Joe Rogan Experience #1908 - Erika Thompson

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast,…

   1. NANarrator0:00

      (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (instrumental music)

   2. JRJoe Rogan0:12

      This is your first podcast?

   3. ETErika Thompson0:15

      This is my first podcast.

   4. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      Well, thank you very much for allowing me to be the host of you for the first podcast.

   5. ETErika Thompson0:21

      Thank you so much for having me and the bees.

   6. JRJoe Rogan0:23

      My pleasure. Um, I became fascinated with bees when we did an episode of Fear Factor, where we had to cover these people in bees. And it was this outdoor thing that we did at this ranch, and while we were doing it, a local hive of bees came over and interacted with our bees, and we had to shut down production. And so I talked to the beekeeper, I said, "What's going on?" And he said, "We have to shut everything down for an hour or so while they work this out." And I'm like-

   7. ETErika Thompson0:52

      While, while the bees work it out.

   8. JRJoe Rogan0:54

      Yeah.

   9. ETErika Thompson0:54

      Yeah.

   10. JRJoe Rogan0:54

       I'm like, "What do you mean?" And he's like, "Well, they're gonna communicate 'cause these bees are trying to figure out why these bees are here, wh- why our bees are there." And I go, "They're gonna communicate? Like, is it gonna be a bee war?" He's like, "No, they're gonna sort it out." And I'm like, "How do they sort it out?" And it's kind of unknown, right? Like, how... wh-

   11. ETErika Thompson1:11

       Sure. Well, what happened with those bees?

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:14

       They sorted it out.

   13. ETErika Thompson1:15

       And did-

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:15

       The other bees went away, and our bees came back and stayed, and then we resumed the show.

   15. ETErika Thompson1:21

       That's great.

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:22

       So, uh, what kind of communication are bees capable of? Do we know?

   17. ETErika Thompson1:27

       We don't know everything there is to know about bees. Bees have been around for 120 million years. We've been keeping bees for maybe 10,000. You know, if, if I were to think I knew more than the bees, that would be so foolish of me. But we do know some of the ways that bees communicate. Um, they communicate through scents, through pheromones a lot, through these chemical signals that they're sending out to the entire colony to let this colony, that's a superorganism, know what's going on. And so, in your case, you know, you had one colony of bees. A colony is a collective noun, is the collective noun for a group of bees, whereas a hive is the box they live in. So you had these two colonies, you know, who met and were trying to make sure they all stayed together and they all stayed with their queen and went to the right place. And, you know, it sounds like you had a bunch of bees in one area, and bees are social creatures, so they were attracted to the scents of these other bees and were there to see what's going on and, you know, they eventually figured it out, and everybody went back to their respective places, and, and it was fine.

   18. JRJoe Rogan2:34

       So what is happening, though, when they're, when they're figuring it out? They're smelling the, the... Is it that these other bees have a specifically different pheromone?

   19. ETErika Thompson2:42

       Yes, they will have a different scent, and that's how they'll stay with their colony, and it comes from the queen. The queen has a queen mandibular pheromone, and so she is sending out scent signals, pheromones, to the colony. And they're always communicating with each other, and the queen and the worker bees have this wonderful system of checks and balances to make sure that everything gets done within the hive and that the colony is doing what it needs to.

   20. JRJoe Rogan3:07

       Is it possible that bees who are, like, loner bees could integrate with another hive?

   21. ETErika Thompson3:13

       Absolutely. You know, it happens to me in my work all the time. I remove bees from places and, you know, I'll go in and take a colony and a hive out and relocate it to my apiary. And in that process, I don't always get every bee, of course. And the bees that are left behind, or if there's a loner bee, they can join another colony. And it's actually their chances of successfully joining are increased if they bring gifts of, of pollen or honey. So...

   22. JRJoe Rogan3:43

       Whoa. Wow.

   23. ETErika Thompson3:46

       But, you know, bees live a very short lifespan, so sometimes they'll just live out the rest of their bee life. And the bees that we see out in the world foraging, they're at the end of their, their short bee life.

   24. JRJoe Rogan3:59

       How long is a bee's life?

   25. ETErika Thompson4:00

       So a worker bee, and we're talking about honeybees, western honeybees, the ones you see me keep, um... Uh, the lifespan of a female worker bee varies throughout the year. So in the spring and summer, when the bees are working their hardest, the female worker bees will only live about six weeks. In the winter, when they're not doing quite as much, and when we need more bees to make it through the winter, they'll live a little bit longer and they'll live about six months. And their bodies actually change in the winter. The bees that are born later in the year and need to make it through the winter will have more fat bodies on them so that they can make it through the dearth when there's nothing in bloom and when bees are living off the honey that they collected or stored in their hive earlier in the year.

