Joe Rogan Experience #2086 - Jim Norton

Jim Norton is a stand-up comic, actor, broadcast personality, and podcaster. He co-hosts the "UFC Unfiltered" podcast with Matt Serra, and "Jim Norton & Sam Roberts" show on SiriusXM. www.jimnorton.com https://www.youtube.com/@NikkiandJimNYC

Joe Rogan (in a later segment/overdub)hostJim Norton (playing another character in a bit)guestJamie Vernonguest

Jun 27, 20242h 40mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

150 min read · 30,033 words

0:00 – 5:35
NYC synagogue tunnel mystery and instant conspiracy swirl
1. JRJoe Rogan
  (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out.
2. JNJim Norton
  The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music) Speaking of cold in New York. How about these fucking Jewish folks?
3. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
4. JNJim Norton
  With the tunnel they're making under? Well, I- I'm reading about that. I don't even know what it means. Why would they hire people to dig a hole?
5. JRJoe Rogan
  (sighs) Um, I don't know exactly what's happening. All I know is very short clips that I found on the internet. But the funniest thing is this one guy on Twitter that was saying a while back, uh, "I live on a f- a ground floor apartment, and I hear Jews underneath me." (laughs) And everybody's like, "You're out of your fucking mind."
6. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, that's anti-Semitic.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  Exactly. And now he's like, "I told you I wasn't crazy!"
8. JNJim Norton
  (laughs)
9. JRJoe Rogan
  But this guy's just too much. (laughs)
10. JNJim Norton
  But what are they doing? Like, I- I heard that they hired people to build, like, this tunnel, and they were hanging out. And like the people would live there for like three weeks, these like migrant workers, were just digging this tunnel, and they stayed there for three weeks. But what's the purpose of it?
11. JRJoe Rogan
  I have no idea. I have no idea. I don't know anything. I just know that there's tunnels and that there's- there's this one video of this guy coming out of the sewer. So, he lifts a manhole cover, comes out of the sewer, and then he's fucking wandering around, this Hasidic Jewish guy. And everybody's like, "What the fuck are you doing down there?"
12. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, that's really bizarre. They wouldn't come out too. The cops had to get them out. Like, they were like, "We don't wanna come out." And they were like charged with disorderly conduct or something. I- I don't know. The whole fucking world is just weird.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  What do you know about this, Jimmy? Anything?
14. JNJim Norton
  Zt.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs) I haven't heard anything.
16. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  The best I've gotten is that they started making them during COVID, but that like, it line, it makes sense, but it also when you see the tunnels, you're like, no way. That's not... They didn't do that in two years or a year or six months, whatever it was.
18. JNJim Norton
  They weren't exactly nice tunnels either. They were just kind of shitty, rudimentary, basic holes.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  Right. Yeah.
20. JNJim Norton
  Like were they, were they doomsdayers? That was, they thought the world was gonna end?
21. JRJoe Rogan
  I... Wait a minute. The tunnels are so big that you don't think they could make them in two years? Is that what you're saying? Some of them look big. Really? It's like, how do you... I mean, some of them are saying they go mult- they're going to multiple different buildings. It's like a-
22. JNJim Norton
  Oh.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  ... series of tunnels. It's not just a tunnel. Well, let's, let's look into this. Let's see. I, they're still looking into it. I don't know, like the way they did the mapping of it. When was this discovered? Was it yesterday? It's only been discovered a couple years ago, and I forget how they- Couple years ago? Rea- days ago. Days ago. And, uh, some... I forget even how they discovered it. I think they were looking, um...
24. JNJim Norton
  Probably that guy complaining. He probably heard something and then maybe they saw somebody coming out of a manhole cover and somebody put two and two together.
25. JRJoe Rogan
  I have no idea what happened.
26. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, it's strange.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  But it's very bizarre. And then, of course, there's conspiracy theories and what are they doing down there and evil, evil theories. They immediately want to pour concrete in it, which makes sense 'cause it's probably not safe. You gotta... It's not supporting the weight of the, you know, of all the buildings above it.
28. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, you don't think of that when you move into an apartment building that some asshole might build a tunnel-
29. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
30. JNJim Norton
  ... underneath and collapse the fucking, collapse the building on you. (laughs)
5:35 – 6:47
A culture addicted to outrage (and why everything feels crazier now)
1. JNJim Norton
  And, and it's like the whole, the whole planet just hates each other. Everybody fucking hates each other.
2. JRJoe Rogan
  It's weird, right?
3. JNJim Norton
  It is... I don't even think it's about the issues. I don't think people are necessarily... People believe what they believe, but I think it's more the, the addiction to arguing and the addiction to being angry. Like, no matter what the subject, people just hate each other if they give... If- if someone gives the wrong answer, the people who think it's the wrong answer hate your guts.
4. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah, there's a lot of that going on. I, the- I think there's a lot of like very heavy stress in the world, and people are relieving that stress through these sort of endeavors.... you know? And I don't, I don't think it's logical.
5. JNJim Norton
  No, it's not logical. And it's, it's almost like people don't want the answer that's gonna make sense. They want the answer that's gonna enable them to get angry.
6. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
7. JNJim Norton
  Like, it really is ... Like when people try to go after somebody for jokes or whatever, it's self-serving. It's like, if I hear what you say, it's either gonna make me feel better about my position, or it's gonna get me high because I'm angry at you.
8. JRJoe Rogan
  Yep.
9. JNJim Norton
  But it's always self-serving. It's, it's just, the whole thing is insincere.
10. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, it's all very exag- exaggerated by social media. Social media has made everybody way more insane. And it's not gonna get any better. It's only gonna get worse, because of all this AI shit. It's ju- it's very strange. It's a very, very strange time to be alive.
6:47 – 8:13
AI “women,” bots, and the economics of parasocial horny capitalism
1. JNJim Norton
  Did you see the AI? There was an AI, like they had these AI women on, on Instagram.
2. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. (laughs)
3. JNJim Norton
  And like, we were talking about it on, on the air, and we were laughing about it. And even though I know it's AI, I'm like, "I could still see myself jerking off to this."
4. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
5. JNJim Norton
  I know it's not real. I know it's fake. But if the attitude was right, I could still see myself being turned on by this AI. The hair fucks it up a little bit, 'cause it kinda looks solid. Like the hair sometimes moves as one unit, but the body and the face ... I mean, it really looks like a real person.
6. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, they're making money. They're making money off of OnlyFans. They're tens of thousand dollars a week.
7. JNJim Norton
  Isn't that awesome?
8. JRJoe Rogan
  Amazing. Guys are-
9. JNJim Norton
  Isn't that great?
10. JRJoe Rogan
  God ... Well, there's probably some fucking dude in Moldavia or somewhere like that, running it. (laughs)
11. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, yeah. Yeah, there's always some guy overseas-
12. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
13. JNJim Norton
  ... where you can't get it, uh, you can't get it shut down, you can't get any answers.
14. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. And then, there's some (laughs) fucking jerk-off-
15. JNJim Norton
  In New York City, huh? (laughs)
16. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs) In the, in the East Side. (laughs)
17. JNJim Norton
  With his fucking tomato stained wife beater on-
18. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
19. JNJim Norton
  ... sending money and, and whacking off, and then interacting with these pe- ... If, if you're not tech-savvy and you don't understand that this is probably a man on the other end-
20. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
21. JNJim Norton
  Or not even a man, maybe a computer that's running an algorithm, and you're ... You know, you think you're actually interacting with a woman, you know, you can get completely hooked. I've argued with bots before, and like I, I've actually ... That's like my big insult, is like, "You're a fucking bot." (laughs) And that's like all you can say when they're ... when you know that you've been duped by a computer.
22. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
23. JNJim Norton
  Where there's customer service and you think you're talking to a real person, and they're like, "This is a fucking computer."
8:13 – 9:38
OnlyFans fortunes: $57M creators and the paid-message goldmine
1. JVJamie Vernon
  This is a real person, but she's just talking-
2. JNJim Norton
  That's a real person?
