Joe Rogan Experience #2138 - Tucker Carlson

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast,…

   1. TCTucker Carlson0:00

      (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

   2. JRJoe Rogan0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. TCTucker Carlson0:06

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (rock music) Did you, did you see? The US government just released, apparently by accident, the Project Aqua stuff. Did you see this?

   4. JRJoe Rogan0:20

      No. What's that? Should we start?

   5. TCTucker Carlson0:24

      This is crazy.

   6. JRJoe Rogan0:25

      Yeah, I guess we're rolling.

   7. TCTucker Carlson0:26

      Take... Are we rolling?

   8. JRJoe Rogan0:27

      Yeah. Well, it can wait till we can-

   9. TCTucker Carlson0:28

      No, no, no. You can... This is just... Someone just sent me this. This is like-

   10. JRJoe Rogan0:31

       Project Aqua? (sniffs)

   11. TCTucker Carlson0:33

       Yeah, hold on, I'll, um... (swallows) They just released, I think by accident-

   12. JRJoe Rogan0:42

       How's that happen?

   13. TCTucker Carlson0:43

       K- It's Kona Blue. Are you familiar with this?

   14. JRJoe Rogan0:46

       No.

   15. TCTucker Carlson0:48

       Kona Blue is a, um, it was a program. They... Yeah, dude, they... I'm gonna send this to... Homeland Security just released this.

   16. JRJoe Rogan0:56

       Send it to me, I'll send it to Jamie.

   17. TCTucker Carlson0:58

       And, uh...

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:00

       iPhone, you can Airdrop it to my-

   19. TCTucker Carlson1:01

       No, I got it right, right here. I'll just... I don't do email or what... I don't know how to Airdrop anything.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:06

       You don't do email?

   21. TCTucker Carlson1:07

       No.

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:08

       (laughs)

   23. TCTucker Carlson1:10

       I haven't done email in many years.

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:11

       Really?

   25. TCTucker Carlson1:12

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:12

       How do you exist?

   27. TCTucker Carlson1:13

       I do text.

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:15

       Wow. Just text?

   29. TCTucker Carlson1:17

       Yeah, I don't do email. I don't go on the fucking internet. I don't have a TV. I'm not into that. But anyway...

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:22

       Wow. (laughs) Don't worry.
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   Right. …

   1. TCTucker Carlson15:00

      again, this is like the most obvious observable level of it, but then you just ask yourself like, "What is this actually?" And, you know, if there's been extensive knowledge of this for decades, like maybe 80 years at least, if not going back to the '30s, 90 years, um, you know, to what, to what end? So there are two possible explanations, obvious explanations. The first is the one you often hear, which is this is so heavy that if the public were to know about it, it would be just disruptive.

   2. JRJoe Rogan15:30

      Right.

   3. TCTucker Carlson15:30

      It'd be too scary. Like, you don't want to scare people for no good reason. There's nothing we can do about it. And you also don't want to suggest that, you know, the US military isn't capable of protecting the country, the homeland. Um, and it does suggest that. If you can't control these objects in your airspace, and that's known, if they can't, that's known, okay, then that suggests a limit to the power of the US military, and you don't want to tell people that because then they like won't believe that they're safe. I get it. But then there's a deeper level, which is like, okay, what's your relationship with these things? What is the US government's relationship with these things? And there's evidence that there is a relationship and that it's a longstanding, and that raises like a lot of questions about intent. And, um, and so like, what is that? And I just personally decided, um, you know... And, and people have been hurt by these things. You know, that's a fact. That's a fact. It's a knowable fact. It's a provable fact. Uh, and killed, and I'm not saying millions of people have been killed by whatever these things are, but people have been killed, and it's known because it's working its way through the courts, uh, out of the VA. So, um, I don't know. An, an object that is by definition supernatural, it's above the laws of nature as we understand them, and that has resulted in the deaths of people. What, we don't spend enough time thinking about like what that adds up to. Like, not good actually. Not good.

   4. JRJoe Rogan17:00

      Uh, how many people do you think have died from these things?

   5. TCTucker Carlson17:02

      I, I don't know, but I mean, I-

   6. JRJoe Rogan17:04

      And is it radiation sickness? Is it like, what, uh, what is, what's the cause of death?

