-hmm.

    29. JS

      But you're also doing it extremely successfully. This is what you do.

    30. JH

      Yeah.

  7. 21:35 – 24:27

    Navigating Identity and Belonging

    1. JS

      to do that as a teenager is like, you know, is, is super hard.

    2. JH

      Yeah.

    3. JS

      So what did it, what actually helped to integrate? What, how did you integrate these two seemingly opposite lives that seemed to contradict themselves? Uh, w- what did you do to integrate? What did that look like?

    4. JH

      Yeah. I think in my school, the school-school years, like, you know, till 18 or so, I just really struggled. It kind of felt like a, a dark tunnel those years, 'cause, not, not that every day was dark, but it just, I just didn't feel like I could find that confidence and that self-assurance to feel, yeah, grounded in who I am. And I kind of, um, went back and forth, in and out of, you know, I'd go to a s- regular school for a year, and then I would actually, I mean, several times I kind of made myself sick, actually, with anxiety. Um, I started developing stomach issues, and I'd get headaches every single day. I wouldn't eat at school. I wouldn't, you know, I'd just save my lunch and eat it on the bus on the way home. Just, like, all these behaviors that were not, I don't know why I was doing those things. Um, so then I'd tell my parents, "Okay, I'd, I wanna do, like, homeschooling for a while," and I'd do that. But then, you know, I, I, I could tell myself that I have, um, it's not like I'm, like, super academic, but I, I need to be stretched a bit. Like [chuckles] when, when you're in that comfort zone of home, or you're just with friends, or your parents telling you to do things, you don't, you don't always push yourself. So I would kind of yearn for that environment again, and go back into it, and then feel like, oh, I don't think I can do this. Um, and I think, I think things really changed when I started to feel like I could take agency for myself, and start to take a, have a bit more confidence in choosing the, the, the direction of my education, which I think maybe for many people comes around university, and you're kind of starting to hone in on, you know, what you want to do. But I was gonna say, you w- you were saying, you know, when you were 11, what did you want to do with your life? And I remember sitting on the school bus and writing, I remember, like, three long lists on the page, and they were just all these different artistic things. And I would keep going back to the lists, and every time I would g- learn something more about each of those creative careers, I might cross one off, and it was like [chuckles] florist, then special effects makeup artist.

    5. JS

      [laughs]

    6. JH

      And my, my dad would sometimes take me to, like, do, you know, work shadowing with different people just to, just to try and see what it was a- what it was all about.But yeah, I had no idea-

    7. JS

      [laughs]

    8. JH

      ... where my journey would take me.

    9. JS

      Did you ever narrow it down to one or no? It was just-

    10. JH

      No, I never,

  8. 24:27 – 25:27

    Learning to Trust Your Inner Confidence

    1. JH

      no. [laughs]

    2. JS

      That's so funny.

    3. JH

      I'm still working on that.

    4. JS

      Yeah. [laughs]

    5. JH

      [laughs]

    6. JS

      Was it hard to go from secondary school or high school to college, like, to university? Was that hard, that transition, or-

    7. JH

      Mm

    8. JS

      ... was university not that hard?

    9. JH

      That was easier. That was easier, 'cause by that time I think I'd, I'd developed some confidence. I did my A levels very unconventionally through evening classes, which I was with older people that I found easier to be around.

    10. JS

      Mm.

    11. JH

      'Cause, I don't know, I just think I'd also grown up around a lot of older people and, um, I found I did really well doing, studying independently a lot. And so I think that gave me a lot of confidence, like-

    12. JS

      Mm

    13. JH

      ... choosing how I was going to study, you know. Then I finished the A levels in a year instead of two years. It's like a different way of approaching it.

    14. JS

      Mm.

    15. JH

      And then I c- I started to feel like, okay, you know, I just, yeah, felt different in myself. I mean, you grow up. Um, so I think university, college also, people are a lot more open-minded-

    16. JS

      Yeah

    17. JH

      ... I found. Um, you start realizing

  9. 25:27 – 27:49

    When Parents Are Doing Their Best

    1. JH

      that it can be cool to be different rather than just something to be made fun of.

    2. JS

      We all want to feel better, to have more energy and more focus throughout the day. That's why I co-founded Juni, a sparkling adaptogenic drink made with powerful ingredients like ashwagandha and lion's mane. It's designed to boost your mood, support your focus, and give you natural energy, all without the crash. Get your daily mood boost with Juni at Whole Foods Market, or head to drinkjuni.com to find a store near you. Did you have any wisdom from the spiritual traditional community that you carried through with you that helped you through those tough times?

    3. JH

      Mm.

    4. JS

      Or do you feel it was, you were trying to keep it out so much that it didn't really even have a chance?

