Joe Rogan Experience #2138 - Tucker Carlson

1. 0:00 – 5:03

   Accidental UAP document release: Kona Blue, injuries, and “advanced aerospace vehicles”

   1. TCTucker Carlson0:00

      (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

   2. JRJoe Rogan0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. TCTucker Carlson0:06

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (rock music) Did you, did you see? The US government just released, apparently by accident, the Project Aqua stuff. Did you see this?

   4. JRJoe Rogan0:20

      No. What's that? Should we start?

   5. TCTucker Carlson0:24

      This is crazy.

   6. JRJoe Rogan0:25

      Yeah, I guess we're rolling.

   7. TCTucker Carlson0:26

      Take... Are we rolling?

   8. JRJoe Rogan0:27

      Yeah. Well, it can wait till we can-

   9. TCTucker Carlson0:28

      No, no, no. You can... This is just... Someone just sent me this. This is like-

   10. JRJoe Rogan0:31

       Project Aqua? (sniffs)

   11. TCTucker Carlson0:33

       Yeah, hold on, I'll, um... (swallows) They just released, I think by accident-

   12. JRJoe Rogan0:42

       How's that happen?

   13. TCTucker Carlson0:43

       K- It's Kona Blue. Are you familiar with this?

   14. JRJoe Rogan0:46

       No.

   15. TCTucker Carlson0:48

       Kona Blue is a, um, it was a program. They... Yeah, dude, they... I'm gonna send this to... Homeland Security just released this.

   16. JRJoe Rogan0:56

       Send it to me, I'll send it to Jamie.

   17. TCTucker Carlson0:58

       And, uh...

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:00

       iPhone, you can Airdrop it to my-

   19. TCTucker Carlson1:01

       No, I got it right, right here. I'll just... I don't do email or what... I don't know how to Airdrop anything.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:06

       You don't do email?

   21. TCTucker Carlson1:07

       No.

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:08

       (laughs)

   23. TCTucker Carlson1:10

       I haven't done email in many years.

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:11

       Really?

   25. TCTucker Carlson1:12

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:12

       How do you exist?

   27. TCTucker Carlson1:13

       I do text.

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:15

       Wow. Just text?

   29. TCTucker Carlson1:17

       Yeah, I don't do email. I don't go on the fucking internet. I don't have a TV. I'm not into that. But anyway...

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:22

       Wow. (laughs) Don't worry.
2. 5:03 – 7:10

   Are UAPs real—and who controls them? Government response vs ownership

   1. TCTucker Carlson5:03

      I mean, here's what we do know is that there's enough going on in the skies, but not just the skies, under water that U- uh, the US military has been forced to respond to it. To like move aircraft from one place to another because there are too many of these objects in the sky. That's actually hap- Chris Mellon just wrote a long piece about it. Um, so it's real. The government is not controlling it. In fact, it's forcing the government DOD to respond. Um, and we know that there is a, a real effort and has been underway for a long time to, to keep the public from knowing about it. But, you know, that's all known. That's established. I don't think any rational person would deny that. The question is like, what is it actually? I mean, now is sort of the point-

   2. JRJoe Rogan5:52

      Yeah.

   3. TCTucker Carlson5:52

      ... we have to ask, like, what is this? And, um, you know, so that's the conversation-

   4. JRJoe Rogan5:58

      How much of it do you think is ours?

   5. TCTucker Carlson6:01

      Well, none of it's ours.

   6. JRJoe Rogan6:02

      None of it?

   7. TCTucker Carlson6:03

      Well, I don't know. I mean, clearly, you know, the US government is huge. It's the largest human organization. There are, I think then, I think there are two million federal employees and another 10 million federal contractors, so, who are effectively government employees but don't have civil service protection, for example. Um, so that's 12 million people in a country of 340 million working for the federal government. So, it's kind of hard to overstate how big the federal government is and how well-funded, and so to say the government this, the government that, no, of course, it's people within the government. Um, but yeah, they're working on all kinds of things, obviously, uh, that are classified. But in general, no, they, they can't control these objects. Uh, so no, it's not American technology-

   8. JRJoe Rogan6:52

      Well-

   9. TCTucker Carlson6:53

      ... or Russian or Chinese. It predates-

   10. JRJoe Rogan6:55

       Mm-hmm.

   11. TCTucker Carlson6:56

       ... you know, all of that.

   12. JRJoe Rogan6:57

       Well, some of it does, right? Like, for sure the Kenneth Arnold sightings, that was really early on. That was like the 19, early 1950s. He was seeing these flying saucers, these disks that were moving over mountains.

