Joe Rogan Experience #1885 Andy Stumpf & Mike Sarraille

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   (drum roll) Joe Rogan podcast,…

   1. NANarrator0:01

      (drum roll) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (instrumental music plays)

   2. JRJoe Rogan0:12

      So tell me about your dip problem. (laughs) What happened?

   3. ASAndy Stumpf0:14

      Tell us about your disgusting mouth.

   4. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      Is this how I start? (laughs)

   5. MSMike Sarraille0:17

      (laughs) Yes. Well, so I- I- you know, you talked about high school. You did in high school.

   6. ASAndy Stumpf0:22

      Yeah.

   7. MSMike Sarraille0:22

      I did it one time.

   8. JRJoe Rogan0:22

      He's gotta turn it on you.

   9. ASAndy Stumpf0:24

      Yeah.

   10. JRJoe Rogan0:24

       You did it one time.

   11. ASAndy Stumpf0:25

       One time in high school and never touched it again. Go ahead, mister 19 years.

   12. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       Mike was-

   13. MSMike Sarraille0:28

       (laughs)

   14. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       Mike was just saying that he had to get his skin grafted-

   15. MSMike Sarraille0:32

       (laughs)

   16. ASAndy Stumpf0:32

       (laughs)

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:32

       ... and he's like, "You did it once."

   18. ASAndy Stumpf0:34

       (laughs)

   19. MSMike Sarraille0:34

       Well, I- I remember the first time I did. Somebody gave me Redman Chew, and it was over. I was just yakking everywhere. Where I started was in the Marine Corps is, uh, when we're in a hide site, you have to stay awake when it's your turn for security, but that can be like 3:00 AM in the morning after you've been hiking for like six hours.

   20. JRJoe Rogan0:53

       Right.

   21. MSMike Sarraille0:54

       So eventually my team leader's like, "You are gonna put a dip in to do whatever it takes to stay awake during your watch."

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:00

       Does dip keep you awake?

   23. ASAndy Stumpf1:02

       The, uh, nicotine does.

   24. MSMike Sarraille1:04

       Yeah.

   25. ASAndy Stumpf1:04

       It should.

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:04

       But dip will?

   27. ASAndy Stumpf1:06

       (inhales deeply) Yes.

   28. MSMike Sarraille1:06

       Absolutely. And so it- it morphed from there in the Marines, and we lived... I like to say we lived off of three things on deployment, water, coffee, and dip. And even on a patrol with these guys, I would have a dip in, chewing caffeine gum-

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:22

       Jesus.

   30. MSMike Sarraille1:22

       ... and drinking water.
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   It was a staph…

   1. JRJoe Rogan15:00

      and so during Hell Week, you've got open sores, you're, you're in the water which isn't far from the Tijuana where it drains off. Uh, so th- there's... That's always been a concern and we mitigate it extremely well. Uh, and first off, my condolences to the mother 'cause this kid was a stud. He was the captain of the Yale football team. He was gonna become a SEAL. He passed the hardest, uh, stages of- So, was it like a staph infection?

   2. MSMike Sarraille15:21

      It was a staph infection. And you look at the source, um-

   3. ASAndy Stumpf15:26

      Bacterial pneumonia.

   4. JRJoe Rogan15:27

      Bacterial, yeah.

   5. ASAndy Stumpf15:27

      Yeah.

   6. MSMike Sarraille15:28

      You look at the source-

   7. JRJoe Rogan15:29

      Mm-hmm.

   8. MSMike Sarraille15:29

      ... this, this is all New York Times.

   9. ASAndy Stumpf15:30

      Yeah.

   10. MSMike Sarraille15:30

       It's a string of, of reporters from New York Times-

   11. JRJoe Rogan15:33

       It's the same authors.

   12. MSMike Sarraille15:33

       ... that have just been... They've had a hard on for the SEAL teams. They have been going out. In fact, they wrote a book, and you have the author, Matt Cole.

   13. ASAndy Stumpf15:40

       Mm-hmm.

   14. MSMike Sarraille15:40

       Um, Code Over Country.

   15. ASAndy Stumpf15:42

       Yeah.

