Joe Rogan Experience #1477 - Tony Hawk

1. 0:02 – 1:08

   Skateboard as an extension of the body (and public attention)

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:02

      And we're rolling. (door shuts) How are you, Tony?

   2. THTony Hawk0:04

      Awesome, thank you.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:05

      My pleasure. Thanks for having m- uh, thanks for coming here, man. It was really-

   4. THTony Hawk0:08

      Yeah, hey, thanks for inviting me.

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:09

      ... cool to meet you.

   6. THTony Hawk0:09

      It's an honor.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:10

      It's interesting to see you even just fuck around with your skateboard, just the way you maneuver it.

   8. THTony Hawk0:15

      (laughs)

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      You're so, you're so adept. It's w- really weird, like y- the way you move your feet and just pick it up and-

   10. THTony Hawk0:22

       Oh, it's very impressive. I mean, it really is just, a- at this point, kind of an extension of my body.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:26

       It seems like it.

   12. THTony Hawk0:27

       And, uh, it, it's w- I guess it's weird. I don't think about how comfortable I am, and a lot of times we'll be in a city or something, or just like now, I didn't know where to park, right? So I just park somewhere kinda close and just, I go skate. And I feel way better about doing that than, like, parking and then walking somewhere, and, and it just, you know, I know I can get around people and sort of be indiscreet and, and, uh, stealthy.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:50

       D- and we were indiscreet?

   14. THTony Hawk0:51

       Well, I'm just saying, like-

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:52

       Tony Hawk on a skateboard is indiscreet? (laughs)

   16. THTony Hawk0:54

       (laughs)

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:55

       That's ridiculous. That might be the most ridiculous thing.

   18. THTony Hawk0:56

       I do get weird looks for sure.

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:58

       For sure.

   20. THTony Hawk0:59

       I get, yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:59

       They're like, "Is that-"

   22. THTony Hawk0:59

       I get a lot of, "Do a kick flips out from car windows."

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:02

       Oh, really?

   24. THTony Hawk1:03

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:03

       Oh, that's funny. (laughs)

   26. THTony Hawk1:04

       Yeah. That's my curse that I, that I... (laughs) That's my burden I carry.

2. 1:08 – 3:10

   Viral contraption boards, street vs. vert risk, and learning to fall

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:08

      I'm seeing these new skateboards that are... They look like convertibles where as these guys flip the board, the wheels flip up and go to the other side.

   2. THTony Hawk1:17

      Oh, yeah, that's a, that's sort of a phenomenon, sort of a s- social media thing going on.

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:22

      Ah, like-

   4. THTony Hawk1:23

      And-

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:23

      ... so you can see it in slow-mo? Is that what it is?

   6. THTony Hawk1:25

      No, where... The board is actually a contraption, right?

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:28

      Yes, yeah.

   8. THTony Hawk1:28

      Yeah, I don't, I don't really understand what that is. There's a, there's a select few people doing that.

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:32

      Yeah.

   10. THTony Hawk1:33

       And I've seen a couple where they actually have figured out how to make their board grind and then do a flip around a rail as they jump back on it.

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:41

       Oh, boy.

   12. THTony Hawk1:41

       Yeah, that's... It's very specialized though. I can't say that's a movement.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:44

       (exhales)

   14. THTony Hawk1:45

       It's just a few key people that are doing it.

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:46

       How many bones do you have to break to perfect that?

   16. THTony Hawk1:50

       (laughs)

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:50

       When I see this dude sliding down rails, I'm like, "How many times do you fuck that up-"

   18. THTony Hawk1:55

       Yeah.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:55

       "... and snap a forearm?"

   20. THTony Hawk1:56

       I... Well, skating went through a different, different waves of, of disciplines basically, and in the early '90s, it was all street, right? And so what I did was, was vert skating, that was kinda dying out, so I, I was skating street a lot too, and I realized I was not fit to be a street skater the third time I rolled my ankle. Like, both ankles twice, then the third time, the other one, I was like, "I don't wanna do handrails anymore."

