Joe Rogan Experience #1904 - Neil deGrasse Tyson

1. 0:00 – 2:54

   Webb Telescope vs. Hubble: why JWST is a leap (and why it almost didn’t deploy)

   1. NANarrator0:00

      (drum music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (energetic music)

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:12

      I don't wanna... Every one of my sentences to sound like Barry White.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:15

      Is that what it sounds like-

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:16

      I- i- in-

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      ... in your ears?

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:17

      ... headphones, they do. It's like, "Oh hey, baby."

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:20

      (laughs)

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:20

      (laughs) I, I just can't. Whereas without the headphones I, I'm just regular.

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:24

      All right, ready?

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:25

       I'm ready.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:25

       Good to see you.

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:26

       Hey.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:27

       What's happening?

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:27

       Joe.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       I'm excited to talk to you. I'm excited to talk to you about a bunch of things, but, uh, I've been paying attention to all the, uh, web telescope stuff.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:35

       Oh my gosh.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:36

       Fascinating.

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:36

       It's all that.

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:37

       Could you please explain the difference in the ability of... The capabilities of this telescope versus what we've had previously?

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson0:45

       Yeah. So first of all, it's all that, and the excitement was in part because so much could have gone wrong with this thing, and the fact that nothing went wrong, we were ecstatic.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:58

       Could you explain the... How complicated it is-

   22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:00

       Yeah.

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:01

       ... to get something-

   24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02

       Here-

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:02

       ... like that.

   26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02

       ... yeah. Here's... So one of the great challenges that we face is how do you put a telescope in orbit that's bigger than the rocket that's gonna launch it? Is that even possible? And the Hubble Telescope, do you know what set the size of that 94-inch diameter mirror? That's the biggest mirror you could fit in the payload of the space shuttle. (laughs)

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:25

       Oh.

   28. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:26

       That's what set the size of that telescope. Big as it was, we would've made it bigger if the space shuttle were bigger. Now, I don't know if you've seen the Hubble Telescope. There's a replica of it at the Air and Space Museum in, in-

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:37

       Let's take a... Let's look a photo of it.

   30. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:39

       Uh, and it'll just... Uh, it's there hanging from the ceiling. But if you wanna know how... It's about the size of a Greyhound bus. So the space shuttle deployed a Greyhound bus into orbit, which is the Hubble Space Telescope. And the, the value of the Hubble was that you could update it, w- by s... With servicing missions, and it was serviced many times. And as a result, it lived within our culture for three decades. There are people who came of age only ever knowing the majesty of the universe as delivered to you by the Hubble Telescope. 30 years worth of this. Think about it.
2. 2:54 – 5:34

   Folding a giant mirror: segmented hexagons, sunshield layers, and Lagrange-point orbit

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson2:54

      So here's the thing. So notice the Hubble Telescope, its diameter is, is this spherical shape that fits in this spherical payload of the space shuttle. So now we wanna put a bigger telescope into orbit. How do you do that? And so this is where you need engineers, clever engineers. We say, "Here's a rocket, one of the most powerful rockets we can use, but the fairing, that's the place where you hold the payload, can only be so big." And they say, "All right, why don't we fold the telescope?" Now, how are you gonna fold the mirror? Oh, you turn the mirror into segments, hexagons. Hexagons, one of only three shapes that can tile a surface. A square, a triangle, and a hexagon. No other shape can do this. So... Well, you can have other irregular shapes that can match up. Uh, you can tessellate, what it's called. But if you have a reg... what's called a regular polygon... So here, uh, uh, in the image there, what you can see is all of the mirror segments. Those fold into a narrow structure along with the, the unfurling, uh, uh, uh, solar panels as well as the heat shield. Uh, notice that was made at Northrop Grumman. By the way, Grumman has a long history in helping NASA put stuff in space. The LEM, Lunar Excursion Module, remember that?

   2. JRJoe Rogan4:19

      Mm-hmm.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson4:19

      The thing that landed on the moon? That was designed and built in Bethpage, Long Island at Grumman Aerospace. And so this is... And you go to Bethpage today, people still stand tall 'cause they had aunts and uncles who worked on that project. Space, uh, is a, is a force of nature unto itself in our sense of pride, in our sense of achievement, in our sense of what operates on civilization to take us into the future, lest we continue to regress and move back into the cave-

   4. JRJoe Rogan4:55

      Mm-hmm.

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson4:55

      ... which we came. There it is all folded up in the image that we now see-

   6. JRJoe Rogan4:59

      Oh, wow.

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson4:59

      ... for those who are watching this. And you slip that into a fairing, and then you launch it a million miles from Earth, opposite the sun from Earth, and it unfurls like petals of a flower.

   8. JRJoe Rogan5:15

      Is there an animation of how that goes down?

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson5:17

      Oh, yeah. Yeah, they have... Yeah, a slow-mo animation. Y- y- sure he can find it, and it's the deployment, uh, how it deployed as it was on its way to its location, which is one of the Lagrangian points in orbit. For every two objects that orbit each other, there are five Lagrangian points.

   10. JRJoe Rogan5:34

       Oh, yeah.

3. 5:34 – 11:11

   Infrared astronomy: heat, fog lights, redshift, and seeing the universe’s earliest galaxies

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson5:34

      So here we are unfolding. So there we have solar panels coming out the side, and there's the, uh, uh, uh, communication, uh, antenna. And it has a unique set of baffles that shield it from sunlight so that the mirror and the detector can be very, very cold because it's designed... It's specially tuned to observe infrared....that comes to us from space.

   2. JRJoe Rogan6:06

      Mm.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson6:07

      And infrared, as you may know, we, we normally associate it with heat. Well, how am I, how am I gonna d- detect something that's very, very cold in space if my detector is hotter than what I'm trying to detect?