   16. MSMike Sarraille15:43

       And, and they have just, for the last half decade, if not more, have made it their personal crusade to bring down, down the SEAL teams. And the Eddie Gallagher incident did not help. But here's what I'll say. One, Eddie is a friend. Eddie didn't handle all situations well. But it's amazing how Eddie can have... And I think Eddie had like, eight combat deployments. How he can serve honorably, and he was number one at the SEAL team, his SEAL team, I think for, for-

   17. ASAndy Stumpf16:12

       I don't know.

   18. MSMike Sarraille16:12

       ... for E6, I believe. He served honorably for 19 years, and the last incident he's involved in, which he was acquitted for, that defines his entire career. The last sentence of his chapter as a SEAL defines all the 19 years and all the good work that he did in defense of our nation for those who would never even think of serving.

   19. JRJoe Rogan16:32

       And he was, uh, acquitted. Um, what was the charge again? It was, uh, there was a... It was something about a detainee?

   20. ASAndy Stumpf16:39

       I think the charge was murder.

   21. MSMike Sarraille16:41

       Yes. It wa-

   22. JRJoe Rogan16:42

       Yeah.

   23. MSMike Sarraille16:42

       It was, it was a ISIS prisoner that had been wounded in a strike. And, uh, while rendering medical aid, they, they, uh, accused Eddie of murder.

   24. JRJoe Rogan16:52

       But he was acquitted.

   25. MSMike Sarraille16:54

       He was acquitted.

   26. JRJoe Rogan16:54

       Yes. But they still don't appreciate that he was acquitted. Like, they still treat him like he's guilty.

   27. MSMike Sarraille17:01

       Some of the things I've seen in the press, um, and, and I'll keep reporters out of it. One, I can't remember their names, but, uh, a lot of the liberal news media, uh, just have painted him as a war criminal, bottom line. And his life has been impacted. If you look even at... So, first off, NCIS-

   28. ASAndy Stumpf17:20

       Naval Criminal Investigation Service.

   29. MSMike Sarraille17:22

       The branch in San Diego was never held, held accountable for, let's just say, bad practices that they, uh, implemented while trying to bring Eddie down. They also had a hard on. NCIS is not always, uh, your friend. And they're looking to make a name for themselves as well. And in fact, I was, I was investigated the day I retired by the same crew of people from NCIS San Diego, uh, only six months previous to when the whole Eddie Gallagher thing, uh, uh, sort of came on. But, uh, I mean, they tapped or they put a bug into Eddie's lawyer's emails so that they could read all the documents coming into that lawyer. They, they did some pretty, uh, pretty lame tactics and they were nev- never held accountable.

   30. JRJoe Rogan18:10

       Is that... Is it legal to do that?
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   Yeah, if I could…

   1. MSMike Sarraille30:00

      terrible. Look what they're doing to the recruits. We need to dial this down. We need to dial this back," like I have to do at the office. Like they don't have a comprehension of like what is necessary to get the job done and what you guys have to do.

   2. ASAndy Stumpf30:13

      Yeah, if I could rewind the clock back to 2010, my last deployment, and you take somebody who says that the training that we are talking about is unnecessary, like why don't you just get in my hip pocket for tonight? Why don't you just come with me on target and at the end of this, we're gonna do a debrief, and you let me know how difficult you think the training should be so you can perform at this level in an environment that might take your life? And they're gonna go, "Okay." Well, I don't know what they would say, but I would assume they would say-... "Yeah, you guys can make this as, really as hard as possible, and I'm totally good with you gassing people, and maybe you should gas them for longer many more times, and you should do this." It's the, it would blow their fucking mind what is actually required to be able to perform in that environment. They, and I can't fault them for not understanding that, because they just don't have exposure to it.

   3. MSMike Sarraille30:56

      We've gotten comfortable. We've gotten way too comfortable here. A- and if they saw the atrocities that we saw over there, they would understand why, you know, evil exists and it, you, you've heard the Ralph, uh, Waldo Emerson quote, "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to stand by and, and do nothing." And that, I mean, you, you, we saw ISIS throwing gay men from seven-story roofs with the people in the town watching. Uh, there is evil and, unfortunately, sometimes, uh, you've gotta go to hell to send somebody to hell. It's a, it's a famous quote. Um, it's an ugly job. Uh, I think you said it best. I, I watched an interview where you said, "War leaves a fingerprint."

