Joe Rogan Experience #1156 - Jimmy Dore

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   In four, three, two,…

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:03

      In four, three, two, one. Hey, Jimmy.

   2. JDJimmy Dore0:09

      (laughs)

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:09

      What's up? (laughs)

   4. JDJimmy Dore0:11

      (laughs) Hi, Joe. How you doing, buddy?

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:12

      I'm doing good. Now we're on the radio.

   6. JDJimmy Dore0:14

      Fantastic. It's 3:31.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      All right.

   8. JDJimmy Dore0:16

      Uh, 29 minutes before four o'clock.

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:18

      Here's Val with the weather.

   10. JDJimmy Dore0:19

       (laughs) Hot, hot as fuck.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:21

       Back to you, Jimmy.

   12. JDJimmy Dore0:22

       So, Val, so, uh, we got a car fire in the breakdown lane.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:25

       So you were getting emotional in the green room-

   14. JDJimmy Dore0:28

       Oh.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       ... listening to Henry Rollins talk about Putin. You were about to quote Chomsky. Like, what-

   16. JDJimmy Dore0:32

       Yes.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:32

       What was that?

   18. JDJimmy Dore0:33

       So he was, uh, I just caught the end of it. I s- went in the green room and I, like, you know, everybody loves Henry Rollins, right? And, um-

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:39

       'Cept Henry. (laughs)

   20. JDJimmy Dore0:41

       (laughs) Oh, yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:41

       That's why he's so good.

   22. JDJimmy Dore0:42

       (Laughs) Maybe that, maybe.

   23. JRJoe Rogan0:43

       He's, he's constantly grinding, you know?

   24. JDJimmy Dore0:45

       Yeah, but he was doing that thing about, uh, oh, Putin, you know, there was a journalist who wrote a book about him, ended up dead.

   25. JRJoe Rogan0:51

       Mm-hmm.

   26. JDJimmy Dore0:51

       Putin's a bad guy. He's a bad guy. As opposed to who? (wheezes)

   27. JRJoe Rogan0:55

       Well, no, but he, you, you mean he's definitely a bad guy, right? We all agree to that.

   28. JDJimmy Dore0:59

       Yeah. Who, of course.

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:00

       Yes, but, I mean, just because other people are also-

   30. JDJimmy Dore1:03

       (laughs)
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   Right. …

   1. JDJimmy Dore15:00

      a nuclear power. I want Trump to be friends with anybody. We need detente, you know. NATO is the one wrapping up tensions, ramping up tensions with, uh, Russia, and we have ever since the Cold War supposedly ended. And so, you know, it was just a f- anyways, so I- I- I just think, yes, Putin is a bad guy. They're all bad guys.

   2. JRJoe Rogan15:18

      Right.

   3. JDJimmy Dore15:18

      There's, why ... I, you know, I just had John Kiriakou on my show, I don't know if you-

   4. JRJoe Rogan15:22

      Who is he?

   5. JDJimmy Dore15:22

      So he is a ex-CIA guy, he went to prison because he exposed a torture program.

   6. JRJoe Rogan15:26

      Oh.

   7. JDJimmy Dore15:27

      Yeah. So Robert Mueller actually prosecuted that guy.

   8. JRJoe Rogan15:30

      Whoa.

   9. JDJimmy Dore15:31

      So now he's s- he's a member of Veterans Intelligence Professionals for Sanity, VIPS. And they were, uh, th- they were invented or they were originally organized to debunk the weapons of mass destruction about Iraq. So they were, uh, intelligence professionals who knew what was happening, that this ... We were being sold a bill of goods because the military industrial complex wanted its war, right?

   10. JRJoe Rogan15:52

       Yeah.

   11. JDJimmy Dore15:52

       And so they s- they were, like, all the top guys, Ray McGovern, Bill Binney, and they'd, and they, uh, created this organization to help debunk it. Well, no-

   12. JRJoe Rogan16:00

       Bill Binney is the guy who was the first whistleblower for the NSA, correct?

   13. JDJimmy Dore16:04

       Yes. That they tried to throw ... And the FBI tried to throw him in jail, and, of course, he's the smartest guy the NSA ever had, so he outsmarted the FBI.

