What Every Dad Should Know: Lessons From Literary Legend James Patterson

1. 0:00 – 4:23

   Welcome

   1. MRMel Robbins0:00

      In our Boston studios today, holy cow, are you and I in for a spectacular treat. We have James Patterson. He's the record-breaking literary legend who has sold more than 400 million books. But today, he has stepped away from the writing desk and is pulling up a chair with you and me for a life-changing conversation about fatherhood. James Patterson is letting you in on the things you don't really hear dads talk about. Did your dad ever tell you that he loved you?

   2. JPJames Patterson0:34

      (sighs) Uh, the only time I remember hugging my father was on his deathbed. So many guys out there are lost, overwhelmed. They're no longer the breadwinner or whatever they thought they were gonna be. But I also realized I could love someone in a significant way, and also that I was lovable. This person, this core guy-

   3. MRMel Robbins0:55

      Hm.

   4. JPJames Patterson0:55

      ... is actually lovable. And if we could get more guys to that place, they would have better lives.

   5. MRMel Robbins1:02

      How did becoming a father later in life really change you?

   6. JPJames Patterson1:07

      At the end of the day, when we're looking back at our lives, the most important job you're ever gonna have is as a mom and a dad. And to realize that a little bit and have that drive you, that's probably the most important thing that we do.

   7. MRMel Robbins1:21

      Hey, it's your friend Mel, and welcome to The Mel Robbins Podcast. I am thrilled that you're here, and it is always such an honor to spend time together, to be with you. And today, holy cow, are you and I in for a spectacular treat. We get to sit down with none other than James Patterson. And if you're a new listener, I just want to take a moment and personally welcome you to the Mel Robbins Podcast family. Thank you for being here. And because you made the time to listen to this particular episode, here's what I know about you. I know that you're either a mega James Patterson fan or you are the kind of person who values the people in your life and you would love to know simple ways to improve your relationships with the people who matter most. And I'm gonna tell you something. If you're not a James Patterson fan, you will be after the conversation today. James Patterson has sold a mind-blowing 400 million copies of his books and counting. I mean, you can't step into anyone's house, a bookstore, a library, even the tiniest airport newsstand around the world without spotting a James Patterson title, or heck, 10 of 'em staring right back at you. Alex Cross, Michael Bennett, The Women's Murder Club. James Patterson has written everything from edge-of-your-seat thrillers, laugh-out-loud kids books, jaw-dropping true crime, heartwarming tales of love and loss. You name it. If it's part of the human experience, James Patterson has written it, and readers adore him. Having authored or co-authored over 200 books, he's a literary legend and a machine, and he just keeps on going and going and going, and breaking records along the way. James Patterson holds the Guinness World Record for the most number one New York Times bestsellers. He's the first author to sell a million e-books. And the awards, they just stack up like his stories. But his impact goes far beyond what he creates. James Patterson is a philanthropist dedicated to improving literacy. He's donated over a million books to students and to soldiers serving overseas. He awards scholarships to future teachers and writers through the Patterson Family Foundation, and he has poured more than $9 million into school libraries and independent bookstores across the United States. And out of everything he's written and accomplished, Dad is still his favorite title. His newest release is The #1 Dad Book: Be the Best Dad You Can Be in 1 Hour. I've read it. It's a fast, funny, and heartfelt read packed with the real life lessons James Patterson wishes he'd known sooner. Now, he's come to our Boston studios today for one reason, to be here with you and to share those lessons with you, lessons you'll want to share with all the soon-to-be dads, fathers, grandfathers, and father figures in your life. And this is a pretty special moment for me, because my dad, hi Dad, happens to be one of the biggest James Patterson fans I know.

2. 4:23 – 13:54

   The Secret to Being a Great Dad

   1. MRMel Robbins4:23

      So please help me welcome the one and only James Patterson to the Mel Robbins Podcast. I am so thrilled you're here.

   2. JPJames Patterson4:31

      I, I'm excited. I really am. And a lot of times at these things you don't get that excited, but this time it, this is, this is, uh, it's really fun, I think.

   3. MRMel Robbins4:38

      Well, I am so excited to discuss your n- your newest book. I mean-

   4. JPJames Patterson4:43

      Yeah.

   5. MRMel Robbins4:43

      ... you've got so many books, but this one is really special.

   6. JPJames Patterson4:47

      Yeah.

