EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,026 words- 0:00 – 0:58
100-mile ultrarunning: the “100 Mile Man” and how the sport exploded
- JRJoe Rogan
(door closes) Four, three, two, one. Boom. So what -- um, Hundred Mile Man or Hundred Man- (glasses clink) What is it?
- JIJesse Itzler
The 100 Mile Man.
- JRJoe Rogan
What is that?
- JIJesse Itzler
Uh, I ran a 100-mile race-
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh.
- JIJesse Itzler
... uh, years ago, and that's like-
- JRJoe Rogan
You're like, "I'm the fucking man." (laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
Let me, let me grab it if it's available. (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs) That's cool that you got it, man, 'cause that's a very popular thing now.
- JIJesse Itzler
(smacks lips) Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Did you run this before or after you did the book with David Goggins?
- JIJesse Itzler
I ran it before.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, okay.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah. I think at the time when I did it, there were like 400 Americans that ran 100 miles or something.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, really?
- JIJesse Itzler
It wasn't a lot, so that's why it was available.
- JRJoe Rogan
Isn't it crazy how many people do it now?
- JIJesse Itzler
(smacks lips) Yeah, I think... I was trying to figure out in my head how many do it a year and like how many races, 100-mile races there are there a month and then multiply it out. So probably 5,000 or 6,000 I'm guessing.
- JRJoe Rogan
5,000 or 6,000 people who have done it?
- JIJesse Itzler
I think probably, I think so.
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow.
- JIJesse Itzler
Americans, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
(sighs)
- JIJesse Itzler
It's a long way.
- 0:58 – 3:48
Miss America drops swimsuit judging: internet outrage and cultural tension
- JRJoe Rogan
It's a long fucking way. We were just about talking right before the podcast about how Miss America yanked off, uh, all of... Uh, there's, they're no longer judged by their beauty. And I post this 'cause I thought it was silly.
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
And there's just these fights online, man. There's fucking fights in the comments and fights and... People are tense.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
People need to go out and run those 100 miles, man. (laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah, they'd loosen up fast. Fast.
- JRJoe Rogan
I know. What the fuck is going... Miss America is scrapping the swimsuit competition, will no longer be judged on physical appearance. It's literally a beauty contest. That is what it is.
- JIJesse Itzler
What are they replacing it with?
- JRJoe Rogan
(sputters) I mean, I gotta think it's like when Playboy decided to not have people nude.
- JIJesse Itzler
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
That like, and but they... Here's the thing. But no longer judging them on their physical appearance, well, what does that mean?
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Like how... What does that mean?
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah, that's a twist.
- JRJoe Rogan
"We are no longer a pageant," Gretchen Carlson says. (mouth farts) Competition. We're a competition. Okay. (smacks lips) I give up.
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs) I don't know. I think that's, might have be a, be a, you know, hurt the ratings a little bit.
- JRJoe Rogan
I think a little bit or not.
- JIJesse Itzler
A little bit.
- JRJoe Rogan
Maybe people will get very excited about it. Maybe it'll ramp up.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know?
- JIJesse Itzler
It's getting a lot of talk.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Maybe people will be pissed off and so they'll tune in. It's just, I don't know.
- JIJesse Itzler
Where do you stand on it?
- JRJoe Rogan
(smacks lips) I don't give a fuck.
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
It's so stupid. Miss America... I mean, this is what's really fascinating to me is that, uh, it was... I read in the comments a lot of feminists were angry at me that I was mocking it. I saw a few of them. I don't get it. Like, why would you even want a who I'd most like to fuck contest?
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
'Cause that's what it is. I mean, that's really what it is. You're having these gals parade around in their bikini... It's a beauty contest. Do we have a Mr. America contest? Like, is that just the president? Is that what the Mr. America contest is?
- JIJesse Itzler
I don't know.
- 3:48 – 5:57
Why Jesse went to a monastery: seeking inner work after years of physical extremes
- JRJoe Rogan
Yes, the content. The content. Speaking of content, Living with Monks.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
What is it called?
- JIJesse Itzler
Living with the Monks.
- JRJoe Rogan
Living with the Monks. Um, this is your new book.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
Why'd you decide to do that and how long did you do it for?
