Joe Rogan Experience #1658 - Neil deGrasse Tyson

1. 0:00 – 1:51

   Spotting “fake randomness” in movies (and Joe’s ceiling stars)

   1. NANarrator0:00

      (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music plays)

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:16

      Oh, yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:17

      How much time do you spend looking at random leaves on television shows to recognize that it's a fake pattern-

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:23

      (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:23

      ... not created by the wind?

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:26

      No, I just... You know, you look at scenes from Walking Dead, and they enter this deserted town, as so many towns are when zombies take over, and the, the, the, the leaves, you know, the autumn leaves are evenly spread in the streets and the sidewalks. And I'm thinking, "Some set designer did that thinking that this is what leaves do in the breeze." But that's not what they do. They collect. They circulate. They're the, they're, they're like eddies in the air currents-

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:55

      Mm.

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:55

      ... that'll collect them in one place and not the other. So, so, so we think if something's random, that it's evenly spread, but in fact, there are many more collected elements in something that's random than we typically think. So I'm looking at your new ceiling here in Austin, Texas, and your star... It's beautiful, by the way.

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:17

      Thank you.

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:17

       Nice digs you got here.

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:18

       Thank you.

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:18

       But, uh, the stars are... The lights are kinda evenly spread on the sky.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:24

       Yeah, they don't look real.

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:25

       So that's how... And plus, you know, you could've thrown in at least a constellation up there or something.

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:30

       You know what I should do? I should get someone to make me one and make one and just imitate the Milky Way.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:36

       That'd be, that'd be beautiful.

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:37

       Right.

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:37

       That'd be beautiful, and I, I'll be happy to certify it. (laughs)

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:40

       (laughs) Oh no, I'm scared.

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:41

       You give me a call. You give me a call.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:43

       I'm scared.

   22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:43

       I'm all in.

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:44

       I don't think... I don't think you will certify it.

   24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:46

       (laughs)

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:46

       I think it would be a real problem.

   26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:48

       (laughs)

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:49

       I think it would be a genuine issue.

2. 1:51 – 6:34

   Austin memories, online backlash, and the Texas power-grid tweet

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:51

      So how you doing, Joe?

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:51

      I'm doing good. How you doing?

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:53

      You had your new job.

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:53

      Yeah.

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:53

      You know. I, I used to... Austin is a, is an old haunt of mine.

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:57

      Is it?

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:58

      Yeah, I met my wife here. Uh, I, I, I got my master's at UT Austin. My wife got her PhD in Mathematical Physics there, and I finished my PhD in Columbia in New York City. But, uh, we spent six years here, long ago. Like-

   8. JRJoe Rogan2:11

      I love it here.

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:12

      We were here when Austin, Texas had six gates at the airport. (laughs)

   10. JRJoe Rogan2:18

       Wow.

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:18

       I'm just saying.

   12. JRJoe Rogan2:19

       That's crazy.

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:19

       And there was never more than one other car in front of you at a red light. Just picture that.

   14. JRJoe Rogan2:23

       A lot of folks remember that apparently.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:25

       Yeah.

   16. JRJoe Rogan2:25

       And they, they're very upset.

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:26

       That I would be totally pissed off.

   18. JRJoe Rogan2:28

       The traffic here is still adorable.

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:30

       (laughs) Adorable.

   20. JRJoe Rogan2:31

       It's, it's ridiculous, cute traffic.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:35

       (laughs)

   22. JRJoe Rogan2:35

       And the people are so nice, it's just a-

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:37

       (laughs)

   24. JRJoe Rogan2:37

       ... completely different vibe-

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:39

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan2:40

       ... from Los Angeles.

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:40

       So I miss you, man.

   28. JRJoe Rogan2:41

       I miss you too.

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:41

       So it's good to see you still, you're still at it, you're still-

   30. JRJoe Rogan2:43

       I'm still at it.
3. 6:34 – 10:01

   Making science fun: humor, learning, and what school gets wrong

   1. JRJoe Rogan6:34

      Yeah, but you're a different kind of astrophysicist. You're an entertaining educator, and that's so important.

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson6:40

      Okay.

   3. JRJoe Rogan6:40

      Because you make things fun. You make things fun while pointing out really important points, like really important things that we should probably understand about the way the universe works, and physics, and-

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson6:51

      Well, thanks for thinking about it that way. I, I don't think about it that way. I think that the universe is inherently hilarious. (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan6:57

      (laughs)

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson6:57

      And so I'm just sharing that hilarity with you. Um, but I, I, what I also found is that, when people smile, they learn better.

