Harsh Truths From A Special Forces Master Sergeant - Tim Kennedy (4K)

1. 0:00 – 6:02

   77% of Young People Are Unfit for the Military

   1. CWChris Williamson0:00

      77% of US 17 to 24 year olds could not join the military. The American Department of Defense recently did an analysis of 17 to 24 year olds and found that 77% were unqualified to serve in the military due mostly to obesity, drug abuse, physical health or mental health. Almost half were disqualified for more than one of those reasons.

   2. TKTim Kennedy0:20

      Yeah. It, uh, th- th- this is, um... When we talk about strategic level issues like national security problems, anybody looking at that number from, from the SEAL teams, to the Green Berets, to Ranger, those all are- those select their populations from a larger general population from Combat Arms. Combat Arms gets their people from this larger population of people. So like, as the, as the, the arrowhead gets a little bit more narrow, the availability of people to fund these small groups, to these middle-sized groups, to these potentially larger groups are just shrinking and shrinking and shrinking. This is, um... We're gonna lose to everybody if this trend continues. We just can't, we can't win wars with the bodies that we have.

   3. CWChris Williamson1:09

      Because the catchment area of the normal people feeds into the catchment area of the normal soldiers, feeds into the catchment area of the semi-elite, into the absolutely elite. And if the bottom rung of the ladder, which is population is bad, that trickles all the way up to the very top.

   4. TKTim Kennedy1:23

      Yeah. And the Department of Defense is always, um, a parallel... It- it's just a reflection of what society is at a large, right? When you look at society at large right now, they are just that. They are very large. They're, they're obese. They're gelatinous blobs of broken minds. Um, they don't know if they're a boy or a girl. They definitely have never jumped out of a tree before. So when they go to airborne school and they land on a static line jump and they break both their legs, it's because they've never done it before. You know, you and I grew up chasing kids and like smacking each other with sticks, you know, and this generation hasn't done that. So they're just weaker in every form of the word. I know every generation says this, but right now, statistically, we've never had a data point to point to, to show like that ha- has ever been this bad. So now I, I know like the, the World War II guys were like, "Oh, those Vietnam guys are a bunch of pussies." You know, and the Vietnam guys are like, "Oh man, those GWOT guys are a bunch of pussies." And the GWOT guys are like, "Man, all these millennials and Gen Zs are a bunch of like..." But they really are. (laughs) You know, like, but this is a real big problem and we don't know how to fix it.

   5. CWChris Williamson2:29

      How much do you lay at the feet of the population with this? Because lots of people probably would like to be fitter if they knew what that would feel like. They would like to have better mental health. If they knew what that would feel like, they would... But they weren't aware, they weren't given the tools, there are distractions and, and environmental issues. Technology, screens, social media, porn, video games, all of these things are relatively new inventions that didn't have to be contended with by World War II or Vietnam or even early millennials. So how, how do you think about it sort of individual agency versus environmental, uh, stimulus and restrictions and stuff?

   6. TKTim Kennedy3:06

      Yeah. I think it's a combination of both, right? I don't think you have to point to a specific thing and be like, "This is the thing that's causing the biggest problem." You know, from social media, to pornography, to, um, you know, iPads, screen time, diet. Like the food that we're eating right now is poison. Literally, the things that are in our food is illegal in most other countries, but it's legal here. They're not allowed to export it. You know, if you go to Japan or you go to Italy, a bunch of American foods aren't even allowed to be imported there because they know the things that, that are in them are so disgusting. There's a, there's a hilarious video meme of these Italian moms comparing American pasta to the pasta that they make. And they could not be more dissimilar. They're like, "This is not pasta." Like, we don't know what these ingredients are, but this is not... Like, we use flour and, um, a little bit of salt, you know, and we throw some eggs in there and, and we, and we... And then here's the process of us making pasta. And like this is poison. So it's, I think it's a combination of a whole bunch of things. And then the society culture problem is an- another gigantic piece. We, we have... The culture of being an American has changed in the past 30 years in, in a really negative way. You know, where it used to be family first, you know, like the nuclear family was, was the cornerstone of American society. And like there was the motivating... The motivations for a male figure in the household, like he's gonna be a provider, he's gonna be a protector, he's gonna preserve his family, you know, like he's obviously gonna be sex-driven. So he's like trying to be a, a, a masculine person in the household. S- on the opposite end of that spectrum, the woman would en- would embrace being feminine. You know, the kids respected the parents. If you, if you look at pop culture right now, like Chris, could you point to a single television show that paints a parent in a positive light? I mean, think of every single show on Netflix, Disney, Amazon.

   7. CWChris Williamson5:05

      (clears throat) No.

   8. TKTim Kennedy5:05

      The longest running show currently-

   9. CWChris Williamson5:06

      It's all, it's all flawed. Even the heroes in superhero movies are... It's, uh, Suicide Squad.

   10. TKTim Kennedy5:13

       Yeah.

   11. CWChris Williamson5:14

       Right? It's, uh, uh, Deadpool with Ryan Reynolds. No one can just be... I mean, the closest thing that we got was Top Gun, I guess.

   12. TKTim Kennedy5:19

       Yeah.

   13. CWChris Williamson5:20

       That was it.

   14. TKTim Kennedy5:21

       And, and he's, he's, he's broken, but...

   15. CWChris Williamson5:23

       Yes.

   16. TKTim Kennedy5:23

       And that's definitely an anomaly. Like that's on the outside of the average. That's, uh, the outliers. When you look at Homer, like the longest running cartoon TV series right now, when you go into his brain, he's motivated by three things. Beer, donuts, and c- cluelessness. You know, he's the idiot in the whole entire family. And you know, from Modern Family to-

   17. CWChris Williamson5:48

       Family Guy.

   18. TKTim Kennedy5:49

       Yeah. Every single one of them. Like the parent figure is the most disgusting, despicable person there. So of course that's gonna naturally be eroding the view of this generational passing of information.... that generational

2. 6:02 – 9:22

   The Important Role of Wise Grandparents

   1. TKTim Kennedy6:02

      gap from grandparents to children used to be very commonplace, right? Like, I learned how to magnetize a screwdriver, I learned how to charge a battery, I learned, like, the tricks and the trades of, like, how to hold a hammer and how one hammer was different than a different hammer, and that hammer was specific to a job. And, you know, while my dad could have taught me that, it was actually my grandpa that did that. And I was able to receive that easier from my grandpa than it was my own father. Um, and that's how it has been for hundreds of years until now. Now, you see no, um, kind of, cross-pollination of ideas from one generation to two generations ago, from, like, the grandparents to the grandchild. And that's tragic. There's a huge loss of information there.

   2. CWChris Williamson6:46

      Well, the desire for people to move out at age 16 or 18 or 20 and be in a different country... I mean, I say this as someone who is in a different country, but pan-generational living in some commune-style small village would have been the way that everything was done. Do you know what the grandmother hypothesis is? It's one of the reasons or the evolutionary justifications for why women go through menopause.

   3. TKTim Kennedy7:10

      No.

   4. CWChris Williamson7:10

      Right. So, there's a question to be asked. Most animals aren't able to continue to reproduce while they are... Uh, it's their reproduction doesn't stop while they're still alive. Their capacity to reproduce doesn't... It ceases at the same time that they die, typically. Whereas for humans, you have this weird period, you know, 40s for women, 40s to 50s where they're still about, so you'd think, well, they're a drain on resources and they're no longer contributing any more kin, so what are they here for? And the argument is that human child-rearing is so complex and alloparenting needs to be done, which is the shared parenting of kids from mothers to grandmothers to aunties and close friends, that what you actually need is a grandmother in that sort of matriarch head of the household position who is able to deal with the interpersonal, political backbiting of, you know, 10 women below her that are part of her family and telling them what to do and helping to raise the children and coordinating stuff like that. So, that's a very important role, whilst not still continuing to produce children.

   5. TKTim Kennedy8:13

      Yeah.

   6. CWChris Williamson8:13

      So, it's like, it's so important to the way that humans develop, that it's literally built into female biology.

   7. TKTim Kennedy8:19

      Yeah.

   8. CWChris Williamson8:20

      That's how important it is.

   9. TKTim Kennedy8:20

      You see it culturally. You know, if you go to native, native, Native American tribes, when a girl is having her first period, the, the grandmother would take that child away and teach her all of, like, "Okay, this is how you take care of yourself. This is... During this period of, you know, five to seven days, you're gonna be drinking extra water." You know, like, "This is, this is how you clean yourself." Um, and you go down to South America, a bunch of cultures down there, they're actually, like, traditional tribal periods where that granddaughter would go to the grandmother and she would spend a week or two weeks with this grandmother learning all of the, the birds and bees of life.

   10. CWChris Williamson8:55

       Mm.

   11. TKTim Kennedy8:55

       And, um, the, that transfer of knowledge about how to raise a child, about how to take care of their body, about what this cycle looks like... Like, what is going on in America where now we look at this, the prior generation as these old broken idiots that you can just walk up to on the street in, in New York and slam 'em in the face-

   12. CWChris Williamson9:15

       Mm.

