JRE MMA Show #160 with Francis Ngannou

Francis Ngannou is a professional mixed martial artist and boxer signed to the Professional Fighters League. www.francisngannou.com

Francis NgannouguestJoe Roganhost

Jul 23, 20242h 14mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

150 min read · 30,034 words

0:00 – 0:51
Catching up: Ngannou’s “book” keeps adding chapters
1. NANarrator
  (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  The Joe Rogan Experience.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music plays) All right, we're up. What's up, man? Good to see you.
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Not much. Good to see you, too, Joe.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  You have, uh, had a lot of experiences since the last time I saw you.
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  (sighs) Yeah.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  A lot of things happened.
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  That's why, like, uh, always about writing my book and chapter keep adding up, adding up, adding up. And, uh... Yes, every time you feel like your choice may be in the beginning or in the middle.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  I don't think so. (laughs)
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  (laughs)
13. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs) Uh, y- you're definitely only in the middle.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah, in the middle.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  W- Somewhere... I mean, it's not the beginning, but, uh, it's a lot of experiences.
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes, man.
0:51 – 3:41
Making the Tyson Fury fight happen (and shocking the world)
1. JRJoe Rogan
  So, tell me about leading up to the Tyson Fury fight.
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  (clicks tongue) Oh, the Tyson Fury fight, that was great. You know, I was just there living the dream. You know, get this big moment, get that fight that I've been, I've been waiting for four years.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  The fight that everybody said you were never gonna get.
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes, that I was never gonna get.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Which is crazy. Like, thank God for the Saudis, because-
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  ... they, they are making things happen, which is really incredible.
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  They are making things happen.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  Incredible.
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Uh-huh. And it's not like, "Who is this? Who is who? Who is that?" You know? It's like, "Okay, we want it to happen. Then make it happen."
11. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah, because everybody wanted to see it happen. But it was one of those things where everybody dismissed it. Everybody said, "That's not gonna happen. Tyson Fury's the heavyweight champion, why would he fight a guy who doesn't have any professional boxing matches? That's crazy. Yeah, that's not gonna happen."
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  And it happened. And then, everybody said, "You didn't stand a chance," and then when you knocked him down the second round, everybody was like, "Holy shit." (laughs)
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  (laughs)
15. JRJoe Rogan
  And when you were dancing over him when he went down?
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  (clicks tongue) Yeah. But, you know, I think, uh, a lot of people, uh, do mistake something, you know? And I always tell people, like, "Not because you're a fighter, that you walk in a bar and there is this guy coming to you, maybe this fat guy coming to you, and then you stand there, and because you're a fighter, don't think like he's a threat." Everybody could be a threat. You better step, take two step back, and then like see your distance and get ready to defend yourself. You know, you don't... Uh, if everybody hits you, anybody hits you, you're gonna get hurt.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  You know?
19. JRJoe Rogan
  True.
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  So, yes, I might not have been, uh, doing boxing. I'm not a boxer, but still, I'm a fighter. And even if I wasn't a fighter, you know, I can hurt and I can harm somebody.
21. JRJoe Rogan
  You're a big motherfucker. (laughs)
22. FNFrancis Ngannou
  (laughs) I'm a big guy. So, I was watching it and people was like, "No, he stand no chance. He has zero chance." I'm like, "There is not a fight on Earth that zero chance. That element of zero chance doesn't exist." I mean, um, if you look at it, I'm a man, guy, and then two men together, someone might have more techniques, might know the sport, but even if I never been in the gym, you still better watch out. I still have a chance.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  Yes.
24. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Maybe not as much, maybe not equal chance, but I still do have a chance.
25. JRJoe Rogan
  But you can't dismiss someone like you and drop their, drop your guard and-
26. FNFrancis Ngannou
  No.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  ... and think that you don't have any chance.
28. FNFrancis Ngannou
  You shouldn't dismiss anybody.
29. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. No.
30. FNFrancis Ngannou
  You know? We used to be in the... I, I have seen fight that people show up and then they pretend like, oh, they're gonna fight. They have stone in their hand, and if you dismiss them because you think, like, "Oh, he's a small guy," he hit you with the stone in his hand (laughs) .
3:41 – 4:36
Fight IQ in the ring: southpaw switching and managing Fury’s pressure
1. JRJoe Rogan
  Right. Exactly. Um, but it m- it was very clear to me, uh, that you had some interesting strategies when you went into that fight. First of all, you were, you were fighting a lot of it in southpaw. Why, why did you decide to do that? Was that something that you, you guys had devised before the fight, you thought it would be an interesting strategy?