- JIJesse Itzler
I did it for 15 days. I was-
- JRJoe Rogan
That's enough.
- JIJesse Itzler
That's more than enough, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Where'd you go?
- JIJesse Itzler
Go, go like this for an hour, your finger will fall off, you know.
- JRJoe Rogan
What are you doing with your finger? Up and down.
- JIJesse Itzler
Uh, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Up and to the side.
- JIJesse Itzler
Just the repetition.
- JRJoe Rogan
What did you have to do?
- JIJesse Itzler
I, uh... Well, I lived with... There were, there were eight monks, four of which have been there for 50 years.
- JRJoe Rogan
50?
- JIJesse Itzler
50.
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow.
- JIJesse Itzler
On a monastery, 800, 800... Uh, 500 acres, kind of in the middle of nowhere. And, um, I went for 15 days. So I figured, you know, I'd, I'd invested so much of my life on the physical side and ran 100 miles and just always active and this and that and have really invested very little on my own inner work. And I just felt like, man, I, I just felt overwhelmed a little bit. And I said to my wife, you know, "Who are the masters?" And everything pointed to monks.
- JRJoe Rogan
Monks.
- JIJesse Itzler
And I said, "I want to go live in a monastery."
- JRJoe Rogan
There's something romantic about that, right? It's almost like the guy who goes off into the woods to write a book. Like, being with a, with a monk, like, and just being, you know, in a monastery with monks. There's something very romantic about that, right? Uh, that you've shed all your worldly belongings, and you no longer care about the day-to-day nonsense that everybody is fixated on. You just decide to just, "Ohm."
- JIJesse Itzler
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
Ohm all day.
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- 5:57 – 8:33
First night shock: ‘You think’—and realizing how hard stillness is
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow. Now, when you were up there, was there any time where you're like, "What the fuck am I doing?"
- JIJesse Itzler
... like, one minute into it.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
I got -- when I first got up there, the main monk, like, my go-to monk-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JIJesse Itzler
... Brother, Brother Christopher took me to my room. They call the rooms th- a cell, which is about the size of this table. And I had a bed. I walked in, there was a bed, there was a little desk with a night lamp on it, and nothing on the walls. And he said, "Tomorrow we're gonna start prayer, reflection, and meditation at 7:15 AM." And I looked at my watch and it was 6:00 PM and I asked him, "Well, what do we do between now and 7:15 AM?" And he looked at me dead in the eye and he said, "You think." And I said to myself, "I'm fucked."
- JRJoe Rogan
(sighs)
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs) Because-
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
... like, I'm like... I don't really, like, spend a lot of time-
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
... in thought.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mmm.
- JIJesse Itzler
So I went and I said, "Okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna meditate." You know, like, "I'm here, let me start this journey with meditation." I had taken a little, a course in transcendental meditation. I'm not a big meditation guy, uh, other than running. And so I set my timer for 20 minutes and I sat down in my chair and I started, like, focusing on my mantra. And like, immediately I'm bombarded with how is my wife, how are the kids, the Hawks, like all this, you know-
- JRJoe Rogan
Hawks?
- JIJesse Itzler
The Atlanta Hawks.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh. (laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
I live in Atlanta, like, you know, not your kinda hawk. Everything's coming at me and I'm, you know, time is going by and I'm just getting bombarded with thought and I'm like, "Why hasn't my timer buzzed? Like, it's been, I've been here forever." So, I was gonna look and reset my thing and I'm like, "That would be cheating. Let me keep going," and I'm going and all the time's going by and finally I'm like, "The fuck is going on with my timer," you know? So I open my eyes and I look to reset my timer and it's three minutes and 27 seconds.
- JRJoe Rogan
No.
- JIJesse Itzler
And I said to my, I started-
- JRJoe Rogan
You really thought it was 20 minutes?
- JIJesse Itzler
I thought it was, like, hours, man. I mean, like, I'd never really sat in a room, like, with nothing going on and just closed my eyes alone and thought, and time just stopped. And I calculated how much time I had left, like, 15 days times 24 hours or 60 minutes and I said to myself, like, "Man, I'm in trouble. This isn't like, like, this isn't what... I'm on Gilligan's Island. This is a real... Like, I can't get outta here." And I, I had a really hard time with it.