   21. JRJoe Rogan2:21

       (laughs)

   22. THTony Hawk2:21

       "This is not working for me. This impact is... I'm, I'm not gonna be able to skate anymore if I keep doing this."

   23. JRJoe Rogan2:26

       Yeah, I see these kids, uh, like, when you, whenever you go, like, near, like, a, a large office building that has a lot of outdoor space and you see them using the rails and stuff, I'm like, "How many b- breaks can you have before..." Like...

   24. THTony Hawk2:38

       I, there, I think that it's a little deceiving 'cause people do know how to fall relatively safely from, from stuff like that.

   25. JRJoe Rogan2:46

       But they get addicted, right? They're doing that probably every day.

   26. THTony Hawk2:49

       Sh- Yeah, for sure.

   27. JRJoe Rogan2:50

       Yeah.

   28. THTony Hawk2:50

       And, and it, there's, there's all kinds of different styles to those. There's textiles where it's more people are skating ledges and benches and they're-

   29. JRJoe Rogan2:57

       Mm-hmm.

   30. THTony Hawk2:57

       ... doing, you know, they're flipping their board, grinding, flipping out, stuff like that where it's low impact, but super technical, and then there's just the stuntmen who are doing the big rails, the big gaps, um, you know, jumping fences, and-

3. 3:10 – 4:40

   How skateboarding evolved: Dogtown, empty pools, and the insurance crash

   1. JRJoe Rogan3:10

      How did this happen? Like, what was, like, wha- how did it go from just riding a skate... Like, when I was a kid, um, you and I are the same age, but when I was, I guess I was probably like 11 or 12 I had a skateboard, I was just riding it on the street-

   2. THTony Hawk3:23

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan3:23

      ... with all my friends. We'd just ride a skateboard on the street. Like, what happened? Like, how did it get to be, like, grinding across benches-

   4. THTony Hawk3:30

      (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan3:31

      ... and railings, like...

   6. THTony Hawk3:32

      I think there's a, well, there's a pretty deep history there of how it got there, but, uh, skating was, yeah, just more of, like, a transportation toy. And then it was really the, the Dogtown crew that took it to a new level where it was like, "Oh, you can use this to do aerials and skate swimming pools," and they were just trying to emulate their surfing.

   7. JRJoe Rogan3:52

      Mmm.

   8. THTony Hawk3:52

      And so then skate parks started cropping up, skating got popular in the late '70s, early '80s, and then it was all swimming pools. And then, uh, maybe, like, four years later, the skateboarding kinda started falling impopularity. The, the skate parks couldn't get their insurance anymore 'cause the liability was crazy.

   9. JRJoe Rogan4:14

      Oh, yeah, it was bad.

   10. THTony Hawk4:14

       And so then the streets became the skate park because there was nowhere else to go. And there was a, this, there were a few key skaters that, that figured out how to use, like, the urban landscape as a skate park, and then that was it. Like, i- it was... (laughs) All bets are off. Skating kind of took off in the underground as the street culture or street sport, and then people started doing handrails, ledges, benches, stairs, 'cause they-

   11. JRJoe Rogan4:39

       H-

   12. THTony Hawk4:39

       ... just didn't have parks.

4. 4:40 – 5:18

   The internet levels the playing field for new skaters worldwide

   1. JRJoe Rogan4:40

      How much of an impact did the internet have on it? 'Cause it seems like once kids could see all these YouTube videos of people doing all this crazy shit, it must have really accelerated it.

   2. THTony Hawk4:49

      Uh, I, I think what it did, I mean, especially in the last 10 years, it evened the playing field. You didn't have to live in Southern California, you didn't have to live in New York or be near where the industry is. You could just be in your little town, as long as you're putting out content and it's progressive, you're gonna get noticed.

   3. JRJoe Rogan5:06

      (sighs)

   4. THTony Hawk5:06

      And I think that's awesome.

   5. JRJoe Rogan5:07

      Oh, yeah, that is awesome.

   6. THTony Hawk5:08

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan5:08

      Yeah, that's one of the cool things about it, like, uh, like you said, it evened out the playing field.

