Joe Rogan Experience #1156 - Jimmy Dore

Joe Rogan 0:03 In four, three, two, one. Hey, Jimmy.

Jimmy Dore 0:09 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 0:09 What's up? (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 0:11 (laughs) Hi, Joe. How you doing, buddy?

Joe Rogan 0:12 I'm doing good. Now we're on the radio.

Jimmy Dore 0:14 Fantastic. It's 3:31.

Joe Rogan 0:16 All right.

Jimmy Dore 0:16 Uh, 29 minutes before four o'clock.

Joe Rogan 0:18 Here's Val with the weather.

Jimmy Dore 0:19 (laughs) Hot, hot as fuck.

Joe Rogan 0:21 Back to you, Jimmy.

Jimmy Dore 0:22 So, Val, so, uh, we got a car fire in the breakdown lane.

Joe Rogan 0:25 So you were getting emotional in the green room-

Jimmy Dore 0:28 Oh.

Joe Rogan 0:28 ... listening to Henry Rollins talk about Putin. You were about to quote Chomsky. Like, what-

Jimmy Dore 0:32 Yes.

Joe Rogan 0:32 What was that?

Jimmy Dore 0:33 So he was, uh, I just caught the end of it. I s- went in the green room and I, like, you know, everybody loves Henry Rollins, right? And, um-

Joe Rogan 0:39 'Cept Henry. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 0:41 (laughs) Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:41 That's why he's so good.

Jimmy Dore 0:42 (Laughs) Maybe that, maybe.

Joe Rogan 0:43 He's, he's constantly grinding, you know?

Jimmy Dore 0:45 Yeah, but he was doing that thing about, uh, oh, Putin, you know, there was a journalist who wrote a book about him, ended up dead.

Joe Rogan 0:51 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 0:51 Putin's a bad guy. He's a bad guy. As opposed to who? (wheezes)

Joe Rogan 0:55 Well, no, but he, you, you mean he's definitely a bad guy, right? We all agree to that.

Jimmy Dore 0:59 Yeah. Who, of course.

Joe Rogan 1:00 Yes, but, I mean, just because other people are also-

Jimmy Dore 1:03 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:03 ... bad guys doesn't negate his point of Putin being a bad guy. What he was saying is just that it's very bizarre that the Republicans, these people that were, you know, at the forefront of the Cold War, these ones who are always, you know, I mean, th- these are the people that remember Khrushchev banging on the desk, you know, saying, "We'll bury you," with, with Kennedy. And these people are now, like, uh, they're whitewashing Putin. They're essentially, like, uh, trying to paint out Putin to be a good guy because Trump is in this position where he's trying to be friends with this guy.

Jimmy Dore 1:34 So, uh, well, here's the quote I wanted to send you.

Joe Rogan 1:39 Okay.

Jimmy Dore 1:39 Right?

Joe Rogan 1:39 Please.

Jimmy Dore 1:39 So that whole thing, if, if Nuremberg laws were applied, then every postwar American president would have been hanged, since, says Noam Chomsky. Uh, Putin kills journalists. We just torture ours.

Joe Rogan 1:51 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 1:52 (laughs) So, I mean, Chelsea Manning is a, well, a whistleblower we t-

Joe Rogan 1:55 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:55 Barack Obama tortured her. So-

Joe Rogan 1:57 Yeah. Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:57 ... uh, we have, our president, uh, our, our, our... We have presidents and vice presidents who are, are legit war criminals (laughs) that walk around today. They had a torture program.

Joe Rogan 2:06 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 2:06 Okay? So, uh, you know, Barack Obama got a peace prize and then he had a kill list. How... That's what... A peace prize winner with a kill list-

Joe Rogan 2:14 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 2:14 ... a drone killed. Would you keep the kill list next to the peace prize?

Joe Rogan 2:17 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 2:17 Where do you keep those two things? Are they... Anyway, so this-

Joe Rogan 2:20 Not only that, some of the people that were killed were American citizens with no due process.

Jimmy Dore 2:23 With no due process. And so it, nobody has a problem with Trump being buddy-buddies with Benjamin Netanyahu, who is a psychopathic maniac who shoots, who shoots with precision, uh, uh, uh, uh, medics who are ch- trying to help people, and nurses, and journalists, by the way.

Joe Rogan 2:40 Well, he doesn't, but some Israeli troops have done that.

Jimmy Dore 2:41 Right, Israeli troops do that.

Joe Rogan 2:43 That's a dis- a really depressing thing. You know, I had Abby Martin on, and she sort of illuminated that whole situation to me. I really didn't know how bad it was, nor did she until she went over there.

Jimmy Dore 2:53 Right.

Joe Rogan 2:54 And, you know, just experiencing what it's like, the, the, the... It's crazy that people that went through the Holocaust, that realized the cost of dehumanizing an entire race of people now are capable, at least some of them are capable of doing that to the Palestinians.

Jimmy Dore 3:11 Yeah, and it's, and it's, it's kind of mind-blowing. So when, to hear... And I have friends who do that. Everyone's doing this, right? Everyone's getting caught up in this hysteria. That's why there's a word called hysteria, 'cause it happens, and we're in one. And, you know, uh, what I like is what Noam Chomsky said about this Russia hysteria that's happening. He said, "If you care about effects on our pristine elections," which he said very sarcastically, he said, "If you care about what's affecting our pristine elections, the Russia gate is the last place I would look." And the first place he would look, if you're worried about foreign, uh, uh, uh, control of, or influence on our government, he said he would look to Israel. They're the ones... Benjamin Netanyahu came here and addressed the joint, uh, uh, session of Congress without the permission or invitation of the president. Remember when Obama was president and he did that? He did that. That's a guy coming here to tell our guys how to vote in direct defiance of our president, and everyone embraced him. Can you imagine if Putin did that? Putin came to America and addressed a joint session of Congress against the will of the president? So this idea that somehow because Putin is a bad guy, Trump shouldn't have a good friendship with him is BS. The guys who are really influencing our government here are Benjamin Netanyahu. Saudi Arabia, b- Trump opened eight businesses in Saudi Arabia during the election (laughs) and no one gives a crap about any of that stuff-

Joe Rogan 4:25 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 4:25 ... because they're our friends. Saudi Arabia, by the way, just bombed a school today, a school bus, 29 kids dead.

Joe Rogan 4:32 Huh?

Jimmy Dore 4:32 So, yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:32 Why did they do that?

Jimmy Dore 4:33 I just retweeted that from Sara Abdullah. So, uh, why would they do that? Because they're in Yemen. They're do, they're, they're bombing, we, we're committing genocide in Ye- Yemen right now, so we're helping Saudi Arabia commit a genocide in Yemen. And the way we're doing it is they're doing a thing called siege warfare, which is a war crime. And we just, in fact, they just prosecuted someone a few months ago in, uh, uh, at The Hague for it. So, but we're, since we're doing it and we're the enforcers... And Saudi Arabia's on the Human Rights Council. So it's just this, everything's a joke now, right? So we've, we're past it, where it's a farce. We're living in this farce. And so when I see a guy that I love, like Henry Rollins, um, saying stuff like, "Oh, Putin's this special kind of bad," I just quote back Chomsky. We're, there, we have nothing... We have lit- legit war criminals just one presidency away. Uh-

Joe Rogan 5:19 Do you think he's a step removed from that, though? I mean, he, he'll assassinate journalists in his own country who criticize him.

Jimmy Dore 5:26 Right now, right now, we're trying to assassinate Julian Assange. Right now, our government-

Joe Rogan 5:30 Do you think we're trying to assassinate him?

Jimmy Dore 5:30 Right. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 5:31 Is that what they're trying to do?

Jimmy Dore 5:31 Yes. They're trying to kill that guy. (laughs) Yes, they want, uh, that guy dead. Hi- Hillary Clinton was like, "Can't we drone that guy? Can't we kill him?"

Joe Rogan 5:38 Yeah, she really did say that.

Jimmy Dore 5:39 Yeah, she really did say that-

Joe Rogan 5:40 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 5:40 ... after she just got done killing Gaddafi (laughs) and then laughed about it. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 5:44 Yeah. Yeah, that, that's, we've played that several times.

Jimmy Dore 5:46 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:46 We came, we saw, he died.

Jimmy Dore 5:49 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 5:49 Ha ha ha. The fact that any human being would ever do that-... that she... And by the way, the way he died, that's some dark shit. They watched them, they stabbed him in the asshole-

Jimmy Dore 5:59 Right.

Joe Rogan 6:00 ... and, uh, there's a video of them stabbing him in the asshole while he's standing there, just confused, not knowing what they're doing. This guy's jamming a sword up his ass.

Jimmy Dore 6:07 Have you seen the video?

Joe Rogan 6:08 Yes.

Jimmy Dore 6:08 Oh, I have not seen that.

Joe Rogan 6:09 Oh my God, it's awful. You wanna see it?

Jimmy Dore 6:11 No.

Joe Rogan 6:12 The video of them capturing him is fascinating because it's a guy who has lived with an iron fist-

Jimmy Dore 6:18 Right.

Joe Rogan 6:18 ... controlled these people, been a brutal dictator, been a- a- a horrible monster of a human being. Now all of a sudden these rebels have captured him and they can't believe they have him, and they're shooting him and stabbing him, and- and then eventually they have his body and they parade his body around after they've killed him. But there's- there's- there's video of him. Should look at it for- just for a moment, 'cause it's so stunning to see him captured and alive and can't believe that these rebels have him, that it's not even- it's not even, like-

Jimmy Dore 6:46 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 6:47 ... y- you know-

Jimmy Dore 6:48 I have seen video of him captured and- and that look on his face-

Joe Rogan 6:51 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 6:51 ... so I know what you're talking about.

Joe Rogan 6:52 Just the guy shoving, like, a sw-

Jimmy Dore 6:53 But I did not- I can't-

Joe Rogan 6:54 ... shoving a knife up his ass.

Jimmy Dore 6:57 I, um, I hit a dog with my car a while ago and I just can't... I have no stomach for any of that stuff anymore.

Joe Rogan 7:05 Mm-hmm.

Narrator 7:05 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 7:05 I just, uh, I don't... So something went ha- something h- I had a real breakdown, like, I had-

Joe Rogan 7:11 Aw.

Jimmy Dore 7:11 We took it to the vet. It lived... I didn't hi- I di- uh, so I hit a d- I hit a dog, killed it, uh, about a year and a half ago. It might've already been dead.

Narrator 7:22 Wow.

Joe Rogan 7:22 It already been dead?

Jimmy Dore 7:23 Because I think it was laying in the street, 'cause I didn't-

Joe Rogan 7:25 Oh, Jesus.

Jimmy Dore 7:26 ... yeah, 'cause I didn't see it, so it had to be already laying there anyways. So it ru- you know, I just... And then I saw... I was driving to my pot store in Eagle Rock, and I saw this little black p- pup dog run across the street in front of our car, and there's this big median, like a grass median, and it was... And I go, "Stop, stop." And the cars hasn't started coming yet the other way, and I stop. So my wife stops and I jump out and I'm running, and I see the cars coming and they're just... And I don't see the dog anymore. And, uh, then I see the dog next to the curb and it's kind of like just going like, like that, and it just crushed me. Like, even now that I think of it. Anyways-

Joe Rogan 8:05 So it was twitching like it got hit?

Jimmy Dore 8:06 Yeah, yes, it got hit. And so, um, my... We- we picked it up and we ran... We drove to a hospital as soon as we could. I mean, you know, an animal hospital, which there was one not far away, and it lived.

Narrator 8:18 Wow.

Jimmy Dore 8:19 The dog lived, but I couldn't believe-

Joe Rogan 8:21 Did you take it as a pet?

Jimmy Dore 8:22 Y- y-... No, no, no, no. Um, uh, uh, um, they just... My s- my wife called back, you know, to the thing and they said, "Yeah, it's gonna live and we have someone who's gonna take it."

Joe Rogan 8:34 Oh.