   26. JRJoe Rogan4:47

       And how long does a queen live?

   27. ETErika Thompson4:49

       The queen can live the longest. She can live about five years. That's on the longer end. Most queens will live a l- little bit shorter, but, uh, she can live significantly longer than all the other bees in the hive. And then we have the worker bees, um, uh, who live about six weeks, six months. The queen bee can live up to five years, and the drone bees will live about six months. The male bees.

   28. JRJoe Rogan5:12

       And what is the ratio of male bees to female bees?

   29. ETErika Thompson5:16

       They're... Uh, a honeybee colony is about 95% female.

   30. JRJoe Rogan5:21

       Oh.
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   They don't lay eggs.…

   1. ETErika Thompson15:00

      lay eggs.

   2. JRJoe Rogan15:00

      They don't lay eggs.

   3. ETErika Thompson15:01

      So, they can, and on occasion they will if a colony is queenless.

   4. JRJoe Rogan15:07

      Hmm.

   5. ETErika Thompson15:07

      But it doesn't mean the colony can continue. So without a queen, a colony can't continue. So as a last resort is the only time you will see female worker bees laying eggs in a colony. And they will lay eggs that turn into bees that look different. They're male drone bees and so their, their larvae and their pupae look a little bit different than the worker bees. And so as a beekeeper, if you see a colony full of male honeybee babies, brood, eggs, and larvae, it's a sign that a colony may be without a queen.

   6. JRJoe Rogan15:41

      And what happens then?

   7. ETErika Thompson15:43

      So as a beekeeper, you can introduce a new queen to the colony and likely they'll accept her. You can also give the colony eggs from another colony that are female eggs, so female bee eggs. Any female bee egg can be made into a queen bee. So if you give a colony that's queenless the opportunity to make their own queen, that's sometimes even better than introducing a new queen to them. And the way that a queen bee is made is when the queen bee lays an egg, and if it's a female worker bee egg, which most of them are because, again, 95% of the colony's population is female, every bee in the first three days of their life, they're fed royal jelly, and then they're switched to a diet of, of pollen and a little bit of nectar. But if a baby bee is fed royal jelly through the duration of its development, it turns into a queen bee.

   8. JRJoe Rogan16:42

      But a regular worker bee cannot give birth or cannot lay an egg that would be a queen bee ...

   9. ETErika Thompson16:49

      Correct.

   10. JRJoe Rogan16:49

       ... or even a female bee.

   11. ETErika Thompson16:50

       Correct.

   12. JRJoe Rogan16:50

       So where does that female bee come from? Only from a queen?

   13. ETErika Thompson16:54

       Where does ... Yes.

   14. JRJoe Rogan16:56

       So a queen can only give birth to a queen.

   15. ETErika Thompson17:00

       A queen can lay both female and male bee eggs.

   16. JRJoe Rogan17:02

       O- I shouldn't say give birth. Lay, lay ... So a female can lay a female d- So does, when the female, when a queen knows that her time is short, when she's about to die, does she, like, make a successor?

   17. ETErika Thompson17:17

       Well, it's not always the queen that knows and it's more the colony that's making the decision. So we often think of, you know, a colony of bees being a monarchy where the queen is in charge and making all of the decisions, but that's not the case at all. It's the colony making the decisions. So it's all the worker bees, it's the collective of female worker bees making that decision. And they can take any female egg and turn it into a queen bee, not only by that diet of royal jelly, but they will also make the cell that the bee is born into a little bit bigger to accommodate the queen bee's larger body size. So it's actually the group of female worker bees that's making that decision. And the queen bee doesn't always know when she's in her final days. It's the colony that would know. Her pheromones would get weaker and they would prepare for having a new queen, and sometimes ...... even have a new queen develop while their old queen is still alive. And in the case that you have a colony with an older queen who is failing and a new queen who was just, who just emerged from a cell, the queens will fight to the death.

   18. JRJoe Rogan18:26

       Oh, geez.

   19. ETErika Thompson18:27

       (laughs) And then, then, and the, and the best queen wins. And that's, you know, that's what happen, that's what needs to happen for the life of the bee colony.

   20. JRJoe Rogan18:35

       Wow, they fight to the death. What a ruthless world.

   21. ETErika Thompson18:39

       Y- ... They have figured it out, though, how to do this and how to live in these giant societies. And, you know, it all works, and it's remarkable.