   13. TKTim Kennedy9:15

       ... which we see all the time. Um, it's, it's been an erosion of respect of these other generations.

3. 9:22 – 17:08

   Young People’s Views on Conscription

   1. TKTim Kennedy9:22

   2. CWChris Williamson9:22

      There's a, an interesting trend. I found this article about conscription for Gen Z and some of the feedback that Gen Z gave about that. "'I'm going to war for Rishi Sunak. Give your head a wobble. I've got things to do,' said 23-year-old TikToker Charlie Melot in a widely-shared video she posted on a platform over the weekend. 'I'm gay,' she continued. 'I'm northern and I will play those cards.' 26-year-old content creator iAmePee uploaded a similar video. 'I'm sitting here naked eating a bowl of yogurt,' she begins, 'reading about how we might have to go to war. They want to send me, a little girl, to the front line.' The army is simply no longer seen as a moral endeavor. As a 24-year-old, the last war in my living memory was not a barnstorming defeat of the Nazis, but rather a series of wars and invasions in the Middle East exposed as failures and widely thought to be based on lies. The belief held by older generations that the British Army is solely a force for good in the world does not stand up anymore. As Gen Z would put it, the military propaganda is not propaganding."

   3. TKTim Kennedy10:17

      Yeah. The, um... One, what a entitled little pricks. Um, how, how sad is that? There, there, there sh- should be a yearning to serve. Um, I, I've found nothing more meaningful in my life than finding opportunities to do good to somebody or for something that is bigger or better than myself, and I've, as a, as an individual, have found growth in those, in those times, more so than anything else in life. Um, but a whole bunch of people right now don't want to serve anyone but themselves. They wanna build a brand, you know, they want food delivered to their door. Um, it's just so shortsighted in, in realizing that sometimes it takes time to develop who you are as a person, and that development comes from struggle and failure and service. On the military front, uh, you don't think that those young men and women coming out of the Great Depression had things to do when they learned that Nazis were flooding across the borders throughout Europe? You know, you don't think that during the Korean War, as America has the largest economic boom in history, uh, in the history of our species, that those, that Americans didn't have something to do besides fight communism in a land that most people had never even heard of before? You know, go to Vietnam, you know, the, the ones that were then conscripted, the, the draft occurs and hundreds of thousands of people had no choice but to go serve their country. Um, you don't think they had better things to do as, as, like, the great awakening of, of culture is happening in the '60s and '70s? Um, you know, we're, we're fighting for civil rights, we're fighting for the rights of women, we're fighting, um, for transparency within the government. You know, we, we lose one of the greatest presidents our country's ever had. Like, all of this is in real tough times.... but I get that you want to sit there naked and eat your yogurt. But you think that that's more important than what was happening previously? Like they didn't have other things to do? It's- it's- it's so pathetic and childish. I just look at it like a petulant child.

   4. CWChris Williamson12:25

      How would you fix... Or how do you think about fixing the culture and the populace's perspective of the armed forces and service?

   5. TKTim Kennedy12:37

      Yeah, I think it's a c- communication problem on Department of Defense side. I think we failed to clearly show what we do. Um, you know, like, people look at my resume and be like, "Man, that guy, all he's done in his adult life is gone overseas and killed." That's f- the furthest thing from the truth. There have been periods where I had to do that to- to create stability and security within a nation, but why? Why were we doing that? It was to give that place an opportunity to exist, where democracy could have a foothold, where a hook could be set, and that place had a chance to live. The better, uh, the more secure and the more stable a world has, a country like ours that is built off capitalism has more countries to do commerce with. Um, but on the human- on the human rights side of it, with stability and security comes opportunity. Opportunity for young girls to learn how to read, for young men to find occupations besides working i- within terrorism or slinging- slinging some form of human suffering. And, uh, we have to communicate to that gay girl eating yogurt naked on her couch, what does it look like to serve? And I think they'd be blown away to realize that we go to the sum of the most downtrodden cultures on the planet and give them a chance. We give them opportunity. We create something that they've never had in their... Like, if you were born in America, you won the lottery. You know, like, you're- you're in the safest, richest planet- place on the planet to have ever existed. Like, you look one continent to our east, slightly south, and you can't go to a country that doesn't have... Um, when I say, like, third world poor, I'm not talking, like, favelas in Brazil. I'm talking, like, they're one meal away from starving to death. And starving to death, when we say, "Man, I'm so hungry, I'm starving," starving to death means, like, you are so malnourished that if- if you even eat a meal, it might kill you because your body can't process the calories that are in it. Um, they've never seen suffering and- and human desperation like we see all over the world, and we get to go to that place and give them a chance. It's like, how do you tell a girl that's sitting there on TikTok? Um, I don't know.

   6. CWChris Williamson14:53

      I think the presumption, what it sounds like the presumption is, is this is, you know, colonial powers, it's something to do with oil. This is, you know, the military industrial complex trying to take over some country. It doesn't sound like, uh, aid. It doesn't sound like liberation. It doesn't sound like assistance or medicine or health care or any of those things. What it sounds like is just more colonialism going on, white people invading brown people. Uh, that- that's what war is.

   7. TKTim Kennedy15:24

      Yeah. Uh, colonialism has existed for forever. And some of the greatest things to happen to some countries were them being conquered, and then settled, and then commerce occurs, and then for the first time, that country isn't tribally just killing each other. Uh, it's really easy to, like, label any form of expansion of a country or an idea or a culture negatively. There are cultures that are better than other cultures. I know we're supposed to be like super inclusive. Um, I could list a couple dozen cultures that are so disgusting and so evil where, you know, a 67-year-old man can have five, ten wives, and guess what? Those wives are little girls. As soon as they have their first period, they are eligible to be sold and married to this dude. You, please tell me that it would not be better for Britain or for America or for Mexico to go over and settle that country. It would be 100% better, and the people there would be better off for it. Um, but like, oh, we have to appreciate all these cultures. We def- definitely don'twannak assume any of these... No, there are better cultures. And, um, the world would be better off. It'd be a more peaceful place. Not- n- no- not everybody has to be Westernized. That's not what I'm saying. Um, but there are evil ideas, and there are evil religions, and there are evil cultures. And, uh, man, I just wish that... But there are also s- shared values. You know, there are norms that are beautiful that transcend cultures and transcend countries and transcend borders. And those ideals like murder is wrong, rape is wrong, those ideas are not wrong in some cultures. Well, those cultures are evil.

   8. CWChris Williamson17:07

      Yeah, I wonder,

4. 17:08 – 21:20

   The Armed Forces Needs New Messaging

   1. CWChris Williamson17:08

      I wonder what needs to happen from a messaging perspective. Uh, it certainly needs to maybe highlight at least two things that I can think of. One being the honor in making a bad place better, and the second one being the, uh, sort of heroism and sense of purpose and meaning that people who do that get-

   2. TKTim Kennedy17:31

      Yeah.

   3. CWChris Williamson17:32

      ... because it seems strange that an entire culture, uh, an entire generation can talk about meaninglessness, purposelessness, hopelessness. You know, 60% of teenage girls say that they have regular or persistent feelings of hopelessness. I think 30% of girls in that same age bracket have seriously considered taking their own lives. If that's the case, surely one of the things that a lot of people in the armed forces say is the most meaningful thing, probably maybe except family, uh, that they do. Well, that seems like a pretty good antidote to me. But I guess what it sounds like, what it looks like to people who haven't had the messaging put across in the right way is, "Oh, this is just hard things for bad ends."

   4. TKTim Kennedy18:17

      Yeah.The- I don't think there's anything more dangerous than a young man or woman without purpose. There's- there's nothing that will destroy and erode that person's future than their lack of purpose. There's also nothing more beautiful, and I'll just talk to young men specifically, than a young man with purpose. You know, like during the Holocaust, when those rumors started coming across the Atlantic that Jews were being put on trains and taken to no one knows where, but nobody sees them again, but we see towers of smoke coming out of these places like Auschwitz. And young men are like, (laughs) "No. Fuck no. Yeah, I'll- I'll storm beaches, I'll climb cliffs, I'll jump out of airplanes for the first time behind enemy lines-

   5. CWChris Williamson19:05

      Mm-hmm.

   6. TKTim Kennedy19:05

      ... with equipment that's never been used before in a- in a- in a form of warfare that's never been tried, because this is my purpose, is to do good." Uh, where is that? We see on the opposite end of that spectrum young men without purpose that then get angry and get bitter and, um, they start having res- uh, resentment against specific groups and people, whether it's the color of their skin or their religion, and then they walk into a school or a church or a movie theater and they start hurting people. That's a broken young man without purpose. But a man with purpose, man, you know, he's gonna- he's gonna figure out that you can fly a plane off this little tiny island in North Carolina. You know, he's gonna figure out that he can step off this ladder and jump into almost weightlessness on a surface of a moon that nobody's stepped on before. Like, that's purpose. What was the purpose? We're in an arms race against the Russians. The ra- this space race was an arms race, but that was purpose. It was an idea that we can do something significant to improve America. Fill yourself with something more important than yourself, and pour everything that you are into it, and the- and that's purpose. And with that, like- like, I'm filled with purpose and I'm filled with joy and I'm filled with hope and I'm filled with love and I'm filled with grace, but all of that is a byproduct of purpose. Like, you can't be sitting there and be like, "I'm depressed. I'm thinking about suicide," you know, like, "I'm- I'm feeling hopeless." I will- I could give you- I could write 1,000 different ideas that you could contr- that you could dedicate your life to, and it would be a life worth lived- living.