    5. JH

      Mm.

    6. JS

      Like, I've really felt that when I went back into the world of work, the thing that I held onto the most that really changed my life, I genuinely mean it, was the, the verse that says, uh, "When you protect your purpose, your purpose protects you." And I'm-

    7. JH

      Mm

    8. JS

      ... translating dharma as purpose-

    9. JH

      Yeah

    10. JS

      ... in that regard. The original is, "When you protect your dharma, your dharma protects you."

    11. JH

      Yeah.

    12. JS

      And when I heard that verse, that was just profound to me, and I started to want to protect what I believed my dharma was-

    13. JH

      Mm

    14. JS

      ... rather than neglect it and reject it to move toward what the world was trying to get me to focus on.

    15. JH

      Yeah.

    16. JS

      And that acted as a real compass for me when I was feeling unsure. Was there anything for you? I'm just intrigued. Or was it so-

    17. JH

      Mm

    18. JS

      ... like you were like, "This is so alien, I have to keep it separate," that you were just trying to avoid it?

    19. JH

      That's such a great question. I don't think I've thought about it in that way before. I, I don't remember actually taking strength from the spiritual tradition, like, independently. I think my parents would try to help me with that, and I d- I know for sure, I think on an emotional level, my mom was trying to care for me in every way [laughs] possible. I mean, I really gave my parents a hard time. I'm also the eldest, so I was the first of the children to go out to school, and-

    20. JS

      What do you mean you gave them a hard time?

    21. JH

      I would cry every day. I would beg not to go to school. Um, I think they were just... You know, parents are just trying to do the best for you. They wanted me to have opportunity. They wanted me to, to grow intellectually, to, you know, to do well in studies and everything, and I think they were

  10. 27:49 – 31:02

    Questioning Life Within a Spiritual Community

    1. JH

      really [laughs] confused about, like, how can we make her be happy and just embrace this with confidence and not just be kind of, yeah, stressed and anxious all the time?

    2. JS

      Yeah.

    3. JH

      So yeah, I feel, I feel really sorry for what, you know, putting them through that. Um, but they were definitely really trying to help also from a spiritual perspective always, and you know, in, in simple and digestible ways. But I think, yeah, it was, it was difficult for me to really integrate that at the time.

    4. JS

      Did, did you... So many kids who grow up in religious and spiritual communities-

    5. JH

      Yeah

    6. JS

      ... end up leaving.

    7. JH

      Yeah.

    8. JS

      Did you ever consider it?

    9. JH

      Not at the time. Not at the time. And people would always ask me that, and I would... It was, like, a very common question, especially from people outside of the tradition. They'd always be like, "So did you ever wanna just rebel and just leave?" And I would always very confidently say, "No, no, I never really had that inclination." One of the reasons I think with that is that my parents have been always very broad-minded, very open to talking about anything, and I would have a lot of conversations, especially with my dad, about any, you know, any theological questions, philosophical things, doubts that would come to my mind. We would always talk about it, and he's, um, very well-read, very extensively in many different traditions. So he'll always have some great insight to offer. So I didn't feel that pull, but I think what I didn't know was that, you know, doubt and crisis of faith or looking at your tradition from a different lens, it doesn't necessarily always happen in those formative teen times. Sometimes it can come later on, or sometimes comes multiple times through your life. So it's not that I ever felt the strong urge to leave, but I definitely went through some difficult times at a later phase. I think when I really started to... Yeah, it's almost like with every step further out into the wider world, it kind of demands of me to go deeper-

    10. JS

      Yeah

    11. JH

      ... in what I practice and believe.

    12. JS

      Mm.

    13. JH

      Because it's being kind of butted up against just these intense currents of-

    14. JS

      Mm-hmm

    15. JH

      ... everything that's going on in the world.

    16. JS

      Yeah. I, I often think about that, because, you know, when Radhi and I talk about, like, thinking about having children or whatever it is-

    17. JH

      Yeah

    18. JS

      ... and, like, how we wanna raise them where they have good spiritual values, but at the same time they have choice.

    19. JH

      Yeah.

    20. JS

      And, and it's always hard, because you're kind of like... I always thinkI always believed that people who choose what they follow-

    21. JH

      Mm-hmm

    22. JS

      ... and someone who's grown up in a tradition also gets that opportunity as they get older-

    23. JH

      Yeah

    24. JS

      ... to keep choosing.

    25. JH

      Yeah.

    26. JS

      And I always feel like when you choose what you follow, it, you're more confident about it. It generally has more power-

    27. JH

      Yeah

    28. JS

      ... generally speaking.

    29. JH

      Yeah.

