EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,000 words- 0:00 – 15:00
(drum roll) Joe Rogan podcast,…
- SRSteven Rinella
(drum roll) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience.
- NANarrator
Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music)
- JRJoe Rogan
Steve Rinella.
- SRSteven Rinella
(laughs) That was a long exhale.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs) I needed one.
- SRSteven Rinella
I- is this Trump's chair?
- JRJoe Rogan
Uh, he sat in that chair, yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
Oh.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- SRSteven Rinella
I wanna soak up some of the tenacity, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs) He's got a lot of that.
- SRSteven Rinella
That, it took me a long time, man. Um, it took me a long time to, to, to see it. Like, I remember when people would talk, you know, th- th- there was this thing when he, when he emerged on the scene, it was a thing about, like, toughness.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- SRSteven Rinella
And I'd always defined, like in my mind, toughness was being able to go through some, like, alder-choked hellhole real fast.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- SRSteven Rinella
Or hike up a hill.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- SRSteven Rinella
So I was like, "That's not tough." And then later I was like, "Oh." (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
Like that kind of-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mental toughness.
- SRSteven Rinella
That kind of tough, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
I mean, think about what that guy went through. I mean, he had the entire media, the entire justice system. He had, uh, the, the deep state, the Central Intelligence Agency. He had all these people, like, conspiring to take him out. Literally an assassination attempt and then another one. In and out of the news in no time, nobody cared, no grace period.
- SRSteven Rinella
No.
- JRJoe Rogan
They, they, they went, they went, waited about a day, and then they started talking shit about him again.
- SRSteven Rinella
That's the thing is I would've, uh, when I looked at like now that I've come to understand it better, I'm like, m- like, the fact that, uh, most people would've crawled into a hole.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
You know, after a while. I got, I, I got a buddy, I don't wanna say who it is, but he, uh, he had sold his business and he told me, he goes, "Well, I'm gonna, when I sell my business, I'm gonna crawl into a deep, dark hole." And, um, later he's kinda back out and bought another business. And I said, "What about crawling into the deep, dark hole?" And he said, "Well, I did, but my wife was in there." (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- SRSteven Rinella
He goes, "I have to get back. I'm not ready yet. I gotta get back out." (laughs)
- 15:00 – 30:00
Yeah. …
- JRJoe Rogan
'cause it's way easier for them to make money. And that's what they like to do.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
They like to make money. They like to be in bed with the lobbyists and the military-industrial complex and the pharmaceutical industrial complex, and they like to fucking impor- impose their will on people. And if you can't express yourself and say, "Hey, this is fucked up. This is crazy. Why am I doing this?" Like, "These studies show that you're not correct." Like, if you can't say all those things, which right now you can't do in Canada. It's not the same. Like, their ability to express themself on the internet has been severely limited. It's real weird, man. It's real weird, and it's happening right... You could walk there. If you wanted to, you could walk there. And it's fucked. It's like it's on the same patch of land as us, and it's fucked.
- SRSteven Rinella
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
It just shows you what can happen here if you don't have the right laws. Because people like that fuckhead Justin, they pretend that they're-
- SRSteven Rinella
You guys are on first name basis? (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, that cocksucker. They pretend that they're... And I don't talk this way about anybody.
- SRSteven Rinella
No, I'm really surprised.
- JRJoe Rogan
I, I, I genuinely despise people like that. I think it's good to say it publicly because people need to understand, like, what these people are doing. These people are leading you on the road to legitimate communism. Like, he's l- he's leading that country on a road to legitimate communism. It's very dangerous. And I think most Canadians are fed up with it. At this point, it's just like the party, the party up there has so much control. And he's been forced to resign, so he's gotta step down.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And just hopefully they don't get some new slick talker to con them into the same old bullshit. Hopefully someone comes along that has, like, real, meaningful change.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Which is what I'm hoping is gonna happen in America too. If that Tim Walz cocksucker, if that guy got into d- into power, like if Kamala died and T- Tim Walz, Tampon Tim was our fucking president-
- SRSteven Rinella
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
... you know how crazy this country would be? That weirdo who puts tampons in the boys' room and, "What about our joy?" Like, he's a complete pathological liar, like a c- complete liar. Lied about being in Tiananmen Square, lied about being a fucking f- uh, head coach of a football team when he-
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah, I thought some of that was, uh, i- just weird in how avoidable it was.