3. 7:10 – 8:42

   From aliens to the supernatural: Tucker’s ‘spiritual entity’ framework

   1. TCTucker Carlson7:10

      Well, right. I mean, the Prophet Ezekiel writes about it-

   2. JRJoe Rogan7:12

      Right.

   3. TCTucker Carlson7:12

      ... in the first chapter. Wheels in the sky.

   4. JRJoe Rogan7:15

      Yeah. That's a crazy one. Boy, when you read that-

   5. TCTucker Carlson7:17

      Well, it is crazy if you-

   6. JRJoe Rogan7:18

      Yeah.

   7. TCTucker Carlson7:18

      ... if you read it, it's like, "Oh, wow." You know?

   8. JRJoe Rogan7:21

      Yeah. Wheel within a wheel.

   9. TCTucker Carlson7:22

      And so, and not just, you know, the Hebrew scriptures, like it's all over every-

   10. JRJoe Rogan7:26

       Mm-hmm. The Vedic texts.

   11. TCTucker Carlson7:27

       Of course.

   12. JRJoe Rogan7:28

       Mm-hmm.

   13. TCTucker Carlson7:28

       So, these are spiritual phenomenon. There's no evidence they're from another planet. I mean, I think that's the op, that's the lie, that they're from Mars. Look, space, the atmosphere is really well monitored, right? Both for military, for defense reasons, but also because like it would be nice to know when asteroids are coming. And there's no evidence, there's never been any evidence that lots of these objects, these vehicles coming into our atmosphere from somewhere else, some other planet. There's no evidence of that at all.

   14. JRJoe Rogan7:57

       Hmm.

   15. TCTucker Carlson7:58

       So, they're from here, and they've been here for thousands of years, whatever they are. And, um, it's pretty clear to me that they're spiritual entities, whatever that means. They're supernatural, and which is to say, supernaturals means above the natural, above the observable, uh, nature. And, um, they don't behave according to the laws of science as, as measured by people, you know? And, um, and they've been here for a long time. And there's a ton of evidence they're under the ocean and under the ground. So, like with that fact set, what do you conclude?

   16. JRJoe Rogan8:34

       When did you start having this opinion that they, they were spiritual and that they've always been here? Like when, when did this-

4. 8:42 – 17:00

   Why Tucker changed his mind (2017): distrust, journalism, and the ‘dark’ turn

   1. TCTucker Carlson8:42

      Well, I didn't know anything about the topic until 2017. And like-

   2. JRJoe Rogan8:46

      Was that after the New York Times piece?

   3. TCTucker Carlson8:48

      No, it was before. It was before. And the things that I saw, I mean, like I was, and am still, a very conventional person. I mean, I'm 54. I grew up in this country, in California, which was like, like every assumption about America, I bought completely, just completely. And I thought that everyone who questioned those assumptions was bad. I just bought into the system completely without even thinking about it, and I imagined that I was like some kind of free-thinker, and you know, I'm going against the grain. But like the core, my core assumptions were the, you know, the assumptions fed to me by the culture and the government, and I didn't even realize it. But anyway, I'd never really thought about UFOs at all, and I'd been in journalism since I was a kid, so of course I'd run into a lot of people who had crazy views on a lot of different topics. UFOs, 9/11, circumcision, you know, like every whack job in the world you run into when you're covering stuff.

   4. JRJoe Rogan9:39

      Fluoride.

   5. TCTucker Carlson9:40

      Fluoride. (laughs) Right? I just brushed with non-fluoride toothpaste this morning.

   6. JRJoe Rogan9:45

      Me too.

   7. TCTucker Carlson9:45

      (laughs) Exactly. Exactly. But, probably unlike you, I didn't have any opinions like that. I was like, "Fluoride? Come on." You know, "9/11, shut up!"

   8. JRJoe Rogan9:59

      Yeah.

   9. TCTucker Carlson9:59

      "UFOs, you're fucking crazy." You know what I mean?

   10. JRJoe Rogan10:02

       Right, right.