- JRJoe Rogan
What was the commitment?
- JIJesse Itzler
The commitment was 15 days.
- JRJoe Rogan
So the only... Y- you did-
- JIJesse Itzler
It was a personal commitment.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You did it up to you, like, there was no... Y- n- nothing in writing and... Did you have a way to escape?
- 8:33 – 12:19
No escape (literally): German Shepherds, confinement, and running the driveway
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs) I mean, I was thinking of escape plans, but, um, on the monastery, and this is a little crazy, the, the way the monks keep the lights on is they breed German Shepherds. That's how they make money. They breed German Shepherds. It's the largest-
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, I've seen this. They wrote a book.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah, they wrote a book.
- JRJoe Rogan
I have the book. It's a book about raising puppies.
- JIJesse Itzler
Correct.
- JRJoe Rogan
The same guys?
- JIJesse Itzler
Same guys.
- JRJoe Rogan
Ah.
- JIJesse Itzler
So they weren't Buddhist, they were Russian Orthodox, and they raise German Shepherds. So they live on this property and there are these 11 German Shepherds. And at the end of the property, the only way off the property were two mobile homes, unconnected to the monastery, at the end of this road that leads up to the monastery. And both of those homes had German Shepherds as well that were a little territorial. So there really was no way for me to escape.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
Like, I couldn't... I ran 120 miles up and down the driveway while I was there because I couldn't leave the property.
- JRJoe Rogan
So you just timed yourself or paced yourself with... Using an app or something like that?
- JIJesse Itzler
No, I said, like, "2000 steps equals a mile," you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
So you counted your steps?
- JIJesse Itzler
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, Jesus Christ, dude.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah. I counted it and I marked it.
- JRJoe Rogan
What did they think about you running back and forth like that?
- JIJesse Itzler
Thought I was a fucking psychopath.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs) I'm like, "You guys have been here for 50 years, man."
- JRJoe Rogan
50 years.
- JIJesse Itzler
"I'm just trying to get some exercise."
- JRJoe Rogan
Now, what are the, the guys like that have been there for 50 years?
- JIJesse Itzler
Uh, quiet. (laughs) No, they were, they were, you know, extremely... Listen, they, they were doing what they wanted to do with their life, so they were super happy.
- JRJoe Rogan
Really?
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah. Super present. I mean, very present. And I mean, I live in a world of to-do lists, man, and like, you know-
- JRJoe Rogan
Right, right.
- JIJesse Itzler
They were very present, very happy, and really, really nice to me and, and everybody.
- JRJoe Rogan
Whew. Did you talk to them?
- 12:19 – 22:10
Monks as entrepreneurs and masters: dog training as a spiritual and practical lesson
- JRJoe Rogan
And where do they get funding?
- JIJesse Itzler
They're self-sufficient, so they s- they breed German Shepherds, they sell them.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right. Okay.
- JIJesse Itzler
That's kind of one income stream. And then they are masters, world masters, of dog train- training. So every two weeks, they have 10 dogs that come in and they ... And I've, I watched this. I mean, they literally ... Dogs come in like Spuds Mackenzie and leave like they just left etiquette school.
- JRJoe Rogan
Really?
- JIJesse Itzler
Like it's, it's f- ... It was ... You know, like, any time you're in the presence of the people that are the best in the world at what they do, it's fucking fascinating. And these guys were masters. They are the masters of ... I mean, I'm sure there's a lot of people that are great, but in their space of dog training and breeding.
- JRJoe Rogan
What was so special about the way they trained dogs?
- JIJesse Itzler
Just the command, like, like, they had a, an energy that the dogs responded to. I mean, like, I would walk in, the dogs would go crazy. They'd sniff my nuts, they'd ju-
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
Like, they'd go nuts.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JIJesse Itzler
These guys would walk in and, like, they could just sense-
- JRJoe Rogan
That they were in control.
- JIJesse Itzler
... that they were in control.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JIJesse Itzler
And, like, the eye contact that they ... E- everything. The way that they talk, their tone, their hand mannerisms. They just have mastered this. And they have a deep connection with the dogs.
