Modern WisdomDavid Goggins - Stop Training Yourself To Be Soft (4K)
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,001 words- 0:00 – 0:33
Intro
- DGDavid Goggins
I'm trying to build people up. I'm trying to armor their mind. I'm trying to get them the belief, because this world we live in is tough. It will beat you down. The world and the life that we live in is the ultimate competitor. It will try to take you out. It will find your weakness, and it will fucking just hammer you. If I can help you build belief, build confidence to the point where nothing can hurt you because you know exactly who you are. (airplane whooshing)
- CWChris Williamson
David Goggins, welcome to the show.
- DGDavid Goggins
Hey, man, appreciate you having me, brother. Thank you.
- CWChris Williamson
Thank you for being here. Where have you been for the last four years?
- 0:33 – 7:00
David's New Career of Smoke Jumping
- CWChris Williamson
- DGDavid Goggins
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
You've been jumping out of helicopters and fighting fires and shit. What have you been doing?
- DGDavid Goggins
Well, I did that last year, right? I guess this year I did that. But I've just, I just do me, you know. I'm out there running, working out, and, uh, just trying to find out more of what this is all about, trying to find out more of what I'm all about. So, that takes me getting away. You know, I'm not about even doing these podcasts, man. So not, nothing against you, but, um, I'm not about all this stuff. I'm not one that likes to hear himself talk a lot, um, about action. And action means less talking and more doing, so that's where I've been.
- CWChris Williamson
What is that smoke jumping stuff?
- DGDavid Goggins
So basically, it's, um, you know about wild land firefighting, about when the forest has fires, there's a lot of times there's roads and there's access to get there. So these, you know, whether it be a, um, hotshot crew or whatever, these different crews who come in by vehicle, they can get into the fire that way. What a smoke jumper is, is you can't get a vehicle into that place. It is a spot where it's tight, there's no vehicles, there's no access. So they'll send us in there, smoke jumpers, jump outta airplanes, and we'll land in these really tight, small drop zones with all of our gear, and we'll put the fire out.
- CWChris Williamson
How do you take water in?
- DGDavid Goggins
We jump out. So everything is-
- CWChris Williamson
Hang on. You're jumping out of a-
- DGDavid Goggins
Airplane, parachute.
- CWChris Williamson
With backpacks of water, like a camel pack type thing?
- DGDavid Goggins
So we'll jump out, we'll have this, it's called a ditty pack. And it, and it sits in, you know, it sits like by your waist, you know-
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- DGDavid Goggins
... on your legs area when you jump out. And that has a lot of your gear. But what happens is once you jump out, the aircraft will go lower and will push out all the rest of your gear, your water pumps.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, and that'll get air dropped in-
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... with its own little parachutes.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
Right. Got you, got you, got you.
- DGDavid Goggins
So a lot of our main gear gets dropped into us, and then we're out there for several days until the fire is put out by us and only us.
- CWChris Williamson
That's insane.
- DGDavid Goggins
It's insane. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Why'd you do that?
- DGDavid Goggins
Well, when I left the military, um, you, I'm always looking for more. I'm always looking for what's the next thing for myself. How can I grow? And that right there was the next thing for me. You know, I didn't wanna sit back and, you know, just enjoy my retirement from the military. That's, there's, there, there's no growth in that. So I decided to go out and do this, so...
- CWChris Williamson
You jump out of an airplane-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... with a team. You get your kit also parachuted outta the back.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
You're now in the middle of an area where there's no evac, there's no vehicles that can come and get you.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- 7:00 – 13:21
The Danger of Success Making You Soft
- CWChris Williamson
one of the things that I've been thinking about is the danger of success making you soft.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
And this must be something that you've battled with over the last few years.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
More money, more attention, more fame, more free things if you wanted, more opportunities to go places and do stuff with people.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
How have you dealt with this battle of success not making you soft?
- DGDavid Goggins
You have to cap it. You have to learn to cap success. So, what I do is, like right now, I don't like doing podcasts. There's a lot of things I don't do have to do now to get the message out there to help people out, and what I mean by capping success, I believe everybody should live their life. So, everything that someone says in life, take it with a grain of salt. Take what they give and don't be like, "Oh, David Goggins said this," or whoever said this. No. Do not take what I say and do exactly what I say. So for me, what makes me who I am, because my mission is very different than yours or anybody else's, I have to go into a situation, "Okay, I'm a guy who wants to make people better. For people to get better, I have to continuously get better myself." For me to do that, I can't just say, "Oh, I have this resume. The resume is there forever. I'm good." I have to cap my success because for me to help people out, I can't just say I did it once, and I'm good. I have to continue to reinvent the wheel of the mind and figure out more and more ways for you to pull 'cause if I have a cookie-cutter message, it may hit 5 people out of 25. You just failed. My message needs to be in a way where I can hit all 25 people. It needs to be broad enough to where all 25 people may not like the message, but they're getting something from it, and that is evolution. You must continue to evolve, and you don't evolve, for me, in my job, unless I cap myself somewhere and say, "Okay, you made this much money. Get back to fucking work. It's time to get back to work. Stop hearing yourself talk. Get off the podcast. Don't be on social media too much. Cut out all the fucking noise. Get back to the fucking mental lab 'cause that's where the knowledge came from." So, for me, I must cap myself so I can come back with better, more unique knowledge versus the cook- you know, all that cookie-cutter knowledge that's out there, that's why people buy the books I have because it's not cookie cutter. It's real knowledge.
- CWChris Williamson
But, the other thing now is, when you first started, you were a lone ranger.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
Nobody really knew who you were outside of some obscure endurance places and half-heard truths of these weird myths.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
But now, you've got people's expectations-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... layered on top as well.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
So, not only have you got to deal with success potentially making you soft, so you've got to cap that. You've got to say no to more money, and opportunities, and cool people.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
You've also got this extra layer of expectation-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... that's coming through from other people, too. And I think that you talk about trained humility-
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
... in the new book, too.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
I've got to presume that that fits into this equation.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right. It fits in big time, um, and that's one big reason why I do Fight Fire because the o- all the knowledge for myself comes from that place. It doesn't come from the place of success. My knowledge does not come from a place of suc- Like, 'cause, for me, like, I built Goggins from the ground up. I was born David Goggins. David Goggins wasn't good enough. He was a scared, bullied, uh, abused kid, um, who struggled in life. And that kid, whenever something got tough, no matter how hard I trained, no matter how ready I was, whenever something got tough for me, David Goggins, the real David Goggins, would come out, and he would quit. So, I realized this over a period of time. So, I had to build Goggins. And in that process, I had to go back to that mental lab, and that mental lab is at scratch. That mental lab is in that trained humility. And so, that's where I get better. I get better when I'm digging holes in the ground, when I'm waking up early knowing I don't have to do these things. That's where I get better.