    30. JS

      Uh, but it-

  11. 31:02 – 34:51

    From Curiosity to Creative Mastery

    1. JS

      you shouldn't work that hard-

    2. JH

      Mm-hmm

    3. JS

      ... or you should marry a man who works hard, or-

    4. JH

      Right

    5. JS

      ... your parents may have had the belief that you, uh, should always do what you love or you should never do what you love. You should do what is safe and is reliable. And I think we all go through our 20s and 30s and have reflection points-

    6. JH

      Yeah

    7. JS

      ... where we say, "Well, yeah, my parents believed that, but I didn't." And so-

    8. JH

      Yeah

    9. JS

      ... it applies to all of life, but obviously very specifically a- a- aligns to someone who's grown up in a specific tradition, in a specific path.

    10. JH

      Yeah.

    11. JS

      When did music go from being passion, exploration, curiosity to mastery? Because I think this is such an important part. I think I hear a lot of people who say, "Follow your passion."

    12. JH

      Mm-hmm.

    13. JS

      And I think that's okay, you know?

    14. JH

      Mm-hmm.

    15. JS

      But if you're gonna turn it into something you do professionally-

    16. JH

      Yeah

    17. JS

      ... the passion at one point has to turn into proficiency-

    18. JH

      Yeah

    19. JS

      ... and mastery. When did you start to actually master your art and craft? What did that look like?

    20. JH

      I don't identify with the word master in any way. Um, and I don't mean that in a falsely humble way. I just, uh, yeah, I feel like I'm, I'm very much scratching the surface. But I think that, um, I think that it happened very organically. I started to, you know, when I was 18, I started to develop more of an independent interest in, uh, in my own tradition and really engage with, um, with the mantra meditation practice, kirtan. And also, uh, you know, I'd been studying the violin since I was about 10 years old, and that was always something I did basically in my bedroom [chuckles] and in my room with the teacher. I never, I never really used my instrument in a public place. I did, I, I did one ti- one day in an orchestra, and I got bullied, and then I was like, [laughs] "I'm not going back." Um, so it was a very, like... I got to a point and I was like, "Why am I even learning this instrument?" So it was only when I started playing it at the temple in the kirtan and trying to improvise, I realized that, uh, you know, aside from just participating in this activity, musically, there's something I can offer, something I can develop and refine. And initially, that was my connection through the violin. Um, that was my voice, you know. I was too shy to sing. But, um, I think everything actually stemmed from there because through the violin, um, I ended up joining a, a mantra music group that was forming at the time, um, right as I was finishing my undergraduate degree, and I did not know what was, I was gonna do next. You know, I, I studied English and cr-creative writing, linguistics. It was, like, very interesting to me, but I, I had no idea what to do with it. And this opportunity came, like, a month before my graduation, uh, to tr- to tour all over America and, um, all around the world it had ended up being. So I was just, it was a no-brainer. I was like, "Yeah, I wanna do that." Um, and I thought that it would just be... I still felt like, well, I'll have to get a, a regular job. I s- I didn't know what that was. Um, I actually then, I did get a job as a magazine editor, but I, I, I got the job, and then right when I was meant to go back and take it, I was doing this touring beforehand, and then I just wrote to them. I said, "I'm sorry, I can't. I, I think I need to keep doing what I'm doing." It was s- yeah, speaking to my soul-

    21. JS

      Yeah

    22. JH

      ... I guess. Um, so it's been very organic. I think I have struggled with a lot of doubt along the way because anyone who does anything creative or artistic knows it's, there's no assurance

  12. 34:51 – 36:43

    Experiencing the Divine Through Sound

    1. JH

      of any kind of ability to maintain yourself, have a livelihood with that, with that activity. And so it's a real a-act of, um, I think, faith and courage to sort of just keep going with it, uh, year upon year.

    2. JS

      Mm.

    3. JH

      And so I was m-many times constantly questioning myself, "Okay, so is now the point when I should get a, quote-unquote, 'regular job' or something that's more, yeah, predictable-

    4. JS

      Yeah

    5. JH

      ... and stable?" [laughs]

    6. JS

      Yeah. Do, do you think you experience divinity when you sing and make music in a way that you don't access through any other practice?

    7. JH

      I would say yes. Yeah, I do. Um, I think it's an incredibly deep idea that you can access divinity through sound. Sound being so subtle, not requiring any instrument, any tool, just your own voice, and it just requires presence. And it's, it's very esoteric, but I feel like anyone can experience it also. Like, we have ears to hear, you know, a voice to use and, um-Yeah, I remember first starting to become aware of that around... I mean, I had many incredible moments when I was a child. You know, sometimes people ask me what some of my earliest memories of, of kirtan, and there's so many incredible times. Um, like, there was a festival that would happen every year. Uh, we would walk in procession through London to this huge park, Battersea Park, and there would be a festival, many tents there, till late at night. And the kirtan would be going all afternoon

  13. 36:43 – 39:39

    Creating Space for Others to Feel Free

    1. JH

      into the evening. And I just remember feeling so joyful, so exhausted [laughs] but, like, so filled by that experience.