   8. THTony Hawk5:13

      Yeah, and, and (sighs) y- you know, people are making careers as skaters now in the most unlikely places.

5. 5:18 – 6:34

   Becoming ‘the’ name in skating: longevity, X Games, and the 1999 video game

   1. JRJoe Rogan5:18

      Well, you are the Lance Armstrong of skating. And th- this is what I mean. I don't mean that you got caught doing drugs.

   2. THTony Hawk5:23

      (laughs)

   3. JRJoe Rogan5:23

      What I mean is that you, you're the guy... Like, when people talk about professional skaters, (bang) Tony Hawk. Like, I don't know a single fucking bike rider other than Lance Armstrong. I mean, Greg, um... There was that other guy. Greg Lamont. Yeah. See, but I can't remember him real quick.

   4. THTony Hawk5:39

      (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan5:40

      But y- for you, it's, that's gotta be strange 'cause, like, you were the first and you're, for sure, the most prominent. Like, how did you pull that off?

   6. THTony Hawk5:48

      Uh, I th- well, uh, mostly longevity by surviving the first wave of skating in the '80s. Or, well, it was actually kind of the second wave of skating in the '80s, where I had a pretty good career. Um, I was doing really well in competition, especially in the, in the mid to late '80s, and then as skating kinda went underground, I never quit.... and started my own skate company in 1992. And then when the X Games came into play, I was still kind of on top of my game. I did really well there, and I think a lot of people carried over my name from that, that first round where they were skaters in the '80s and now maybe their kids skate. And they're like, "Oh, I remember that guy." You know, and, and their kids are watching the X Games. And then when our video game came out in 1999, that's when everything changed, for sure.

6. 6:34 – 12:27

   Teen pro life: turning pro at 14, buying a house at 17, and money mistakes

   1. JRJoe Rogan6:34

      Well, you were famous for skating when you were, like, 17 or something, right?

   2. THTony Hawk6:39

      Uh, I turned pro when I was 14.

   3. JRJoe Rogan6:41

      (laughs)

   4. THTony Hawk6:41

      Yeah. And then, but I mean, that, uh, when I say that it seems ... It, it might seem magical, but at the time, skating was this little tiny scene. So when I first ... When I literally went pro, I fill- was filling out an entry form to a competition, and I had already reached the top of the amateur ranks and there was a little box that said "pro" and a little box that said "am." So I clicked ... I checked the pro box, and that was it.

   5. JRJoe Rogan7:06

      (laughs)

   6. THTony Hawk7:07

      I was pro. No one was offering me a contract. No one had champagne. You know what I mean? And, and, like, my coach was l- I'll never forget, Stacy Peralta was looking over my shoulder and I checked it and he's like, "Okay."

   7. JRJoe Rogan7:19

      (laughs) That's it.

   8. THTony Hawk7:20

      That was it, yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan7:21

      Wow. S- but you had a coach?

   10. THTony Hawk7:23

       Uh, we had a t- we had a team manager. Um, he, he's the one who put me on what is now considered the Bones Brigade, but the, the company was Powell-Peralta. And that was sort of the elite crew of skaters in the, in the early '80s. Um, and I was the super young newbie on the team. Like, super skinny, dorky kid. And a lot of the guys that were established were like, "This guy? Really?"

   11. JRJoe Rogan7:49

       (laughs) What do you g- what is that, Jimmy? Oh, is that you (laughs)

   12. THTony Hawk7:51

       That's me at age 17.

   13. JRJoe Rogan7:54

       Wow. Time flies.

   14. THTony Hawk7:58

       (laughs)

   15. JRJoe Rogan7:58

       Does it freak you out looking at that?

   16. THTony Hawk8:00

       Um, I think it's fi- I mean, I see that photo making the rounds, so, uh, it's cool. I'm actually ... So, by the time I turned 17, I was kind of doing well in competition and, and making money. So I'm literally sitting outside of my house that I bought-

   17. JRJoe Rogan8:17

       Whoa.

   18. THTony Hawk8:17

       ... while I was a senior in high school, in that photo.