   7. CWChris Williamson20:46

      Mm-hmm.

   8. TKTim Kennedy20:46

      Like, go. Go and do great things.

   9. CWChris Williamson20:48

      A lot of that's from service, it seems.

   10. TKTim Kennedy20:50

       Exactly.

   11. CWChris Williamson20:51

       But the point is that in the modern culture-

   12. TKTim Kennedy20:54

       I'm gonna try this thing.

   13. CWChris Williamson20:55

       Get that thing inside of you. Go on.

   14. TKTim Kennedy20:56

       Okay.

   15. CWChris Williamson20:57

       Put it in you.

   16. TKTim Kennedy20:57

       You sure you want this?

   17. CWChris Williamson20:58

       Oh, yeah.

   18. TKTim Kennedy20:58

       Okay.

   19. CWChris Williamson20:59

       Yeah, yeah, yeah. Come on.

   20. TKTim Kennedy20:59

       I- I- I know I'm always, like, hard already.

   21. CWChris Williamson21:01

       Mm-hmm.

   22. TKTim Kennedy21:01

       And then you're like, "Do you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna give this guy a little bit of caffeine-"

   23. CWChris Williamson21:03

       Don't say you're hard already. That's a- I mean, there is-

   24. TKTim Kennedy21:05

       I mean figuratively.

   25. CWChris Williamson21:05

       (laughs)

   26. TKTim Kennedy21:06

       But also literally. I me- I meant... That's good.

   27. CWChris Williamson21:13

       That'll do.

   28. TKTim Kennedy21:14

       Yeah.

   29. CWChris Williamson21:14

       That's what we want. You'll be dialed in now. Oh, yeah. Feel that coursing through your veins? Um, so we

5. 21:20 – 27:08

   Is Too Much Freedom Making Us Weak?

   1. CWChris Williamson21:20

      have a- a culture which is very individuated, very individualized. Um, uh, people are atomized from their family, from their culture, from their history, uh, and from each other as well. If you're living in- if you're fucking citizen number 233,000 living in your pod, bleep-bleeping away, that shared sense of purpose, it doesn't surprise me that that's not the case. But you look to other cultures that are competitors. Uh, you know, this Gwenda Bogle, one of my friends, wrote an amazing article about TikTok and the, uh, SpinachTok equivalent that they have in China is showing people being proud of their country and people doing cool science stuff and people building technology and young people-

   2. TKTim Kennedy22:00

      Pornography bad, sleep good, family good.

   3. CWChris Williamson22:03

      Yes. Well, video games-

   4. TKTim Kennedy22:04

      No exercise, bad.

   5. CWChris Williamson22:04

      Have you seen when, uh, they can play video games in China?

   6. TKTim Kennedy22:06

      Yeah.

   7. CWChris Williamson22:07

      Yeah, it's between, I think, 7:00 PM and 9:00 PM Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and-

   8. TKTim Kennedy22:11

      Four days a week, two hours a day.

   9. CWChris Williamson22:13

      Yeah.

   10. TKTim Kennedy22:13

       That's it.

   11. CWChris Williamson22:14

       And it's... Outside of those times, it's just not on.

   12. TKTim Kennedy22:16

       Yeah.

   13. CWChris Williamson22:16

       It's like you can't... You know, like the fucking someone's unplugged the power.

   14. TKTim Kennedy22:19

       Yeah.

   15. CWChris Williamson22:19

       It's like the ultimate parent. Uh, it's- it's wild. And thinking, okay, is this... is what we have now with the degrees of freedom, you're someone that very much, you know, wants people to have freedom and has fought for it a lot.

   16. TKTim Kennedy22:34

       I like that freedom stuff.

   17. CWChris Williamson22:35

       But that multiplicity of options and lack of constraint just causes people to sort of race to the bottom of the pleasure stem.

   18. TKTim Kennedy22:45

       Mm-hmm.

   19. CWChris Williamson22:46

       Right? So you under- there's a bit of a-

   20. TKTim Kennedy22:47

       Yeah.

   21. CWChris Williamson22:47

       There's a paradox going on here that some of the authoritarian, dictatorial, um, uh, tendencies are actually enabling the population in some ways to be better.

   22. TKTim Kennedy22:59

       Yeah. Uh, I- I will never say that the government is a solution for anything. Um, if we think that it would be a better idea, solution, to give the government authority-

   23. CWChris Williamson23:12

       Mm-hmm.

   24. TKTim Kennedy23:12

       ... to go into households and say how much time they should be on screens or who they should call-

   25. CWChris Williamson23:17

       Mm-hmm.

   26. TKTim Kennedy23:17

       ... like, that goes against every ounce of I- what I- what I believe and what I think it means to be an American. Um, for... In the preamble of the Constitution, we, the people, like, the people really were badasses. They carved their existence out of the wilderness. You know, they- they fought bears and they fought Indians, and then they were told that they're going to be taxed a certain amount, and they're like, "No, and then we'll throw this tea in the harbor." And they're like, "Okay, well, we're gonna have this little problem in Boston, and an American's gonna get shot. Now you pissed us off, we're gonna kill all of you, and we're gonna kick you off the continent." Like, we, the people, were a bunch of badasses. There is individual responsibility for those people. They're well-read, they're well-traveled. For you to vote, you had to be a landowner. Um, you knew how to shoot a gun. You were required to own a gun and to train with that gun.

   27. CWChris Williamson24:09

       You were required to own a gun.

   28. TKTim Kennedy24:10

       Required to own a gun. If you were- if you were (laughing) a voting member, you had to own a gun and you had to train with it, and there was a dedicated day off for the entire country. Every single person-

   29. CWChris Williamson24:20

       Wow.

   30. TKTim Kennedy24:20

       ... had a dedicated day to go out and train. And-... there, there were some inherent responsibilities to being a citizen, to being we the people. Now, we're just like, every, "Somebody's gonna do it for me. Somebody's gonna take care of this problem. Somebody's gonna solve this world problem. Somebody's gonna tell me how much I'm supposed to eat or what I'm supposed to eat." That responsibility we've just been handing over bit by bit for the past 40 years, and now we don't know how to take it back. And responsibility is where freedom comes from. You can't be free unless you are self-sufficient.
6. 27:08 – 31:25

   Churchill’s Ministry of Ungentlemanly Warfare

   1. CWChris Williamson27:08

      One of my favorite books has just been turned into-

   2. TKTim Kennedy27:10

      Good.

   3. CWChris Williamson27:10

      You like it?

   4. TKTim Kennedy27:11

      Yeah.

   5. CWChris Williamson27:11

      You don't need to turn it around each time.

   6. TKTim Kennedy27:12

      Okay.

   7. CWChris Williamson27:12

      It's looking at you. It can stare at you. Ah, yeah, it's more-ish. So, uh, one of my favorite books has just been turned into a movie, Churchill's Ministry of Ungentlemanly Warfare.

   8. TKTim Kennedy27:21

      Mm-hmm.

   9. CWChris Williamson27:22

      Do you know this?

   10. TKTim Kennedy27:22

       I do know it.

   11. CWChris Williamson27:23

       So, have you seen the trailer for this?

   12. TKTim Kennedy27:25

       Uh-uh.

   13. CWChris Williamson27:25

       So, do you know who Alan Richer is? He's the guy that played-

   14. TKTim Kennedy27:28

       Yeah.

   15. CWChris Williamson27:28

       Yeah.

   16. TKTim Kennedy27:28

       Yeah.

   17. CWChris Williamson27:28

       So, Jacked Out of His Mind.

   18. TKTim Kennedy27:30

       Yeah.

   19. CWChris Williamson27:30

       Henry Cavill is in it. It's directed by Guy Ritchie.

   20. TKTim Kennedy27:33

       Also, Jack- Jacked Out of His Mind.

   21. CWChris Williamson27:34

       Directed by Guy Ritchie. So it's gonna be sexy, it's gonna be cool. And, uh, I ju- I can't wait, but as you know-

   22. TKTim Kennedy27:41

       True story.

   23. CWChris Williamson27:42

       You've read the book. Yeah, of course. This is what I... This is... Like, this sort of renegade spirit is so cool. So, the beginning of World War II, the British being the prim and proper gentlemen that we are-

   24. TKTim Kennedy27:52

       Mm-hmm. You mean, a monocle and a bow tie-

   25. CWChris Williamson27:53

       Yeah.

   26. TKTim Kennedy27:54

       ... go out, take a tea, with a real

   27. CWChris Williamson27:55

       crumpets.

   28. Exactly.

   29. TKTim Kennedy27:56

       You know?