   14. JRJoe Rogan16:11

       Well, how did he do that?

   15. JDJimmy Dore16:12

       So he had-

   16. JRJoe Rogan16:12

       I forget the story, but he-

   17. JDJimmy Dore16:13

       I forget the story. He told it to me, but they, he had them secretly recorded-

   18. JRJoe Rogan16:17

       Mm-hmm.

   19. JDJimmy Dore16:17

       ... saying certain things. And so when they tried to, th- uh, to show the evidence against him, he's like, "Actually, I got you guys." And they're like-

   20. JRJoe Rogan16:24

       Yeah.

   21. JDJimmy Dore16:24

       ... "Oh, shit." And so they couldn't ... So he had them, so he outsmarted them. And he tells the story on my show. Uh, you know, it was about a year ago, so I don't remember exactly how it went. But he told me a lot of mind-blowing stuff on my show, a lot of stuff. Just, um, you know, like about how they spy on us. (laughs)

   22. JRJoe Rogan16:40

       Well, he was the one that first exposed this program that was essentially spying on every single email, every-

   23. JDJimmy Dore16:45

       Yeah.

   24. JRJoe Rogan16:45

       ... single voicemail. Every single conversation that you have is being recorded.

   25. JDJimmy Dore16:49

       So William Binney invented a thing called ThinThread. So ThinThread was, uh, a data collection. So what he did is he hooked up every cell phone to every cell phone i- in the, in the universe. It's, uh ... And he did it. And it was hard to do, and everybody said, "You couldn't do it." He did it. And so he knew that metadata wa- was more predictive than, say, if I tap your phone and listen to your actual phone conversation, that I actually learn more by looking at a larger data set. And when, and when contacts start happening, that means movement's happening, that means an attack is gonna happen, that means more ... So if the metadata means more ... And so he found a way to track people and keep your identity secret, so it was constitutional.

   26. JRJoe Rogan17:31

       Oh.

   27. JDJimmy Dore17:32

       That's what he cared about, the Constitution and the right to privacy. And ThinThread did that. It was a better ... And th- and they got rid of ThinThread, and a couple weeks later, 9/11 happened.So that's, what Bill... So that's who Bill Binney is. And so he said they got rid of it because there's billions of dollars in the new pro... They brought in a, uh, uh, uh, a m- I think it was called Trailblazer out... And not as good as a, a tracker, not as good as a metadata thing. And, but it was, you know, five, six billion dollars to Booz Allen or whoever invented it. And that's what this is all about. This is all about money, and you don't wanna disappoint people who wanna have a lot of money paid their way.

   28. JRJoe Rogan18:07

       Mm-hmm.

   29. JDJimmy Dore18:08

       And then, so that's what... So he blew the whistle on that and they come back at him and they try to put (laughs) him in jail. That's what they do to whistleblowers. That's what we do. So that's funny to hear him say, "Oh, well, somebody wrote a bad book about Putin and they ended up dead." What do you think we do in this country? Look what they did to Chelsea Manning. Look what we did to people who exposed war crimes inside of our country. Right now, we're trying, they're trying to assassinate Julian Assange. They have him in basically solitary confinement. We literally did torture Chelsea Manning. So, uh, and then, you know, Barack Obama used, uh, uh, he- he prosecuted lots of whistleblowing journalists using the... Now I'm blanking on the word it's called, but, um, Espionage Act. So this idea that, yeah, I'm sure Putin, maybe Putin didn't... Maybe that woman who wrote that book about Putin has a lot of powerful enemies. Usually you do when you are that kind of a journalist where you're exposing the powerful. She probably didn't just expose Putin, so she probably exposed a lot of people. My point being is that, uh, you know, now who's being naive, Joe?

   30. JRJoe Rogan19:06

       Well, I mean, she probably did expose a lot of people, but it's also very likely that Putin had her killed.
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   He told everybody to…

   1. JRJoe Rogan30:00

      waste? Like, what is he saying?