   4. JRJoe Rogan6:19

      Mm.

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson6:20

      I, you can't... y- there's no way to see something that is warmer than the temperature of your detector, so your detector has to be very cold, extremely cold. So, these are the baffles and it... there are many, many layers so that when sunlight hits one layer, that layer absorbs it and re-radiates it in both directions, forward and back, so there's less that goes to the next layer. So then, the next layer re-radiates it and it... by the time it gets to the fourth layer, hardly anything goes towards the telescope.

   6. JRJoe Rogan6:50

      Ah.

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson6:51

      And so it is insulated and it drops to deep space cold temperatures. And it's literally where the sun don't shine right now.

   8. JRJoe Rogan7:01

      So, the solar panels are getting this solar energy from the bottom-

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:05

      Yeah, because it... that's the direction the sun is, correct.

   10. JRJoe Rogan7:07

       ... and it's ra- so it radiates off the bottom and those are the things that protect it and l- you see how all those layers-

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:12

       All the layers, yeah. Yeah, they-

   12. JRJoe Rogan7:13

       ... fan out. Amazing.

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:13

       It... yeah. It... and it's specifically tuned for the infrared part of the spectrum. You remember the spectrum? So you have like visible light, right? Uh, we... ROYGBIV, right? If you wanna remember it. Red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, violet. Those are the parts of the spectrum we can see. But there's light outside of this. There is like beyond the violet, there's ultraviolet. That's where... how you get that, and below the red is infrared, not visible to the human eye. By the way, insects can see ultraviolet. We can't.

   14. JRJoe Rogan7:46

       Oh.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson7:46

       That's why bug zappers work. You put a UV light in a bug zapper, the, the, the bugs say, "Oh my gosh, I love ultraviolet!" And then they get zapped. And we're old enough to remember before there were bug zappers, you'd had a, a picnic bulb for, uh, for twilight picnics and it's like a yellow bulb, kind of yellow-amber bulb. It was a bug bulb. It was sold as bug bulbs. It's not that they repelled bugs. It's that the bugs couldn't even see it 'cause their whole vision is shifted towards the ultraviolet.

   16. JRJoe Rogan8:18

       Oh.

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson8:19

       And it leaves out the deep red.

   18. JRJoe Rogan8:21

       Oh.

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson8:21

       Yeah, so it's... that's evidence we're smarter than bugs. (laughs)

   20. JRJoe Rogan8:24

       That's one piece, luckily.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson8:26

       (laughs) That's one piece of evidence that we're smarter than bugs. So, just to, to bring that to a closure, uh, the earliest forming galaxies in the universe, um, radiated a lot of ultraviolet. So you might say, "Well, let's get an ultraviolet telescope." No, because 14 billion years later, the expansion of the universe has redshifted the ultraviolet into the infrared.

   22. JRJoe Rogan8:52

       Oh.

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson8:52

       So if you wanna see the birth of galaxies, you gotta know what they look like in the here and the now. And in the here and the now, it's in the infrared. So this is a telescope-

   24. JRJoe Rogan9:03

       Wow.

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson9:03

       ... specifically tuned to see galaxies born at the edge of the universe, and infrared also allows you to see deep into gas clouds.

   26. JRJoe Rogan9:13

       Now, when they're showing you an image like this...

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson9:15

       So right here, this is the Pillars of Creation, which were so named at the time Hubble first attempted this. We were gaga over the Hubble image of this, and now, like the, the JWST, oh my gosh. For those who are more prone to religion, some have called this The Hand of God because if you look at the pillars, um, you can kinda picture like a, you know, (fingers snapping) a thumb and, uh-

   28. JRJoe Rogan9:39

       Fingers?

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson9:39

       ... fingers, yeah. So... but, but regardless, this is nearby. This is the telescope peering deep into gas clouds that otherwise would enshroud what's going on, and you get to see stars being born, planets being born. And so what's remarkable about JW... JWST is that to be tuned for the edge of the universe and the birth of galaxies is the same properties you would want to see the birth of stars. A star is born right in front of your nose that would otherwise be cloaked by gas.

   30. JRJoe Rogan10:19

       Oh.
4. 11:11 – 13:08

   What Webb can do now: power gains, non-serviceability, and micrometeoroid reality

   1. JRJoe Rogan11:11

      Now, how much bigger is this telescope?

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:14

      So, um, it's abou- so you wanna think about collecting area, and I forgot the exact number. Uh, something like eight times, uh, around there, uh, more powerful in the sense of it can see things, uh, eight times dimmer. Uh, yeah, that... there you go.

   3. JRJoe Rogan11:29

      Oh, there you go. Wow.

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:29

      So that's, uh, two... it's about two and a half squared. It's about eight times the area and-

   5. JRJoe Rogan11:34

      And the technology obviously is improved as well, so like the ability that-

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:39

      Well, our, our detectors are better. And, uh, let me remind you that when the Hubble was designed, it was designed in like the 1980s and it was scheduled to go up. Uh, and then we had the Challenger accident.

   7. JRJoe Rogan11:50

      Oh.

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson11:51

      And that delayed the shuttle program, so there's Hubble sitting there in mothballs with a... with an old Microsoft chip, and by the time it launched, it was already not as fast as it could've been. And so the very first servicing mission swapped all that out and put in, uh, better...... uh, uh, uh, methods and tools for measuring what it is we always needed it to do. So, this is... so one sad part about this is that it's not serviceable. We have no access to that point in space a million miles from the moon. We haven't left low Earth orbit since 1972. We're not going out a million miles from Earth to fix a telescope.

   9. JRJoe Rogan12:29

      Mm-hmm.