   22. JRJoe Rogan18:49

       It is very remarkable, but it's, it's also very ruthless, right? I mean, it's kinda crazy that they fight to the death.

   23. ETErika Thompson18:55

       I, sure.

   24. JRJoe Rogan18:56

       Like, this poor queen, like, she's done a great job. She's made all these bees and ...

   25. ETErika Thompson19:01

       A lot of bees. A queen bee will lay up to 2,000 eggs per day. I mean, she's li, an egg-laying machine. That's all she does. She doesn't feed herself. She doesn't clean herself. She's the only bee that defecates in the, in the hive. All the other bees defecate outside the hive, and she has bees that clean up after her. She has-

   26. JRJoe Rogan19:18

       (laughs)

   27. ETErika Thompson19:18

       ... like a royal court of attendant bees that follow her around and take care of all of her needs.

   28. JRJoe Rogan19:25

       Is there ever a time where the queen, like something eats her or something attacks the queen?

   29. ETErika Thompson19:32

       I mean, the queens will die naturally all the time, you know.

   30. JRJoe Rogan19:35

       But is there any, like an insect or anything that ...
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   Is it gross? …

   1. ETErika Thompson30:00

      of pollen, of course. And it-

   2. JRJoe Rogan30:01

      Is it gross?

   3. ETErika Thompson30:02

      It doesn't have much of a taste or flavor. To me, it kind of tastes like wheat grass almost.

   4. JRJoe Rogan30:10

      Mm.

   5. ETErika Thompson30:10

      You... It d- it's, it's not sweet.

   6. JRJoe Rogan30:12

      So it's something you put in a shake or something?

   7. ETErika Thompson30:13

      Yes. It's very, um, very mild. Not much, not much flavor in my opinion. But-

   8. JRJoe Rogan30:17

      Is it as bioavailable as, like, chicken or beef? Because you know that there's certain plant proteins that aren't that bioavailable, even though there's a high gram of protein per ounce.

   9. ETErika Thompson30:26

      Um-... we wouldn't want to harvest as much pollen from bees as we do other protein sources, of course. And, you know, this is their food source, so we shouldn't really be taking this-

   10. JRJoe Rogan30:41

       Oh, no, I'm not saying to take-

   11. ETErika Thompson30:42

       ... too consume.

   12. JRJoe Rogan30:42

       I'm not saying to take it from them, but I know that bee pollen is something that people do supplement their diet with.

   13. ETErika Thompson30:47

       Yes.

   14. JRJoe Rogan30:48

       And I just was curious if you know that, if it's bioavailable?

   15. ETErika Thompson30:51

       I don't know.

   16. JRJoe Rogan30:52

       Hmm. Okay. So as you're-

   17. ETErika Thompson30:54

       I guess I don't know what bioavailable means.

   18. JRJoe Rogan30:56

       Bioavailable is like the s- some of the most ... Bioavailable protein is meat, whereas, like, if you have, um, 10 grams of, uh, say, venison, it's more bioavailable than 10 grams of protein from, say, broccoli. The p- protein that is in plants is less bioavailable. Your body doesn't, your body doesn't process as well.

   19. ETErika Thompson31:19

       Oh, meaning how we process it?

   20. JRJoe Rogan31:20

       Yes.

   21. ETErika Thompson31:21

       I have no idea how our bodies process bee pollen.

   22. JRJoe Rogan31:23

       You're only interested in bees? (laughs)

   23. ETErika Thompson31:26

       I like to spend most of my time with bees and-

   24. JRJoe Rogan31:28

       You like bees more than you like people?

   25. ETErika Thompson31:30

       I spend most of my time with bees and, I mean, I just naturally, I don't spend that much time with people.

   26. JRJoe Rogan31:36

       I like how you avoided that question. (laughs)

   27. ETErika Thompson31:37

       I spend most of it with bees. (laughs) You know, um ...

   28. JRJoe Rogan31:41

       You kinda like bees more than people.

   29. ETErika Thompson31:43

       I love bees.

   30. JRJoe Rogan31:44

       Wow.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   A frequency in terms…

   1. ETErika Thompson45:00

      and communicate to you how they're feeling, you know. Of course, they'll start stinging you if they're not feeling well and if they are feeling defensive, but, you know, they'll... Before that they'll sort of ping you, and there's a frequency pitch that changes sometimes, you know, in a hive that's, uh, maybe a little bit more defensive. So-

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:18

      A frequency in terms of like the sound they make?

   3. ETErika Thompson45:19

      Like the sound, sure.