   4. ASAndy Stumpf31:41

      Yeah.

   5. MSMike Sarraille31:42

      It leaves a fingerprint and, and that fingerprint will always be a part of our, our DNA. Um, and I question some of the things we did and, and the outcomes of the war. And, and I even went back as a BUD/S instructor. I was, I was the junior officer training course director for the SEALs that graduated BUD/S, and my job in one month was to turn them into ground force commanders, GFCs as we call it, and I worked a Hell Week evolution. And when I worked it, I was the, uh, not the, what do you call it, the, not the phase officer, but the OIC for the, the, the evolution.

   6. ASAndy Stumpf32:12

      Oh, probably just like the shift lead or something like that.

   7. MSMike Sarraille32:14

      Yeah, the shift lead. And the first time I, I looked at the guys and I'm like, "Oh my God, we're gonna kill these kids." And they're like, "Hey, hey, Mike, calm down. We thought that the first time we saw this training as well." And we've, we've all been through it, but when you're watching it-

   8. ASAndy Stumpf32:25

      It takes you back when you go back and actually... 'Cause you go through it the first time and it's so abstract because it's just day after day after day, and you go back as an instructor and there's not enough instructors to, in just first phase, which is where Hell Week occurs. They augment from all the other phases because it's a 24-hour training pipeline from a Sunday till about Friday afternoon. And you watch people who are on the verge of death, and they're there voluntarily. And even though you went through it, it, you sit back and you're like, "Holy shit. Like, did we look that bad?" I remember specifically asking other instructors, like, "Do you think that we looked as bad as they look when we were in training? 'Cause these dudes are the walking dead." I, it's gnarly.

   9. MSMike Sarraille33:05

      That's what I was just gonna say. It, it... Joe, you gotta understand, we've got medical personnel out there. We've got ambulances out there. Sometimes you have a psychologist out there. I mean, we are going through a checklist to mitigate risk down to the lowest, uh, level. But the interesting thing about the assessment and selection is, you know, we used to play a game, who's gonna make it through the training?

   10. ASAndy Stumpf33:25

       (laughs) Good luck.

   11. MSMike Sarraille33:25

       And you are 90% wrong.

   12. ASAndy Stumpf33:27

       Yeah.

   13. MSMike Sarraille33:27

       I mean, we had a NCAA athlete in one of the classes, a f- a starting fullback. Didn't last two weeks of the... How long is the training? Uh, eight-

   14. ASAndy Stumpf33:35

       BUD/S, 26 weeks.

   15. MSMike Sarraille33:36

       Yeah, 26 weeks. Didn't last past the, uh, the second week. And, and I, even going through it, 'cause I was a prior Recon Marine, so I thought I, I knew what they were looking for, made a judgment on some of the kids that were going through BUD/S with me. One of them was a little Asian kid who was sort of passive, uh, and unassuming.

   16. ASAndy Stumpf33:54

       Is he an astronaut now?

   17. MSMike Sarraille33:55

       Yes.

   18. ASAndy Stumpf33:56

       (laughs)

   19. MSMike Sarraille33:56

       And at the end of Hell Week, at the end of Hell Week, I'd look down the line and I think we started with 250, we ended up with 25. And there's this little Asian kid that weighs probably 140, 150 pounds. I'm like, "Huh. Wow, was I wrong assessing that kid as a, as a fellow student to him." And we ended up in the same, uh, SEAL team. I watched him earn the Silver Star literally with my eyes. Or, or he, he did something that he was awarded the Silver Star for. Then he went back and, and became a Navy doctor. And yeah, became a astronaut all by the age of 34, and his name is Dr. Johnny Kim. And he's, he's the most humble dude that you'll ever meet.

   20. ASAndy Stumpf34:32

       Classic underachiever.

   21. MSMike Sarraille34:33

       Yeah.

   22. JRJoe Rogan34:34

       So what is it when you're looking at them and they look like they're at the verge of death? Like, what, what part of the program are they going through?