   30. CWChris Williamson27:56

       Spinning, spinning a cane.
7. 31:25 – 41:30

   The State of the US/Mexico Border

   1. TKTim Kennedy31:25

   2. CWChris Williamson31:25

      What's happening on the US-Mexico border at the moment?

   3. TKTim Kennedy31:28

      Oh.

   4. CWChris Williamson31:28

      You spent some time down there. Give me the... I think... Was it in December? 300,000 potential, uh, immigrants were stopped. That was the number that were stopped?

   5. TKTim Kennedy31:39

      Yeah, yeah. Yeah. But the getaways is the number that nobody talks about. So, 300,000 people were stopped and then let in. How many weren't stopped? How many just got in? Is it more than 300,000?

   6. CWChris Williamson31:53

      What do you think?

   7. TKTim Kennedy31:54

      Oh yeah, I 100% know it's more than 300,000. So, like, the number of people that we caught is gonna be a small fraction of the- of the number of people that made it across without being stopped. When you look at the vastness of that border and where the wall is, where our ports of entry are, um, where the river is, uh, it- it is porous beyond belief. You can... I- I've crossed that border, like, 25 times in a week. Both sides. Like, blblblblbl, you know, like, "I'm in Mexico." Like, my phone says, "Welcome to Mexico. Like, it's gonna c- cost you $10 a day to be here. Welcome to the international program by- via Verizon." Then I come back and it's like, "Hey, welcome back to the United States." They can do this all day long. So the ones that we're catching, the- the ones that we catch compared to the ones that make it through, is a very, very small fraction. The ones that really don't wanna be caught, the way... The cartel will push a bunch of people that they know are gonna get caught because if you just think of a- a... the... Okay, I'm the commander. I have X number of resources. I have 100 tr- troops at my disposal. Of course I wanna do counter-interdiction, so I wanna stop drugs, I wanna s- stop human traffickers, I wanna stop, um, sex enslavement, I wanna stop we- um, weapon smuggling. As I'm at the river, in Del Rio, and I have a thousand immigrants cross at one time. How many of my 100 soldiers do I need to use to deal with those 1,000 people? All right, so I've, I've one guy receiving, right? I'm gonna put him in the lines. I'm gonna... I, I make some choke points, I funnel them into a specific area, use some concertina wire to make sure, like, I have an orderly way. 50 guys? May- h- 75 guys, right? So now I have 50 to t- to 25 guys left for me to use and I have this entire area that I have to be covering. But the moment those people start coming across the river, is the same time that five guys jump into the river with bundles on their back. And then another five miles up the river, two boats get pushed across with a bunch of Middle Eastern and Eastern Ukr- uh, Eastern European guys that are being smuggled and trafficked across. And then five miles down the river, there's a bunch of young girls, they're 11 or 12, that are going back into Mexico that they kidnapped in El Paso. Okay, wh-

   8. CWChris Williamson34:02

      The whole thing's coordinated.

   9. TKTim Kennedy34:03

      Tell me how to distribute my la- remaining 25 guys. Also, the thousand that start coming across, the cartel dudes are just gonna grab a couple of little girls and throw them in the river. They're gonna grab a baby and drop it in the drink. They're gonna take a dad and just trip him with a kid on his shoulders, and they're all drowning. Do you want my soldiers to jump in with body armor to start swimming after them? This is the reality every single day across the whole entire river, and it is the largest border in the world. In the world, is our border on our southern border. Canadia, Canada to the north, gigantic border. Mexico border to the south.

   10. CWChris Williamson34:38

       We need to stop those Canadians coming in. That's the important thing that no one's talking about.

   11. TKTim Kennedy34:41

       Those...

   12. CWChris Williamson34:43

       (laughs)

   13. TKTim Kennedy34:43

       I don't know. I got hopes for their next election, though.

   14. CWChris Williamson34:45

       Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, can you explain, you know, for the people who haven't been down to the Mexico border, what is the... Is it all, uh, demarked in some form or another? Is there some type of... Or is- are there elements where it's literally just, this is a piece of land and you can wander across?

   15. TKTim Kennedy35:05

       Uh, a lot... Texas has mostly private land. Um, so that- the border is on somebody's ranch.

   16. CWChris Williamson35:14

       Right. Fantastic.

   17. TKTim Kennedy35:16

       Yeah. So-

   18. CWChris Williamson35:17

       So you guys welcome in.

   19. TKTim Kennedy35:19

       In some cases, but, I mean, those ranchers, the- the- the cartel charges, we- we'll say, like a ticket. So if you want yourself and your family to come across, you're- you're, um... Ecuador right now. Kind of spicy. Cartels took the whole entire thing over. I'm not sure if you saw two weeks ago, they were like, they were killing news hosts in the news station while they were on the street, killing a bunch of people in the street and targeting government officials and judges. And it was happening, like, in real time live on the news. So, you have legitimate asylum seekers that are on the run from cartels. They move through Central America and they come up to the Mexico border. They pay the cartels to allow them to cross or they pay them extra to facilitate them coming across. Um, this is an endless cycle of revenue for the cartels. Like, they- it costs them nothing to produce. They don't have to smuggle in drugs. They don't have to kidnap anybody. People are just walking to them and they- they on the south side have created barriers where you can't cross without permission. And if you don't...... pay them, they'll kill you. So there's- there's, in some cases, physical barriers and in some cases psychological barriers where you know if you point this par- like, this point of departure, you will be executed without a- a wristband, like your ticket.

   20. CWChris Williamson36:49

       (laughs)

   21. TKTim Kennedy36:49

       Like, I could show you what those wristbands look like. Those wristbands, color-coordinated, kind of tell you, "I got a round trip, I have multi trip, I have single direction, I'm allowed to go through this area."

   22. CWChris Williamson37:01

       Oh, so su- super sophisticated?

   23. TKTim Kennedy37:02

       Super sophisticated. All color coordinated and a-across the s- on the southern side, all, uh, agreed between this cartel that's working with this group, with this cartel, with these traffickers. And it's- it's unstoppable the way that we're currently try to fight it- fighting it. It's just, we're not gonna win.

   24. CWChris Williamson37:26

       What is a way that would make it stoppable?

   25. TKTim Kennedy37:32

       So when the Chinese built the Great Wall, um, they recognized that any barricade without observation isn't a barricade. So I can build a wall, but if there's not something there observing that thing, it's not really a barricade 'cause I can do whatever I need to do to get over that barricade and there's nothing to stop me. Um, so there's, like all problems, there's not a single solution, unfortunately. The wall creates choke points. It forces people to go through specific areas. And in those specific areas, uh, we can set up to interdict those people. Now, there's a misconception that there is this barrier stopping people from crossing. There's not. And additionally, there are ports of entry, there are legal places where anybody, to include people, like Mexicans, can just walk across the border. They can walk up and say, "Hey, I'm gonna be working. Here's my visa." Or, "I'm gonna be working at this ranch. My mom lives across the street." And, you know, some of those borders, when they were set, some families lived on this side, some families lived on this side, and they've been going back and forth all the time. Um, but there are su- there are so many hundreds of thousands of people that have flooded these areas that it creates a human- humanitarian crisis, and it creates this logistical problem of how, as we, the United States government and Department of State, how do we process this number of people? We- we- we can't, um, which is what- exactly what the cartel wants. And the surges that happen from the executive level, so at the White House right now, they changed some policies, and the word gets out that it's open borders. Everybody comes, and everybody's coming.

   26. CWChris Williamson39:20

       What was the word that got out that made it seem like it was open borders?

   27. TKTim Kennedy39:23

       Uh, you get money when you cross. You know, "We'll give you a couple thousand dollars. We'll give you a bus ticket to the inland. Um, we'll throw you on a plane and bring you to the city that you wanna go to." Um, well, instead of you, if you're an asylum seeker, when, during the Trump era, for example, if you came in and you were caught, uh, an asylum seeker that just crosses, um, they'll then just on the inland be like, "Hey, I'm looking for residency here." Um, if they're stopped on the border, they'll claim that they're asylum seekers. Well, we would make that person wait either at the country of their crossing or the country of their origin for their case, for their asylum case to be heard. Now, they get a date. "Come back in, like, six months or 12 months to your court hearing for you to learn about the process of your- your asylum case." Uh, so there's n- there's only motivation for everyone to come here to the border and then to get an automatic pass in.

   28. CWChris Williamson40:27

       Because there's no penalty.

   29. TKTim Kennedy40:28

       That's right.

   30. CWChris Williamson40:28

       It's like universal asylum.
8. 41:30 – 47:53

   Strategies for Solving the Immigration Crisis

   1. CWChris Williamson41:30

      with these detention centers? That was a big news story a couple of years ago.

