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Joe Rogan Experience #2009 - Duncan Trussell

Duncan Trussell is a stand-up comic, writer, actor, host of the "Duncan Trussell Family Hour" podcast, and creator of "The Midnight Gospel" on Netflix. www.duncantrussell.com

Joe RoganhostDuncan Trussellguest
Jun 27, 20242h 58mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

  1. 0:00 – 1:00

    Intro

    1. NA

      (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

    2. NA

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

    3. NA

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music)

    4. JR

      All right, let's go play. Let's go. What's happening? Hello, doctor. Hello, doctor. Hello. I feel good to be in a lab coat. It feels like, um, my opinion means more. Dude, it does. I mean, I l- this is freaking incredible. Like, the, you don't realize the power in costumes until you got a lab coat on. Like, if we were walking around a CVS... Right. ... people would ask us for advice. Yes. They'd probably be like, "Is this the right spray for me?" Isn't it amazing? It's amazing. Like, what is the purpose of a lab coat? Like, why this particular coat? What does this... Does this provide any protection? Is it, uh, good for the act? You want monkey blood? You want monkey blood on your good shirt? Like... Oh. ... you gotta, like, wear the lab coat 'cause, like, you get blood. Right. In the late 19th and

  2. 1:00 – 3:17

    White Lab Code

    1. JR

      20th, early 20th centuries, when many scientific breakthroughs happened, the white lab coat started to symbolize cleanliness and scientific rigor. Not only it made doctors and scientists easily distinguishable, but it also made spotting any contamination easier. That makes sense. Was that a problem back then, mixing up your doctor with your scientist? Is that a real problem? Was that what they're saying? It says it makes doctors and scientists more easily dis-... Oh, together. Yeah. 'Cause they're both wearing- They're both wearing lab coats. ... oh, it's not like costumes, like doctor costumes- (laughs) No. ... scientist... (laughs) Right. You go to the doctor, "Doctor, help me." "I'm not that kinda doctor." (laughs) "I'm a PhD." (laughs) "I study nuclear atoms." I like that that acknowledges that this is a kind of, uh, ceremonial outfit. Yeah. Right. It's a priest's robe because it's, like, symbolic more than practical for some people. Well, there's a bunch of those, right? Like the judge's robe. Oh my God, that's so weird. How weird is that? Because if you had a guy who was dressed, like, in a golf shirt with, like, shorts on- Yeah. ... and a pair of Nikes, and he's, like, ruling judgment on things, you'd be like, "Fuck that guy. Who's that guy?" Yeah. "He's a regular guy." (laughs) Yeah, like a tan- (laughs) Like a tank top. (laughs) Yeah. A dude in a tank top sending you to life. With a mullet. (laughs) A dude who's dressed like Joe Dirt. Also, the hammer. Right. They bang the hammer to, like, signify that justice has been served. What a weird trick. That is a we-... I mean, this is... When you realize how all of society has got occult aspects to it. Like, those are people in ceremonial clothes- Yes, yeah. ... banging a ceremonial hammer. Y- if not occult, definitely cult. Well, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, cu- it's like... Yeah. Yeah, what is the d- what's the v-... well, the root of cult and occult? Like, what is the, the, the connection to those to- those two words? The devil. Satan. (laughs) Satan. There's, uh, gotta be some kind of connection, right? Doesn't it-

    2. DT

      The, the fascinating thing about cults is that when they get to a certain size, we stop calling them cults. Yeah. Like, they're really successful... Well, the, the idea is

  3. 3:17 – 6:35

    Cult vs Occult

    1. DT

      that there's no such thing as a successful cult, and that's really just not true. Okay, the words "cult" and "occult" are popular terms that should not be confused as one another, so what are the differences between them? Cult... No, the, the term "cult" typically is used by the secular media to describe religious or semi-religious groups whose members are controlled in almost every single respect by a single individual. Hmm. Huh. Some good examples are Hari Christians and Scientologists. But that's not, like, a single individual. I don't think that's a good definition. You know what I'm saying? Uh... By a single individual? Well- That's not- ... i think that is a- ... it's a group. ... m- that's the classic... I mean, the- ... right, but they're saying Scientology. Scientology clearly has an organization. I mean, there's one guy that's the head of Scientology, but- Yeah. ... they have, like, a whole... they're, they're very... it's a very complex organization. Very complex. Oh, well, I mean, I think the idea is that the... so the, the main cult leader generally has, like- The doctrine. ... you know, deputies around him. Okay. Like, uh, you know, he has his own sort of close inner circle. Hmm. Right. In that case, it's true, right? And the bigger it gets, then the deputies have deputies, or whatever you wanna call it, and then, and that's how you get a big, functional cult. Right, right. You know, and, and l- I think probably... I mean, it would be safe to say that r-... a successful cult passes that barrier- Mm-hmm. ... between "What, what the fuck? You guys believe that shit?" to "What the fuck? You don't believe that shit?" Like, your cult doctrine becomes the, like, language of truth. Yeah. And then you've succeeded, like, then your cult went... that's like the, the, the... you, you're one in 100 million, maybe. Most cults just fail, I imagine. Yeah, that, but that seems to be a, just a natural pattern for, for human thinking and behaving, that we, uh, for whatever reason, like, naturally fall into groupthink. Oh, yeah. And it, it happens. And if we're led by a very strong, charismatic person that we think is exceptional, we'll, we'll accept it. Yeah, right. Like, you... and, and I... You know, we've talked about this. I can see the function in that. Like, if you, like, if you're in a situation that you don't know how to handle, you want the person who's the best at handling the situation to say, "Here's what we do." Yeah. And then that's great, then that's when it works. Right. But it should only be... it should be situational, right? Right. It shouldn't be like you know everything. Right. That's where it turns into a cult. Well, that's like... W- that, that... what is that term that, uh, some people that are really smart...