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Uh-
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Or is that just, like, the way you like to box?
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I like to box like that, but I also thought it was a strategy. Um, uh, that it would be a good strategy as well, because, like... Basically on this, uh, Tyson Fury fight, I think the southpaw was a big component in that fight because every time that I realize, uh, that every time that I switch to southpaw, he was thinking. But when I switch back to orthodox, he was pressing. So, when I wanna take a break, I switch to southpaw-
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm.
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... a little bit. (laughs)
4:36 – 6:59
Boxing vs MMA: ring nerves, endurance doubts, and learning on the fly
1. JRJoe Rogan
  What was it like to... I mean, there's obviously you've had many MMA fights, you've been very successful, UFC heavyweight champion as an MMA fighter, but what was the difference in the feel of, like, going into a professional boxing fight with a guy like Tyson Fury, who is the heavyweight champion of the world and one of the greatest of all time? I mean, o- uh, he's absolutely one of the greatest heavyweight boxers ever.
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah. But he was completely different, you know. Uh, the environment is different, the organization is different. It's different to be, uh, step in the ring, uh, for the first time. Okay, you have all this spotlight on you, but you're in the ring. Feels different. Sometime you are in the cage, you're used to the cage, you lean on that cage-
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... you have that feeling. You, you, you grab the, the cage. All those stuff.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Also, your shoes on.
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes. Uh, and then, in the cage, you know that you can, you can do more, you're, uh, you can wrestle, you can do this, and you're comfortable with that. But you're, you're in the ring for the very first time, somewhere that you've never been, it feels different. And then you're thinking like, "Oh, man, how am I going to do? Am I going to be able to do three rounds? Am I going to be able to do four rounds? I don't know. I'm gonna find out just now." There's no way back. You're gonna find out.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  That's crazy.
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  So, every, by every round, you have to think about like, "Okay, how am I doing? This the first round, then second round. Okay, so...... this is the fifth round, I'm not too bad, so I think I'm gonna get there. You know, just go like that-
9. JRJoe Rogan
  So you were concerned-
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... round after round.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  ... about endurance.
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  You're con- very concerned about endurance. It was 10 rounds and I didn't know how I gonna be feeling after the third round.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  You turned it on in the eighth round. In the eighth round, you hit him with some big shots.
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Mm. Yeah.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  That was one of your best rounds.
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah, the, uh, yeah, the eight round was pretty good. Then I get little... then I pull my, my feet off the gas on the ninth round, rounds. And then the 10th round, so I'm like, you know, like, "Oh, I feel good. This is the last round, right? Feel good." That's when I started to do like those, this Superman punch, all this stuff. For me, it was already a win. (laughs)
19. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs) Yeah, that's... You shocked the world, that's for sure.
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
6:59 – 10:54
Training camp realities: sparring choices, prep timeline, and “destiny” thinking
1. JRJoe Rogan
  Did you have any, um, mock fights in the gym? Like did you bring any professional boxers and have like try to go eight, 10 rounds in the gym?
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Sparring?
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  But like with no headgear, like smaller gloves. Did you do anything like that-
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  No.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  ... replicated an actual professional boxing match?
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  No.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  No?
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Uh, we just do like a normal sparring, uh, have d- uh, different sparring partner sometimes who push me but, um, we didn't do anything like that. You know, as a MMA fighter, we used to spar without gloves, without headgear and stuff, but you get into boxing, everything is so strict, so specific. And then you get to the point that you kind of like ask yourself, like, "Why taking the chance to hurt now and get pu- and get pull up out the fight?"
11. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  You know, I'm just going to train, I trained the best that I could, uh, that I can, then I will get there, see, figure out what's happen.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  And so but from the time the negotiations started to the time of the fight, how much time did you have to prepare for this?
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  For the negotiation?
15. JRJoe Rogan
  No, so you had the negotiations and then once it was signed-
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  ... how much time did you have to prepare for the actual fight itself? And how mu- were you preparing already, hoping you were gonna have a, a boxing match?
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah, but it's different to like thinking that, "Oh, I might have a, uh, a boxing match, I wanna have a boxing match," than when you have a boxing match and knowing who you are going to fight.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm.