   2. TKTim Kennedy41:33

      They've- they've always been there. Um, like, there- there are more detention centers and larger detention center- centers during Obama than there were Trump. Um, that's kind of a play of numbers though, because so few people tried to cross during Trump because they knew that they were gonna be kicked back to their country of origin. Um, y- you know, just a couple of days ago in New York, did you see the video of the immigrants that were attacking the NYPD officers? Oh, this is horrific. The police were trying to deal with a small problem with, uh, involving a bunch of immigrants, and the immigrants attacked the two police officers. The two ple- police officers end up grappling on the ground against a couple of them, and then the whole entire crowd came up and started soccer kicking the police officers. And it turns into, like, this... I mean, it's a- it's a hard video to watch. I- I'm actually about to post it today, uh, 'cause I wanted to get some more context as to, like, what was the initial call, why were they there? Like, they were there doing the right thing. There- there were actually crimes being committed, and they were there to, like, try and keep the peace as good police officers, and then it was escalated, not on their end, but on the illegals' end, and then they ended up getting, like, skull stomped. Uh-This is foreshadowing of what's gonna be coming. Like, this- this is just a tiny little taste. Like, tho- those are just immigrants. Tho- those weren't even bad actors that were trained and are hoping for an opportunity to do America damage. 'Cause tens of thousands of them came into this country over the past couple of years.

   3. CWChris Williamson42:59

      Did you see that video of a bunch of people on a plane refusing to sit down because someone was being deported?

   4. TKTim Kennedy43:06

      Yeah.

   5. CWChris Williamson43:07

      And it turned out that that person had been involved in gangland shootouts and all manner of fuckery?

   6. TKTim Kennedy43:13

      Yeah. T- 10 days ago, uh, live news near Eagle Pass, another common-

   7. CWChris Williamson43:22

      Texas?

   8. TKTim Kennedy43:23

      Yeah. Another common smuggling point. Uh, this news host is talking about all the immigrants coming across, and this guy, in- in pretty decent English, walks up behind. He goes, "You don't know who I am, but you're gonna know my name." And you're like, "What is going on here?" Facial recognition ties this guy to 82% that he is a multi-time terrorist that was in Gitmo, and he just walked across the border. He's live on television as this terrorist just walks into America and is bragging that everybody's gonna know his name. That was- that was almost two and a ha- two weeks ago, a week and a half ago.

   9. CWChris Williamson43:59

      What would you do? What would you do to try and fix this problem? You've mentioned that you need to have presumably more staffing, more, uh, funding to be able to train people up to be able to do this.

   10. TKTim Kennedy44:07

       Yep. So, th- this isn't a border n- state problem. This is a nat- this is a national problem, right? So, the governor of Texas is using state resources. He- he approved Operation Lone Star, which is using Texas National Guard soldiers to protect the border, so he is using tons of Tex- of state funding to- to protect the Texas border. It's not just the Texas border. This is America's border. But a whole bunch of, you know, most of California, Arizona, New Mexico, Texas, um, are bearing the burden of this immigration humanitarian crisis, but the other 36 states are kinda just... Or, the other 46 states are just kinda like hanging back, being like, "Heh, sucks to be you guys." But then we- we bus a couple bus loads up to them, they're like, "Oh my God, we're, like, being overwhelmed." And like, we sent you 500 of them. Do you know what it's like when you have 300,000 that just came across your border that are in your country? Um, what would I do? I would finish the wall. Um, I would make certain areas impassable. That's concertina wire, um, that is armed guards, that is, um, men on horseback. That epic photo of those border patrol guys, that he was actually using his leads and they thought it was a whip, because people are idiots and they actually don't know how to ride a horse. Um, sensors, drones, we have the solutions. This is a fixable thing. We just don't have, yet again, the appetite to do what it takes to close that border. Once a border's closed, we open the ports of entry. Department of State funds... And Department of State is doing the best they can with the very restricted resources they have. So imagine, like the White House is telling the Department of State, "Hey, you have to be- be doing this." And the Department of State's like, "We don't have the resources and we don't have the means to facilitate this number of people." But then the White House is like, "Hey, everybody come over here." And the Department of State's like, "We can't." So these ports of entry have to be opened, and the systems have to be fixed for us to be able to process more people in a more, um, strategic way.

   11. CWChris Williamson46:21

       Didn't someone rip down a ton of razor wire? Wasn't that a big deal, like last week?

   12. TKTim Kennedy46:26

       Yeah.

   13. CWChris Williamson46:26

       Two weeks ago?

   14. TKTim Kennedy46:27

       So the federal government is... There's- there's, like, competing efforts at the, at the border right now. So Texas is saying, "The border's closed," and the federal government's saying, "No, the- the border's open." So the federal government is coming down to the barricades and the barriers that Texas has put up and said, "We- you can't have those. That goes against federal law." And Texas is saying, "No, you can't do that. The- this is Texas land, and we are closing the borders. So if you're not gonna close the American borders, we're gonna close the Texas border." Um, yeah, they're literally... Like, federal law enforcement is coming in and doing the opposite of what the Texas law enforcement is doing. Wild.

   15. CWChris Williamson47:10

       Yeah, that's conflict. Bryan Callen told me that he tried to trick you into believing that he was asleep, and you stood over him and said, "Do you know how many people have tried to pretend that they're asleep-

   16. TKTim Kennedy47:20

       Yeah.

   17. CWChris Williamson47:21

       ... as I've stood over them?" (laughs)

   18. TKTim Kennedy47:24

       Yeah. I love that guy. Uh, but he did get up and he did go to the water with me, and then he did wrestle with me on the southern coast of France in the sand.

   19. CWChris Williamson47:35

       Yep.

   20. TKTim Kennedy47:35

       Yeah, and I, um, I started, like, leg riding him from behind, and put his face down in the sand. And while he was, like, trying to, and ineffectively trying to get away from me, I was, like, drawing hearts in the sand.

   21. CWChris Williamson47:47

       (laughs)

   22. TKTim Kennedy47:47

       And his face is like this, and I'm like, I'm drawing hearts in the s- it was awesome. What a great, what a gem of a human.

9. 47:53 – 59:29

   The Reality of Being in an Armed Conflict

   1. TKTim Kennedy47:53

   2. CWChris Williamson47:53

      For the people who haven't, uh, almost no one really that's listening who will have been in any kind of kinetic, uh, armed encounter, what's it actually like to be in a firefight? What's the sense of that like? What, just like describe what's going on.

   3. TKTim Kennedy48:08

      Fear, chaos, anarchy. I mean, it's like, uh... It is so not like the movies, you know, where it's like John Wick's just, like, doing, like some cool, artistic, violent ballet, and there, it's- it's, um... It smells like shit. Uh, you know, the- the smell of human flesh being burnt, whether it's a bullet going in it or an explosion from an IED or an RPG. Um, you know, the diesel from a Humvee or a RG33, the smell of gunpowder from a .50 cal machine gun, the... Like, those are all hard smells.And then, um, you know when, when there's over pressure from, you know, a machine gun or a bomb or a grenade or an AT4, it of course kicks up the dirt and ... But it's the fine dirt. It's not like the heavy, good soil like on farmland. It's like the gross moon dust dirt.

   4. CWChris Williamson49:11

      Human skin.

   5. TKTim Kennedy49:12

      Yeah. And so you get these really weird not natural smells mixed with very earthy smells. And smells are a trigger for a lot of people's memories and, um, that earthy with mechanical with burning thing are like really overwhelming sensations. That's the smell portion. And then there's like what you're seeing, and the fog of war could not f- like fail to express how hard it is to see what you're seeing. You know, you've, you've heard the expression "the fog of war" and people trying to remember back to battles and they have a really hard time explaining what they're seeing. It's 'cause I don't think your brain can process what you're seeing. You know, you- your- your brain can't process, like, your friend just got blown up and he's burnt over here and there's a guy up there that's shooting a bullet at you that's from a machine gun position that's gonna kill you. You know, and like the vehicle that w- you're just in is, like, shredded with a bunch of ... Wait. Those holes in the front of this vehicle weren't there a few seconds ago, and that's what that sound was. And- but your brain's trying to process this all the time. All the while, like, adrenas- adrenaline and cortisol is just exploding through your body. Um, it's, uh, it's ... War is hell, uh, and the fog of war are apt expressions to try to in a succinct way say it's fucking chaos.

   6. CWChris Williamson50:41

      So it's not ... It- it- yeah. Chaos is the right word, that there's no degree of pause or control in what you've just described, but presumably that's what tactics and preparation are for.

   7. TKTim Kennedy50:51

      Yeah.

   8. CWChris Williamson50:51

      It's to allow you to be able to wrangle what's going on and actually have some sort of process that you guys are moving through.