   11. TCTucker Carlson10:02

       I just, like I had this reflexi- I'm ashamed of it. I'm not bragging about it, but um, but it was, it was 2017 and really it was the Trump campaign. It wasn't that I was like so in love with Trump, though I've always liked Trump 'cause he was hilarious and charming and all that. But I wasn't like a Trumper or anything. Um, but it was watching that campaign, and particularly his claim that they were spying on him, and I was like, "Really? They're not..." The intel services and federal law enforcement, FBI, do not spy on presidential campaigns. Like that's so out of the realm. That's so crazy. Like that could never happen 'cause of course there's no democracy in a system like that. And fundamentally we're a democracy, an imperfect one. It kind of lumbers along, you know, but like it's not fake. And then that turned out to be true, and I, and I knew it was true. And that just blew my mind, so I began a process still ongoing of reassessing a lot of other things, like okay, well if that was not true, what else is not true? And what else that they told me was a conspiracy theory might actually have some basis in fact? And um, and then someone from, you know, a DoD employee reached out to me and said, "Actually, there's a ton of evidence that this UFO thing is real." And, really? And so I started doing segments on it, um, when I worked at, at the TV channel, and uh, and there was like a lot of mockery, but I was like, "I don't care. I'm just gonna do this." And then of course the second you start, as you know better than anybody, you start talking about something, then people reach out to you, and some of them are deranged, but some of them aren't, at all. So, I just started getting a lot of information from people and meeting with people, mostly in private. You know, "Come to my house, let's talk." And, and I decided on the basis of what they told me, and then I talked to a lot of people about it, um, that actually this is really a very heavy duty question, actually. It's not just, it's not the little green men question. It's like a much bigger question, and it's really bad. It's really dark. And, and then I stopped. Then I was like, "I don't wanna know anymore because it's not helping me."... um, at all as a person, and I don't-

   12. JRJoe Rogan12:08

       What, what information did you get that made you feel like it's dark?

   13. TCTucker Carlson12:13

       Well, it's so dark. Well, first of all, the deception is always bad. Like, lying is bad, and it, and it's bad not just in a legal sense, in that it can be illegal to lie, but it's bad, it's like bad for you. Like, it rots you. Like, being a liar makes you a bad person. When you lie, you are serving evil. There's a moral quality to it that's inescapable and very obvious, and only like advanced, advanced civilizations ignore that. Lying is bad.

   14. JRJoe Rogan12:41

       Right.

   15. TCTucker Carlson12:41

       And so if you have lying at scale, which we have on this topic, it's inherently bad. Okay? So that's the first level. The deeper level is what are... Okay, so if there are spiritual beings, which I believe they are, like, uh, uh, it's a binary. They're either, you know, you're on team good or team bad. You can assign any name to it you want, but like what are these things? Are they good or bad? And, um, and I think some of them are bad. And if the US government knows that, or par- elements, the people within the US government know that, then, you know, then they're serving a bad force and they're-

   16. JRJoe Rogan13:17

       Well, when you say-

   17. TCTucker Carlson13:17

       Think about that for a minute.

   18. JRJoe Rogan13:18

       ... spiritual, like what, what makes you draw that conclusion that they're spiritual?

   19. TCTucker Carlson13:21

       What's the obvi- I mean, spiritual may be the wrong word. Supernatural. You know, they're beyond nature as we understand it. I mean, obviously they are. I mean, just chart their physical behavior. It doesn't, you know, it goes outside of what we understand about physics. No visible means of propulsion, you know, coming at i- indescribable speed, hitting the ocean, continuing at speeds that are impossible under sea. I mean, in other words, if I, if I take a, you know, nine millimeter, uh, 7.62 by 39 and shoot you at 50 yards underwater in a swimming pool, and it's even more intense in salt water because it's denser, you could catch the bullet, if it even makes it to you, right? So if you have a craft, any object underwater that's traveling at 500 knots as measured by sonar, right there, you're challenging our understanding of physics. Like, what is that? How can that be? So, yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan14:11

       They've, they've tracked that? They've tracked things going 500 knots under the sea?

   21. TCTucker Carlson14:16

       Yeah. Really, yeah. Much, much faster than any object could, can actually go under, under sea. Oh, for sure. Oh, yeah. There's a lot of stuff going on underwater, and, um, a lot. And there's video of these things coming out of the sky into the water and also emerging from the water.

   22. JRJoe Rogan14:37

       Right.

   23. TCTucker Carlson14:37

       Yeah. So-

   24. JRJoe Rogan14:39

       Wow. It's all so blurry though.

   25. TCTucker Carlson14:42

       I don't think it's that-

   26. JRJoe Rogan14:42

       You know, like the trans-medium video.

   27. TCTucker Carlson14:45

       Yeah, I don't think some of it's that blurry. I think some of it's crystal clear. Um-

   28. JRJoe Rogan14:49

       We just don't have access to it? Is that what you mean?

