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Building a world-class sales org | Jason Lemkin (SaaStr)

Jason Lemkin created and runs SaaStr, the world’s largest community for B2B/SaaS founders, and is the managing director of SaaStr Fund, a $90 million venture capital firm specializing in early-stage enterprise investments. He is also the mastermind behind two major tech conferences each year—one in the Bay Area, drawing in over 15,000 people, and another in Europe, with a crowd of more than 3,000 SaaS executives, founders, and entrepreneurs. Before SaaStr, Jason wore many hats: CEO and co-founder of EchoSign (later bought by Adobe), vice president at Adobe Systems, co-founder and president of NanoGram Devices Corp., vice president of NeoPhotonics, and a senior director at BabyCenter. In our conversation, we discuss: • How far you should go without a salesperson • Signs it’s time to hire salespeople • Why you need to hire two salespeople • How to compensate your salespeople • How to interview salespeople • When to hire a VP of Sales • How to prevent their flaming out • How to scale your sales org • How to improve the relationship between your sales and product teams • Much more — Brought to you by: • CommandBar—AI-powered user assistance for modern products and impatient users: https://www.commandbar.com/lenny • Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny • LinkedIn Ads—Reach professionals and drive results for your business: https://www.linkedin.com/podlenny Find the transcript and references at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/building-a-world-class-sales-org Where to find Jason Lemkin: • X: https://twitter.com/jasonlk • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonmlemkin/ • Website: https://www.saastr.com/ Where to find Lenny: • Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com • X: https://twitter.com/lennysan • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/ In this episode, we cover: (00:00) Jason’s background (06:18) The importance of sales in B2B businesses (11:23) Signs that you should start hiring salespeople (14:19) Attributes to look for in early sales reps (19:08) Hiring a VP of Sales (26:43) The role of a VP of Sales (30:06) Interviewing salespeople (45:16) Determining sales compensation and quota (53:34) Transitioning from 100% commission to a smaller percentage (56:58) Indicators of a hard-to-sell product (59:39) Scaling the sales organization (01:05:26) Understanding sales roles and titles (01:10:02) Product involvement in sales, and vice versa (01:20:32) Thoughts on product teams taking on P&L responsibilities (01:27:23) One thing founders can do to become better at sales (01:31:02) The ideal trial length for a free trial sales team (01:39:50) Closing thoughts (01:41:43) Lightning round Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com. Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Jason LemkinguestLenny Rachitskyhost
Feb 17, 20242h 1mWatch on YouTube ↗

At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Jason Lemkin’s playbook for building and scaling B2B sales teams

  1. Jason Lemkin lays out a practical, often counterintuitive blueprint for when and how to build a B2B sales organization, starting with founders closing the first 10 customers themselves. He explains why your first two sales hires must be people you’d personally buy from, why you should delay hiring a VP of Sales until at least two reps are reliably hitting quota, and how to structure compensation so reps are accretive rather than a cash drain. The conversation dives into the critical (and tense) relationship between product and sales—how product leaders should engage in sales cycles, handle feature requests, and think about free trials and pricing. Jason also touches on event strategy, arguing that small, high‑quality customer gatherings are often more valuable than mid‑tier conferences, and urges product leaders to make this “the year of the customer.”

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Founders must close the first ~10 customers and be honest about their motion.

If your earliest unaffiliated customers need hand-holding, security reviews, and deployment help, you do not have a pure PLG motion—ignoring that and forcing self‑serve will likely kill the business. Founders, even if they dislike “sales,” are usually excellent in the middle of deals and must learn to ask for the next step.

Hire two AEs early, not one—and only if you’d buy from them.

You need an A/B test on humans, which means hiring two initial reps and comparing their performance and style. Ignore shiny logos on resumes and prioritize reps who deeply understand your product and can explain and sell it in a way that convinces you personally; early leads are too precious to give to someone you wouldn’t buy from.

Delay the VP of Sales until two reps are reliably hitting quota.

A VP of Sales’ real job is taking you from roughly 3 to 300 reps, not finding product‑market fit and being your first closer. Hiring that role before a basic sales motion is working almost always fails and burns cash; when you do hire them, they should spend 20–30 hours a week in deals and be willing to carry a quota.

Structure sales comp so reps can win early, then become clearly accretive.

Pay roughly market OTE (often 50/50 base/variable), let new reps keep 100% of what they close for their first quarter to ramp, and then aim for them to close 3–5x their OTE annually depending on deal size. Don’t obsess over squeezing OTE down by 10–20k; the real question is whether they can consistently sell multiples of what they take home.

Make product a core weapon in big deals and formalize sales’ roadmap influence.

Great heads of product deeply engage in sales, especially large or complex deals, where their product fluency and authority can make or break contracts. To avoid chaos, give sales a fixed quarterly “budget” of roadmap influence (e.g., 10% of capacity) and force them to prioritize, instead of reacting ad‑hoc to every big prospect request.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

We’re not really selling in B2B. We’re solving problems.

Jason Lemkin

Those first couple reps have to be people you would buy your own product from.

Jason Lemkin

If you hire a VP of Sales before two reps are hitting quota, there’s approaching a 100% chance of failure.

Jason Lemkin

Every time you rip a customer off, you lose compounding.

Jason Lemkin

Make this the year of the customer. Ship three great things this year—great, not good.

Jason Lemkin

When and how to hire your first salespeople as a founderCriteria and interview tactics for early sales hires and VP of SalesSales compensation, quota design, and early-stage unit economicsStructuring and scaling the sales org (SDRs, AEs, managers, VPs)Product–sales collaboration: feature requests, roadmap influence, and trialsFreemium, free trials, pricing, and churn in PLG and SaaSRunning conferences and events as a growth and community strategy

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