- CWChris Williamson
So, it's important to stay hungry.
- DGDavid Goggins
It's important to stay hungry, but it's important more to stay humble within that hunger. So while you're hungry, a lot of people are hungry, but humility is everything.
- CWChris Williamson
What was that story about William Crawford, the janitor?
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah. So this guy won the Medal of Honor. So he won the Medal of Honor and which is the highest award in the military, and this guy went to the Air Force Academy, and he was a janitor, and no one knew who the fuck this man was. He had the highest award in all the military for heroics, for heroics, saving lives, putting his life on the line, coulda g- you know, could've been killed.And he is now basically, you know, cleaning shitters for young kids, and we can all imagine how that probably went. You know, there was probably some, you know, little bit of taunting here and there, and he just sat there and cleaned the shitter. So that's why he's in my trained humility part, because for this man to be at the level he was and have that kind of humility to go, "I'm a Medal of Honor winner, but I'm going to put that in my closet, and I'm gonna pick up my broom and dustpan, and I'm gonna pick up, you know, this rag and clean this shit for these young men." That right there is amazing for me, man. That's, that's where you grow. That's, that's growth. Huge growth. And also it shows that he was doing his job. He was a servant. He didn't look at himself any better than anybody else. And the second that you do that, you've totally lost. You cannot look at yourself... Like people, with me even, I always look at people, I, I know where you are. I know where, 'cause I've been there. That's why I help so many people out. I've, I've never been above you. I've always pretty much been beneath you, and that's where my knowledge came from, so I know how to reach those people who are in the dungeon, because I've been there so many times.
- 13:21 – 17:54
Is SEAL Selection Too Harsh?
- CWChris Williamson
of getting too soft, did you see that there was a news story that came out recently about the treatment of SEALs during their selection process?
- DGDavid Goggins
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
Did you see this?
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah, I saw it.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, they were getting, uh, sprayed with tear gas-
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... uh, whilst they were on the ground, and they were made to sing Happy Birthday so that they couldn't hold their breath while it was happening.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right. Right.
- CWChris Williamson
And there was a, a quote from, uh, this guy, "I think this type of training is really senseless," said Sven Yort, a Duke University associate professor who studies tear gas and its effects. "It looks more like a form of hazing."
- DGDavid Goggins
Right. I see all that. Trust me. Like I said, you know, I'm not gonna sugarcoat anything. I understand that guy. I understand exactly where you're coming from. That is your personal opinion, and I totally get that, but there's very few people in this world who want to do a job like that, and it takes a different kind of mindset. Is it tear gas appropriate? I don't know. How hard that training is, I don't expect anybody to understand it but 1%. But the loud voices of this world are the 99% who don't understand exactly what you have to do. That's why when I speak and you don't understand me, it's probably a good thing, 'cause that probably means I'm in a area of life that you're not in, which is fine. That's why I don't judge people, and this guy right here judging that, unless you've been there and done that, and you really can't speak about it unless you're in those situations that are so hard that it takes a special human being to get through them.
- CWChris Williamson
I think it's the same kind of feeling that I get when I heard about Elon Musk telling the employees at Twitter-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... "We're going to ask you to work harder than you've ever worked in your life."
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
This is a place, Twitter is now a company where people can go if they want to be in the top naught point naught, naught, naught one percent of hardworking programmers and software developers on the planet.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
And there was, everybody was up in arms, "This is unbelievable, we're going back to this old version of capitalism where the, the worker is being abused and used and thrown away." What they didn't account for is that there is a non-insignificant cohort of people for whom that's their dream.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
People who want to be able to get up on a morning, having gone to bed four hours before, and can contribute to some sort of progress-
- DGDavid Goggins
Sure.
- CWChris Williamson
... that they think, "This, this is what I'm here for."
- DGDavid Goggins
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
And it's the same with the SEALs. If you're not the sort of person that is built to go through selection, it's like speaking a different language.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's it, and that's why I don't try to convince people otherwise. I understand that, why you're confused. I understand why you say things like that. I'm not saying anything bad about that. I understand it. But also, what you don't understand, what you fail to understand, is the other side, that you need people like that. You need the Elon Musks, you need the David Goggins, you need some of these Navy SEALs, some of these other people. You need those people, and they don't, they forget that, and it takes a very, very unique person, a unique mind, to do some of these jobs that are necessary in this world.
- CWChris Williamson
Well, especially when we're thinking about someone going to war.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
Like, do you want your armed forces to be underprepared for the battlefield because you didn't want to be too mean to them in advance?
- DGDavid Goggins
That's, that's the problem. That's the problem, and that's a problem that I've always had, I've always had, is that right there, is that w- even, even some of the most trained people in the world fall back on that. It's easy to talk about. Like I said, when you go through it once, when... It's a perishable skill. Hardness, mental hardening, mental toughness, it's a perishable skill. Just because you went through some training once and you got through it doesn't mean it lasts fucking forever, and that's why most people hated me in my life, because I realized that. You don't just say, "Oh, I got it. I'm checked off. I'm good for the rest of my life." That's why you gotta requal. You requal on fucking everything, and you definitely must requal when it comes to the mind. That is one of the biggest requalifications you must have, and when you're at that level, you gotta requal every fucking day, not once a year.
- 17:54 – 23:40
Running the Moab 240
- DGDavid Goggins
- CWChris Williamson
One of the other things that you did to stop yourself from getting soft was running the Moab 240.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
Talk me through that experience.