   2. JDJimmy Dore30:01

      He told everybody to vote for Hillary. He told ... I mean, he's not starting a third party. And, you know, his whole life he was like, he said that we have to have ... The, the, the verbiage he used one time I saw him was that, uh-You know, uh, Jesse Jackson's correct, we need, we need a rainbow coalition of people. Uh, but it has to happen outside of the Democratic Party. He said that. That was him. So we have to have a progressive coalition, but it has to happen outside. And who better to lead it but Bernie Sanders? So that's why it's hard to start a third party, because you need people who are already pop- famous and popular and, uh, in government. So if he left and he got, say, Tulsi Gabbard and Nina Turner and Ale- Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, and you got a bunch of people that are super popular on the left, we'd have a third party at- that would be polling at 10%, 15%. And now the Democrats would have to join- form a coalition, instead of what they're doing now, which is ignoring progressives. After she, uh, cheated Bernie Sanders, after the Democrats cheated Bernie Sanders in the primary, Hillary Clinton didn't choose Bernie Sanders as her vice president, as a olive branch. She didn't choose Elizabeth Warren as an olive branch. She went to her right. She got Tim Kaine, who's to the right of her, who's-

   3. JRJoe Rogan31:11

      Yeah.

   4. JDJimmy Dore31:11

      ... anti-union who's every bad thing you want in a corporate Democrat. He's pro-wall, the whole deal. She went ... So just ... So if we had a third party that actually polled at 10% or 15%, they would have to, they couldn't do that anymore. They'd have to, they'd have to do a thing called, Joe, voter outreach instead of voter shaming or what it's devolved to now, which is democracy shaming. They're literally shaming people for participating in democracy. "You don't get to participate in democracy because you're a third party." Well, fuck you. That's called democracy and so- "Yes, I do. And I get to vote my conscience." And we'll be right back.

   5. JRJoe Rogan31:45

      Aah!

   6. JDJimmy Dore31:47

      (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan31:47

      That's a good break. That's a good ad break right there.

   8. JDJimmy Dore31:49

      (laughs)

   9. JRJoe Rogan31:49

      That's solid. If you run a radio show, that would be the way to go.

   10. JDJimmy Dore31:52

       (laughs)

   11. JRJoe Rogan31:52

       Hey, one of the reasons why we came in today is 'cause we wanted to talk about the Alex Jones situation. Um, I know you were, uh, not just a vocal critic of Alex Jones, you spit in his face on, on live internet.

   12. JDJimmy Dore32:03

       Joe, I did not spit in his face. That was-

   13. JRJoe Rogan32:05

       You did something.

   14. JDJimmy Dore32:05

       ... completely involuntary. (laughs)

   15. JRJoe Rogan32:08

       He coughed and liquid came out of your mouth and it got him right in the face.

   16. JDJimmy Dore32:11

       As you know, Alex Jones is hilarious. There's no doubt.

   17. JRJoe Rogan32:13

       Yeah.

   18. JDJimmy Dore32:13

       There's no denying that.

   19. JRJoe Rogan32:15

       He's occasionally very hilarious. Yeah, yeah.

   20. JDJimmy Dore32:18

       Yes. And I, I told you what happened. I was walking up-

   21. JRJoe Rogan32:20

       Yeah.

   22. JDJimmy Dore32:20

       ... he's having this ... They're just about to go fisticuffs the whole time.

   23. JRJoe Rogan32:23

       Yeah.

   24. JDJimmy Dore32:24

       And, uh, as I walk up, he goes, "Hey, I'm just trying to be nice."

   25. JRJoe Rogan32:27

       (laughs) And you had a spit take.

   26. JDJimmy Dore32:27

       And I had a mouthful of iced tea, and that was that.

   27. JRJoe Rogan32:30

       I understand.

   28. JDJimmy Dore32:30

       That's my story, I'm sticking to it.

   29. JRJoe Rogan32:31

       Good story.

   30. JDJimmy Dore32:32

       (laughs)
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   Right. …

   1. JDJimmy Dore45:00

      and debunk him.

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:01

      Right.

   3. JDJimmy Dore45:01

      You know, Kyle Kulinski does that kind of stuff all the time.

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:03

      Yeah.

   5. JDJimmy Dore45:04

      People do that stuff all the time. That's how you conver- ... If you're afraid of an idea, you don't shut down the idea. You expose the idea-

   6. JRJoe Rogan45:11

      Oh, okay.