    2. JR

      ... uh, tend to believe they're really smart at other things, because they're really smart at one thing, they'll get, uh, a distor-... it's a very common term.

    3. DT

      I know what you're saying.

    4. JR

      F-... uh, it's- it's at the tip of my tongue.

    5. DT

      It's a distortion.

    6. JR

      But it- it's a thing that happens to you when you're really good at one thing, where you think you're just exceptional, period.

    7. DT

      Right.

    8. JR

      And you think you know-

    9. DT

      Yeah.

    10. JR

      ... more about m-... may-... you know, like, there are scientists that are really terrible about health. They're probably brilliant when it comes to certain aspects of-

    11. DT

      Right.

    12. JR

      ... whatever it is they study. String theory.

    13. DT

      Yeah, sure.

    14. JR

      But their- their- their knowledge of health, their knowledge-

    15. DT

      Yeah.

    16. JR

      ... of how to work their... Like, I've talked to scientists, they're like, "Oh, I don't think vitamins are important." Like, what the fuck are you saying?

    17. DT

      Dunning-Kruger.

    18. JR

      Dunning-Kruger effect. Thank you. The smarter... Can you just put... Sorry. It

  4. 6:35 – 12:18

    Cognitive Bias

    1. JR

      says, "The smarter you feel, the dumber you are. Uh, the dumb people think they are smart, and the smart people think they're dumb. Uh, if you're like most people, you'll likely be very good at something, and you openly admit you're less competent at something else."

    2. DT

      Yeah.

    3. JR

      "However, we've all met someone in our work and life who always overestimates their knowledge or ability of a certain topic or skill. Where some people are obviously incompetent in a particular subject, they'll, like, confidently insist they know everything. That's when you start to wonder, how on earth could this person be that, well, stupid?"

    4. DT

      Stupid.

    5. JR

      "In fact, this is not uncommon. Even William Shakespeare mentioned it 400-plus years ago, 'The fool thinks himself to be wise, while the wise man knows himself to be a fool.' Today, this phenomena is known as cognitive bias of illusionary superiority." So, um, but it-

    6. DT

      Wow.

    7. JR

      ... but it does have something to do with you being good at something and being really stupid at other things because you think you're smart.

    8. DT

      What a great insult to tell someone that they have Dunning-Kruger.

    9. JR

      A Dunning-Kruger. Yeah.

    10. DT

      Yeah.

    11. JR

      Yeah.

    12. DT

      That is a great way to call someone dumb.

    13. JR

      Yeah. Well, it's- it's interesting, 'cause that's what... This is the problem with the term dumb. Really what it is, is what are you focusing on? Because there's very intelligent people that didn't focus on communication.

    14. DT

      Right.

    15. JR

      They didn't focus on language. They didn't focus on proper grammar or how to structure a good sentence.

    16. DT

      Yeah.

    17. JR

      They focused on a particular act, whether it's swimming, or whether it's chess-

    18. DT

      Yeah.

    19. JR

      ... or whether... They- they focused on a th-... whether it's playing guitar-

    20. DT

      Pool.

    21. JR

      ... playing pool. I've met brilliant people playing pool.

    22. DT

      Right.

    23. JR

      I think I've told you about my friend Johnny, who could do complex math in his head.

    24. DT

      Yeah.

    25. JR

      I mean, he... and not com-... not complex, but math in his head. So, what you would do, you would- you would... one guy would have a calculator, and we would do this at the pool hall, and then we would go, "300 divided by 5 minus 4 plus 16 times 2." And he would bang. (snaps fingers)

    26. DT

      Yeah.

    27. JR

      He would just rattle it out. We would go, "What the fuck, man?"

    28. DT

      Yeah. What i- what the fuck? How di-

    29. JR

      What... And he was homeless.

    30. DT

      Did he say how he did the trick?

  5. 12:18 – 14:18

    Blindfolded Chess

    1. JR

      gotta be a skill.

    2. DT

      There's videos of people teaching you how to do it.

    3. JR

      Oh, wow.

    4. DT

      Um, but I'm trying to... This is just, like, people talking about it. I'm just trying to find a... Like a game, I guess. It's not showing two people, though. It's not... It's kinda hard to watch.

