The Mel Robbins PodcastThe Body Reset: How Women Should Eat & Exercise for Health, Fat Loss, & Energy | Dr. Stacy Sims
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,069 words- 0:00 – 11:42
Welcome
- MRMel Robbins
(instrumental music plays) It often has felt like, to me, as I've learned more and more, like, oh my God, wait a minute, we've just kinda treated women and our health almost like if you're golfing. There's the tee that's further back for the guys, and there's the tee that's a little bit, like, closer for the women, and we're just gonna treat everybody the same but shrink it a little bit.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Well, take running shoes-
- MRMel Robbins
Yeah.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... or a bicycle. All they do is they make it a little bit smaller, maybe put some pink on it and say it's a woman's product. (screen swooshes) We experience things differently as women than men do, but that's not ever really explained. When we look at the trends of the fasted training, don't eat before, it's all on male data. If you look at most women who make a point to get up, do some training, go exercise, and after four weeks of following the same kinda training program as their male partner, their male partner has gotten leaner, fitter, better focus, all of the things that you want outta fitness. And the woman's like, "How come I'm fatter and tired?" (screen swooshes) We have gotten into a societal idea that we all live in the same kind of temperature. We have automatic garage door openers. We are, have created this environment where we don't move, and if we're talking about, "How do we just make one small change to improve our mental health?" that's exercise. (clock ticks)
- MRMel Robbins
Hey, it's your friend Mel. Welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast. I am absolutely thrilled that you're here. I am on such a... I don't even know what to say it. I feel so excited about what we're talking about today. It is gonna be liberating. It is such an honor to spend time with you, to be together with you, but especially when we're gonna have a conversation that is gonna light you on fire and make you feel both mad and empowered. Let's fricking go. And if you're a new listener, I wanna take a moment and just welcome you. Welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast family. And boy, have you picked a winner of a conversation to listen to. Because you made the time to listen to this particular episode, here's what I already know about you. You're the type of person who values your health. You want the facts. You want the science. You want results, and that's what you deserve. And if someone sent this to you, that's really cool because they care about you, and they want you to have the science and the facts and the correct information so that you can take better care of yourself too. I cannot wait for you and I to learn from Dr. Staci Sims today. Now, Dr. Sims is a globally recognized expert in women's health, exercise physiology, and nutrition science. She has a PhD in exercise physiology and nutrition science. She's on the faculty at Stanford, teaching about lifestyle medicine, and at Auckland University of Technology, teaching sports medicine. She is a renowned researcher and has directed research programs at Stanford, Auckland University of Technology, and the University of Waikato, and she has published, check this out, 107 peer-reviewed research papers, which in normal-person speak is a ton. Her research has revolutionized how women, mm-hmm, women approach fitness, especially during menopause and hormone changes. She's the author of two groundbreaking books, Roar and The Next Level. She also has a daughter and, just like me, is in her mid-50s, juggling a big career, a marriage, motherhood, and hormone changes. She has so much to teach you today, and we are gonna go straight for the bro science. We are going to tell you the mistakes and the lies that you've been told. We're gonna tell you the truth based on the research about what works for women and what doesn't. We're gonna teach you why the things that you've been doing have been backfiring. It's because you have been exercising like a dude, and it is time for you to exercise like a woman. I am so fired up for you to be here. I am fired up to learn with you, and I am fired up for all of the women and the young women in your life that you're gonna share this with. So please help me welcome Dr. Staci Sims to the Mel Robbins Podcast. Dr. Staci Sims, I am so thrilled that you're here in our Boston studios. I have been waiting a long time to be able to sit down, meet you, and learn from you. I'm s- just thrilled that you're here.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Oh, thanks for having me. I'm excited.
- MRMel Robbins
Awesome.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I'm gonna have lots of fun.
- MRMel Robbins
And we have a lot to dig into, and so here's where I wanna start. Could you speak directly-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
... to the person that's listening? And this is somebody who doesn't have a lot of time, but they made the time-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... to be here to learn from you.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Okay.
- MRMel Robbins
What could that person expect might change about their life or feel different if they take everything to heart that you're about to teach us and share with us today, and they use it in their own life?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I find there's two big things that often happen. One, most women become more empowered and have better body positivity. And two, they have a sense of separation from the stress and their own selves, so they're able to take that step back from the stress of everything that's happening. It's kinda like that pause moment, 'cause when you are taking care of your body, then it feeds back into a lot of positive metrics. So, the big thing that I love is watching women go through an evolution to go from being not so confident in themselves to having such empowerment to be able to stand up and say, "I own this space, and I'm taking it."