   23. ASAndy Stumpf34:41

       I would say when you're seeing them at that phase, it's gonna be the trenches of Hell Week. 'Cause that is literally a 24-hour-long, from Sunday evening, somewhere between sun going down at 6:00 PM to whenever they start it with breakout at 8:00 PM, all the way through to Friday. You're gonna get about two hours of sleep on Wednesday. So it's gonna be Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, they're, they're absolute walking dead. By-

   24. JRJoe Rogan35:03

       Is...

   25. ASAndy Stumpf35:04

       By design.

   26. JRJoe Rogan35:04

       They're just barely getting any sleep at all?

   27. ASAndy Stumpf35:07

       Two hours of sleep on Wednesday, that's it.

   28. JRJoe Rogan35:08

       That's it. So-

   29. ASAndy Stumpf35:09

       You might get like some micro rewards because everything is like a team evolution. There's some really famous pictures of people running with boats on their heads, and if you win an evolution, you maybe get five minutes of standing there by yourself. Or the instructors might let you put your boat down and they'll not pay attention to you for a little bit so you can get like a micro nap. Other than that, they're, they're just moving constantly. Evolution after evolution after evolution after evolution.

   30. JRJoe Rogan35:31

       How can you stay awake that long?
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   Yeah. …

   1. JRJoe Rogan45:00

      owes you something-

   2. ASAndy Stumpf45:01

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan45:01

      ... you think that you're entitled to something, you think that you're working too hard. The, the people that excel in any endeavor in life are the people that are willing to work the smartest, the hardest, and the people that are able to get out of their own fucking way and realize that they're task-oriented, they, they get the job done, whatever the fuck it is. People that concentrate on ... And, and this is something that's enforced in our society, people that concentrate on the, the negative aspects of things, like the, like, that, you know, "Why is it so hard? Why is this, why does this person have something that I don't?" You know, "Why do they get a chance and I don't?" And that, that kind of thinking is encouraged in our culture today. It's, like, encouraged that if you didn't succeed, it's more likely that somebody fucked you over. It's, it's less likely that you're kind of fucking lazy or entitled or, you know, and nobody wants to tell anybody that today. Nobody wants to tell you, but you're getting worked up on.

   4. ASAndy Stumpf45:58

      Well, or you'll get ganged up on-

   5. JRJoe Rogan45:59

      Yes.

   6. ASAndy Stumpf45:59

      ... by the people who are used to being told, like, "It's not me, it's everything else-"

   7. JRJoe Rogan46:02

      Yeah.

   8. ASAndy Stumpf46:02

      ... externally." Yeah, I don't know where the end state leads to that, but I don't, I don't think it's awesome. I don't, I don't think it's the place where we wanna end up.

   9. JRJoe Rogan46:10

      It's only awesome for people who don't think like that, 'cause then they excel. (laughs)

   10. ASAndy Stumpf46:15

       It, uh, it's like- (laughs)

   11. JRJoe Rogan46:17

       You know what I'm saying?

   12. ASAndy Stumpf46:18

       Yeah.

   13. JRJoe Rogan46:18

       I mean, for, you know, I had this conversation, uh, with someone about, uh, uh, Gordon Ryan, like, why is Gordon Ryan so good? And I said, "Well, one of the reasons why he's so good is he works every day."

   14. ASAndy Stumpf46:28

       Yeah.

   15. JRJoe Rogan46:29

       He's, he's 365 days a year, he doesn't take any days off.

   16. ASAndy Stumpf46:31

       Almost like he's dedicated his life to it.

   17. JRJoe Rogan46:33

       Yeah.

   18. ASAndy Stumpf46:33

       Crazy, right?

   19. JRJoe Rogan46:34

       Yeah, crazy.

   20. ASAndy Stumpf46:34

       Who would've thunk?

   21. JRJoe Rogan46:35

       Crazy. I mean, you, you wa- everybody wants to be a bad motherfucker, but nobody wants to do what it takes-

   22. ASAndy Stumpf46:39

       Yeah.

   23. JRJoe Rogan46:39

       ... to become that. And therein lies the problem, I think. So, one, I, I think the next epidemic that we need to confront and confront now is victimhood. It's, it's permeating the United States-

   24. ASAndy Stumpf46:50

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan46:51

       ... uh, rapidly. But you're awarded for it.