    5. JR

      Is there one that says, uh, how t- uh, "two people playing blindfolded chess"?

    6. DT

      Uh, I figured something would pop up with people playing chess in a...

    7. Is that it, ma- No.

    8. JR

      Yeah. Right in t-

    9. DT

      Three-man chess is head-to-head-to-head mental combat. Like...

    10. That's just a different kind of chess.

    11. See, that's why I thought this was gonna be-

    12. JR

      Wait, what is it called again?

    13. DT

      This is s- something else.

    14. JR

      What, what... How do they... What are they called? Blindfolded chess?

    15. DT

      Blindfolded chess.

    16. JR

      How about just type in "two people playing blindfolded chest"? Chess. There it is, blindfolded chess.

    17. DT

      Oh, it's just one guy.

    18. JR

      Hmm.

    19. DT

      Here's a guy playing 48 games blindfolded.

    20. JR

      (laughs) Jesus Christ.

    21. DT

      Wow. (laughs)

    22. JR

      What?

    23. DT

      While he's riding an exercise bike.

    24. JR

      Oh, my God. That's so insane.

    25. DT

      All the games start at the same time.

    26. JR

      Oh, my God. That is so insane.

    27. DT

      Um...

    28. What?

    29. Is there a video?

    30. 80% win rate?

  6. 14:18 – 17:33

    Chess

    1. JR

      thing you're r- you're relying upon. I wonder if that... I wonder if that does anything for your long-term memory too? Like, I wonder if ch- like, c- they do say that chess is, like, one of the very best games for j- just, just your cognitive function.

    2. DT

      It makes sense.

    3. JR

      It makes sense. It's-

    4. DT

      Yeah.

    5. JR

      ... super complex.

    6. DT

      Yeah.

    7. JR

      I mean, think of... It's, it's basically like running with your brain.

    8. DT

      Yeah.

    9. JR

      Right? And-

    10. DT

      Did you ever get into it?

    11. JR

      No. I got scared.

    12. DT

      It's, it's, it's pretty... I, I, I only got into it 'cause I had a cool video game where the chess pieces could fight.

    13. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    14. DT

      And so that made me, like, get interested in, like, the most surface level. I mean, I was horrible at, you know, the opening moves.

    15. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    16. DT

      And how each opening move, there's... Statistically, I think, the right opening, uh, second move to do against the opening move, and then you, you... All these combos and shit that you have to memorize.

    17. JR

      Hmm.

    18. DT

      It's so c- And then y- you have to think so many moves ahead, uh, so the... Based on all the possible things they might do.

    19. JR

      Yeah.

    20. DT

      Producing all these parallel chess timelines, and you're trying to pick the one that's, like, the one you win in.

    21. JR

      Chess falls into that whole golf thing with me. I'm sure I'd love it.

    22. DT

      Yes.

    23. JR

      But I don't wanna do that. I don't, I don't have any time for anything new like that. I already have a problem with pool. Uh, you know, like, I, I, I fucking wanna play it all the time.

    24. DT

      Yeah. Well, I mean, it's a lot easier to... For me, to, like, level up in Diablo IV-

    25. JR

      (laughs)

    26. DT

      ... than go to the gym.

    27. JR

      Right, right.

    28. DT

      Like, infinitely easier.

    29. JR

      (laughs)

    30. DT

      And my brain does not produce the same level of pleasure leaving the gym. But, what is it, like, f- 30% of that? And I think sometimes if you are particularly weak, you'll just settle for that. You're like-

  7. 17:33 – 19:48

    Health

    1. DT

      first?

    2. JR

      No. It's, uh, necessary for me, and it's necessary for me for mental health, and also I'm not e- Uh, I don't want my body to fail. Like, it... I don't... I've seen people my age-

    3. DT

      Yeah.

    4. JR

      ... that don't exercise, and their shoulders don't work and their knees-

    5. DT

      Right.

    6. JR

      ... are fucked, and they're always tired, and-

    7. DT

      Yeah.

    8. JR

      Like, that's not a good way to go through life. If you wanna enjoy life, you wanna have as much energy as possible, and the best way to have as much energy as possible is to be really fit.... be really fit and healthy and eat good foods and take a lot of vitamins, take supplements, take... you know, eat healthy food, try to stay the fuck away from processed garbage. Don't drink too much.

    9. DT

      Right.

    10. JR

      Don't, don't do anything bad for your health. Because your, your, your energy depends upon this physical form.

    11. DT

      Yeah.

    12. JR

      And it's literally made out of what you put in it.

    13. DT

      Yeah.

    14. JR

      It's literally made out of that, both with effort and with food.

    15. DT

      Right.

    16. JR

      And with sleep.

    17. DT

      Yeah.

    18. JR

      The, the effort that you take to sleep.

    19. DT

      Right.

    20. JR

      And then also the effort you take to have a stress-free environment, you know? The, the, the effort that you take to put out as, as little bullshit as you can, and to, like, be nice to people as often...

    21. DT

      Yeah.

    22. JR

      ... as you can. And just sort of a... keep harmonious, fun people around you-

    23. DT

      Yes.