- MRMel Robbins
You know, one thing that strikes me about you already is that you actually exude that.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Oh, thanks. (laughs)
- MRMel Robbins
You know, you have a level of presence and power in your body, and it's not just because you are in incredibly great shape in terms of muscle definition, but i- i- it's, it's actually something that's noticeable, and so I think this goes beyond sort of that sense of separation of stress. Like, what I experience in just sitting here with you is that you're actually embodied in the present and in your body.And a lot of times when we're stressed out, especially, you know, as caregivers and the amount of stuff that we do are up in our heads and disconnected from our body.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
And so I'm excited to really learn from you because I wanna feel more like the centered confidence and calmness that you just seem to move through a space with.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I'm good with a facade. No, just kidding.
- MRMel Robbins
(laughs)
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Thanks. Um, yeah, it does come from a lot of pushback I've had in my life, so it's like putting... being put into a pretty male dominant situation, you have to find your feet and how do you move through that space, and I found it through exercise, strength, all the stuff that we're gonna talk about.
- MRMel Robbins
Amazing. So you have such an incredible background and I'm actually gonna read it because it's quite a bit. You know, I've talked about this in... when I was introducing you, but you have a PhD in exercise physiology, you're a researcher, you're a former professional athlete, you now train professional athletes, you're an expert in exercise physiology, you have a long list of other specialties like cardiovascular disease prevention, thermoregulation, women's health, you are a pioneering researcher that participates in her own studies, and you have this incredible mantra, Dr. Simms, "Women are not small men."
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
What does that mean?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
(laughs) Yeah. Um, I laugh when people say, "Women are not small men," because when we hear it, we're like, "Oh, yeah, it's right." But it started from when I was teaching at Stanford and wanted to wake some of the undergrads up after, you know, lunch and afternoon sleepies come in and I was teaching about sex differences in training or high performance, so, uh, we'd started with women are not small men. And people are like, "Well, of course not." Like, that's... You know, women aren't small men. But what I mean by that is everything from what happens in utero until we die is different for women than men. So when we talk about women are not small men and we see all the guidelines that are out there for exercise, all the guidelines out there for mental health, for the connections, the sociocultural pressures, we experience things differently as women than men do, but that's not ever really explained. So when we say women are not small men, it makes people take that pause and ask, "Well, what do you mean by that? What topic?" So today, what I mean by women are not small men is we're gonna dive in to exercise, especially how what we do should change as we move through our lives.
- MRMel Robbins
What does that motto women are not small men mean in practice?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I think when we look right now at what's being portrayed in social media, fitness trends, the medical trends-
- 11:42 – 18:00
Common Fitness Mistakes Women Make
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Perfect.
- MRMel Robbins
So what's the most common mistake that women make by following male-centric fitness advice?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Uh, they don't get any results and they end up what we call tired but wired. I mean, if you look at most women who make a point to get up, do some training, go exercise, and it happens so often after four weeks of following the same kind of training program as their male partner, their male partner's gotten leaner, fitter, better, um, cognition-... you know, focus all of the things that you want out of fitness, and the woman's like, "How come I'm fatter and tired and I don't have any, like, increase in my fitness like my partner does?" And I see it all the time and I'm always explaining, "Well one, your partner might get up and go faceted training. Women's bodies don't respond well to faceted training."
- MRMel Robbins
What's faceted training? I don't even know what the heck this is. Like, what is faceted training?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
(laughs) Yeah. Faceted training means you're not having any food before you go do exercise.
- MRMel Robbins
Oh, so like... Well, that's what I would always do.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
Like, I would always... Literally, like I'm gonna eat after-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
... because my husband would eat after-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
... and then we would g- I... My mouth is on the floor, you can see this on YouTube, but, like, as you're listening, I- I'm, I'm processing this because I'm thinking how often I've been pissed off at Chris, my husband-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... because we will take on some challenge together and I'm like, "This is not fair."
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
Like, "How is it that this is actually making you lose weight and I feel like I'm puffier and fluffier and tired and pissed off?"
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yep.
- MRMel Robbins
And I'm following the same steps, I'm doing the intermittent fasting, I'm not eating beforehand, I'm slamming the thing after, I'm doing... And I'm like, "What the hell is going on?" And i- this is because he's male and I'm female.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yep, exactly. And it comes really to the brain, right? So when we start looking just at first thing you get up and our responses are different, where women's brains will start going, "Okay, where's the food to come in to help bring my stress hormones down and get me started for the day?"