Jimmy Dore 8:34 I'm like, "Oh, okay. Thank God." But I, I was so surprised at how I just broke down over that puppy. The dog I ran over I was, like, numb to, but that dog, for some reason, it just... Everything opened and I was just... I'm... I couldn't. (laughs) I was such a basket case.

Joe Rogan 8:48 It's hard. Puppies are so cute. When you see a puppy-

Jimmy Dore 8:50 It was such... I was-

Joe Rogan 8:51 ... that just hit by a car. That's sad shit.

Jimmy Dore 8:53 I was s- And so it's just like, I can see and I s- and I feel like... I don't know if I have this, but I feel like I have PTSD over that, right? Like, I way overreacted to that situation. So there was a lot more going on there. And so-

Joe Rogan 9:08 And so when someone says something like the Gaddafi video, you're like, "I can't."

Jimmy Dore 9:10 I just can't even.

Joe Rogan 9:11 "I can't." Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 9:12 Yeah, so I can't even imagine guys who have to go to war and the stuff they have to see and the things that they have to do. I don't know how they all don't come home-

Joe Rogan 9:19 Do you know anybody who went over there?

Jimmy Dore 9:21 Yeah, I-

Joe Rogan 9:22 Yeah?

Jimmy Dore 9:22 ... I've been, I've been to Afghanistan.

Joe Rogan 9:23 You know many of the s- soldiers, I mean?

Jimmy Dore 9:25 I know so-... But, uh, uh, yeah, I mean, I'd known they... Not personally, like, they come to my show, that kind of stuff, I know those people. I don't have a close friend who was actually in combat like that, no.

Joe Rogan 9:36 I have a- a few close friends that have been in combat and when they start drinking and that's when, you know, inhibitions get loosened up and then stories start flowing and-

Jimmy Dore 9:46 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 9:46 ... you know, it's...

Jimmy Dore 9:48 I-

Joe Rogan 9:48 Most people... But it's- it's not something people are designed to see, you know?

Jimmy Dore 9:52 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 9:52 Especially not when no one else is seeing it.

Jimmy Dore 9:54 Right.

Joe Rogan 9:54 The thing is, if we all lived in the Roman times and everybody was getting sworded up every day and people were getting hit with arrows all the time, it's a normal part of life.

Jimmy Dore 10:02 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 10:02 And people start accepting the fact that there's gonna be loss. But there's something about living today where the majority of human beings live in this uber safe environment that's probably as sa- more safe than any people have ever lived ever. And just overall in general, like, the- the- the modern Western civilization. But then you're going over to Afghanistan and you're- you're, you know, you're dealing with bombings and schools and buses and sniper attacks and, you know, your buddy just lost a leg from an IED, and, you know, that- that kind of shit just wears on a person.

Jimmy Dore 10:34 Yeah. Just an- any- anything... I... Ugh. I can't, I can't believe we still do war like this.

Joe Rogan 10:41 I know.

Jimmy Dore 10:41 It's just, you know, I'm very... See, I get in a lot of trouble 'cause I'm anti-war and all wars are bullshit.

Joe Rogan 10:46 How do you get in trouble 'cause you're anti-war?

Jimmy Dore 10:48 Well, for instance-

Joe Rogan 10:49 Who's pro-war? (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 10:50 Uh, the entire establishment is pro-war. You know that. Every- every newscaster is pro-war. If you're on... If you're not pro-war, you don't get on TV. If you're against the war, you get fired like Phil Donahue, like Ed Schultz, like Jesse Ventura, like Ashley Banfield. If you're, if you tell... Like Chris Hedges. If you tell the truth about the war, you will get fired from establishment news.

Joe Rogan 11:09 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 11:09 And so-

Joe Rogan 11:09 There's no establishment news that will let you talk openly? Other than RT. RT seems to be pretty, uh, open.

Jimmy Dore 11:16 (laughs) Yes.

Joe Rogan 11:16 Which is really ironic.

Jimmy Dore 11:17 That's ironic, right?

Joe Rogan 11:18 Yeah, I mean, when Abby Martin was working for RT-

Jimmy Dore 11:20 Working for...

Joe Rogan 11:20 ... it was like, Jesus Christ, like, wh- how does that work?

Jimmy Dore 11:23 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:23 You know?

Jimmy Dore 11:24 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:24 The Empire Files and you're working for Russia?

Jimmy Dore 11:27 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:27 Like, (laughs) you know?

Jimmy Dore 11:29 I know, it- it does seem-

Joe Rogan 11:30 It's crazy.

Jimmy Dore 11:31 It's a crazy, crazy juxtaposition. It is weird. Ed Schultz was the one who said that, uh, you know, he was n-... He was told what to cover, what not to cover at MSNBC.

Joe Rogan 11:39 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 11:39 He was told not to cover Bernie Sanders. He wanted to cover Bernie Sanders anyway. He said that the Hillary Clinton campaign and the head of NBC News, Andy Lack, were joined at the hip and he tried to cover Bernie Sanders, he was told not to. He was yelled at by the head of MSNBC, that's how he described it. And a month later he was fired.... he was out.

Joe Rogan 11:58 Well, Cenk had a ser- a similar situation, Cenk from the Young Turks.

Jimmy Dore 12:01 Cenk, he was told that, uh, "Our friends in Washington don't like your tone." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 12:06 Oh, my God.

Jimmy Dore 12:07 That's what they told him.

Joe Rogan 12:08 That is hilarious.

Jimmy Dore 12:10 And he was winning his time slot-

Joe Rogan 12:11 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 12:11 ... and they told him that. And they moved him to the weekend to give Al Sharpton ... Th- this is true, this is true. So they moved him to the weekend to ... uh, and they said they wanted him to work on his presentation skills. The guy's winning his time slot. They're saying, "W- we want you to work on your presentation skills." And meanwhile, who'd they replace him with? Al Sharpton.

Joe Rogan 12:29 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 12:30 He's got great presentation skills. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 12:32 That's all Al has. I mean-

Jimmy Dore 12:34 But he's got-

Joe Rogan 12:35 ... he's got a nice suit on. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 12:37 Al Sharpton, did you ever see him try to-

Joe Rogan 12:38 (sighs)

Jimmy Dore 12:38 ... read a teleprompter? It's brutal.

Joe Rogan 12:40 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 12:41 I mean, he's a great orator-

Joe Rogan 12:42 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 12:42 ... but he's not a teleprompter reader.

Joe Rogan 12:44 No.

Jimmy Dore 12:44 And it was like, we used ... I have clips, we used to make fun all the time on my show of him.

Joe Rogan 12:48 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 12:48 It was hilarious.

Joe Rogan 12:49 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 12:49 And then, th- to find out that that's the reason they gave was because he's a better presenter. He's a better ora- he's a great orator.

Joe Rogan 12:55 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 12:55 That's different than being a news presenter.

Joe Rogan 12:57 Right.

Jimmy Dore 12:57 And that is not in Al Sharpton's wheelhouse. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 13:00 No, it's just, he's not the most trustworthy person either. I mean, he's got-

Jimmy Dore 13:04 (coughs)

Joe Rogan 13:04 ... a history of deception. So you having the-

Jimmy Dore 13:06 Well, the way he got that job.

Joe Rogan 13:07 Yeah. Well, how about the way he became famous? The Tawana Brawley case.

Jimmy Dore 13:11 Mm.

Joe Rogan 13:11 I mean, he became famous through deception. And so you're seeing this guy who is l- basically a famous con man who's now on television on a news program.

Jimmy Dore 13:21 (laughs) Well, they ha- they have ... There's a lot o- Look at Brian Williams.

Joe Rogan 13:25 Yes.

Jimmy Dore 13:26 I mean-

Joe Rogan 13:26 Is he back?

Jimmy Dore 13:27 They don't-

Joe Rogan 13:27 Is he back in the air?

Jimmy Dore 13:27 Yes, he has The 11th Hour on MSNBC. So ...

Joe Rogan 13:30 So has everybody forgotten?

Jimmy Dore 13:32 Everybody has forgotten. A-g- his punishment was he had to g- he had to go spend six months, uh, giggling with Rachel Maddow.

Joe Rogan 13:38 What did he do?

Jimmy Dore 13:39 (laughs) They, they w-

Joe Rogan 13:40 (laughs) Do a cooking show?

Jimmy Dore 13:41 They have these show. They do these shows. They got, like, these round tables and yeah ... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 13:45 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 13:45 And he has to laugh and pretend ... They all pretend-

Joe Rogan 13:47 You know what the fuck's up about him? He, all he had to do was tell the truth, and it was scary enough.

Jimmy Dore 13:51 (laughs) No shit.

Joe Rogan 13:52 Yeah. I mean, you were in Iraq. You really were there.

Jimmy Dore 13:54 You really were there.

Joe Rogan 13:55 Yeah. I mean, you really were there, or Afghanistan? Was it Iraq or Afghanistan? You didn't-

Jimmy Dore 13:58 I think it was Iraq.

Joe Rogan 13:59 And you b- really, b- shots were fired.

Jimmy Dore 14:02 (laughs) Why, why-

Joe Rogan 14:03 But Hillary did the same goddamn thing.

Jimmy Dore 14:04 Oh, that's right.

Joe Rogan 14:05 She lied about being shot at.

Jimmy Dore 14:06 Oh.

Joe Rogan 14:06 She fucking straight up lied about being shot at.

Jimmy Dore 14:08 Oh, when she was in Bosnia, right?

Joe Rogan 14:09 Yes.

Jimmy Dore 14:09 Yeah, she was-

Joe Rogan 14:10 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 14:10 And, and, and, and who was it? The, who was the comedian who outed her? It was, uh, Sinbad.

Joe Rogan 14:15 Did he?

Jimmy Dore 14:16 Yeah, it was Sinbad who was on that trip (laughs) And he's like, "There was no sniper fire." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 14:20 Oh, that's hilarious.

Jimmy Dore 14:22 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:22 And she was busted straight up lying about being shot at.

Jimmy Dore 14:25 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 14:26 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 14:26 So it's just, it's always shocking to me when I find out that politicians are lying, isn't it?

Joe Rogan 14:31 It's crazy.

Jimmy Dore 14:32 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 14:32 Can't believe it's real.

Jimmy Dore 14:33 They're all nar- that's weird. It's y- it's such a ... Only the s- the, the purest of people are drawn to that, but question, it's whenever I find out they're-

Joe Rogan 14:41 Fish out there.

Jimmy Dore 14:41 ... narcissistic megalo- narcissistic megalomaniacs, I'm always shocked.

Joe Rogan 14:44 Well, you know what it is, Jimmy?

Jimmy Dore 14:45 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 14:45 We're weeding out the bad apples, and then we're eventually (laughs) g- gonna get to the good ones.

Jimmy Dore 14:50 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:50 We just gotta get rid of these bad ones first.

Jimmy Dore 14:52 So that's why it comes back to when he was talking about how Putin, he's like, "Hey, I wanna tell Trump, 'Slow down. Don't be friends with this guy.'" No, I want Trump to be friends with Putin because he's a nuclear power. I want Trump to be friends with anybody. We need detente, you know. NATO is the one wrapping up tensions, ramping up tensions with, uh, Russia, and we have ever since the Cold War supposedly ended. And so, you know, it was just a f- anyways, so I- I- I just think, yes, Putin is a bad guy. They're all bad guys.

Joe Rogan 15:18 Right.

Jimmy Dore 15:18 There's, why ... I, you know, I just had John Kiriakou on my show, I don't know if you-

Joe Rogan 15:22 Who is he?

Jimmy Dore 15:22 So he is a ex-CIA guy, he went to prison because he exposed a torture program.

Joe Rogan 15:26 Oh.

Jimmy Dore 15:27 Yeah. So Robert Mueller actually prosecuted that guy.

Joe Rogan 15:30 Whoa.

Jimmy Dore 15:31 So now he's s- he's a member of Veterans Intelligence Professionals for Sanity, VIPS. And they were, uh, th- they were invented or they were originally organized to debunk the weapons of mass destruction about Iraq. So they were, uh, intelligence professionals who knew what was happening, that this ... We were being sold a bill of goods because the military industrial complex wanted its war, right?