    2. JS

      Mm.

    3. JH

      Um, I think I started to really notice that, wow, this, there's something really special here, around 16, 17, 18, and feel like I want to come back to this, you know?

    4. JS

      Mm.

    5. JH

      How you feel when you... I, I guess there's so many things you could, you could liken that to, but you just-

    6. JS

      Mm

    7. JH

      ... yeah, you wanna keep doing it.

    8. JS

      What have you found when people are... Because I think singing out loud can feel so nervous for people-

    9. JH

      Yeah

    10. JS

      ... because it's this call and response where you're-

    11. JH

      Yeah

    12. JS

      ... chanting and people are responding back-

    13. JH

      Yeah

    14. JS

      ... especially when you're live.

    15. JH

      Yeah.

    16. JS

      What have you seen, like, the transformation people have had, where they start off; 'cause you do retreats, et cetera, where they start off really nervous and anxious, and they're a bit-

    17. JH

      Yeah, yeah. [laughs]

    18. JS

      And then w- what have you seen that turn into, even for people who think, like, "I can't sing to save my life," or-

    19. JH

      [laughs]

    20. JS

      ... you don't like the sound of your voice-

    21. JH

      Yeah

    22. JS

      ... or whatever it may be.

    23. JH

      Yeah.

    24. JS

      My singing voice. I'm very confident speaking, but I-

    25. JH

      I've heard you sing. I think you can sing.

    26. JS

      Yes, terrible. No.

    27. JH

      I think you can sing. [laughs]

    28. JS

      So, so that, that's a lie. Now I know you're lying for sure.

    29. JH

      [laughs]

    30. JS

      Now I have proof that last night when [laughs] you were talking about that thing, you were lying. Uh, but what, yeah, what is that for you? Like, what have you seen? I'm intrigued. For people, anyone who's listening right now, who- anyone who's listening right now, I hope you're gonna go to Spotify or, you know, Apple and type in Jahnavi Harrison. And, you know, I'm looking. You've got, like, 134,000 monthly listeners right now.

  14. 39:39 – 41:35

    When Music Becomes Healing

    1. JH

      as well. You can sing back in, in your heart. I do that on the plane if I'm [laughs] stressed.

    2. JS

      Mm.

    3. JH

      I listen to something, and then I sing back with my inner voice.

    4. JS

      Mm.

    5. JH

      But, um, it's incredibly freeing.

    6. JS

      Mm.

    7. JH

      And I've seen people f- relax and become free-

    8. JS

      Mm-hmm

    9. JH

      ... in a way that they didn't expect-

    10. JS

      Yeah

    11. JH

      ... by letting go and letting their voice out. You know? E- everything that feels uncomfortable initially usually feels, you feel a great sense of achievement afterwards as well. [laughs]

    12. JS

      Yeah, yeah. What, what do you think, what do you think people turn to your music for? Like, when you're finding people discovering your music-

    13. JH

      Yeah

    14. JS

      ... who are not from the tradition, who, who don't, aren't familiar with it.

    15. JH

      Yeah.

    16. JS

      What do they f- I mean, like, you're, you were Radhi's, I think, number one artist on Spotify Wrapped this year.

    17. JH

      Yeah. [laughs]

    18. JS

      As per usual.

    19. JH

      Oh, was I? [laughs]

    20. JS

      Yeah, 'cause she's playing in the house all the time.

    21. JH

      Aw.

    22. JS

      Like, w- what do you think people are... Yeah, what are, what are people seeking? What have you found?

    23. JH

      I can say what people tell me-

    24. JS

      Mm-hmm

    25. JH

      ... which is, I think pe- people say that they find a sense of peace, um, a sense of shelter and comfort. A lot of people tell me that they listen to their mus- to my music, um, in difficult times, you know? So many people say, um, "Yeah, you know, I was, I was studying for exams," um, "My parent was unwell," "Someone in my family was dying," um, or, you know, "I was getting ready to get married, and then I played your music on my, on my wedding day as I was coming in." These kind of, um, transitional and very meaningful moments in life.

    26. JS

      Mm.

    27. JH

      Um, a lot of people talk about playing my music first thing in the morning or last thing at night when they want to connect to a place of deep, uh, prayer or, um, a sacred space.

    28. JS

      Mm-hmm.

    29. JH

      Yeah, I think that's what people find. And, um, I'm always blown away by people's stories.

    30. JS

      Mm.