- DGDavid Goggins
So, um, I hadn't run a 100-mile race in, I think it was about six years. You know, I had, you know, some heart surgeries, I had some...... maybe some questioning in my mind about, I call it part-time savage. I started kind of going through this. I started getting, you know, a little bit of injuries, a little bit of this, a little bit of that. Things that, back in the day, never slowed me down. (inhales deeply) So when I got my head out of my ass and realized that, A, we have more left, we can still push harder, we're not there yet, I realized, talking to a guy named Cameron Hanes who did this race, 240-mile race, and, um, I was thinking, I go, "Is- is this the, is this the new level? Is this the new, is this the new push?" So when I decided to do that race, it was in the back of my mind, like, "Man, I've really become an expert at running 100-mile races." So for me, this was the new level, the 200-plus-mile race. And what was so amazing about that, as you probably read in the book, I had a hard time the first time doing it. I came back and did better, but what's amazing about the human mind is that it becomes your new norm. Like, to- to- to think that I can run 200 miles, 240 miles, and that becomes like running 50, I never thought that was possible. This is why I'm- I'm always pushing that limit, because I know that within pushing these limits, there's always more. So I ended up doing, like, almost, like, back-to-back 200-mile runs. When the 200-mile race, 240-mile race was hard at once, it became something that was very easy after I figured it out. So that's why that happened.
- CWChris Williamson
Well, you got lost-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... on the first one.
- DGDavid Goggins
Oh, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
And then you went to bed and woke up halfway through the night, and nudged Kish and said, "How long have we got left until the end of the race?" But because you hadn't completed the official route, you couldn't go across the official finish line.
- DGDavid Goggins
(smacks lips) Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
So you ring your race, um, like, pacers?
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
Some of whom had gone home.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
What ... Like, what- what do you think? It's-
- DGDavid Goggins
So-
- CWChris Williamson
... 3:00 in the morning and you're ringing people saying, "You know that race that we just finished because of health problems?"
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
"Can we go back and finish it?"
- DGDavid Goggins
So the crazy thing about that in that- in that spot, so I got lost the first time, I got seriously sick, was off course, so basically, I bedded down about 12 hours, then I got back in the race. So I was still part of the official race now.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay.
- DGDavid Goggins
So the first time I got lost, I- I got sick, got back, got lost, got back in the race after 12 hours of being out of the race. So now I get to about 200 and some odd miles and I'm sick as hell, can't breathe, high altitude pulmonary edema, totally jacked up, and now the doctor tells me, "If you get off course now and you go to the doctor, you won't be able to come back and finish the race." So I had to make a- a call, like, "You know what? I'm pretty messed up." Got off. So this is where you're talking about, I'm s- literally laying in bed and I'm feeling better, and I thought ... Honestly, I s- swear to God, I thought that someone was speaking to me. I thought it was Jennifer. It was like, "You're not done yet, motherfucker." And I'm like, "What the fuck is this?" It was actually probably my subconscious saying, "Get your ass back out there." So I wake Jennifer up, I'm like, "Hey, how much time do we have until the cutoff?" I know that I'm already, you know, DNF'd. So no matter what happens here, I'm not gonna be an official finisher of this race.
- CWChris Williamson
This isn't for glory.
- DGDavid Goggins
No. This is now for the fact that you can. So e- you can sit here and not, and think about that for a whole year until you come back here and do this, or you can go out there for yourself and take some- some kind of pride in knowing that you could and you did. So basically, I wake her up, "How much time left?" She goes something like ... I don't know what it was, but how many ... What did you say the time was? I think we had like seven hours. Like, you know, whatever. And half my crew had left and there was two people there. I woke them up. They were getting ready to get on a plane. I said, "Look, can you guys help me out? I have 40 miles to go. I'm gonna have Jennifer drop me back off at the spot where I left, then I'm gonna finish this fucking race." And I couldn't cross the finish line because I wasn't a official finisher. So I end up finishing on a road on- you know, by a- by a telephone pole, and that was my official finish. It ended up being like 250 miles, 255 miles, but it was one of the best races of all time because we're going through it fast, but all the fucking times that I was like, "This is ... I- I'm not going back," and I went back. "I'm not going back," and I went back. "I'm not going back," and I went back. It showed me even more of what we have as- as- as humans if we're willing to go there and we're willing to push that extra step. And like I say, you know, I always tell people ... A lot of people be like, "Man, how do you do what you do?" At the end of the day, I ask myself one question: Can I take one more step? And usually the answer is yes. So if you can answer that question and not take another step, that is real failure. That is real quitting. So a lot of people can take one more step but they choose not to. I don't know if you can take two steps. You gotta answer that question after you take the first step. But I can always take one more step, so if I choose not to, that's on me and I gotta live with that.
- 23:40 – 32:11
David's One-Second Decision Theory
- DGDavid Goggins
- CWChris Williamson
Does that link in with the one-second decision?