- JRJoe Rogan
100% avoidable, but pathological liars.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
People that are habitual liars, they just lie all the time about everything.
- SRSteven Rinella
But there's a way, uh... There's a way he can do it where it's sort of like no one's ever gonna know, and there's things you can fib about that are just fi- that you find out in five seconds.
- JRJoe Rogan
Sure.
- SRSteven Rinella
So you wonder about making the call to embellish something that a person could answer on their phone.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs) Right, right. Instantly.
- SRSteven Rinella
Like, almost as you're saying it.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Um, that's not true.
- SRSteven Rinella
You know?
- JRJoe Rogan
No, this was your rank in the military.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, you didn't deploy, uh, for m- for war. You didn't.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah, I know.
- 30:00 – 45:00
Yeah. …
- SRSteven Rinella
called Rigs to Reefs, which is to tip them over so they're not navigational hazards. The, uh, shrimpers don't like them 'cause they, they are, they're a ... You know, they cause like navigational obstructions and you can hang your gear up on them. But all the rod and reel fishermen and all the spear fishermen want the rigs there. So, you wind up in this situation like that where it's this real complexity. And y- you can picture, um ... You know, it puts people in a situation, uh, in viewing it, it puts you in a situation where it's not that clean.
- NANarrator
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
You know?
- NANarrator
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
Like, you're creating ... I mean, you ... They ... You almost hate to say it, 'cause you're supposed to, you know ... Y- you know, you're, you're supposed to be, uh, an- ... You know, most people from the environmental movement are anti oli- oil exploration, but then you go and look and be like, they created like an unb- ... Accidentally created an unbelievable fishery-
- NANarrator
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
... in the Gulf. And there's dudes now, like I got buddies that spearfish there and fish there.And it's like, you remember in Star Wars, the original Star Wars, where they go to that fucking planet and the planet's gone?
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- SRSteven Rinella
They're like, "Hey, shouldn't the planet be here?" You know, that scene? I've been with buddies of mine and they got, they got GPS marks for rigs, and you show up and it's like Star Wars. It's like you show up and the rig's not there anymore.
- JRJoe Rogan
Ah.
- SRSteven Rinella
'Cause there's these ships out there called rig reapers (laughs) that are out plucking the rigs, and they're plucking them faster than they can put them in. But it's got all the fishermen pissed off.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's an interesting situation.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah, they want them there now, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
Lake Austin has a similar situation. So Lake Austin used to be this am- it's still very good for bass fishing.
- SRSteven Rinella
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
They have big bass on Lake Austin. And, um, the people that live on the lake, you know, the high-falutin' folks didn't like all the weeds.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
So they brought in carp.
- SRSteven Rinella
Oh.
- JRJoe Rogan
And the carp ate everything.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
So now the, the place looks like the bottom of a swimming pool.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yup.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's like all the vegetation is fucked, and so the bass don't have a lot of places to go. Like, you know, where, where I live, people go to the docks. Like they, they cast to the docks, you know, and they, they fish near people's docks, 'cause that's-
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... like the only cover th- these fish have. And so there's talk of, like, submerging, like, trees or, you know, dropping things down.
- SRSteven Rinella
Sure, creating structures, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, creating structures. And then there's people that are opposed to that, 'cause like, you know, you have your w- you know, the wakeboarders and all the people that like to, like recreation on the water, they don't want anything that could possibly fuck up their boat.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, but like, if... They already fucked it up by bringing in the carp. Like and you can't get the carp out.