   7. MRMel Robbins4:47

      The #1 Dad Book: Be the Best Dad You Can Be in 1 Hour. I would love to start by just having you speak directly to the person who has found the time and made the time to be here with you and me today. What might they experience about their life that could be different if they've-

   8. JPJames Patterson5:07

      Yeah, I think, person, (laughs) you know, uh, uh, I, ho- hopefully this book, and I think it is in the spirit of what Mel does with all of these podcasts, which is to help a little. Uh, a- and, and, and that's huge. Help a little to, to make tomorrow a little better, to... A- and in particular, because this book affects everybody in your family. It's, it's for dads, but in, in talking to dads, in helping dads to be better, uh, it will help the partners and it will definitely help the kids. Uh, and the grandparents even. So this book, I think, is in the spirit with, with pretty much everything that Mel does, and, and I think it's particularly useful because this isn't a book about, "Well, let's think about stuff and then we go home and w- and nothing changes." This is about doing. This is about changing, uh, in good ways. And it's not a book about perfect, 'cause I don't believe in that and I don't, I don't know (laughs) how anybo- I don't think we can be p- every guy can be perfect but not us. Uh, uh, this is, this is about...... uh, being better tomorrow than we were today. And as I said, it- it, the idea of doing this for the whole family is, it's, I think, I think it's a very useful thing and I'm, I'm really excited about, about spending some time with you.

   9. MRMel Robbins6:19

      And we're super excited to spend time with you. And we're gonna dig into this book. I love, love, love this book, and I know you're gonna love it too. And before we jump into the number one dad book and all the incredible lessons in it, I just wanna take a step back and talk a little bit about your career.

   10. JPJames Patterson6:38

       Yeah.

   11. MRMel Robbins6:39

       You were not born a bestselling author.

   12. JPJames Patterson6:42

       Yeah.

   13. MRMel Robbins6:42

       But the world knows you as probably the most successful living author today. 400 million copies of your books sold.

   14. JPJames Patterson6:52

       Yeah, too many. Way too many. He writes too many books, but, you know, whatever.

   15. MRMel Robbins6:56

       67 number one New York Times bestsellers. You've got 13 more books coming out this year alone. And you have a really interesting story though, because you didn't begin as a writer. You were studying to get a PhD and then went into advertising. Tell me a little bit about your background.

   16. JPJames Patterson7:14

       Well, I was in advertising, but I've been clean for 30 years now, so thank you for bringing that up.

   17. MRMel Robbins7:19

       (laughs)

   18. JPJames Patterson7:19

       (laughs) Um, yeah, I, I grew up, uh, well, I just, uh, grew up in a small town upstate New York, Newburgh, New York. Um, my father actually grew up in a poor house there. Um, his mother was a charwoman. She cleaned the bathrooms and the kitchens, and he got th- th- they had shared a room in the basement. Um, and, um, you know, so kind of lower middle class in terms of the way, way we grew up. And, um, I, I was, I always wanted... I was a good student, but I wasn't a big reader, uh, in high school, Catholic high school. I moved up actually in, in this area, uh, my parents did, w- had moved to Lexington, and I worked at McLean Hospital, uh, in Belmont nearby, a mental hospital, and I worked a lot of night shifts and I, I would go into Cambridge like three times a week and just get these books. You could buy 'em for 25 cents. And I started reading, reading, reading, and then I started scribbling. And this turned around my life and I think saved me as a human being and has eliminated a lot of stress and sores and difficulty from my life because somebody said, "You're lucky if you find something you like to do, and then it's a miracle if somebody will pay you to do it." Well, in starting to read and reading stuff that I wanted to read and reading a lot of fiction and plays and whatever, I found what I wanted to do. I wasn't getting paid for it yet, but that was, that was just so key to find this thing. I knew that I wanted to be a writer.

   19. MRMel Robbins8:44

       So do you remember the moment where you were like, "I think I want to do this for a living"?

   20. JPJames Patterson8:48

       I, I don't think I... It wasn't that I wanted to do it for a living, but I wanted to do it. I wanted to write novels. Uh, I went down to Vanderbilt for grad school and I was very lucky to have a professor there who just said, "You got it. You have this thing, you can, you can do it." I was writing a lot of short stories and I wrote... uh, there was actually... The first book I was, uh, yeah, I, I published it when I was 26, the Thomas Berryman number. Uh, it got turned down by 31 publishers, then it won an Edgar as best first novel. So go figure that one out. And that's the thing in terms of people, sometimes you get rejected or you get rejected re-... But you just, if, if you believe in yourself, just, you know, keep going. Uh, and that was something that I did. I, I kind of... And, and this professor helped a lot 'cause he said, "No, you can do this. You have, you, you have what it takes to, to, to be a really good writer, or to be successful, or at least to make a living doing it."

   21. MRMel Robbins9:38

       Wasn't it almost 20 years later though that Along Came the Spider! was published?

   22. JPJames Patterson9:42

       Yeah.

   23. MRMel Robbins9:42

       And that's kind of the, the Alex Cross novel. That's the one that my dad's like, "Oh, James Patterson's my..."

   24. JPJames Patterson9:47

       Uh-huh.

   25. MRMel Robbins9:47

       'Cause I grew up with a dad who was always reading your books.

   26. JPJames Patterson9:52

       Uh-huh.

   27. MRMel Robbins9:53

       Always. And so it, I think it's also important to note because more than anything, you've not only been patient, you've been persistent.

   28. JPJames Patterson10:02

       Mm-hmm.