- DGDavid Goggins
(smacks lips) Yes. Yes. So the one-second decision is I had to live through that one-second decision several times during this race. So this race took me 100 and some hours. Okay? And this is what people don't get. For you to finish that race, even though I DNF'd, I still finished in the time, so there's a lot of pride in that. If you're 100 and some odd hours, let me use Hell Week as this is a perfect example. Hell Week's 130 hours.And 130 hours is a lot of seconds, a lot of fucking seconds, and if you lose ... Let's say you win every second but one, you lost. It only takes one second for you to lose the whole thing. So the one-second decision is just that. You're in a situation where life is sucking. Let's say you're in extreme cold water, and your life is flashing before your eyes. Every time that wave goes over your head, your thought process is, "I gotta get the fuck out of this water." And you're in Hell Week, and you're f- hour one of 130 fucking hours. It's all fun and games, okay, because at the beginning of Hell Week, the guns are going off. It's like a pep rally, so you're fucking hyped up. And your boys are linked arms and you're getting sprayed, and it's like a fucking pep rally. The instructors are yelling at you. Bombs are going off. Concussion grenades, blanks from M60s. "Yeah, hooya, fuck yeah, fuck yeah, yeah, motherfucker, yeah." But then what they do is they shut that shit off. They shut it off. All that hooya, all that hype gets real quiet, and they march you out to that surf zone for something called surf torture. And it's that water of that Pacific Ocean that's cold as shit. So no more pep rally, you're now in your head, you're linked arms with, you know, your brothers beside you. You don't know if they're gonna be there long or not. You don't care. You're thinking about yourself. You lay back, and that first wave hits you. Your mind goes straight from hour two all the way to hour 130. You can't process five days of this shit. You're now in a, you're, you're now in a "fuck you," like, "I gotta get out of here." You're in fight or flight. "It's cold, I can't be cold this long." And then this is when that one-second decision comes in. You forgot every reason why you wanted to be there. You don't care about Seals. You don't care about any of this shit. You don't care about fighting for your country. You don't care about that gaudy gold trident that they put on your chest. You don't care about any of that shit no more. All you wanna do is go back home. You want the warmth. You may want something to eat. You want your girl to hold you. All those things of comfort are there in that one second, and this is where people lose. So what I do in that one second ... 'Cause we all think about quitting when shit's hard, but what you have to do in that one second is hard to process information during pain, because that pain takes over, and you can't think rationally. You're thinking about fight or flight, save yourself. That's not a rational thought. It's not a thought that's gonna get you through hard times. Most people fail that one second. So what happens, what I do in that one second, it's, uh ... And there's a bigger process to all this, but in that one second, I physically stayed in that water, because if I get out of the water, I quit. So I physically stay in the water, but mentally, I'm on the fucking beach with the fucking instructors. And the instructors, it's cold outside, so they got these parkas on. They got their cup of fucking joe, and they're warm 'cause they've already been through it. So now it's your turn to go through it. So mentally, I get back with them. I'm still in the water, physically, but mentally, I'm back with ... I'm chilling. I got my parka on, and now I'm thinking logically, 'cause I'm warm now. Mentally, I'm warm. I've taken that one second, "Let's not quit yet, Goggins. Let's fucking think about your options. Where are you gonna end up if you quit this shit? Where you gonna go? What are you gonna say to yourself? Because you know you're gonna get warm. The second you get out of this water, you could take a shower, and you're gonna be warm, and you're gonna be ... And in five days you could be out." So I start thinking logically. I calm my brain down, 'cause your brain just wants to get the fuck out. Ring the bell, put your helmet down, get warm, and then you're really fucked. And these are the things you have to think about that one-second decision. So that's what that's all about. It's about gaining control of your mind, putting things back into proper perspective, and then saying, "I really do want to be here, and I'm gonna have a bunch of these one seconds through this 130-hour journey. And I have to learn to control these, 'cause if I fail one of these one seconds, I will not be a Seal. I will not be a doctor. I will not be a lawyer. I will not be whatever the fuck it is." So that's how important that one-second decision is. It's all about your mind takes control of you. You have to say, "Fuck you, I run this motherfucker." And that's what that's all about.
- CWChris Williamson
We'll get back to Goggins in one minute, but first, I need to tell you about LMNT. LMNT is a tasty electrolyte drink mix with everything that you need and nothing that you don't. I've replaced my morning coffee with LMNT every day for over three years now, and I've never looked back. It means I've optimized my hydration, my brain feels better, I'm not getting mental fog, and it's helping me to curb cravings if I'm fasting throughout the day. Even Video Guy Dean uses it. My favorite flavor is the orange. That and a cold glass of water upon waking feels really, really good. It's a science-backed electrolyte ratio of sodium, potassium, and magnesium, which helps me to feel at my absolute best all day. Also, they have a no BS, no questions asked refund policy, so you can buy it and try it for an unlimited amount of time, and if you do not like it, they'll give you your money back. And you don't even need to return the box. That's how confident they are that you'll love it. Head to drinklmnt.com/modernwisdom to get a free sample pack of all eight flavors with your first box. That's drinklmnt.com/modernwisdom. Projecting yourself forward to see what are the consequences of failing, what are the consequences of stopping-
- DGDavid Goggins
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
... is about as powerful of a motivation strategy as I can think of. You know? Because what you're doing is you're trying to optimize right now to stop the discomfort.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
But what you're gonna pay for that in is shame-
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
... and guilt-
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
... and regret, long term.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
So what you need to be able to do is bundle all of that up, that is as yet unfelt-
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
... but will last for way, way, way longer. You know, the future is much longer than now.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
The future is going to extend out up until the day that you die.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
And the now is just for now. And even 130 hours is just 130 hours.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
And you get to look back, and do you look back with pride and glory, or do you look back with shame and guilt?
- DGDavid Goggins
That's it. That's, that's the one second. You just summarized it right there. And most people fail those one seconds. And then that one second leads to 20 years, 30 years, 40 years of fuck. I have people who have been through training with me, Ranger School, SEAL training, Air Force training, and I get calls from them today, and they have great lives. And all they talk about is how they failed in that one moment. And they can't even great k-... They can't even enjoy their life now, because they're now warm. They're now warm. There's no more suffering. There's no more suffering for me either. And we're in the same boat now. But you're suffering and I... And so we're not suffering, but you're thinking about what you could've been. I am exactly what I should've been. And that's where people start to lose it. 'Cause now I, I realize that in that one second. I go through all that. I know how it's gonna feel 'cause I failed so many times before. Failure is the ultimate thing, man. I failed so many times before, that's why I don't look at failure anymore as failure. I look at it as my first, second, and third attempt. So, that's what that's all about, man.
- CWChris Williamson
Well, I mean,
- 32:11 – 36:03
When Moab Round #2 Wrecked David’s Ass
- CWChris Williamson
you went back to go and do Moab again-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... a second time.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
Which is your second attempt.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right.
- CWChris Williamson
Had you banged your knee up? It was pretty bad in between the first and the second one.
- DGDavid Goggins
It was pretty bad way before either one of 'em.
- CWChris Williamson
Uh-huh. Yeah.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah. It was, it's been jacked up now for about 20 years.
- CWChris Williamson
I've seen some gnarly photos of it recently. It looks-
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... interesting.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah. So, all those miles I've run on this thing, it's, it's, uh, it's been a lot of, uh, it's, it's been a lot of gut checks.
- CWChris Williamson
So you go back-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... you do Moab a second time.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
And then you turn your ass into, like, a hamburger or something-
- DGDavid Goggins
(laughs) Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... as well.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
So it's not just the knee, it's the ass as well now?
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah. So at mile 201, we have a good video of it, matter of fact. Jennifer is like, "There's some people up there." So, at, at... So 201 is a spot where I was really finished in the first Moab.
- CWChris Williamson
So that was a, um-
- DGDavid Goggins
It was-
- CWChris Williamson
... way marker, checkpoint for you-
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... the second time.
- DGDavid Goggins
So Jennifer is extremely happy right now 'cause I'm there.