   7. TCTucker Carlson17:08

      So the person that I talk to, I interviewed someone who was a Stanford Medical School professor who's, who's out there and worth talking to, by the way, and a, um-

   8. JRJoe Rogan17:17

      You're talking about Garry Nolan?

   9. TCTucker Carlson17:18

      That's exactly who I'm talking about. He's an, uh, effectively an expert witness in these cases.

   10. JRJoe Rogan17:22

       Mm-hmm.

   11. TCTucker Carlson17:22

       So he's an expert in brain injury. Do you know him?

   12. JRJoe Rogan17:25

       Yeah.

   13. TCTucker Carlson17:25

       Yeah. Entirely credible person. Um, checks all the boxes that I care about. He's, he's got patents, so he's, like a lot of Stanford University professors, he's like independently rich. He flew to... I live in a remote place and he flew to my place at his own expense because he wanted to tell his story. So he, he's got no profit motive here. He's the most highly credentialed person at the university practically, Stanford Medical School. We consider that a big deal. Uh, and he's worked on this for, you know, over 10 years, um, assessing the injuries to US servicemen from being in close proximity to these objects or having contact with these objects. And his conclusion, as you know because you've talked to him, is that there's some kind of energy coming off here that scrambles people's brains or kills them.And it's not exactly radiation, um, at least in his telling to me. So, anyways, but the point is, people have died.

   14. JRJoe Rogan18:24

       Yeah.

   15. TCTucker Carlson18:24

       And so, you know, it, it does raise a lot of, a lot of questions about, like, what the hell? Right?

   16. JRJoe Rogan18:32

       Yeah.

   17. TCTucker Carlson18:32

       What the hell? American citizens have died and you're hiding it. Why are you hiding that? Why would you hide that?

   18. JRJoe Rogan18:39

       Perhaps because they don't have any explanations. Because they, they're... It's so beyond our comprehension that they're still trying to piece it together. Like, I would wonder how much interaction they really do have with these things. Like, if I was from another planet or if I was some interdimensional being, I don't know how much I'd give a shit about the president. I don't know how much I'd give a shit about the government. I would probably look at this infantile race, this species, this bizarre territorial apes with thermonuclear weapons, this very weird species. I, I'd probably look at them as very chaotic, and, uh, I wouldn't really have much concern for who's running it. Uh, especially if they have the ability to travel at insane speeds and go undetected and...

   19. TCTucker Carlson19:34

       Well, it depends. Like, that... Okay, so the template that you're using to understand this is like science fiction, right? These are an advanced race of beings from somewhere else. But the template that every other society before us has used is a spiritual one.

   20. JRJoe Rogan19:48

       Mm-hmm.

   21. TCTucker Carlson19:48

       There is a whole world that we can't see that acts on people, a supernatural world that's acting on us all the time for good and bad. Every society has thought this before ours.

   22. JRJoe Rogan19:58

       Mm-hmm.

   23. TCTucker Carlson19:58

       In fact, every society in all recorded history has thought that until, I'll be specific, August 1945 when we dropped the atom bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and all of a sudden, the West is just officially secular, "We're God. There is no god but us." And that's the world that we have grown up in, but that's an anomaly.

   24. JRJoe Rogan20:15

       Mm-hmm.

   25. TCTucker Carlson20:15

       Like, no one else has ever thought that. There's never been a society that thought that. Every other society has assumed, and they've had all kinds of different explanations and the details differ, but the core idea does not differ and never has differed from caves until now that we're being acted on by spiritual forces at all times. And so to someone born before or living before 1945, I think it would have been much more obvious that this is the thing that every society has written about.

   26. JRJoe Rogan20:45

       Mm-hmm.

   27. TCTucker Carlson20:45

       And in fact, that battle, that unseen battle around us, that spiritual battle, has, like, been the basis of every society, of every reli- e- every religion, not just Christianity. So, like, it just... Once you discard your very, very recent assumptions, relatively speaking, about how the world works, you're like, "Well, that kind of seems like the obvious explanation, right?"

   28. JRJoe Rogan21:10

       Hmm. It's not that obvious to me. (laughs)

   29. TCTucker Carlson21:13

       (laughs) So what's more obvious do you think?