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  It's, it's something different. You know, you prepare... The real preparation start now. And, uh, between the moment that we signed the fight to the fight itself, it was, uh, over three months because I know that he wasn't my, my fan, you know, and, uh, I didn't have any, um... And it's not like I was in the gym training boxing every day, so it was basically four months. So I took-
21. JRJoe Rogan
  That's crazy.
22. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah, I took it, a, a moment for a pre-camp. Uh, I came back here, uh, because I was in Cameroon at time, then I came back here. My team and I, we work on like everything, start like a pre-camp, you know, just train to get in shape, start like sparring, and then we started, we started the sparring with three rounds.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  Wow.
24. FNFrancis Ngannou
  The first sparring was like three rounds, move around, see-
25. JRJoe Rogan
  Wow.
26. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... how we started to go, uh, work round after round, you know.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  What it m- s- what I thought when I saw the fight is imagine if you had just gone into professional boxing like 10 years ago, how well you would do. If you... No MMA, no kicking, no wrestling, just professional boxing.
28. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Uh...
29. JRJoe Rogan
  For you to do that well-
30. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I don't, I don't-
10:54 – 14:57
Aftermath and theatrics: judging, the knockdown, and the “bad teacher” dance
1. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. What was the experience like when it was all over? Like, what did it feel like when you just went 10 rounds and a lot of people, including myself, thought you won?
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah. Oh, I feel, I f- I f- I feel very great, you know like, um... Regardless of the result, for me, uh, knowing what I was going through, what was in my mind, like, "What's gonna happen into this fight?" First round, second round, then I get in the 10th round. Good. And I pretty... I feel like I wasn't doing bad. So for me, that was a win, that was a satisfaction, you know.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  The result was other part of it which didn't matter most. But I knew already that when or if ever we get... because I couldn't guarantee that we would get in the 10 round, but if ever we get there, I wasn't expecting to win.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  When you dropped him-
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Definitely not.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  When you dropped him in the second round, I jumped off the couch.
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  I jumped in the air.
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I will say something. You know, like, I want this from the moment that they accepted the fight, that they signed the fight, because I think, um, I was under- very underestimate, you know. They didn't know that I would... I could've...... do something, you know?
11. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  If they have known that beforehand, maybe this fight wouldn't have never happened-
13. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... because they would have see a risk and they wouldn't wanna take that risk. So this was basically, like, less re- zero risk for the-
15. JRJoe Rogan
  And it probably would have been different, too, because he, there was no footage to prepare for you.
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Mm-hmm.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  Right? Like, the only footage that he could prepare was y- watching you fight in MMA.
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes. He was, um ...
19. JRJoe Rogan
  There it is. Ar- why were you dancing in front of him?
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  When we start the fight, when the referee say, uh, "Okay, you guys go to your corner," he said, "Let me take you to school."
21. JRJoe Rogan
  Hmm.
22. FNFrancis Ngannou
  So that was, the dancing was like, "I think you're, um, you're a bad professor."
23. JRJoe Rogan
  (laughs)
24. FNFrancis Ngannou
  "You're a bad teacher." (laughs) That, that was the only reason why I did that.
25. JRJoe Rogan
  He's a funny guy, man.
26. FNFrancis Ngannou
  He, he's funny. He's very entertaining.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah. Oh, he's so entertaining.
28. FNFrancis Ngannou
  You know, like-
29. JRJoe Rogan
  He's so entertaining.
30. FNFrancis Ngannou
  He's just a show guy-
14:57 – 15:45
Why no Fury rematch: contract details, timing, and moving to Joshua
1. JRJoe Rogan
  Um, was there any talk after the fight about a rematch?
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes. There is a, uh, there was even a rematch clause, um... How, how do you call, like, um, first regard of rematch clause. There was some sort- something in the contract of a, about a rematch clause.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Was that if you beat him? Or if...
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Mm. Was if I get in the eighth round.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Really?
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  Wow.
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  So the deal of the rematch was if I get in the eighth round.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  So why didn't the rematch materialize?
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Uh, I think it's the timing. I think it's a matter of the timing.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  Hmm.
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  So, so you go from that fight to the Ant- Anthony Joshua fight.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes.
15:45 – 23:19
Anthony Joshua fight week: schedules, waiting games, and feeling drained
1. JRJoe Rogan
  So tell me about the preparation in leading up to that fight.