3. JVJamie Vernon
  Yeah. She made $57 million since COVID on her OnlyFans.
4. JNJim Norton
  Oh my God.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Whoa.
6. JNJim Norton
  I don't-
7. JRJoe Rogan
  Like how would you ... Like if you married that girl, how would you tell her to get a regular job?
8. JNJim Norton
  I wouldn't.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  You can't.
10. JVJamie Vernon
  For sure.
11. JNJim Norton
  I'd be happy if she did it, yeah.
12. JVJamie Vernon
  Breakdown of ...
13. JRJoe Rogan
  But if you were like, like a, a guy who wasn't into that ... Wow, that's insane.
14. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, if you're a guy who marries her and you think you're gonna rescue her-
15. JRJoe Rogan
  Ugh.
16. JNJim Norton
  ... and pull her out of there, and she's making $57 million-
17. JRJoe Rogan
  This is the-
18. JNJim Norton
  ... you have to just accept that's her job.
19. JVJamie Vernon
  Half of it's from the messages part, which, that's what you were just sort of saying, like probably not her messaging.
20. JNJim Norton
  Right.
21. JVJamie Vernon
  $27 million worth of messages.
22. JRJoe Rogan
  Whoa.
23. JVJamie Vernon
  (laughs)
24. JRJoe Rogan
  Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. 27 million guys ... $27 million in money has been sent by guys?
25. JVJamie Vernon
  Well, that's ... Yeah.
26. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  Just sending it her directly as a message, "I love you."
28. JVJamie Vernon
  Ten, 10 million in just tips. That's on top of, that's just, "Thank you-"
29. JNJim Norton
  Oh my God.
30. JVJamie Vernon
  ... "for doing what you're ... I'm already paying you for it."
9:38 – 14:12
Authenticity vs. performed awkwardness (and why audiences sniff out fake)
1. JNJim Norton
  But then you get like girls like this, who are probably just as unapproachable as any other attractive woman I've ever tried to talk to in a club.
2. JRJoe Rogan
  Maybe. But like, really hot nerds are always like the, probably the most attractive thing.
3. JNJim Norton
  Yes, but they, they play nerds. Like, they have nerdy interests, but there's nothing worse to me-
4. JRJoe Rogan
  (sniffs)
5. JNJim Norton
  ... than like a comic who's like ... who pretends he's like this shy guy, but he's really a good-looking dude. And it's like, you're confident and you know you're good-looking, but you're playing like the shy guy-
6. JRJoe Rogan
  Oh.
7. JNJim Norton
  ... who's awkward with girls.
8. JRJoe Rogan
  Just putting it on onstage.
9. JNJim Norton
  You're putting it on. It's like-
10. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
11. JNJim Norton
  It's not who you are. Like Dan Naderman. You know Dan Naderman?
12. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
13. JNJim Norton
  He's hilarious. He is an awkward guy. Naderman's a truly awkward guy. And I say that with love, 'cause he's brilliantly funny. But when you see these good-looking guys who are comfortable with women pretending funny, it just fucking ... Uh, pretending, uh, quirky and awkward, it just annoys me.
14. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. Well, anything disingenuous, people sniff it out. They sniff it out. You know, that's one of the things, uh, peop- (laughs) Brian Simpson said about you last night. He goes, "I never met anybody so comfortable being weird." (laughs)
15. JNJim Norton
  That's nice. (laughs)
16. JRJoe Rogan
  He's like, "He told me more personal shit in the first five minutes." (laughs)
17. JNJim Norton
  (laughs)
18. JRJoe Rogan
  And he goes, "He just lays it all out there." And it-
19. JNJim Norton
  Well, Christine was asking us que- me questions about being married, and about-
20. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
21. JNJim Norton
  ... Nikki, and I was like, "I'm f- I'm very comfortable with it." And it's like, if ... It, it's almost like on stage. If you're okay with it, people are okay with it. You know?
22. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. Well, I, I've always used you as an example. When, you know, back, way, way back in the day, you were doing this before anybody was. You were doing this on ONA, fucking, what was it? 15 years ago? 17 years ago?
23. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
24. JRJoe Rogan
  You were ... You'd just talk openly about all your quirks and whatever, it's prostitutes or drugs or any of the things that you ever did. You just would spill it out there. And nobody judged you. Everybody loved you. It wasn't like, you know, "Oh, this guy i- has been pissed on. What a piece of shit." It was like ...
25. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
26. JRJoe Rogan
  It was funny. It was like, "That's Norton."
27. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
28. JRJoe Rogan
  You know what I mean? It's like ... But, but it's because you are who you are. You, you n- And you're not pretending. People don't like when people are bullshitting them. They don't like newscasters.
29. JNJim Norton
  Right.
30. JRJoe Rogan
  They don't trust them. When you find a newscaster with a dead guy in his fucking jacuzzi, you're like, "Oh, of course."
14:12 – 17:12
Dating Nikki, immigration hurdles, and the pandemic that forced cohabitation
1. JRJoe Rogan
  Say, say what you think. And, you know, I remember when we first started talking about, uh, this d- d- ... Like, when ... This was, like, when you f- ... When did you first start dating Nikki?
2. JNJim Norton
  We started dating ... Uh, yeah, I remember that. It was, uh, we st- ... We started talking in 2016. I was, uh, friends with her for seven months before we met. I actually booked gigs overseas just to meet her. Like, Bill had been on me for years, "Dude, go to Europe." And I just would never do it, 'cause I'm like, "They're gonna fucking hate me." You know, I just, I blink and I get manic. And I finally booked Norway just to go over and meet her, and we clicked, and we dated long distance and casually for a long time. Um, and then we got ... We broke up, got back together in 2019 in, uh, around Valentine's Day. And then in, uh, I would drive up to Canada every weekend to see her. Every weekend, I would do s- radio Monday through Thursday, get in the car, drive six hours, spend the weekend with her, drive home.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Wow.
4. JNJim Norton
  Um, 'cause immigration was a fucking nightmare. And I got a call from my producer one day, this is, like, right after the pandemic started. And he goes, "Hey, by the way, uh, they might close the Canadian border soon." So an hour later, I was in my car. I packed a bag, I jumped in the car. An hour later, March of 2020, I'm headed to Canada. I get to the border, and I'm afraid they're not gonna let me in. I'm like, "Hey, my fiance is having a panic attack." I figured I'd be there for two or three weeks. I didn't come back until July of 2021. So I was out of the country for 15 months, and I didn't say it publicly, I didn't tell fans. I just ... We lived together. It was my first time living with anybody. I'd never lived with a woman, I'd never been engaged. And, uh, we were kind of trial by fire, like, "Is this gonna work or not gonna work?" And it was great. Like, it was a blessing for me to have that pandemic happen the way it did.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Were you doing the radio show remotely?
6. JNJim Norton
  Every day. But that was serious. Like, it wasn't like I didn't show up for work. They weren't letting people in the building.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
8. JNJim Norton
  We had been remote for about a week or two, and they're like, "We don't know when we're gonna allow you back."
9. JRJoe Rogan
  So how did you do it? W- w- ... Computers?
10. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, yeah, just on ... They hook- ... Came and hooked up ISDN lines, and, and, and, like, uh, all the things they do to make audio better. Uh, and we had a guy in Montreal who did it, and I did it from the kitchen in, uh-
11. JRJoe Rogan
  No shit.
12. JNJim Norton
  ... in this apartment I rented for us in Canada.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  Wow. So you just had a dedicated ISDN line?
14. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  So that it couldn't go down?
16. JNJim Norton
  No. And it, it ... You know, once in a while, it would get, like ... But even if I was in New York, we still would have been doing it remotely. Like, they wouldn't let us in the building. Um, nobody was broadcasting from Sirius.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm.
18. JNJim Norton
  But it was like ... It was so bizarre to never have lived with anybody, and now I am in Canada with my fiance, and we're together every day. And they were fucking worse in Canada than the US. Like, they were way stricter, curfews at 8:00, everything closed. So it was just kind of we're stuck in the house together, and are we gonna make it or are we not a good couple? So that kind of told me we were okay.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  What a fucking weird time.