   29. MRMel Robbins10:03

       And I think that's a really important lesson when I look at your life from the outside.

   30. JPJames Patterson10:07

       It, it's a simple thing with me, I just love to do it.
3. 13:54 – 24:16

   A Writing Habit That Sold 400 Million Books

   1. JPJames Patterson13:54

      bad way, uh, I think.

   2. MRMel Robbins13:56

      That must also be a way in which you write, is thinking through the consequences of what's happening next.

   3. JPJames Patterson14:02

      Well, I, I think part of it, I mean, that's why I do my outlines, uh, e- every... and not everybody does this. I interview, I do interviews a little bit. Like Michael Connelly doesn't do outlines and, uh, uh, Baldacci doesn't do outlines, but I do. I really... uh, and I'm not a slave to them. I mean, I'll do my outline and it can be 50, 60, 70 pages, but then I'm open to... and I, and I always do change 'em because you're writing and you find that a character is more interesting than you thought they were gonna be, or y- you know, y- theoretically you were gonna get rid of the bad guy. "Oh, no, but I, I want the bad guy to come back and" (laughs) you know. Uh, so, so to be open to change is, is also important. And I guess that's important in life too. It's sort of like you, uh, you have to outline your life, right? And, um, uh, y- you know, to have a plan, uh, but not to worry about it. Uh, uh, y- you know, I, I think I'd like to... and, and the other thing I think is to be open, and a lot of people aren't open. They get... "Oh, I never wanna do this. I never..." well, you don't know. A- and, and I think even with kids, how do you get them just to be open? Just consider this.

   4. MRMel Robbins15:01

      Mm-hmm.

   5. JPJames Patterson15:01

      Think about this. Don't... you know, uh, it... uh, people take kids out to see colleges and the kids go, "Oh, I love these buildings." That's nice, but, you know, in a month, you won't, you won't s- you'll stop noticing the buildings. But what really is it about this school that's really gonna m- you know, for example, uh, our son went to Brown, and the culture there is, um, you're all smart, so don't beat each other up and support each other. So, that's the important thing about that school-

   6. MRMel Robbins15:29

      Mm-hmm.

   7. JPJames Patterson15:29

      ... or one of the important things. If that appeals to you, then that's a good school for you, much more important than, "Oh, I li- I really liked the buildings and it was so cute and you know, da-de-da." No, no, no, that culture is r- that's really important, if, if that, if that appeals to you.

   8. MRMel Robbins15:42

      How do you come up with so many ideas?

   9. JPJames Patterson15:44

      (inhales) Uh, you know, uh, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's hell. (laughs)

   10. MRMel Robbins15:49

       What do you mean it's hell?

   11. JPJames Patterson15:50

       No, I'm kidding.

   12. MRMel Robbins15:51

       It seems like a gift.

   13. JPJames Patterson15:52

       Y- yeah, it is. It, it, what I... yes, it is a gift. I just, for whatever reason, I just have this monstrous, uh, uh, imagination. I think a piece of it is growing up, uh, in Newburg, uh, initially my, my... it was, uh, seven or eight acres, my grandmother's... it was just woods, you know, th- uh, th- once again, modest house, that they built, my grandmother and grandfather, and then woods. And I would wander out in those woods and just make up stories, story, story, story, story, story, story, story, story. And I think I just got into the habit of it. I remember when I was going to Vanderbilt, I used to drive down there from Massachusetts where I was living, and it was like 28 hours or whatever the hell it was, and I would write musical plays going back and forth to Vanderbilt. I would just make up these plays, and I would, I would... and I'd make them up on the spot and then I would sing the songs, I'm a terrible singer, uh, and, and create the characters as I was going, and I... you know, I don't know, it just, uh, it's somehow in my head, I don't know why, but maybe it's dreams. I don't know (laughs) where it comes from. Sometimes I'll, I'll wake up and I'll be d- I'll be in the middle of a story that I've been dreaming.

   14. MRMel Robbins16:55

       And then do you have like a notebook by your bed that you then make notes?

   15. JPJames Patterson16:58

       I used to, I used to. (laughs) But now I... what I found out is that if it's good, you're gonna remember it.

   16. MRMel Robbins17:03

       Mm.

   17. JPJames Patterson17:04

       And if you bother to write it down and it wasn't that good, you go like, "What? (laughs) What is this? (laughs) Why did I write this down?" You know? The good stuff I t- I think I remember.

   18. MRMel Robbins17:13

       And do you typically work on one project-

   19. JPJames Patterson17:16

       No.

   20. MRMel Robbins17:16

       ... at a time?

   21. JPJames Patterson17:17

       No. No, right now, I think there are 31 live projects, things that I'm working on.

   22. MRMel Robbins17:23

       And so do you walk in and it's sort of like one of those docents-

   23. JPJames Patterson17:26

       (laughs)

   24. MRMel Robbins17:26

       ... like, "Which one's pulling me towards today?"