   19. JRJoe Rogan8:19

       Whoa. (laughs)

   20. THTony Hawk8:21

       Which was a challenge-

   21. JRJoe Rogan8:23

       Oh!

   22. THTony Hawk8:23

       ... trying to stay focused on schoolwork when you have the party house.

   23. JRJoe Rogan8:28

       That's crazy. You own a fucking house?

   24. THTony Hawk8:31

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan8:32

       Wow!

   26. THTony Hawk8:32

       Well, a, a duplex, but yeah, it was my own place.

   27. JRJoe Rogan8:35

       Still.

   28. THTony Hawk8:35

       But, you know, like, when you're a senior, "Oh, this- so-and-so's parents are out of town. Party's at his house." Like, my parents were never home.

   29. JRJoe Rogan8:42

       (laughs)

   30. THTony Hawk8:43

       So everyone's going to my house.
7. 12:27 – 15:18

   Skating’s downturn: being labeled a ‘dinosaur’ and scraping by in the early ’90s

   1. THTony Hawk12:27

      It's, it's deceiving though. I mean, especially when you have that much success at a young age, you think, you think it's never gonna end.

   2. JRJoe Rogan12:32

      Right.

   3. THTony Hawk12:33

      You think you're invincible. And I definitely sometimes treated it as such, where I was just like, "Whoo!"

   4. JRJoe Rogan12:39

      (laughs)

   5. THTony Hawk12:39

      You know, just throwing money away. And, and like I said, my dad was encouraging me to save it. And then, it all came crashing down in about, mm, like, 1991, '92, where my, my paycheck was all based on royalties of skate products. And it started getting cut in half every month.

   6. JRJoe Rogan12:58

      Whoa.

   7. THTony Hawk12:59

      Just from lack of interest, lack of sales.

   8. JRJoe Rogan13:01

      Why did it drop? Did you, it was just a liability thing for-

   9. THTony Hawk13:04

      It was that and just skating was considered a fad. It was just like... And, and also, my style of skating, I was... I skated the ramps, right? So I'm a vert skater. Vert skating was just instantly not cool because street skating had taken over. So I was considered this dinosaur-

   10. JRJoe Rogan13:19

       (laughs)

   11. THTony Hawk13:19

       ... and it was just like, "You're out. Skating's not cool, and you're not cool in skating."

   12. JRJoe Rogan13:23

       Wow.

   13. THTony Hawk13:25

       So, uh, it was, it was rough, that, those... Like, I would say sort of '92 to '95-ish were, were very lean.

   14. JRJoe Rogan13:34

       So you were trying to figure out like, "Hey, what am I doing? I got really good at this." Were you thinking, "I gotta find something else to do?"

   15. THTony Hawk13:41

       Yes and no. I, I knew I wouldn't quit skating because I just loved it. Like I, I never did it for the money. You know, when I started, there were no... No one could be rich or famous from skating. So that was never the objective. It was just because I loved what it brought to me. I loved the self-confidence it brought to me. I loved the creativity. I loved the, the misfit crew, the, the community of it. And so when things started to go south financially, I knew I wouldn't quit. I just had to figure out how to make ends meet. And, uh, I actually had a video editing system, and I learned how to do that very early, like right when nonlinear video started happening, I had a system. So I started doing freelance work for companies, doing video editing, super random, some skate companies. And then, um, I did exhibitions. Like, we were doing, uh, exhibitions in, uh, amusement park parking lots. We weren't even in the amusement park. We're like in the parking lot as people walk in as entertainment, you know, and doing that for like 100 bucks a day.

   16. JRJoe Rogan14:41

       Wow.

   17. THTony Hawk14:42

       Um, but it, but it allowed me to skate and allowed me to pay the rent, and it was like, that was good enough for me.

   18. JRJoe Rogan14:48

       But were you thinking that this is gonna stop totally?

   19. THTony Hawk14:52

       It, well, it was definitely... Felt like it was heading that way.

   20. JRJoe Rogan14:55

       Yeah.