   26. ASAndy Stumpf46:53

       You're rewarded for it.

   27. JRJoe Rogan46:54

       But you look at Gordon Ryan, everyone who looks at him on social media thinks it just came overnight.

   28. ASAndy Stumpf46:59

       Well, he just got canceled on social media. I can't believe you brought that up.

   29. JRJoe Rogan47:01

       Yeah, what is happening with this v-

   30. ASAndy Stumpf47:03

       They shut his account down.
5. 1:00:00 – 1:10:09

   (laughs) …

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:00:00

      is an image of him flying through the air-

   2. ASAndy Stumpf1:00:04

      (laughs)

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:00:04

      ... delivering this haymaker to an unconscious Michael Bisping. Find Henderson's logo. I mean, this is like Henderson's fuck you to Michael Bisping. He literally made a logo of him hit- hitting, hitting Bisping when he was out cold.

   4. ASAndy Stumpf1:00:18

      It's a power statement.

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:00:19

      That punch right there-

   6. ASAndy Stumpf1:00:20

      Oh my God.

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:00:20

      ... in the left corner.

   8. ASAndy Stumpf1:00:21

      (laughs)

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:00:21

      That's him. That is him. That, that is that. That's his most, uh, you know, historic moment, his most brutal, legendary moment.

   10. ASAndy Stumpf1:00:33

       (laughs) Look at the one with the red coat. (laughs)

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:00:34

       I mean, you know how crazy that is? Look, the red coat one is hilarious.

   12. ASAndy Stumpf1:00:38

       (laughs)

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:00:38

       But you know how brutal that is? Like the guy's fucking logo is him delivering a flying right hand, and he had one of the greatest right hands in the history of the sport. If you ever hug Dan Henderson...He feels like this table. He's made out of wood. There are certain dudes, they just have like a different composition to their body. Like, I talked to his massage therapist, and she was like, "His fucking body is like... You, you can't get in there." Like, she'd be, like, trying to mas- you're not going anywhere. It's so... He's so fucking dense. And when he would deliver a right hand, it was just preposterous, and he would load that fucking thing up and just always look for it, always look for it. And when he landed it, you're fucked. He knocked out Fedor. That fucking guy is a middleweight, and he knocked out one of the greatest heavyweights of all time in a fight where he was in trouble. He got caught in a bad situation, he was on the bottom, Fedor is cracking him, and he escapes. He sneaks out the side and cracks him with an uppercut, and then, and then lands a couple follow-up shots and puts him out. That motherfucker could punch. And imagine his logo is him flying through the air-

   14. ASAndy Stumpf1:01:46

       (laughs)

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:01:46

       ... hitting an unconscious opponent.

   16. ASAndy Stumpf1:01:49

       It's, it's quite the boss move, for sure. (laughs)

   17. NANarrator1:01:52

       That, that is like pulling your dick out and, you know, laying it on the table.

   18. ASAndy Stumpf1:01:56

       And having a big old hog.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:01:57

       Big old hog.

   20. ASAndy Stumpf1:01:58

       (laughs)

   21. NANarrator1:02:00

       Big old donkey dick.

   22. ASAndy Stumpf1:02:01

       I mean- (laughs)

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:02:02

       Have you ever been hugged by dudes where you're just like, "Don't ever hug me again"?

   24. NANarrator1:02:06

       Yeah, all the time. I fucking hug all those guys. Yeah.

   25. ASAndy Stumpf1:02:09

       Insane.

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:02:10

       Yeah, man. I mean, literally, I mean, look, when you meet Brock Lesnar, you're like, "What the fuck are you?" I had a joke about Brock Lesnar. I'm like, "I'm not worried that Brock Lesnar would fuck me. I'm worried he would use me as a condom to fuck something way bigger."

   27. ASAndy Stumpf1:02:23

       (laughs)

   28. NANarrator1:02:23

       (laughs) Breaking into the zoo, like, "Where are we going?" "Shut the fuck up!"

   29. ASAndy Stumpf1:02:28

       (laughs)

   30. NANarrator1:02:28

       "Okay."

Episode duration: 2:27:03