   9. TKTim Kennedy50:58

      Yeah. I mean, tha- that's why we do, we do tens of thousands of reps of an emergency reload of my rifle, right? The bolt locks to the r- the rear. I feel the bolt. My- I feel my, my magazine getting li- lighter as I'm shooting, and then I literally feel against my chin the bolt lock to the rear and I feel the little catch stop that bolt from traveling back forward because the follower was pushed up by or pushed up the, the bolt lock by the follower of the magazine so I know my gun's empty. I drop the magazine, I insert a new magazine, I drop the bolt, I re-grip the gun, I find my sight and I press the trigger and all that happens in less than a second. My brain shouldn't- can't do that. Like, I can't cognitively think about doing that process but I've practiced it s- you know, tens of thousands of times that it just happens. And when we start maneuvering and we have a group laying down suppressive fire while another group is flanking or we have one group move up to a- an oversight position to start laying down suppressive fire while another element goes ... Like, these are all rehearsed responses to known problems. And, uh, and that's why the most elite units on the planet have so much time to train and so many resources to facilitate them training. Go ambush Delta Force. You know? Like, go give that a whirl. You know? Like ... (laughs) real bad plan, you're all gonna die. Send as many people as you want and just know that you're not gonna get any of them back. You know? Like, cool, go deal with SEAL Team Six on the water. That's a good idea. You know? Or like go kidnap an American and drag her into the desert and then use a cellphone and see how that works out for you. Um, you know, these- these- these are all stories of SEAL Team Six, like, dropping into North Africa and going and rescuing this beautiful blonde, um, NGO worker and killing literally everybody on the ground. True stories. And, uh, it's because they've done it thousands of times, thousands of reps, thousands of jumps, thousands of time- rounds on- down on the range. So when that chaos happens and you're scared and you're full of fear, you're just doing the thing that you've always practiced to do, and ... if you do it, you'll live. If you don't, you're gonna die.

   10. CWChris Williamson53:12

       So I understand the moving things that you have to do from system two, deliberate thinking, into system one, automatic thinking. It's what you did in the UFC.

   11. TKTim Kennedy53:21

       Mm-hmm.

   12. CWChris Williamson53:21

       Right? Someone throws a punch. You don't think, "Oh, that's a, a left jab. I'm gonna, like, slip. Yeah."

   13. TKTim Kennedy53:25

       Yeah.

   14. CWChris Williamson53:25

       "I'm gonna move a little bit. I'm gonna move. I'm gonna move." Uh, it just happens but presumably in a firefight it's not just reaction and response. There's this sort of, uh, system one thinking where you're just doing the things, reloading the weapon, but then there's also the- you need to use some cognition too. So what about that pulling in and pulling out thing? How do you utilize a little bit more of the analytical brain if you've just caught this all in adrenaline?

   15. TKTim Kennedy53:52

       Yeah.

   16. CWChris Williamson53:52

       And ...

   17. TKTim Kennedy53:53

       Well, th- those systems and those processes are built within the military combat unit. You know? So while you have the fighters, you also have the ... You know, we'll just use a Special Forces ODA. You know, you have-

   18. CWChris Williamson54:06

       ODA?

   19. TKTim Kennedy54:07

       ... Operational Detachment Alph- uh, Alpha. It's- it's like the 12-man A-team.

   20. CWChris Williamson54:11

       Right.

   21. TKTim Kennedy54:12

       Uh, within that team you have two guys per job. There's four main jobs which are the eight men that do the body of the work. The other four guys are leaders in some form or fashion, and each of them take a certain piece of the pie on the leadership role, like-

   22. CWChris Williamson54:32

       Is that one for each two?

   23. TKTim Kennedy54:33

       No.

   24. CWChris Williamson54:34

       Oh.

   25. TKTim Kennedy54:34

       So the team sergeant, he's kinda running the eight guys. He's the, the E8 that is, like, the battle-hardened. He's the most senior NCO on the ground, and he's feeding the information to the 18 Bravo, the- the weapons guy to the communication guy to the engineer who's gonna be launching mortars and rockets, um, and to- to the medic who's making sure, like, all the f- the- the team and their foreign fighters are all working in unison. And then you have, you know, the-... the intel guy who's kinda feeding information and helping the team sergeant, but he's also feeding information to the team leader. The team leader's on the phone talking to command, getting, um, maybe some air support. He wants some fixed-wing fast movers, or he's looking for some rotary wing support, or he called an AC-130. So, they're all reacting, but they're reacting in their piece of the pie.

   26. CWChris Williamson55:24

       Mm-hmm.

   27. TKTim Kennedy55:25

       And th- some of those reactions are... That team leader, the, the captain, if he picks up the .240 machine gun and hops up on top of the back of the Humvee and he's just like, "I'm a war hero!" You know, like, sir, you're fired. That is not your job. Your job is to go get on that radio and to call higher and get a support. Similarly, if that team sergeant isn't directing and coordinating the men to respond to, you know, the, the threat or the ambush in the right way that they've rehearsed and they've planned, then, like, he's not doing his job. So, each one of these awesome jobs has an awesome role, and the individual responsibility of that person to understand that role and then-

   28. CWChris Williamson56:10

       Mm-hmm.

   29. TKTim Kennedy56:10

       ... to be e- be able to execute that role in this hell that is war during the fog of war is so freaking badass. And that's why you... It's one of the many reasons why I, you know, I look to, like, the Marcus Luttrells and the Andy Stumps and the Jockos and, and the Evan Hafers and, and you see them be, like, incredibly successful in business. And you're like, "Of course they will." Because look at what they did beforehand in all of these different roles as they moved up the military ladder and filled every single one of the roles on the way up, where, like, they'll go run a Fortune 500 company or they'll go start a brand new one and, you know, and then bring it public and sell it for a hundred, few hundred million dollars. And here's my face of surprise. You know, like, "They can do anything."

   30. CWChris Williamson56:55

       What do each of the four pairs of people do?
10. 59:29 – 1:04:07

    Men Who Couldn’t Bring Themselves to Shoot in War

    1. CWChris Williamson59:29

       I was reading about some rumors of the number of soldiers that had been deployed, perhaps it was in World War II but it could've been in one of the later wars, who didn't fire their rifle or purposefully fired their rifle over the heads of the enemy. What, how much truth's in that?

    2. TKTim Kennedy59:45

       There's truth to that. We have a, we have this wild phenomenon called no- non-shoot snipers. So, a guy who's into combat arms, he goes to the only casualty producing school within the military, sniper school, where they're actually just teaching a person how to kill another person.

    3. CWChris Williamson1:00:00

       The only casualty producing... Right, o- because the only role that you have or the primary role that you have-

    4. TKTim Kennedy1:00:05

       Primary role.

    5. CWChris Williamson1:00:06

       ... or I guess spotting as well-

    6. TKTim Kennedy1:00:06

       Yeah.

    7. CWChris Williamson1:00:06

       ... is like in tr- observing movements and shit.

    8. TKTim Kennedy1:00:08

       Yeah, observing, feeding back information.

    9. CWChris Williamson1:00:09

       Yeah, yeah.

    10. TKTim Kennedy1:00:09

        But ultimately, we're also teaching-

    11. CWChris Williamson1:00:11

        Damage.

    12. TKTim Kennedy1:00:11

        ... a dude how to take crosshairs, figure out how to take a bullet and put it into somebody and make a hole. Um, you have lots of military schools. I'm about to go to one that's, like, six months long, and that is not a casualty prod- casualty producing school. That's a leadership school. It's like, lots... Ranger school, not a casualty producing school. That's a leadership school. Um, SFARTEC, that is not a casualty producing school. Even though you learn a ton about how to shoot, move, communicate, and medicate, that is how to rescue somebody that is a hostage. You go to SFAWIC, Special Forces Advanced Urban Combat. That is, how do I do war in a combat area or in an urban area? So, each of them building necessary skills within that special operations unit. But sniper school, teaching somebody how to make a hole in somebody far, far away. The no-shoot sniper comes from com- combat arms, goes to sniper school, goes to war, and can't pull the trigger. And it's not common, but it, it does, it happens. And I...And this is just my personal opinion, I- I think it is, uh, for a couple of reasons. One is the- the- the equipment that we use, just like I can see you here, very, very close. You know, like, I can see your skin, I can see your pores, I can see the veins on your neck. Like, that's how intimate it is when you're looking through a 20 power optic.

    13. CWChris Williamson1:01:31

        So it humanizes the target?

    14. TKTim Kennedy1:01:33

        Yeah. And I'm watching them breathe and I know I'm gonna have a bullet flight of two to three seconds, so I actually have to be watching how you're moving, so I need to know where you're gonna be in two to three seconds from now. So I'm, like, learning so much about you and how you move, and it really connects me to you, which is one problem. Um, and then the other part is the- the thing that we've known throughout all war, which is some people just can't do it. It's not for everybody. Um, have you... Hacksaw Ridge, have you ever read- seen this movie or read this book? Medal of Honor recipient. He was a conscien- conscientious objector. He would not hold a weapon. This is during World War II. He would not hold a gun. He said he wouldn't do it, it was against his faith. And during one of the island invasions in the Pacific, he rescued like hundreds of Americans. And, um, gets shot, gets stabbed, gets, uh, blown up, and he just keeps going up this cliff and grabbing these Americans. And everybody at the base of the cliff has no idea who keeps lowering down these Americans. And they find out that it was this guy that they've been trying to kick out of the unit because he wouldn't fight. And not everybody needs to fight. There's a- there's a beautiful poem written about the warrior. There's 100 men that go to war, 80 of them shouldn't even be there. You know, like, they're just bags of blood, they're gonna be running forward to die. Um, 10 of them are gonna, like, they're the men that are going to carry the- the war. Like, they're the ones that are gonna go out and fight. You know, and then there's the remaining 10, and man, they're- they're incredible. They're brave, they're courageous, they're leaders. But then there's the one, right? There's the one that's gonna bring all the men home, and that's the- that's the Marcus Luttrells, that's- that's the Dakota Meyers, that's the- that's the extraordinary- that's the Andy Stumps. You know, like, you know some of these guys.