   21. THTony Hawk14:55

       Um, but I, like I said, I was trying to... I was just trying to do whatever I could. So I w- I was trying to learn different skills. Um, and, you know, maybe skating wasn't gonna pay the bills, but I couldn't let it go from my life.

   22. JRJoe Rogan15:09

       Wow. That's a great story.

   23. THTony Hawk15:12

       It was a-

   24. JRJoe Rogan15:12

       You hung in there, and you brought it back (laughs) .

   25. THTony Hawk15:14

       I, yeah, I guess (laughs) .

   26. JRJoe Rogan15:15

       I mean, in a lot of ways, right?

8. 15:18 – 23:16

   X Games growth, mega ramps, and the reality of concussions/CTE risk

   1. THTony Hawk15:18

      It was, um, it started to slowly come back, uh, really when the X Games came into play-

   2. JRJoe Rogan15:24

      Mm-hmm.

   3. THTony Hawk15:25

      ... um, where suddenly we were f-... We were on TV, and kids could see how much skating had evolved. Well, the whole public could see how much skating had evolved from the time that they last saw it in the late '80s. And then they were seeing it, and it was just like, "Whoa, these guys are... This is for real." You know, this is, uh, you know, for lack of a better word, this is a sport. These guys are doing acrobatic things, and, and it takes discipline, and it takes, um, it takes determination. And, and kids recognize that, and I think they, you know, that's really when skating started to spark again.

   4. JRJoe Rogan15:58

      And this is like '95-ish?

   5. THTony Hawk15:59

      Probably more closer to '96, '97. The first X Games was a little strange, a little scattered because it was like skateboarding and bungee jumping-

   6. JRJoe Rogan16:08

      (laughs)

   7. THTony Hawk16:08

      ... and rock climbing and sky surfing and-

   8. JRJoe Rogan16:11

      They were just trying to figure it out.

   9. THTony Hawk16:12

      ... eco chal-... They were just throwing everything. And then it really rubbed us the wrong way because suddenly we were labeled as extreme.

   10. JRJoe Rogan16:19

       Mm-hmm.

   11. THTony Hawk16:19

       And it was like, "What do you do?" "Oh, I skateboard." "Oh, you're into extreme sports?" "No, I skateboard. I don't know what..." (laughs)

   12. JRJoe Rogan16:27

       (laughs) Yeah, that's a weird category, right, that extreme sports category.

   13. THTony Hawk16:29

       It was just anything... Yeah, and that was... I mean, really, it was coined by ESPN. So that's why-

   14. JRJoe Rogan16:34

       Ah.

   15. THTony Hawk16:34

       ... they changed it to X Games. So the first one was Extreme Games '95. They changed it to X Games in '96. I think they really found their, their niche a few years later when they really sort of started to weed out all the random stuff, and it was more about skateboarding, um, uh, BMX, motocross. Like, those became really the highlights and the reason people were tuning in, and then that's when things really exploded for them.

   16. JRJoe Rogan17:00

       And what were like the early skateboarding events in X Games? Like, what did you do?

   17. THTony Hawk17:03

       Uh, it was, it was street and vert, and-

   18. JRJoe Rogan17:07

       So vert came back?

   19. THTony Hawk17:09

       Yeah, yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan17:10

       Well, a lot of it, for us-

   21. THTony Hawk17:11

       I think it was really because e- ESPN recognized that the vert is a spectator sport.

   22. JRJoe Rogan17:16

       Yeah, that what I was gonna say. For us on the outside, we would watch it to see someone fall spectacularly (laughs) .

   23. THTony Hawk17:22

       Yeah, 'cause sure.

   24. JRJoe Rogan17:22

       Because you guys would go. You would g- hit those ramps, and you would watch people just fuck up, and you're like, "Oh my God, look how far he's falling."

   25. THTony Hawk17:31

       Right, um, yeah, for sure. And, and then once they got... I- You know, once they evolved that into what they call the big air ramps, the mega ramps, then it was just like the, the aerials and the risk factor was tenfold.