    24. JR

      ... you, you feel better.

    25. DT

      Yeah.

    26. JR

      You know? Like when... if I'm going through something, like some friends of mines are squabbling and I have to, like, s- get in between them and have conversations, I fucking hate it.

    27. DT

      Yeah.

    28. JR

      I hate it.

    29. DT

      The worst.

    30. JR

      I hate when people's feelings are hurt, I hate when people are mad at other people. I fucking hate it. And I think a lot of times, it can be avoided. But if you could... uh, if you're not avoiding it and you're just jumping in it all the time-

  8. 19:48 – 22:08

    Maintenance

    1. JR

      not call things out when something's atrocious.

    2. DT

      Right.

    3. JR

      But just the less bullshit you have in your life, whether it's bullshit that you have to deal with 'cause you didn't exercise or your body's breaking down, it's like car maintenance. Like, if you just don't ever change your oil-

    4. DT

      Right.

    5. JR

      ... you could go a long time. I dated, I dated this girl once when I was 22, and she told me she had never changed the oil in her car.

    6. DT

      What?

    7. JR

      I go, "How long have you had this car?" (laughs) She started the car, it was like b- literal black smoke was coming outta the back.

    8. DT

      Holy shit.

    9. JR

      She had a Firebird. And I was like, "You've never changed your oil?" She'd never changed her oil, but her car was still driving. That's a lot of humans' bodies. It's the same thing. It's just... it's-

    10. DT

      Right.

    11. JR

      ... very similar. You're not doing the maintenance.

    12. DT

      Right. Yeah.

    13. JR

      Yeah.

    14. DT

      Man, it is, uh... it's interest-... like you just described, like two parallel universes that exist side by side, like...

    15. JR

      Mm.

    16. DT

      And if I had to bet, there are more people in the, in the discordant... Is that what you'd say? In the, in the inharmonious reality-

    17. JR

      Yeah.

    18. DT

      ... than the harmonious one. Like I think that, that probably... I mean, I... it's cynical to say, but probably what? Like 70% of people to some degree are stuck in the gravity well of whatever those things you... it's a gravity well.

    19. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    20. DT

      That's, that... because that's the thing, man. You know, climbing out of that fucking hole is the hardest part, but that hole has its own gravity. And the gravity is around addiction to just the stuff you're describing. You're addicted to drama, you're addicted to eating shitty food, you're addicted to, like, staying up late and doomscrolling, or whatever it's...

    21. JR

      Mm.

    22. DT

      It's, it's a gravity. And so then you gotta crawl out of it to get into that other place.

    23. JR

      Yeah.

    24. DT

      And you get in that other place, and generally the first thing you think is, "God, this is incredible." But then the more you stay in that place, you kind of forget how bad it felt in the other place.

    25. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    26. DT

      And that's where the pattern can, like... you get sucked back into the gravity well. You don't-

    27. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    28. DT

      ... like, stay steady in the discipline.

    29. JR

      Yeah.

    30. DT

      I think that's a lot of

  9. 22:08 – 23:18

    Natural Instincts

    1. DT

      people. Like that is a... an-

    2. JR

      It's more people than not, because our natural human instincts are to, you know, ah, ah. It's like to squabble.

    3. DT

      Yeah.

    4. JR

      It's like there's natural squabble-

    5. DT

      Yeah.

    6. JR

      ... that's built into people. But it's a pattern of d- behavior. It's a pattern of thinking. You can recognize that it's a dangerous pattern, or a shitty pattern, or, or an unproductive pattern, an overall negative pattern-

    7. DT

      Yeah.

    8. JR

      ... and just sort of, "Uh." Just get it out of there.

    9. DT

      Yeah.

    10. JR

      Just don't... y- you can do that. I've done it. You can do it. People can do it. You gotta, you gotta learn what it is.

    11. DT

      You gotta admit your own aggression.

    12. JR

      Yes.

    13. DT

      Because if you don't, then you trick yourself as you engage in some conversation-

    14. JR

      Yeah.

    15. DT

      ... into thinking that there is an aggression behind it. And, you know, you... I don't know if you can get rid of all aggression and confrontation. Like I don't know if it's possible to fully drop it. I imagine... but, you know, uh, listening to other people too, like I try... I have to do that. And people are like, "You, you, you were being short," you know, or, "You were..." whatever.

    16. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    17. DT

      It's like, you gotta listen, think-

    18. JR

      Right.

    19. DT

      ... it's po-... even though I don't think I was.

    20. JR

      Right.

    21. DT

      Your... our vol-... your volume

  10. 23:18 – 27:33

    The Green Room

    1. DT

      might be different or something.

    2. JR

      We were having a conversation about this last night in the green room too. It's like the way we talk to each other as comics, like, you know... (laughs) everyone had a story of how they talked to their wife or their spouse like a comic once. You know, like, "What the fuck did you think was gonna happen?" You know, where, like, the way you would say something to me, like if I did something really stupid, you're like, "What the fuck did you think was gonna happen?" (laughs) And I would start laughing.