- 36:03 – 42:52
The Most Painful Pursuit Of David's Life
- CWChris Williamson
all of the physical pursuits that you've endured, which has been the most painful?
- DGDavid Goggins
By far, by far, my first 100-mile race. By far. This, 2019 Moab, the one that I DNF but still finished, (clears throat) that's up there. But when you are...Um, so I guess, you're, you're, you're not prepared to run 100 miles, and you take it for granted, and you didn't do any training at all, and you didn't have the right nutrition. And off a whim, like literally, you're like, "You know what? I wanna raise money for a foundation." That's how that happened. So I don't know if you know the story or not, but basically, I'm sitting there and the Lone Survivor incident happened, where a bunch of, you know, some SEALs died, I wanted to raise money for them. I went through training with most of these guys. So, I had the bright idea to, uh, raise money, you know, I wasn't gonna do a hot dog or hamburger sale. I was gonna do something that people would be attracted to, so I, I Googled the world's toughest events. And what comes up is this race called the Badwater 135. It's 135-mile race through Death Valley in the summertime. Now, I had no idea about ultra running. I didn't know what the fuck ultra running was. But when I heard of, so when I saw 135 miles, I automatically assumed it was a stage race, where you ran like maybe 10, 15 miles, bed down and you got up the next morning and did it. So when I called the race director up, Chris Costman, I'm like, "Hey, I would like to do this race to raise money for a foundation." He goes, "Have you ever run 100 miles?" And I was like, "Like, in, in a week, or like, like what are you talking about?" He goes, "No, like in 24 hours, 'cause that's what you gotta do to qualify." And I was like, "Is that even, is that even possible?" Like, I, I didn't know. So anyway, he goes, "No, you can't get in my race unless you qualify." And I call him up on a Wednesday, and that Saturday ... and I was a bodybuilder at the time. I did cardio 20 minutes a week on the elliptical trainer every Sunday. He goes, "Yeah, Saturday, you're in San Diego, Saturday is a 24-hour race, where you run around a one-mile track for 24 hours, and if you can get 100 miles, I'll consider you in my race." So, I go sign up for this race, and the first 70 miles, I'm doing pretty good. And then I hadn't sat down, I was, uh, hadn't gone to the bathroom. I was eating, I was drinking Myoplex and Ritz crackers. I was, you know, eating Ritz crackers, so-
- CWChris Williamson
Elite nutrition.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah, elite, elite high quality nutrition. So, what happens when you're that ignorant and you go out to do this race, and you sit down in a chair, your body's done. So I'm sitting there, and when you sit down for the first time in over 12 hours, your body's now going through some metamorphosis. Like, go fucking home. Go, go to a doctor, get some help. But I'm sitting there and I had this urge to go to the bathroom, and there's a Porta Potty in front of me, that fucking wall, but I can't get up 'cause my blood pressure's all messed up from my great nutrition that I was on. And so I can't stand up. So, I look at my ex-wife, and I literally say, "I'm gonna shit on myself right now." So I sit there and I'm, I'm shitting up my back and I'm peeing blood down my leg, and I have 30 miles to go. And I end up finding a way to get through that 30 miles, and when I got done with that race, it's the worst pain I can ever even ... I can't even describe the pain of that last 30 miles to anybody. No one ... It, it's very hard.
- CWChris Williamson
Whole body?
- DGDavid Goggins
Whole body. Um, so when it ended, I, I, I'm literally dizzy going up my stairs to, to get to my house. I'm literally ... I have my arms wrapped around her going up the stairs, and every flight of stairs, I got, I have to lay down because I can't stay upright for too long or I'm gonna pass out. So I finally get in the house, and when I get in the house, I'm once again on the floor. I'm in the kitchen on the floor, just laying there. I finally make it to the bathroom, into the tub, I get rolled in the tub, and she puts the water on me. I'm just laying there with water coming on me. And what I pee out looks like Coca-Cola. And I'm laying there in the worst pain of my entire life. I'm shaking, I'm jacked up, and all I could think about was, I can't believe what I just done, because when you get to 70 miles of a race and you felt the way I did, it's, to me it was humanly impossible to even think about going 30 more miles in that shape. And once you do it, what, what came over me when that shower hit me and it, and the reality hit that I just ran 101 miles, and that last 31 miles was something that I can't even describe to people. And she's like, "We gotta get you to the hospital." So at the time, my mom was seeing this doctor, and he was like, you know, so, so she's describing to my mom what I'm going through. He's like, "You gotta get in the hospital now." And I just said, "Just, just shut up and let me enjoy this pain. I don't want anything to numb it. I don't want anything right now." Because what I had done was I just, in my mind, and people will take this wrong, and take it as wrong as you want to, I don't really care, I had just climbed a mental wall that was amazing, and I didn't want anybody to take that pain away from me at that point, 'cause I was, that, that was all confirmation.
- CWChris Williamson
It seems like... I've heard you tell that story a number of times.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
It's amazing. Did that set the tone or the rhythm for what you wanted to try and achieve and feel again? Each time there's, you're pushing further, there's more difficulty.
- DGDavid Goggins
I never wanted to feel it again. I never wanted to feel it again. But what it did was it showed me what is possible, and that's what set the new stage for me. That's when I realized, oh man, I've really been underachieving my entire life.I'm not saying that you have to go to that place, because that place is a dangerous, dangerous place that y-
- CWChris Williamson
Borderline rhabdo, heart arrhythmia, da-da-da-da-da-da-da.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah. Oh, it wasn't borderline rhabdo, it was all that.
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- DGDavid Goggins
But you don't, you don't wanna go there. But it taught me what is possible. So, from that 19-hour lesson, one of the best, biggest lessons I had in my life, it, it taught me like, "Okay, I got it. Check."
- 42:52 – 53:33
Why Make a Mixtape of Hate Messages?
- CWChris Williamson
Tell me about this mixtape of hate that you've made.
