Modern WisdomThe 2026 Immortality Protocol - Bryan Johnson (4K)
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
115 min read · 23,350 words- 0:00 – 11:14
Is Morning Wood the Ultimate Sleep Score?
- CWChris Williamson
Sorry to report, I have a new boner record, three hours, forty-nine minutes.
- BJBryan Johnson
[laughing]
- CWChris Williamson
The Fellowship of the Ring is three hours, forty-eight minutes.
- BJBryan Johnson
Is that a good thing? I mean, uh, I guess, uh, from w- whose perspective? [chuckles]
- CWChris Williamson
Pick. Well, yeah, uh, your perspective. Is it good for you?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. I mean, it-- yeah, it's, it's, uh, substantially better than an elite eighteen-year-old.
- CWChris Williamson
What would an elite boner eighteen-year-old be?
- BJBryan Johnson
Around two hours and forty-five minutes-ish.
- CWChris Williamson
What refers to elite? Like vasodilation, like g- g-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, like take an eighteen-year-old in peak condition.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay.
- BJBryan Johnson
And let's say, what would their nighttime erections be? They'd probably hover somewhere around like high two or two, nearly three hours. Uh, that'd be elite level.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay.
- BJBryan Johnson
And so it just crushes that level. So yeah, I mean, from a, like, a pure biological capacity-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm-hmm.
- BJBryan Johnson
... yeah, it's pretty, it's pretty good.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay. What were you doing with it, the three hours and forty-nine minutes?
- BJBryan Johnson
[laughing] So this is-- it's like, kind of like it's news to people-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm-hmm
- BJBryan Johnson
... as I've been sharing this, that, I mean, people, men are generally familiar with the idea that when you are twelve, thirteen, fourteen, you start having boners, and they happen a lot. You know, like in class, you don't even ask for it.
- CWChris Williamson
Gust of wind.
- BJBryan Johnson
[chuckles] Yeah, gust of wind. Literally anything, and you can't do anything about it.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, hey, whoa!
- BJBryan Johnson
Like, I-- I mean, do you remember, like, I would walk in between classes, and it's like, you got a boner.
- CWChris Williamson
Where's it gonna go?
- BJBryan Johnson
Where's it gonna go?
- CWChris Williamson
Tuck it into the waistband, fold it on the-
- BJBryan Johnson
Exactly. Pull it up. Exactly.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- BJBryan Johnson
Put a little book cover in front of it, but like, you can't control it, you can't really stop it. And then as you age, those things naturally go down, so people kind of forget about it as a phenomena. But men and women have arousal cycles every night, three to five erections every night. Men get erect, women have their clitoris engorge. And so it's this natural process. The body says, like: I want to keep my sexual function li- alive and vibrant, and it pulses it every night. And so it depends upon your quality of sleep, your, uh, metabolic health, your cardiovascular health, your physiological health, and your hormone health.
- 11:14 – 17:11
How Will AI Change Longevity Science?
- CWChris Williamson
do you make of the Harvard longevity study? I'm sure that you've become familiar with this.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
The world's longest-running study on adult life and happiness, and it does have some sort of longevity, life, uh, span, health span, uh, predictions in there. Uh, given that that's been going already for such a long time and has had lot... a huge data set, right? I think it's, like, eighty thousand-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... maybe even more.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
What's your perspective on that, given what you're interested in?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, I mean, there's probably some truisms on, like, humans respond favorably to having robust relationships. Like, that's true long ago, it's true now. Uh, humans respond favorably to exercise. There's a lot of truisms, like, we know this shit's really, you know, the case. But I think it, it's like what may be interesting about this is, uh, that is a good retrospective study. I'm not sure all of it's going to carry over into the future. So in the, in the coming years, if we figure out some of these, uh, new therapies to rejuvenate ourselves in ways we couldn't before-... it may be an entirely different environment in which we look at long-lived species, and it may be less about those things and more about other things. Now, this is not to say that relationships are going away. It's not to say that fundamentals of, like, uh, being active are going away, but I do think we're at a, a moment in time where in-- if you had that study going on, and we were talking in the nineteen sixties, we'd be like: "Yep, good data. Let's carry on." But being in twenty twenty-five, where AI is now starting to make novel discoveries-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
-I think the landscape's gonna be very different.
- CWChris Williamson
What are the specific differences that are gonna have the most lever behind them?