    3. DT

      Yeah.

    4. JR

      But you can't make those kind of jokes sometimes with regular people. Like, regular people, we wi- we are insult... like you could say, like, the most heinous joke to Tony Hinchcliffe, and he would fall on the ground laughing, holding his thighs.

    5. DT

      Yes.

    6. JR

      You could say terrible things about him and connecting him to Joffrey from Game of Thrones, and he'll, he'll be on the ground laughing.... right? But if you do that to just a regular guy that you work with, it's very likely he's gonna be severely upset, and-

    7. DT

      Oh, yes.

    8. JR

      ... very butthurt. And we are so used to talking to each other like that.

    9. DT

      Dude, I've made, like, permanent, I don't wanna say enemies-

    10. JR

      (laughs)

    11. DT

      ... but I know there's people who, like, won't talk, won't talk to me now 'cause I forgot that. And just, you know, start... uh, just out of a habit.

    12. JR

      Yeah.

    13. DT

      Just, you interact with them, uh, and you can't, you can't do that.

    14. JR

      No, you can't.

    15. DT

      I just put te- I just put, uh, tear... eye drops in my eyes so my eye, face was wet as though from tears, walked out in the living room and told our midwife that Obama had died. Like, and thank God, she has a s- she laughed, a sense of humor, but then suddenly I realized, like, "What the fuck am I doing?" My wife is looking at me like, "What are you doing?"

    16. JR

      (laughs)

    17. DT

      It's the midwife. You're coming out here with fake tears saying Obama died. Obama died? That's fucked up. Everyone, like, went... (gasps) "What?" 'Cause, you know, it's, would be so upsetting, but, like, and then I realized, like, "What am I doing?"

    18. JR

      (laughs)

    19. DT

      What am I doing?

    20. JR

      You're doing what you would do in the green room. (laughs)

    21. DT

      In the green room, in my living room.

    22. JR

      You're always doing that.

    23. DT

      (laughs)

    24. JR

      When, when you say something to me, there's always, like, this, "What's... uh."

    25. DT

      I know.

    26. JR

      You should do it. You should definitely meet them.

    27. DT

      Um-

    28. JR

      Remember that last night?

    29. DT

      Me too, me too.

    30. JR

      You were s- you were trying to convince me s... I'm s... I can't even say it because I would have to admit-

  11. 27:33 – 29:38

    Fake Arguments

    1. JR

      wh- like, it's one thing if you're having some argument with some stranger, but especially when it's, like, a good friend.

    2. DT

      Joe, I remember what you were saying.

    3. JR

      What was I saying?

    4. DT

      You were saying when people have an agenda, like when you're in a conversation with somebody like that and you f- s- detect some kind of slight agenda in there somewhere.

    5. JR

      Oh, I was saying, you, the, the, some of your best fake arguments about things, you get real subtle with it, where I'm like, "What is... what... is he serious? Like, is it-"

    6. DT

      Right.

    7. JR

      And then you'll slowly-

    8. DT

      Right.

    9. JR

      ... slowly enter-

    10. DT

      I got you.

    11. JR

      ... into the preposterous. (laughs)

    12. DT

      I got you. I got you. Yeah. That, the... oh, yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about.

    13. JR

      So, if you were doing that-

    14. DT

      Yeah.

    15. JR

      ... with, like, normal people, it would take a long time for them to figure out what the fuck you're doing.

    16. DT

      And then when they do, they're like, "Why?"

    17. JR

      (laughs)

    18. DT

      "Why did you do that?"

    19. JR

      I know. (laughs)

    20. DT

      (laughs)

    21. JR

      Then they could never... see, and then they would never trust you again.

    22. DT

      Yeah, it's a sociopath.

    23. JR

      (laughs)

    24. DT

      "What, what? He just told me his, his, his sister was eaten by a bear last week. What..."

    25. JR

      Do you know what I'm realizing? That there's a wh- there's another, uh, layer of comedy. There's another layer of comedy. It's green room comedy.

    26. DT

      Right.

    27. JR

      Green room comedy is some of my favorite comedy.

    28. DT

      The best.

    29. JR

      Some of my favorite comedy. We were crying last night.

    30. DT

      Yeah.

  12. 29:38 – 32:18

    Ideas

    1. DT

    2. JR

      Right.

    3. DT

      "This is happening?"

    4. JR

      Yeah. Isn't it crazy that it was an idea and now it's a real thing?

    5. DT

      Yes.

    6. JR

      It was an idea, and now it's a real thing. That's the... I w- I had the, the wildest idea, uh, about ideas once, that what if ideas are a life form, and the way they manifest in reality is they, they get into a person's brain and then influence that person to take action to create them? The same way, like, a parasite will get into, uh, a grasshopper's brain-

    7. DT

      Yeah.

    8. JR

      ... like, a water pe- like, those aquatic worms, and they convince the grasshopper to commit suicide-

    9. DT

      Yeah.

    10. JR

      ... so that they could be born. Like, w- weird shit happens with parasites. What if ideas are a life form...... is everything that exists that human beings have created. Just think about the fucking immense amount of objects that we've created. All of them came from ideas.