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:21

      Mm-hmm.

   5. ETErika Thompson45:21

      Um, and so it's... I think the communication goes back and forth, and I hope that they can pick up on my behavior as well, that I'm not there to harm them. I'm not ripping open their hive as quickly and as forcefully as possible, and I'm not... You know, I'm doing everything with a lot of care and precision, or as much as I can. And, um, I hope that they pick up on that too. I, I certainly think that they do.

   6. JRJoe Rogan45:45

      So, it's the movement, but is it also the mindset? Is it like a vibe that you're putting out? Are you like l- saying in your mind, "I'm your friend."

   7. ETErika Thompson45:55

      (laughs)

   8. JRJoe Rogan45:55

      "I'm here to help out." Like, are you-

   9. ETErika Thompson45:57

      I'm probably not saying it in, in my mind. I'm probably talking to them.

   10. JRJoe Rogan45:59

       Oh, really?

   11. ETErika Thompson45:59

       So, (laughs) yes.

   12. JRJoe Rogan46:00

       You talk out loud to the bees?

   13. ETErika Thompson46:01

       Yes, all the time.

   14. JRJoe Rogan46:02

       Really?

   15. ETErika Thompson46:02

       Um, it's just me and them, you know? I mean, and you're really working alongside them. And I, I like to think that at some point during, during the removal process they realize that I'm offering them something better, you know, after I've opened their hive and removed half the wall or what have you. It's... They know that this new hive is where their food is, where their baby bees are, and it's just a better place for them. So I hope they know that I'm on their side. I certainly, you know, try to tell them that. Um, and yes, I talk to them. But I don't know. It's... I mean, it's a... It's just a wonderful experience, you know? And every bee removal is different.

   16. JRJoe Rogan46:41

       Well, at the very least they seem to accept it.

   17. ETErika Thompson46:44

       Yes, they do. I mean, they seem to not mind, you know, um, when I pick up their queen and move her into a new box, which you would think, you know, that w- maybe would anger them. But, you know, the colony all works together and it's that superorganism. So they, they, they all want to be together and they're all doing what's best for the good of the colony. And so I sometimes think that if I'm doing that as well, then, you know, it's, it's a lot easier to do my job, for sure.

   18. JRJoe Rogan47:11

       Now, as you've done this, have you become friends with other beekeepers, and do they have a similar mindset and similar experiences to the way you approach it?

   19. ETErika Thompson47:22

       I have met some wonderful beekeepers and have some wonderful beekeeping friends, and everybody has their own way of keeping bees. Um, it's very much a craft, you know? It takes a lot of skill, of course. I, I think it's an art form, especially the bee removal process. There's... It takes a lot of creativity, and everybody will do it in a different way and everybody has their own opinions about their bees or what's best for their bees. And the beekeeping community can be, you know, divisive, but, um, yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan47:55

       How so?

   21. ETErika Thompson47:56

       I... Just because everybody has a different opinion on what the best way is to keep bees, and that probably stems from a lack of understanding that we all don't know all the answers to all the questions, you know?

   22. JRJoe Rogan48:08

       So, what's like the major points of contention amongst the beekeeping community? Yeah.

   23. ETErika Thompson48:11

       Between the beekeeping community? Just different techniques for keeping bees, you know? Some folks, um, have different control methods for different pests and diseases. Some folks like to do it more naturally. There's just... There's a lot of different ways people keep bees all around the world, and I think everyone's doing it the best they can. But every- everybody has a different idea, you know, on how to keep bees, but also everybody has a different reason for keeping bees, and so they might have different management techniques for that.

   24. JRJoe Rogan48:43

       Do you use... Is it like, uh, the smoke? Is that like a point of contention? Like-

   25. ETErika Thompson48:48

       No, not at all.

   26. JRJoe Rogan48:48

       ... don't use too, too much smoke? Don't use any smoke?

   27. ETErika Thompson48:51

       No, the...... the ... Don't use too much smoke, but always use smoke. (laughs)

   28. JRJoe Rogan48:56

       Always use smoke.

   29. ETErika Thompson48:56

       Yes.

   30. JRJoe Rogan48:56

       What-
5. 1:00:00 – 1:15:00

   Yeah. …

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:00:00

      what anybody would want to do with you is do some sort of reality show.

   2. ETErika Thompson1:00:03

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:00:04

      Just sort of ramp up what you're doing and just figure out a way to monetize it. And you'll be far more successful, completely independent, far more financially successful because you won't have a bunch of parasites sucking off of what you've done.