   7. JRJoe Rogan7:05

      Oh, for sure. Yeah, when they're less tense, yeah.

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:07

      Yeah, they're less tense, and there's a pleasing feeling that they had at a point when they learn something. And so that's gotta work some kinda dopamine chemicals-

   9. JRJoe Rogan7:17

      Yeah.

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:17

       ... so that you say, "I wanna learn something again tomorrow."

   11. JRJoe Rogan7:20

       Yeah, I mean, science educators are so important because so many people equate, whether it's mathematics or science or even history, they equate it with boredom. Right?

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:31

       I, I think not only science, but many academic subjects.

   13. JRJoe Rogan7:34

       Yeah. Yeah.

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:34

       And what's, what's that song by Alice Cooper? Uh, School's Out.

   15. JRJoe Rogan7:39

       Yeah.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:39

       << School's out for the summer. School's out forever. >>

   17. JRJoe Rogan7:42

       Yeah.

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:42

       This is an anthem-

   19. JRJoe Rogan7:43

       Yeah.

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:44

       ... for people who hate school. (laughs)

   21. JRJoe Rogan7:46

       Yeah.

   22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:46

       What else is that, right?

   23. JRJoe Rogan7:47

       Yeah.

   24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:47

       And then I thought to myself, when you're in school, your only job is to learn. And for that to be a chore means something is wrong in that school. I'm not blaming the people who are throwing their notes in the air running down the school steps. I'm blaming the system that's not making school fun and entertaining, and it should be a place where you are trained to become a lifelong learner.

   25. JRJoe Rogan8:14

       Yeah.

   26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson8:14

       Where some infusion of curiosity, y- you get bitten by a curiosity bug, and then when you c- walk down the step, you say, "Wait a minute. I don't wanna leave school. I wanna stay." Or, "If I have to leave school 'cause I, I'm, I'm, I graduated, let me find other ways to continue to stay enlightened throughout my life." Otherwise, you get ossified in one way of thinking with one, uh, uh, dimension of, uh, information or facts or, or insights. And then you're stuck there, and you think that's the world, and it's not.

   27. JRJoe Rogan8:46

       It's not, but let's put this into perspective. Think about the budget for the homeless. Think about the budget for the military. Now, let's think about the budget that a school has to work with. And think about the fact that you have to take 40 kids who may not have been paying attention most of their life, and then all of a sudden, you catch them when they're 14.

   28. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson9:06

       (laughs)

   29. JRJoe Rogan9:06

       Good luck. I mean, you've got a lot of momentum-

   30. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson9:09

       (laughs)
4. 10:01 – 1:18:32

   Educator vs lecturer: reading the audience and adapting the message

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson10:01

      Well, I think we have similar, each of us has, you and I, have similar challenges in a, in a theater audience, right? Now, you have the advantage that they're all fans, so they know where you're coming from when you do a standup routine. But still, there's 1,000 people or more who are different from each other. Some are old, some are young, some are left, some are right, you know, politically. And you thread that, and y- I think you thread it brilliantly. You get people with you, and you get them to want to listen to you. So part of what I glean from people's reactions to my Twitter posts is, "Was that how you thought about that? I, I didn't know that."

   2. JRJoe Rogan10:37

      Mm-hmm.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson10:38

      "Oh, you know, I thought what I posted was funny, but nobody laughed." That's useful information to me.

   4. JRJoe Rogan10:43

      (laughs)

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson10:43

      Okay? (laughs) I wanna know-

   6. JRJoe Rogan10:45

      Yeah.

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson10:46

      ... if I'm succeeding or not and what words I choose, what phrases, what ideas, what topics. And, and by the way, those touch points have evolved over the years. I've done this, a, a purposeful experiment. I took an identical tweet and just retweeted it five years after I first did it.

   8. JRJoe Rogan11:05

      Mm-hmm.

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:06

      And reactions are different.

   10. JRJoe Rogan11:07

       Because of the time.

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:08

       The times have changed, that's correct.

   12. JRJoe Rogan11:10

       Yeah. Yeah.

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:10

       And so if I wanna stay, if I wanna stay effective as a, an educator, I will, first, I will never want them to meet me at the chalkboard-

   14. JRJoe Rogan11:22

       Mm-hmm.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:22

       ... or whatever boards are made of today 'cause what is that? That, yeah, okay, you're, you're a professor. Professor Neil is facing the chalkboard drawing on the board, and you either get them or you don't.