- JRJoe Rogan
Dogs are weird in that way. Like, I have a one-year-old golden retriever, and he has different rules for different people. And he knows who he can get away with what with. Like, um, my wife's mom has zero shot at controlling this dog. Like, it's, it's like-
- JIJesse Itzler
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
He's like, "Uh, no, no, no. I'm the boss. I think I'm gonna jump up on ya and kiss ya." You know? "No, I'm gonna just run around, I'm gonna put my paws on you-
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
... when you sit in the chair."
- JIJesse Itzler
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
And, you know, we're like, "Marshall, come on, man. What the fuck? What is this? You don't do this." And it doesn't matter. When she's here, he just decides, "Nah, new set of rules with this lady."
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
"She doesn't seem to know what the fuck to do with me." (laughs) But when, uh ... Y- I had a trainer that I worked with him for in, um, the beginning when I first got him. And when, uh, Ryan, the trainer, comes over, he just, like, sits down, he's super chill, he listens. He's like, "Oh, this guy knows what the fuck to do."
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
"He knows how to control me."
- JIJesse Itzler
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know? It's, it's, it's very interesting. He's even different with me than he is with my friends. Like, my friends will come over, he's like, "Let me try you out, motherfucker."
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- 22:10 – 33:55
Settling in by day seven: decision fatigue, clarity, and a new relationship with time
- JIJesse Itzler
Felt really g- ... On day-
- JRJoe Rogan
See what's going on on Twitter?
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs) On, on day four and five, I was already kinda making excu- ... I was rationalizing in my head that seven days would be enough. So like, in my head I was going home day seven.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, really?
- JIJesse Itzler
Well, I mean, I was like, "No one's gonna know the difference or care if I went 15 days or seven days or-"
- JRJoe Rogan
Is that like if you're at mile 50 and you're like, "That's enough."
- JIJesse Itzler
It is.
- JRJoe Rogan
Same kinda thing?
- JIJesse Itzler
Same kinda thing until you wake up the next day and you're like, "I dropped out."
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JIJesse Itzler
And you feel like, you know. So, um, anyway, I decided like, you know, I'm gonna stick this out, and then when I left, it was, uh, it was a good feeling. And the feeling was proud. I felt proud of myself-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm.
- JIJesse Itzler
... for sticking through it, you know? I-
- JRJoe Rogan
Isn't that funny? These guys have been there for 50 years.
- JIJesse Itzler
50 years, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
And you're like, "I did it in two weeks, man." (laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah. It felt good.
- JRJoe Rogan
(coughs) I bet it did. (laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
It also felt good to go into a bed.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, it's cr- ... The 50 years, when you're describing that, that seems so insane to me that I can't even relate, but when you're talking about your 15 days, I'm like, "Man, you poor bastard."
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, I feel bad for you. The guy, the 50, 50 years, he might as well be living in another dimension-
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... as far as I'm concerned.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
The guy, I mean, went in there in his 20s? That is just ... So nothing? No sex, no family, no, no neighborhood.
- JIJesse Itzler
Nope.
- JRJoe Rogan
No fucking hobbies, no drive to work.
- JIJesse Itzler
Nope.
- JRJoe Rogan
Fuck.
- 33:55 – 48:08
Practical changes after returning: ‘life resume,’ saying no, and the ‘Kevin Rule’ adventures
- JRJoe Rogan
Like what kind of adjustments did you make when you came back?
- JIJesse Itzler
Started saying no, started prio- like I just, I reversed engineered my life. So let me give you an example.
- JRJoe Rogan
Okay.
- JIJesse Itzler
My parents are (clears throat) 88, okay?
- JRJoe Rogan
(clears throat)
- JIJesse Itzler
I have a good relationship with my parents. My parents are 88, they live in Florida. I see my parent... Let's say my parents live to be 92. I hope they live longer, but let's say they live, let's say they live five years.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JIJesse Itzler
I don't have five years left with my parents. I see my parents twice a year. That means I have 10 visits with my parents.
- JRJoe Rogan
Hmm.
- JIJesse Itzler
So when I started to look at shit like that, I made significant changes. Like, okay, I'm gonna get on a plane to see my parents. And when I'm in those moments, my feet are on the ground. That's where I am. Because I only have a limited amount of time with them. You understand?