   4. ETErika Thompson1:00:17

      Right.

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:00:17

      Because all they're trying to do is capitalize on it. And I guarantee one of the things they'll do... 'Cause I've done some reality stuff before, one of the things they like to do is they fake scenarios. They, they'll create a scenario that might... I mean, they might even, like, want to place a queen somewhere and, and then you have to... Like, there's a dilemma. You know, there's a sorority house, you have to help these girls and they're shrieking. You know what I'm saying?

   6. ETErika Thompson1:00:40

      Yes.

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:00:40

      Like, they'll, they'll come up with some bullshit.

   8. ETErika Thompson1:00:42

      They do.

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:00:42

      Don't. Yeah. Don't, don't. Don't get involved in the machine.

   10. ETErika Thompson1:00:46

       That's-

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:00:46

       The machine is filled with a bunch of... Some of them are wonderful people.

   12. ETErika Thompson1:00:50

       Mm-hmm.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:00:51

       But there is a very clear mandate. They want to create problems and solutions, and that's what every reality show is. And they have fake problems and they have fake solutions. You don't want to be a part of that. And also, you're gonna have a bunch of people telling you how to do it and how... You're gonna get, uh, weirded out by it, you're gonna hate it.If you did do it, I guarantee you we could have a podcast two years from now and you're like, "You were right."

   14. ETErika Thompson1:01:12

       (laughs)

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:01:12

       (laughs) It sucks. It's-

   16. ETErika Thompson1:01:13

       Well, then I, I probably won't.

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:01:15

       Yeah.

   18. ETErika Thompson1:01:15

       You know, I think I've made that decision that TV isn't for me. Thank you for your perspective. You know, it was-

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:01:21

       You don't have to.

   20. ETErika Thompson1:01:22

       You know, and that's how I felt too is that if my goal is really to reach the most amount of people, I mean, just looking at the numbers of what a video that I-

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:01:29

       Yeah.

   22. ETErika Thompson1:01:30

       ... you know, you know, just set up a couple iPhones and do the best I can editing it and putting it together-

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:01:36

       133.5 million people look at that.

   24. ETErika Thompson1:01:40

       That, that one-

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:01:40

       Yeah, you cannot get that on television. They'll just rob you.

   26. ETErika Thompson1:01:45

       I, I wasn't even gonna post that one with 133 million.

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:01:48

       (sighs)

   28. ETErika Thompson1:01:48

       And it's my lar- it's my, it's the most popular-

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:01:51

       Why weren't you gonna post it?

   30. ETErika Thompson1:01:52

       Well, I'm in my pajamas.
6. 1:15:00 – 1:17:12

   And what would those…

   1. ETErika Thompson1:15:00

      of food for native pollinators, there's a lack of places for them to find homes and what they need to live their lives. So, um, yeah, there's little things everybody can do to make a difference in the lives of bees, and the biggest one is everybody can plant food for bees. Anytime you're planting something in your yard or your garden or on your balcony, wherever you live, make sure it's something bees can forage from, and you will-

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:15:25

      And what would those things be?

   3. ETErika Thompson1:15:26

      Flowering plants. So whatever is local and native to your area is best. And when you go to your nursery, you know, you can ask someone for help, or what I like to do is I just look for the plants where the bees are on (laughs) . So if I see a plant covered in bees, you know, I make sure it's native but then, you know, I know it's probably a, a plant the bees will forage from and get food from. So everybody can plant food for bees and, you know, we just need a greater awareness about it too on a larger scale, an urban scale, when we're planning our cities and building our roadways, thinking about the natural forage and food that we're taking away from the creatures that have lived here longer than us.

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:16:07

      One of the things that I read about bees and honey is that local honey can protect some people from allergies that they may have from the very plants that these bees are getting their pollen from. Is that true?

   5. ETErika Thompson1:16:22

      That's completely false.

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:16:24

      That's false?

   7. ETErika Thompson1:16:24

      There is no scientific evidence to prove that, and the idea-

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:16:28

      That hippy logic?

   9. ETErika Thompson1:16:29

      (laughs) Well, the idea of it doesn't even hold weight. So the idea is that, you know, if you are somehow exposed to the local pollen in, in your area, that you will gain some sort of immune response to it, and bees keep pollen and honey separate in their hives. So when you eat honey, you're ingesting a very small amount of pollen. Also, bees are not foraging from the plants that are causing your allergies. So like here in Austin, plants ... or bees are not foraging from cedar or hay. They're ... or ragweed. So there is really no, no merit to that, to that claim.

Episode duration: 2:31:05