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
And men, by the nature of being XY, their brain's like, "Eh, okay. I'm gonna supply some amino acids and some blood sugar and let's get on with the day, then we'll find some food, that's fine." But women's brain, specifically what we call the hypothalamus, that is really sensitive to blood sugar and food coming in. So if you get up and you start your, your exercise without any food, the hypothalamus is like, "Wait a second, this is a stress to the body that I need to really try to figure out. But if I don't have food to counter the fuel that the muscles are needing from a contraction, I need to find a way to supply that fuel." So it goes into a little bit of a tizzy, and one of the first things that starts to get broken down is your muscle mass, 'cause muscle is a pretty active tissue. And the hypothalamus is like, "Well, I don't know if I'm gonna be able to supply the food that this muscle needs if I don't have any food coming in." So it's a very small amount of food that a woman needs first thing in the morning to then go be successful in her training, and it's even if you're going for a walk. A lot of women will get up and go for a walk on the auspice of-
- MRMel Robbins
Are you with me? Like, I, l- are you in my house with me?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Maybe.
- MRMel Robbins
E, Stacey, I'm, I'm sitting here thinking to myself, I think a lifetime of messaging about, like, thin is preferable-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... and that I wanna maximize calories burned-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
... so I'm gonna get up and I'm gonna have a cup of coffee because I'm tired and I'm gonna wire myself-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yep.
- MRMel Robbins
... and then I, you know, back in the day would be going for a run or going to some sort of, like, fitness class. Uh, you know, I'm old enough to have been doing step aerobics and everything else-
- 18:00 – 28:41
Why Women Should Be Lifting Weights
- MRMel Robbins
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Right. And one of the things that, um, has come up recently in conversations where, uh, some women who've just started into strength training realm or have dropped all of their, you know, big cardio walking, 'cause we all come from the 80s and 90s of let's do 90 minutes of aerobics and, and that's not appropriate, so they've gotten out of that mentality, but...They'll see other women at the gym who are on the elliptical or treadmill or out running-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... and they look really lean.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
And they're like, "Well, I don't understand. I kind of wanna look like that, but I know that I need to be doing strength training, so I'm confused." The women that are 40 plus who are doing the cardio, so for the most part, they're gonna be what we call skinny fat. So that means that they're not gonna have a lot of quality muscle. There's gonna be a lot of- of fatty tissue within the muscle and their bones are gonna be like chalk. Because if we are doing all that cardio work and we're not looking at how our bodies are aging and what we need, we need the food before the training, we need to put in some strength training, then we're going to continuously be breaking down the tissue that we want to keep to age well.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So when we're talking about that mentality of, "Well, what do I do?" It's like these small steps of, yeah, let's have some food before. Let's look at how we are dosing our exercise. What's ki- kinds of intensities? Let's bring in some strength training 'cause all of those are gonna feed forward to having our lean mass, having really strong bones, having really good neuroplasticity, so that means how your brain changes in a positive way. So as we age, we don't get dementia. So these are all the things that I would rather women focus on than the drive from the '90s to be Kate Moss thin.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Because on the outside, that drive to be super thin is killing us on the inside.
- MRMel Robbins
Wow. You- you mentioned protein coffee.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
Can you explain what that is and how that might satisfy the first takeaway, which is eat before you move in the morning?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah. So a lot of women don't have an appetite first thing in the morning.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I'm one of those, but I know that I need fuel. So I'm very much a espresso addict. I love it. And one of the simple things that I do is I make a double espresso at night and I mix some protein powder into my almond milk or whatever milk you want, and then I put the hot coffee in there and I put it in the fridge overnight, and then it's my go-to first thing in the morning, where then I'm getting my 30 grams of protein, I'm getting my caffeine, it tastes like a latte, I'm good to go. And so that's the first hit. It's the first eating opportunity to bring in some of that protein that we need. And if you're gonna go do any kind of exercise knowing that exercise mutes your appetite, then it also helps with that recovery part because you're gonna have those amino acids circulating. Your brain's gonna say, "Hey, yeah, okay, I've got stuff to rebuild tissue." So it's a really good way of being able to have what you need without feeling overfull and still enjoying some of the good things of life, like coffee.
- MRMel Robbins
Well, you've changed my life already-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yay!
- MRMel Robbins
... because I've got two takeaways. The first one is... And I still wanna stay on it so I actually understand why eating first thing before I move my body and having fuel first thing in the morning is actually super important. And I wanna unpack that a little bit more, but I wanna hover on the protein coffee because I'm drinking it right now. Mm. You made me one in our studios here in Boston. This is gonna change my life and here's why. I have struggled forever since I've learned, and a lot of us are learning as women, that focusing on more protein and especially getting protein first thing in the morning is super important. And I'm always struggling with how the hell am I gonna get 30 grams of protein first thing in the morning without choking down 10 egg whites?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
And what do I do if I'm on the go? And what do I do if I'm tired of eggs?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
(laughs)
- MRMel Robbins
And what do I do if I don't have a blender near me and my stuff? What do I... Like, and so you literally took a scoop of protein, shoved it in milk, put in espresso, stirred it up and put on ice. It tastes like a freaking milkshake. And what I love about this is that, A, I can make it the night before, B, it's 30 grams of protein in a cup, which, C, means I could even take this on the walk with me. I could take this in the car if I'm dropping my kids off somewhere. I could make this on the road.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
Like, this is such an incredible tip. So thank you for that.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
You're welcome.