   16. JRJoe Rogan11:32

       Right.

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:32

       Okay? But that, uh, y- that person cannot claim to be an educator. The educator is someone who faces the audience and wants to know how is your brain wired for thought? And if I know that, I have a chance of shaping knowledge, information, insight in ways that can best be received by your receptors.

   18. JRJoe Rogan11:54

       Mm-hmm.

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:54

       And yes, if it's a mixture, so I'd, I'd, you, you dance a little bit. You, you, you put out some feelers in this, uh, way. So if I have an audience and some of them are over 75, look for the silver-haired folks, they'll remember, you know, the later stages of the, uh, Second World War and early stages of the Cold War, I'll throw in a reference, just for them. You know, the 20-somethings won't know and they won't care. They probably won't even get it, but I'll go buy it quickly enough that, that I can offer the other community demographic-

   20. JRJoe Rogan12:27

       Mm-hmm.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson12:27

       ... in the audience something else. And this is my way, um, uh, maybe it's a tennis match, I'm hitting the ball back and forth to different people, and that way, I can take this body of knowledge that is the universe and have everybody share in it. Otherwise, I c- I don't know that I can claim to be an educator.

   22. JRJoe Rogan12:45

       Well, you certainly can claim to be an educator, but maybe you're not making the best use of your particular abilities, your particular abilities that are unique to you are your humor and your fun, your jovial, along with being deep and philosophical and talking about very heady things.

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:01

       I, I, I found that mattered, people, like I said, people like to smile.

   24. JRJoe Rogan13:04

       Yeah.

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:05

       And...

   26. JRJoe Rogan13:05

       They like silliness.

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:06

       Yeah.

   28. JRJoe Rogan13:06

       You're a silly dude.

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:07

       (laughs)

   30. JRJoe Rogan13:07

       It's fun. I mean, for a guy who talks about-
5. 14:52 – 24:57

   “Everyone has a camera now”—so where’s the clear alien footage?

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson14:52

      Just the light in the sky and it moves in ways they don't understand or can't explain. So, um, but a point I've made before, I'll just, uh, rehash it here, uh, we live in a time where everyone is equipped with a high-resolution color camera and video recorder, basically everyone. And if you run the numbers on it, it's about, I got this from someone from Google, there's about six billion photos and videos uplifted to the internet every day. And in that collection, you find really rare things that you only heard about or maybe you saw the results of, but you didn't actually see it happen. You s- so there are videos of buses tumbling in the winds of a tornado. Now, in the aftermath of a tornado, there's a bus on its side, and so you knew wind took it there, but previously, no one is gonna say, "Oh, that bus is about to lift into the air," Wizard of Oz style, like the house, "Let me go in and get my (laughs) , my, my, my, my movie camera."

   2. JRJoe Rogan16:00

      Right.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:01

      "And then come back out and shoot this." No one did that. If you did, you'd be stupid. That, you'd wanna get the hell out of there. But everybody has a video camera. So we have images of this rare phenomenon, uncommon, n- hardly ever filmed, buses tumbling in the air. We have video footage of animals doing interesting things that y- that, you know, we never had video recordings of. S-

   4. JRJoe Rogan16:24

      Like bears walking on two feet?

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:26

      B- yeah, bears and, and one of them right at a traffic cone, there's a video of that.

   6. JRJoe Rogan16:31

      Yeah.

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:31

      It was just walking down the street and there's a traffic cone and it looked at it and it, it, uh, was tipped over and it righted it and just kept walking. And I'm thinking, "Wow, this is what bears do when we're not chasing them or when they're (laughs) not chasing us."

   8. JRJoe Rogan16:43

      Mm-hmm.

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:43

      This is just a casual... They're mammals, they have large brains, you know, compared to any other kinds of-

   10. JRJoe Rogan16:48

       They're, they're oddly playful too.

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:50

       Yes.

   12. JRJoe Rogan16:50

       Yeah.

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:50

       And they love, uh, people's backyard swimming pools, apparently. (laughs)

   14. JRJoe Rogan16:53

       Yeah, and benches. You ever seen them on picnic benches?

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:55

       And they're just chilling on the bench, yeah.

   16. JRJoe Rogan16:56

       They lay on benches and roll around on picnic benches.