   29. TCTucker Carlson14:51

       Yeah.

   30. JRJoe Rogan14:51

       Just we haven't seen it?
5. 17:00 – 28:44

   Mechanisms of harm: Garry Nolan, brain injuries, and energy effects

   1. JRJoe Rogan17:00

      Uh, how many people do you think have died from these things?

   2. TCTucker Carlson17:02

      I, I don't know, but I mean, I-

   3. JRJoe Rogan17:04

      And is it radiation sickness? Is it like, what, uh, what is, what's the cause of death?

   4. TCTucker Carlson17:08

      So the person that I talk to, I interviewed someone who was a Stanford Medical School professor who's, who's out there and worth talking to, by the way, and a, um-

   5. JRJoe Rogan17:17

      You're talking about Garry Nolan?

   6. TCTucker Carlson17:18

      That's exactly who I'm talking about. He's an, uh, effectively an expert witness in these cases.

   7. JRJoe Rogan17:22

      Mm-hmm.

   8. TCTucker Carlson17:22

      So he's an expert in brain injury. Do you know him?

   9. JRJoe Rogan17:25

      Yeah.

   10. TCTucker Carlson17:25

       Yeah. Entirely credible person. Um, checks all the boxes that I care about. He's, he's got patents, so he's, like a lot of Stanford University professors, he's like independently rich. He flew to... I live in a remote place and he flew to my place at his own expense because he wanted to tell his story. So he, he's got no profit motive here. He's the most highly credentialed person at the university practically, Stanford Medical School. We consider that a big deal. Uh, and he's worked on this for, you know, over 10 years, um, assessing the injuries to US servicemen from being in close proximity to these objects or having contact with these objects. And his conclusion, as you know because you've talked to him, is that there's some kind of energy coming off here that scrambles people's brains or kills them.And it's not exactly radiation, um, at least in his telling to me. So, anyways, but the point is, people have died.

   11. JRJoe Rogan18:24

       Yeah.

   12. TCTucker Carlson18:24

       And so, you know, it, it does raise a lot of, a lot of questions about, like, what the hell? Right?

   13. JRJoe Rogan18:32

       Yeah.

   14. TCTucker Carlson18:32

       What the hell? American citizens have died and you're hiding it. Why are you hiding that? Why would you hide that?

   15. JRJoe Rogan18:39

       Perhaps because they don't have any explanations. Because they, they're... It's so beyond our comprehension that they're still trying to piece it together. Like, I would wonder how much interaction they really do have with these things. Like, if I was from another planet or if I was some interdimensional being, I don't know how much I'd give a shit about the president. I don't know how much I'd give a shit about the government. I would probably look at this infantile race, this species, this bizarre territorial apes with thermonuclear weapons, this very weird species. I, I'd probably look at them as very chaotic, and, uh, I wouldn't really have much concern for who's running it. Uh, especially if they have the ability to travel at insane speeds and go undetected and...

   16. TCTucker Carlson19:34

       Well, it depends. Like, that... Okay, so the template that you're using to understand this is like science fiction, right? These are an advanced race of beings from somewhere else. But the template that every other society before us has used is a spiritual one.

   17. JRJoe Rogan19:48

       Mm-hmm.

   18. TCTucker Carlson19:48

       There is a whole world that we can't see that acts on people, a supernatural world that's acting on us all the time for good and bad. Every society has thought this before ours.

   19. JRJoe Rogan19:58

       Mm-hmm.

   20. TCTucker Carlson19:58

       In fact, every society in all recorded history has thought that until, I'll be specific, August 1945 when we dropped the atom bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and all of a sudden, the West is just officially secular, "We're God. There is no god but us." And that's the world that we have grown up in, but that's an anomaly.

   21. JRJoe Rogan20:15

       Mm-hmm.

   22. TCTucker Carlson20:15

       Like, no one else has ever thought that. There's never been a society that thought that. Every other society has assumed, and they've had all kinds of different explanations and the details differ, but the core idea does not differ and never has differed from caves until now that we're being acted on by spiritual forces at all times. And so to someone born before or living before 1945, I think it would have been much more obvious that this is the thing that every society has written about.

   23. JRJoe Rogan20:45

       Mm-hmm.

   24. TCTucker Carlson20:45

       And in fact, that battle, that unseen battle around us, that spiritual battle, has, like, been the basis of every society, of every reli- e- every religion, not just Christianity. So, like, it just... Once you discard your very, very recent assumptions, relatively speaking, about how the world works, you're like, "Well, that kind of seems like the obvious explanation, right?"