   7. JDJimmy Dore45:11

      ... and you debunk it.

   8. JRJoe Rogan45:12

      But if you have a private platform and you own this, you start a business, and your business is, uh, putting up YouTube videos-

   9. JDJimmy Dore45:19

      Right.

   10. JRJoe Rogan45:19

       ... and you decide that someone is putting up something that's hurtful-

   11. JDJimmy Dore45:22

       Right.

   12. JRJoe Rogan45:22

       ... and damaging and racist and it could be used to attack large groups of people, and then you see, like, all, all, all the, the craziness that's been connected to the alt-right movement and you associate that with this individual, do you have to keep that on your platform? I mean, there's no regulation right now.

   13. JDJimmy Dore45:41

       No.

   14. JRJoe Rogan45:41

       It's not like-

   15. JDJimmy Dore45:42

       Technic-

   16. JRJoe Rogan45:42

       ... Public Utilities or-

   17. JDJimmy Dore45:44

       Right. It should be, though. That's my point.

   18. JRJoe Rogan45:45

       Yeah.

   19. JDJimmy Dore45:45

       My point is that 70% of the people get their news from Google and Facebook, and they're a monopoly, right? So they have monopolistic powers.

   20. JRJoe Rogan45:52

       70%?

   21. JDJimmy Dore45:53

       Yeah, that's, that was a qu- ... That was a stat I read today. So, you can't ... Uh, it's like, well-

   22. JVJamie Vernon45:59

       I was reading that, too. I don't know if I believe it.

   23. JDJimmy Dore46:00

       Hey, they took-

   24. JVJamie Vernon46:02

       It's a stretch.

   25. JDJimmy Dore46:02

       Yeah, they took-

   26. JRJoe Rogan46:03

       Why do you, why do you think it's a stretch?

   27. JVJamie Vernon46:04

       That's a lot of ... If it says 45% of the people get it straight from Facebook, that means 150 million people are on Facebook every single day.

   28. JRJoe Rogan46:12

       Yeah, I think that-

   29. JVJamie Vernon46:13

       That's not accurate.

   30. JRJoe Rogan46:14

       No, but I think that's right. But whether or not-
5. 1:00:00 – 1:09:24

   ... why does- so…

   1. SPSpeaker1:00:00

      to- contact and be nice 'cause he doesn't want them to regulate him. He'll do it for, I'll do... Julian Assange, in 2010, gave a speech which I saw recently on a plane where he predicted this. He was like, "The corporations are an extension of the government and they will do the censorship in the future." And that's exactly what's happening right now. So do you think it's the government that's censoring Alex Jones? 'Cause I would think that the government that's in power currently would wanna keep Alex Jones in position 'cause he's a supporter of Trump. He's a supporter of, you, you know-

   2. JDJimmy Dore1:00:26

      ... why does- so why does- why is Trump going after Julian Assange? Is it because he's afraid he'll expose him someday?

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:00:31

      I don't know.

   4. JDJimmy Dore1:00:32

      Why is he allowing the CIA to do that, to go after Julian Assange? And, you know, that just shows you how shitty the journalists are in America, because not one of them are standing up for Julian Assange. And they're all pretending that when Trump says mean things about Jim Acosta, that somehow that's this unbelievable d- vi- violation of our freedom of speech and our press. And he's got... You son of a bitch. You don't care... If you cared about freedom of the press, you would say something about Julian Assange, and no one is saying... What lie has Julian Assange ever printed? Na- never-

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:01:01

      Nothing that they can prove.

   6. JDJimmy Dore1:01:02

      Never. What did Julian Assange do? He revealed that our election was being rigged by the Democratic Party. Not Russia, but by the Democratic Party. And that is a sin you can't commit. You cannot tell the truth about the powerful. And that's what's happening right now. And, uh, you know, he, he revealed the CIA in, in, um, has all those spying techniques. That they can get your TV to listen to you, your phone.

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:01:26

      Yeah.