- MRMel Robbins
And what I wanna do though, Dr. Tsim, is you mentioned that when women wake up, our brains are different than the guys and our stress levels are higher, and it is important to understand that and to give yourself a little bit of fuel.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
What happens in your body if you do start eating breakfast in the morning or you... 'Cause a lot of women skip it. A lot of women are now intermittent fasting. A lot of people are waiting until noon. A lot of people don't wanna eat before they exercise because they don't want cramps or they, like, actually wanna maximize calorie burn, but what is the benefit to a woman in particular first thing in the morning if you give yourself fuel?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
There's a few things to unpack there.
- 28:41 – 36:13
The Ideal Breakfast According to a Top Nutrition Scientist
- MRMel Robbins
tired.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
So what would be the ideal breakfast for anyone, whether, like, and let's just talk about the person who just wants to move more, they wanna take better care of their body, they wanna understand how their body works so that you're getting better results and you're feeling better in your life. So what would breakfast look like just on an average morning if, you know, for anybody?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah, that ...
- MRMel Robbins
(clears throat)
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I will say that it's a hard one because people have different food preferences. How about an avatar?
- MRMel Robbins
What's an avatar?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
A, a makeup person.
- MRMel Robbins
Okay, a makeup person.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Makeup person. So we'll say there's a woman who is plant-based but not vegetarian.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
You know, so she has a preference for plants. Three kids, you know, super busy, wakes up, has been waking up tired but wired, didn't sleep well, was like, "Okay, I need to make this change." Never hungry in the morning. So we can split her breakfast. It could be overnight oats, which is chia seeds, oatmeal, some, um, milk or, or oat milk to soak it.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Then when she gets up, she's like, "I'm gonna split that in half. The first half I'm gonna add some berries and maybe another tablespoon of Greek yogurt 'cause then I'm gonna get some protein, some carbohydrate, some fiber, and it's gonna calm me down. It's gonna tell my brain, 'Yep, ready to go.'"
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Then you either are going out for your walk. I mean, maybe you're gonna do some home strength training. Maybe you're meeting a friend for a session. Maybe you're taking 15 minutes of just (exhales) breath work to, to bring yourself down, especially if you're the avatar of three kids and a busy life-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... just taking that moment to put yourself first.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
And then when you get back, maybe it's an hour, hour and a half later, you have the second half. The second half of those overnight oats with a few more tablespoons of Greek yogurt and some nuts and berries 'cause then you're getting the protein, carbohydrate. So you've actually split your breakfast, but you've given your body the benefit of food on different eating opportunities without being overfull. But at the end, you end up with 30 grams of protein over the course of a couple of hours.So it's easy, you can mix it up, do it the night before. You know that, "I'm not that hungry, but if I have a little bit..." And then over the course of a couple of weeks, you're gonna find that you're gonna wake up going, "Yeah, I need some food." And this is kind of a reset of your circadian rhythm. Your body is starting to fall in line. Your hypothalamus is understanding. Your appetite hormones are starting to work properly. And when all of that feeds forward, then you're gonna start to see changes in body composition because you're having better sleep, 'cause we can't change anything if our sleep is p-perturbed. So the more we focus on how are we going to work with our body's natural rhythms and the way that our hormones work, the more it feeds into better parasympathetic drive for better sleep.
- MRMel Robbins
I have just so screwed this up. Like I literally wake up, I delay the coffee, I exercise on an empty stomach. I then have my coffee, which I'm then drinking on an empty stomach-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... which means I've now maximized stressing myself out, and then I'm slamming something that has 30, 45 grams of protein after I work out. And so what have you done if you are the kind of person like I am that you've bought into all the BS and you've basically been starving yourself in the morning? And even if you get out for a walk, how are you kind of actually not only not getting the benefit, but you're making it worse? What's happening in, like, the person's body when you do not feed yourself first thing in the morning as a woman?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah, I always bring it down to, what are we doing when we, when we want to exercise, right? We're looking for better blood glucose control. We're looking for better bone. We're looking for better muscle. If you're not eating, then you are not going to get better at any of that stuff, because the body, again, is like, "I need fuel for the stress that's occurring, and I need fuel for the exercise."