   30. JRJoe Rogan21:18

       Well, I, I, I don't think there's an obvious explanation. I think... If I had to guess, some of this stuff is ours, and some of these things are propulsion systems that they theorized way back in the 1950s, anti-gravity propulsion systems, things that can operate without igniting fuel and-
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   For sure. …

   1. JRJoe Rogan30:00

      that currently exist, because it'll design much better computers. It'll use quantum computers. It'll have the ability to recode things and change things. It'll make better versions of itself. So instead of biological evolution, which is very slow... It takes a long time, uh, relatively. It takes... It's pretty quick, really, when you think about it, like, how long... It's n- not that long to go from being a single-celled organism to being a human being flying a plane, really, relatively, uh, over the course of a billion years, if you think about how long the universe has been around. But it's slow compared to technological evolution. I mean, 100 years ago, we didn't have shit, and now we have... Uh, we could send videos from your phone, and it'll hit New Zealand in a second.

   2. TCTucker Carlson30:46

      For sure.

   3. JRJoe Rogan30:47

      It's, it's crazy. The stuff that we have now is beyond imagination. It's essentially magic for people 100 years ago.... if that keeps going, it's ultimately gonna lead to a life form. And if that life form has now untethered, it hasn't, doesn't have any problems with biological evolution. Now, it's just about information and implementing the technology that's available, and then increasing that technology and making it better and better. It essentially becomes a god.

   4. TCTucker Carlson31:18

      Mm-hmm.

   5. JRJoe Rogan31:19

      Because if, if you give it enough time-

   6. TCTucker Carlson31:21

      (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan31:21

      ... it, it d- it doesn't, it has the ability to make better versions of itself, which will in turn make better versions of itself. It has the ability to utilize everything. It has the, the, the understanding of everything that exists in the universe, ex- black holes, dark matter, everything. And it probably has the ability to harness that or even reproduce that. So, if you take artificial sentient intel- intelligence and it has this super accelerated path of technological evolution, and you give artificial s- general intelligence, sentient artificial intelligence that's far beyond human beings, you give it 1,000 years alone to r- to make better and better versions of itself, where does that go?

   8. TCTucker Carlson32:10

      S-

   9. JRJoe Rogan32:10

      That goes to a god. It, it c- literally c- can create universes.

   10. TCTucker Carlson32:13

       I don't... So, but what kind of god? So, like I, I think of it this way. So, the first stage of the Industrial Rev- Revolution consisted of people building machines that were stronger than the human body.

   11. JRJoe Rogan32:23

       Right.

   12. TCTucker Carlson32:23

       Right? So, the steam-powered loom.

   13. JRJoe Rogan32:26

       Sure.

   14. TCTucker Carlson32:26

       The backhoe.

   15. JRJoe Rogan32:27

       Combustion engine.

   16. TCTucker Carlson32:28

       The combustion engine. They replace mu- they replace muscles.

   17. JRJoe Rogan32:31

       Right.

   18. TCTucker Carlson32:32

       Right. So, that's what the machine does. It em- it becomes stronger than the human body. The second stage, which we're in the middle of, consists of creating machines that are more powerful than the human mind. That's what computing is. And I would say AI or supercomputing is just that exponentially.

   19. JRJoe Rogan32:50

       Yeah.

   20. TCTucker Carlson32:51

       Uh, but that doesn't make it a god in the sense that the machine, however powerful it is, any more than a backhoe is a god-

   21. JRJoe Rogan33:00

       Mm-hmm.

   22. TCTucker Carlson33:00

       ... because it can dig a trench faster than 100 men, it, it's still something that people created. So, the story hasn't really changed. At the center of the story are people, and their creative power may lead to unintended consequences. But the machines that they build did not make the universe and did not make people. People made the machines.

   23. JRJoe Rogan33:21

       Right.

   24. TCTucker Carlson33:21

       So, if you, and I, but I would say the part I agree with is there's a spiritual component here for sure. People will worship AI as a god. AI, Ted Kaczynski was likely right, will get away from us. We will be controlled by the thing that we made. All those are bad. Like that's just bad, and we need to say unequivocally it's bad. It's bad to be controlled by machines.

   25. JRJoe Rogan33:43

       Right.

