Joe Rogan Experience #1928 - Jimmy Corsetti & Ben van Kerkwyk

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast,…

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

   2. NANarrator0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:06

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (instrumental music plays) We're up. What's happenin'?

   4. JCJimmy Corsetti0:15

      Hi, Joe, how you doin'?

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:15

      Good to see you again. Ben, nice to meet you.

   6. JCJimmy Corsetti0:17

      It's a pleasure to meet you as well, Joe.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:19

      I've enjoyed your videos and-

   8. JCJimmy Corsetti0:20

      Thank you.

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:20

      ... I've enjoyed your videos, of course. Uh, Jimmy, I watched your, your whole series on Atlanta all day today. I've been watchin' for hours. I've been watchin' th- the impact videos, videos about th- the Atlanta structure, and so let's just get into it.

   10. JCJimmy Corsetti0:38

       Let's do it. So the Richat Structure, I was on your show a little over a year ago and sh- shared some details about it. To people who aren't aware, there's a location in the Western Sahara desert of Mauritania called the Richat Structure. It's also commonly referred to as the Eye of the Sahara. It is a site that most people have never seen or heard of before, which is truly peculiar because it's so spectacular. It's a site that, uh, astronauts typically use to reference from space. It is a geological feature that is said to be volcanic in nature, and what's so spectacular about this is that it just so happens to match more than a dozen striking similarities to what Plato had described as the lost ancient capital city of Atlantis.

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:21

       I almost feel like we're not going to do your video justice by just talking about it, because the video's so good and you go into so many details. By the end of it, my jaw was dropped. I was like, "Holy shit." Like, from what you had the last time you were on the, the podcast, to what you put out now, it's even more compelling.

   12. JCJimmy Corsetti1:41

       Agree.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:41

       Like way more compelling.

   14. JCJimmy Corsetti1:43

       I appreciate you saying that, and I guess to anyone that wants to check it out, I have a YouTube channel called Bright Insight. It's right at the top of the page, and it says, "Lost Ancient Roman Map has Atlantis in Sahara, Africa." And that's kinda where it goes from there is that there is a... Actually, let me just mention real quick, like, you're a very inquisitive indi- individual. You have many interesting people that come and chat with you, and when I had asked you last time, you said that until you had saw my video, you had never seen or heard of the Richat Structure.

   15. JRJoe Rogan2:10

       Never heard of it, yeah.

   16. JCJimmy Corsetti2:12

       Anytime I meet somebody new or if I'm at some party and be like, "Oh, what do you do?" and we start talkin' about YouTube, the first thing I do now is I show 'em a picture of the Richat. And I've never, not once, ever come across one single person that has seen or heard of it before, other than people who are familiar with what I've shared.

   17. JRJoe Rogan2:26

       But there's so many things, like the, the, the, where the water flows to the south, where there's clear evidence of water erosion that took place after the volcano. There's so much that points to that possibly being Atlantis.

   18. JCJimmy Corsetti2:43

       It's spectacular. So just to run down real quick, Plato had described Atlantis as being the capital. Let me just mention that because it was an empire said to be made up of 10 kingdoms, and what I'm focusing on is the lost capital city, which was said to be made up of concentric circles, three of water, two of land, which matches the Richat Structure. It also was said to have an opening to the sea at the south, and if you look at it from satellite imagery, you can clearly see that water had ran through it.

   19. JRJoe Rogan3:07

       Let's take a look at that. Put, tell Jimmy what image to pull up so we can-

   20. JCJimmy Corsetti3:10

       And-

   21. JRJoe Rogan3:10

       I don't know. I was just downloading them.

   22. JCJimmy Corsetti3:12

       Um, and furthermore, it was said to have mountains to the north, and you just so happen to have mountains called the Atlas mountain chain, which Atlas was said to be the very first king of Atlantis. And what's interesting is that the very first known king of Mauritania, which is where the Richat Structure's located, is also s- Their very first known king was also named Atlas, and though I'm not saying that that's the same individual, but what we do today is we pass down names, right? Like, people are like, "Oh, my dad's name's John and so is, so is my son," and so it's, it's another striking similarity, but it goes further than that. Like, there's geological similarities such as the fact that Atlantis was said to be made up of red, black, and white color stone, which is another similarity you see at the Richat Structure. Um, it was said to have an abundance of gold and that the outer walls were lined with it, and it turns out that Mauritania is loaded with gold. And not only that, the richest person ever known to exist in all of mankind is Mansa Musa of the Mali Empire, which consisted partly of modern-day Mauritania, and he was so rich from gold that he would be richer than Elon Musk and, like, Bezos combined almost. Like many, a unfathomable amount of billions of, of dollars. So that's another similarity.