  15. 41:35 – 45:23

    Turning Personal Prayer Into Shared Experience

    1. JH

      person, or, or I speak for myself, like, we're, we're so aware of our humanness and our flaws and everything that we bring to, [laughs] you know, we bring all of it to every endeavor.

    2. JS

      Yeah.

    3. JH

      So it's really incredible for me that I can do something that allows someone to enter into that space, um, where they feel so deeply connected. Because I know that that's not... It, it, it's me because I'm allowing myself to be used in that way, but I know that there's something a lot deeper that's happening.

    4. JS

      Yeah. Every time, I mean, every time I'm in one of your sessions, I'm, like, just at the back trying to hold back my tears.

    5. JH

      [laughs]

    6. JS

      Like, trying not, trying not to cry.

    7. JH

      I, I've seen that. I've seen that.

    8. JS

      Yeah, trying not to cry. I'm like... It's, it's, it's strange, though, because you can't really explain it.

    9. JH

      Yeah.

    10. JS

      It's, it's, it's so hard to put into words-

    11. JH

      Yeah

    12. JS

      ... where you just gotta be in one.

    13. JH

      Yeah.

    14. JS

      And I've had, like, my team has come to sessions. Obviously, we have friends here who've come-

    15. JH

      Yeah

    16. JS

      ... to events at our home. And, and it's amazing how you don't need to know the language. You don't really, you don't even need to know-To some degree. I know you always explain what it means-

    17. JH

      Yes

    18. JS

      ... but even if someone doesn't know what it means, it's, it's, it's so interesting how s- and sound has that potential. I, I think, you know, if you look at even music right now, like Latin music is, you know, so global now.

    19. JH

      Yeah.

    20. JS

      And, you know, you've got Bad Bunny, who's Puerto Rican, and that-

    21. JH

      Right

    22. JS

      ... that style of music has taken over. And you've got... And that's what's so beautiful about music in general-

    23. JH

      Yeah

    24. JS

      ... is that it's so beyond language and so-

    25. JH

      Yeah

    26. JS

      ... beyond where you grew up.

    27. JH

      Yeah. It transmits-

    28. JS

      It transmits

    29. JH

      ... regards-

    30. JS

      Yeah. Yeah

  16. 45:23 – 49:17

    The Biggest Misconceptions About Spiritual People

    1. JH

      recent album, Into the Forest, I think Rise and Into the Forest are similar in that they incorporate both mantras and, and, uh, some original lyrics.

    2. JS

      Yeah.

    3. JH

      Yeah.

    4. JS

      Love that. That's great. Yeah, for anyone who's starting out their-

    5. JH

      Yeah. Yeah

    6. JS

      ... their journey of wanting to, you know, move into devotional music and have, have never had the experience-

    7. JH

      Yeah

    8. JS

      ... of it.

    9. JH

      Or they should check out Radhi's [chuckles] playlist.

    10. JS

      Radhi's playlist. Yeah, yeah.

    11. JH

      So many people tell me, "Oh, I found your music through Radhi's playlist."

    12. JS

      Yeah.

    13. JH

      'Cause she's got a great collection there-

    14. JS

      Yeah

    15. JH

      ... of, of also many other wonderful artists.

    16. JS

      Yeah. I love that. I love that. What's, what's a misconception you think people have about spiritual people?

    17. JH

      I think people tend to project a lot onto spiritual people, that they're like, "You're so divine."

    18. JS

      [laughs]

    19. JH

      And like, "You must float around your house all day," you know, spouting like wisdom quotes and-

    20. JS

      Yeah

    21. JH

      ... um-

    22. JS

      That's exactly what I do. [laughs]

    23. JH

      [laughs] I've seen you in your robes.

    24. JS

      Yeah. [laughs]

    25. JH

      Um, yeah. I think a misconception is that spiritual people don't have doubts, don't have material desires, don't make mistakes. Well, all, all of those things obviously are true. Um, or that spiritual people have all the answers. I think to, to try to pursue a life connected to a spiritual core is courageous because there is a level of faith that's required where there's not always a hard, hard answer. There's very good answers, but you also still have to be very open-hearted and constantly open to, to learning and-

    26. JS

      Yeah

    27. JH

      ... surrender, which is very, very difficult.

    28. JS

      Yeah. Such a great answer. Not what I expected, but yeah, such a great answer. It's, uh... Yeah, everyone's human and everyone's-

    29. JH

      Yeah

    30. JS

      ... trying and everyone's failing and everyone's making mistakes. And, and I think the problem is when you think that a spiritual person is perfect-

  17. 49:17 – 51:05

    Growing Up Surrounded by Spiritual Validation

    1. JH

      older, especially just accepting both your own fl- being patient with your own flaws.