    11. DT

      Yeah.

    12. JR

      All of them.

    13. DT

      Yeah.

    14. JR

      And the, we think of, "This is my idea. I had this idea." But we both know that ideas are very strange. They, they come to you in the weirdest of ways. It's the reason why people believe in the muse. It's the reason why, uh, Pressfield's book, The War of Art, is so good.

    15. DT

      Yeah.

    16. JR

      Because when he documents this sort of journey that he goes on every day when he writes, where he summons the muse.

    17. DT

      Yeah.

    18. JR

      He does it like... And he is, if, in m- his mind, "No, it's a real thing," and then starts to write, and, and, and treats it like a ritual.

    19. DT

      Yeah.

    20. JR

      Like you're gonna be there all the time. What, what is happening there? Like what, uh, what are you summoning when you get these ideas? Whether it's summoning something that's a, a creative work, like literature, or whether it's the invention that changes society forever.

    21. DT

      Right.

    22. JR

      Like all of them came from ideas.

    23. DT

      Yeah, and a lot of them, like a lot of, like, uh, the great ideas, like, uh, Tesla, he just openly admits it came to him in a vision.

    24. JR

      Yeah.

    25. DT

      He saw it. Like he doesn't even ascribe it to his own mind. It was like a, uh, a vision.

    26. JR

      Don't you feel that way about some of your best jokes?

    27. DT

      Yeah.

    28. JR

      That they just pop into your head?

    29. DT

      Yeah, but you know what's, you know what's weird about Tesla, and, uh, uh, j- d- j- I'm sorry, you guys, if I'm wrong about this, but I, I, I, I read it and was blown away, and I think it was on his Wikipedia, but I could be wrong. Apparently, he was thinking about Faust when he had the vision. Now, I hope I'm not wrong about that, you guys.

    30. JR

      Really?

  13. 32:18 – 35:53

    Poetry

    1. DT

    2. JR

      How poetry inspired Tesla to design one of his most important inventions. Do-do-do. Let's, uh...

    3. NA

      It's, uh, somewhere...

    4. JR

      There it is.

    5. DT

      Faust.

    6. JR

      Yeah. (clears throat) One of the lesser facts, uh, known, one of the lesser-known facts about Tesla is that he was also a great fan of poetry. Uh, uh, it was an expert of-

    7. DT

      Goethe's-

    8. JR

      ... Gert-

    9. DT

      I think Goethe.

    10. JR

      Gerta? Goethe's, Goethe Faust.

    11. DT

      Goethe's Faust.

    12. JR

      Goethe's Faust that inspired him to finalize his invention of the alternating current motor. The term world-changing invention certainly applies to this innovation. Uh...

    13. DT

      So what inspired that was a, a poem, I, well, I thought it was a play, a poem about an alchemist selling his soul to the devil. So all of modern technology originated from the inspiration that he derived from a poem about a satanic (laughs) bargain.

    14. JR

      Whoa.

    15. DT

      (laughs) Isn't that wild? When-

    16. JR

      The Faustian bargain.

    17. DT

      The Faustian bargain-

    18. JR

      Yeah.

    19. DT

      ... was the, w- according to the person who invented it, was the inspiration-

    20. JR

      Yeah.

    21. DT

      ... for technology that we are still, like, h- using today, like, that's-

    22. JR

      Yeah.

    23. DT

      So that, so then you th- then you go back and you think, "Well, what, what inspired Goethe?" You know, and then you realize it's like this crazy wave of, like it ripples through time. Like you, somebody gets a great inspir- uh, gets inspired, writes it down, it's beautiful. I don't know how long passed between when he wrote that and Tesla had his vision. But certainly, obviously, Goethe probably had no idea that when he spent the time writing that thing and trusted to write it down, he was gonna warp the entire planet. His poem was gonna ripple out and warp the entire planet just from a poem. That's wild, man.

    24. JR

      Phew.

    25. DT

      Isn't that crazy? Isn't that nuts? Especially, and it's so meta.

    26. NA

      You weren't wrong. It is a play, but it's written in verse.

    27. JR

      Ah.

    28. NA

      So it is a poetry also.

    29. DT

      Gotcha.

    30. JR

      Wow. 1808.

  14. 35:53 – 45:07

    Bandwidth

    1. JR

      (laughs)

    2. DT

      (laughs)

    3. NA

      (laughs)

    4. JR

      Well, it's, it's, uh, uh, I always tell people that the way I try to think about things is bandwidth. I try to think about... I pretend, uh, there's a number. Let's say that number is 100. I have 100 band- one 100 units that I have for my information, for what I'm allowed to think about, that-

    5. DT

      That's cool.

    6. JR

      ... what I can use my brain for. Anytime-

    7. DT

      (laughs)

    8. JR

      ... I put stuff in there that's nonsense, anytime I put stuff in there that's, uh, that's negative or unproductive or-... at least, uh, un- unless it's funny.

    9. DT

      Yeah, right.