- MRMel Robbins
So if you've been brainwashed like I am-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
... and you're exercising because you are trying to, like, lose weight or you're trying to look thin-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
... what is happening if I continue to go down that route where I don't eat before I exercise and I'm basically starving myself and I'm going for my walk and I'm delaying food?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
You lose muscle. And then the other thing, when we look at women who are late 30s, early 40s onwards-
- 36:13 – 47:51
Why Strong Women Stress Less
- MRMel Robbins
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
And, you know, one thing I wanna ask is, does this work for everyone? You know, I got this listener question, 'cause when people found out that you were coming, oh my god, it was like our website crashed.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
(laughs)
- MRMel Robbins
Ruby wrote in, "Why do some people have natural muscle tone and some of us can eat right, work out, and we are still flabby and not toned?"
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
There are lots of things on this, and I wish that Ruby was in this room 'cause then I could say, "Well, let's look at, um, your morphology. So your body type." So there are some women who have, uh...... better predisposition for building muscle, and we call those mesomorphic. And then we have other women who struggle r- really hard to put m- m- muscle mass on, and they tend to be a little bit flabbier, and that is more of our endomorphic. And then we have in the middle, the ectomorphic that are the super skinny Kate Moss, and-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... most of the time, people are a mix of that.
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So when you look at those different muscle types, and you're looking at doing all the work and not getting any benefit, I wanna see what kind of training you're doing. Because if we are looking at when you're eating and how you're complementing your exercise, then we can make gains. And every woman's a little bit different. Like my sister, she isn't so into athletics and stuff that I am. We grew up in the same household, but I was always out building tree forts, and she was in, reading books.
- MRMel Robbins
Uh-huh.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
But over the past year, she's really put herself into getting stronger and strength training. Body composition's changing. Her grip strength is stronger. And she's like, "I never really thought that lifting weights would help me change my body composition." I was like, "Why have you not thought of that?" Like, if you're lifting under load, you build muscle. She's like, "But then that's weight on the scale, and I was always afraid of the weight on the scale, not the outcome of looking better."
- MRMel Robbins
Right, and then we also, because we've been so gaslit to think that it's about being so thin-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Right.
- MRMel Robbins
... that, and that's what's desirable, that you hear, "Build muscle," and you're like, "But I don't wanna bulk up. I'm actually trying to lean down."
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
And what you're saying is, "No, no, no, this is actually like putting on your own Spanx with your muscles."
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Right.
- MRMel Robbins
It tightens you up.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Right. And I will say, like, I sit here, and I know people always comment about my arms (laughs) and-
- MRMel Robbins
It takes a lot of work to get arms like that, I would think.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah, but the other thing is I-
- MRMel Robbins
I think they're amazing arms.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Thanks. I-
- MRMel Robbins
I'm wearing a long-sleeve shirt for a reason.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
(laughs)
- MRMel Robbins
(laughs) If I had your arms, I'd be wearing a tank top too.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I would love it if all of this would go lower body. Like, I have tried for years to get really strong hamstrings and really strong glutes. They're strong, but they're not bulky. It's just mesomorphic up here, ectomorphic down. So it's-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... the difference in the combination. Um, but I went through a time where I was really upset with the fact that I had more muscle. Like when I was bike racing, I tried really, really hard to lose it, but I couldn't because my body's like, "No, this is how you are born." So women who are like, "I'm really trying to build muscle," it doesn't necessarily mean you're gonna get bulky. If you don't have a genetic predisposition for putting muscle on really, really easily, it's really hard to get bulky. And for most women who are trying to put muscle on, not eating or doing lots of cardio work, you're not gonna put muscle on. It's really hard to get bulky.
- 47:51 – 51:17
This Advice Helped Thousands of Women Get Stronger
- MRMel Robbins
Why is strength training so important for women in particular?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah, I wish I had known about strength training way back when. Like, I was introduced to it when I was 16 because my friend's brother was a bodybuilder. And I was like, "Oh, okay, I'll go 'cause Michelle, you're going, I'll go with you."
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
But I didn't really realize what that meant. So when we talk about the science of strength training right now, we know that with age, we lose muscle really quickly, start to lose it when we hit 30, and it's really important because, one, it's an active tissue, so it helps maintain so many different systems in our body. Not only that, but we think about strength training and how it, um, puts leverage on the bone to improve bone. But the big thing really is when we think about cognitive decline. So we see that there's a sex difference as we get older in Alzheimer's, dementia, cognitive decline, and it has to do with brain, brain metabolism, so that's the fuel that your brain uses, and what we call neuroplasticity or how your brain, uh, a- adapts and creates neural pathways.
