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How to be the best coach to product people | Petra Wille (Strong Product People)

Petra Wille is an independent product leadership coach who’s been helping product teams expand their skill sets since 2013. She’s also the author of Strong Product People, which she published in 2021. Alongside her freelance work, Petra curates and co-organizes Mind The Product Engage Hamburg. She started her career as a software developer and in 2008 went to work at Xing, a German social media site, where she learned from two incredible product leaders: Marty Cagan and Jason Goldberg. In today’s podcast, we talk about Petra’s book, and how to help your team grow as a product leader. Petra also shares how to improve your storytelling skills, get better at public speaking, and why community is so important for product managers. — Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-be-the-best-coach-to-product — Where to find Petra Wille: • Twitter: https://twitter.com/loomista • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petra-wille-b8b1329/?originalSubdomain=de • Website: https://www.petra-wille.com/ — Where to find Lenny: • Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com • Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/ — Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible: • Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny • Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups • Assembly: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=nov27 — Referenced: • PMwheel framework: https://www.strongproductpeople.com/pmwheel • Marty Cagan’s assessment: https://www.svpg.com/coaching-tools-the-assessment/ • PM Daisy: https://pmdaisy.com/ • The Eisenhower matrix for prioritization: https://www.productplan.com/glossary/eisenhower-matrix/ • Continuous Discovery Habits: Discover Products that Create Customer Value and Business Value: https://www.amazon.com/Continuous-Discovery-Habits-Discover-Products/dp/1736633309 • Mochary Method Curriculum: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18FiJbYn53fTtPmphfdCKT2TMWH-8Y2L-MLqDk-MFV4s/edit • Matt Mochary on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary/ • Hans Rosling’s Ted talks: https://www.ted.com/speakers/hans_rosling • Sarah Kay: If I should have a daughter: https://www.ted.com/talks/sarah_kay_if_i_should_have_a_daughter? • Nobody Wants to Read Your Sh*t: Why That is and What You Can Do About It: https://www.amazon.com/Nobody-Wants-Read-Your-Sh-ebook/dp/B01GZ1TJBI • Selling the Dream: https://www.amazon.com/Selling-Dream-Guy-Kawasaki/dp/0887306004 • Nancy Duarte’s website: https://www.duarte.com/ • The 72 Rules of Storytelling: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/72-rules-commercial-storytelling-jeremy-waite/ • The Art of Thinking Clearly:https://www.amazon.com/Art-Thinking-Clearly-Rolf-Dobelli/dp/0062219693 • Outcomes Over Output: https://www.amazon.com/Outcomes-Over-Output-customer-behavior/dp/1091173265 • Martin Erickson’s Decision Stack: https://martineriksson.com/the-decision-stack • Present Yourself Kickstarter: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/womentalkdesign/present-yourself-a-public-speaking-book • The Product Experience podcast: https://www.mindtheproduct.com/the-product-experience/ • Product podcast in German: https://www.produktmenschen.de/ • Watch New Amsterdam on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/stream-tv/new-amsterdam • Harvest bookkeeping and time tracking: https://www.getharvest.com/ • Qanto: https://qonto.com/en — In this episode, we cover: (00:00) Petra’s background (05:51) The things leaders of product teams don’t always understand (09:33) Why Petra wrote the book Strong Product People to help managers of product teams  (11:21) The five ingredient coaching method (17:00) Why Petra usually recommends starting coaching with a development plan (19:31) Why weekly time should be carved out for ‘people development’ (21:16) How to define a competent PM in your organization and tools to help you (24:06) Petra’s PM Wheel and how she developed it (27:36) Other info product leads will find useful in Petra’s book (30:46) Tips for coaching your team (35:17) How to improve your storytelling (40:56) How to get better at public speaking (44:45) Why it’s important to develop good storytelling and public speaking skills  (53:36) The importance of a community of practice for product people (56:14) Why people tend to stick around when they are supported and growing in a community (57:53) What to look for in a community (1:06:48) Lightning round — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Petra WilleguestLenny Rachitskyhost
Nov 26, 20221h 12mWatch on YouTube ↗

At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Coaching, storytelling, and community: leveling up modern product managers

  1. Product leadership coach and author Petra Wille joins Lenny Rachitsky to unpack how managers can become excellent coaches for product managers, why storytelling and public speaking are critical career skills, and how community accelerates growth. She outlines a simple five-part framework for developing PMs: define ‘good’ in your context, understand where each PM is now, align on a shared vision, build a concrete development plan, and follow up consistently. Petra also shares practical techniques for improving storytelling and public speaking, emphasizing deliberate practice, audience-friendly language, and reusable story formats. Finally, they explore the outsized impact of strong product communities—both internal communities of practice and external networks—in driving learning, retention, and shared standards of excellence.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Start coaching with a clear definition of a ‘good PM’ in your context.

Most managers hold an implicit, fuzzy view of what good looks like; Petra urges leaders to explicitly define the skills, knowledge, and personality traits they value, using or customizing existing competency models so PMs have a concrete compass for growth.

Anchor development in a simple, living plan—then follow up relentlessly.

Rather than over-engineering frameworks, co-create a quarterly development plan around 1–2 focus areas (e.g., storytelling, prioritization), break it into small, realistic actions, and revisit progress regularly in one-on-ones so it doesn’t get lost in day-to-day execution.

Use multi-perspective assessments to understand where each PM is today.

Tools like Petra’s PM Wheel™ and other published PM assessments can be adapted to your environment, and should ideally include self-assessment, manager assessment, and peer/team input to reveal blind spots and inform targeted coaching.

Treat storytelling as a design task that demands time and iteration.

Compelling stories rarely emerge spontaneously; Petra recommends budgeting serious time (e.g., a couple of weeks in small daily chunks) to craft narratives, test them with different audiences, strip out jargon, and prepare multiple versions (short, medium, long; spoken, written, visual).

Storytelling and public speaking are career accelerators, not nice-to-haves.

Petra sees weak storytelling and public speaking as a common career stall for PMs—rallying teams around a shared goal, evangelizing strategy, and influencing stakeholders all depend on these skills, which can be built gradually through small, safe speaking opportunities and structured feedback.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

“It’s not a role, it’s a career, being in product.”

Petra Wille

“How should you help people grow if you have no clue what their role actually is all about?”

Petra Wille

“Getting promoted is way harder if you're not good in telling stories and rallying the team behind a shared goal.”

Petra Wille

“Consistency beats intensity… smaller chunks of people development in your calendar are better than the big bang 360-degree reviews.”

Petra Wille

“Training budgets are expensive. Communities are a pretty cheap way of doing people development.”

Petra Wille

Five-part framework for coaching and developing product managersDefining what ‘good’ product management looks like in your contextUsing skills frameworks and assessments (e.g., PM Wheel™) to map strengths and gapsPractical storytelling and public speaking techniques for PMs and leadersDesigning and leveraging personal development plans and follow-up ritualsValue and mechanics of product communities and communities of practiceHow to build and sustain healthy, high-signal product communities

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