   23. JRJoe Rogan4:22

       What year was this?

   24. JCJimmy Corsetti4:24

       Oh, this is, uh, 1300s or 1400s.

   25. JRJoe Rogan4:27

       There he is.

   26. JCJimmy Corsetti4:27

       Yeah, there we are, 1312, 1337.

   27. JRJoe Rogan4:29

       What a great name, too.

   28. JCJimmy Corsetti4:30

       Yeah. (laughs)

   29. JRJoe Rogan4:30

       Mansa Musa.

   30. JCJimmy Corsetti4:32

       Um, but the similarities don't end there. There was said to be an abundance of elephants, which is one reason why to suggest that Atlantis would've been in Africa, is because, well, besides the fact that elephants are known to be in, throughout Africa. They used to be in Mauritania. They're unfortunately pretty much extinct there today, um, but another little detail that most people aren't aware of, because they think of Atlantis like, "Oh, must be at the bottom of the ocean." Well, that's not exactly how Plato worded it. He did describe that the aftermath of Atlantis followed a catastrophic event involving water, is that, is that what was left of Atlantis was reeds of grass and a shoal of mud that prevented ships from navigating to and from. And what people don't realize is that Sahara Africa, up until about 4,500 to 5,000 years ago, was totally green. It was tropical. It had the largest network or one of the largest networks of rivers ever known to exist. It had the largest freshwater lake ever known to exist, which is Mega Lake Chad, which, just to put this into perspective, it is, if you take all the North American Great Lakes combined, that's 94,000 square miles of surface area, whereas Mega Lake Chad was 139,000.
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   Mm. …

   1. BKBen van Kerkwyk15:00

      on the coast of Madagascar and Western Australia that we can see in satellite images today. There's got these like 500, 600-foot high chevrons from where the water went miles inland. And they, they, they found organic material from the seabed in these chevrons, and then they date that with carbon-14 dating and they put it right at, uh, 5,000 years or so, so 2500, around that time, BC, which is actually a really interesting date when you consider some of the, I guess, the publications that we rely on in our, in our modern civilization today. The Bible, the Old Testament wasn't written long after that. And if you think about where the Indian Ocean is, that could have been the source of the Biblical flood. Like that-

   2. JRJoe Rogan15:36

      Mm.

   3. BKBen van Kerkwyk15:36

      ... that would've washed up north into the Persian Gulf, flooded the hell out of that whole region.

   4. JRJoe Rogan15:40

      It's just crazy that it's happened so many times.

   5. JCJimmy Corsetti15:43

      Yeah, it's what they say.

   6. JRJoe Rogan15:43

      Like, we, we like to think of history as being this linear thing. We started out as cave people.

   7. JCJimmy Corsetti15:48

      That's right.

   8. JRJoe Rogan15:48

      And then we branched out from Africa all across the world.

   9. JCJimmy Corsetti15:50

      Not the end of it.

   10. JRJoe Rogan15:51

       And, and kept, and kept learning. And here we are today with cellphones. But no.

   11. JCJimmy Corsetti15:55

       Yeah.

   12. JRJoe Rogan15:56

       No. It's, we've been, we've been rocked like multiple times.

   13. JCJimmy Corsetti15:59

       Many times.

   14. JRJoe Rogan16:00

       Many, many times. And there's real solid evidence. The Antarctica one, how old do they think that is?

   15. JCJimmy Corsetti16:05

       I don't recall on that.

   16. BKBen van Kerkwyk16:06

       Mm.

   17. JCJimmy Corsetti16:06

       I have to double check that. I have to do a Google, Jamie.

   18. JRJoe Rogan16:08

       (laughs) Yeah.