    2. JS

      Mm.

    3. JH

      Um, I've definitely had to learn to be very patient with myself.

    4. JS

      Mm.

    5. JH

      Um, because yeah, I mean, we're blessed to have as well, you know, we're blessed to know so many people who truly are exemplary in their life and their actions, and yeah, s- I mean, I identify with that, looking at someone thinking, [inhales] "God, you know, I'm never gonna be, I'm never gonna be spiritual." [laughs]

    6. JS

      Yeah. Yeah, yeah. What, what's something that you used to believe to be true spiritually, and now you don't agree with it?

    7. JH

      I think, I think growing up in a p- particular spiritual tradition, um, you can have... You're surrounded by constant affirmation and validation of that tradition. Um, y- you know, if you're immersed in a community, you're sur- rounded by people who believe in that path, in those practices. Um, and I think the more that I've grown and encountered people from all different walks of life, who've had all different kinds of experiences, um, I don't know if it's so much something that I don't believe anymore, but it, it challenges a lot of, um, things that I've heard-

    8. JS

      Mm

    9. JH

      ... things that I've just accepted because everyone around me was saying, "Yes, yes." Um, and I really value that. I th- I, I feel that's necessary.

    10. JS

      Mm.

    11. JH

      Um, but it's not always easy, because sometimes there's not an easy resolution or answer, um, to, yeah, conflicting worldviews and, and opinions about

  18. 51:05 – 54:22

    Holding a Safe Space for Spiritual Exploration

    1. JH

      things. So that's something that I've encountered a lot on, on my journey. Sometimes it's even people that are within the same broad category of a, of a religion or a faith tradition, but, you know, different strands of-

    2. JS

      Mm-hmm

    3. JH

      ... of specific beliefs. Um, there's so much nuance, and yeah, I think I've found it harder to, to be like, "This is the answer."

    4. JS

      Yeah, yeah.

    5. JH

      You know?

    6. JS

      Yeah, yeah.

    7. JH

      Mm. Yeah.

    8. JS

      Yeah, yeah. It's, uh... I, I agree. I think it's a healthy thing, and it's also, it's, the brain just doesn't like it for simplicity's sake. It's just easier for the brain to have its set of beliefs and move with them, even if they're not helpful.

    9. JH

      Definitely.

    10. JS

      And so when you allow yourself to be in a paradox-

    11. JH

      Yeah

    12. JS

      ... it's, it's challenging.

    13. JH

      Yeah.

    14. JS

      And that's why we avoid it.

    15. JH

      Yeah.

    16. JS

      That's why we prefer left or right-

    17. JH

      Yeah

    18. JS

      ... or black or white-

    19. JH

      Exactly

    20. JS

      ... or binary thinking. And so I, I find that in my own self. I try and live it like that. I try and live in the middle of the Venn diagram always.

    21. JH

      Mm.

    22. JS

      Like, trying not to be binary.

    23. JH

      Yeah.

    24. JS

      But it's hard, because you're-

    25. JH

      It's hard

    26. JS

      ... it's so much easier to, to pick a place to live and say, "Yeah, I'm gonna go all in and believe this is the truth," or, "I'm gonna refute it." And, and it's like-

    27. JH

      Yeah

    28. JS

      ... well, no, there's things that make sense, and there's things that don't make sense.

    29. JH

      Yeah.

    30. JS

      And I was just saying to someone this morning, I was like, "It's funny how we've always talked about how, whether the glass is half full or half empty." And I'm like, "It's both."

  19. 54:22 – 56:45

    Navigating a Crisis of Faith

    1. JH

      they feel it's a safe space to-

    2. JS

      Mm

    3. JH

      ... to, to be in a spiritual space, but not have something imposed upon them.

    4. JS

      Mm-hmm.

    5. JH

      And I, I'm, I feel happy about that, you know? Um, I want to try to, to hold thatTension, tension. I don't know if it's tension-

    6. JS

      Yeah

    7. JH

      ... but it's like, you know, walking a path of integrity and specificity oneself, but being able to, to create space that feels very inclusive and, and welcoming for everyone.

    8. JS

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    9. JH

      I don't think there's been a, a, a life event like, you know, some of the huge things that happen or, you know, losing a loved one, things like that, that are often the, the cause of a, you know, a deep, um, grief and sorrow that, you know, it w- sometimes leads to a spiritual search. Um, but I think I have experienced crisis of faith, which required [laughs] faith-

    10. JS

      [laughs]

    11. JH

      ... to come out of.

    12. JS

      That's good, yeah.