   26. TCTucker Carlson33:43

       Machines are our helpmates. Like they, we created them to help us, to make our lives better, not to take orders from them. Um, so I, I, I don't know why we're not having any of these conversations right now. We're just acting as if this is like some kind of virus, like COVID, that just spreads across the world inexorably. There's nothing we can do about it. Just wait to get it. And it's like, no. If we agree that the outcome is bad, which and specifically it's bad for people, we should care what's good for people. That's all we should care about, is it good for people or not. If it's bad for people, then we should strangle it in its crib right now.

   27. JRJoe Rogan34:20

       (laughs) Right.

   28. TCTucker Carlson34:21

       And we'll just blow up the data centers. Like I don't un- why is that hard? If it's actually going to become what you just described, which is a threat to people, humanity, life, then we have a, a moral obligation to murder it immediately. And since it's not alive, we don't need to feel bad about that.

   29. JRJoe Rogan34:38

       Well, you could say the same about the atomic bomb, right?

   30. TCTucker Carlson34:40

       Yes, you could.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   But do you think…

   1. TCTucker Carlson45:00

      stuff, except somehow AI isn't a problem.

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:04

      But do you think that they're informed? Because this is not a narrative that you ever hear. You never hear, uh, on the news-

   3. TCTucker Carlson45:10

      Well, I grew up in a world where a wood stove was considered wholesome and natural, and now it's considered-

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:14

      Smells good too.

   5. TCTucker Carlson45:15

      Oh, it's the best. And the heat is the ... I u- ... I have a wood fired sauna, which I use every day, and it's the great ... You know, it's one of the-

   6. JRJoe Rogan45:22

      How do you make sure it's the right temperature? Is it like a, like an offset smoker? Like you have to kind of fiddle with it for a while-

   7. TCTucker Carlson45:27

      Oh, no, it's amazing.

   8. JRJoe Rogan45:27

      ... to get the right temperature?

   9. TCTucker Carlson45:28

      It's time-consuming.

   10. JRJoe Rogan45:30

       Yeah.

   11. TCTucker Carlson45:30

       No, I have a Finnish, um ... The Finns are geniuses, but I have a Finnish, uh, stove in it, and it's incredibly prec- ... I don't know if you've ever used a wood stove, but there's a carburetor on it-

   12. JRJoe Rogan45:40

       Right.

   13. TCTucker Carlson45:40

       ... basically, that lets in air.

   14. JRJoe Rogan45:41

       Like a, like an offset smoker? You know-

   15. TCTucker Carlson45:43

       Yeah.

   16. JRJoe Rogan45:43

       Yeah.

   17. TCTucker Carlson45:43

       Exactly. And it's-

   18. JRJoe Rogan45:44

       Let a little air in?

   19. TCTucker Carlson45:45

       So precise. I mean, it's absolutely crazy. I mean, you move it, you know, a third of an inch, and it just like ... The flame changes. So I use birch, which I love. And, um, the whole process takes a while. I get it to 200, which probably takes an hour and 20. I mean, it's, it's a thing.

   20. JRJoe Rogan46:02

       Oh, you like it hot?

   21. TCTucker Carlson46:03

       I like it hot, yeah, yeah.

   22. JRJoe Rogan46:04

       200?

   23. TCTucker Carlson46:05

       Yeah. Well, I do it every-

   24. JRJoe Rogan46:06

       That's-

   25. TCTucker Carlson46:06

       Well, I wear a sauna hat, so-

   26. JRJoe Rogan46:07

       Oh, okay. Does that help?

   27. TCTucker Carlson46:08

       Which is embarrassing.

   28. JRJoe Rogan46:09

       The wool hat?

   29. TCTucker Carlson46:10

       Yeah. Well, it's, it's felt.

   30. JRJoe Rogan46:12

       Yeah, I bought one of those. I never wore it.
5. 1:00:00 – 1:15:00

   Sure. Oh, absolutely you…

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:00:00

      detrimental to the people that were-

   2. TCTucker Carlson1:00:02

      Sure. Oh, absolutely you could say that.

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:00:04

      ... encountered with them.

   4. TCTucker Carlson1:00:05

      Yeah.