- DGDavid Goggins
(laughs) So, what started happening is, as you get bigger, and as you get more successful, you open the door for people to critique every fucking thing you do. And most of the people who are critiquing you usually aren't where you are. And all their critiquing comes from people who are really at a low level of life, which is sad. But what we do, people who are on the upper level, hearing the haters at the lower level, like I say, there, you'll never meet a hater doing better than you. True statement. I started having fun with it. So, I'll go through the comments, while- while most people don't go through comments, I go through them intentionally to look for the bad ones. And while I'll block and delete you because the people on my page don't need that negative energy, I'll block and delete you, but I take a snapshot on my phone, and I put it in the archive. So, what happens is, there's days where I'm like, "You know what? I really don't wanna do this today." And I'm like, "Oh, hang on." So, I started making these mixtapes with all of these hate messages about people talking shit, and it became such a source of fuel that it was amazing because I know why you hate me. You hate me because you're probably in the bed right now, you're probably an underachiever, you're probably somebody who doesn't wanna do anything with your life. So, I make you question everything about yourself, so I'm gonna continue making you question yourself by coming out here and being even more successful. So, I listen to that while I run, I sometimes play it in the house, and it sometimes gets on Jennifer's fucking nerves 'cause I'm sitting there listening to somebody talk mad shit on a loop about me, and she's like, "Why do you do this shit?"
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- DGDavid Goggins
It's half comical and it's half, um, it's half inspiring. I'm actually inspired by it.
- CWChris Williamson
I've heard you say previously that listening to music while you train is cheating.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
So, what you're telling me-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... is that the silence of your own dark thoughts isn't enough of a soundtrack, and you've had to crowdsource insults-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... from the internet, self-narrate it-
- DGDavid Goggins
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
... and then play it to yourself while you train?
- DGDavid Goggins
That's it. I do that sometimes, yes.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- DGDavid Goggins
Yes.
- CWChris Williamson
Have you got your phone on you right now? I wanna hear it.
- DGDavid Goggins
No.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- DGDavid Goggins
My, I, I don't travel with my phone.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, very interesting.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yeah, my phone does not go with me anywhere.
- CWChris Williamson
Why is that?
- DGDavid Goggins
Once again, man, like, right now, I'm with you. A lot of times people are in conversations or they're somewhere, they're elsewhere. You may think they're with you, but they're not. That phone is the biggest distraction in the world. When the time, w- so when it comes time for the phone, I'm on the phone. When I'm not, I don't use it. I'm all about being present where I'm at, so that's why that phone right now... Uh, no, we do have it. It's in your, it, it's, it's silenced, it's off, so I do have my phone right now, but, but usually I don't take it anywhere I go.
- CWChris Williamson
Got you.
- DGDavid Goggins
So...
- CWChris Williamson
While you're listening to the self-narrated insults of random people on the internet that you don't like-
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
... what are you thinking of while you're listening to that while you're working out or while you're walking around the house?
- DGDavid Goggins
How that, back in the day, when I was sometimes getting bullied or in a dark place, how sometimes that would have bothered me. How I would want to clap back, I, I would want to be on there all day explaining myself to people, and how now I'm in a place now where I can hear it and I can actually enjoy it, I can actually know where it's coming from. I've studied it. So, I don't just, like, listen to it and, like, make fun of it. I actually study it because I was once that negative person. I was once that person who saw someone successful and didn't see, "How can I get there?" I was like, "Oh, fuck that. They're probably cheating," or, "They're probably doing this." I was, I was that negative person because I wasn't there and I didn't wanna work to get there. So, these people who hate on people, I've studied them and I've gained a lot of knowledge from them 'cause I gained a lot of knowledge for myself when I was in that dark place. So...
- 53:33 – 57:49
What People Get Wrong About Motivation
- CWChris Williamson
most people get wrong about motivation?
- DGDavid Goggins
They think it's a permanent fix. They think it's something that, that is a constant. They think that, "Maybe once I get it, I'm gonna hold onto it." And that's the thing about that I was telling you, that I always talk about, is nothing is permanent. Nothing is permanent. And a lot of times, you have to learn to perform without motivation. You have to learn to perform without purpose. You have to learn to perform a lot of different things, and that's what people think. They think, "I need to have this motivation to work out, to study, to be better." So if they don't have it, they just don't fucking do it, and that's where you fail. You have to learn to train your mind well beyond motivation. If you have motivation, that's great. That's some kindling to the fire. All it takes is a little bit of fucking spark, you can burn the whole forest up. But motivation, you have to learn to exist without it. You have to learn to be... You have to be your best self when you're least motivated.And that's the tricky part about all that shit. Motivation's just a word. You have to have these different things in your mind on where you wanna go and know that motivation's not gonna get me there, 'cause I'm not gonna always be motivated.
- CWChris Williamson
Jocko said the exact same thing. He said that discipline eats motivation for breakfast.
- DGDavid Goggins
And discipline's good too. But without a clear head space, there's no discipline.
- CWChris Williamson
What do you mean?
- DGDavid Goggins
So, let's say we have a circuit breaker. Okay? And I'm loading everything up to one fucking circuit. Just load it up. It's gonna fucking blow. And once that thing blows, man, the circuit's all fucked up. You gotta have each thing plugged into the right spot, like a fucking crowded garage. You can't put anything in it. Once your brain is crowded, discipline is great, motivation's great, but if you can't fit shit in your brain because it's all fucking cluttered with shit, there's no discipline. You may have it sometimes when it fits in that crowded garage of your mind, but you don't have the consistency that you need to have with that discipline.
- CWChris Williamson
So what are you talking about here? Are you saying doing self-work and reflecting on you as an individual?
- DGDavid Goggins
So-
- CWChris Williamson
Are you doing therapy?
- DGDavid Goggins
I call it my, I call it mental zones. I don't get into it much 'cause we'd be here all day. But basically, is you're organizing your mind so you can put that discipline. So, a lot of people talk about discipline. Okay, great. Why do you fall off the fucking wagon? Why can't I continue with this routine, going to the gym, being better, waking up early, eating the right foods? It's because maybe it's your kids, maybe it's your wife, maybe it's your job, and it's all just stuffed in your fucking brain. You don't have it compartmentalized and organized in these nice shelves. Like, you look in a garage, it's all fucking... A nice, organized militant garage. "Hey, where are my dumbbells?" "Right there." A lot of people whose brain, "Hey, where's my dumbbells?" "Uh, let me look." They're fucking throwing shit, they're looking through totes, they're all fucked up. So where am I gonna put discipline in that mind if I can't find other shit? You gotta be able to find all these different things in your mind. Oh, I can put discipline right there. I can put consistency right there. I can put all these things right there in that spot. So that's what I'm talking about. If your life is not organized, and your life being everything around you, because it takes one little fucked up piece of outside interference to clutter your whole mind.