   19. JCJimmy Corsetti16:09

       It's-

   20. JRJoe Rogan16:10

       So researchers have discovered a crater 1.5 kilometers beneath the Antarctica ice crust.

   21. JCJimmy Corsetti16:15

       (laughs)

   22. JRJoe Rogan16:15

       482 kilometers in diameter.

   23. JCJimmy Corsetti16:17

       Okay.

   24. JRJoe Rogan16:18

       482 kilometers in diameter.

   25. BKBen van Kerkwyk16:20

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan16:21

       Holy shit.

   27. JCJimmy Corsetti16:22

       What does that remind-

   28. JRJoe Rogan16:22

       Probably dates back to a meteorite impact 250 million years ago. That's a-

   29. JCJimmy Corsetti16:27

       Wow. That's-

   30. JRJoe Rogan16:28

       Okay, so that's an old one.
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   I think the gatekeepers…

   1. BKBen van Kerkwyk30:00

      happened, but it used to be taken a lot more seriously. And there's certainly a lot of, uh, evidence coming from prior cultures that something did exist. And I think now we've, we've got a massive body of evidence to suggest how-... our history as a species and as a civilization goes way back, much further than, than what we've thought about as being our own history. Since, you know, f- s-... I mean, right up until 2006, we pretty much thought, nope, the last 6,000 years, that's when we stopped being cavemen and became... you know, started building cities and s- organized societies and things like that. And that's- the whole game has changed now.

   2. JRJoe Rogan30:29

      I think the gatekeepers of academia, you know, just the stuff that you two gentlemen put on your YouTube pages should r- open up fields of inquiry. People should be c- oh, reaching out to you. They should be having you speak at universities. They should be watching your videos. They should be like, "Oh my God. Like look at all this actual evidence." Not speculation. Mm-hmm. Not like... Look, you're looking at physical geological evidence, physical erosion evidence, and then all the stuff with the structure that lines up exactly with the stories of Atlantis. It's fucking wild. Yeah.

   3. JCJimmy Corsetti31:07

      It's, it's one of these things. Like I'm a very open-minded person. I'm not... I can't say like with 100% certainty. I mean, anything's possible.

   4. JRJoe Rogan31:13

      Of course.

   5. JCJimmy Corsetti31:13

      But even... But I'm like, there's so many similarities that if nothing else, it shouldn't be ignored. The, the... Off the West Coast should be drilled and, and run with s- uh, some LiDAR to see what's going on underneath that s- uh, sediment. And not only that, like let's just pretend, okay, Atlantis never existed, the Richite's not it. Well then, let's like focus in then on why is this catastrophic water erosion going through the Sahara 60 million years more recently than it was supposed to? There's another image in there, Jamie, that shows where the Trans-Saharan Seaway went and it does not reflect it going west over the Western Sahara. So I'm like, in the context of climate science, I'm like, this should be discussed. Wh- why is nobody talking about the Sahara was green potentially 4,500 years ago, which is by the way, the same alleged date as the Great Pyramids construction in Giza 4,500 years ago?

   6. JRJoe Rogan32:00

      (laughs)

   7. JCJimmy Corsetti32:00

      So check this out. As you can see, it does not, uh, annotate the water erosion going west over the Richite. But as we just showed, it clearly did.

   8. JRJoe Rogan32:09

      Mm.

   9. JCJimmy Corsetti32:09

      And this was based on a 20-year study. Wonderful people did this. I don't know, I have no explanation for why it- they don't annotate it going west, but it clearly did. And not only that, it went, uh, east of Niger, uh, along Chad, which, you know, I showed you the water erosion along the volcano. So what I'm suggesting is that either something else separate happened or they just missed something because again, the Sahara is a big s- place and they can only search so many places.

   10. JRJoe Rogan32:32

       When they did this, did they have the sort of satellite imagery that are available today?

   11. JCJimmy Corsetti32:36

       N- well, I can't say no. Satellites were certainly around.

   12. JRJoe Rogan32:39

       What year was this?

   13. JCJimmy Corsetti32:40

       Uh, this is like, I wanna say 2007 or so.

   14. JRJoe Rogan32:43

       Oh, no.

   15. JCJimmy Corsetti32:43

       I could be wrong and I gotta double check that.