20. JNJim Norton
  Mm.
21. JRJoe Rogan
  It w- ... I think it's so traumatic to us that we're sort of like pretending it didn't happen now. I see a lot of people do that.
22. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  They almost like don't address that just two years ago, the world went insane.
24. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, it was cr- ... It was, it was ... The whole thing felt like a dream state in a, in a weird way.
25. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
17:12 – 19:39
Chip Chipperson’s strange TV run—and fans blaming Jim’s wife
1. JNJim Norton
  Like, I look back at stuff ... And you know what's really funny? Is, is like I, I did Chip. I stopped doing Chip for a while. Uh, I just got bored with it.
2. JRJoe Rogan
  Chip Chipperson, your character?
3. JNJim Norton
  I know. I really shouldn't say that like the public at large knows who this asshole character is.
4. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
5. JNJim Norton
  I'm saying Chip like he's a member of the zeitgeist. Uh, I stopped doing it, and then they asked me if I would do this TBS thing, uh, this Laugh thing. And I won't ... I hate competitions. I said, "No." I'm like, "But Chip will do it."
6. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
7. JNJim Norton
  So they let me do it as Chip Chipperson.
8. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
9. JNJim Norton
  And my fucking ...
10. JRJoe Rogan
  Chip. (laughs)
11. JNJim Norton
  (laughs) Chip will do it. And then I put my foot down, I'm like, "Chip will do it."
12. JRJoe Rogan
  Ugh.
13. JNJim Norton
  And surprisingly, they went for it. And, uh-
14. JRJoe Rogan
  Ugh.
15. JNJim Norton
  ... the amount of great comedians that Chip beat in the voting is really funny. Like, every week, they had, you had to vote, go head-to-head with, with a couple of people, and Chip beat some really funny guys, I think Chip beat Tim Dillon-
16. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
17. JNJim Norton
  ... has to ... (laughs) Chip ... I mean, Chip is not funnier than Tim Dillon, but just Chip fans were really-
18. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
19. JNJim Norton
  ... invested in just making this a fucking disaster.
20. JRJoe Rogan
  That's hilarious.
21. JNJim Norton
  Um, but she filmed all of it. Like, she filmed everything. And I came back and I did Chip for a while, and then I stopped. And all these people are convinced that my wife made me stop doing Chip. They're like, "Fuck her. She made him stop doing Chip."
22. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
23. JNJim Norton
  ... like, what, how bizarre do you think my life is-
24. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
25. JNJim Norton
  ... that my fucking, I, I marry somebody who's gonna tell me, "Don't do Chip," and I'm gonna listen?
26. JRJoe Rogan
  Ugh.
27. JNJim Norton
  I just got bored with it. You know how it is with podcasting-
28. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
29. JNJim Norton
  ... once in a while, you wanna move on.
30. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, especially a character like Chip that's so extreme.
19:39 – 28:58
Anti-“messaging,” scolding culture, and the career incentive to virtue-signal
1. JNJim Norton
  Um, and we're doing a YouTube channel, and it's like, the thing I like about it is it's fun to do something I wanna do with someone I wanna do it with, but there's no message to it. Like, messaging is really annoying to me. Everybody trying to preach to each other and fucking lecture each other and tisk tisk each other. I just can't stand it.
2. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm. Tisk tisk. (laughs)
3. JNJim Norton
  You know what I mean? The whole scolding culture.
4. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah, yeah.
5. JNJim Norton
  It makes me sick.
6. JRJoe Rogan
  Gross.
7. JNJim Norton
  So I hope people like it because they think it's funny. Um, I want them to like us together and judge us based on whether or not they think we're fun to watch.
8. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
9. JNJim Norton
  Like, I, I, I don't, I don't want people going, "I'm so glad you're saying..." I just, the messaging makes me sick.
10. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah, there's, well, there's a weird currency in that messaging that you recognize, and as a person of honesty, you, uh, you, you reject that 'cause there's l- there's like a, there's a weird pathway to like automatic progress and success if you, you know, if you can have a message. Like, you don't even have to be that good. But if you, if you, you're just like barely mediocre, but you've got a message, people will, they'll elevate. They'll broadcast what you're doing.
11. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
12. JRJoe Rogan
  They'll make it a big deal.
13. JNJim Norton
  A definitive message.
14. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
15. JNJim Norton
  Right. Because it's, it's the same self-serving thing as before.
16. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
17. JNJim Norton
  It's like your message either strengthens what they already believed, or they can get angry at your me- like, it's always about being validated or having something to be mad at.
18. JRJoe Rogan
  It's a nice pathway for dunces too.
19. JNJim Norton
  Yes.
20. JRJoe Rogan
  There's like some d- dunce, but there's a very clear message in the zeitgeist, you know, uh, be more inclusive, whatever it is.
21. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
22. JRJoe Rogan
  And then there's the do better people. Do better.
23. JNJim Norton
  Do better.
24. JRJoe Rogan
  Do better.
25. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
26. JRJoe Rogan
  Li- that, those are people that are taking advantage of this movement, this cultural zeitgeist, 'cause there's always people that are just gonna be assholes. They're just gonna be assholes, no matter what. And they'll look for a thing that they can get behind that's like an undeniably righteous issue, and then that gives them an excuse to be an asshole to anyone who opposes it.
27. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, and, and to, anyone who opposes it is an enemy. That's what's the, the problem. Like, if you have one thing in the mission statement you don't agree with, you're an enemy.
28. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
29. JNJim Norton
  Like, there's no room for like, "Yeah, I agree with most of what you're saying, but this is too extreme." That doesn't make sense. There's none of that. It's 100% or fuck you, and that's how people look at all this.
30. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
28:58 – 37:48
Andrew Dice Clay as performance artist (and the genius of bombing on purpose)
1. JRJoe Rogan
  I love those videos that he's doing, the videos where he gets people who don't know who he is to take a picture with him (laughs)
2. JNJim Norton
  "Were you the ones waiting for the picture?"
3. JRJoe Rogan
  "You were waiting for the picture?"
4. JNJim Norton
  And it's like, she's standing-
5. JRJoe Rogan
  "Okay."
6. JNJim Norton
  ... under an awning. Like, why... First of all, even if there was a picture to be taken, why the fuck would that be the meeting spot?
7. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
8. JNJim Norton
  Like...
9. JRJoe Rogan
  But it's just his commitment to doing... Look, this is like... People get so stuffy about what art is-
10. JNJim Norton
  Yep.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  ... and stuffy about performance art, that they could never imagine that Andrew Dice Clay is doing some of the most interesting performance art. He's doing it for no audience.
12. JNJim Norton
  Yep.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  He's doing it entirely for himself, and he just posts it. He's not trying to make it better.
14. JBJim Norton (playing a character in a bit)
  This is just... It's a brand new one.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  L- every one of them is just...
16. JNJim Norton
  Ugh.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  Every one of them is just very awkward.
18. JBJim Norton (playing a character in a bit)
  No, sorry about that.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  Do it from the beginning of that.
20. JBJim Norton (playing a character in a bit)
  I'll, I'll be curious.
21. JBJim Norton (playing another character in a bit)
  You a rester? You waiting for the meet and greet?
22. JBJim Norton (playing a character in a bit)
  No.
23. JBJim Norton (playing another character in a bit)
  (laughs)
24. JBJim Norton (playing a character in a bit)
  No, sorry about that.
25. JRJoe Rogan
  That's it. (laughs)
26. JNJim Norton
  (laughs)
27. JBJim Norton (playing a character in a bit)
  Okay, listen. The meet and greet-
28. JRJoe Rogan
  And this is the guy, is the guy that sold out Madison's Garden, Madison Square Garden, like, 100 times.
29. JNJim Norton
  Yeah. (laughs)
30. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs) And he's wandering around the l- the luggage cart area at an airport pretending that this poor lady is there for a meet and greet, this grandma.