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:00:05

      I think that that kind of thinking, I think cult thinking, whether it's, uh, Scientology or whether it's Christianity or ... There's like a type of thinking, or that's woke. Woke is clearly a cult. It's a mind virus. And I think that, I mean, call it, it's, it's so trite to call it that now. It's like whatever this thing is, this leftism, this Marxist sort of ideology that's waving its flag and, and, and indoctrinating people in this country, it's very similar to all kinds of religions. It's very similar to fundamentalist religions that have always existed, in that everybody has to believe very specific things, and you can't differ. You can't differ from the doctrine. And when you-

   6. TCTucker Carlson1:00:50

      So here's another way to think about it, that I've been thi- I've been meditating on this a lot. It, yes, religion, politics, they're all kind of melding.

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:01:00

      Mm-hmm.

   8. TCTucker Carlson1:01:00

      It's hard to know where one ends and another begins.

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:01:03

      Right.

   10. TCTucker Carlson1:01:03

       So maybe a simpler and more useful way to think about it is, truth or falsehood? L- lying or honesty?

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:01:11

       Mm-hmm.

   12. TCTucker Carlson1:01:12

       Maybe you should assess everything that way. Is someone lying?

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:01:15

       Right.

   14. TCTucker Carlson1:01:15

       I don't care what your justification for it is. Lying about vaccines, they've lied a lot about vaccines.

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:01:20

       Right.

   16. TCTucker Carlson1:01:20

       And they've done it, I think, in most cases 'cause they feel like they're serving some greater good. Like you-

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:01:23

       Right. Well, that's the narrative, right?

   18. TCTucker Carlson1:01:24

       Right. We can't tell people that there are vaccine injuries because they won't get vaccines, which are good for a, a big population. I understand the thinking. But you, how about this? You can't participate in lying.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:01:35

       Yeah.

   20. TCTucker Carlson1:01:35

       You can't lie.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:01:36

       You can't lie, and you can't-

   22. TCTucker Carlson1:01:37

       Per- like period, though. You can't lie about anything. Just don't lie about anything. Try to tell the truth-

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:01:41

       Right.

   24. TCTucker Carlson1:01:41

       ... all the time. If you can't say something that's true, just don't say it.

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:01:45

       Right.

   26. TCTucker Carlson1:01:45

       You're not required to say everything you think, obviously, and you shouldn't say everything you think.

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:01:48

       Right.

   28. TCTucker Carlson1:01:49

       But you should never lie. And if you just stick with that, like you get pretty quickly back to reason and order.

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:01:56

       Mm-hmm.

   30. TCTucker Carlson1:01:56

       Don't you?
6. 1:15:00 – 1:16:42

   Yeah. I d- …

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:15:00

      Yeah. I d-

   2. TCTucker Carlson1:15:00

      Like, the impediment to creativity is lying.

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:15:02

      Sure. And, yeah, I always used to say that about joke thieves. That one of the real problems with joke thieves is when they get caught, and then they have to write their own material. And the problem is, they don't understand the language. They just know how to say the sounds. Like, if you told me what to say in French, I can't speak French, but if you told me what to say and I practice it, and I said it right, you would think, "Wow, that guy fucking speaks French."

   4. TCTucker Carlson1:15:24

      Yes.

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:15:25

      So, that's what comedy's like. So, if you got a guy who knows how to repeat other people's jokes, but he doesn't know how to create them ... See, comedy's one of the rare things where someone, when a, when a com- Like, you get a guy like, uh, Shane Gillis, that guy writes his own stuff. He edits it i- He thinks it out in his head. He performs it. He produces it. He changes the order of things.

   6. TCTucker Carlson1:15:49

      I love that.

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:15:49

      It's a complete ... Everybody does it pretty much the same way. There's a few guys that hire writers, and there's, that's honorable. There's nothing wrong with hiring a writer. And it's also, it gives jobs to other comics, 'cause some comics are just really good writers, and they're not so good at performing. And so people work on stuff. They'll collaborate on stuff. Like, Chris Rock would do this thing where he would hire comics, and they didn't write the jokes for him, but they would be like guys he would bounce stuff off. So, he would have his ideas. He would go on stage, and then after his set, they would all meet, and they would talk about the set. And, you know, guys would have taglines, like, "You could say this. Oh, great." And they'd write that down. They're adding. So, it's a collaboration. So, you have the, the, the master. You have Chris Rock, who is so open-minded and intelligent and humble that he brings in other masters and says, "Tell me what I'm doing wrong. Tell me what I could change. Tell me what I could make better."

Episode duration: 3:07:57