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson12:30

       So that's unfortunate. Maybe a robotic fix? I don't know. Or to refill some of the, the fuel. It needs fuel to station keep.

   11. JRJoe Rogan12:39

       Didn't it get hit by a micrometeor?

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson12:41

       Yeah. Well, that's, that's, that's the breaks. (laughs) When you're in space- (laughs)

   13. JRJoe Rogan12:45

       Yeah.

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson12:45

       ... yeah. But, um, it's not... it doesn't affect the overall performance.

   15. JRJoe Rogan12:49

       That's amazing.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson12:50

       Yeah, yeah. Well, it's huge and, and micrometeors will do small damage, but-

   17. JRJoe Rogan12:54

       What-

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson12:54

       You don't, you don't want it in the middle of a meteor storm. That would be-

   19. JRJoe Rogan12:57

       Right.

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson12:57

       ... uh, totally bad. Yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan12:59

       And d- do they, I mean, they obviously know like where some of the, uh, asteroid belts are and where some of the like-

   22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:06

       Yeah, so the-

   23. JRJoe Rogan13:06

       ... nearby Earth objects are?

5. 13:08 – 15:16

   Naming in astronomy: why ‘buying a star name’ is fake and how real naming works

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:08

      Yeah, so f- in, in this context, we have... so first, most asteroids are in the asteroid belt, so that's between Mars and Jupiter. So, I, I have an asteroid named after me on Earth.

   2. JRJoe Rogan13:19

      Congratulations.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:20

      I, I don't mean to brag or anything, but, um-

   4. JRJoe Rogan13:22

      Can't you like get a star named after you online?

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:24

      Not leg-... not, not-

   6. JRJoe Rogan13:25

      Not legally?

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:25

      ... not authentically. (laughs)

   8. JRJoe Rogan13:26

      You just get robbed? (laughs)

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:27

      (laughs)

   10. JRJoe Rogan13:28

       They just pretend-

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:29

       They'll send you a map-

   12. JRJoe Rogan13:29

       ... that it's yours?

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:30

       ... with your, with your, with your name drawn in the map and-

   14. JRJoe Rogan13:32

       So you pay for a piece of paper.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:33

       Yeah, they claim that it goes, gets registered with the astrophysicist, but it doesn't. Um-

   16. JRJoe Rogan13:38

       Oh.

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson13:38

       No. W- there's only one way we name stars and that's by committee and by traditions and this sort of thing. Uh, it's... they're fascinating traditions. So planets are named after Roman gods and p- planet moons, uh, are named after Greek characters in the life of the Greek god who's the counterpart to that Roman god.

   18. JRJoe Rogan14:01

       Wow.

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson14:01

       So Jupiter, for example, one of its moons is Ganymede. Ganymede was the manservant of Zeus, and Zeus and Jupiter were corresponding, uh, gods in-

   20. JRJoe Rogan14:12

       Mm-hmm.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson14:12

       ... Greek and Roman. And not only that, two-thi- what's the number? Is it a- about half? Somewhere around there, of all the stars in the night sky that have names have Arabic names. So in my field, we have deep respect for people who made great inroads into understanding the natural universe, and the golden age of Islam from a thousand years ago made material contributions in this regard. And of course, Greek and Roman legends and this sort of thing. So there they are and its influence on Western culture. So yeah, no, the universe is a fun place.

   22. JRJoe Rogan14:45

       Pretty fun place.

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson14:46

       Oh, yeah.

   24. JRJoe Rogan14:47

       So this James Webb Telescope, in terms of its ability to recognize things, like what magnitude of improvement are we talking about from the-

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson14:56

       Yeah, factor of 10.

   26. JRJoe Rogan14:57

       ... the Hubble?

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson14:57

       Yeah. Fa- factor of 10.

   28. JRJoe Rogan14:58

       Factor of 10.

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson14:58

       Yeah, easily. That's right. Well, the... a factor of 10 for the things Hubble could see, but it's incalculable when it sees things that Hubble could have never seen-

   30. JRJoe Rogan15:08

       Mm-hmm.
6. 15:16 – 19:22

   Early JWST science and ‘Generation Exoplanet’: how discovery usually really happens

   1. JRJoe Rogan15:16

      So what has changed in terms of our understanding? The, the, the, Webb has been in the, in the million-mile orbit or however far a- away it is for how long now?

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson15:29

      Uh, well, it got there and then we did some engineering, so I, I guess a year, year and a half. Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan15:34

      And, and what has changed in our understanding?

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson15:37

      So that's, that's been people's first question, and what I wanna do is temper that to say something a little different. So yes, we expect James Webb to make great discoveries. We expect that. But the first order of business is hardly ever, "Let's discover something new today." It's, "Here's something that we have limited understanding of. Let's improve on that." And in so doing, we deepen our understanding of how things work in the universe. That's doesn't always involve overturning a previous idea or discovering something that nobody ordered. All right? That will happen. We fully expect that to happen, but we targeted parts of the sky initially because we know other telescopes have gone there before, and we're gonna say, "How can we further advance and deepen our understanding?" One thing it's gonna be able to do and it has already done, we have... do you know how many exoplanets there are? And I don't know how many of your audience was born after 1995. How many 27-year-olds and younger?

   5. JRJoe Rogan16:42

      Probably quite a few.

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:43

      Quite a few. Okay. So I will take this opportunity to knight them Generation Exoplanet. (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan16:52

      Ah. I see what you did there.