Joe Rogan 15:52 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 15:52 And so they s- they were, like, all the top guys, Ray McGovern, Bill Binney, and they'd, and they, uh, created this organization to help debunk it. Well, no-

Joe Rogan 16:00 Bill Binney is the guy who was the first whistleblower for the NSA, correct?

Jimmy Dore 16:04 Yes. That they tried to throw ... And the FBI tried to throw him in jail, and, of course, he's the smartest guy the NSA ever had, so he outsmarted the FBI.

Joe Rogan 16:11 Well, how did he do that?

Jimmy Dore 16:12 So he had-

Joe Rogan 16:12 I forget the story, but he-

Jimmy Dore 16:13 I forget the story. He told it to me, but they, he had them secretly recorded-

Joe Rogan 16:17 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 16:17 ... saying certain things. And so when they tried to, th- uh, to show the evidence against him, he's like, "Actually, I got you guys." And they're like-

Joe Rogan 16:24 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 16:24 ... "Oh, shit." And so they couldn't ... So he had them, so he outsmarted them. And he tells the story on my show. Uh, you know, it was about a year ago, so I don't remember exactly how it went. But he told me a lot of mind-blowing stuff on my show, a lot of stuff. Just, um, you know, like about how they spy on us. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 16:40 Well, he was the one that first exposed this program that was essentially spying on every single email, every-

Jimmy Dore 16:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 16:45 ... single voicemail. Every single conversation that you have is being recorded.

Jimmy Dore 16:49 So William Binney invented a thing called ThinThread. So ThinThread was, uh, a data collection. So what he did is he hooked up every cell phone to every cell phone i- in the, in the universe. It's, uh ... And he did it. And it was hard to do, and everybody said, "You couldn't do it." He did it. And so he knew that metadata wa- was more predictive than, say, if I tap your phone and listen to your actual phone conversation, that I actually learn more by looking at a larger data set. And when, and when contacts start happening, that means movement's happening, that means an attack is gonna happen, that means more ... So if the metadata means more ... And so he found a way to track people and keep your identity secret, so it was constitutional.

Joe Rogan 17:31 Oh.

Jimmy Dore 17:32 That's what he cared about, the Constitution and the right to privacy. And ThinThread did that. It was a better ... And th- and they got rid of ThinThread, and a couple weeks later, 9/11 happened.So that's, what Bill... So that's who Bill Binney is. And so he said they got rid of it because there's billions of dollars in the new pro... They brought in a, uh, uh, uh, a m- I think it was called Trailblazer out... And not as good as a, a tracker, not as good as a metadata thing. And, but it was, you know, five, six billion dollars to Booz Allen or whoever invented it. And that's what this is all about. This is all about money, and you don't wanna disappoint people who wanna have a lot of money paid their way.

Joe Rogan 18:07 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 18:08 And then, so that's what... So he blew the whistle on that and they come back at him and they try to put (laughs) him in jail. That's what they do to whistleblowers. That's what we do. So that's funny to hear him say, "Oh, well, somebody wrote a bad book about Putin and they ended up dead." What do you think we do in this country? Look what they did to Chelsea Manning. Look what we did to people who exposed war crimes inside of our country. Right now, we're trying, they're trying to assassinate Julian Assange. They have him in basically solitary confinement. We literally did torture Chelsea Manning. So, uh, and then, you know, Barack Obama used, uh, uh, he- he prosecuted lots of whistleblowing journalists using the... Now I'm blanking on the word it's called, but, um, Espionage Act. So this idea that, yeah, I'm sure Putin, maybe Putin didn't... Maybe that woman who wrote that book about Putin has a lot of powerful enemies. Usually you do when you are that kind of a journalist where you're exposing the powerful. She probably didn't just expose Putin, so she probably exposed a lot of people. My point being is that, uh, you know, now who's being naive, Joe?

Joe Rogan 19:06 Well, I mean, she probably did expose a lot of people, but it's also very likely that Putin had her killed.

Jimmy Dore 19:12 (laughs) Yeah. Yes, it is.

Joe Rogan 19:13 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 19:13 I'm not, I'm not denying that.

Joe Rogan 19:15 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 19:15 Barack Obama had a kill list. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 19:16 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 19:17 So these guys are out, you know... He, he took us from two wars to seven. He did Libya, turned it into a failed state.

Joe Rogan 19:23 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 19:23 Right now, they have open slave trading.

Joe Rogan 19:25 I know. You can watch it on YouTube.

Jimmy Dore 19:26 Yeah. So-

Joe Rogan 19:27 It's so dark.

Jimmy Dore 19:28 And they wanna do it again. They wanna do it in Syria. They want... So, Joe, let me ask you a question. If we get rid of Assad in Syria, do you know who takes over?

Joe Rogan 19:35 Uh, the... Jesus or something.

Jimmy Dore 19:37 (laughs) That's right. Je- (laughs)

Joe Rogan 19:39 Is that... Who starts running things? Moses or Isiran?

Jimmy Dore 19:42 The... Al-Qaeda (laughs) , al-Qaeda-

Joe Rogan 19:44 Al-Qaeda, yeah.

Jimmy Dore 19:44 ... Al-Nusra.

Joe Rogan 19:45 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 19:46 Uh, uh, so that, the, the ra-

Joe Rogan 19:47 They create a power vacuum-

Jimmy Dore 19:48 The, the-

Joe Rogan 19:49 ... which is what always happens.

Jimmy Dore 19:50 The Wah... Uh, the, the Wahhabi terrorists funded by Saudi Arabia, that's who takes over.

Joe Rogan 19:55 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 19:55 And I have videotape after videotape of our top officials admitting that Saudi Arabia funds ISIS and that we also did, so... And that we created, we created Al-Qaeda, we got, we created... And, and ISIS was created because of our invasion of Iraq, but then we actually fund them and we ship them arms. So, uh-

Joe Rogan 20:14 For what reason?

Jimmy Dore 20:15 To go overthrow Assad so we can put a, a pipeline through, uh, Syria.

Joe Rogan 20:20 So we fund them so that they fight Assad, but then Saudi Arabia funds them.

Jimmy Dore 20:24 This isn't the first time we did that. We funded Al-Qaeda so they would fight the Russians.

Joe Rogan 20:28 Right.

Jimmy Dore 20:29 So it's the same. And then we, and then we're left with them.

Joe Rogan 20:31 So that was when was the Mujahideen.

Jimmy Dore 20:32 That's when they were the Mujah... Yes.

Joe Rogan 20:34 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 20:34 Mujahideen. Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 20:35 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 20:35 So... And I have videotapes of Hillary Clinton screaming about this. "We created this problem!" She says this on video. I have it. So, um, that's why I get in trouble, because I tell the truth about the war. And if you tell the truth about the war, you'll be called a conspiracy theorist by the establishment news. That's exactly what's happened.

Joe Rogan 20:54 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 20:54 That happened to me.

Joe Rogan 20:55 Are you a conspiracy theorist now?

Jimmy Dore 20:56 No- That's what they say.

Joe Rogan 20:58 Oh.

Jimmy Dore 20:58 You know, what the biggest... Because I tell the truth about Syria.

Joe Rogan 21:01 Right.

Jimmy Dore 21:02 Uh, the biggest conspiracy of my lifetime was the Iraq War. That was a conspiracy.

Joe Rogan 21:06 Yeah. That's a legit conspiracy.

Jimmy Dore 21:07 (laughs) That's a legit conspiracy.

Joe Rogan 21:08 Yeah. I mean, that's one you can actually prove.

Jimmy Dore 21:10 Right.

Joe Rogan 21:11 I mean, I used to have a whole bit about it. I used to have a whole bit about, like, that there... The only way to find out if someone... It was, like, from 2005. It was that the reason why they put George Bush in power is... The only way to find out if someone is really stupid, is to put an actual stupid guy in as president and find out if everybody freaks out. That's the only way to really tell. And we were like, "Well, we could put a smart guy in there and have him act dumb." Like, no, no, no. We'll never know.

Jimmy Dore 21:33 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 21:34 We'll never know.

Jimmy Dore 21:35 Never know.

Joe Rogan 21:35 We get a, we get a dumb guy, let's just try it out and see what happens. And then it was all... The whole thing about us going to war in Iraq. Like, "Why did we go to the war over there? And what, what did we tell them? And they bought that? Holy shit." And then, and then it was, "He won again?"

Jimmy Dore 21:49 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 21:49 "He won again. Fuck." And I go... And, you know, there's someone in the back of the room going, "I think we can go dumber."

Jimmy Dore 21:56 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 21:57 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 21:59 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 21:59 And that became Trump.

Jimmy Dore 22:00 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 22:01 (laughs) That's... I mean, that was from 2005 from my Showtime special from 13 years ago.

Jimmy Dore 22:07 So, uh, let me tell you something. Trump i- will be allowed to be president and was allowed to be president because he's doing the bidding of the establishment. They're on board with most of the stuff he's doing. They're like that he's, he- he's not re- he's not pulling back on any of the wars. He's... They've all ramped up the military budget. Isn't it funny, Joe? They're not-

Joe Rogan 22:24 But they're not protecting him from Mueller. They're not protecting him from this, this investigation.

Jimmy Dore 22:29 Well, i- he's... Nothing's happened.

Joe Rogan 22:30 Right.

Jimmy Dore 22:31 The... A- again, it's... And by the way, what they've got him on is all regular corruption. Like I said, Trump is corrupt. Yes, he's corrupt. He's corrupt with Saudi Arabia. He's cor- he's corrupt with Russia. He's corrupt with Israel. He's... Yeah, they're all corrupt. But he tu-... The Clinton Foundation, the pre- they're, they're all what... The Chomsky quote, "They'd all be hung-"

Joe Rogan 22:47 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 22:48 "... if we applied the Nuremberg standards." So this is the world we're living in. So this idea that somehow we need to focus extra on Trump and somehow Put-... And you know what? Journalists i- the anti-Putin journalists in Russia will tell you that we're a bunch of n- numbskulls over here because we're inflating Putin's power. So we are blu-... Like he's this all-powerful guy who's got his finger in every decision everywhere at all times. Alyssa Milano is now blaming (laughs) the Green Party being controlled by the Russians for an Ohio election, a special election. I'm not kidding. I can show you the tweet.

Joe Rogan 23:20 What? Alyssa Milano?

Jimmy Dore 23:21 You think I'm... (laughs) And who doesn't love Alyssa Milano, right?

Joe Rogan 23:24 Oh. Alyssa. She's beautiful.

Jimmy Dore 23:25 Who doesn't... She's one of the prettiest of all time.

Joe Rogan 23:27 I met her in a hotel once.

Jimmy Dore 23:28 Did you really?

Joe Rogan 23:29 Wandering through the hotel, we got in the elevator together.

Jimmy Dore 23:31 So here is-

Joe Rogan 23:32 I said, "I can't believe I'm in a hotel elevator with Alyssa Milano."

Jimmy Dore 23:35 I got this...

Joe Rogan 23:35 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 23:35 That is just mmm.

Joe Rogan 23:36 I said, "Hello." She said hello back, and that was it. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 23:39 Did she know who you were?

Joe Rogan 23:40 I don't think so.

Jimmy Dore 23:40 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 23:41 No. It was a long time ago too.

Jimmy Dore 23:43 She says, "You know what sucks? Because of our unwillingness to pass policy that protects our election integrity, I immediately think the Green Party votes to- tonight's are Russian meddling. Why else would anyone cast a protest vote in Ohio when there's so much at stake?" (laughs)

Joe Rogan 23:58 So much at stake. That's so delusional. Like, what is a protest vote? What's your vote worth? If everyone votes and they all vote Green, is that a protest vote?

Jimmy Dore 24:07 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 24:08 Like if- is it-

Jimmy Dore 24:09 It's like he- he-

Joe Rogan 24:09 ... impossible that the Green Party can win? Like, you have no faith. So what they're doing is essentially just bowing down to a rigged system, saying the system's rigged, so just vote for side B even though side A and B are funded by the same people. I know, I know, but ideologically side B is our side. That's what she's saying.