    15. CWChris Williamson1:03:41

        I texted Andy this morning.

    16. TKTim Kennedy1:03:42

        Yeah, great human. Uh, this is Andy's.

    17. CWChris Williamson1:03:44

        It's nice. Origin?

    18. TKTim Kennedy1:03:45

        Yeah, yeah, but I stole it from him. We were in-

    19. CWChris Williamson1:03:47

        Oh, right, you actually took it off his back?

    20. TKTim Kennedy1:03:49

        No, no, he- he lay down and set it down, and I took it and I put it in my bag, and then I left with it.

    21. CWChris Williamson1:03:55

        Right. So if Andy's looking at you thinking, "That's a familiar looking..." Yeah, 'cause it is.

    22. TKTim Kennedy1:03:59

        Yeah. I wasn't sure if it was his or Denver's, but I'm like 90% sure that it was his.

    23. CWChris Williamson1:04:03

        Okay.

    24. TKTim Kennedy1:04:03

        So, like, 90% that I stole this.

    25. CWChris Williamson1:04:06

        But it's nice.

    26. TKTim Kennedy1:04:06

        Yeah,

11. 1:04:07 – 1:13:43

    A Soldier Tim Wishes Everyone Knew About

    1. TKTim Kennedy1:04:07

       it is nice.

    2. CWChris Williamson1:04:08

       Uh, is there anyone, you mentioned Marcus Luttrell, Dakota Meyer, is there anyone that you have heard about or you served with that you wish their story would be better known? Is there someone or- or are there, um, incidents that you wish that you could sort of bring to public light more?

    3. TKTim Kennedy1:04:25

       Yeah.

    4. CWChris Williamson1:04:25

       Gimme some.

    5. TKTim Kennedy1:04:26

       Roy Benavidez. All right, you're not gonna believe this one. Okay. Roy Benavidez, he's, um, in Vietnam, he's a Texan, and he, uh, he's sitting on a forward base and he listens to a Special Forces ODA, he's a spec- he's a Green Beret, get in a gunfight. And he's like, "Whoop, this sounds bad." Helicopter goes in to try to get some dudes, he gets scuffed up, comes back with a bunch of bullet holes, and Roy runs up to the helicopter and he's like, "Hey, I'm gonna go with you. Take me back in there." He throws a bunch of guns and ammo in there, the helicopter takes off.

    6. CWChris Williamson1:05:00

       On his own?

    7. TKTim Kennedy1:05:00

       On his own. Flies him back to where the ODA has almost all been massacred. He goes, starts leading the remaining men that are all busted up, all of them are wounded, most of them are dead. He gets them to start fighting back the Viet Cong and starts pushing them back. He gets all of the men together and they start, um, surviving for a little bit. Helicopters are trying to come get them out. Through the course of th- I think he gets like 70, 80 or 90 bullet wounds, fragmentation from grenades and bayonet wounds. He kills a dude with a rock, kills a dude with a bayonet. There's a portion where one of the helicopters is trying to take off, but it has so much, um, s- they overload it with the wounded and dead. He's running ar- alongside of it with a machine gun providing support with his body and a machine gun laying down supporting fire as this helicopter's trying to take off. Helicopter comes back again, he gets the last remaining bits of equipment, he gets the last few men back onto the helicopter, he's the last guy to come. He gets jumped, gets stabbed with a bayonet, takes the bayonet out, kills the dude, kills a couple more dudes, hops in the helicopter and falls over. They z- they, uh, the helicopter lands, he's covered in blood, he's covered in mud, and, um, they're like, "This dude's dead." They throw him in a dead body bag so they can throw him in the morgue, and as they're zipping the b- the thing up, he goes... And he spits in the doctor's face. He couldn't talk, he'd been so wounded, there's nothing that he could do besides spit on this dude to let him know that he was still alive. He's like, "Oh my God, Roy Benavidez is still alive!" That's a good one. You know Shugart and Gordon?

    8. CWChris Williamson1:06:29

       No.

    9. TKTim Kennedy1:06:29

       Black Hawk Down?

    10. CWChris Williamson1:06:30

        No.

    11. TKTim Kennedy1:06:30

        Aw. Okay, I'm gonna do this without crying.

    12. CWChris Williamson1:06:32

        Okay. Good luck. Good look.

    13. TKTim Kennedy1:06:35

        (inhales deeply) You're familiar with the Black Hawk Down, Battle of Mogadishu, they're in there to get this, um, terrorist leader. And, um, the plan was for Delta Force to come in on top of this building. The Rangers come up to create a perimeter, security perimeter around this building while they find the bad guy inside, move him to the vehicles, and they all drive out together. That was the plan. Like Mike Tyson said, "Everybody has a plan 'til you get hit in the face." Guys get in, they get the bad guy, Rangers arrive, helicopter gets struck by an RPG in the tail, helicopter crashes.Um, this then begins this horrific battle against a bunch of different terrorist organizations all trying to kill the Rangers and Delta Force that are now trapped in Mogadishu. And ... it's a b- I mean, this is a fight. 30, 40 to one odds in ratio between terrorists to American operators. Shugart and Gordon are two Special Forces snipers that are in a helicopter providing overwatch. One of the helicopters that gets shot and crashes is getting overrun by all of these insurgent militia terrorists. They see on the ground that this helicopter, that some of the- the people inside of it survived the crash. And they see small arms fire, they see flashes from these guys trying to protect themselves. They get on the radio and they're like, "General, we'd like permission to go in and protect these guys. If we don't get down there, they're gonna get overrun. We can see everything." The general's like, "Negative. You do not have permission. You cannot be put on the ground." And they're like, "Understood."

    14. CWChris Williamson1:08:22

        Why did they not give permission?

    15. TKTim Kennedy1:08:24

        So they call again five minutes later. They're like, "If we don't get on the ground right now, everybody in that helicopter is gonna die." The general's like, "No, denied. You cannot go down there. You f- see better than we can that there's no way for us to get you out. If you go on the ground, it's just gonna add to the problem. It's two more people." They get a third time. "Sir, with your permission, please allow us to get on the ground. We will fight to the helicopter, we will create a perimeter, a security perimeter around these guys, and we will protect them until we get a time to get these guys out." The general's like, "I don't know when that's going to be. If you go on the ground, I can't send the Rangers to you. I have no more helicopters to send to you. I have no resources to go and rescue the people in that helicopter." And, um, Durant, an amazing book, the pilot that was in that helicopter, um, he tells in his book the most dangerous time to be taken captive is, like, the first few minutes. There's, like, this blood lust, this, like, rampant rage. So the helicopter crashes, right? And, like, think like you're an insurgent, you're a terrorist on the ground.

    16. CWChris Williamson1:09:30

        We got 'em.

    17. TKTim Kennedy1:09:30

        We got 'em, right? Like, you're rushing in, you're just killing everything. It's like there has to be this lull if anybody has a chance to survive. So Shu- Shugart and Gordon talk the general after three efforts into putting them on the ground. These two Delta Force, Special Forces snipers from my, from, like, the school that I went to, it's the best sniper school on the planet. These dudes fight from their info point to the helicopter, and they kill literally everybody. Like, if there was anybody within 200 meters that was holding a gun, they went on the ground leaky of blood and dead. They get to the helicopter, and, um, this is all explained in Durant's book 'cause he was the one that survived. He was the one that they went to rescue. He was the one that they ultimately gave their life to save, and they did just that. They grab him, they drag him out of the, out of the helicopter, they bring him into the building, and then they go back out to the helicopter. They give him an MP5 and they say, "Anybody that comes in behind us, stop them, 'cause we're gonna fight to slow ..." 'Cause there were, like, this big huge surge, like this, uh ... Like y- you've seen, like, where riots kinda start getting that energy-

    18. CWChris Williamson1:10:38

        Yup, yup.

    19. TKTim Kennedy1:10:38

        ... and, like, people start pulsing.

    20. CWChris Williamson1:10:39

        Fever.

    21. TKTim Kennedy1:10:40

        Yeah. So that fever is there, and they're just trying to keep it at bay. And they run out of rifle ammo. They run out of ... They start acquiring weapons off the ground, and they run out of that ammo. And they end up with pistols and they're f- like, f- bare knuckle fighting these guys and shooting the remaining pistol rounds as they have before ultimately they're both killed. And they save his life. And, um, Shugart and Gordon knew, and I ... That's the, this is the, this is the hard one. They knew they were gonna die. Like, there's not a, there's not a way that you're sitting in a helicopter like that and you're like, "We'll survive this." Um, when that question is there's no greater thing than to lay your life down for another. Service, right? Here we are, full circle. Um, they knew that they were gonna die for the chance to save a dude. I've asked myself this question a thousand times. Like, what would I do? And I don't know. Um, Shugart and Gordon, pretty rad men. I could go on for hours telling these stories, 'cause if you, if there's a part of you that is lacking purpose, sometimes you can find insurp- inspiration from somebody else's purpose. And, um, there, I mean there's been times where I'm, like, looking at Israel, like, "Do I have to go over there? Is this where I really need to go?" Um, and those questions of, like, should I be there? Is, is, uh, am I just another pawn to these large strategic influences?