    13. JH

      Yeah, yeah. Um, which, yeah, took me by surprise, you know? I think the experience, especially if you're used to being someone who, who that's something that you do feel sure of, and then when it's suddenly not there-

    14. JS

      Mm

    15. JH

      ... it can feel like

  20. 56:45 – 59:35

    What It Feels Like to Lose Faith

    1. JH

      a rug is pulled out from under your feet, and-

    2. JS

      Mm

    3. JH

      ... I, I felt like I'm, I'm not quite sure who I am, you know? You're like, like, uh, like in a coloring book, you know, you've got the lines, and that's, like, the defined, you color within the lines, but imagine if the lines just disappeared, and [laughs] you just color. Like, who am I without that? Um, I have experienced that a couple of times.

    4. JS

      Yeah.

    5. JH

      Yeah.

    6. JS

      Yeah, it's, yeah, it's, it's an interesting answer because, yeah, it's like how... I hosted the Variety Faith & Spirituality honors last week.

    7. JH

      Yeah.

    8. JS

      And I was talking about how the people who are being awarded and honored, they've showed different types of faith, and I was saying it showed having faith, messy faith, losing faith, and that's what makes it so real, where-

    9. JH

      Mm

    10. JS

      ... I think faith-based content or people sometimes have always been shown as one note.

    11. JH

      Mm-hmm.

    12. JS

      Where like, this is who you are.

    13. JH

      Yeah.

    14. JS

      Or like, this is the kind of person you should be.

    15. JH

      Yeah.

    16. JS

      And-

    17. JH

      Gotta believe. [laughs]

    18. JS

      Yeah, yeah. And now I think we're showing these variegated depictions of what faith can look like-

    19. JH

      Yeah

    20. JS

      ... and spirituality can look like, and it's just so much more real.

    21. JH

      Yeah.

    22. JS

      Because-

    23. JH

      Relatable.

    24. JS

      Yeah, relatable, and grounded-

    25. JH

      Yeah

    26. JS

      ... and accessible, and, and yeah, just truly transparent because-

    27. JH

      Yeah

    28. JS

      ... that's what it can look like. And I think if anyone is a person of... How did faith help you refind faith when there was a crisis of faith?

    29. JH

      I think there was a period of time, and it wasn't that long, but because of the disorientation that I felt, it felt a lot longer than it was, I think, um, of, of feeling like the faith had just totally evaporated. Um, and you know, it feels like a type of, it feels like a type of darkness because something that had previously given you a lot of light and internal support and nourishment just seems to disappear or no- it seems like vapor, that is, was that actually real?

    30. JS

      Mm.

  21. 59:35 – 1:03:09

    Using Meditation to Access Stillness

    1. JH

      more ritual type of worship or a set-

    2. JS

      Mm-hmm

    3. JH

      ... you know, practice or routine more spontaneously, more expressively, um, in, in English. And it's funny 'cause I, I grew up, you know, con- completely steeped in prayer, like, throughout [laughs] the day 'cause that's just the environment I was in. I was thinking about the soundscape of my, of my life growing up. There was always bells ringing and, you know, in, in my tradition, we blow this conch shell. It's, there's these kind of spiritual sounds around, and, um, ancient mantras. Sanskrit was a very familiar language for me, but what I didn't have confidence and ease with was praying in the language that I speak.

    4. JS

      Mm.

    5. JH

      Um, and actually being that personal to just be alone and speak those words, um, whatever was coming up. And I think that was a really transformative experience and time for me, and actually led to some of the songs that I've recorded becauseEventually I thought, you know, you don't always think like, oh, that I should record this, because it's so personal and specific.

    6. JS

      Mm.

    7. JH

      But I did feel that I bet there are others who go through these times or who feel these, these emotions-

    8. JS

      Mm

    9. JH

      ... who may, it may enable them to express words that they, they can't find the words to say.

    10. JS

      Do you think we all need to talk to God more?

    11. JH

      100%. [laughs]

    12. JS

      [laughs]

    13. JH

      100%, yeah. I was thinking about this, um, ahead of our chat, because I was thinking about how much, you know, in the last, I don't know if it's the last decade, but of course, mindfulness is a word that we've heard so much. Meditation has become something that is so, in, in many ways, integrated into... You know, it's not that everyone does it, but if you say it, no one's gonna probably look at you funny. You might see people doing it in an ad or, you know, I always remember walking into, I think it was Gap or something, you know, on a high street, and there were these mannequins sitting like this in the lotus position. And I was like, oh, interesting. This is, like, filtering into just everyday h- you know, culture and fashion. But I, I was thinking about how meditation can bring us into this space of stillness and internal connection, but what am I meditating on? And the, the difference between just coming to a place of groundedness, stillness, calming the mind, and prayer, to me, is quite distinct. Um, that's my personal take on it.

    14. JS

      Mm-hmm.