Jimmy Dore 24:26 So what ... They've gone past ... So now the #Resistance have gone beyond voter shaming, and now what they're actually doing is democracy shaming.

Joe Rogan 24:34 Yes. Right.

Jimmy Dore 24:34 You don't get to participate in democracy.

Joe Rogan 24:36 Exactly.

Jimmy Dore 24:37 And those people ... So let me tell you something. When people say, "Oh, you know, the Greens take away votes," I would not have voted in the presidential election if I did not have the opportunity to vote for, uh, the Green Party.

Joe Rogan 24:47 Right.

Jimmy Dore 24:48 So, those votes, you don't own those votes. The way electoral politics works is that if you don't have enough votes to win, you have to go get them.

Joe Rogan 24:56 Right.

Jimmy Dore 24:56 And you have to appeal to those votes. But they don't have an appeal to voters, the Democratic Party, they have nothing. And so what they have left is fear and voter shaming. And that's it. Now they're actually shaming democracy.

Joe Rogan 25:08 But you would also think that by the ti- ... After we've gotten through this past election, where no one, literally no one in the mainstream media, other than maybe Fox News, predicted that Trump was gonna win. No one. They all were 100% sure-

Jimmy Dore 25:20 Right.

Joe Rogan 25:20 ... that Hillary was gonna win. They were, they were had in the 90% range of probability-

Jimmy Dore 25:25 (laughs) Yes. Right.

Joe Rogan 25:25 ... of her winning and they were displaying it on CNN. So they know that that's wrong. So why would someone think that a Green Party candidate has to be ... or a Libertarian candidate, has to be a protest vote? Why can't it be a real vote at this point? When you're talking about the kind of social media outreach that, that is capable today, that's possible today, when you, a person who has some really good points and is a real- ... Look at this woman who won in New York, the 28-year-old girl who's a Democratic Socialist.

Jimmy Dore 25:53 Oh, like Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez?

Joe Rogan 25:55 Yes. Look, if that doesn't tell you, like, this world is changing in a radical way, and upstarts and, and, and people who are huge underdogs have the possibility of winning. It's not a protest vote, it's an actual vote. And if everybody who thinks this way votes towards that protest vote, guess what? They win.

Jimmy Dore 26:12 That's right.

Joe Rogan 26:13 That's what it is.

Jimmy Dore 26:14 So I used to, uh, have a joke where I would say, "Uh, no you can't vote for a, you can't vote for a third party candidate until a lot of people are already voting for a third party candidate."

Joe Rogan 26:23 Yeah. Exactly. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 26:24 (laughs) That's what they're saying. "You can't vote for them, they have no chance to win. So you have to wait til a lot of people are already ..." So that ... you ... they-

Joe Rogan 26:30 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 26:30 People don't understand that inherent contradiction. And by the way, people, uh, maybe if you spent a tenth of the energy trying to excite the half of the country that doesn't vote-

Joe Rogan 26:40 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 26:40 ... as you do and- trying to sh- voter shame Progressives or Green Party or environmentalists for not giving you their vote, which you do not fucking own-

Joe Rogan 26:48 Right. Exactly.

Jimmy Dore 26:49 If you were to spend a tenth of the energy trying to excite people who don't participate to participate instead of shaming the people who do participate, maybe you'd get somewhere.

Joe Rogan 26:58 It's also this reluctance to admit that both sides are corrupt is this very strange thing that exists on people who operate within this narrow bandwidth. And this narrow bandwidth is whatever side you're on, whether it's you're on the right or the left, this is the side that you want to win. And it's the right side, and they're the good people, and the other side, even though ... well, even though our side does wrong, this side does worse. And they, they operate in this real narrow bandwidth. This is why she would think something that's possibly negative for her side is a protest vote instead of being your actual feelings on the issue.

Jimmy Dore 27:32 And if these people really cared about voting integrity, wouldn't they want paper ballots?

Joe Rogan 27:37 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 27:38 If they really cared about, uh, voter integrity, wouldn't they want rank choice voting? Wouldn't they want that? Then you don't have-

Joe Rogan 27:43 What is that?

Jimmy Dore 27:43 ... don't y- you don't have to worry about this.

Joe Rogan 27:45 Rank choice voting? What is that?

Jimmy Dore 27:46 Rank choice. So they have it in Maine now, right? So, uh, it's where ... so they know, you, you get to, this is my first choice, this is my second choice, this is my third choice.

Joe Rogan 27:56 Oh.

Jimmy Dore 27:56 So you don't get to ... So it, it eliminates that you're a spoiler, right?

Joe Rogan 28:00 Oh. Interesting.

Jimmy Dore 28:01 Yeah. So, um, and, and they voted it in in Maine, and the politicians, of course, don't want it.

Joe Rogan 28:08 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 28:08 So they got rid of it.

Joe Rogan 28:09 Oh.

Jimmy Dore 28:09 And they had to ... The court reinstated it. They had to ... I think it's happened twice now.

Joe Rogan 28:13 How does it work in terms of, like, say if you're gonna vote for a, you know, governor of Maine. You have a first choice, a second choice, and a third choice?

Jimmy Dore 28:20 Okay, let's, let's say there's three choices.

Joe Rogan 28:21 Right.

Jimmy Dore 28:22 So you get to, you get to say, well, let's say, let's say your first choice was a Green Party candidate and you go-

Joe Rogan 28:26 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 28:26 ... "Okay, that's my first choice, but my second choice would be the Democrat."

Joe Rogan 28:30 So in case a-

Jimmy Dore 28:30 And my third choice would be, you know, maybe nobody.

Joe Rogan 28:33 And so does, like, second choice have different points?

Jimmy Dore 28:35 So if y- if your first choice doesn't get enough votes-

Joe Rogan 28:38 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 28:38 ... to win, then your second choice goes, right?

Joe Rogan 28:41 Oh.

Jimmy Dore 28:41 So that's how it works. So you're never wasting your vote. And you know what's ironic? Is that ... And I might've ... You- you- there's b- people who can better explain that, so ple- ... I know people are gonna b- ... "Jamie, the way, better way to say that ..." I- I'm sure there's better ways. But the thing that kills me is that Bernie Sanders, his whole career was about being an independent. And I have video tapes of him saying, "You know what kills me is I go out and I do, I do these talks and I t- talk to people and they come up to me after these debates and they say, 'You know, I liked what you said and, uh, you, you make the most sense, uh, but I can't vote for you 'cause you're never gonna win.' I hate that." They go, "I wanna waste my vote. Oh, if there's one thing I hate more is that, that phrase, 'Waste your vote.'"

Joe Rogan 29:18 Mm.

Jimmy Dore 29:19 This was what he was saying his entire career, until now. And I wanna know why. I wanna know what the hell does Bernie Sanders in 2018 know that Bernie Sanders in 2006 didn't know, and Bernie Sanders in 1996 doesn't know. And he tells everybody, "You gotta run." And he's, you know, getting people to come into the Democratic Party, which is actively cheating them, yet he's still running-

Joe Rogan 29:41 Cheating him.

Jimmy Dore 29:41 And him.

Joe Rogan 29:42 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 29:42 And he still runs as an independent in Maine, I mean in Vermont. He still runs it. Everybody's saying, "You guy- you can't d-" He gets to run as an independent.

Joe Rogan 29:50 He gets to run as an independent while representing the Democratic Party sometimes.

Jimmy Dore 29:53 Yes. Yes. So they have a special sweetheart deal is what I'm-

Joe Rogan 29:56 So what is he saying when he said ... Is he saying now that protest votes are a waste? Like, what is he saying?

Jimmy Dore 30:01 He told everybody to vote for Hillary. He told ... I mean, he's not starting a third party. And, you know, his whole life he was like, he said that we have to have ... The, the, the verbiage he used one time I saw him was that, uh-You know, uh, Jesse Jackson's correct, we need, we need a rainbow coalition of people. Uh, but it has to happen outside of the Democratic Party. He said that. That was him. So we have to have a progressive coalition, but it has to happen outside. And who better to lead it but Bernie Sanders? So that's why it's hard to start a third party, because you need people who are already pop- famous and popular and, uh, in government. So if he left and he got, say, Tulsi Gabbard and Nina Turner and Ale- Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, and you got a bunch of people that are super popular on the left, we'd have a third party at- that would be polling at 10%, 15%. And now the Democrats would have to join- form a coalition, instead of what they're doing now, which is ignoring progressives. After she, uh, cheated Bernie Sanders, after the Democrats cheated Bernie Sanders in the primary, Hillary Clinton didn't choose Bernie Sanders as her vice president, as a olive branch. She didn't choose Elizabeth Warren as an olive branch. She went to her right. She got Tim Kaine, who's to the right of her, who's-

Joe Rogan 31:11 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 31:11 ... anti-union who's every bad thing you want in a corporate Democrat. He's pro-wall, the whole deal. She went ... So just ... So if we had a third party that actually polled at 10% or 15%, they would have to, they couldn't do that anymore. They'd have to, they'd have to do a thing called, Joe, voter outreach instead of voter shaming or what it's devolved to now, which is democracy shaming. They're literally shaming people for participating in democracy. "You don't get to participate in democracy because you're a third party." Well, fuck you. That's called democracy and so- "Yes, I do. And I get to vote my conscience." And we'll be right back.

Joe Rogan 31:45 Aah!

Jimmy Dore 31:47 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 31:47 That's a good break. That's a good ad break right there.

Jimmy Dore 31:49 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 31:49 That's solid. If you run a radio show, that would be the way to go.

Jimmy Dore 31:52 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 31:52 Hey, one of the reasons why we came in today is 'cause we wanted to talk about the Alex Jones situation. Um, I know you were, uh, not just a vocal critic of Alex Jones, you spit in his face on, on live internet.

Jimmy Dore 32:03 Joe, I did not spit in his face. That was-

Joe Rogan 32:05 You did something.

Jimmy Dore 32:05 ... completely involuntary. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 32:08 He coughed and liquid came out of your mouth and it got him right in the face.

Jimmy Dore 32:11 As you know, Alex Jones is hilarious. There's no doubt.

Joe Rogan 32:13 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 32:13 There's no denying that.

Joe Rogan 32:15 He's occasionally very hilarious. Yeah, yeah.

Jimmy Dore 32:18 Yes. And I, I told you what happened. I was walking up-

Joe Rogan 32:20 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 32:20 ... he's having this ... They're just about to go fisticuffs the whole time.

Joe Rogan 32:23 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 32:24 And, uh, as I walk up, he goes, "Hey, I'm just trying to be nice."

Joe Rogan 32:27 (laughs) And you had a spit take.

Jimmy Dore 32:27 And I had a mouthful of iced tea, and that was that.

Joe Rogan 32:30 I understand.

Jimmy Dore 32:30 That's my story, I'm sticking to it.

Joe Rogan 32:31 Good story.

Jimmy Dore 32:32 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 32:33 Um, you know, and Trump meant to say "would."

Jimmy Dore 32:38 (laughs) Wouldn't.

Joe Rogan 32:38 And he actually said-

Jimmy Dore 32:39 He said wouldn't.

Joe Rogan 32:41 Yeah. Yeah, he actually ... What did he say? "I don't see any reason why they would."

Jimmy Dore 32:44 Would.

Joe Rogan 32:44 But he meant to say wouldn't.

Jimmy Dore 32:45 Say wouldn't.

Joe Rogan 32:46 Yeah. That was one of the worst lies I think anybody's ever told on television in front of millions of people. That was a disturbing lie, because in the context of the words and the way he was communicating, it's very clear. It's very clear he meant to say would.

Jimmy Dore 32:59 It mea- It was s- It was disconcerting to me for a different reason. It was disconcerting to me because it showed that he- they got him to cave.

Joe Rogan 33:06 Yeah, someone talked to him. Someone pulled him aside and said, "Do you understand what the fuck is going on here?"