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:59

       Yeah. So, um, and in another case, I saw, it was a magpie, one of these birds known for how smart it is. There was a full, uh, uh, uh, you know, half liter, um, you know, plastic, uh, thing of water, it was just water, okay? You know, a water bottle, and it was full. So the magpie goes over and sips out the water. Now, you can on- it, the beak is only, what, an inch and a half long, or an inch at most, so it goes in until it can't reach the water anymore. So what does it do? It goes off to the side, gets a rock just the right size, drops it into the water bottle.

   18. JRJoe Rogan17:39

       And raises the level of the water.

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson17:40

       Thereby displacing water. Here it is.

   20. JRJoe Rogan17:43

       That, that is heavy.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson17:44

       You've got the video. There it is. And so it's, now it comes and it goes back, and gets another stone, drops it in, and every time it drops it in, the water level rises and it can drink more water. And it just, it keeps doing this.

   22. JRJoe Rogan17:57

       That's pretty amazing.

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson17:58

       Okay? And so, so every time we study animals...They're smarter than we ever thought they were. So maybe for our own ego, we kept building ourselves up, saying how separate and distinct we are as humans in the animal kingdom, when maybe we're not as separate and distinct as we think we are. So now what, what's my broader point there about, that I was making? I, I just distracted myself.

   24. JRJoe Rogan18:27

       Something about UFOs.

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:28

       Yeah, no-

   26. JRJoe Rogan18:28

       (laughs)

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:28

       ... I was trying to get back to UFOs on that.

   28. JRJoe Rogan18:30

       The theing, the fact that we have high-resolution cameras in our pocket and we take videos of things that are very unusual.

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:34

       There are ver-, oh, so exactly. So here's video of a magpie doing Bernoulli experiments on a, on a, on a water, in a water bottle. Who woulda known that even happened, right?

   30. JRJoe Rogan18:44

       Right.
6. 24:57 – 42:20

   Scientific scrutiny and the Planet X lesson: sensors can mislead

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson24:57

      ... than if we're being visited by intelligent aliens from another planet. Go visit a ... Go, go to a scientific conference and watch the level of scrutiny we put on other people's work. If they have a sensor that has a new result, we'll say, "Did you calibrate the sensor? Did you ... How long has the sensor been in use? What..." I- I- I'll give you an example. Here's an example. Okay? Um, do you remember Planet X?

   2. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)25:23

      Yes.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:23

      The search for Planet X.

   4. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)25:25

      Nibiru.

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:26

      N- uh, that was one, uh, there was, s- sorry. There were several incarnations of Planet X.

   6. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)25:32

      Right.

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:32

      That was among them. Okay?

   8. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)25:34

      That, that was the most wacky.

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:35

      But I'm talkin' about, I'm talkin' about a hundred years ago Planet X.

   10. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)25:38

       Yes.

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:39

       Okay?

   12. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)25:39

       Oh, a hundred years ago are we talking about?

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:40

       Well, there's several Planet X's, right? So, um, Uranus was moving weirdly and nobody understood. Maybe there's a planet beyond it-

   14. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)25:48

       Right.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:48

       ... whose gravity we have yet to reckon in our equations. Ah, boom! We discover Neptune. Wait a minute. Neptune is moving a little, a little, uh, unfamiliarly. I just... Oh, my phone is... Okay, sorry about that.

   16. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:00

       You're gonna drop that thing and break it with no case on?

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:04

       (laughs)

   18. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:04

       (laughs)

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:06

       So, uh, yeah. This, uh, I got the 12 and, yeah, I can still do this. I'm just, sorry, it's not dropping.

   20. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:09

       Yeah, I get it. Last time you were here, you had a broken case.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:12

       (laughs)

   22. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:12

       Or a broken back.

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:14

       (laughs)

   24. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:14

       Remember?

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:16

       So, uh, why, why are you distracting me like...

   26. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:18

       Sorry, sorry.

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:19

       I- I was, I was, like, on a roll.

   28. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:20

       Um.

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:21

       And...

   30. GUGuest (secondary, unidentified)26:22

       Neptune.
7. 42:20 – 1:00:46

   Why aliens might avoid us: human violence, Hollywood mirrors, and METI worries

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson42:20

      Now think of the hubris of us saying this advanced...... civilization of aliens-

   2. JRJoe Rogan42:26

      Mm-hmm.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson42:26

      ... who can cross the gaps of space, are interested in us and our gonads-

   4. JRJoe Rogan42:32

      (laughs)

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson42:32

      ... and they wanna paint circles in our crops. That's kinda weird, I would think.