37:48 – 44:35
Kinison, fame, and the trap of becoming a rock-star caricature
1. JRJoe Rogan
  'Cause out of those guys from that day, that era, the only guys that are really left are like Dom Irrera, of course-
2. JNJim Norton
  Yep.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  ... who I was always friends with. But, uh, Kinison was gone.
4. JNJim Norton
  Did you know him?
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Nope, never met him. Saw him live a couple of times.
6. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  Um, saw Hicks live a couple of times. Never really met him. I said hi to him when I was an open mic-er, but never met... you know, never had a conversation with him. But having to see Kinison live... And unfortunately, I saw Kinison live when it had already kind of fall apart.
8. JNJim Norton
  Right.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  Like, Kinison... If you go to like '86, I think Kinison's like one of the greatest comics of all time.
10. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  If not number one. He was so original, so dynamic, so powerful. That HBO special... What is it? Have You Seen Me Lately? Is that what it was?
12. JNJim Norton
  I don't remember the name of it. It's not the Dangerfield one? You mean the one, his Hours?
13. JRJoe Rogan
  Right, there's, there's the, the album that was, uh, that was released. It was called Louder Than Hell. It's really hard to get. Um, and then there was the HBO special, which I think it was, Have You Seen Me Lately? Like, it was like, a play on the carton of milk with the missing kid thing.
14. JNJim Norton
  Oh, okay.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  It was one of those things. Um, that one's amazing. That one's amazing.
16. JNJim Norton
  I still-
17. JRJoe Rogan
  And then a year later, unfortunately, you gotta think, it took so many years to develop that material.
18. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  And then a year later he's touring with new material, and it's not... He's not developing it in a club-
20. JNJim Norton
  Right.
21. JRJoe Rogan
  ... like he developed all the other stuff. He's developing in front of large audiences that came to see him. So it becomes caricaturish, becomes very cartoonish.
22. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  Just like someone's got, doing an impression of what Sam Kinison would talk about.
24. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, could be, 'cause you, you don't have time to develop it. All of a sudden-
25. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
26. JNJim Norton
  ... there's that pressure to keep it going.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
28. JNJim Norton
  I saw him, I met him once, but we never... We had to talk for like five minutes. It was at an open mic at Rascals in New Jersey, and, uh, they brought him out to talk to some of the newer comics. Um, and that's when I saw him live that night, and I saw him live another night. And like, you didn't know what you were gonna get. Like one night, he was on fire. And I mean, he was just... He fucking blew the roof off. And then the next time, uh, he was kinda hungover and, you know, kind of slug, you know?
29. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. Well, that's what you're gonna get with a guy like that, you know?
30. JNJim Norton
  Yeah. I wish would've known him, though. Like, I, it's such a shame he died when he did. I'm glad I got to see him, but he was a guy I never got to know. And I wish I had... I never... And Bill Hicks, I never met, never saw live.
44:35 – 50:49
Sitcoms, acting misery, and why comedy escaped “the business”
1. JNJim Norton
  As a comic, I find that I never wanna think, like I never wanna convince myself that I'm fucking cool or that I'm sexy.
2. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
3. JNJim Norton
  Like, I, I... You know what I mean?
4. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
5. JNJim Norton
  That to me is the death knell for comedians. When you start to think that an open vest on stage is a great idea-
6. JRJoe Rogan
  Ugh.
7. JNJim Norton
  ... you're a fucking idiot.
8. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
9. JNJim Norton
  Like, stop thinking you're sexy.
10. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
11. JNJim Norton
  Like, that to me is a... I-
12. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
13. JNJim Norton
  Not that I've ever been tempted to think that, but you know what I mean? Like, it's always like, remember who you are as a person.
14. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
15. JNJim Norton
  Don't start ever thinking, because you have fans, that you're this larger than life gu- Y- You know, it's just... You gotta stay grounded or you're gonna really fall into kind of that type of a trap.
16. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, I d- It's also like, for a woman... I mean, how many women dress sexy on stage and are really... Well, Natasha Leggaro pulls it off. But how many other women dress, like hot on stage and do stand up? Most of them, they kinda like... Whitney will dress down.
17. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
18. JRJoe Rogan
  You know, most of them dress down. They wear like slacks and a jacket and a shirt or something like that, or something comfortable.
19. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
20. JRJoe Rogan
  They're not trying to look hot.
21. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, I find th- Like when I see good-looking people on stage, if I think someone is naturally... Like, that's how that person dresses. But like you said, if it feels genuine.
22. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
23. JNJim Norton
  If it doesn't feel genuine, if I feel like someone is trying to sexy it up on stage-
24. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
25. JNJim Norton
  ... male or female, I don't like it. Like I just-
26. JRJoe Rogan
  No.
27. JNJim Norton
  It's a different emotion for me. And maybe if I had any sex appeal, I would do it, but I don't.
28. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah, but it's a different emo- It's, it, it count- You get something different than you're getting funny.
29. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
30. JRJoe Rogan
  It's like, like the... You're not getting funny out of that. You're getting something different, and now you have t- You can- might add funny to it, but it might be taking away from funny with this, like extra effort that you've put in to looking hot.
50:49 – 1:19:00
Radio’s evolution: Imus → Stern → O&A → podcasts (and what changed)
1. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, it's also we got very fortunate in the timeline in which we came along. Right? Because what happened was, you got guys like Don Imus, who kinda started it all, right? He t- starts just commentary and talking shit-
2. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  ... on the radio, and he's a wild man and a bad boy. And then Howard Stern takes it to a completely different level. And then Howard Stern takes over radio all over the country. And then Opie and Anthony comes along. And Opie and Anthony is the next stage 'cause they have a different perspective on how to do a show.
4. JNJim Norton
  Yep.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  It's a hang.
6. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  So you go in there, and with us, especially with comics, we would just go in there and hang.
8. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  That was all it was. You'd go in there and hang out in the studio, and everybody was cool and it was fun.
10. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  And that led the way to podcasts, because they went to XM. So then they go to XM, now you could swear.
12. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  So now we're doing ONA with swearing and we're, you know, you could tell crazy stories. Uh, and then that goes into podcasting. It's like we came along as all these doors were opening. Like, we hit every green light.
14. JNJim Norton
  Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. I didn't get into pod-... I mean, I wish I had at one p- obviously now I do, I look back on it. But my contract doesn't allow for it. It may have early on, before they knew what podcasting, before the company knew what podcasting would be. But, uh, you know, I, for the last X amount of years, I haven't been allowed to do my own.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  But you're still doing the same thing.
16. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, still talking.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  Which, it's still the same thing. You're just doing it for a different company. You're doing it for Sirius. But if it, it's the same thing as doing a podcast. You're doing it just like ONA did it when they went to Sirius.
18. JNJim Norton
  Y-
19. JRJoe Rogan
  Or like anybody else would, if you're, if you're just doing a show that you're putting together yourself.
20. JNJim Norton
  Yeah, just talking. I mean, look. I l- I, I do the UFC podcast with Matt, like even that I love. Like, we're talking specifically about one thing.
21. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
22. JNJim Norton
  But it's like how much fun, like I get to hang out with Matt Serra, who's fucking hilarious.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  He's so funny.
24. JNJim Norton
  And talk to people I like. Like, you know what I mean? Like-
25. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
26. JNJim Norton
  ... it's, it's just, it's a great life. Like, when I look at it, like, I, I'm like, I get to do exactly what I wanna do. It's everything I've always wanted, which was just to not have a schedule that I resented.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. And also, again, this is not that other business. We talk about the business is so phony, the business is bullshit. It's-
28. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.
29. JRJoe Rogan
  ... like, like, that's a different business. I don't think we're in that business anymore. There's a few of us that still act and s- and do stuff. But if you look at the vast majority of comics today, and like, what business are they engaging in? They're doing, engaging in the business of live shows and podcasts.
30. JNJim Norton
  Yeah.