   25. JPJames Patterson17:28

       No, I, I kind of know, I, I, I kind of know what the one or two or three that I'm messing around with are. But the good thing about it is, uh, you, you don't get writer's block that way.

   26. MRMel Robbins17:37

       Well, you know, it's interesting you say that because one of the things that I read about a technique or a strategy that you use that w- I found super help, I'm like, "Oh my gosh, I wish I would have read this years ago," is you said that a lot of writers trip themselves up because they try to get the chapter perfect.

   27. JPJames Patterson17:55

       Mm. Mm-hmm.

   28. MRMel Robbins17:56

       And you have this ability if the chapter's not working to just-

   29. JPJames Patterson17:59

       Yeah.

   30. MRMel Robbins17:59

       ... be like, "Okay, next," and-
4. 24:16 – 32:33

   The Real Reason Men Feel Lost

   1. MRMel Robbins24:16

      How, how does that story impact you when you think about fatherhood?

   2. JPJames Patterson24:21

      (sighs) My... And this relates to, to The Number One Dad Book.

   3. MRMel Robbins24:24

      Mm-hmm.

   4. JPJames Patterson24:25

      The only time I remember hugging my father was on his deathbed. (smacks lips) And that says a lot. And, and in therapy, I learned that one of the reasons that I would get angry sometimes was just, it was my father.

   5. MRMel Robbins24:41

      Yeah.

   6. JPJames Patterson24:42

      And, and I had to sort of, uh, at times go, "That's not... That, yelling at this cab driver, that's not me. That's just, that's stupid. That's ridiculous. It's, it's irrational. And that's just this, whatever, pent-up anger." Uh, A, A, A-, A, and B, um, uh, don't blame him. He was doing the best he could, and I think he was. And, uh, one of my best friends from college, whatever, I was over his hou- uh, my- Sue and I were having dinner over there and with- th- their two sons both played football, high school football. And after dinner, they, th- the boys were going out the front door, and, uh, and my friend said, "You know, where d- where you guys going?" And, and they stopped, and they came over, and they gave him a hug. And I said, "Yeah, th- there's a life lesson right there." Th- here are these two big football play-... It didn't matter, you know, that they were football players, but he insisted on having a hug. So with our son, Jack, every single night, and to this day, if he comes home, he gets a hug. I, when I came here, I got a hug. I like that.

   7. MRMel Robbins25:43

      Yeah, I do, too.

   8. JPJames Patterson25:43

      It's great. And, and not everybody's a hugger. But the book, uh, Number One Dad Book, it, it's about those little... And once again, not lectures or anything, and making it work for, for guys, that hugs are, are, are, are a good thing. And it's a page, but it, but... And it, and the book is just full of all of those thoughts, uh, that can be helpful to guys.

   9. MRMel Robbins26:03

      Well, you know, I love that you're writing this. And I also am happy that you shared that story about your own dad and your uncle-

   10. JPJames Patterson26:12

       Mm-hmm.

   11. MRMel Robbins26:12

       ... and your grandfather. Did your dad ever tell you that he loved you?

   12. JPJames Patterson26:16

       (sighs) Uh, no, not that language.

   13. MRMel Robbins26:20

       Did he ever tell you that he was proud of you?

   14. JPJames Patterson26:23

       Yes. Uh, the book, uh, The Book Writing, he always wanted to be a writer. Uh, he wasn't, he was, uh, an insurance salesman. He did the best he could, and he, he, he, he, he made a living f- or helped... My mother was a teacher, between the two of them. Um, they were functioning alcoholics, so that was a, a problem. But, but once again, they did the best they could.

   15. MRMel Robbins26:42

       Yeah, and I think one of the things that's really amazing about what you said, because it's a very... You're giving people grace. Nobody can pass on what they weren't given.

   16. JPJames Patterson26:51

       Mm-hmm.

   17. MRMel Robbins26:52

       And when you share the story of what happened in your dad's life and-

   18. JPJames Patterson26:56

       Mm-hmm.

   19. MRMel Robbins26:56

       ... the fact that his own father wasn't present-

   20. JPJames Patterson26:59

       Yeah.

   21. MRMel Robbins26:59

       ... and it was also a very different time and a different generation-

   22. JPJames Patterson27:02

       Mm-hmm. Yeah.

   23. MRMel Robbins27:02

       ... that-

   24. JPJames Patterson27:02

       Oh, yeah, yeah. Right.

   25. MRMel Robbins27:03

       ... when you can look at your parents through compassionate eyes-

   26. JPJames Patterson27:09

       Mm-hmm.

   27. MRMel Robbins27:09

       ... you can understand that you may have deserved something different or wanted something different-

   28. JPJames Patterson27:13

       Yeah.

   29. MRMel Robbins27:13

       ... but they could only give you what they had to give.

   30. JPJames Patterson27:16

       Well, you know, these life lessons, and, and so coming to grips with my father, huge. Um, understanding that I wanted to write more than anything and then, uh, that I was gonna do it.
5. 32:33 – 39:11

   How to Show Up For Your Kids Better

   1. MRMel Robbins32:33

   2. JPJames Patterson32:33

      Mm-hmm.