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson16:53

      1995, uh, was the first exoplanet discovered, a planet orbiting another star. And, uh, I'll never forget that because it was my first time on national television. Uh, I was freshly minted as director of the Hayden Planetarium in New York City, and NBC sent a... uh, New York City, it's, it's the media news headquarters, right? Of all the networks. So NBC sent an action cam. They interviewed me 'cause of my title, not 'cause they knew or gave a crap who I was. Uh, my title was Director of the Planetarium. And so I gave my best professorial reply. I said, "Well, the Doppler shift, this is how it's discovered and what we do and how we measure it." And, and I was describing the fact that when you discover these planets, you don't actually see the planet. You see the effect of the planet's gravity on the host star. And so if you watch the host star, the host star like jiggles, okay, just a little bit in response to the planet going back and forth around it. So you're measuring the star. So I, I motioned that like with my hips, and that evening on the evening news-That's all they showed, was me jiggling my hips. (laughs)

   9. JRJoe Rogan18:04

      (laughs)

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:04

       And I said, "Oh, my gosh. Okay, that's how you're gonna do this."

   11. JRJoe Rogan18:09

       (laughs)

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:09

       "Okay. You don't want me to be Professor Neil, you want me to be Soundbite Neil."

   13. JRJoe Rogan18:13

       Yeah.

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:14

       All right, so from then on, I practiced my soundbites.

   15. JRJoe Rogan18:17

       Mm.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:17

       And a soundbite's like, three sentences.

   17. JRJoe Rogan18:20

       Oh, so you recognized this is the format now.

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:22

       Correct.

   19. JRJoe Rogan18:23

       Yeah.

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:24

       And I said, "I, I can't just give them my stump speech as a professor of astrophysics. I, it has to work in their medium." And I, and so I s- went home and stood in front of the mirror and had people just shout out things to me, anything in the universe, any idea, object, person, place, or thing, and I would come up with like three sentences that are-

   21. JRJoe Rogan18:44

       Wow.

   22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:44

       ... interesting, make you smile, and be tasty enough to wanna tell someone else, the anatomy of a soundbite. So try it.

   23. JRJoe Rogan18:51

       Mm.

   24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:51

       Say anything in the whole universe.

   25. JRJoe Rogan18:52

       How do we know how-

   26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:54

       No, no, j- just one word.

   27. JRJoe Rogan18:55

       Okay.

   28. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:55

       Just say anything.

   29. JRJoe Rogan18:56

       The Big Bang.

   30. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson18:57

       Big Bang. Ooh. The birth of spacetime energy, and everything we know and love about this universe. Occurred 14 billion years ago, and we have no idea what happened before it. And we're still expanding, as we will forever.
7. 19:22 – 24:07

   Is the Big Bang wrong? Newton vs. Einstein as a template for scientific ‘replacement’

   1. JRJoe Rogan19:22

      I read an article about the Webb Telescope, and th- th- what they were taking into consideration is the possibility that the Big Bang may be incorrect, and that m- the universe might be larger and older than we think.

   2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson19:37

      So, uh, I hesitate to ask what pages on the internet you hang out on. (laughs)

   3. JRJoe Rogan19:43

      It was a d- like a legit-

   4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson19:45

      Okay.

   5. JRJoe Rogan19:45

      It wasn't saying the universe is older.

   6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson19:48

      Yes.

   7. JRJoe Rogan19:48

      It's saying as more data and new information comes in, there is a distinct possibility that the Big Bang might just be the r- it just might explain the reach of the technology and not the actual scale of the universe itself.

   8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson20:02

      Okay, so the way to think about this is, and this is the way science has worked since basically the year 1600 where Galileo sort of starts codifying what people knew probably should be happening but no one really did it in large scale, if you have an idea about something, then you test it multiple ways and get other people to test it. And if the tests give you consistent results, you have a new understanding of the universe. When that happens, that knowledge of the universe doesn't go away. It doesn't get undone. What happens typically is you have a deeper understanding of the universe in which that understanding gets embedded.

   9. JRJoe Rogan20:46

      Mm.

   10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson20:47

       And you realize that you only understood a small part of a larger whole. But the small parts you did understand, where you had multiple experiments that confirmed it, that doesn't change. So the, the cleanest example of this, and I'll get back to your question, is Newton's Laws of Motion and Gravity. He, uh, you know, did anyone see anything move faster than a galloping horse in his day? Probably not. And so, the News Laws of Motion and Gravity worked. They worked not only for galloping horses, it worked for the moon in orbit around the Earth, and the Earth in orbit around the sun, and Jupiter's moons in orbit around Jupiter, all right, and for the planets. So, okay, but wait a minute, it doesn't work for Mercury. Mercury's orbit is not following Newton's Laws. Is it something wrong with the data? Let's check it. Data's correct. Oh my gosh, what's happening? Einstein comes along and says, "I have a new understanding of gravity and a new understanding of motion, and it accounts for this weirdness in Mercury's orbit."

   11. JRJoe Rogan21:54

       What was the weirdness?

   12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson21:56

       It just, w- it, it, its shape was not exactly what Newton's Laws of Gravity would give you. Its shape could only be accounted for when you throw in Einstein's Theory of General Relativity. Why? Because the sun's gravity is so monstrous and Mercury's orbiting close enough to it that it's being influenced by extra phenomenon going on in the universe that's the product of very high and significant gravity. And so, so then do we throw Newton out the window? No, actually. You know what Newton's Laws are? They're what E- they're what Einstein's Laws look like when you put in low speeds and low gravity.

   13. JRJoe Rogan22:38

       Mm.

   14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson22:38

       If you put in low speeds and l- they become Newton's Laws in that limit. Newton's Laws don't stop working where they used to work. We w- the Apollo to the moon used only Newton's Laws.

   15. JRJoe Rogan22:51

       Mm.