    15. JH

      You know, someone may t- use those terms differently and, and describe it differently. But I, I feel like, um, yeah, if prayer is not something that you've ever done-

    16. JS

      Mm

    17. JH

      ... or even if it is something that's familiar that you did grow up with, I, I feel like, you know, sometimes they say, "Oh, just try doing something with your left hand or your non-dominant hand, because it will reveal something to you, or you'll feel-

    18. JS

      Yeah

    19. JH

      ... a different way of looking at something-

    20. JS

      Yeah, yeah

    21. JH

      ... and doing something. I think, I think, yeah, pe- it might be something that listeners would like to try, you know, to, to either approach it for the first time or approach it through a different pathway-

    22. JS

      Yeah. I like that. I like that as an example

    23. JH

      ... than what you've been used to. Yeah.

    24. JS

      Just like a new neural pathway almost.

    25. JH

      Yeah. Yeah.

    26. JS

      Just why not try?

    27. JH

      Yeah.

    28. JS

      Yeah.

    29. JH

      Yeah, sometimes

  22. 1:03:09 – 1:09:20

    Asking Yourself, “Am I Being of Service?”

    1. JH

      it, sometimes it involves... You know, there's so many different ways that people pray. For some people, it's very spontaneous. Some people have a very ritualized way of placing their, their body in a certain position or doing certain actions. And, um, I think all of those things are designed to bring us into a certain s- state of mind and of being that allows, can allow you to express some of these deepest, um, these deepest sentiments that are otherwise quite hard to access-

    2. JS

      Yeah

    3. JH

      ... in a natural way.

    4. JS

      Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I, yeah, I, I... For me, like, I find I love talking to God when I'm driving.

    5. JH

      I do that. I do that.

    6. JS

      That's, that's my favorite time.

    7. JH

      Yeah. And, and one of the hardest times I experienced-

    8. JS

      Yeah

    9. JH

      ... that was the time. You just reminded me of that.

    10. JS

      Yeah.

    11. JH

      I, I would just talk, yeah, driving by myself, cr- cry.

    12. JS

      Yeah.

    13. JH

      Speak, sing.

    14. JS

      I, I find driving to be so therapeutic-

    15. JH

      Yeah

    16. JS

      ... and a place to share streams of thoughts.

    17. JH

      Yeah.

    18. JS

      And I always love it. I think it also reminds me of that Bruce Almighty scene where he's, like, asking God for a sign.

    19. JH

      Yeah.

    20. JS

      And God keeps sending him loads of signs-

    21. JH

      Yeah. [laughs]

    22. JS

      ... and he keeps ignoring them, and then his car goes off the bridge or whatever it is. And I'm like-

    23. JH

      Yeah

    24. JS

      ... yeah, I'm always looking around for signs when I'm driving and connecting billboards to-

    25. JH

      [laughs]

    26. JS

      ... to God's message to me.

    27. JH

      Yeah.

    28. JS

      And it's just, like, this fun idea that-

    29. JH

      Yeah

    30. JS

      ... that there's some, you know, there's some power in what I'm reading and seeing.

  23. 1:09:20 – 1:21:30

    Jahnavi on Final Five

    1. JS

      as big and small, and the more you see it as just yours.

    2. JH

      Mm.

    3. JS

      And so there is no... It, it kind of fades away because it's so clearly what you were meant to do-

    4. JH

      Yeah

    5. JS

      ... that then you don't see it as big or expansive or small or not.

    6. JH

      Yeah.

    7. JS

      It just is.

    8. JH

      Yeah.

    9. JS

      And, and therefore, I find that people who know their purpose and their dharma are less envious and less comparative and less-

    10. JH

      Right

    11. JS

      ... all of those things because they just found their thing.

    12. JH

      Yeah. You c- you know you can't be or do what someone else is doing 'cause-

    13. JS

      Correct

    14. JH

      ... you, you know yourself so well and-

    15. JS

      Correct

    16. JH

      ... and you feel aligned in what you're doing.

    17. JS

      Yeah.

    18. JH

      I guess, I guess [laughs] I'm coming to that. I'm coming to that now.

    19. JS

      [laughs]

    20. JH

      I think I've finally accepted myself as doing what I'm doing, and this is, this is who I am.

    21. JS

      [laughs]

    22. JH

      It's taken a long time.

    23. JS

      Yeah.

    24. JH

      But-

    25. JS

      Well, God and the universe had to nominate you for a Grammy-

    26. JH

      [laughs]

    27. JS

      ... to, to get you to understand that.

    28. JH

      I mean, He knows that I, I need a big, uh, a big push, you know?

    29. JS

      Yeah. I love it.

    30. JH

      Yeah.

Episode duration: 1:21:30

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