   3. MRMel Robbins32:33

      And you were just talking about how so many men and dads are feeling lost or they're focused on the wrong things or they're distracted-

   4. JPJames Patterson32:42

      Yeah.

   5. MRMel Robbins32:42

      ... and so here's one of the essays.

   6. JPJames Patterson32:44

      Focused on the wrong things is, is beautiful. I mean, uh, uh, it's not in the book, but your words, that's, that's exactly right.

   7. MRMel Robbins32:50

      "Here's one of my trade secrets. When I'm writing a novel, I sometimes scrawl a note to myself at the top of the page. It says, 'Be there.' It reminds me that I need to put the reader in the scene so that they'll really feel it. The same goes for being a dad. Let's be honest. There's lots of distractions in life, the internet, Zoom calls with in-laws, night shifts, Netflix, the NFL draft. There will be times when you can only give your kids part of your attention. But whenever you can, as much as you can, focus. It's not just being around, although that's a big part of it. It's paying attention, setting other thoughts aside, and really being present. There are some woo-woo terms for this, intention, mindfulness, but what it comes down to is this. When you're with your kids, be there. Have you ever seen little kids on a school stage lighting up when they spot their parents in the audience? It's like they're witnessing a miracle. Now you're the miracle. You might not be able to be at every recital, every birthday party, and every game, but be at as many as you can. It matters. Sure, someone else can shoot video of a game or a birthday, but it's only live once. Years later, your kids will not remember what song they sang, what flavor cake they had, or whether they won or lost that third match of the season, but they'll remember if you were there."

   8. JPJames Patterson34:11

      Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, and that's a personal one for me, because, uh, somewhere in the book I say something to the effect of, "Had I done this research, had I thought about it, I, I could have been a better dad." I could have been. And, and one of the things would be literally be there. I was there in the sense that I worked at home and I, you know, I was with, around Jack a lot, but I could have been more intensely present than I was at times. So I was, I would be distracted present at times. And, and so, and that would have been better.

   9. MRMel Robbins34:41

      How did becoming a father later in life really change you?

   10. JPJames Patterson34:46

       Well, um, one of the advantages that Sue and I had is that we didn't have financial problems, and that's, uh, that's just, that takes something, th- uh, baggage out of the way, which is huge. So, so we didn't have that. We were both totally prepared for it. We were more mature, obviously. Um, I, um, you know, the thing of it was, is that Jane and I, uh, the, the woman I was with originally, uh, who died, uh, we would have been married and had, you know, it just didn't... And then I, I, took me a long time to get past that, but I always wanted to have kids. Uh, and then when I got together with Sue, uh, uh, she wanted to have, uh, you know, kids as well. And we got, you know, she, when I, um, I think I was 49 when we got married. I think she was 39. Uh, uh, Sue is interesting too. My joke line about Sue is, if Sue ever leaves me, I'm going with her. (laughs)

   11. MRMel Robbins35:46

       (laughs)

   12. JPJames Patterson35:46

       But the, but the real-

   13. MRMel Robbins35:47

       (laughs)

   14. JPJames Patterson35:47

       ... the real, the real story is, every once in a while, uh, there are a couple hours where I can't stand her, but there's never a day goes by that I'm not in love with her. And that's true.

   15. MRMel Robbins35:58

       Mm.

   16. JPJames Patterson35:58

       And, and we, uh, pretty much every night hold hands f- when we go to sleep.

   17. MRMel Robbins36:03

       Hmm.

   18. JPJames Patterson36:03

       Which is, which is a-- not everybody can do that. But, but, uh, that's-- I think it's nice if you can, if you can do it.

   19. MRMel Robbins36:09

       Well, Chris and I typ-

   20. JPJames Patterson36:09

       As I said, I've been very lucky about a lot of things.

   21. MRMel Robbins36:12

       Chris-

   22. JPJames Patterson36:12

       And one of them is finding Sue.

   23. MRMel Robbins36:13

       Chris and I typically start out that way, but then-

   24. JPJames Patterson36:15

       Uh-huh.

   25. MRMel Robbins36:15

       ... I get so hot-

   26. JPJames Patterson36:16

       Well, there's a certain point-

   27. MRMel Robbins36:18

       ... and he's like, "I have to let your hand go."

   28. JPJames Patterson36:18

       Well, I don't wanna hear about the hot part, but you know.

   29. MRMel Robbins36:21

       (laughs)

   30. JPJames Patterson36:22

       (laughs)
6. 39:11 – 46:26

   The Most Important Job You’ll Ever Have

   1. JPJames Patterson39:11

   2. MRMel Robbins39:11

      You know, I reached out to Jack.

   3. JPJames Patterson39:13

      Oh, oh, really? Okay, uh-

   4. MRMel Robbins39:14

      Yes, um, and I have-

   5. JPJames Patterson39:15

      Oh, well, that little creep didn't tell me.