   25. JRJoe Rogan21:10

       Hmm. It's not that obvious to me. (laughs)

   26. TCTucker Carlson21:13

       (laughs) So what's more obvious do you think?

   27. JRJoe Rogan21:18

       Well, I, I, I don't think there's an obvious explanation. I think... If I had to guess, some of this stuff is ours, and some of these things are propulsion systems that they theorized way back in the 1950s, anti-gravity propulsion systems, things that can operate without igniting fuel and-

   28. TCTucker Carlson21:38

       Yeah.

   29. JRJoe Rogan21:38

       ... pushing something out, that they operate in some completely different way that utilizes gravity and almost can instantaneously transport to new places, essentially fold space-time. Um, I don't know. So there, there's, there's things that the government does, where they have these programs, and the people that are sworn into these programs, whether they're the physicists or, you know, the metallurgists or whoever these people are that are working on these programs, they don't tell anybody. All their phones are monitored. Everything's monitored. There's a soc- there's a culture of secretivism that's pretty intense. And it's not inconceivable that over the course of the last 70 plus years of them theorizing and then eventually implementing some of these things, that they've developed drones that can move in ways that this, the conventional, the people that understand conventional propulsion systems could not imagine, and that they've figured out a way to do this and to keep it secret. And we're probably not the only ones working on these things. But where did they get that information? And, uh, you know, have you... You know Diana Pasolka?

   30. TCTucker Carlson22:57

       Mm-hmm.
6. 28:44 – 34:38

   AI as the next life form vs human control: ‘caterpillar to cocoon’ debate

   1. TCTucker Carlson28:44

      For what purpose, I wonder?

   2. JRJoe Rogan28:46

      Well, that's a very good question. My as- my belief is that w- biological intelligent life is essentially a caterpillar. And it's a p- caterpillar that's making a cocoon, and it doesn't even know why it's doing it. It's just doing it. And that cocoon is gonna give birth to artificial life, digital life. It's gonna give birth to a new life form. And I think we're real close to that. I think we're m- m- way closer than that, to that, than most people would ever wanna admit.

   3. TCTucker Carlson29:19

      I agree. I agree.

   4. JRJoe Rogan29:20

      And I think-

   5. TCTucker Carlson29:21

      But can we assign a, like, a value to that? Is that good or bad?

   6. JRJoe Rogan29:25

      That's a good question. It depends... Universally, it, I think it's the path. I think it's what happens. I think what this thing is, if, if you extrapolate, if you take the concept of, uh, a sentient artificial intelligence that has the ability to utilize all the information that every human being has on Earth at a level of computing that's far beyond the capabilities of the human mind and all of our super computers that currently exist, because it'll design much better computers. It'll use quantum computers. It'll have the ability to recode things and change things. It'll make better versions of itself. So instead of biological evolution, which is very slow... It takes a long time, uh, relatively. It takes... It's pretty quick, really, when you think about it, like, how long... It's n- not that long to go from being a single-celled organism to being a human being flying a plane, really, relatively, uh, over the course of a billion years, if you think about how long the universe has been around. But it's slow compared to technological evolution. I mean, 100 years ago, we didn't have shit, and now we have... Uh, we could send videos from your phone, and it'll hit New Zealand in a second.

   7. TCTucker Carlson30:46

      For sure.

   8. JRJoe Rogan30:47

      It's, it's crazy. The stuff that we have now is beyond imagination. It's essentially magic for people 100 years ago.... if that keeps going, it's ultimately gonna lead to a life form. And if that life form has now untethered, it hasn't, doesn't have any problems with biological evolution. Now, it's just about information and implementing the technology that's available, and then increasing that technology and making it better and better. It essentially becomes a god.

   9. TCTucker Carlson31:18

      Mm-hmm.

   10. JRJoe Rogan31:19

       Because if, if you give it enough time-

   11. TCTucker Carlson31:21

       (laughs)

   12. JRJoe Rogan31:21

       ... it, it d- it doesn't, it has the ability to make better versions of itself, which will in turn make better versions of itself. It has the ability to utilize everything. It has the, the, the understanding of everything that exists in the universe, ex- black holes, dark matter, everything. And it probably has the ability to harness that or even reproduce that. So, if you take artificial sentient intel- intelligence and it has this super accelerated path of technological evolution, and you give artificial s- general intelligence, sentient artificial intelligence that's far beyond human beings, you give it 1,000 years alone to r- to make better and better versions of itself, where does that go?