   16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson22:52

       Because Einstein didn't matter at those scales. The moon, and Earth, and, and rockets, we're not going fast enough for any of that to matter. But when you start going fast enough, you cannot use Newton's Laws. You have to use a deeper understanding. Now, where does Einstein take us? You go into the center of a black hole, you get black holes from Einstein, center of a black hole, there's a singularity. All the theories say the matter occupies zero volume, thereby having infinite density, and that's kinda weird. "What? No, you can't have infinite... No." That's a limit of Einstein's theory. That's where it breaks down. It's something of joke, that's where God divides by zero.

   17. JRJoe Rogan23:35

       (laughs)

   18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson23:35

       Remember in math class? You can't divide by zero.

   19. JRJoe Rogan23:37

       Right.

   20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson23:37

       It's, it's not, not defined or not allowed. So in Einstein's equations, we're dividing by zero at the singularity. So we all know that as brilliant as Einstein was and as successful as his general theory of relativity has been, it has limits. And one limit is the center of a black hole, and another limit is the very birth of the universe itself. But getting back to your question, the Big Bang.So, we have top people working on

8. 24:07 – 28:53

   Multiverse and ‘false vacuum’ analogies: what could be ‘outside’ the Big Bang

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson24:07

      trying to resolve the singularity problem. And in so doing, you get to some ideas that, well, maybe our big bang... 'Cause the big bang's not gonna go away. All the data support this. So, now I've got this big bang thing, okay? And, well, is this embedded in something bigger?

   2. JRJoe Rogan24:25

      Mm.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson24:26

      Ooh.

   4. JRJoe Rogan24:27

      Ooh.

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson24:29

      So, when you put, like, quantum physics and general relativity and you try to come up with some bigger understanding, deeper understanding... String theorists have been all into this... You get a multiverse. We didn't pull that out of our ass. That came outta the equations. So, how old is the multiverse? I don't know. It's definitely older than our universe 'cause it birthed our universe, and it birthed other universes, and it birthed... E- the way the equations drive it, an infinity of universes. This is the idea that maybe there's a version of us in another-

   6. JRJoe Rogan25:04

      Yeah.

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:04

      ... where I'm bald and you got the afro, and who is... But everything else is the same.

   8. JRJoe Rogan25:09

      And also a version where everything's the same.

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:11

      Where everything would be the same, yes.

   10. JRJoe Rogan25:13

       Everything you've ever said has been said before exactly in the same order.

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:16

       Correct. There's no reason to presume that everything in this universe isn't... or hasn't already played out e- in the exact way in another one of these infinite universes.

   12. JRJoe Rogan25:28

       And in an infinite number of different ways.

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:31

       Correct. And so, that's, that is what comes outta the equations. So, that makes the big bang a kind of a small part of a much larger whole.

   14. JRJoe Rogan25:39

       Mm.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:39

       And so, yeah, we're ready for that. But the fact that the universe had a beginning 14 billion years ago, and there's the cosmic microwave background, all of these features are intact. They're not gonna, all of a sudden, not apply. That's my point. That's my long answer to your-

   16. JRJoe Rogan25:56

       So, this thing-

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson25:57

       ... very clean question.

   18. JRJoe Rogan25:57

       ... that happened 14 billion years ago, what is the predominant theory of why?

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:05

       So, this multiverse concept gives us a reason why. Okay? So, um, it's like, imagine you're rolling around in a, in a basin, okay? And you're stable there, you're just fine, but then something kicks you out of the basin, and you didn't know that there's a huge hill to roll down after you come out of that basin. But you didn't know that. You thought y- everything was just fine.

   20. JRJoe Rogan26:35

       Mm-hmm.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson26:35

       You roll down that hill, you're gaining energy. At the bottom of the hill, something stops you, and then where does all that energy go? One of the hypotheses, and I'm highly simplifying here, is that the energy gained by rolling down a hill, and these are energy hills that would exist in this sort of higher dimensional space that we're talking about, that e- that energy has to manifest in that object somehow, and it becomes an explosion, and gives birth... With enough energy, it gives birth to matter, uh, everything that we know and love, and it expands, because when you concentrate that much energy in a small spot, that's the only thing you can do-

   22. JRJoe Rogan27:16

       I understand that you're-

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson27:17

       ... is expand.

   24. JRJoe Rogan27:17

       ... simplifying it, but I don't understand-

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson27:19

       Simplified in the sense that, um, I'm... by using this basin analogy-

   26. JRJoe Rogan27:23

       Right.

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson27:23

       ... and rolling down a hill, that there, there are equations of the energetics of a system, and this is called e- this is called a, um, uh, well, a w- a false vacuum. So, you can be in a place that's not the true bottom energy state of the system, but you think everything is fine, and... but it's not. And so, if you move around in among these hills and valleys, you end up birthing universes out the other side, and this multiverse concept actually delivers this for you-

   28. JRJoe Rogan27:58

       So-

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson27:58

       ... basically for free.

   30. JRJoe Rogan27:59

       ... that, that thought would be that the big bang is just one of many events that happen in the multiverse.
9. 28:53 – 38:18

   Species ‘bigotry’ and moral consistency: from ticks and mosquitoes to trees and mycelium

   1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson28:53

      I spent, I spent a whole section in this, in this book talking about, uh, people who love animals, um, and wanna care for them and don't wanna eat them, um, but they only love ones that are cuddly, that you-

   2. JRJoe Rogan29:04

      Oh, yeah, for sure.

   3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson29:05

      ... you'd make a, a plush toy out of it.

   4. JRJoe Rogan29:06

      My agent said that. She knows I hunt. She's like, "You should hunt pigs 'cause they're ugly."

   5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson29:10

      (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan29:12

      I'm like, "How dare you?"

   7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson29:14

      (laughs)

   8. JRJoe Rogan29:14

      "First of all, domesticated pigs are adorable."

   9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson29:18

      (laughs) They are, in fact.