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
If we're strength training-... then we're, yeah, we're taking care of our bone and our muscle, but it's creating signals to the brain to increase its ability to be really plastic. So it's like, "Yeah, okay, I need to have a new path- pathway. Let's develop that pathway." And so it's always changing. It's like sudoku, right? You're mentally working on that. But strength training does the same thing, but it also improves overall metabolism. So now your brain is very flexible and it's like, "Okay, well, I need glucose, but then I can use lactate." So when you start doing all of these things, it reduces your chances of developing cognitive issues.
- MRMel Robbins
Huh.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So for women, I'm always like, yeah, strength training is great because we're building all these things, we're changing our body composition, but for the long term, we wanna have a good body and a good mind. So if we're doing these things and creating more pathways and developing existing pathways and making the brain very responsive and able to be flexible, then we're gonna have a really good sound mind when we're all doing Zimmer frame races when we're 100.
- MRMel Robbins
What are Zimmer frame races?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
You know those frames that old women have to use and, or old men?
- MRMel Robbins
(laughs) I've never seen those.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
I don't know what you're talking about.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
In the nursing homes, you haven't seen those silver walkers?
- MRMel Robbins
Oh, yes.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
I thought there was a game you were talking about.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
No, no. So the sil-
- MRMel Robbins
I have a feeling you're not gonna be using a walker.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Oh, yes.
- MRMel Robbins
I have a feeling you're gonna be the one teaching us all how to lift weights when we're 90 years old in the nursing home together.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Well, no, I'll be using a Zimmer frame. I'll be doing the races with everyone else, 'cause I can't say that my joints are all that great.
- MRMel Robbins
(laughs)
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
(laughs)
- MRMel Robbins
So what is the biology behind building muscle and how is it different for men versus women? Like, what do women need to know?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Women are what we call more fatigue resistant. So as I was describing earlier, the differences in the muscle fiber types, right? So women have more of those fat burning, we call endurant fibers. So that means that you can do lots of work and then you recover relatively quickly. So when we're looking at sets and reps and things like that-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... women don't need as much recovery time between your sets and reps to be able to have the same kind of training
- 51:17 – 53:46
The Exercise Routine Designed for Women
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
stress. Now break that down.
- MRMel Robbins
Please, 'cause I don't know-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... anything that you just talked about. I was like-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... sets, reps, all that stuff.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
All that stuff, right.
- MRMel Robbins
Okay, what are we doing?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So say you have a man and a woman that go to the gym and they're like, "Okay, I'm supposed to do five sets." So that's-
- MRMel Robbins
Five sets?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So yeah. Uh, this is-
- MRMel Robbins
That's a lot.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I know. It's an avatar here. okay, well, let's just-
- MRMel Robbins
Or a group.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... use an avatar of somebody who (laughs) is just starting. Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
Okay? So like, we're gonna like, what's the bare minimum, doctor? So I'm looking for something I can succeed at. Five sets sounds like a lot to me.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah, I'll get to there.
- MRMel Robbins
Okay, okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
But I want, I wanted to explain the biology.
- MRMel Robbins
All right, I'm gonna shut up. Okay, you tell me the biology.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I'll give you the biology-
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... and then I'll give you the actionable-
- MRMel Robbins
Thank you.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... where to start.
- MRMel Robbins
Thank you, Dr. Simms.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
All right. So if we take a man and a woman, they go to the gym and they have this, this similar program-
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... where they're supposed to do five sets of five reps on the three minutes. So what does that mean? You do five reps of a squat in three minutes, so however long it takes you to do those, and then you rest the rest of the time for three minutes.
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- 53:46 – 1:08:39
Getting Stronger Starts in the Kitchen, Not the Gym
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
- MRMel Robbins
You know, I'm about to ask you a bunch of questions about like the specifics of what we should be doing, but I had one question. You know, whenever I'm complaining about, uh, my body or, you know, feeling outta shape or whatever it is that I want to change, my husband always turns to me and says, "Well, don't forget, abs are built in the kitchen-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
(laughs)
- MRMel Robbins
... not in the gym."
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah. I mean, yeah, it's similar.
- MRMel Robbins
You're, is this like a man's... Is that what works for men?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
That works for men, definitely. Yep.
- MRMel Robbins
'Cause when I hear that abs are built in the kitchen, not in the gym, I'm like, "Am I supposed to starve myself?" Like, what, what are you talking about?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Right. So this comes back to the, uh, you know, the fasting, and I get really frustrated where more men will, will drop alcohol or they'll drop sugar, then all of a sudden their abs are ripped, right?