    10. JR

      Anytime I'm putting stuff in there, that's taking away from all my other stuff. And one thing that people need to understand is that one of the things your brain will do to protect yourself from, whether it's the pressure of success, or succeeding, or accomplishing things, your brain will, when you're presented with the stress of trying to accomplish something, it will put extra emphasis on all these stupid things in your life to distract you.

    11. DT

      Yes.

    12. JR

      And it, it almost, like, protects you from the stress of having to do the work. And you see people sabotage their lives, sabotage their careers. You see it happen to artists, musicians, fighters, comedians.

    13. DT

      Sure.

    14. JR

      It's a normal thing that we do just as, as human beings. You, you get freaked out by what you know you should do, so you spend more time paying attention to the things that you shouldn't do.

    15. DT

      Yeah, man.

    16. JR

      Self-sabotage.

    17. DT

      Self-sabotage. And, and-

    18. JR

      It's very real.

    19. DT

      Very real. And, and based, at least my own assessment of it, it's based on the delusion that the feeling of pro- procrastination is less painful than the feeling of doing your work.

    20. JR

      Mm.

    21. DT

      And it couldn't... It's the opposite.

    22. JR

      Yeah.

    23. DT

      Like, procrastination, you spread it out across your life, like your weeks, you just spread this nice shitty coating of procrastination, mild anxiety, general, like, sense of like, "Oh, I'm a piece of shit," 'cause you're not doing it, and then when you finally get around to doing it, you realize the thing you didn't wanna do is so fun-

    24. JR

      Yes.

    25. DT

      ... most of the time.

    26. JR

      Most of the time.

    27. DT

      Engaging, interesting, but if nothing else, you feel so much better 'cause you're finally taking care of it.

    28. JR

      Yeah.

    29. DT

      And you realize, all that anxiety, all that... If you, if you somehow could quantify the amount of anxiety you're gonna feel procrastinating versus the amount of anxiety you're gonna feel doing something, you know what I mean? It's exponentially more anxiety from procrastinating.

    30. JR

      Yes.

  15. 45:07 – 48:19

    Presidents

    1. JR

    2. DT

      Yeah.

    3. JR

      Yeah.

    4. DT

      So that, to me, is interesting. Like, within society is a whole hidden realm. And specifically, as far as I'm aware, no one has seen a president come in the public. Like, it's more secret than aliens. Like, there's no video of a president coming? There isn't that I'm aware of. We will never know.

    5. JR

      You don't think on Epstein's island there was vis- videos of presidents coming?

    6. DT

      Like, you would play them? Like... (laughs)

    7. JR

      Over and over again. Well, do you... Why do you think Epstein had that giant painting of Bill Clinton in a dress in his foyer?

    8. DT

      Dude.

    9. JR

      Do you know that picture?

    10. DT

      Yeah.

    11. JR

      That painting?

    12. DT

      Epstein's taste in art was not great. Like, if you look at the shit-

    13. JR

      Yo, that was great.

    14. DT

      That-

    15. JR

      That- that painting is like, "I got you, bitch." That's what that is.

    16. DT

      Oh, right.

    17. JR

      You got a president who was on the flight logs 26 times with Epstein, and you got that guy in a fucking dress in your house.

    18. DT

      Okay, I'm dumb. I'm sorry, dude. I'm officially dumb-

    19. JR

      Why?

    20. DT

      ... 'cause I've known about that picture, and I've just been like, "Why would anybody want a fucking picture of Bill-"

    21. JR

      That- that is, "I got you, bitch."

    22. DT

      That's just a like, "Hey, yeah, you're-"

    23. JR

      That's, "I got you, bitch."

    24. DT

      That is terrifying.

    25. JR

      That's terrifying. Imagine if I knew some horrible dark secrets about you, and you came over my house, and I have a giant painting of you right when you walk into the front door.

    26. DT

      Yeah.

    27. JR

      Of you in a dress.

    28. DT

      Yeah.

    29. JR

      And I'm like, "Hey, buddy."

    30. DT

      "Hi. Welcome."

  16. 48:19 – 49:28

    Creeping me out

    1. JR

    2. DT

      Ah.

    3. JR

      Where were we?

    4. DT

      Man, we... You were creeping me out.

    5. JR

      (laughs)

    6. DT

      Because you were like... There was like... You have a talent for creeping me out, man. Like, uh, like when you describe bear attacks.

    7. JR

      Yeah.

    8. DT

      Fucks me up for a while, or shark attacks. But yeah, we were talking about, uh... We were talking about the Epstein Clinton painting and how, you know, sort of like the implication of anything like that or the reminder of anything like that is... Because the- the- the... Our leaders are human, and humans are culpable and hackable, and it's easier to invade a country or take over a country by... Just control the leader, you control the country, so there's a clearly a pressure there. There's obviously people who would love to do that. And...... probably try, would try, and have probably succeeded a few times. Meaning, that our understanding of democracy as, like, the president represents the people, it's, like, totally wrong. That, in fact, it's, uh, s- potentially someone being controlled by people you'll never meet, or maybe never even knew existed. Ugh.