   10. JRJoe Rogan29:18

       Yeah. Domesticated dogs are ugly, too, 'cause they're desperate.

   11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson29:22

       In fact, I have a, uh, a, I, I have a voice cameo of a pig in a Disney XD cartoon called Gravity Falls.

   12. JRJoe Rogan29:32

       (laughs)

   13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson29:32

       It's, it's a farmhouse and there's a pig that lives with everybody, and the pig eats some slop that the kids are told makes you smarter, and so... They bought it at a fair or something. So, they went to sleep putting the slop on their forehead, thinking it would get into their head and make them smart, but the pig sees it on their forehead and licks it off of their forehead, and then overnight, the pig becomes a supreme genius, builds an atom smasher, builds a voice translator, and while the pig is smart, I'm its voice. (laughs) It's-

   14. JRJoe Rogan30:01

       (laughs) Oh. That's hilarious.

   15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson30:03

       It's, it's cute. It's a cute, um-Uh, and so... But what was I talking about before-

   16. JRJoe Rogan30:09

       Big Bang, multiverses-

   17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson30:11

       Mm-mm.

   18. JRJoe Rogan30:11

       ... different laws of physics.

   19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson30:12

       Yeah, diff- slightly different laws of physics are a fascinating prospect.

   20. JRJoe Rogan30:15

       Mm.

   21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson30:15

       How that they might vary and how you might wanna avoid it. Oh, but I was talking about if you wanna save animals, um, I, I never seen, I've never seen anyone say, "Save the leeches." Uh-

   22. JRJoe Rogan30:27

       No, no one cares about bugs.

   23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson30:29

       ... or, or s- save the ticks. In particular, parasites. Save the mosquitoes. Mosquitoes, you know, the biggest enemy of humans, as big an enemy as we are to each other through warfare and the history of civilization. The greatest enemy to human life has been the mosquito. Responsible for more than a billion human deaths in the history of civilization. And so, here we have mosquitoes, ticks, uh, tapeworms, uh, you know, go down the list and you can ask if you're really into animals and don't wanna kill them, if you heard that ticks were endangered, would you start a movement to protect ticks? Would, would you do that? And if you would, uh, more power to you, but I'm thinking you're not.

   24. JRJoe Rogan31:20

       Why would you if you know about Lyme disease?

   25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson31:23

       This is my point.

   26. JRJoe Rogan31:24

       Yeah. Or-

   27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson31:25

       This, this is my point. I mean, by the way, the Lyme virus wants to live too, right?

   28. JRJoe Rogan31:29

       Right.

   29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson31:29

       The- these, these are all creatures on God's green Earth, right?

   30. JRJoe Rogan31:32

       Mm-hmm.
10. 38:18 – 53:42

    Psychedelics, objective reality, and near-death experience tests

    1. JRJoe Rogan38:18

       Have you ever done psychedelic mushrooms?

    2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson38:20

       I've never done anything psychedelic. Can, can, can I tell you why?

    3. JRJoe Rogan38:24

       Why? Yeah, please do.

    4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson38:25

       So I don't know if it's a good reason. I, I don't know if it's the, the best reason that can exist, but for me, it's a really good reason. The human mind barely works as it is. Barely. You ever see a book of, of, of optical illusions?

    5. JRJoe Rogan38:46

       Mm-hmm.

    6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson38:47

       Wh- no one doesn't love a good book of optical illusions. And you turn the page... "Oh, what is that? Oh, is it in the page? Out of the page? Is the line longer? Is it shorter?" And you're scratching your head. These are simple line drawings that confound the human mind's ability to interpret. Our brain barely works as an accurate decoder of the natural world around you. You now wanna stir in chemicals? I recognize it'll take you on a ride, but I have always valued objective reality. I don't want anything interfering with my understanding of what is actually happening in front of me. And there are people who would claim that under the influence, they're accessing some actual other reality. All I can say is, if in that other reality you can, you know, invent the James Webb Space Telescope, tell me about it. (laughs)

    7. JRJoe Rogan39:52

       Well-

    8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson39:52

       If, if you can f- figure out how to fly w- you know, and, and if you can do that, tell us about it. And there are people who say, "Oh, I visited Venus, uh, when I was at... on a head trip." "Did you bring back evidence?" Evidence matters, okay? "Did you bring back..." No, but it was in their head.

    9. JRJoe Rogan40:08

       Well, the material world, what we're talking about is actual physical objects, right? It's the... like, if you could bring back something-

    10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson40:15

        The physical world. The physical universe. Yeah.

    11. JRJoe Rogan40:16

        The physical... wh- what they're experiencing-

    12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson40:19

        Mm-hmm.

    13. JRJoe Rogan40:20

        ... is something akin to, well, you could call it a hallucination, you could call it, uh, a, a, a portal where physical reality doesn't exist and you only exist as consciousness.

    14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson40:33

        Here's my skepticism. Uh, I don't mind people saying that they visited another planet.

    15. JRJoe Rogan40:37

        Mm-hmm.

    16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson40:38

        Or whatev- wherever they're visiting-

    17. JRJoe Rogan40:39

        Right.

    18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson40:39

        ... or some a- astral plane.

    19. JRJoe Rogan40:41

        Mm-hmm.

    20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson40:41

        Okay? I, I don't... o- okay. Uh, I'm, you know, write a travel log and share it with people, as some have done. I guess I would ask whether what you experienced is part of an objective reality that we can all recognize, because if it's not, then it's completely in your head. And if it's completely in your head-

    21. JRJoe Rogan41:05

        But w- wait a minute.

    22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson41:06

        ... it's less useful.

    23. JRJoe Rogan41:07

        What do you mean by that, part of an objective reality?