   6. JRJoe Rogan42:36

      Okay. I hate this argument.

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson42:38

      I, I just think it's a little weird.

   8. JRJoe Rogan42:39

      Listen, tell you, I hate it.

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson42:40

      I, I don't think we're that interesting.

   10. JRJoe Rogan42:41

       I think we're really fucking interesting. I think-

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson42:44

       To, to a, to an event-

   12. JRJoe Rogan42:44

       ... we can, we can nuke the entire planet many times over and yet we don't. We did it once in 1947. We bullshit each other constantly. We spew out propaganda. We have this bizarre ritual where every four years, we pick a leader based on a popularity contest.

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson43:00

       Who you wanna have beer with. Yeah. (laughs)

   14. JRJoe Rogan43:01

       We're con... Yeah, we're constantly involved in murder and rape and genocide all over the world. We choose what things to pay attention to and what not to pay attention to. We celebrate people who pretend to be heroes in films and television, and we barely know scientists who win Nobel Prizes. We're fucking fascinating.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson43:19

       (laughs)

   16. JRJoe Rogan43:20

       We're the weirdest-

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson43:21

       Fascinating to whom? (laughs)

   18. JRJoe Rogan43:22

       ... things, the weirdest things. Well, see, you were... uh, if you studied us, if you were from-

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson43:26

       (laughs)

   20. JRJoe Rogan43:26

       ... another planet filled with things like us, like if there was another planet of us, and we found w- uh, a planet doing the sac- exact same kinda nonsense that we do somewhere else, we would be riveted.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson43:37

       Here's what, here's how I think about another planet.

   22. JRJoe Rogan43:40

       Okay.

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson43:40

       All right? If I can share this. This is, this is getting a little deep, but if you're ready for that.

   24. JRJoe Rogan43:43

       Oh, please.

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson43:43

       Okay. So, um, whether you are a vegetarian or omnivore or carnivore, um, you must kill something that was alive to survive. Okay?

   26. JRJoe Rogan44:00

       Yes.

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson44:01

       Uh, the only thing that you consume that was never once alive is sort of basically milk and honey, okay, and salt. Everything else was once alive. You are killing, and of course vegetarians are doing it as well. In fact, I'm intrigued that vegetarians in particular will focus on the baby version of the plant they would otherwise be eating, baby spinach, baby carrots, baby arugula, baby this, baby that, and on the sort of reproductive organs of plants. "Oh, let's eat the, the flowers or the seeds or the nuts," or these are things that plants try to make another plant with, you collect it and eat it. So now imagine a civilization from another planet that is entirely energized by photosynthesis. Just imagine that. Okay? Maybe they have what we would call an animal, but their entire skin photosynthesizes. Okay? So all living creatures on that planet consume sunlight from their home s- star. Okay. And so they say, "I wanna explore the galaxy." And so they build a spaceship, and they come to Earth, and what do they see? Humans and other animals killing to survive, inventing means of mass murder of fellow other life forms on their planet just to survive.

   28. JRJoe Rogan45:37

       Mm.

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson45:39

       They would consider us astonishingly, inexcusably, bewilderingly barbaric for having done so. And I don't think they would be interested in us.

   30. JRJoe Rogan45:53

       I think if they really are using photosynthesis, they're plant-based creatures, they're probably gonna be so tired all the time, they're not gonna have the will to travel through the universe.
8. 1:00:46 – 1:10:47

   Human–technology symbiosis: from medicine to Neuralink (and misinformation)

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:00:46

      I, when I look at what we're doing with human beings, and, you know, th- the replacing people's knees, and replacing people's hips, and artificial this and artificial that, and then with CRISPR and genetic engineering, I think it's a matter of time before we are some sort of symbiotic thing. We're partially created by, you know, wha- whatever technology's available at the time, whether it's 100 years from now or 500 years from now.

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:15

      It's-

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:01:15

      Something that's gonna be superior, that's not gonna provide us with all the problems.

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:18

      It's, it's already happened-

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:01:20

      Yeah.

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:20

      ... you just don't think about it that way.

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:01:21

      With your phone and your glasses.

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:22

      No. Oh, no, no, no, no, no. Y- no, even before that. We are symbiotic with chemistry.

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:01:28

      Mm.

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:28

       You're living twice as long, better living through chemistry.