Jimmy Dore 33:11 By the way, when they go, "Oh, he di- He, uh, Trump contradicted our intelligence communities in public in Helsinki, and that's treason." No, asswipe, that's not treason. The president sets our foreign policy. You're not supposed to contradict the fucking president. Whatever the president says goes. And I hate fucking saying this, 'cause I'm not a fucking fan of Donald Trump, but God damn it, did we all lose our head and think that the unelected spies run our foreign policy? They do not.

Joe Rogan 33:39 Yeah. Spies.

Jimmy Dore 33:40 Spies.

Joe Rogan 33:41 Our spies.

Jimmy Dore 33:41 Unelected.

Joe Rogan 33:42 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 33:44 So ... And the ones who led us into Iraq. Let's not forget that. The very dude ... Anyway. Don't ... Do you ever play that video I played almost weekly on my show of Robert Mueller lying about weapons of mass destruction to Congress to get us into the Iraq War?

Joe Rogan 33:57 Well, he was misinformed at the time.

Jimmy Dore 34:00 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 34:00 He wasn't aware of all the information. And, uh, you know, him along with Colin Powell and many others were-

Jimmy Dore 34:07 Yeah. "They're just good guys who did that bad information."

Joe Rogan 34:09 They're good people. Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 34:09 "Good people. Good people do it in bad."

Joe Rogan 34:11 Those, those no-bid contracts that Halliburton got for billions and billions of dollars is just because they were the right ones for the job. I mean, why have bids when you've got Halliburton and you've got a guy who's really close to Halliburton in Dick Cheney, who used to be the CEO of Halliburton, as the vice president? You got a sweet deal here. Take advantage of it. Get-

Jimmy Dore 34:31 Halliburton gave Dick Cheney a $30 million down payment when he became vice president.

Joe Rogan 34:35 "A little bit of this, a little bit of that."

Jimmy Dore 34:38 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 34:38 "Trying to help you out. Yeah, I know you like to go duck hunting. Give you a nice gun. Don't shoot your friend in the face."

Jimmy Dore 34:44 That's ... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 34:46 I used to do a bit about that too. He shot his friend in the face and his friend apologized.

Jimmy Dore 34:50 And his friend apologized.

Joe Rogan 34:51 Yeah, that's how gangster Dick Cheney is. "Ah, I shouldn't have been there. I look like a bird."

Jimmy Dore 34:55 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 34:57 The whole thing-

Jimmy Dore 34:58 Fucking crazy.

Joe Rogan 34:58 The whole thing was so fucking crazy. You know? Um, we were talking about Alex Jones and how-

Jimmy Dore 35:03 Oh, okay. So he's deemed a platform.

Joe Rogan 35:05 Yeah. I mean, it- it- it seems to be, like, across the board, like, they're- it's almost ... They waited for Apple, it seems like. And when Apple pulled him from iTunes, then, you know, YouTube had danced with it, right? They'd given him some strikes. It was really recently, like within the last couple of months.

Jimmy Dore 35:25 Facebook too.

Joe Rogan 35:26 Yeah. Facebook had given him some strikes and YouTube gave him some strikes and people were like, "Hey." You know, there was some, uh, I, I felt like almost like unfounded, um, speculation that they would remove him from the platform. Like, "They're never gonna remove him. That's crazy. That's too far." And then all of a sudden, boom, everybody in one fell swoop, Spotify ... Did Spotify remove him? They were going to.

Jimmy Dore 35:51 Yes.

Joe Rogan 35:51 They did.

Jimmy Dore 35:52 Right?

Joe Rogan 35:52 iTunes removed him. There's a loophole though that somebody ... I saw an article today where people, like, want nothing but less than total destruction. Uh, I- that Apple, uh, attacked Alex Jones and got rid of him, but they offered him a safety net in the form of the app that he has on their, their app store. That they're still ... So they were trying to take that down too. Like, take down the app.

Jimmy Dore 36:12 Yeah. His- his show became instantly way more popular.

Joe Rogan 36:15 Oh, I'm sure.

Jimmy Dore 36:16 So again, the unintended consequences. I try to tell people-... that, uh, you know, I'm not defending Alex Jones. I'm defending, you know, the principle of freedom of speech. You know, people who are convicted ... of killers who are on death row, they still get their freedom of speech. You're allowed to print articles and they're allowed to have ... You know what I mean? They're still allowed their-

Joe Rogan 36:35 Yeah. Well, he's allowed to, still. I mean, he d- he hasn't been silenced.

Jimmy Dore 36:38 Right.

Joe Rogan 36:38 He has his website.

Jimmy Dore 36:39 But-

Joe Rogan 36:39 He can put his show out on his website.

Jimmy Dore 36:41 Correct.

Joe Rogan 36:41 He can, he can host it from his website and it can all be fine, but these major media companies ... Now, they just decided, "We've had enough. We don't want this on." And here's the thing, like, I don't know what he said that, that they w- that there was a straw that broke the camel's back. It seemed like it's not a recent statement that he said.

Jimmy Dore 37:01 Well, let's just go to the court transcripts and we'll figure out ... Oh, (laughs) there wasn't. There wasn't a court-

Joe Rogan 37:06 Not in no court. No due process. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 37:06 Oh, there was no hearing or nothing? There wasn't a judicial hearing?

Joe Rogan 37:09 No.

Jimmy Dore 37:09 There was no ... Come on. They, they just what? They let some jagoff billionaire in the middle of the night on a whim fucking do this? Is that what happened? Yes.

Joe Rogan 37:17 Do you think that's what it is? That it was some billionaire? Or do you think it's the middle managers and the, the produ- you know, the executives at all these giant tech companies that just decided?

Jimmy Dore 37:27 Um, I don't know. It's, it's definitely, uh ... The government tells Facebook, uh, what to do a lot of times, right?

Joe Rogan 37:35 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 37:35 And so they bow to the government all the time 'cause they don't wanna be regulated.

Joe Rogan 37:39 Right.

Jimmy Dore 37:39 So, uh, that's why they just, they just started having hearings with the ... That's why they had those hearings. "Should we regulate Facebook?"

Joe Rogan 37:46 Right.

Jimmy Dore 37:46 So, the whole-

Joe Rogan 37:46 Those hearings, by the way, were fucking bizarre.

Jimmy Dore 37:50 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:50 It was like a guy pretending to be human.

Jimmy Dore 37:52 Yes. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:53 You know? It was like some sort of a robot or an alien, the way he would sip water. He would take it like this and ... Like, who fucking sips water ... It was like a guy spitting dip into a glass. He would go like this.

Jimmy Dore 38:04 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 38:05 Like, it was the weirdest little sips. Someone should make a compilation of Zuckerberg's sips of water.

Jimmy Dore 38:11 Oh.

Joe Rogan 38:11 It is so strangely-

Jimmy Dore 38:12 Whoever is that guy who makes the compilations of your show, he does a good job. (laughs) He does a funny job on those. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 38:18 This is me. This is my Zuckerberg impression.

Jimmy Dore 38:22 (laughs) Okay.

Joe Rogan 38:24 No, Senator. No, sir. Here, watch this sip.

Jimmy Dore 38:27 Oh.

Joe Rogan 38:27 Watch that sip. Give me another one of those.

Jamie Vernon 38:29 There's a bunch of those.

Joe Rogan 38:29 Oh, there is one.

Jamie Vernon 38:30 There's one right there.

Jimmy Dore 38:30 They have them.

Joe Rogan 38:30 Oh, some of your-

Jamie Vernon 38:31 Yeah. There's a few.

Joe Rogan 38:31 (Laughs) Oh, there's a fucking ... (laughs) There is a drinking water compilation. (laughs)

Jamie Vernon 38:34 Of course there is.

Jimmy Dore 38:35 Oh, my God.

Joe Rogan 38:36 Look at this. Watch him sip. Who fucking sips water like that?

Jimmy Dore 38:39 It's like he has to think about it.

Joe Rogan 38:41 Mm-hmm. Yeah. Act normal. Be human. Humans drink water. Drink the water.

Jimmy Dore 38:45 Look how slowly he tilted that glass. And him and the guy behind him have the same color tie.

Joe Rogan 38:50 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's the guy they're gonna shoot in the head.

Jamie Vernon 38:52 He's keeping eye contact while he's drinking the water. It's kind of weird.

Jimmy Dore 38:55 Yeah.

Jamie Vernon 38:55 He's trying to, at least.

Jimmy Dore 38:59 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 38:59 He doesn't wanna be disrespectful.

Jimmy Dore 39:01 This is fantastic.

Joe Rogan 39:03 So strange. That, that whole thing was so strange. It was so strange.

Jimmy Dore 39:06 Hey, what a better guy to, uh, to kee- to protect us from fake news and tell us what's real news than a ... And, you know, who ... What has integrity and what doesn't than a guy who made a couple billion dollars off a stolen idea from his friends? I mean, I think that's the perfect guy to fak- say it's hard-

Joe Rogan 39:21 Is that the true story? Is that what he actually did?

Jimmy Dore 39:23 (laughs) Yeah, I think so.

Joe Rogan 39:24 That's what was in the movie, right?

Jimmy Dore 39:25 That was in the movie. (laughs) That's what I know.

Joe Rogan 39:26 Yeah. I didn't see the movie.

Jimmy Dore 39:28 Oh, okay.

Joe Rogan 39:28 Yeah. I know the story, though, was that he ripped people off. That it wasn't his idea, but he was the one who figured out a way to wrestle it free ...

Jimmy Dore 39:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:37 And, I don't know, get rich as fuck.

Jimmy Dore 39:39 Uh, but this is ... Matt Taibbi wrote an article on the 2nd, August 2nd, about this, and, um, there's been a lot of people being deplatformed from Facebook that you don't know about.

Joe Rogan 39:51 Like who?

Jimmy Dore 39:52 Like, this isn't like-

Joe Rogan 39:53 Okay.

Jimmy Dore 39:53 Uh, okay. So, um, here's, here's what he s- ... They shut down lots of other sites at the behest of the government in Israel, like the ... And the Atlantic Council. So pages like Black Elevation, they got shut down. A page called Mindful Being, they got shut down. Uh, Facebook also wiped out Know Unite The Right too, which is a page appearing to advertise a counter-rally on the upcoming uni- anniversary of the violence in Charlottesville, so they shut that down too. Matt Taibbi, let me just give you a quick quote from his article. He says, "Facebook was helped in its efforts to wipe out these dangerous memes by the Atlantic Council, on whose board you'll find confidence-inspiring names like Henry Kissinger, CIA Chief Michael Hayden, former acting CIA Head Michael Morell, and former Bush-era Homeland Security Chief Michael Chertoff. These people now have their hands on what is essentially a direct lever over nationwide news distribution. It's hard now to state the potential mischief that lurks behind this union of internet platforms and would-be government censors."

Joe Rogan 40:56 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 40:57 Uh, can I just read you one more p- paragraph?

Joe Rogan 40:59 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 40:59 'Cause this is, this is exactly what we're talking about. He says, "It is already a scandal that these de facto private media regulators have secret algorithmic processes that push down some news organizations in favor of others, which they do."

Joe Rogan 41:12 Which they do.

Jimmy Dore 41:12 "Witness the complaints by outlets like AlterNet, Truthdig and others that big platforms have been deemphasizing alternative sites in the name of combating fake news. But this week's revelation is worse. When Facebook works with the government and want to- wannabe star chamber organizations like the Atlantic Council to delete sites on national security grounds using secret methodology, it opens the door to nightmare possibilities that you'd only find in dystopian novels." So, he goes on, and it's awesome, what he says, but, um-

Joe Rogan 41:43 We would have more comfort if there were ... I mean, there's no ... Like, one of the things that they're doing is they use that blanket term hate speech.Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 41:50 So, by the way ... So, now they're, they're trying to put a bill, have you heard about this in Congress? To make police a protected class of people so if you say shit about them, now it's considered hate speech. Did you know that?

Joe Rogan 42:01 What?