   6. MRMel Robbins39:18

      (laughs) And-

   7. JPJames Patterson39:19

      And I thought I could trust him.

   8. MRMel Robbins39:20

      (laughs) I'm very persuasive. And, uh, I have something to play for you.

   9. JPJames Patterson39:27

      Oh, okay.

   10. JPJack Patterson39:28

       Hi, Dad. Surprise. Um, and hi, Mel. Um, so, Mel wanted me to share a bit about the impact that you've had on my life. Your strength as a parent, at least from my perspective, was helping me confidently be my own person. You know, I, I, I sometimes felt like I found myself completely trapped in the shadow of my dad, um, and that can be, you know, a little disempowering. You know, someone goes, "Oh, well, you know, that's so-and-so's kid," or they even... sometimes they would call me James, right? My name's Jack. James isn't even my legal name. Um, you know, someone just seeing you as the son or daughter of insert person here. Um, that may seem innocuous, but I think it really can eat at you. And so, you know, for me, as someone who kind of aimed for the moon, um, and seems to, you know, maybe not be landing on the moon, but at least getting somewhere, um, I sort of developed an obsession with overachieving so much that I could kind of prove to this, like, imaginary composite person, um, taking up real estate in my mind that, you know, "No way, full stop, it's, it's, it's me, it's not him." Um, and I think your best quality as a parent, Dad, at least for me, was encouraging me when possible not to think that way, you know, not holding your success over my head as much as possible, not falling into the trap of being the successful person, um, who, who made my childhood into a pressure cooker. So, uh, good job.

   11. MRMel Robbins41:18

       He's funny.

   12. JPJames Patterson41:19

       He's, he, he's... see what a good writer he could have been too. He's a really good writer. He has no interest in it, which I get. Uh, but he's, he's a really, really good writer and, and, uh, and very funny. He could have been a comedian. He's very... he wasn't being funny here, but he can be hilarious. But anyway, oh, that, that, that's great. That's great. I'm, I'm glad that he (laughs) glad he liked something that I did. Excellent.

   13. MRMel Robbins41:40

       I think he liked more than just something.

   14. JPJames Patterson41:42

       Well, you know, here's the thing about Jack. Jack calls three or four times a week-

   15. MRMel Robbins41:45

       Hmm.

   16. JPJames Patterson41:46

       ... which is nice. And, uh, you know, so, so... I mean, he wants to talk to Sue more than me, but he talks to both of us, you know, so it's, uh... that's a rewarding thing.

   17. MRMel Robbins41:54

       Well, he's clearly a very mature and very self-aware guy.

   18. JPJames Patterson41:58

       Mm-hmm.

   19. MRMel Robbins41:58

       And it's clear in the way that he described his experience-

   20. JPJames Patterson42:03

       Mm-hmm.

   21. MRMel Robbins42:03

       ... that he was aware of the pressure he's putting on himself.

   22. JPJames Patterson42:06

       Yeah.

   23. MRMel Robbins42:06

       And the...... compliment that he clearly gave you is that you didn't do that to him.

   24. JPJames Patterson42:12

       Mm-hmm.

   25. MRMel Robbins42:13

       So, if the person who's listening really relates to your story, 'cause they're like, "Well, I didn't have a really good example either-"

   26. JPJames Patterson42:19

       Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

   27. MRMel Robbins42:19

       Like, one of the things that I get from you and reading your book is that even if it wasn't modeled for you, you have the ability to actually change how you show up and be a different kind of dad.

   28. JPJames Patterson42:33

       Mm-hmm. Well, I think we all do on some level. Uh, you just have to commit to it. Um, you know, with, with Let Them, you have that one piece, which I, which I love. I just, it, it actually, uh, uh, a small piece of it, and, and actually something I talked to, with President Clinton about, this notion of don't, let's not waste our life or our time worrying about stuff we can't do anything about.

   29. MRMel Robbins42:59

       Hmm.

   30. JPJames Patterson43:00

       And if we can do something, let's do it.
7. 46:26 – 49:17

   One Habit to Teach Your Kids

   1. MRMel Robbins46:26

      So, one of the things that you've talked about is the importance to you and your wife Sue to really support literacy.

   2. JPJames Patterson46:33

      Mm-hmm.

   3. MRMel Robbins46:34

      And one of the essays is about reading. Read to your kids. I'm on page 45. "You read. It doesn't take much time to make a big difference. Reading to your kids helps boost their brain power. It gives them new worlds and new ways of putting them together." Talk more about why this is so important as a dad to read to your kids.