   16. JRJoe Rogan32:45

       No. Germany would've had satellite.

   17. JCJimmy Corsetti32:47

       Yeah.

   18. JRJoe Rogan32:47

       Yeah. No.

   19. JCJimmy Corsetti32:47

       So, but, uh, I know that they were doing some boots on the ground stuff. Um-

   20. JRJoe Rogan32:50

       Maybe they just didn't think to look at that particular area as being... Uh, maybe they had like a preconceived notion.

   21. JCJimmy Corsetti32:58

       That's what I suspect. I don't think they're intentionally not looking at it, but I feel like, you know, when it comes to, you know, you're mentioning like, we should be speaking at universities. You know, Joe, the first thing they ever say is like, "Oh. Oh, Jimmy, he's a... He was a fraud investigator. He's from the corporate world." Like Ben... Uh, Ben has an awesome story too, by the way, coming out of the corporate world. You got-

   22. JRJoe Rogan33:15

       Ah, we could get into that story. Yeah, go.

   23. JCJimmy Corsetti33:17

       You got patents with... Okay. All right, tech guy.

   24. JRJoe Rogan33:18

       (laughs)

   25. JCJimmy Corsetti33:18

       Um, we'll get into that. Um, but like, so that's... They immediately dismiss. And I wanna make an interesting point, which is that, so-

   26. JRJoe Rogan33:24

       It's so crazy that they're gatekeepers.

   27. JCJimmy Corsetti33:26

       Yeah. They... Well-

   28. JRJoe Rogan33:27

       The, the egocentric, ego-minded gatekeepers. Like they don't want anyone to discover something they haven't noticed.

   29. JCJimmy Corsetti33:34

       100%.

   30. BKBen van Kerkwyk33:35

       That's right. Yeah.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   Wow. …

   1. BKBen van Kerkwyk45:00

      they're not engineers. They're not particularly interested in sort of how things were manufactured. So what, what they've done is they've taken this and put this in a machine and it, it, it's a structured light scanner, so it creates like a point cloud of different lights, and then you match a geometric shape to it, be that like a, a flat plane, a cylinder, a sphere, a, a cone. And then you can perform sort of geometric, um, calculations on it and define things like precision. So if you go back to that f- uh, the surface A, the vase lip, right? So this is... You can see down on the bottom, they've, they've created a, uh, a point cloud of the top of this lip, so the flatness. And it's, they've called this Surface A. It's comprised of 3,813, uh, points and it's within three thousandths of an inch o- of being basically perfectly flat.

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:46

      Wow.

   3. BKBen van Kerkwyk45:46

      But that's-

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:47

      Three thousandths of an inch?

   5. BKBen van Kerkwyk45:48

      Three thousandths of an inch.

   6. JRJoe Rogan45:49

      And this is over who knows how many thousands of years-

   7. BKBen van Kerkwyk45:52

      Well-

   8. JRJoe Rogan45:52

      ... of erosion and sand and dust and wind and-

   9. BKBen van Kerkwyk45:56

      Exactly. It's, it's at least 5,000 years old. I, I suspect this could be far older than that. Now, what's interesting once you start doing this, and if you go to the next one, Jamie, you now, he's now... Now, we're looking at the, the lip. So this... You take a cylinder and you match... You basically take 10,000 points plus and you match the, the, the inside, the mouth of the vase to a cylinder. And what you can now measure that against the other surface. So if you think of like the top of it as being like the X axis, this is now your Y axis. So that first symbol here, the perpendicular symbol, what you sh- what it's showing is that how perpendicular is this cylinder on its axis relative to the top of the vase, the Surface A that's on the top, within one thousandth of an inch.

   10. JRJoe Rogan46:37

       One thousandth?

   11. BKBen van Kerkwyk46:38

       So it's perfectly perpendicular to within one thousandth of an inch of the top of the vase. And then the second reading here shows you how perfectly s- what's the circular error, like what's the circularity of it's within 13 thousandths of an inch of being perfectly circular.

   12. JRJoe Rogan46:53

       How are you gonna do that by hand?

   13. BKBen van Kerkwyk46:54

       You, you... Well, you can't. This is, this is the thing, and if you, you go-

   14. JRJoe Rogan46:57

       You literally can't?