    24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson41:09

        An objective reality. So here's an example. Um, uh, th- the... when people have these near-death experiences, okay?

    25. JRJoe Rogan41:17

        Mm-hmm.

    26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson41:17

        Or one where they're dying on a table and they... th- uh, commonly described, they leave their body and they look back on themselves, okay?

    27. JRJoe Rogan41:25

        Mm-hmm.

    28. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson41:25

        That's a thing going... that's something, okay?

    29. JRJoe Rogan41:28

        Right.

    30. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson41:28

        Let's investigate this, okay? So, the test for whether you really left your body or whether you were hallucinating it is get some writing that faces the ceiling up above your body, okay? And th- they've done this experiment. And if you're floating above your body, above that piece of paper, when you come back to life, you should be able to say what's written on that piece of paper. And that has yet to happen.
11. 53:42 – 1:00:58

    Law, eyewitness fallibility, and why science wants data—not ‘a witness’

    1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson53:42

       There's, there's a chapter in here called, um, cri- um, uh, Law and Order, where I get into the role of science in deciding whether someone is-

    2. JRJoe Rogan53:53

       Hm.

    3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson53:53

       ... guilty or innocent. And it's the idea that, in a courtroom, someone says, "I need a witness!" This is like, in the court of science, that is the last thing you are ever asking for.

    4. JRJoe Rogan54:06

       Yeah.

    5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson54:06

       Because we know, and the psychologists knew this first. The rest of us, you know, figured it out after the fact, that eyewitness testimony is one of the least reliable forms... Uh, I, the third time I was rejected from jury duty. Uh, I show up-... dutifully, okay? And they... (laughs) The, the, the third time, they said there was a woman who was robbed on the street of her groceries and her, and her purse. And they had the person who she accuses, positively identifies and sh- and her. And it's a literal, he said, she said.

    6. JRJoe Rogan54:44

       Mm-hmm.

    7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson54:44

       Okay? We, we read the particulars of the case. Uh, she said he robbed her of the groceries, took it and then ran off. When they, the cops found the guy, he was not in possession of anything she said he took. They looked in the area for anything stashed in dumpsters or anything, they couldn't find anything. Okay? So, it's, that's, that's the state of the case. And the judge reads the particulars and goes to the, um, down, like down to the last 15. I'm almost on a jury for the first time in my life, I'm almost there. And said, uh, "Do you have any, would, does anyone have any, think they would not be able to convict based on the kind of information and evidence that's been presented?" And, um, and they said, "Juror 14." Whatever you're numbered, right? Until you're selected. Um, they said, uh, "Would you have any prob..." I said, "Yes. I'd have a problem if the only evidence available is eyewitness testimony that everything I know about it, tells me I should not trust it on the level where you end up putting someone in jail." It's like-

    8. JRJoe Rogan55:48

       Hmm.

    9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson55:48

       ... so I could not convict if that's the only evidence you have. What the judge said next was, "Are there any other jurors, like juror 14, who th- said, who needs more than one witness before they would be able to convict?" And I said, sh- should I jump in now and say, n- that's not what I said? What should I do? I think in my s- the person in front of me said, "Your Honor, that's not what he said."

    10. JRJoe Rogan56:16

        Ah.

    11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:17

        Okay? And, and I said, "Oh, thank you." (laughs) Thank you, Jesus. Right? Wh- where I s- he said, "That's not what he said." And I, I resisted with all my might to say, "Your Honor, you were eyewitness to what I said 20 seconds ago and got it wrong." (laughs)

    12. JRJoe Rogan56:34

        Yes. (laughs)

    13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:35

        But I, I resisted, but I was nonetheless on the street 20 minutes later.

    14. JRJoe Rogan56:39

        I think you should've said that just for his own edification.

    15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:41

        No, it was a she, by the way.

    16. JRJoe Rogan56:42

        She?

    17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:43

        But, um-

    18. JRJoe Rogan56:43

        Sorry, I'm sexist.

    19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:44

        You're totally sexist.

    20. JRJoe Rogan56:45

        What's wrong with me? (laughs)

    21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:45

        We've, we've all knew, known that forever. Um-

    22. JRJoe Rogan56:48

        Slap myself on the wrist.

    23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:49

        Right. Uh, so I'm just saying it's clear that the legal system, the precision of-

    24. JRJoe Rogan56:56

        Deeply flawed.

    25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson56:57

        ... uh, it's deeply flawed. And they say, "Well, it's the best we have." Well then fix it.

    26. JRJoe Rogan57:01

        Yeah.

    27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson57:01

        I mean, if that's how you were talking when they used to dunk people-

    28. JRJoe Rogan57:03

        How-

    29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson57:03

        ... and if you died face up you were innocent and died face down you were guilty.

    30. JRJoe Rogan57:08

        Yeah.
12. 1:00:58 – 1:13:22

    Probability, casinos, and human intuition failures: ‘small world’ and the gambler’s fallacy

    1. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:00:58

       You know, um, in, in the... uh, there's a whole other chapter called Risk and Reward, all right? Here's something. Surely in your life, you have taken an average of numbers before.

    2. JRJoe Rogan1:01:10

       Okay. Yeah, sure.

    3. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:11

       Tell me yes. Lie to me even if it's not true. (laughs)

    4. JRJoe Rogan1:01:13

       I have, yeah, definitely.

    5. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:14

       Yeah, yeah. So, okay. Do you realize that the first time anyone ever did that, to realize that "Maybe there's some interesting result here," was after the invention of algebra, trigonometry, geometry, and calculus.

    6. JRJoe Rogan1:01:34

       Really?

    7. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:35

       Statistics is just something that the human brain... it, it's just not natural.

    8. JRJoe Rogan1:01:42

       Mm.