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JIJesse Itzler
It's like, it's not five years. People are like, "Oh, I got five more." No, you don't. How many times do you see 'em, man? You see 'em two times a year. You got 10 visits. So I re- I just started looking at stuff like that and became really aware when I'm in moments that are big moments, to take it in and take note of it so it has an impact on me and I appreciate it.
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow. Did you, did you shift anything else in your life? Like as far as like what you do with your time during the days?
- JIJesse Itzler
I did. So, you know, I started putting parameters around simple things like my phone. So like, I was the guy at the movie theater, I'd be checking my, you know, I forgot to, bing, I'd like look under my shirt so the light doesn't light up and know what... You know.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, I'm glad- at least you did that.
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs) No, but I-
- JRJoe Rogan
At least you're courteous.
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs) Yeah, that's true. But I put parameters, you know, nothing at, I'm not keeping my phone in at, at, at, at nighttime and you know, seeing anything come in at 5:00 in the morning.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JIJesse Itzler
Nothing at the dinner table with my kids. And so like basic obvious things like that. But as far as my time, I, I made two really big changes. One change is, and I'd kind of always been doing this, so I wouldn't necessarily say it was a change, but I take three hours a day for myself, religiously every day. And I got literally-
- JRJoe Rogan
And this is new just since the monastery?
- JIJesse Itzler
It's, it's, it's kind of like, um, it's unwavering since the monastery.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JIJesse Itzler
It's kind of been in my life and outta my life, but I just made a pie chart of time. It's 24 hours in a day. We all have the same pie chart.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JIJesse Itzler
Starts the same.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JIJesse Itzler
Like, and I said, all right, I sleep seven hours. I mean, sometimes I'm out of balance if I'm doing something big and, but right now, six or seven hours. I take three for myself and it's cumulative. So like, I'll take, could be, I'm gonna go for an hour run. I'm gonna sit in the sauna for 20 minutes. I'm gonna do fucking nothing. But when I'm in my time, I'm not mad that I'm not with my kids or my wife or, or I'm not mad that I'm not at my office. Like, that's my time. And when I'm with my kids, I'm not mad that I'm not at work or whatever, 'cause I don't wanna resent-... my wife, or my boss, or anybody for taking away the shit that I love to do. Like, if they said, "You can't run, you can't go in the sauna," I'd be really pissed off. I'd be pissed-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JIJesse Itzler
... at my wife, I'd be pissed at everybody.
- 48:08 – 53:46
Early hustle origin story: rapper to sports theme songs—and dodging a lifetime 10% deal
- JIJesse Itzler
I use it as a motivator. And I remember, I remember when I was, when I was starting out, I was 21 years old, this is a crazy story. Uh, I just got dropped from a record label. I was signed to a record label called Delicious Vinyl, I didn't-
- JRJoe Rogan
What did you do?
- JIJesse Itzler
I was a... I'm a... I had a rap record on Delicious.
- JRJoe Rogan
You were a rapper?
- JIJesse Itzler
I was a rapper signed to Delicious with Tone Loc and Young MC.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, get the fuck outta here.
- JIJesse Itzler
So, my album doesn't get picked... I don't get picked up for a second album, and I move to New York City. I have two things on my resume, kiddie pool attendant, 'cause I was a kiddie pool attendant, and rapper. So I'm staying on my friend's couch, living on his couch with his roommate, and he tells me on Monday, "I gotta get outta the apartment." So instead of going to look for a new apartment over the weekend, I go to my friend's bachelor party on the Jersey shore.I'm at the bachelor party, I'm getting a drink at the bar and I see this girl. I start chatting with her, she asks me where I live. I told her, "Actually, as of Monday, I have nowhere to go." She takes out a napkin, she writes her address on the napkin, I'm 21 years old, and she says, "If it's an emergency on Monday and you're stuck, you can come live with me." Monday comes, I get kicked out of my friend's apartment. I have nowhere to go, I'm like, "This is an emergency." (laughs) I take out the napkin and I live with this girl and her roommate for six months.
- JRJoe Rogan
Whoa.
- JIJesse Itzler
It turns out that her father is a big entrepreneur, business mo- he owns a piece of the Yankees, just like monster mogul. I write this song for the New York Knicks called Go New York Go, and it becomes a big success. You remember that song?