- 45:00 – 1:00:00
Mm-hmm. …
- SRSteven Rinella
I just all of a sudden made some discovery that had huge implications, and people would need to become immediately aware of what I might have found out, right?
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- SRSteven Rinella
Um, there's a term for it, where you would release these... You would release these like preliminary findings, even though it hasn't been held up to academic rigor, because it's of such importance. Like a lot of times you don't get to skip that step, but in cases of medical, you get to skip a step and say like, "Hey, hang tight. We're not all the way there yet, but look, this is kind of alarming."
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- SRSteven Rinella
They had a case and it, and it all corroded, but these guys had a case where they were able to in, in fact, a rhesus monkey with CWD.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh.
- SRSteven Rinella
Um, but then it, you know, it didn't, wasn't replicable, didn't hold up. But, think, when things like that happen, they tend to get a ton of media. But then down the road, the media doesn't follow suit. Like there, there's been cases where, um... There was one not long ago where they were looking at people that had this rare form of dementia, and they were kind of... They found that of these people that had this rare form of dementia, um, a couple of them had... Were deer hunters who lived in CWD areas, right? So they come out with a, "Hey everybody, check this out." But then it winds up being that when you do a statistical analysis on it, it w- it was no different than anything else. There was no reason that, that... It wasn't like they scored higher, that deer hunters scored higher, or nothing.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's just a certain percentage of people get dementia.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah, and so it's like a certain number of people eat dementia, a certain number of re- people eat venison, and statistically you're gonna have some overlap if you survey enough people. So even though they gave like a big heads up, it wound up being nothing there. Uh, but yeah, CWD, um, it's an in- it's a highly infectious disease. It was first identified in Colorado on a game, on a, on a research facility, not a game farm. It was first identified on a cervid research facility in Colorado, I believe in the early '70s. And then there's been a, there's been a, a debate, like s- some, some people feel that it was always there and wasn't detected, right? And that we, that it wasn't like we found it the minute it came out, it was just that it would, perhaps had been there, and then we discovered that it was always there. Um, but it does, it does expand its range all the time, right? Um, even in the last few years, we've had our first cases in Montana. And you, we keep, every year we add, like... Without fail, every year, we find CWD in states where it didn't previously exist, or within states that have CWD, we find CWD in counties that didn't have it. Oftentimes you can look and it makes sense because it flows. But now and then you get these weird jumps, right? Where, where, um, something jumps a big moat of inactivity and then all of a sudden you get like a new hotspot, and you look and be like, "Well how did... If it's an infectious disease, and deer aren't flying in airplanes, how did it jump?" Some of the jumps people tie it to transporting, uh, there's a theory that is well accepted in a lot of circles would be that moving cervids, moving deer and elk, um, to penned operations has facilitated the movement of CWD. Uh, what, what it used to mean to be a C... If someone was a CWD denier before, it would be that they, they, they denied that it was a thing. Like there is no disease called CWD. There's generally, it's generally accepted now that there's a disease called CWD but, but now the debate is like, is, sort of does it matter or not? Right? Uh, our mutual friend Doug Dern is like heavily involved in, in, in CWD, combating CWD, trying to get more money spent to understand CWD. Um, and they look at, you're looking at, there's two risks with CWD. One risk is that ultimately it's gonna lead to like destruction of deer herds. Meaning if you get like, it's always fatal, and if infection rates get to a certain point, we're gonna lose deer. Right? Like i- if it's always fatal, and you have infection rates of 50 or 60%, and it takes a couple years to kill them, like you're gonna run out of big bucks, 'cause nothing can live long enough. The other fear is that it...... jumps the barrier and becomes a human pathogen.
- JRJoe Rogan
Hmm.
