The Joe Rogan ExperienceJoe Rogan Experience #1154 - Doug Duren & Bryan Richards
At a glance
WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT
Experts Warn Chronic Wasting Disease Threatens Deer, Food, And Humans
- Joe Rogan speaks with landowner/hunter Doug Duren and wildlife biologist Bryan Richards about chronic wasting disease (CWD), a fatal prion disease affecting deer, elk, moose, and reindeer. Richards explains how CWD works, why it is uniquely persistent and contagious among prion diseases, and how it is rapidly spreading across North America and into Europe.
- They contrast CWD with other wildlife diseases like EHD and mad cow (BSE), highlighting CWD’s long incubation, environmental persistence, and lack of any natural “off switch.” The conversation addresses the potential—though currently unproven—risk to humans and livestock, including via plants and agricultural products contaminated with prions.
- The guests also dissect how captive deer farms, carcass movement, baiting/feeding, and political resistance to science-based management have accelerated the spread. They argue that hunters, landowners, and policymakers must accept bitter “medicine” now—more testing, carcass controls, and targeted harvest—if they want viable wild deer populations and hunting traditions in the future.
IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING
5 ideasCWD is a 100% fatal, contagious brain disease that spreads silently for years.
CWD is caused by misfolded prion proteins that convert normal prions in the brain, leading to sponge-like damage, neurological decline, and certain death—after an incubation period of roughly two years during which animals look healthy but shed infectious material.
Prions persist in the environment and can bind to soil and plants for years.
Disease-associated prions are highly resistant to heat, UV, and degradation, can remain infectious in soil for years to decades, and can both adhere to plant surfaces and be taken up into plant tissues, creating long-lived environmental reservoirs of infection.
The disease is expanding geographically and in prevalence, with no natural stop.
Once thought confined to a small area in Colorado/Wyoming, CWD is now detected in at least 25 U.S. states, multiple Canadian provinces, South Korea, and Scandinavia; in long-established hotspots, adult male prevalence can approach ~50%, and no ecological factor (like frost with EHD) shuts down transmission.
Human-assisted movement of deer and carcasses is a major accelerant.
Captive cervid farms, interstate movement of live deer and elk, improperly discarded carcasses, and possibly contaminated hay and feed all help leapfrog CWD far beyond what natural deer movements alone would achieve, making regulation and education around movement critical.
Human infection risk appears low but not zero—and exposure is rising.
Epidemiological data have not yet shown increased human prion disease where CWD occurs, but lab models demonstrate that some CWD strains can overcome species barriers in principle; as more hunters and consumers are exposed to infected meat or environments, the odds of a rare crossover event climb.
WORDS WORTH SAVING
5 quotesIf you wanted to stack the deck for a disease, you couldn't come up with a better set of characteristics.
— Bryan Richards
Can you name any other disease of humans, fish, livestock, dogs, wildlife, anything else that has that set of characteristics and that degree of penetrance into the population and you go, 'Yeah, that's no big deal'?
— Bryan Richards
Buy time, pay for science.
— Doug Duren
This seems like a ticking time bomb.
— Joe Rogan
Ethical behavior is doing the right thing even when no one's watching and the wrong thing is legal.
— Doug Duren (quoting Aldo Leopold)
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