    9. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:42

       It is completely foreign to us. We, we don't know how to interpret simple random events because we wanna give meaning to them. You know the thing where you're, you're in a some other country in some other city and you meet someone like a childhood friend.

    10. JRJoe Rogan1:01:58

        Yeah.

    11. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:01:59

        And you say, "Small world!"

    12. JRJoe Rogan1:02:00

        Yeah.

    13. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:01

        That's your first thought, right?

    14. JRJoe Rogan1:02:02

        Mm-hmm.

    15. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:02

        Small world. Okay. Here's, here's how to cure that. Okay? Next time you're in a foreign city, go up to every single person you walk by and say, "Do I know you?" And they'll probably say no. I mean, know you personally. They'll know you 'cause you're a dude, but (laughs) they know you personally? No. Just keep doing this. And if they say, "No, I don't know you," then say, "Big world!" Just do that. You'll do that millions of times-

    16. JRJoe Rogan1:02:31

        Okay.

    17. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:31

        ... before you meet someone who you once knew. And the proper statistics will then get recorded for that. So, no, it's not a small world, it's a fucking big world, and there are a lot of people in it who you don't know.

    18. JRJoe Rogan1:02:46

        It's just very unusual when you meet someone in another country that you know from back home.

    19. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:02:49

        No, no, no, no, there's a point where... well, if you do the math, there are a lot of things that people say are unusual where it would be unusual if you didn't.

    20. JRJoe Rogan1:02:59

        Well, if you fly to England and you don't tell anybody you're flying to England and you run into a friend from back home, that's pretty unusual.

    21. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:03:09

        Look how often people say that, say that it happens. (laughs)

    22. JRJoe Rogan1:03:11

        Well, we, we live in a strange world now. Like, like, that's why, that's precisely my point! Right.

    23. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:03:15

        Okay? Everybody you know has that story.

    24. JRJoe Rogan1:03:19

        Yeah.

    25. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:03:19

        If you run the statistics on it-

    26. JRJoe Rogan1:03:20

        Mm-hmm.

    27. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:03:21

        ... it would be odd if you went your life... uh, presuming you have a normal life and you know people and your school was big and all of this.

    28. JRJoe Rogan1:03:28

        Uh-huh.

    29. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:03:28

        Okay? You didn't grow up in a farm with, you know, with, where nobody... w- you didn't know anybody. I- i- it requires some basic number of people.

    30. JRJoe Rogan1:03:36

        Right.
13. 1:13:22 – 1:25:03

    Risk vs. emotion: deer collisions, predator reintroduction, and why numbers don’t persuade

    1. JRJoe Rogan1:13:22

       How so?

    2. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:13:24

       Do you realize, last year we lost as many people in the United States to traffic accidents as we did in all the years we fought in Vietnam? Look at the effort we put up as a country, beginning maybe 1967, certainly '68, to stop the carnage. And that's just the American deaths, not to mention the millions of deaths of the Vietnamese themselves, North and South. Point is, our reactions to statistics are very different depending on what caused it.

    3. JRJoe Rogan1:14:01

       Yes.

    4. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:14:01

       And that's... I'm intrigued by that. I don't have a good understanding of it. Um, uh, any laws that treat it are gonna have to fold in people's emotions. Here's an example. Uh, you, you, you shoot deer with your bow and arrow. Uh, there's a certain number of deer deaths and human deaths by cars hitting deer in the roads.

    5. JRJoe Rogan1:14:23

       Mm-hmm.

    6. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:14:23

       Especially in suburban/rural (sniffs) places, okay? Well, uh, what do you do about this? What are you gonna do?

    7. JRJoe Rogan1:14:31

       Get a truck with a big-ass bumper.

    8. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:14:33

       (laughs)

    9. JRJoe Rogan1:14:35

       That's what they do out here.

    10. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:14:36

        The Joe Rogan solution to- (laughs)

    11. JRJoe Rogan1:14:37

        That's the Texas solution. You ever see those guys that work on ranches? Ranches, they have these-

    12. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:14:41

        Make sure your truck has significantly more mass than the, than the deer, correct.

    13. JRJoe Rogan1:14:45

        No, they, they have specific bumpers that they, they build to save people's lives.

    14. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:14:50

        Right. And, of course, this is what, uh, the old locomotives had if there were cattle on the... You, you ever see that pointy front on locomotives?

    15. JRJoe Rogan1:14:58

        Yes, exactly.

    16. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:14:58

        Yeah, that was to pry cattle off-

    17. JRJoe Rogan1:15:00

        Yes.

    18. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:15:00

        ... so it wouldn't roll over the cow and derail the thing.

    19. JRJoe Rogan1:15:03

        Right, right.

    20. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:15:03

        So, um, so what do you do? Do you accept the 100 deaths a year in your county, whatever... Human deaths.

    21. JRJoe Rogan1:15:12

        Uh-huh.

    22. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:15:12

        No one's counting deer deaths here, right? Or, or do you find something that-

    23. JRJoe Rogan1:15:16

        Get yourself a big-ass bumper.

    24. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:15:16

        Oh, there you go. Big-ass bumper.

    25. JRJoe Rogan1:15:18

        Deer killer bumpers, look at those suckers.

    26. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:15:20

        I like the Ford F-250 right there.

    27. JRJoe Rogan1:15:22

        That's what I'm talking about. That's what I'm saying. Look at that one, uh, the Ford F-250, that red one, that's what I'm talking about.

    28. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:15:26

        The problem is, if the-

    29. JRJoe Rogan1:15:27

        Get yourself one of those.

    30. NTNeil deGrasse Tyson1:15:27

        ... if the center of mass of the deer is above the level of that bumper-

Episode duration: 2:52:39