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  In fact, the preparation for the Anthony Joshua fight, then I started, you know, I, after having, like, four months of training camp for the Tyson Fury fight, I had this feeling, you know, and then-
3. JRJoe Rogan
  (sniffs)
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... I get little, um, I get a little confident. Now I know how he works, like, 10 rounds, and then, uh, was pretty good. You know, the Tyson Fury fight, um, I think I spar, I sparred, like, 10 rounds for, like, two weeks. Yeah, like, four, four sparring of 10 rounds barely, but the Ty- the Anthony Joshua fight, six week before the fight, I was... No, I wasn't 10. No, the Tyson Fury... Yeah. Y- uh, four weeks before the fight, I was already doing, like, 10 rounds and I was feeling good, you know, even little lighter. But things plays out different and I think, um, unlike the Tyson Fury fight that nobody expected me to do anything, here, they were expecting me to do something. So things play, played out little different. And then we get in the fight week and then, um, every time that we're gonna do something in the fight week, uh, whether it's media, they're gonna pick me up and then I get there, have to wait, like, one hour and half before he arrives. And that was, like, uh, maybe the third day of the week that Dewey, Dewey Cooper, he said, oh, he start to get really, uh, mad, uh, upset about it, like, "Yes, this is how they get, they do to get fighter tired." But at the time, I didn't know what was going on, you know?
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  So I'm like, "No, come, uh, relax, Dewey. It's okay." You know, I didn't know until we get to the fight day. Fight day, receive a email, pickup time. I mean, this one thing am- among others. Pickup time, uh, 10:30, from the hotel. And then when they say 10:30, by 10:20, there is a car in your door, waiting. We go to the supposedly fight, fight time, mean- between midnight to 1:00 AM. We get to...... to the arena, 10:45. There is a producer come into the locker room, say, "Oh, guy. We are l- running late on the broadcast. Now, we are ha- we, uh, we gonna go around 1:45 each." I'm like, "Okay, 1:45." It's 10:45, three hours. (sighs) Okay. You know?
7. JRJoe Rogan
  So what do you do? Do you eat? Do you sleep? What do you do when you know you, you have three more hours?
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  You don't know. You just stay there and then you have like a drug test guy around waiting for you to pee.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  How far before the fight do you eat?
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Usually, maybe like four, five hours. Yeah, like maybe five to six hours and then you get some snacks in between, you know. And then, um, yeah. It was 1:00, around 1:30 that he was, Anthony Joshua arrived. I saw on screen. I'm like, "So we're supposed to fight at 1:45. He's arriving at 1:30. What does that mean? He's going to..." So-
11. JRJoe Rogan
  So they're playing games.
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Until we, we fight at 1:00... At 3:30. We leave the-
13. JRJoe Rogan
  Oh, wow.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... locker room at 3:30. I have been in Saudi for almost two months training to fight between midnight and 1:00.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm.
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  That was my be- my training time. By 2:00, 3:00, I'm in bed asleep.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  So they wanted to keep you anxious, drag it on psychologically, put it in your head you don't know when you're gonna fight.
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Pretty much.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  But even at that time, I didn't know what was happening.
21. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
22. FNFrancis Ngannou
  It was after, after everything that I'm like, "What's going on?" Because I get in the f- I get to the point that I was so tired. I was in the locker room, eating meat then sit down, feeling asleep. Then I tell Eric, Eric Nyksick, like, "Bro, something wrong." (snaps fingers) I fe- I'm asleep. I feel like I wanna sleep. Like, I'm sweating. But we just keep, we just keep doing. So that fight, um... I mean, not to say Anthony Joshua couldn't win me. You know, I think if there is somebody that you, uh, you can lose against him, he, he is, he is the guy, you know? And, uh, he's the, one of the best of doing it, you know?
23. JRJoe Rogan
  (sighs)
24. FNFrancis Ngannou
  But... And this is definitely not on him because he wasn't the guy that was sending all those email, was organizing. So I'm not blaming about anything. But the organization, bro, nah. They did quite some stuff that wasn't fair, which on the Tyson fight was perfect. Everything was perfect because I wasn't a threat. I wasn't... Nobody cares about me. Everything was organized. We get there in the locker room, I think was two hours before the fight probably. Yeah.
25. JRJoe Rogan
  Hmm.
26. FNFrancis Ngannou
  So then that, I'm like...
27. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, Anthony Joshua is a veteran, you know? He's been in the boxing game for a long time and he knows-
28. FNFrancis Ngannou
  For sure.