- MRMel Robbins
Yes.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
They're like, "Whoo, belly fat gone."
- MRMel Robbins
Yes.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
But for women, we tend to store belly fat, you know?
- MRMel Robbins
Correct. And if I'm not drinking-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... I want results.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I know, but it doesn't necessarily happen.
- MRMel Robbins
No, it doesn't-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
No.
- MRMel Robbins
... Dr. Simms.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
It doesn't.
- MRMel Robbins
This is not fair.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
No.
- MRMel Robbins
'Cause I don't understand my own body.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I know. It's very frustrating.
- MRMel Robbins
And I've been listening to the bro science and my stupid husband telling me the advice that works for him-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
... and he's, he's only trying to help. So what do I... So why does it not work that way for women?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
We have a higher percent body fat.... for one, and again, it comes down to food intake in the hypothalamus. So if we start taking out food and not replacing those calories with something else, then we end up in a lower energy state. So that's a- n- that could be a whole nother podcast, but basically we're not eating enough to support body composition change and health outcomes. So if we talk about abs in the kitchen, if we're eating the same kind of grandparent diet, then we're gonna have the same outcomes, right? But if we have the extra 20 bit of life where we're having chocolate and whiskey and all those fun things, a man can take that out and get super ripped. A woman takes it out, there's no change. Why? Because the hypothalamus is like, "Where are those calories? I need those calories." So if we want to eat a little bit cleaner, we have to make sure that we're actually s- providing enough calories. So if we're providing enough calories and our body's like, "Yep, sweet, we got enough for all the things that we need to do in a day, overcome the stress, and we have enough to, uh, fuel the training and the changes we want with the exercise we're doing," you're gonna get those abs.
- MRMel Robbins
Wow.
- 1:08:39 – 1:14:42
Everything You Need to Know for Your First Time at the Gym
- MRMel Robbins
I would love to have you talk directly to the person listening who has never stepped foot in a gym.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
'Cause I do think, you know, even though I'm in shape and I know a little bit about what I should be doing, I always feel intimidated when I go to a gym because there's always guys, like it's filled with guys.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yep.
- MRMel Robbins
And there's more and more women which is great, but if I walk into a gym, even- even at a hotel, and I'm seeing all the machines, and then I see the free weight space, and then I see the little space over, and- and I don't know exactly what I should be doing-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Right.
- MRMel Robbins
... I don't stay long and I leave. And I would love to have you, since you've been in this industry for so long, talk to the person who wants to do something and wants to learn about this, but the idea of actually walking into the local gym is just daunting.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yep.
- MRMel Robbins
So what do you want them to know though about the people at the front desk and the way that people at a gym think about somebody new walking in?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah, so gyms are super gendered. I sometimes get intimidated.
- MRMel Robbins
You do?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah. So I'll say, like, if I go to a typical bro gym, like a Gold's Gym-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... I'll walk in and I'll see the lifting platforms, and there's some big dudes. And I'm like, "Uh, maybe I'll come back. I'll go do something else first." So it's- it's still there because the gyms are so gendered, and it's a fault of that industry, where you walk in as a woman, the front desk person looks at you and goes, "Oh, okay. How much weight do you wanna lose? Here's the cardio machines."
- MRMel Robbins
(laughs)
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
"Here are our classes." If a guy walks in, they're like, "Yo, bro, how much weight do you wanna put on? How much muscle? The lifting platforms are back there, and we have bumper plates, and our dumbbells go up to 80 pounds, so you know, it's all back there." But it's so gendered even if you feel like-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... "I'm gonna go to the free weights," because you have to walk through all the treadmills and the ellipticals and cardio.
- MRMel Robbins
Yeah. Yep.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
And then, you... Like, the free weights are here, and then lifting platforms are at the back.
- MRMel Robbins
Yes.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So it's not surprising that someone who's not ever been in a gym situation doesn't want to go into a gym situation. And the way that we can get started in this is put the gym out- out of your head at the moment, right?
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So we can look at... There are two main things that allow women to thrive in strength training. One is knowing what to do and two is community, right? We see that working out with someone else is fun for one thing, and two, it allows you to push yourself a little bit harder. It's just intrinsically you want to keep up or you don't want to look like the weak link. It's just a psych- psychological thing.