- CWChris Williamson
Because it's on such a knife edge.
- DGDavid Goggins
That's right. And people don't get that. Your mind has to always be clear. That's why I mo- that's why I meditate two hours every single night, because I refresh, I reorganize the garage, which is my mind, every night. So then discipline's in there, organization, everything is in its right spot. So when I wake up, I'm ready to go.
- CWChris Williamson
What does
- 57:49 – 1:01:31
David’s Daily Routine
- CWChris Williamson
a morning look like for you at the moment? Have you got a routine of some kind?
- DGDavid Goggins
Yes. I run every single morning. So that's the-
- CWChris Williamson
What time are you up? When are you waking up?
- DGDavid Goggins
I'm up about 5:00, 5:30. So, every morning starts with a run. And that's because that's the one thing I hate to do more than anything in the world. So, that's like my cup of coffee. And I'm all about armoring yourself. So, the second you leave your house, and the second you open your phone, the second you do any of that shit, you are now letting in poison and cancer. So, I make sure... A lot of things you can't avoid. So, as I get up, I start to armor plate my mind and body. Like a person who's going to war, you put your body armor on. That's what I'm doing on that run. I'm waking up and I'm giving myself all this armor, so when I come out in the world and I look at that phone, I'm ready. I'm not waking up late. I'm not rushing around. I'm not disorganized 'cause I know I'm gonna get hit in the fucking mouth. There's a, there's a art to getting hit in the fucking mouth. And that is why these things are important. You have to wake up and you have to give yourself belief. You have to give yourself confidence. So that, it starts with that run. So, after the run, I come home, I eat something small, then I hit the gym.
- CWChris Williamson
How long's the run typically at the moment?
- DGDavid Goggins
Nowhere under 12 miles. So, 12 miles is the minimum.
- CWChris Williamson
And what are you getting that done in? How long?
- DGDavid Goggins
It depends. Right now, I'm running a heart rate, so I'm doing like 8:15s, 8:30s 'cause I'm retraining right now because I've been late.
- CWChris Williamson
What's that? Is that zone two for you?
- DGDavid Goggins
Zone two.
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- DGDavid Goggins
'Cause of the leg surgery I had, so I'm going back, starting from scratch. So, anywhere from about an hour thirty to two hours I'll run every day.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm-hmm.
- DGDavid Goggins
So, that's it.
- CWChris Williamson
So you're fasted on the morning?
- DGDavid Goggins
Yes.
- CWChris Williamson
Up, straight out.
- DGDavid Goggins
Straight out.
- CWChris Williamson
90 minutes to two hours of running.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
Back, eat.
- DGDavid Goggins
Eat, and I'm in the gym. So, and then after that, um, to whatever's on the plan for the day. That's how that works every day.
- CWChris Williamson
Are you still doing your stretching? 'Cause you've got two hours of-
- DGDavid Goggins
Every night. Every night.
- CWChris Williamson
... you've got two hours of meditation.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
90 minutes to two hours of running.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
How long is the gym session?
- DGDavid Goggins
Depends. 45 to an hour and a half.
- 1:01:31 – 1:07:52
How to Build Unshakable Confidence
- DGDavid Goggins
- CWChris Williamson
You said before about, um, how you build up self-esteem and confidence and stuff.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
And there's this quote from one of my friends, Alex Hormozi, that says, "You don't become confident by shouting affirmations in the mirror, but by having a stack of undeniable proof that you are who you say you are. Outwork your self-doubt."
- DGDavid Goggins
Yes. That's d- That's-
- CWChris Williamson
Nailed.
- DGDavid Goggins
Nailed.
- CWChris Williamson
Completely nailed.
- DGDavid Goggins
Yes. Because a lot of people will... And some of these motivational people out here, it's- it's the funniest thing in the world to me. They'll go and say, "When you wake up in the morning, pound your chest," you know, fucking, "Look at yourself in the mirror and do all this fucking bullshit." I hope it works. What works for me is that everyday resume, the things I know I've accomplished, the things I know I've done, real hard work, the real calluses on my mind, the real calluses on my hands. That's- That's it. The... You don't need to pound your chest in the mirror the fuck anymore if you have that.
- CWChris Williamson
It seems like, especially with confidence, right, or self-esteem, there's a relationship between confidence and competence.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
So what you're looking to do is trying to have what you believe that you can do be ahead of what you can do.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
And you're not looking for it to be delusional. You don't want it to- to be able to believe that you can do something like fly, right? But you need to have a relationship between the two. But what people are asking for is for their confidence to be so far ahead of their competence that without having even been competent at anything in the beginning. And that's just delusion. That's fantasy.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right. Well, I believe that you have to build belief. Belief is like... There's a after-school special belief where the mom says, "Believe in yourself," and that's all great, but there's also a built belief. And the built belief is one where you are constantly... Like, for me, I came from a bad place. How I build belief is through the- the daunting tasks I put myself through. So, that's proof positive that I can. So it correlates, and that's how this piece-of-shit kid I once thought I was built belief by saying, "Hmm, I was in three hell weeks. I went to Ranger School. I tried out for Delta selection."
- CWChris Williamson
Undeniable stack of proof.
- DGDavid Goggins
That is proof, motherfucker. So whenever you think... Whenever you think you can't, the confidence comes from the thing that you built. You must build belief. You must build confidence. It can't be like, "Hey, um, I'm gonna go knock that shit out." You gotta look over here and say, "I can knock that shit out." It's belief, and it's built on what you put in to yourself.
- CWChris Williamson
Another friend sent me a- a message this morning knowing that we had this- this big thing that we've been working toward for a long time today. He said, uh, "Nietzsche said, 'I know of no better life purpose than to perish in attempting the great and impossible.' The fact that something seems impossible shouldn't be a reason to not pursue it. That's exactly what makes it worth pursuing. Where would the courage and greatness be if success was certain, and there was no risk? The only true failure is shrinking away from life's challenges."
- DGDavid Goggins
Nailed that one also.
- CWChris Williamson
Two for two.
- DGDavid Goggins
Nailed that one also, man.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, it's that, um... It's that dealing with laziness and self-doubt thing-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... I think. Uh... And I do wonder how many people use the look in the mirror, pound the chest, stare into your eyes, say your affirmations, don't get the results-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... and then lose confidence.