   4. JPJames Patterson46:53

      (sighs) Uh, if it works, and, and one of the things that I say in the book, which I think is useful, is there's gonna be certain things in here you're not gonna be able to do or you're not gonna agree with, and it doesn't matter. The important thing here is at the end of this book, uh, and I think this is gonna be true for every dad out there pretty much, uh, I'm gonna guess at that anyway, if you read the book and you keep your mind open, you're gonna pick up two or three or four things that are gonna make you better at what you're doing, and, and you'll be happier about it. You'll be more fulfilled. Uh, so I don't, you know, the reading to the k- I think it's really useful. It's not for everybody, uh, 'cause some people, they just, it's just not their thing, and that's okay. But I do think, uh, and in particular, and there were studies about this, that i- if you have books, if you read to your kids, if you talk to your kids a lot, uh, uh, their, their vocabularies are just gonna increase dramatically, so that when they get to kindergarten or first grade, they'll be so ahead of the pack. One of the things that, that, that I've been working on with University of Florida for now five or six years, the percentage of kids reading at grade level in this country is like 43%, which is a disgrace.

   5. MRMel Robbins48:00

      Disgraceful.

   6. JPJames Patterson48:00

      When I was growing up, small town, uh, uh, little Catholic school, everybody in our, in our class could read. Everybody could read. Everybody.What, what, what the hell is going on? This is insanity. So we've adopted ways of teaching kids to read that don't work. And, and it's true in, in pretty much every state. Massachusetts very... The percentage here is under 50%. That's ridiculous. It's insane. All right, University of Florida has this program. They can get it up into the 80s. And it's just... So it's now in, I think, 13 counties in Florida. Canada picked it up like crazy. W- we're making a little documentary about it, and, uh, and I- I visited some schools. And you sit in these classes, uh, you could fake it for 10 minutes, but I'll sit for like an hour, and these kids are so turned on by this program. A lot of it is going back to ph- to phonics and stuff, and, and the kids are so... They love it, it's fun, they're excited, and the scores just go up, up, up, up, up. Even some of these schools where the percentage of kids reading at grade level is like 10%, all of a sudden it's up into the 50s and 60s. And that... One of the things that I'll talk about when I go out and talk to teachers and librarians or whatever, I'm here to save lives. And, and I'm not... I don't mean I am, but the program is.

8. 49:17 – 1:01:10

   Every Kid Needs THIS from their Dad

   1. JPJames Patterson49:17

   2. MRMel Robbins49:17

      What is your most favorite essay in this book? Do you have one?

   3. JPJames Patterson49:21

      Uh, n- no, I don't think so. What I try to do at the end is, is, is, uh, to help people, like, "Here's... Here are some of the things, in case you're forgetting." I encourage them to go through and, and cross out stuff, or star stuff that they like, and you know...

   4. MRMel Robbins49:34

      Yes. You have, you have some re- you have a really, really great thing at the end. "If just two, or three, or five of these ideas work for you, you'll be a better dad."

   5. JPJames Patterson49:43

      Yeah.

   6. MRMel Robbins49:44

      And that's one hour very well spent. Be consistently fair. Trust really is built on consistency, and trust is everything.

   7. JPJames Patterson49:52

      Mm-hmm.

   8. MRMel Robbins49:53

      What is it important to be consistent about?

   9. JPJames Patterson49:57

      Uh, the trust is everything is a real thing. You just need... If your kids trust you, if you trust them, within reason (laughs) ...

   10. MRMel Robbins50:06

       (laughs)

   11. JPJames Patterson50:06

       Uh, that's, that's huge. That, that will last... You, you, they will... You will always have a, a relationship with them. A good relationship. Uh, consistency. I- if you think about sports, I don't know how much different people, but if, if, if, if the refs aren't consistent in a football game-

   12. MRMel Robbins50:25

       Mm-hmm.

   13. JPJames Patterson50:26

       If they're like, "Oh, sometimes they play it close, sometimes we'll let it... Give them a lot of room," it... The game doesn't work. And that consistency, like here's kind of within reason the way we operate. And, and, you know, and if the kids go, "That's just not fair," you need to listen to them a little bit. And, and, and sometimes... Obviously, you know, we're having a bad day and we, we, we're not gonna be consistent that day or we, you know, we shoot our mouth off more than we should. And there... I mean, and there are things in there about, you know, trying... I know this isn't totally possible, but try not to have arguments in front of the kids, especially heated ones. Especially if it's about them. Take it outside. We talk about that... Doing that, uh, uh, which is, which is, which is really important. Uh, talk about things like (laughs) being able... Guys being able to say, "I was wrong."

   14. MRMel Robbins51:16

       This is an important one.

   15. JPJames Patterson51:17

       Well, and the fi- (laughs) and the line I throw in there, you know, once again... I try to keep it semi-humorous because you want the, the guys to sort of, you know, not think they're getting preached to. And, and I'm not preaching, I'm just throwing stuff, but, "I was wrong." And then I said, "Just in case it ever happens."

   16. MRMel Robbins51:31

       (laughs) .

   17. JPJames Patterson51:31

       Uh, uh, which is, which is... Yes, it is important because a lot of guys think that if they, if they... If they admit they were wrong that somehow it lessens them as a human, as a guy, as a... No, I was wrong.