   26. JRJoe Rogan17:44

       Yeah, the, the risk factor, I mean, I've, I've seen some wipeouts that are just... I- I- I... They're, they're baffling.

   27. THTony Hawk17:52

       I think, uh, when, when things started to really explode with that, with the big air thing, and then Jake Brown had his big accident, the one that kind of everyone saw, went viral, you've probably seen it, where he's just falling from like three feet up.

   28. JRJoe Rogan18:04

       Yes.

   29. THTony Hawk18:04

       Um, that's when they started to, I don't want to say tone it down, but, but really, they, they started to figure out how to do it in a way that is still progressive but not just throwing caution to the wind and not just trying to break all the height and spin records. It was just-

   30. JRJoe Rogan18:21

       How bad did he get hurt?
9. 23:16 – 29:55

   COVID-era California: masks, closures, and skateparks filled with sand

   1. JRJoe Rogan23:16

      And, um, the mayor actually just asked to go into stage three. They made a request in San Diego to go into stage three of the recovery from c- coronavirus.

   2. THTony Hawk23:25

      Uh-huh.

   3. JRJoe Rogan23:26

      They're like, "Everything's great down here. Let's... I know the rest of the city or the rest of the state is having issues in some spots, particularly Los Angeles," but he feels ready to rock and roll and push it to the next level.

   4. THTony Hawk23:36

      I, I keep getting different (laughs) ...

   5. NANarrator23:38

      (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan23:38

      ... different views, different news, different, different guidelines- Yeah.

   7. THTony Hawk23:42

      ... so I don't... I, you know, I'm just kinda like, I'm, I'm go out, wearing a mask.

   8. JRJoe Rogan23:46

      Mm-hmm.

   9. THTony Hawk23:47

      Doing the... you know, trying to follow the guidelines as possible as, as much as possible while still leading a relatively normal life.

   10. JRJoe Rogan23:55

       Yeah. It's a weird time, right?

   11. THTony Hawk23:57

       It's... yeah. And, and, uh, the strange part to me is the, the, the great divide in terms of, for instance, um, my daughter loves to get bagels in the morning before school. So, I still try to do that with her sometimes so she can feel like we're doing a normal school day even before she goes online. And the bagel shop says, like, "Face mask required." And people just walk in without them and give you dirty looks for wearing the mask. And it's just like, "I'm just following the rules of the place."

   12. JRJoe Rogan24:26

       They give you dirty looks?

   13. THTony Hawk24:27

       Yeah. I'm just like, "This isn't some war of politics here. I'm just..."... following what they're-

   14. JRJoe Rogan24:32

       Ugh.

   15. THTony Hawk24:32

       ... asking me to do.

   16. JRJoe Rogan24:33

       That's so weird.

   17. THTony Hawk24:34

       Yeah. It's, it's really str-- (laughs) it's like they're making a stand by not, and I'm like, "Okay, well," uh, you know, I, it's the same theory as no shirt, no shoes, no shir- no service, like.

   18. JRJoe Rogan24:44

       Except your stinky feet doesn't get someone sick.

   19. THTony Hawk24:46

       (laughs)

   20. JRJoe Rogan24:46

       You know what I mean?

   21. THTony Hawk24:47

       Yeah.

   22. JRJoe Rogan24:47

       It's, it's a little different. It's a f- fucking weird time, man. It's a weird time politically. It seems like, uh, the coronavirus is, is a line in the sand politically.

   23. THTony Hawk24:57

       Uh, absolutely.

   24. JRJoe Rogan24:58

       You know?

   25. THTony Hawk24:58

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan24:58

       You know?

   27. THTony Hawk24:58

       Yeah. It's, it's, it's a strange time. And like I said, I'm just, you know, doing my best to follow th- the guidelines, the experts, and, um, and still try to maintain a, a semblance of normalcy for my family-

   28. JRJoe Rogan25:13

       Mm.

   29. THTony Hawk25:13

       ... um, so that, you know, we feel like we ... there's, (laughs) there's light at the end of the tunnel.