Jimmy Dore 42:01 Yeah, they're trying to make pe- ... Yes.

Joe Rogan 42:03 So "Fuck the police" would be-

Jimmy Dore 42:05 Would be considered hate speech.

Joe Rogan 42:06 ... hate speech? So they would just retroactively arrest NWA?

Jimmy Dore 42:09 They could and-

Joe Rogan 42:10 What about ICE-T? He was a cop killer, remember?

Jimmy Dore 42:11 I ... Right. I-

Joe Rogan 42:12 "I'm a motherfucking cop killer." Remember that?

Jimmy Dore 42:14 And so now if you do have a rally that's against the police, that's a hate rally.

Joe Rogan 42:17 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 42:18 And they can take your YouTube channel down if you said hate stuff about the cops and stuff.

Joe Rogan 42:22 Wow.

Jimmy Dore 42:22 So, so that's where we are. Hate speech, the fuck? How, how come I'm not allowed to hate shit, by the way?

Joe Rogan 42:28 Right.

Jimmy Dore 42:28 I hate Nazis. Can't I say I hate fucking Nazis?

Joe Rogan 42:31 That's hate speech.

Jimmy Dore 42:31 I hate the KKK. Can't I say I hate them?

Joe Rogan 42:33 Th- that's hate speech.

Jimmy Dore 42:34 Right? I-

Joe Rogan 42:35 You strongly dislike the KKK.

Jimmy Dore 42:36 I ... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 42:38 You can strongly dislike something.

Jimmy Dore 42:39 I ... When I was a kid, I hated the fucking Dodgers.

Joe Rogan 42:42 (gasps)

Jimmy Dore 42:42 I know.

Joe Rogan 42:43 Hate speech.

Jimmy Dore 42:43 'Cause I was a Cubs fan and the Dodgers always kicked our ass. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 42:46 Hate speech.

Jimmy Dore 42:47 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 42:47 Yeah, hate speech is a strange blanket term, almost like drugs.

Jimmy Dore 42:51 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 42:51 You know, like, uh, drugs is caffeine, but it's also heroin. You know, it's like, uh, drugs-

Jimmy Dore 42:56 What's wrong with hate?

Joe Rogan 42:56 Hate is-

Jimmy Dore 42:56 I don't understand what ... There's hate out there, so what?

Joe Rogan 42:59 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 42:59 So what's wrong? So, uh, by the way, I'd-

Joe Rogan 43:01 But it's a bad way of expressing things. Like, hate speech is, it's, it's not a good descriptive because-

Jimmy Dore 43:07 I agree.

Joe Rogan 43:08 ... when you, uh, you stop, uh, what does it entail? Like, you know, I had a conversation with a woman, uh, at YouTube about Sam Harris and, um, (phone chimes) uh, Douglas Murray in a podcast where they had had, um, a conversation and someone put it on their YouTube channel in their playlist, just put it in their playlist, and they got a community guidelines strike.

Jimmy Dore 43:29 Oh, my God.

Joe Rogan 43:30 And so I asked, I asked why, and the woman said very cleanly, "It was hate speech." And I said, "What are you talking about?" I go, "Did you listen to it? It was two intellectuals. It was two public intellectuals discru- discussing immigration and some of the problems that Europe is having right now, and you decided that that's hate speech. And you don't even know what they said." But that, but the fact that she so confidently described it in that way sort of, it, it, it sort of embodies what this problem is, is that they have these blanket terms they're able to throw on problems and there's a million other fires to put out, so there's no more need to put any more consideration into this. "This guy's a problem. This is problematic. This is hate speech. Shut it down."

Jimmy Dore 44:10 I ... Uh, if people don't realize how bad it is, Joe. You do, 'cause you know this story-

Joe Rogan 44:15 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 44:15 ... but people go, "Oh, good for Alex Jones. He shouldn't be able to do that's enough, what he's doing. Not good." I'm like, "Do you not understand (laughs) that this is the shot across the bow? That if they can do this to Alex Jones, that they're coming ... I've already been trashed by the establishment media, by the Washington Post, by CNN. I've already been equated to pedophiles and those kind of things, and conspiracy theorist. I've been in articles with Alex Jones, they've done it to me."

Joe Rogan 44:38 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 44:38 It's because I tell the truth about the war.

Joe Rogan 44:41 Right.

Jimmy Dore 44:41 And so, uh, the antidote to bad speech, if you really hate what Alex Jones is doing, the antidote to bad speech is not censorship. The antidote to bad speech is more speech. If you think-

Joe Rogan 44:54 It's good speech, yes.

Jimmy Dore 44:54 If you think what Alex Jones is doing needs to be debunked, create a Facebook page called Debunking Alex Jones and debunk him.

Joe Rogan 45:01 Right.

Jimmy Dore 45:01 You know, Kyle Kulinski does that kind of stuff all the time.

Joe Rogan 45:03 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 45:04 People do that stuff all the time. That's how you conver- ... If you're afraid of an idea, you don't shut down the idea. You expose the idea-

Joe Rogan 45:11 Oh, okay.

Jimmy Dore 45:11 ... and you debunk it.

Joe Rogan 45:12 But if you have a private platform and you own this, you start a business, and your business is, uh, putting up YouTube videos-

Jimmy Dore 45:19 Right.

Joe Rogan 45:19 ... and you decide that someone is putting up something that's hurtful-

Jimmy Dore 45:22 Right.

Joe Rogan 45:22 ... and damaging and racist and it could be used to attack large groups of people, and then you see, like, all, all, all the, the craziness that's been connected to the alt-right movement and you associate that with this individual, do you have to keep that on your platform? I mean, there's no regulation right now.

Jimmy Dore 45:41 No.

Joe Rogan 45:41 It's not like-

Jimmy Dore 45:42 Technic-

Joe Rogan 45:42 ... Public Utilities or-

Jimmy Dore 45:44 Right. It should be, though. That's my point.

Joe Rogan 45:45 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 45:45 My point is that 70% of the people get their news from Google and Facebook, and they're a monopoly, right? So they have monopolistic powers.

Joe Rogan 45:52 70%?

Jimmy Dore 45:53 Yeah, that's, that was a qu- ... That was a stat I read today. So, you can't ... Uh, it's like, well-

Jamie Vernon 45:59 I was reading that, too. I don't know if I believe it.

Jimmy Dore 46:00 Hey, they took-

Jamie Vernon 46:02 It's a stretch.

Jimmy Dore 46:02 Yeah, they took-

Joe Rogan 46:03 Why do you, why do you think it's a stretch?

Jamie Vernon 46:04 That's a lot of ... If it says 45% of the people get it straight from Facebook, that means 150 million people are on Facebook every single day.

Joe Rogan 46:12 Yeah, I think that-

Jamie Vernon 46:13 That's not accurate.

Joe Rogan 46:14 No, but I think that's right. But whether or not-

Jimmy Dore 46:15 But when they get their news-

Jamie Vernon 46:16 We don't. Not three people in this room aren't, so that's-

Joe Rogan 46:18 Hm.

Jamie Vernon 46:18 Three people right here that aren't.

Joe Rogan 46:19 But I get my news from Google.

Jimmy Dore 46:21 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 46:22 Some of it, yeah. But-

Jamie Vernon 46:22 I have that g- I have that Google app on my phone, and every, every day I go to it in the morning when I'm taking a shit and I go over, like- I just did.

Joe Rogan 46:29 ... "What's crazy today? What's happen- ... Oh, new Porsche are coming out. Oh."

Jamie Vernon 46:32 Just put it up, put it in one sentence like that.

Jimmy Dore 46:33 (laughs)

Jamie Vernon 46:33 It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 46:33 What did Sacha Baron Cohen do?

Jamie Vernon 46:35 One sentence is tough.

Joe Rogan 46:36 Well, let's see what they said.

Jamie Vernon 46:37 I, I just looked at it. That's what it said, 45% get it from, from, uh, Facebook. But if you add Google-

Joe Rogan 46:41 But according to, is it a galloping?

Jamie Vernon 46:43 It was according to their stats, and I went back to read another Rolling Stone article to find out where they got that from.

Jimmy Dore 46:47 In Rolling Stone, right? Uh-huh. Yeah. Rolling Stone.

Joe Rogan 46:48 Oh.

Jamie Vernon 46:48 And it's a bunch of, like, uh, Facebook article-selling advertisements.

Joe Rogan 46:53 Mm.

Jamie Vernon 46:53 Trying to find the data.

Jimmy Dore 46:54 So even, uh, even if you quibble with those, you, we can't deny ... Like, Alex Jones cannot now go, "Well, just go to the other YouTube." (laughs) There isn't another YouTube.

Joe Rogan 47:01 There isn't another YouTube.

Jimmy Dore 47:02 "Hey, just go to the other Facebook." There is another ... So we have to recognize that the way we, uh, organize as a society, that the town square is now owned by corporations who, that need to be regulated, right?

Joe Rogan 47:12 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 47:13 Like, if, like, before, you know, when AT&T was the phone carrier for everybody, they couldn't go, "I'm not gonna give Alex Jones a phone service 'cause I don't like the shit he's saying."

Joe Rogan 47:21 Right.

Jimmy Dore 47:21 You can't ... So, you know, we, you can't deny services. Somebody ... All that stuff, so-

Joe Rogan 47:25 But there's ... That's not really a-

Jimmy Dore 47:26 So-

Joe Rogan 47:26 ... a valid comparison because the phone service wasn't distributing information to people.

Jimmy Dore 47:32 Right.

Joe Rogan 47:32 Like, the phone service is just a method of communication. It was just a utility. What, what he's been able to do through, uh, Infowars is, if you've got him on your platform, he's gonna say some things and he's gonna use your platform to say some things that, you know, might not be true and might be crazy. So you gotta decide, like, when does it become a problem? And I think where they drew the line was Sandy Hook.

Jimmy Dore 47:53 So here's what I say, Joe. Uh-... we need to treat these as public utilities because they are, right?

Joe Rogan 47:59 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 47:59 Facebook, there is no alternative. There is an alternative to YouTube. We need to regulate them. Oh, it's long overdue, by the way. And they are monopolies. We ... That's obvious to everyone that they're monopolies, but, you know, when you, when you invent something called WhatsApp and then Facebook buys it for $20 billion (laughs) , there's a monopoly.

Joe Rogan 48:16 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 48:16 There's no way, there's no way to, to compete with these people. So, these are monopolies. They need to be regulated and peoples need to be protected. And it, it ... That's how, that's where we need to go because right now, we're leaving it up to the whims of a billionaire. Like you say, hey, if Alex Jones really did some shit that was wrong and he should be taken off or his free speech should be abridged for it, do it. Let's see a ... Go, go to a court or go to a thing or go ... People go, "Well, he doxes people and he ..." I go, is ... If doxing's illegal, he should be prosecuted. If that's what hap- ... But you shouldn't take away-

Joe Rogan 48:48 Did he dox people? Who'd he dox?

Jimmy Dore 48:49 That's what they're saying. They're saying he's do- ... He'd wanted ... He doxed people from Newtown or whatever, uh, from the school shooting. So that's what they're saying.

Joe Rogan 48:56 Oh, he talked about the individuals and their families?

Jimmy Dore 48:57 That he gave their addresses and their names.

Joe Rogan 48:59 What?

Jimmy Dore 48:59 That's what they're saying, that he doxed them.

Joe Rogan 49:01 Okay, but let's, let's find out if he actually did that 'cause that sounds crazy.

Jimmy Dore 49:05 Yeah. I, I, I'm s- ... I don't know if he did. We-

Joe Rogan 49:06 But they're not saying what he actually did. This is what's crazy. I keep hearing that he, um, promoted the idea that Sandy Hook was, uh, uh, uh, false.

Jimmy Dore 49:17 False.

Joe Rogan 49:17 Was false, and that it was a false flag and that these were all actors.

Jimmy Dore 49:22 Right.

Joe Rogan 49:22 I don't know if he actually said that. I think what he actually said was, "I don't know if that happened." I think that's what he actually said.