   15. BKBen van Kerkwyk46:59

       No. The- no one's ever been a- you... It gets... You can... You... If you rub two surfaces together, you can make them flat. But when you start looking at the... The real teller in, in precision and in these discussions about ancient engineering, the, the... It's an easy thing to understand when we talk about 90-degree turns and flat surfaces. But what gets really interesting is when you start talking about one surface in relation to another. And remember, these objects, like the big boxes in the Serapeum that weigh like 70 tons, you've got surfaces, you know, 11 feet apart. It's the relativity of one surface to another. So how flat, how straight is this in relationship to this surface?

   16. JRJoe Rogan47:35

       Right.

   17. BKBen van Kerkwyk47:36

       And with this vase, the, the, the incredible thing about it is, is that it's... As you go down it, there's a, another slide if you can look at the-

   18. JRJoe Rogan47:43

       Go back.

   19. BKBen van Kerkwyk47:43

       Yeah. Um-

   20. JRJoe Rogan47:45

       And you should mention how much this equipment cost real quick, how new this technology-

   21. BKBen van Kerkwyk47:47

       Well, yeah, so these structured light scanners are like $250,000. They, they're professional. You know, this is, this is absolutely a tool that gets used in aerospace quite a bit. So no one's ever, um, really done this type of work. So, um, this... And it does... There's nothing like this approaching... You can't do this with hand work, this type of thing. But if you s- skip to the next one. So now it's... This is like... This is a great example. So what you're doing here is, is measuring the circularity. Go to the next one, because the lug handles are kind of the really important part of this. It's an interesting thing. So for one thing, it's showing you that, okay, they, they solved the problem of carving granite. It's made from granite. It's actually made from the same rose granite that the, the box in the King's Chamber of the Great Pyramid is.

   22. JRJoe Rogan48:26

       Yeah. Not pottery, just to-

   23. BKBen van Kerkwyk48:27

       Not pottery.

   24. JRJoe Rogan48:27

       ... in case someone doesn't understand what this is.

   25. BKBen van Kerkwyk48:29

       This wasn't... This isn't pottery. People often call it pottery.

   26. JRJoe Rogan48:30

       I- I... Can, can I pause real quick?

   27. BKBen van Kerkwyk48:31

       Yeah.

   28. JRJoe Rogan48:32

       When you talk about these measurements-

   29. BKBen van Kerkwyk48:34

       Yeah.

   30. JRJoe Rogan48:34

       ... what kind of measurements can be achieved through ceramic pottery?
5. 1:00:00 – 1:08:31

   What's the speculation? Like,…

   1. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:00:00

      any pressure off it, that's ... The whole tool removes itself from the surface of the stone, so those marks can't be made by, uh, withdrawal of the tool. It's 100% something going on. And, and Petrie back in the, you know, late 1800s was scratching his head looking at this stuff and he goes, "There must have been a weight of two or three tons on o- ... " Like, he, he just ... He sort of said it was, well, a, a, a jeweled tube of bronze that did this, but he was looking at it. He knew a mystery when he saw it and he couldn't explain it. Um-

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:00:28

      What's the speculation? Like, what's the wildest speculation as to how these things were made?

   3. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:00:33

      Well, I, I'm, I'm pretty convinced that there was, uh ... Uh, it was a ... There's obviously saws and tube drills that are powered by something. Now, I thi- I think it, it may not just be pure friction. There might be ultrasonics involved. One of the i- whole interesting things I like about this space is it's like ... And this has to do with even, like, the energy stuff that Randall was talking about, that he's coming to talk about as well. There are realms of science that sit outside of our understanding. We'll know more tomorrow, in 10 years, in 1,000 years about science, so I think when we look at some of these, these things in the past, we should be open-minded enough to consider the possibility that some of the answers may sit outside of our current perspective 'cause, you know, our tendency is to look at it all and try and s- ... How would we do it?

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:01:14

      Right.

   5. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:01:15

      How would our technology solve this?

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:01:15

      But does anybody have wild speculation that you've entertained?