   18. MRMel Robbins51:45

       And this is why this book is so important. It's why I'm going to buy it for every single new dad that I know, is because I think that you get just caught up in the day-to-day and in your emotions-

   19. JPJames Patterson51:59

       Mm-hmm.

   20. MRMel Robbins52:00

       ... and being tired-

   21. JPJames Patterson52:01

       Yeah.

   22. MRMel Robbins52:01

       ... and just the grind of it all-

   23. JPJames Patterson52:03

       Yeah.

   24. MRMel Robbins52:03

       ... that it's easy to forget the things that you know deep down are true.

   25. JPJames Patterson52:07

       Yeah.

   26. MRMel Robbins52:08

       You know what I think about this book? I think people are gonna read it in an hour and they're gonna get a tremendous amount out of it, but I think it's one of these books that stays with you and that you keep on your desk.

   27. JPJames Patterson52:18

       Mm-hmm.

   28. MRMel Robbins52:18

       And if you were to just pick this up once a day or a couple times a week and you read one two-page essay-

   29. JPJames Patterson52:25

       Yeah.

   30. MRMel Robbins52:26

       ... it's almost like walking into a church and hearing the sermon that you needed to hear.
9. 1:01:10 – 1:04:58

   The Power of “I Love You”

   1. JPJames Patterson1:01:10

      useful.

   2. MRMel Robbins1:01:10

      You know, one of the things that, uh, you know, I- I think a lot about in terms of the topic of advice is that I personally believe that you are best equipped to help the person you used to be.

   3. JPJames Patterson1:01:22

      Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

   4. MRMel Robbins1:01:23

      And that if you are open as you are and you go through life with an open mind and an open heart, you can learn something from absolutely everybody that you meet.

   5. JPJames Patterson1:01:34

      Mm-hmm.

   6. MRMel Robbins1:01:35

      And so p- I think what you've achieved in The #1 DadBook, honestly, 'cause you keep saying, "I didn't boil it down to one thing," I think you actually did. I think you created not only something that you can read in an hour, but I think you created a lifeline for somebody to just open up-

   7. JPJames Patterson1:01:54

      Mm-hmm.

   8. MRMel Robbins1:01:55

      ... and be able to be reminded of the power that you have to do just a little better today.

   9. JPJames Patterson1:02:02

      Mm-hmm.

   10. MRMel Robbins1:02:03

       And every single one of the essays that you've written will help you do it.

   11. JPJames Patterson1:02:06

       Yeah. Well, that's very kind of you and touching and, um, uh, a- a- and- and- and I think there's some truth there. And- and as I said, it is that thing about- boy, I- I, uh, I love the notio- the idea that tomorrow I can be a little better at something.

   12. MRMel Robbins1:02:21

       Yes. So my favorite essay is the one you wrote on page 95, and I would love to have you read it.

   13. JPJames Patterson1:02:27

       Sure. "Kids benefit from seeing their parents respecting each other and being affectionate with each other. A little parental PDA can show them what a healthy, loving relationship looks like, so let them see you holding hands, let them see you hug, let them see you kiss, let them hear you say, 'I love you,'" which I think is monstrously important if people can do it. "'If you do it often enough, they'll learn not to chirp, 'Ew,' (laughs) every time they see you hugging or kissing or whatever. Now, some dads will say, 'I'm not an I love you kind of guy.' Says who? Who passed that law? Your dad? Your dad's dad? You can be an I love you guy. You can change at least a little. You'll be a better man for it. Saying I love you is not a sign of weakness. It's a sign of strength. Now go ahead, say I love you. Was that so hard? If it was, say it again. Okay, I'll say it. I love you, man."

   14. MRMel Robbins1:03:41

       I love you, James Patterson.

   15. JPJames Patterson1:03:42

       Oh, thank you. (laughs) I love you, too.

   16. MRMel Robbins1:03:44

       You're really awesome.

   17. JPJames Patterson1:03:44

       Uh, I- this is fun. This is nice. Uh, this is actually, in some ways, the nicest experience I've had of this sort since hanging out with Dolly Parton.

   18. MRMel Robbins1:03:54

       Well, I've loved every minute of getting to meet you, of getting to sit down and learn from you. You are delightful. You are so caring. And I'm gonna reflect this back to you. You are such a caring, curious, smart, and loving guy. Thank you, James, and thank you. Thank you for being here with me and James Patterson. And I know James already told you that he loves you, man, but I wanted to be sure that I told you that I love you and I believe in you and I believe in your ability to create a better life. And there were so many amazing moments and nuggets and pieces of wisdom that James shared with you and me today that I am certain that this conversation will help you and the people that you share this with do exactly that. All righty. I will see you in the very next episode. I'll be waiting to welcome you in the moment you hit play. I'll see you there. You're definitely gonna love this one, and I'm gonna be waiting to welcome you into it the moment you hit play. I'll see you there.

Episode duration: 1:04:58