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:01:32

       Sure.

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:33

       Okay? You have w- we control your cholesterol, your i- inflammation, your, y- you, uh, we know how to, uh, to re- reduce the chance of stroke. So, you're thinking very narrow on this-

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:01:45

       Right.

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:45

       ... "Oh, I need a new kneecap," or, "I need a new this."

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:01:49

       Right.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:49

       The fact is, science and technology has already been infused in the human condition in a way that, for example, has doubled our life expectancy within the last 150 years. So, so, it's already happening chemically. So now you wanna do it mechanically because that requires, um, material science and, uh, that's a much later field than chemistry was developed-

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:02:14

       Hm.

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:14

       ... in order to contribute to what our lives are. Now you wanna get into our DNA, that's just the next level. Okay? Now, are we gonna have some internet infused in our head? I, I don't think so.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:02:26

       But that's what Elon's working on.

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:27

       Now, I don't think ... Well, why would you do that when the entire internet is in your palm of your hand on your smartphone?

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:02:33

       Because you don't ... You have to touch that stupid thing, you might drop it. How about what Elon's doing?

   22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:38

       Oh, oh, oh, so, oh, so ... Oh, what you're saying is, I don't wanna touch this. Yes, open up my skull-

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:02:43

       Yeah.

   24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:43

       ... and put in an internet transmitter.

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:02:44

       Yeah, yeah, yeah.

   26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:45

       That's better.

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:02:46

       But it makes you smarter.

   28. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:47

       So does the smartphone.

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:02:49

       No, no, no, but, like, much smarter. What he's saying is it's gonna increase the bandwidth that you have to access information. You're gonna be able to access information quicker because it's not going to go through all these-

   30. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:03:00

       Okay, so people can do stupid things quicker in the face of information that you think is correct.
9. 1:10:47 – 1:42:10

   Truth, nuance, and deception: why binary lie-detection fails

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:10:47

      If there... If we could come to a point where technology could eliminate deception, how much more information could be shared and how much more could we understand?

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:10:57

      But what I don't know is, if we cannot eliminate deception, uh, deception in ourselves, either self-deception or purposeful deception in others, I don't see how we can program that into our technology.

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:11:11

      But I think we can if we can understand whether someone's telling the truth or not. If it's clear and glaringly obvious. If you and I are talking and, uh, I start talking to you and all of a sudden a green light pops up which indicates I'm full of shit, you'll see it and I'm like, oh, my green light's showing.

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:27

      No, but that assumes that things are either true or false.

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:11:30

      Right.

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:30

      And that's just not true. That's not... The, the actual-

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:11:32

      Some things.

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:33

      The actual world is way more nuanced than that.

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:11:37

      Right.

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:38

       So, so-

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:11:39

       Unintended deception.

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:41

       So for example, I can think something is true.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:11:43

       Right.

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:44

       And b- what, what you're basically saying, not to put words in your mouth, is that everyone walks around with a lie detector in, on their forehead.

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:11:51

       Yeah, that's a bad idea. That's, that's a bad example.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:53

       But you just said this and I'm-

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:11:54

       I know.

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:54

       All right.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:11:55

       Yeah.

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:11:55

       So everyone has a lie detector. And if I think something happened even though it didn't, then I'm telling the truth. I'm telling my own understanding of the truth.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:12:05

       Which is a problem with some people-

   22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:12:06

       And you can't-

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:12:06

       ... with some stories, right? Like-

   24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:12:08

       You can't then indict me-

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:12:09

       Yeah.

   26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:12:09

       ... for that truth being wrong if that's how I saw it. That's like the umpire. That's how I called it 'cause that's how I saw it.

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:12:15

       Yeah.

   28. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:12:15

       The umpire is not being evil. That's just what they saw. So that's one problem with that. Another one is there's so many things that are... And that's what makes the world interesting, I think, um, is... So you want, you want a- an example of where truth is nuanced. Um-... uh, I'm try- I can't think of it off the top of my head. But I, I'm just telling you that in almost every case where someone wants to turn a question into a binary answer, they're not doi- they're doing a disservice to human intellect. To the, to the real world that's out there. Uh, uh, uh, I'll give you an example. So how tall are you?

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:12:59

       Five-eight.

   30. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:12:59

       Five-eight. Okay. Uh, presumably you measured that with some kind of tape measure. All right. So are you five-seven and three-quarters?

Episode duration: 3:02:43