   30. JRJoe Rogan25:18

       Yeah. We all feel that way. Yeah. It's, um ... just California, in particular, is a very restrictive state when it comes to the recovery.
10. 29:55 – 44:26

    Training, aging, and injuries: neck issues, pelvis fracture, and pool-based rehab

    1. JRJoe Rogan29:55

       Mm-hmm. So w- when we're talking about San Diego being like v- a very fit place, do you do any sort of strength and conditioning or anything for skateboarding? Is that something that people do?

    2. THTony Hawk30:04

       Some people do it. I never found it to help my skating, and I always felt like skating kept me fit, so I never really did it. I mean, outside of swimming and surfing, which is more upper body than skating obviously, but, um, but I do feel like that would've benefited me later in life. I just got stuck in my mode. And then just skating was it.

    3. JRJoe Rogan30:29

       And you stay there. You're in your mode now. You don't do anything ...

    4. THTony Hawk30:32

       I don't do anything else. I, I do, I do make an effort to like swim some laps.... um, 'cause my mom lived, uh, till her 90s and she swore by swimming. So-

    5. JRJoe Rogan30:41

       Oh, swimming's amazing.

    6. THTony Hawk30:42

       Yeah.

    7. JRJoe Rogan30:43

       Yeah.

    8. THTony Hawk30:43

       Um, she would go, uh, you know, through... I mean, I remember all as a kid, she would definitely... She had to get her 20 laps in every day. Um, and, and, we, we... Our, our, uh... Where I lived, the residential area had a community swimming pool that was like Olympic size, so that was the kind of thing, yeah.

    9. JRJoe Rogan31:01

       Oh, nice. Yeah, we were talking before about, uh, surfing. And I was saying that I think that surfing, a- at least partially, would kind of mimic some of the muscles that you use in skateboarding. And then you were telling me about getting towed in by Laird Hamilton.

    10. THTony Hawk31:16

        (laughs) Yeah. (laughs) Well, yeah., so-

    11. JRJoe Rogan31:18

        While you drink his coffee.

    12. THTony Hawk31:20

        Wow. Um, yeah, so... Well, my brother, my older brother was a surfer and he got me into skating, 'cause he skated in the '70s when that was the thing, was... They were trying to emulate surfing with the skateboards. And so he actually gave me one of his old boards. That was my first skateboard. Um, and then he would drive me to the skate park once a week, like come home from college and take me to the park, and then I just got hooked. Like that was, that was my home away from home from that point on. Um, and so I surf pretty regularly. I would say less now, but, um, but it was hard not to with my brother's influence. And we were in Hawaii... My brother actually used to be the, uh, editor of Surfer Magazine, so he knows all the surfers.

    13. JRJoe Rogan32:03

        Oh, wow.

    14. THTony Hawk32:04

        Um, 'cause he's a re- he's a journalist, um, really good writer. Uh, teaches at Stanford now actually. And so we went to Hawaii... We went to Maui and he said, "Hey, Laird said he'd take us out tow-in surfing if you wanna go." I'm like, "We're gonna go tow-in surfing with Laird Hamilton?"

    15. JRJoe Rogan32:21

        (laughs)

    16. THTony Hawk32:22

        Like that... I don't think his level of what is mellow is something that is... what we would consider... And he's... And I go, "But, you know, we gotta go." Like it's once in a lifetime.

    17. JRJoe Rogan32:32

        Right.

    18. THTony Hawk32:32

        So they took us out, uh, to Spreckels, which is near Jaws, which is their big spot. This is like early 2000s. So tow-in surfing was just starting to come into play. I'll never forget Dave Kalama, who's one of the surfers, one of his homies, he was f- trying out the first foil board there.

    19. JRJoe Rogan32:50

        Oh, wow.

    20. THTony Hawk32:50

        And he had... He was wearing ski boots attached to the foil board. That's how he was riding it.

    21. JRJoe Rogan32:57

        (laughs)

    22. THTony Hawk32:58

        I was like, "These guys are out of their minds."

    23. JRJoe Rogan33:01

        (laughs)

    24. THTony Hawk33:01

        And, uh, and so, uh-

    25. JRJoe Rogan33:03

        Does it detach like a ski boot if you fall?