- MRMel Robbins
Huh.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So community and working- working out with someone is super important. So if you're someone who's like, "I don't want to go to the gym, I don't know what to do," well, we can look at some of the online things that are out there. So, like, if you're really super, super basic and you want someone to work with, maybe one-on-one or maybe a small group, you could look to someone like Loretta Hawk who does Loretta Loves Lifting. She's very, like she trains her mom, she trains other people who are just trying to really understand how to do stuff in their house. So it's a very basic way of starting, and you can move forward from there. If you're someone who's like, "I got that part, but I want to work out with a friend and we want a set program," then maybe you look at someone like The Betty Rocker, where she has specific programs. We can work out with her in her community or you and a friend can work out together-
- MRMel Robbins
Mm-hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... and that's a way to do more stuff with dumbbells in the house. Then we can move forward and go to something like Haley Happens Fitness that I've partnered with, where it's from the gym where you actually have an app that shows you what to do. You can go into the gym, you know exactly what machines or- or barbell or dumbbells to use. You bring in a friend. You can both do it together. So you're like, "Here's my app. This is what I do." You can record everything, keeps progress, and you know exactly what to do. And it's guided for 12 weeks, and it's progressive overload so you get benefit. There's lots of conversations. There's lots of community around it. Or you can even look, if you're really confident and you're like, "Yep, I got that too. I want to go straight to barbell with some dumbbell," then you can look at something like Annie Torsdottir's Empower, which has a page from CrossFit. So there's all sorts of levels that you can find, and the big thing is grab a friend. Have a friend and have that ownership to say, "For 20 minutes, let's meet, have our conversation, and do this together because we're gonna get strong together, and it's fun." I've been trying to-... get my daughter engaged in some strength training stuff, and she's 12. We have a project coming up where she needs to know how to move properly.
- MRMel Robbins
Hmm.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
And I have her working with one of my friends in a high performance gym, but it's not lifting, it's moving and having fun. So she has another little friend in there who's a surfer and a soccer player just like she is, and they go there and they have fun. She came back the first day fizzing, going, "I didn't know how fun it could be at the gym, especially when you have a friend." I'm like, "Exactly." It's the adult playground, but little kids are being exposed to it. It's like, "Come into my playground. Let's play together."
- 1:14:42 – 1:30:41
Cold Plunging & Sauna for Women: What You’re Doing Wrong
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
- MRMel Robbins
Can you talk about cold plunging?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Sure.
- MRMel Robbins
Should women be doing it? What are the mistakes that we're making? What's the difference between men and women and cold plunging?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So inherently, women don't need as cold.
- MRMel Robbins
(gasps)
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So...
- MRMel Robbins
Thank you.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
I know.
- MRMel Robbins
We don't?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
No.
- MRMel Robbins
Why?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
When we're looking at stress response, 'cause that's how I view all of the environmental and exercise things, is what kind of stress it puts on the body. When a woman gets into ice cold or cold water, and gets in there, it invokes such a severe strong stress response, much stronger than a male's response, that her body goes into, uh, more of a shutdown phase, where it invokes a sympathetic drive and it doesn't create the metabolic changes that we see with men. If you were to take a woman and put her in 15 or 16 degrees Celsius, which is around that 55 degree mark, she'll end up with the same responses that a man has, because it's not as severe a shock to a woman's body as it is for a man's. Why is that? Because we have more body fat, so we tend to vasodilate and vasoconstrict first for controlling our temperature, where men will vasoconstrict and sweat.
- MRMel Robbins
When they're cold?
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
No. When-
- MRMel Robbins
Oh, in general.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
We're talking about just in general.
- MRMel Robbins
Okay.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
So if we're taking a woman and putting her in ice, the body's first response to environmental change is severe vasoconstriction. And with women with Raynaud's, we have a stronger constriction response, because it's a protective mechanism. For men, they'll constrict and then start shivering to induce heat, and women will just constrict. If we put ourselves into that 55 to 60 degree water or 15 to 16 degrees Celsius, we'll constrict and then start shivering, so we'll get the same benefit. It's just the ice is too cold for us to start that shivering. So we need-
- MRMel Robbins
Oh.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
... the shivering for thermogenesis to get some of those responses. So we don't need ice, we need cool water.
- MRMel Robbins
I have been doing this all wrong.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
And do you feel uncomfortable when you get in the ice? (laughs)
- MRMel Robbins
Of- Well, I- I- I mean, I live in southern Vermont, so there's always-
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Oh, so, yeah.
- MRMel Robbins
... like an ice slick on the thing, and you're, like, having to take an ax and, you know, cut off the top of the barrel or keep an agricultural bubbler in it to keep it from freezing.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Mm-hmm.
- MRMel Robbins
It's- it's gotta be at least 32 degrees.
- SSDr. Stacy Sims
Yeah, too cold.
- MRMel Robbins
And my husband gets in it, and he's like a fricking, like, meditation zen... He just gets in, sits down, he starts shivering.
Episode duration: 1:35:20
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