- DGDavid Goggins
Well, that's part of it. A lot of it is limited horizons. Limited horizons are like... I use me as an example always. I came from a small town in Indiana, where there was a handful of Black families. And a lot of people in that town... When you come from a town of 8,000 people, it's like we had a local plant, Great Dane. And you're like, "You know what? I wanna work at Great Dane and get a house next to my mom." That's what you know. So many of us come from these small places in our mind that we're not willing to think outside of w- only what we've seen. Our mind works in such a small compartment. And one thing I was able to do was to dream. Many people... But don't make dreams your fucking master. But I was able to dream outside those fucking four walls of that small town. And until you're able to really put yourself into that dream, but don't make dreams your master, that's where you truly become what you're destined to become.
- CWChris Williamson
What do you mean, "Don't make dreams your master"?
- DGDavid Goggins
A lot of people sit back and they dream about being a sports figure, or dream about being a SEAL, or dream about being an astronaut, and all it is is a motherfucking dream. They don't put the work behind the dream. That dream has become their fucking master. When you become the master of your fucking dream is when you say, "I wanna go be a Navy SEAL," and you say, "Okay, I'm gonna lose 106 pounds in less than three fucking months." The dream was the one thing I thought about, and the dream was now gone. Now, what comes in? The dream goes away, and the fucking laundry list of fucking details and tasks come up. "Gotta do this, gotta do this, gotta do this, gotta do this." That's when you become the master of your dream. So, a lot of people out there dreaming-
- CWChris Williamson
Ryan Holiday says, "Talking about the thing and doing the thing vie for the same resources. Allocate yours appropriately."
- 1:07:52 – 1:17:57
Sharing David’s Mother’s Difficult Experiences
- CWChris Williamson
So again, with the audio version of this book-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... you've done podcasts in between each chapter-
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
... where you're recapping what's just happened.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
And this time you brought guests.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
One of which was your mother.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
And you spend a 35-minute conversation-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... sitting down with her and talking about the experiences that she had-
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... with your father and reflecting on that.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
A lot of stuff you'd elected to leave out of the first book.
- DGDavid Goggins
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
So that means there's been a journey that you've gone through to get to the stage where both you and her and collaboratively you felt okay sharing that publicly.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
Like, what's that process like?
- DGDavid Goggins
Well-
- CWChris Williamson
'Cause your mum didn't ask for this. I mean, you kind of also d- you put a book out there 'cause you thought it was useful and now millions and millions of people know about you.
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- CWChris Williamson
But, you know, the, uh, gravity field of your notoriety is starting to bring other people in as well. So what was the journey of getting to that stage like?
- DGDavid Goggins
Well, it wasn't so much me. I had already laid out, you know, a lot of shit about me that was, you know, pretty embarrassing in Can't Hurt Me. So for her, that actually helped her out. She said, "Wow, if you had the courage to go out there and tell people all your shit..." You know, and so that process was... it, it took about four years of me working with my mom because, you know, she was very damaged by what she went through, and so was I. But I knew no one was coming to save me, so I had to go ahead and fix my shit. And she kind of lived in a different place. But when I wrote Can't Hurt Me, it started waking her up that, "Hey man, why do you care? Why do you care so much what people think about you, what you went through? Why, why are you putting so much, so much on other people and what they may say about you?" Like, there's some stuff I talk about, you know, that is pretty embarrassing for some people. But she got to a point in her life where she was able to, you know, stop caring j- 'cause we all have our shit. No one, like, like people... It's so funny to me. There'll be people who are out here commentating about people who are fucking up out here, famous people who are fucking up. And I don't know how they're able to do that when I guarantee while your skeletons are not being out there, if I were to open up your fucking door, motherfucker, how, how, how are you doing that? So I know that about everybody. Like, people love to talk shit about somebody and keep themselves out of it. And so we went through that journey together, and so it allowed her to come out and say, "Yeah, fuck it." You know, I'm, I'm a big person who... I wanna get people the confidence to walk in a room of a million people and none of them like you and you just, like, say, "Fuck you. I'm good," and walk out with you by yourself.
- CWChris Williamson
And you helped your mum do that as well.
- DGDavid Goggins
And now she can look at everybody and say, "Yeah. I fucking married a motherfucker that choked a woman to death. I was in a bad place. I'm good with that."
- CWChris Williamson
One of the days that you focus on a good bit in that conversation is the day that she decided to leave your father-
- DGDavid Goggins
Right.
- 1:17:57 – 1:24:53
Why David Went Back to See His Tyrannical Father
- CWChris Williamson
of this trauma that you go through, why would you choose to go back and see this tyrant of a father for one last time?
- DGDavid Goggins
It was the only way for me to move forward. So, like a lot of times if your back is hurting, it may not be your fucking back. It may be something else in your body that's making your back hurt. For me, I'm like, "Man, why can't I get past this fucking hurdle?" It's like I said, I'm always examining myself every day. What is it? What is it? Well, there's only one thing you haven't examined yet and it's going back to the beast, going back to the demon. So when I went back to him, I realized that that was the unsolved mystery, was I had to look that man in the eye one more time. Like how I studied the, that Navy Seal talking shit in Lion, I got it from this part right here in the book. I went, and I didn't see him anymore as this beast. I started doing research on him, found out that his dad used to beat him really bad so my, his, his dad would put him in front of a furnace, open the furnace up with the flames coming out, and put him right in front of it.... have him bare, butt-naked, and he would whip the shit out of him. And the whole idea of that is, if you move, you're gonna get burned. So stay right here and take your fucking beating. So what happened with him, those demons from his father went to my father, and he tried to transfer them over to me. I had to understand who my father was, understand where he came from, understand, "Why were you so fucking brutal to us?" I got my answers. Took those answers and made myself better from the answers about him. And so that's why it was necessary for me to go back, not... I was looking for an apology so that maybe I could just go be a loser and understand that you fucked me up.
- CWChris Williamson
Why would the apology make you a loser?
Episode duration: 1:52:59
Install uListen for AI-powered chat & search across the full episode — Get Full Transcript
Transcript of episode ngvOyccUzzY
Get more out of YouTube videos.
High quality summaries for YouTube videos. Accurate transcripts to search & find moments. Powered by ChatGPT & Claude AI.
Add to Chrome