   7. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:01:19

      Uh, yeah. I think there's ... Yeah, so one of the topics that often gets mentioned here is, is, uh, like, ultrasonic drilling.So having, having it resonate at a frequency that matches the native frequency of the rock and sort of separating the, uh, the, the rock e- more easily, and that's a technology that we're developing. Like, we do some ultrasonic drilling like this today with jewelry and stuff and it's ... You literally vibrate, you find the correct vibration you can put like a s- little star-shaped bit through a stone. Uh, they do it in, like, small work. I've seen lots of examples. And if you turn off the machine, it's like Excalibur stuck in the stone. You, you can't get that thing out. Like, it's, it takes ... You need that vibration to go through it. Uh, plasma, you can even go as far as, well, they were softening the stone somehow with, with some molecular technology. Um, speculation like that. Uh, I would also say that some of these examples of technology and machining extend way up to the, these massive objects. Like, you have thousand-ton, single-piece objects that also exhibit some of these signs of precision engineering. So you might be talking about some truly giant machines that made them. Uh, giant columns and, and statues and things like that.

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:02:22

      And what do, what do conventional archeologists say when they're confronted by all this data? The pottery, or the, the, excuse me, the, uh, the vases, this, this stuff that you're looking at here-

   9. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:02:36

      It's, it's, you-

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:02:36

       ... what do they say?

   11. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:02:37

       Well, you either get, you either just get a, a, a denial and they won't address it, and you get dismissed as, as a, as just being ridiculous pseudo-archeology fantasy theory type thing, or in the case of the tube drills, for examples, uh, they, they (laughs) will ... And this is a funny story 'cause they will argue that, "No, no. It's not spiral. The grooves on that thing aren't spiral." And in fact, in the textbook - this is what Chris Dunn found out - in the textbook that they, where they do try to address the engineering with that tube drill, they took the photo of the tube drill and they just tilted it, just a little bit, so when you look at it on the page, the lines look horizontal.

   12. JCJimmy Corsetti1:03:11

       Nah!

   13. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:03:11

       (laughs) It's literally in a- in the textbook, in the-

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:03:14

       Oh, they fucked with it in the textbook?

   15. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:03:15

       Yeah.

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:03:15

       Why would they do that?

   17. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:03:16

       They altered the photo because they ... If, if you admit that that, that the, the, that tube has a spiral, has a spiral groove on it, now you're admitting that they're cutting into that granite at a ridiculous rate and you can't do any of that stuff with any of the primitive tools. It has this flow and effect that just knocks over this house of cards that says all this stuff was built with primitive technology and the whole concept of the ancient Egyptians is, is off. Now, I, I don't think it's o- ... I think the dynastic Egyptians, they used primitive tools. I think they just inherited a lot of stuff that's potentially a lot older. You know? I, i- ... And the proofs in the puddings with these vases, for example. That stuff, tho- those things disappear from dynastic Egypt after the, like, the third, fourth dynasty. They don't make 'em anymore. They made alabaster vases.

   18. JCJimmy Corsetti1:04:00

       Is that a tool? That-

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:04:01

       What is that?

   20. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:04:02

       That's, that's a, the fantastic (laughs) example of, of what I would call an out-of-place artifact. It's a hollow tube of lapis lazuli, which, by the way, there's no quarries for lapis in, in Egypt, or the, the closest one's probably in Afghanistan. Uh, came from Gebel tariq. Found in a pre-dynastic site. It's hollowed, uh, it's perfectly made. This is a very difficult thing to achieve even with, uh, modern machinery, and it's displayed in a cabinet next to what? Bone and beads.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:04:26

       (laughs)

   22. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:04:26

       (laughs) Right?

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:04:27

       And what is that?

   24. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:04:29

       It's-

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:04:29

       What is that supposed to be?

   26. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:04:30

       It-

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:04:30

       That tube?

   28. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:04:31

       It's a, it's something decorative, I assume. It has a gold sheath, but it's a hollow tube. I actually have pictures of it from the end on, not, not probably in the ones you have, Jamie, but, yeah, hollow tube. It's an out-of-place artifact. Like, the-

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:04:41

       But-

   30. BKBen van Kerkwyk1:04:41

       These things from hard stone, they a- ... And these are more examples. Rock crystal obsidian gourds and vases that show just perfect machi- like, just very high degrees of sophistication.

Episode duration: 3:00:45