   13. TCTucker Carlson32:10

       S-

   14. JRJoe Rogan32:10

       That goes to a god. It, it c- literally c- can create universes.

   15. TCTucker Carlson32:13

       I don't... So, but what kind of god? So, like I, I think of it this way. So, the first stage of the Industrial Rev- Revolution consisted of people building machines that were stronger than the human body.

   16. JRJoe Rogan32:23

       Right.

   17. TCTucker Carlson32:23

       Right? So, the steam-powered loom.

   18. JRJoe Rogan32:26

       Sure.

   19. TCTucker Carlson32:26

       The backhoe.

   20. JRJoe Rogan32:27

       Combustion engine.

   21. TCTucker Carlson32:28

       The combustion engine. They replace mu- they replace muscles.

   22. JRJoe Rogan32:31

       Right.

   23. TCTucker Carlson32:32

       Right. So, that's what the machine does. It em- it becomes stronger than the human body. The second stage, which we're in the middle of, consists of creating machines that are more powerful than the human mind. That's what computing is. And I would say AI or supercomputing is just that exponentially.

   24. JRJoe Rogan32:50

       Yeah.

   25. TCTucker Carlson32:51

       Uh, but that doesn't make it a god in the sense that the machine, however powerful it is, any more than a backhoe is a god-

   26. JRJoe Rogan33:00

       Mm-hmm.

   27. TCTucker Carlson33:00

       ... because it can dig a trench faster than 100 men, it, it's still something that people created. So, the story hasn't really changed. At the center of the story are people, and their creative power may lead to unintended consequences. But the machines that they build did not make the universe and did not make people. People made the machines.

   28. JRJoe Rogan33:21

       Right.

   29. TCTucker Carlson33:21

       So, if you, and I, but I would say the part I agree with is there's a spiritual component here for sure. People will worship AI as a god. AI, Ted Kaczynski was likely right, will get away from us. We will be controlled by the thing that we made. All those are bad. Like that's just bad, and we need to say unequivocally it's bad. It's bad to be controlled by machines.

   30. JRJoe Rogan33:43

       Right.
7. 34:38 – 42:14

   Moral absolutes and hubris: nuclear weapons, wartime logic, and humility

   1. JRJoe Rogan34:38

      Well, you could say the same about the atomic bomb, right?

   2. TCTucker Carlson34:40

      Yes, you could.

   3. JRJoe Rogan34:41

      And you could say that we have to develop it, like Oppenheimer felt, before the Nazis did.

   4. TCTucker Carlson34:47

      I love that (laughs) . How'd that work? (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan34:51

      (laughs)

   6. TCTucker Carlson34:51

      How'd that work?

   7. JRJoe Rogan34:52

      Well, it-

   8. TCTucker Carlson34:53

      I love, by the way, that people on my side, I'll just say, I'll just admit it, on the right, you know, have spent the last 80 years defending dropping nuclear weapons on civilians. Like are you joking?

   9. JRJoe Rogan35:05

      Right.

   10. TCTucker Carlson35:06

       That's just like prima facie evil.

   11. JRJoe Rogan35:08

       Yeah.

   12. TCTucker Carlson35:08

       If you can't, "Well, if we hadn't done that, then this, that, and the other thing, that was actually a great savings." Like, no, it's wrong to drop nuclear weapons on people. And if you find yourself arguing that it's a good thing to drop nuclear weapons on people, then you are evil. Like it's, it's not a, it's not a tough one, right?

   13. JRJoe Rogan35:22

       Right.

   14. TCTucker Carlson35:22

       It's not a hard call for y- it's not a hard call for me. So, with that in mind, like why would you want nuclear weapons? It's like just a mindless, childish, sort of intellectual exercise to justify. Like, "Oh, no, it's really good because someone else could get..." How about no? How about like spending all of your effort to prevent this from happening? Would you kill baby Hitler, you know, famously?

   15. JRJoe Rogan35:43

       Right.

   16. TCTucker Carlson35:45

       Um, so I don't know why we're sitting back and allowing this to happen if we really believe it will extinguish the human race or enslave the human race. Like-

   17. JRJoe Rogan35:54

       Yeah.

   18. TCTucker Carlson35:54

       ... how, how can that be good?

   19. JRJoe Rogan35:55

       Well, if God creates everything, if God created the universe and God creates people, God probably creates a process. And we think that we are very important because we are very important to us. But are, are we very important in a universal sense? Not really. Like if the Earth just imploded and disappeared, if the sun went supernova and our whole solar system was blown to bits, the universe, it still exists.