Jimmy Dore 49:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 49:31 And people are saying, "Well, that's promoting the idea that, that it was a hoax." Um-

Jimmy Dore 49:35 So am I. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 49:36 But I wanna know if that's what he really said. See, I don't know if that's even the case 'cause I've heard it t- ... I've heard it written that he promoted the idea that Sandy Hook was a conspiracy, but I ... They're not quoting. When they say that, there's no quotes. There's no, "Sandy H- Hook was a hoax. Those kids were actors. Those kids are not dead." I don't see that anywhere.

Jimmy Dore 49:56 Right.

Joe Rogan 49:57 But they keep attributing that to him without quotations.

Jimmy Dore 50:00 But again, if this, i- if there was some kind of process, due process-

Joe Rogan 50:03 Right.

Jimmy Dore 50:04 ... we could go back and look at the transcript and we would know this.

Joe Rogan 50:06 Not only that, not only that. If during this whole time-

Jimmy Dore 50:08 (chuckles) .

Joe Rogan 50:08 ... where he's being tried, he was still able to be on YouTube and have his videos, he could show in his videos that he didn't say that. He could show what he actually said and s- tell you what he actually said and show clips. He can't do that anymore. So, now, the narrative is completely in the hands of the mainstream media, 100%. So, the Alex Jones narrative is being taken 100% out of his hands, and now, it's in the mainstream media. And now, they're s- "Sandy Hook denier, conspiracy theorist, right-wing lunatic," all these different things, which may or m- you know, some of it. I mean, Alex, pretty fucking nuts, but-

Jimmy Dore 50:43 My, my, my point is, uh, we've had nuts people with ... They still have that ... When I was a kid, Joe, maybe you remember, Johnny Carson used to go ap- apeshit about The National Enquirer.

Joe Rogan 50:53 Yes, yes.

Jimmy Dore 50:53 Do you remember that?

Joe Rogan 50:53 Yes, yes.

Jimmy Dore 50:53 And it was a big deal.

Joe Rogan 50:55 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 50:55 He would stop his show and, "I'm putting my foot down about this."

Joe Rogan 50:58 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 50:58 They still have The National ... And, and nobody said, "Take it out of the supermarkets." Nobody was like, "We gotta ban that newspaper because we can't handle the ideas from this newspaper." No, they're still right there. You go to Ralph's, they're right there.

Joe Rogan 51:08 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 51:08 They're the last thing you see before they leave. They're right at the eye level for kids.

Joe Rogan 51:11 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 51:12 Nobody w- says, "Take away The National Enquirer." I went to Facebook. They still have a Facebook page, Na- National Enquirer.

Joe Rogan 51:17 Do they?

Jimmy Dore 51:17 Yes! So does the World News Daily. And you know what the first news, news story was that came up on World News Dailies?

Joe Rogan 51:23 Alien babies?

Jimmy Dore 51:23 Was, uh, a, uh, "A British man can only defecate through his mouth." That was the first story-

Joe Rogan 51:28 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 51:28 ... that came up. The first story! And you don't have to look for it. "British man defecates through his mouth." I'm like, geez, this is, this is like South Park.

Joe Rogan 51:35 Right.

Jimmy Dore 51:36 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 51:36 Yeah. And it's not like you want them to be taken down as well.

Jimmy Dore 51:40 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:40 But it's ... What's interesting is, like, World Nudes Daily and Star Magazine and all those, they've sort of been ... They're a joke. Like, you know it's not real. You know The Enquirer's not real. We, we know that. But it's not ... It's, it's just implied-

Jimmy Dore 51:51 Somebody's buying those. Somebody's buying those.

Joe Rogan 51:53 Right. But are they buy- ... Are they, are they kinda buying them just for fun, entertainment?

Jimmy Dore 51:56 Somebody wa- ... Somebody watches professional wrestling.

Joe Rogan 51:58 Here it goes. Lawsuit quotes Jones saying s- ... "Yeah, so Sandy Hook is a synthetic, completely fake ... Is, is a thin- synthetic, completely fake with actors, in my view, manufactured." Okay.

Jamie Vernon 52:14 I would show the video, but I got taken off YouTube.

Joe Rogan 52:14 January ... Right. January 13th, 2015, the lawsuit quotes Jones saying, "Yeah, so Sandy ..." Yeah, so Sandy Hook is a synthetic, completely fake with actors.

Jimmy Dore 52:27 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 52:28 In my view, manufactured. Um, yeah.

Jimmy Dore 52:33 You, uh ... You actually nail that impression.

Joe Rogan 52:35 I spent a lot of time with that dude drunk.

Jimmy Dore 52:37 There's a ... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 52:38 He's, um ... That's-

Jimmy Dore 52:39 Like that's-

Joe Rogan 52:39 That's a real problem, saying something like that is crazy. But he's, he's ... Look, he, his whole business is saying things that are sometimes right and saying things that are sometimes absolutely wrong. You know? And, and-

Jimmy Dore 52:53 I, and yeah.

Joe Rogan 52:54 ... that's, and it's all wild and it's all globalists. And you ever see that song that they did where these guys took his actual words and rants, but then they have, like, this, like, emo song, singing the words?

Jimmy Dore 53:07 No, I haven't.

Joe Rogan 53:07 It's fucking genius. Would we get pulled over ... Off of YouTube if we play that? Let's find out if we get yanked for this one 'cause it's brilliant. 'Cause it's, it's a parody, but it's so, it's so-

Jamie Vernon 53:17 Is it indie folk song?

Joe Rogan 53:18 Yeah.

Jamie Vernon 53:19 You said emo song and if there's two.

Joe Rogan 53:20 Indie folk, emo. Just, you know, some low testosterone music.

Jamie Vernon 53:24 Make sure it's the right one.

Jimmy Dore 53:24 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 53:25 Pl- pl- listen to this. Listen to this. Listen to this.

Jamie Vernon 53:28 Okay.

Joe Rogan 53:28 That's why we're just out here doing simple things pointing out that we're meant to be in nature and be natural. And this is where we find the source that God made to transcend the new world order. And that's why they wanna try to keep us out of it. Watch this.

Jimmy Dore 53:39 (singing) I'm angry. I've had enough of these people.

Joe Rogan 53:46 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 53:47 They're a bunch of Christian murderous scum. They run giant death factories keeping babies alive.

Jamie Vernon 53:52 This might get us pulled off YouTube if you take this audio out.

Joe Rogan 53:54 What?

Jamie Vernon 53:54 Take the audio out.

Joe Rogan 53:55 Oh, you're taking the audio off?

Jamie Vernon 53:57 'Cause a lot of you-

Speaker 53:58 Alex Jones' rants as an indie folk song for people that are just listening to this. You gotta Google this 'cause we removed the sound from YouTube.

Jimmy Dore 54:08 Oh, okay.

Speaker 54:10 Babies.

Jimmy Dore 54:11 (laughs)

Speaker 54:11 We wanna eat babies.

Jimmy Dore 54:13 (laughs)

Speaker 54:13 We love Satan, we wanna eat babies. I have them on video.

Jimmy Dore 54:16 (laughs)

Speaker 54:16 That's just what you just said. "I have Hillary Clinton on video." (laughs) Look at his face. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 54:26 (laughs)

Speaker 54:44 Listen to this. Oh, Obama and Hillary both smell like sulfur. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 54:54 (laughs)

Speaker 54:54 It's his song. Literal vampire pot-belly goblins. (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 55:04 (Laughs) Come on.

Speaker 55:06 Oh. Oh my God. Ah. Ah!

Jimmy Dore 55:11 Ah!

Speaker 55:14 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 55:15 (laughs)

Speaker 55:19 Uh, you know, I think there's something, there's something about his struggle right now that's representative of the, the chaotic world that we live in. That, that he does have this giant voice, then he does has, have this giant following, and that it is this, this, his actual words come out in song like that and are so hysterical. And that they think that somehow or another, yanking this guy off all these platforms is gonna like, remove it.

Jimmy Dore 55:51 (laughs)

Speaker 55:52 Do, do they understand the Streisand effect? 'Cause this is just gonna, it's, there's gonna be another way. But here's the thing-

Jimmy Dore 55:57 What's the Streisand effect?

Speaker 55:58 Barbra Streisand had a house in Malibu, this giant ass house and they took pictures of it, and she went ape shit. And you know, complained to all these, you know, newspapers and complained to the police and everything that they're taking photos of her house and, "Get the fuck out of here. This is, I'm Barbra Streisand." And because of that, it became a giant story.

Jimmy Dore 56:16 Oh.

Speaker 56:16 That Barbra Streisand is pissed that someone's showing her house. And they're like, "Well, it must be a hell of a house. Where is it?" And then, there it is.

Jimmy Dore 56:22 Ah.

Speaker 56:22 The Streisand effect is a phenomenon, there's the house, (laughs) where, whereby an attempt to hide, remove or censor a piece of information-

Jimmy Dore 56:29 Oh.

Speaker 56:29 ... has the unintended consequence of publicizing the information more wildly, usually facilitated by the internet.

Jimmy Dore 56:35 Okay.

Speaker 56:35 Yeah. They wanna eat babies.

Jimmy Dore 56:39 (laughs) No, I thought you guys-

Speaker 56:39 Ah. Ah! Ah!

Jimmy Dore 56:45 (laughs)

Speaker 56:46 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 56:46 But on pr- Again, people are, make, make the false que- "Oh, you're defending Alex Jones." I'm not defending.

Speaker 56:51 You're defending free speech.

Jimmy Dore 56:52 I'm defending free speech and I understand the argument that, hey, it's a private corporation. I get that.

Speaker 56:58 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 56:58 I get that. But if you took a look at the bigger picture, these should be, everyone thinks the internet should be a public utility. I mean, most people do.

Speaker 57:06 Right.

Jimmy Dore 57:06 And that's what they're upset, that they're not treating it like a public utility. Obama administration did. They decided to at the last minute.

Speaker 57:12 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 57:13 And so if you think the internet should be a public utility, I s- I think YouTube and Facebook should be a public utility also. And-

Speaker 57:20 But there's, there, there's an opening for other people to make their own YouTube. Like, make a version of it. If you have-

Jimmy Dore 57:27 But what happens when-

Speaker 57:27 ... sufficient capital.

Jimmy Dore 57:29 But you don't. And there's a man, if you do start it, they'll just buy you out, like the, like I just showed you the example-

Speaker 57:34 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 57:34 ... of WhatsApp with the-

Speaker 57:35 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 57:35 They gave you 20, nine, what, $19 billion or whatever they paid. But it was some crazy. So that's how they just eat up their competition. So right now, we need a Teddy Roosevelt to come along and break up all these monopolies. It's never gonna happen. Uh, the end of the empire is coming.

Speaker 57:47 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 57:47 So here's the question. Like, is there a, a valid parallel, a valid comparison? Like, are there people that have things that are more hateful that are on YouTube that haven't been deplatformed? Is it the influence that he has that, that's terrifying? Is it the fact that he's a figurehead for this kind of stuff? Is that what it is? Like, that he's the, this whole Infowars movement is, in some people's mind, a figurehead for this pro-Trump thing they're trying to stop and silence? Like, what is it?

Speaker 58:21 I don't know. It's very curious that it all happened at the same time, right? And because, uh, there's a, there's a, um, in 1996, there was a law passed that actually, um, insulates the platforms from being sued. Did you know that? So like-

Jimmy Dore 58:36 The platform. So if someone puts up something-

Speaker 58:38 So if, and so like say he puts something up that leads to someone getting killed, right, on YouTube.

Jimmy Dore 58:42 YouTube, okay, can't get in trouble.

Speaker 58:43 You can't sue, you can't sue YouTube.

Jimmy Dore 58:44 Right.

Speaker 58:44 You can't sue Facebook for it. That's in that 1996 law. Um, so there's that. So I get that they're a private company, but again, they have to have the protection now of the law.

Jimmy Dore 58:54 Right.