- SRSteven Rinella
You know? So people, you know, all the hunters I know, like the, the question we always talk about is like, "Do you, uh, do you ... would you eat CWD positive meat?" You know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Right. Even if it doesn't jump currently-
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... would you take that risk to be patient zero?
- SRSteven Rinella
So, Yanni, Yanni was recently with a guy and he's like, he's eaten, him and his family have eaten four CWD positive deer.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh.
- SRSteven Rinella
Um, man, uh, I couldn't s- I, I, I can't, I, I like, I couldn't serve it to my kids.
- JRJoe Rogan
No. I wouldn't eat it myself either.
- SRSteven Rinella
I can't serve it to my kids.
- JRJoe Rogan
No, I wouldn't serve it to my kids.
- SRSteven Rinella
I, I, I don't, I haven't knowingly eaten it, but here's the thing, here's the rub. Um, I've said this to number of people before, and people are like, "That's not true," but it's true. I'm telling you. Hundreds of thousands of people have eaten CWD positive. Hundreds of thousands of people have eaten CWD positive meat.
- JRJoe Rogan
I would imagine that's true.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
Over many decades.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
Right? So, at what point do you, at what point do you get comfortable?
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't know.
- SRSteven Rinella
(laughs) It's a, it's a ... Dude, it's a tough one.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. It's a tough one because-
- 1:00:00 – 1:11:48
Wow. (gasps) …
- SRSteven Rinella
I don't think... I- if I'm wrong, I'm wrong by maybe one county, but I'm- I'm pretty positive I'm not wrong, and this is generally absolutely true. Um, you can't go to a county that had infected deer that no longer has infected deer. No one's gone into a population of deer and eradicated CWD.
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow. (gasps)
- SRSteven Rinella
No one's got rid, no one's gotten rid of it.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's crazy.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Has it jumped to moose?
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah, I think that, uh, um, cervids though, so the primarily whittailed deer, mule deer, elk, they found it in, they've had it transmit to caribou. Um... God, I should know that.
- JRJoe Rogan
'Cause moose-
- SRSteven Rinella
It- it's gotta be 'cause it's a cervid, so there's no other, there's no way it doesn't-
- JRJoe Rogan
Lower numbers, like, you know.
- SRSteven Rinella
That, from, not from that.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right, but I'm saying like the thing about moose is there's lower numbers and they don't, they don't exist in like packs.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah, yeah. But since it is a cervid disease, I should know this. Since it is, I'm assuming they've, they've found it in there.
- JRJoe Rogan
Hmm.
- SRSteven Rinella
I can't think of examples. I can think of, uh, mule deer, whitetail deer, elk, caribou-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- SRSteven Rinella
... but I can't think of whether or not there's been a positive case of, of moose. And moose have a whole host of problems, um, right now in some areas, particularly in the lower 48. The northern, the northern states of the lower 48, between wolf depredation and, uh, and then, uh, a tick.
- JRJoe Rogan
Ooh.
- SRSteven Rinella
Like a tick is really hammering those moose right now.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Someone told me they went hunting and they got a moose and it was just covered in ticks.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah, yeah. There's a problem with... In this long series of mild winters-... um, that that's, that these extreme colds that would lower these tick numbers down hasn't been happening, so you're, you're, you're having animals literally dying. Like, a l- a lot of moose literally dying from tick infestations.
- JRJoe Rogan
Ugh.
- SRSteven Rinella
Yeah. And then Colorado's becoming like a great ... Oh, here's all the-
- JRJoe Rogan
There it is, found in moose in many state provinces of the-
- SRSteven Rinella
There you go.
- JRJoe Rogan
... Alberta, Saskatchewan, Colorado, and Te- Texas has moose?
- SRSteven Rinella
Oh.
- JRJoe Rogan
What? Texas has moose?
- SRSteven Rinella
No, no, no. He's l- um ... well, that's not-
- JRJoe Rogan
Relatively small areas in the panhandle of west Texas.
Episode duration: 2:47:53
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