   20. TCTucker Carlson36:24

       It depends how wide your-

   21. JRJoe Rogan36:25

       And God created-

   22. TCTucker Carlson36:25

       For sure. In, in our li- i- in the end, as Conan O'Brien, the famous philosopher, once said-

   23. JRJoe Rogan36:31

       (laughs)

   24. TCTucker Carlson36:31

       ... "Every grave goes unvisited," which is true, and that's an important perspective. Pull out the lens a little bit.

   25. JRJoe Rogan36:36

       Mm-hmm.

   26. TCTucker Carlson36:36

       Does it really matter? No, it doesn't.

   27. JRJoe Rogan36:38

       But it does matter.

   28. TCTucker Carlson36:39

       W-

   29. JRJoe Rogan36:39

       It does matter to us.

   30. TCTucker Carlson36:39

       Dear kids... How about this, dear children matter?
8. 42:14 – 45:15

   Energy, California, and the homelessness industry: incentives and ‘compassion’ as cover

   1. TCTucker Carlson42:14

      is like, like collapsing.

   2. JRJoe Rogan42:16

      Yeah.

   3. TCTucker Carlson42:16

      And they're betting everything on AI, for the, the tax base is gonna be dependent on this technology working, and that's why-

   4. JRJoe Rogan42:22

      Is that really what they're betting on?

   5. TCTucker Carlson42:23

      Of course. The, well, the, the, AI is the, the Cal-

   6. JRJoe Rogan42:27

      Didn't you see the most recent thing about the amount of billions of dollars they spent on the homeless problem with no trackable results?

   7. TCTucker Carlson42:32

      Well, they've had massive results. They've increased the-

   8. JRJoe Rogan42:34

      (laughs)

   9. TCTucker Carlson42:34

      ... homeless population dramatically. If you pay for something, you get more of it.

   10. JRJoe Rogan42:38

       (laughs)

   11. TCTucker Carlson42:38

       And that would include fentanyl addicts. Oh, absolutely. It's been a wild success. I actually talked to Kevin Newsom the other day.

   12. JRJoe Rogan42:45

       Did you really?

   13. TCTucker Carlson42:46

       T- Yeah. And, um-

   14. JRJoe Rogan42:48

       What's that like? Does he smell like sulfur?

   15. TCTucker Carlson42:50

       It was by phone. I was talking to him on the phone.

   16. JRJoe Rogan42:52

       (laughs)

   17. TCTucker Carlson42:52

       It's such a weird, um ... (laughs) does he smell like su-

   18. JRJoe Rogan42:56

       (laughs)

   19. TCTucker Carlson42:56

       That was too fast for me. (laughs)

   20. JRJoe Rogan42:57

       Sulfur and hair grease.

   21. TCTucker Carlson42:58

       Yeah. (laughs) No, but I was making, I was making fun of ... I shouldn't even make fun of it, 'cause it's so tragic, but what's happened to the state and people living on the street.

   22. JRJoe Rogan43:07

       And what is his non-gaslighty perspective?

   23. TCTucker Carlson43:12

       He said, "Go back to Russia. You like Russia so much." I was like, "You know, I don't... Actually, I'm originally from San Francisco, but um, I can't live there because of all the-"

   24. JRJoe Rogan43:20

       He really told you to go back to Russia?

   25. TCTucker Carlson43:21

       Of course.

   26. JRJoe Rogan43:22

       (laughs)

   27. TCTucker Carlson43:22

       I mean, he was laughing.

   28. JRJoe Rogan43:23

       (laughs)

   29. TCTucker Carlson43:23

       Whatever. Um, he's a perfectly charming guy. They all are in person.

   30. JRJoe Rogan43:27

       Of course.
9. 45:15 – 55:07

   Sauna discipline, discomfort training, and life without constant digital noise

   1. TCTucker Carlson45:15

      Oh, it's the best. And the heat is the ... I u- ... I have a wood fired sauna, which I use every day, and it's the great ... You know, it's one of the-

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:22

      How do you make sure it's the right temperature? Is it like a, like an offset smoker? Like you have to kind of fiddle with it for a while-

   3. TCTucker Carlson45:27

      Oh, no, it's amazing.

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:27

      ... to get the right temperature?

   5. TCTucker Carlson45:28

      It's time-consuming.

   6. JRJoe Rogan45:30

      Yeah.