    9. JR

      Yeah.

    10. DT

      It's creepy. That

  17. 49:28 – 51:50

    Control

    1. DT

      can't be true.

    2. JR

      Well, it's gotta be true, because if it wasn't... Well, they would never... If you had (laughs) an enormous organization that controls everything-

    3. DT

      Yeah.

    4. JR

      ... you control everything in the country, would you really let a new person just run it every four years-

    5. DT

      Right.

    6. JR

      ... in whatever way they like?

    7. DT

      Right.

    8. JR

      Wouldn't you... If you're there forever, you're there forever, you're not there for four years.

    9. DT

      Yeah.

    10. JR

      You're running the various agencies, and, like, wouldn't you make sure over time that you secured enough control that the president really is just sort of a figurehead?

    11. DT

      Joe, I am a doctor. And-

    12. JR

      Oh.

    13. DT

      I, I'm sorry, but it seems like you're imply-

    14. JR

      Is this some kind of misinformation?

    15. DT

      Not, y- yeah.

    16. JR

      Mal-information?

    17. DT

      Mal-informations. Put the thing up. Say this was fact-checked and is wrong. 'Cause to me, it feels like, yeah, you're, like, implying that the presidents, the president of the United States' past-presidents were controlled by secret groups, or, I don't know, corporations or something. (laughs)

    18. JR

      That sounds crazy.

    19. DT

      Well, it's preposterous. It's preposterous.

    20. JR

      Yeah, I mean, we have a democracy. That, that's not even possible.

    21. DT

      Nobody, nobody o- on this planet would ever want to control the United States without having to invade it. Nobody would ever wanna do that, or try to do that, or su- succeed in doing that. Goddamn, man.

    22. JR

      You definitely couldn't do it with money.

    23. DT

      No. Presidents don't like money.

    24. JR

      No. They generally shy away from it.

    25. DT

      Most of them are dead broke even when they're in there in the White House. Like, you know? Like, they're, they're, like, dead fucking broke.

    26. JR

      That's why Bill Clinton ate McDonald's.

    27. DT

      Every day. Every day. And people had to loan him money and shit, dude. He would get his car booted and couldn't afford (laughs) to get the boot off. (laughs)

    28. JR

      (laughs)

    29. DT

      Yeah. This is why all of our American politicians are, like-

    30. JR

      They're paupers when they get out.

  18. 51:50 – 1:22:53

    Speaking Fees

    1. JR

      (laughs)

    2. DT

      Like, wow.

    3. JR

      How'd you make that much money? You, you just got back into business.

    4. DT

      Yeah.

    5. JR

      You weren't in business at all. And-

    6. DT

      Jump back into that housekeeping business.

    7. JR

      Now you're worth hundreds of millions of dollars. That's kind of crazy.

    8. DT

      F- you know, just some... You know, a- actually, my... I have a blind investor. I have a bl-... What do they call it where they don't know the investments being made? Like, "I just happen to have, like, a really good business, dude, who, like, invested the $10,000 I saved up before I became president, and it turned into millions."

    9. JR

      The most transparent one is speaking fees.

    10. DT

      Yes.

    11. JR

      'Cause it's... Speaking fees are a way that you can give people money. You can just give them money, and they, they perform a thing, they talk. And it can be the most uninspired, nonsensical, horseshit talk, it doesn't matter. They're gonna get a half a million dollars.

    12. DT

      That's right.

    13. JR

      And then-

    14. DT

      That's right.

    15. JR

      ... that's just a normal amount of money that you get. And then you go here, and you make it over there, and you go here, and you make it over-

    16. DT

      Yeah.

    17. JR

      ... and you collect from everybody. So you have some sort of financial arrangement, but that financial arrangement is about speaking fees.

    18. DT

      See, this is what I'm talking about, man. This is the liminal or subliminal part of the human experience. What you're talking about right now is upsetting to people, uh, but also, a lot of people w- will say, "Don't even talk... You're not even supposed to say that." Like, and, and even though it's true, like, even though it's in plain sight, trackable, traceable, precedent for it in the past, not even that, like, astounding, you are supposed to, like, rest in this strange dream world where human beings experiencing some of the most power you can have in the world don't go a little f-... Or totally or completely insane, or don't get hijacked, or don't get... Like, we're supposed to pretend that doesn't happen.

    19. JR

      Right.

    20. DT

      When you look at the president, look, like, does Biden seem like he'd be hard to trick?

    21. JR

      (laughs)

    22. DT

      (laughs)

    23. JR

      Uh... Would you even have to trick him, though?

    24. DT

      Maybe.

    25. JR

      I mean, I think... Oh, it's so hard to know what c- what goes on behind those closed doors when they're making decisions.

    26. DT

      Don't wanna know.

    27. JR

      I mean, see they made... They sent an extra b-... How many billion dollars did they accidentally sent to Ukraine?

    28. NA

      6.2.

    29. JR

      6.2 billion. It was an accident. They accidentally sent-

    30. DT

      They accidentally sent it?

Episode duration: 2:58:28

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