    26. THTony Hawk33:06

        I never saw it detach.

    27. JRJoe Rogan33:07

        Mm.

    28. THTony Hawk33:09

        He's nuts.

    29. JRJoe Rogan33:10

        Oh, my God.

    30. THTony Hawk33:10

        Yeah, it-
11. 44:26 – 1:17:16

    Skateboarding tech limits, longevity in the sport, and creating new tricks at 52

    1. JRJoe Rogan44:26

       Now, how much ... I- I don't know shit about skating, so I w- like, uh, f- forgive me if this is an ignorant question, but how much improvement has there been in the wheels, in the boards, in the components and all, and all the different things? Like are there things you can do now today that just really weren't possible when you first started skating?

    2. THTony Hawk44:45

       Uh, only in the ... Well, when I first started skating, skateboards were all over the place, so they were made of different materials, they were different with like all different shapes. Um, they, you know, the urethane had just come into play. But I would say for the last 30 years, it's pretty much the same construction.

    3. JRJoe Rogan45:03

       Hmm.

    4. THTony Hawk45:04

       Seven plywood, maple skateboards. Uh, trucks have not changed. Um, wheels have changed in size and hardness, but it's still the same urethane for the most part. So there hasn't been a lot of huge advancements. The big, uh, the- the big changes are the shapes of the boards.

    5. JRJoe Rogan45:21

       Now, why have they, um, stuck with plywood? What about like carbon fiber-

    6. THTony Hawk45:26

       (sighs)

    7. JRJoe Rogan45:26

       ... any synthetic?

    8. THTony Hawk45:27

       You know, that is, th- that's the big question, and- and something that I would like to pursue, but w- we really need a sea change in skateboarding with materials. I believe that.

    9. JRJoe Rogan45:37

       Yeah?

    10. THTony Hawk45:38

        And we've, we haven't found anything that, that, uh, responds the same.

    11. JRJoe Rogan45:45

        Hmm.

    12. THTony Hawk45:45

        Um, or, you know, it ... The other thing is skaters as, as much as they are (smacks lips) very progressive and, you know, they like to be ... do different things and, and, um, go out- s- think outside the box and whatnot, if you try to sell them a deck that's, you know, 200 bucks, that's g- that's gonna be hard.

    13. JRJoe Rogan46:06

        Hmm.

    14. THTony Hawk46:06

        Even if you can convince them that it's gonna last three times long, four times long.

    15. JRJoe Rogan46:10

        So is it just a money thing?

    16. THTony Hawk46:12

        (clears throat)

    17. JRJoe Rogan46:12

        Or, or are they married to the-

    18. THTony Hawk46:13

        We just haven't really found ... Like there's some, some people have done, uh, different construction where they add a different ply in and that has worked a little bit, um, but, uh, they, it, I ... like I said, there just hasn't been that, that one seed planted where it's like, "All right, this is it. This is-"

    19. JRJoe Rogan46:31

        I would imagine carbon fiber.

    20. THTony Hawk46:34

        I- I- I tried something along those lines and it just, like I said, didn't, it didn't have that reflex.

    21. JRJoe Rogan46:41

        Hmm. Does it have to have a certain amount of weight to it too? 'Cause-

    22. THTony Hawk46:44

        That, th- well, that's the other thing. We're- we're kind of stuck where this is, this is how skateboards should weigh.

    23. JRJoe Rogan46:50

        Right.

    24. THTony Hawk46:50

        And so if you bring in something that's way lighter, maybe that's not the answer.

    25. JRJoe Rogan46:55

        Hmm.

    26. THTony Hawk46:55

        But we don't know. It just g- you know, it takes R&D for sure.

    27. JRJoe Rogan46:58

        Hmm. And you would have to get someone really good to fuck with it too, right?

    28. THTony Hawk47:03

        Yeah.

    29. JRJoe Rogan47:03

        You'd have to g-

    30. THTony Hawk47:03

        And to believe in it.

Episode duration: 1:42:54