   7. TCTucker Carlson45:30

      No, I have a Finnish, um ... The Finns are geniuses, but I have a Finnish, uh, stove in it, and it's incredibly prec- ... I don't know if you've ever used a wood stove, but there's a carburetor on it-

   8. JRJoe Rogan45:40

      Right.

   9. TCTucker Carlson45:40

      ... basically, that lets in air.

   10. JRJoe Rogan45:41

       Like a, like an offset smoker? You know-

   11. TCTucker Carlson45:43

       Yeah.

   12. JRJoe Rogan45:43

       Yeah.

   13. TCTucker Carlson45:43

       Exactly. And it's-

   14. JRJoe Rogan45:44

       Let a little air in?

   15. TCTucker Carlson45:45

       So precise. I mean, it's absolutely crazy. I mean, you move it, you know, a third of an inch, and it just like ... The flame changes. So I use birch, which I love. And, um, the whole process takes a while. I get it to 200, which probably takes an hour and 20. I mean, it's, it's a thing.

   16. JRJoe Rogan46:02

       Oh, you like it hot?

   17. TCTucker Carlson46:03

       I like it hot, yeah, yeah.

   18. JRJoe Rogan46:04

       200?

   19. TCTucker Carlson46:05

       Yeah. Well, I do it every-

   20. JRJoe Rogan46:06

       That's-

   21. TCTucker Carlson46:06

       Well, I wear a sauna hat, so-

   22. JRJoe Rogan46:07

       Oh, okay. Does that help?

   23. TCTucker Carlson46:08

       Which is embarrassing.

   24. JRJoe Rogan46:09

       The wool hat?

   25. TCTucker Carlson46:10

       Yeah. Well, it's, it's felt.

   26. JRJoe Rogan46:12

       Yeah, I bought one of those. I never wore it.

   27. TCTucker Carlson46:13

       It's incredible.

   28. JRJoe Rogan46:14

       Yeah? What's the difference?

   29. TCTucker Carlson46:15

       Uh, well, I'll tell you.

   30. JRJoe Rogan46:17

       (laughs)
10. 55:07 – 1:19:50

    Autism, vaccines, and ‘science as a process’: why questions are punished

    1. JRJoe Rogan55:07

       Well, they certainly have less instances of autism, which is really fascinating. It's very, very fascinating.

    2. TCTucker Carlson55:12

       The Amish have-

    3. JRJoe Rogan55:13

       Oh, yeah.

    4. TCTucker Carlson55:13

       ... less autism?

    5. JRJoe Rogan55:14

       Yeah, there's almost none.

    6. TCTucker Carlson55:16

       Well, I'm not surprised.

    7. JRJoe Rogan55:17

       It's extremely rare.

    8. TCTucker Carlson55:18

       Why do we think that is?

    9. JRJoe Rogan55:19

       Oh, well, I wonder. I really do.

    10. TCTucker Carlson55:21

        (laughs) Well, I can think of a couple.

    11. JRJoe Rogan55:23

        Yeah.

    12. TCTucker Carlson55:23

        That's funny. I don't wanna go Bobby Kennedy on anyone.

    13. JRJoe Rogan55:25

        Well, that's the problem.

    14. TCTucker Carlson55:26

        Right.

    15. JRJoe Rogan55:26

        Y- if you go Bobby Kennedy, they'll come for you.

    16. TCTucker Carlson55:28

        But, but, but why?

    17. JRJoe Rogan55:28

        But, but the question is why.

    18. TCTucker Carlson55:29

        But why? Look-

    19. JRJoe Rogan55:30

        Right.

    20. TCTucker Carlson55:30

        ... and I don't, I don't know the answer, but-

    21. JRJoe Rogan55:33

        How is that not in the de- debate? How is that not in the conversation?

    22. TCTucker Carlson55:36

        Well, it's not only not in the conversation, you're punished for-

    23. JRJoe Rogan55:38

        Punished.

    24. TCTucker Carlson55:38

        ... adding it to the conversation.

    25. JRJoe Rogan55:39

        Yes.

    26. TCTucker Carlson55:39

        And so, like-

    27. JRJoe Rogan55:41

        We are dancing around anti-vax conspiracy theories right now.

    28. TCTucker Carlson55:44

        But why, why be on the defensive? It's like-

    29. JRJoe Rogan55:46

        Right.

    30. TCTucker Carlson55:46

        ... if you purport to represent science, and you're mad about a question...

Episode duration: 3:07:57