29. JRJoe Rogan
  ... knows all the different tricks. They also obviously very much prepared for your style. They saw you fight Tyson Fury, so they had tape on you. As, uh, Tyson Fury did not have boxing tape. He didn't have any footage to study, but Anthony Joshua did. And it was very clear that he knew you had certain tendencies and there were certain things that you did with the Tyson Fury fight that he exploited in his fight.
30. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Maybe. And then, uh, I think, again, I think he's, uh, capable to figure out everybody. I think he's capable to win everybody. But in this case, I feel like in some ways, they stand on my way a little bit.
23:19 – 33:00
Rewatching the KO loss: confusion, memory gaps, and “something wasn’t right”
1. JRJoe Rogan
  Um, have you had a chance to go back and watch the Anthony Joshua fight?
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  What-
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I mean, I didn't... Yes, I, I watched it. What was your question?
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Um, wh- wh- w- w- d- what do you remember about the fight? What was different watching it?
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Oh. Even like, feeling it, it wasn't... Even before I went to watch it, I get in the, uh, ring, was, wasn't lo- was, you know, wasn't feeling myself. And the first round, when he knocked me down, like, I fell and I was like, "Did I slip?" Like, "What exactly knocked me down, make me fall?" Like, this punch, because I felt the punch, but it wasn't the punch that would knock me, knock me down, you know? So that's when I really get confused at that time. I'm like, "Damn. What?" But this is the thing. From that moment I get knocked down with the punch that-... wasn't that hard because-
7. JRJoe Rogan
  You don't think it was that hard?
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  No. He hit m- ... He hits my hand before hits my face, and I felt it. I felt the punch, but I wasn't on the floor. The first one.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  And then, uh, I st- ... I get count, then stood up. We finished the round. I went on my corner. But by the time I went on my corner, I never came back from that. I kept going and I remember being in my corner and Dewey was like, uh, "Don't go on southpaw. He's waiting you on southpaw. Do this jab, do this jab." That was it. That wa- ... That's from there, I don't remember when I left the stool to get in the second round.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, that was probably from the big punch in the second round too, right?
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah, but I'm talking about the first round.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  Right. But e- ... The memory afterwards is always gonna be cloudy after a knockout, especially a bad knockout like that.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah, but I'm remember- ... I remember exactly what's happened until we get to the stool. I remember being there.
15. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Like, ho- ... Star- ... Having blurry vision, like the guy was in front of me. The c- ... Uh, my, uh, team was in front of me speaking to me and then the voice was getting distance.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  So you think there was something wrong?
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I don't know if it's the... was the fatigue. I don't know what was it, but something wasn't right.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  So, something wasn't right on... Forget about the punches he landed.
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
21. JRJoe Rogan
  Something else was wrong. Is that what you're saying?
22. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah. Something was wrong.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  Do you think it's something you ate? Do you think it was something-
24. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I don't know. I, I-
25. JRJoe Rogan
  ... that someone gave you?
26. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I have no proof. I don't know if maybe it's-
27. JRJoe Rogan
  Did you get tested after the fight?
28. FNFrancis Ngannou
  No. Maybe it's the fact that I can... um, I get there at that time.
29. JRJoe Rogan
  So just the fatigue and the anxiety-
30. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I don't... Yeah.
33:00 – 51:25
What’s next: PFL MMA return, possible boxing run, and Jon Jones talk
1. JRJoe Rogan
  So, where do you stand now? What do you, what are you planning on doing now?
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  What do I plan on doing now? I think I still have couple in me.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Boxing fights?
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes, I have couple. Yeah, couple boxing fight. Ba- yeah, basically boxing fight. I have couple MMA fight and I think, um, I even think, like, uh, I'm gonna fight MMA fight by the end of the year, uh, with PFL. I'm gonna fight, um, might have to fight in Saudi again.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Really?
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  Well, one of things that has been discussed that, um, a- apparently the UFC might be open to because the Saudis throw around so much money-
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Mm-hmm.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  ... is, uh, the potential of a, um, a joint promotion-
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Cross-promotion.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  ... a cross-promotion with you versus Jon Jones.
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Make it happen.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  That is what the world wants to see. Because when you have a guy like yourself that, you know, knocks out Stipe, becomes the undisputed UFC heavyweight champion and then through negotiation only decides to relinquish the belt, everybody, even though Jon Jones is the champion now, everybody's like, "Yeah, but you didn't win the title against the champion." And you were the most compelling fight in the heavyweight division, for sure, for Jon Jones.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Hmm. Well, uh, that's what I wish, but, you know, in this, um, these, this, this takes a lot more than what I want or what I wish-
15. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  ... to happen.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  There's a lot going on.