- JRJoe Rogan
No.
- JIJesse Itzler
No, no? Okay. That's- (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JIJesse Itzler
... okay. That's okay. (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm not a sports fan, though.
- JIJesse Itzler
No, that's fine. It becomes a big hit and I just realize that there's an opportunity to write theme songs for all these professional sports teams, but I don't have a penny to go in the studio to do the demos to shop them to the teams.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JIJesse Itzler
So I need money. So I go to this music m- guy and he says, "I'll give you $10,000 to go and do these songs for 10% of everything you make for the rest of your life." He wants to buy me like a stock.
- JRJoe Rogan
For the rest of your life?
- JIJesse Itzler
I'm 21, he's like-
- JRJoe Rogan
For the rest of your life?
- JIJesse Itzler
For the rest of your life.
- JRJoe Rogan
Everything you do?
- JIJesse Itzler
I will invest in you-
- JRJoe Rogan
You own an airplane business, he owns 10%.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
Forever?
- JIJesse Itzler
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
You have to kill him then.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. You have to kill that guy.
- 53:46 – 1:13:32
Music industry economics: exploitative contracts, streaming pennies, and audiobooks’ rise
- JRJoe Rogan
That is just crazy that someone would ask for that. But you hear things like, I mean, this is similar to what they do in the music business, like how the music business treats artists. They essentially sign you to these contracts and then take a piece of everything. They take a piece of if you do a movie, they take a piece of your live performances, your merchandise sales, everything. They just say, "Look, we'll, we'll help you out a little bit, but, you know, we want you."
- JIJesse Itzler
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. I mean, at least you're on a contract though, but there's some creepy contracts that they used to do in the old days of Hollywood that were similar to that, right? They just take a piece of you forever.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah. When I, you know, when I signed my music deal, I didn't care.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JIJesse Itzler
I was like, "You can take whatever you want, man. Get me on MTV."
- JRJoe Rogan
Right, of course, yeah, 'cause here we are.
- JIJesse Itzler
Take it all.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, that's the whole idea. The re- the reason why these exploitation contracts work is because in the beginning, you're just so desperate and what you have is what they don't have. You have talent, right? What you have is you're creative, you're young and full of energy and you've got something exciting that people wanna look at. And so what they do is they go, "Oh, you... Look, we got a fucking... We gotta way through the door, but we want 75% of the profits. We want a little bit of this and, and you don't get any money back until we recoup our money that we spent on-... executives and parking and car leases. And they, they calculate all that shit, how much the fucking building costs, how much electricity, all that stuff they cal- It's cr- You've s- you've seen those, I'm sure.
- JIJesse Itzler
Oh, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Those contracts. They're fucking scary.
- JIJesse Itzler
I sign them. (laughs) I've signed them in my own way.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JIJesse Itzler
But, um, you know, it's part of the process and no leverage.
- JRJoe Rogan
No leverage, that's the thing. They've got the leverage. But now, and now they don't have the leverage but they still figure out a way to pull it off. It's really weird because who the fuck is buying an albums now?
- JIJesse Itzler
No one.
- JRJoe Rogan
No one.
- JIJesse Itzler
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
And yet these record companies are still figuring out how to cling onto you like a lamprey and suck blood out. (sucking sound)
- JIJesse Itzler
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
They're still staying alive and their fat fingers driving their fat Mercedes-Benz. They know how to do it. They just figure out a way to grab people that are just, just getting popping. You know, and just signing to s- And then figured out a way to get in with these fucking streaming companies. Have you paid attention to any of that shit?
- JIJesse Itzler
A little bit, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oof. That's the darkest. It's even darker than the music distribution-
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... because the artists get, like, no money.
- JIJesse Itzler
Like .00001.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Steven Tyler was talking about it with me. It's just, he was explaining it and there's a, there's a, it's the company's actually g- or the organization's actually called MMA. What is something, what did, what did it stand for? He had a- Musicians for- Musician's Act. ... uh, some, some sort of an act where they're, you know, trying to stop these streaming companies from ripping off these artists. Music Modernization Act. Yeah. It's dark.
- JIJesse Itzler
Yeah.
Episode duration: 1:47:10
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Transcript of episode b0GIO4lYFls