    22. CWChris Williamson1:12:24

        Mm-hmm.

    23. TKTim Kennedy1:12:24

        Um, should I be at the Mexico border? Should I be in Ukraine? Should I be in Afghanistan? Um, but maybe that purpose is just to be part of something that's bigger and better than yourself. And then the answer is yes. Here I am. Send me, like in Isaiah 6:8.

    24. CWChris Williamson1:12:41

        We'll get back to talking to Tim in one minute, but first, I need to tell you about LMNT. Stop having coffee first thing in the morning. (laughs) Your adenosine system that caffeine acts on isn't even active for the first 90 minutes of the day, but your adrenal system is, and salt acts on your adrenal system. LMNT contains a science-backed electrolyte ratio of sodium, potassium, and magnesium that helps to curb cravings, improve your brain function, and regulate your appetite. You might not actually be that tired, you might just be dehydrated. And proper hydration isn't just about getting enough fluids, it's also about getting enough electrolytes, and this is the best in the world at it. Also, there's a no BS, no questions asked refund policy, so you can buy it completely risk-free, try it, drink the entire box, and if you do not like it for any reason, they'll give you your money back, and you don't even need to return it. That's how confident they are that you'll love it. Head to the link in the description below to get a free sample pack of all eight flavors with your first box or go to drinklmnt.com/modernwisdom. That's drinklmnt.com/modernwisdom.There

12. 1:13:43 – 1:16:24

    When Tim Ran Out of Ammo in a Gun Fight

    1. CWChris Williamson1:13:43

       was a story that you had when you run out of ammo as well. I seem to remember hearing that from you.

    2. TKTim Kennedy1:13:48

       Yeah. That's not a great plan.

    3. CWChris Williamson1:13:50

       (laughs)

    4. TKTim Kennedy1:13:51

       (laughs) If you're in the military, as best you can, never be in a gunfight and run out of ammo. That's, uh ... Yeah, that was in Uruzgan Valley in Afghanistan in 2008. We got blown up and, uh, we've ... They couldn't get ammo resupplies in to us. The gunfight was so intense. We have RG-33s, we had Humvees, we had supporting, um, Special Forces Commandos that were with us. We ran out of ammo. Like, that's wild. (laughs) That's a gunfight.

    5. CWChris Williamson1:14:21

       How long was that firefight?

    6. TKTim Kennedy1:14:24

       Three days in, a couple of days out. So maybe five days cumulatively of gun fighting.

    7. CWChris Williamson1:14:29

       What do you mean in and out?

    8. TKTim Kennedy1:14:30

       So we're moving a group of Czech special operations into this fire base called Fire Base Anaconda. And we had to go through this valley, um, to get to Fire Base Anaconda. And the topography was really advantageous for the Taliban, and, uh, like everything was kinda stacked against us. But we had to get this unit in there, because Fire Base Anaconda had been an- isolated. If you Google Fire Base Anaconda, they have, I think, two or three times been overrun by the Taliban. Like, climbing over walls and they were fighting for their lives.

    9. CWChris Williamson1:15:04

       Who the fuck chose to put this thing there?

    10. TKTim Kennedy1:15:06

        That's a great question. (laughs) That's a-

    11. CWChris Williamson1:15:08

        Stupid idea to put it in this, like-

    12. TKTim Kennedy1:15:09

        Yeah. It's a bad spot. They're also surrounded, um, they're, they're close enough where foreign fighters are easy, e- easily ... That, that area's easily accessible to foreign fighters. Um, it's just like the perfect storm and the worst place to be. Um, ODA782, little shout out to you guys 'cause they held that base, um, better than anybody ever has throughout the whole entire

    13. CWChris Williamson1:15:30

        .

    14. TKTim Kennedy1:15:31

        And it's my, my two best friends in the world, their old ODA. But we're trying to get the Czech Special Forces to Fire Base Anaconda, and you had to pass through this valley, and that's where we got blown up and attacked and ambushed. And then we had to fight for a while. And then once we got to Fire Base Anaconda, you know, we had scuffed up ... You know, we killed like 300, 400 foreign fighters and Taliban on our way in. Like, that really ... Like, we kicked a hornet's nest. So then all of the other organizations were sending all of their people 'cause they th- then they knew that we had to leave. 'Cause our job was to bring those guys in. We left. I put this in my book and I can't remember it off the top of my head now. We left with a couple hundred trucks and we arrived with, like, a couple dozen. That was crappy. (blows raspberry)

    15. CWChris Williamson1:16:23

        So,

13. 1:16:24 – 1:21:27

    How Do You Rest During a 5-Day Conflict?

    1. CWChris Williamson1:16:24

       if you're in a, a situation like that where you need to be fighting for five days straight, like, you can't be awake and functioning well for all of that time. So you're trying to grab 30 minutes of rest whenever you can?

    2. TKTim Kennedy1:16:37

       I don't remember, like, trying to get rest. Um, I remember being underneath a Humvee, and I woke up. And I don't know how I got underneath that Humvee and I don't know how long I had been underneath that Humvee. And I heard, like ... So there's somebody, like, shooting towards you, which is like, "Pew." And then there's somebody shooting at you, which is like, "Pew," the snap, and then there's-

    3. CWChris Williamson1:17:03

       Why is there snap?

    4. TKTim Kennedy1:17:05

       The snap is, is the bullet cre- like, coming past you and-

    5. CWChris Williamson1:17:08

       Right. It pushes the air.

    6. TKTim Kennedy1:17:10

       Yeah.

    7. CWChris Williamson1:17:10

       Yep.

    8. TKTim Kennedy1:17:10

       And then there's bang, "Sss," and that's like the bullet is so close. You hear the bang of the rifle, you hear the pop of the supersonic, and then you hear the l- li- literally the 115-grain or 250-grain thing going, "Sss," past your face. And I'm laying there and I hear, "Sss-kink," as it, like, goes past this Humvee and hits something metal in my vicinity, and I wake up. And then I was like, "Ah." And, uh, I had, I had overpressure sickness, so I was, like, shitting my pants and-

    9. CWChris Williamson1:17:47

       What's overpressure sickness?

    10. TKTim Kennedy1:17:49

        Som- where it's like being concussed. And it's not being concussed. It is being concussed.

    11. CWChris Williamson1:17:54

        Okay.

    12. TKTim Kennedy1:17:55

        So, like, a bunch of small concussions from explosions and IEDs and RPGs and .50 cals and AT4s, like all the things that we're shooting at them and all the things that they're shooting at us. All of those things go, "Who" with air, and that's happening around your head.

    13. CWChris Williamson1:18:09

        Yep.

    14. TKTim Kennedy1:18:10

        So that sucks. Um, and then we're at altitude and then I'm sleeping underneath a Humvee, which is probably not a great place.

    15. CWChris Williamson1:18:16

        While shitting yourself.

    16. TKTim Kennedy1:18:17

        Yeah, while you're shitting (laughs) yourself. Um, I smelled, I bet. That was pretty stank. (laughs) Anyway, so yeah, I don't know when I slept. I just, like, occasionally would wake up and ... When I was writing that, uh, Scars & Stripes, and I went back and I talked to a whole bunch of people that were there with me. Um, one of my friends, Mike, he died in 2019 Afghanistan. He was with me. He saved my life that day. Mike Goebel. I walk up to a door, and I don't know how he knew this, uh, 'cause I woke up, I walk up and I'm about to push the door open, and as soon as I touch the handle to the door, and it's a push door, he shoves me. And he and I always, like, we're kind of physical, like, we're al- almost always gonna fight over something stupid. I got mad at him 'cause he was carrying a pistol through a village and he wanted a pistol kill. And I was like, "You're sitting on a machine gun, why would you be holding a pistol? Put your pistol away." Then we ended up fist fighting. The team sergeant came over and separated. It's like, we're always, like, really rough. So he shoves me and I s- I, like, fall back and I'm, like, getting ready, like ... R- we're in the middle of a gunfight and I'm about to, like, start a fistfight with him because he shoves me, and the whole door starts getting shredded by machine gunfire. There's a PKM on the other side and I don't know if he, like, heard the bolt drop. I don't know if he heard the selector switch, the sa- safety getting pulled. I don't know if he just had, like, an intuition, if there was a sixth sense, divine intervention.

    17. CWChris Williamson1:19:38

        Mm-hmm.

    18. TKTim Kennedy1:19:38

        He shoves it and the whole door just starts getting shredded. Mike Goebel. And, uh ...... a hero. I wish everybody learned about him. There's another multiple tours, you know, countless lives he saved, more people he rescued, like... hero. Um, Mike English. I c- I can't even say his last name 'cause everybo- 'cause he's still in. (inhales deeply) But, uh, (sighs) the fog of war, um, when I went back and talked to all these guys, they remembered a whole bunch of things that I didn't remember. And we... In some cases, the things that we remembered were in conflict of each other. Like-

Episode duration: 2:49:04