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah, there is a lot going on.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  So, tell me w- what, uh, what is the status of your deal with the PFL now? So, how does that work?
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  It's working pretty good. We have a good relationship. I have some fight, um, again, I will be fighting by the end of the year and then, uh-
21. JRJoe Rogan
  Do you know who you're fighting?
22. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I think, Renan Ferreira is the guy.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah.
24. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Uh-
25. JRJoe Rogan
  That's the guy that knocked out Ryan Bader.
26. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
27. JRJoe Rogan
  He's dangerous. That guy is-
28. FNFrancis Ngannou
  He's dangerous.
29. JRJoe Rogan
  ... he's legit.
30. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I've been telling people about this guy for, what, almost two years?
51:25 – 1:22:16
Building PFL Africa: gyms, coaches, and an ecosystem so talent can stay home
1. JRJoe Rogan
  No, I agree, I agree. And so now, the PFL and Bellator are one organization now, right? The PFL acquired Bellator?
2. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes.
3. JRJoe Rogan
  Is that what's going on?
4. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yes.
5. JRJoe Rogan
  Do the Saudis have something to do with that as well? Don't they own part of it?
6. FNFrancis Ngannou
  They invest in the PFL, yes, in the main PFL, because there is a main PFL, uh, a house PFL that has, like, the PFL and the Bellator now.
7. JRJoe Rogan
  Hmm.
8. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah. And then now they are having, like, a P- regional PFL, like a PF- PFL MENA that launch this year, and then PFL Africa, that's launching next year.
9. JRJoe Rogan
  And that's through sure?
10. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.
11. JRJoe Rogan
  And so you're a part of that as well, right?
12. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Oh yeah, that's, that was the biggest, uh, I think that was the biggest reason for me in that contract, the PFL Africa part was the most important one in that contract. You know? Like, um, before that, I was trying to, like, even to the UFC I have requested to be, like, "Oh, I wanna be the UFC ambassador in Africa. I want to do something out there." I'm like, "Oh no, we don't know. You know, this is not... We don't..." And then I get the PFL, they say, "Okay, we doing this, we'll do that." They show me the road map, like, "Okay, we launch PFL Africa 2025, you are the PFL, uh, Africa chairman." I'm like, "Which extent?" Because I don't want that bullshit of paper chairman or whatever it is.
13. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm-hmm.
14. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Like, at which extent, like, what exactly are you seeing in PFL Africa? And then they pl- put it out and give, show me some element. I'm like, "Good, then I'm on board."
15. JRJoe Rogan
  Hmm. Well, that is one good thing about going over to the PFL, because you, you have so much value to them. Like, for you coming over, you were the undisputed heavyweight champion of the UFC. You come over to the PFL, everybody knows who you are, and now it elevates the PFL. So it's nice 'cause it'll allow you to do more things.
16. FNFrancis Ngannou
  And, uh, to be honest, one thing, I have a healthy relationship, you know? It's, it's peaceful. Get to the point of my life that I really get tired or sick of drama.
17. JRJoe Rogan
  Hmm.
18. FNFrancis Ngannou
  (laughs) Sometime I just get into something, into some... Find myself in the middle of some drama, and then I just walk away. Whatever you wanna say, you say. Some- you might say I disrespect you. You say, oh, I this, I that. Bro, I don't have so much energy to give into that.
19. JRJoe Rogan
  So that was part of what was going on with the UFC? There was a lot of drama.
20. FNFrancis Ngannou
  That's, yeah, that's... And that will take a lot out of you. You get to the point that, yo, I'm like, whew, I want j- I just want this to be over.
21. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
22. FNFrancis Ngannou
  I just wanna get... To be over.
23. JRJoe Rogan
  Right.
24. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Get back to my life, but you are already in the middle.
25. JRJoe Rogan
  S-
26. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Whether you wanna go back, you have to deal with drama. If you have to go forward, you have to deal with drama, so you better keep going forward. (laughs)
27. JRJoe Rogan
  Yeah, especially, I mean, like, y- how much time do you have left, Raul? I mean, how many more years you think you're gonna be fighting?
28. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah. And doesn't matter. I mean, uh, soon 38, and I think I'm gonna be... I really wanna retired in my, um...... as I said, I want to leave the sport before the sport leaves me.
29. JRJoe Rogan
  Mm. Smart.
30. FNFrancis Ngannou
  Yeah.