Speaker 58:54 They have Congress protecting them. So they have a certain, that's a certain, that's a type of regulation. You're regulated from, you can't sue them.

Jimmy Dore 59:01 Yeah.

Speaker 59:01 Right? So I'm looking for this tweet by Glenn Greenwald that really, because if we're gonna take down, uh... Here, I'll find it. I'll find it. Um, here it is. He says, um, "There's been a tactic of censors for centuries. They start with someone who is so utterly hated and marginalized that everyone is blinded by their hatred for the first censorship target, that they cheer and forget that they're endorsing a principle and power that will then expand."

Jimmy Dore 59:32 Yeah.

Speaker 59:33 And so right now, we're-

Jimmy Dore 59:34 First they came for the Jews.

Speaker 59:35 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 59:36 That's it.

Speaker 59:36 Right now, we're allowing, uh, the whim of billionaires in the middle of the night to decide who gets to be on these monopolistic platforms and who doesn't.

Jimmy Dore 59:43 Yeah.

Speaker 59:44 If there was 10 YouTubes, uh, no one would care.

Jimmy Dore 59:46 Right.

Speaker 59:46 But there isn't. There's one YouTube, there's one Facebook. And they are monopolies and that's the world we live in right now. And that's why they're doing whatever the government wants them to because they don't want the government to regulate them. That's why he went there and was sipping the water like that and try- trying to make eye to- contact and be nice 'cause he doesn't want them to regulate him. He'll do it for, I'll do... Julian Assange, in 2010, gave a speech which I saw recently on a plane where he predicted this. He was like, "The corporations are an extension of the government and they will do the censorship in the future." And that's exactly what's happening right now. So do you think it's the government that's censoring Alex Jones? 'Cause I would think that the government that's in power currently would wanna keep Alex Jones in position 'cause he's a supporter of Trump. He's a supporter of, you, you know-

Jimmy Dore 1:00:26 ... why does- so why does- why is Trump going after Julian Assange? Is it because he's afraid he'll expose him someday?

Joe Rogan 1:00:31 I don't know.

Jimmy Dore 1:00:32 Why is he allowing the CIA to do that, to go after Julian Assange? And, you know, that just shows you how shitty the journalists are in America, because not one of them are standing up for Julian Assange. And they're all pretending that when Trump says mean things about Jim Acosta, that somehow that's this unbelievable d- vi- violation of our freedom of speech and our press. And he's got... You son of a bitch. You don't care... If you cared about freedom of the press, you would say something about Julian Assange, and no one is saying... What lie has Julian Assange ever printed? Na- never-

Joe Rogan 1:01:01 Nothing that they can prove.

Jimmy Dore 1:01:02 Never. What did Julian Assange do? He revealed that our election was being rigged by the Democratic Party. Not Russia, but by the Democratic Party. And that is a sin you can't commit. You cannot tell the truth about the powerful. And that's what's happening right now. And, uh, you know, he, he revealed the CIA in, in, um, has all those spying techniques. That they can get your TV to listen to you, your phone.

Joe Rogan 1:01:26 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:01:26 Uh, Vault 7, all that stuff. They, he revealed. That's why they want to get him. But I... And Trump, you know, I just think that Trump is just, you know... He's not really clued in, right? He lets other... He's glad to let the generals do the job and his f- underlings. He doesn't really wanna... He wants to paint broad strokes and lets everyone... "You wanna kill Julian Assange? Go ahead, I don't give a F." That's, I think, how he feels. I don't think it's his plan to do it, but everybody else underneath him wants to. And certainly the intelligence community. And everyone forgets this. Chuck Schumer went on Rachel Maddow's show like two years ago and right out in public said that Trump is making a mistake by crossing the intelligence community because when you mess with them, they have six ways to Sunday to mess with you back. Holy shit. And nobody cared that he said that? So what he's saying is the president should be afraid of unelected spooks, unelected bureaucrats. These, they should be af- he should be afraid of them. That is... And no one went, "What? What the F?" Could you imagine saying that about Barack Obama? "Hey, Barack Obama better be nice to the CIA or they're gonna F with him."

Joe Rogan 1:02:25 As an elected official, yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:02:26 Yes. That's-

Joe Rogan 1:02:27 Someone... An elected official saying that alm- almost sanctioning it.

Jimmy Dore 1:02:30 Yes. And then we have Eugene Robinson in The Washington Post writing an article begging the deep state to undermine, uh, Trump's foreign policy.

Joe Rogan 1:02:38 (sighs)

Jimmy Dore 1:02:38 Did you see that article?

Joe Rogan 1:02:40 No. That's crazy.

Jimmy Dore 1:02:41 Yes. Pulitzer Prize winner. First they spend all their life denying there is a deep state, and then Eugene Robinson writes an article begging the deep state to defy President Bu- uh, President Trump. And-

Joe Rogan 1:02:51 Why are they so blinded by ideology that they don't see the consequences of this?

Jimmy Dore 1:02:55 There's unintended consequences, and here they are. And by... They're coming at... They've already come for me. They're already coming for the left.They're... This is how, this is how this works. So, again, that's why I tell... I warn all my friends about the Russiagate nonsense. Chomsky said, "If you care about the people meddling in our election, Russia would be the last place I would look." The first place to look is concentrated capital. That's what d- dictates who are gonna be our government. That's why we don't have the things the rest of the world has, because we have a cr- cap- capital has captured our government, which is why we don't have F- Medicare for all, which is why we don't have free college, which is why we don't have an infrastructure plan, which is why we're in eight wars. Meanwhile, people, half the country's poor or low-income. 63% of the country can't afford a $1,000 emergency, and a quarter of all kids are in poverty. In the richest country in the world. Joe, what do you call a system that takes the richest country in the world and renders half of its population poor or low-income? That's a failed fucking system. And that's what we're living in right now. And it's failing worldwide.

Joe Rogan 1:03:55 Now, wh- if you were someone like Google, though, or, uh, who owns YouTube, or if you were iTunes or any of these platforms, Spotify. When you get an overwhelming volume of complaints about someone who's in the news right now... Because the fact that Alex Jones is being sued by the Sandy Hook parents, this is what started this all off. 'Cause, I mean-

Jimmy Dore 1:04:19 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:04:19 ... to people, this is so egregious. These poor parents lost their children, and here's this guy-

Jimmy Dore 1:04:25 Yes. It's horrible.

Joe Rogan 1:04:25 ... saying that it's fake and that they don't want that on their platform. So, would you think that they should just delete the episode that has that, that says that? Should they do that or should they allow that episode to stream?

Jimmy Dore 1:04:38 No. They should... I- so, uh, here's- there's a solution. If- if there's- if he did do something in a video that i- is illegal-

Joe Rogan 1:04:47 Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 1:04:48 ... uh, take that video down until it gets adjudicated.

Joe Rogan 1:04:51 Hmm.

Jimmy Dore 1:04:52 You don't de-platform them 100... You don't give them the death penalty.

Joe Rogan 1:04:55 Right. So, okay, what about, like, Stormfront? What if you got some white supremacist group that's calling for violence against people? You- do you take them down?

Jimmy Dore 1:05:04 I think you would... Again, you would have to... I would like to see some kind of adjudication. You know? Again, I, uh-

Joe Rogan 1:05:09 Well, the blanket policy is things- saying things like hate speech. The problem with that is like-

Jimmy Dore 1:05:13 Right. Again, it's all interpretation. And back just a week ago, Mark Zuckerberg was defending it. He was defending that-

Joe Rogan 1:05:18 Yes.

Jimmy Dore 1:05:18 ... we have Holocaust deniers on our platform.

Joe Rogan 1:05:20 Right. Yes.

Jimmy Dore 1:05:20 Holocaust deniers, Joe.

Joe Rogan 1:05:21 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:05:21 And that's not fake news?

Joe Rogan 1:05:23 Right.

Jimmy Dore 1:05:23 That's not gonna... You're not gonna take that down? Like I just told you, they have guys defecating out of their mouth. They have the-

Joe Rogan 1:05:28 (laughs)

Jimmy Dore 1:05:29 They have the- the- the National Enquirer. They're still cool.

Joe Rogan 1:05:33 Yeah. Right.

Jimmy Dore 1:05:33 So this is a very squiggly line, Joe. And again, there's- there's no board. There's no adjudication. It's not transparent. And that's the-

Joe Rogan 1:05:39 It's not transparent. It's not rational either. This is not a rational debate.

Jimmy Dore 1:05:43 Uh, let me just... The sheer... Let me just give you one more thing about what he says. "When, uh-"

Joe Rogan 1:05:48 Who- who said it?

Jimmy Dore 1:05:49 This is Matt Taibbi. He says, "The sheer market power of these companies over information flow has always been the real threat. This is why breaking them up should have long ago become a national priority. Instead, as was obvious during the Senate hearing with Mark Zuckerberg earlier this year, politicians are more interested in using than curtailing the power of these companies. The platform, for their part, will cave rather than be regulated. The end game here couldn't be clearer. This is how authoritarian marriages begin, and people should be very worried."

Joe Rogan 1:06:22 They should be worried. They should be worried, especially if this does escalate. I- I- I understand that people who...... believe that he's a Sandy Hook denier and they read those words, they don't want him to have a platform, they don't want him to be able to spread that hate. They understa- I understand that they would feel like, imagine being one of those parents and you lost your kid and you're- you're- you're seeing this guy on TV or on YouTube saying it's all fake. It's- it's outrageous and it's repulsive.

Jimmy Dore 1:06:50 I agree.

Joe Rogan 1:06:51 And it- and it's offensive. And I get that. But I think it's- it's- it's very dangerous, it's very dangerous to silence people that may or may not have any other recourse, in terms of, like, he doesn't have the ability to defend himself, he doesn't have the ability to make a video about it, unless he puts it on his own website and then who's gonna watch it? Like, there's ... The stuff that they're doing with YouTube, it's just ... I- it's a slippery slope. You know? And especially when they use these terms like hate speech. They're not ... Like, when you say, like, what are they saying? They're saying that he violated their terms, correct?

Jimmy Dore 1:07:33 Yes.

Joe Rogan 1:07:34 So what did- what are those terms that he violated and what is the specific violation? Like, what are the words that he said where you were like, "Enough is enough"? If that's the case, how did you let him get away with saying all this other shit for years and years? And w- when- when do you draw this line? Like, just that video that we played. You know, they smell like sulfur, they eat e- they wanna eat babies, they're screaming, "I love Satan," and they wanna eat babies. (laughs) Like, whoa. W- where does the line get drawn? I just ... I don't- I don't think ... I don't think that should be up to subjectivity. I think that should be a- a very, very hard question that's answered with very clear facts.

Jimmy Dore 1:08:12 Y- you should have an adversarial judicial process with an impartial judge or jury.

Joe Rogan 1:08:17 Right. And how would you even get someone impartial? Instead they have in-house deci- decisions.

Jimmy Dore 1:08:22 Right. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:08:23 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:08:23 Well, you heard the ... I mean, you heard Matt Taibbi just delineate the people who are involved in this stuff. And by the way, Facebook's taken down pages of people who are Palestinians because the Israeli Government tells them to and they do it.

Joe Rogan 1:08:33 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jimmy Dore 1:08:33 So you know about that, right?

Joe Rogan 1:08:35 I had heard about that.

Jimmy Dore 1:08:36 Yes.

Joe Rogan 1:08:36 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:08:37 So they're ... That's them doing the bidding. The government says, "Take it down?" "Okay, I'll take it down." Oh, they don't get free speech? Okay, 'cause I don't want the government to get mad at me.

Joe Rogan 1:08:44 Yeah.

Jimmy Dore 1:08:44 'Cause we're making so much goddamn money right now, I don't want the government to get mad at us. That's what Facebook and YouTube is doing.

Joe Rogan 1:08:49 See, if ... I would like that if someone ... You know, I'm not saying that no one should be taken down. If someone's calling for the death of all Black people and, like, maybe this- it's not a good place to give them a platform. But I feel like the problem that I'm having with this is these things like, air quotes, "hate speech." Because I