   8. JDJimmy Dore1:01:26

      Uh, Vault 7, all that stuff. They, he revealed. That's why they want to get him. But I... And Trump, you know, I just think that Trump is just, you know... He's not really clued in, right? He lets other... He's glad to let the generals do the job and his f- underlings. He doesn't really wanna... He wants to paint broad strokes and lets everyone... "You wanna kill Julian Assange? Go ahead, I don't give a F." That's, I think, how he feels. I don't think it's his plan to do it, but everybody else underneath him wants to. And certainly the intelligence community. And everyone forgets this. Chuck Schumer went on Rachel Maddow's show like two years ago and right out in public said that Trump is making a mistake by crossing the intelligence community because when you mess with them, they have six ways to Sunday to mess with you back. Holy shit. And nobody cared that he said that? So what he's saying is the president should be afraid of unelected spooks, unelected bureaucrats. These, they should be af- he should be afraid of them. That is... And no one went, "What? What the F?" Could you imagine saying that about Barack Obama? "Hey, Barack Obama better be nice to the CIA or they're gonna F with him."

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:02:25

      As an elected official, yeah.

   10. JDJimmy Dore1:02:26

       Yes. That's-

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:02:27

       Someone... An elected official saying that alm- almost sanctioning it.

   12. JDJimmy Dore1:02:30

       Yes. And then we have Eugene Robinson in The Washington Post writing an article begging the deep state to undermine, uh, Trump's foreign policy.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:02:38

       (sighs)

   14. JDJimmy Dore1:02:38

       Did you see that article?

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:02:40

       No. That's crazy.

   16. JDJimmy Dore1:02:41

       Yes. Pulitzer Prize winner. First they spend all their life denying there is a deep state, and then Eugene Robinson writes an article begging the deep state to defy President Bu- uh, President Trump. And-

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:02:51

       Why are they so blinded by ideology that they don't see the consequences of this?

   18. JDJimmy Dore1:02:55

       There's unintended consequences, and here they are. And by... They're coming at... They've already come for me. They're already coming for the left.They're... This is how, this is how this works. So, again, that's why I tell... I warn all my friends about the Russiagate nonsense. Chomsky said, "If you care about the people meddling in our election, Russia would be the last place I would look." The first place to look is concentrated capital. That's what d- dictates who are gonna be our government. That's why we don't have the things the rest of the world has, because we have a cr- cap- capital has captured our government, which is why we don't have F- Medicare for all, which is why we don't have free college, which is why we don't have an infrastructure plan, which is why we're in eight wars. Meanwhile, people, half the country's poor or low-income. 63% of the country can't afford a $1,000 emergency, and a quarter of all kids are in poverty. In the richest country in the world. Joe, what do you call a system that takes the richest country in the world and renders half of its population poor or low-income? That's a failed fucking system. And that's what we're living in right now. And it's failing worldwide.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:03:55

       Now, wh- if you were someone like Google, though, or, uh, who owns YouTube, or if you were iTunes or any of these platforms, Spotify. When you get an overwhelming volume of complaints about someone who's in the news right now... Because the fact that Alex Jones is being sued by the Sandy Hook parents, this is what started this all off. 'Cause, I mean-

   20. JDJimmy Dore1:04:19

       Right.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:04:19

       ... to people, this is so egregious. These poor parents lost their children, and here's this guy-

   22. JDJimmy Dore1:04:25

       Yes. It's horrible.

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:04:25

       ... saying that it's fake and that they don't want that on their platform. So, would you think that they should just delete the episode that has that, that says that? Should they do that or should they allow that episode to stream?

   24. JDJimmy Dore1:04:38

       No. They should... I- so, uh, here's- there's a solution. If- if there's- if he did do something in a video that i- is illegal-

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:04:47

       Mm-hmm.

   26. JDJimmy Dore1:04:48

       ... uh, take that video down until it gets adjudicated.

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:04:51

       Hmm.

   28. JDJimmy Dore1:04:52

       You don't de-platform them 100... You don't give them the death penalty.

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:04:55

       Right. So, okay, what about, like, Stormfront? What if you got some white supremacist group that's calling for violence against people? You- do you take them down?

   30. JDJimmy Dore1:05:04

       I think you would... Again, you would have to... I would like to see some kind of adjudication. You know? Again, I, uh-

Episode duration: 2:17:27