- BJBryan Johnson
I mean, we-- there's an open question, like, what is AI in our lives? Like, is AI a relationship or not? Uh, do we have human relationships? Like, what are the contours of those things? Uh, what do longevity therapies do for us if we start playing around with gene therapies? What does it also-- I mean, for example, you look at Ozempic, like these GLP-1s. You, you put a-- you take a shot, it alters your experience with hunger. Like, it changes a fundamental part of being human. And so if we have the ability to change something so, like, fundamental to our essence, and we get really good at drug design, like, what else are we gonna change? So I'm talking about this on, like, a ten, fifteen, twenty-year timescale. This is not, like, next two or three years, but still, like, we are in this open frontier, where there'll be maybe some things that continue as universalisms-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
-that just as a biological species, they're true.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Also, uh, it's like a radical change, and I'm more interested in, like, what is gonna be different than what has been.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm. Yeah. Uh, Morgan Housel's book, Same as Ever, uh, is an interesting one, that people try to predict the future, but what is easier is to work out the stuff that's not going to change-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... moving forward-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
-because the future is as yet undetermined, but working out what from the past can be predicted-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
-it's quite nice. Um, there is this sense, right? Everybody's had this sense that our generation, we are the one. It's the inflection point, it's the precipice. It's right now-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... it's always right now, because it always does feel like that, right?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
If you look at a hockey curve, that graph, at each point, it was the highest, most rapidly ascending-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
-biggest, quickest-moving point ever, and then you just pull it along a little bit, and then it zooms out, and you go, "Oh, that was nothing."
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- 17:11 – 29:13
Are We Entering a New Moral Framework?
- CWChris Williamson
like, too?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
So I'm interested in how you are thinking about the emotional and spiritual piece of longevity and health when you've got all of this focus on the physical piece. So are you, are you, and how are you looking at the, at, at those two elements? Do you even concede-- conceive of them within your map framework?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, I mean, first, I don't really feel emotions, so no. Just joking. [laughing] I mean, people, that-- So the-- that's a very common perspective. What people don't realize is that the entirety of my endeavor is, um, is about AI and how we, as a human race, survive this moment, like full stop. That is the only reason I'm doing this.
- CWChris Williamson
Was it like that when you first started?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yes.
- CWChris Williamson
Really?
- BJBryan Johnson
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
So you saw the writing on the wall with regards to AI before normies like me did?
- BJBryan Johnson
In twenty sixteen, I, I gave this talk, and I was like: "Look, if we look at this graph, very clear, it's up and to the right, and it's big."
- CWChris Williamson
What was the graph?
- BJBryan Johnson
AI.
- CWChris Williamson
Right.
- BJBryan Johnson
Whatever it is, it's gonna be big. And so I didn't care to get in the prediction game of, like, what it-- when it's going to arrive and what it's gonna be and all that, just that this is a moment. And I was trying to poke around, like-... given this, uh, it, it really does feel like this is like very much like a feel intuit- intuition. It feels big, and it feels consequential, and it feels like we probably want to be sober to get this thing right. And so what I've been trying to do, more than anything, is to say, we need a new moral philosophy that enables us to survive this moment.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
That basically, the, the philosophy we have now that drives everything is, is one built on death. We are inherently a die species. We seek death for the glory of immortality through our various games, and the new moral philosophy I'm trying to create is, don't die. That is, like, when you give birth to super intelligence, existence itself is the highest virtue. And so back to this book of The History of Western Thought: Plato, Aristotle, uh, medieval t- uh, Christianity, medieval times, Renaissance, Enlightenment, modern-day scientific era, like, big chunks of time for these big ideologies. We're due for a brand-new moral philosophy, and it will be induced by AI, and so it-- the opening is right now, and it's not just like some small tweak. It's a really big opening, and that's what I'm really angling for. And so health is a vector to basically talk about it, to say, like, "Here's how you understand philosophy through these very practical actions," but that's really what I'm trying to do. And so above all, it's a-- health is a, is a language to communicate a new moral philosophy on what do we do as a species in this moment.
- CWChris Williamson
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- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. Um, it means that we are going to struggle to keep up, and it's gonna be so unnerving to us that, uh, it-- things might get chaotic and psychotic, and it might just, like, have the bottom drop out. Like, for example, when I was reading this book, Nineteen Twenty-Nine, about the stock market crash, uh, the, the focus was financial gain. You know, invest in the stock market, get credit to invest more, like leverage yourself up.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
And then when that burst, it created all kinds of d- destruction in the economy, and we-- took us a long time to recover from that. I think the equivalent right now would be hope, that you have hope for the future, right? Like, you have imaginations of what you want to be and become, what you want to achieve. Everyone has that, and as society progresses, when AI starts doing various things, it's not that they're bad. It's just that change happens, and that creates uncertainty for humans. Like, what am I gonna do? Who am I? What's my identity? How do I feel secure? All these basic questions, if we can't answer those as fast as people feel insecure about it, then you kind of teeter on this psychosis, where, like, can you keep your shit together? And so people focus a lot on AI, like, is AI a threat? Uh, should we pause it? Like, all these different questions. There's an equal and opposite concern of what happens to human society when all this change is happening so quickly-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
-and we can't respond fast enough. Like, is, is humanity-- like, is, is the bottom falling out the real risk of... You know, then humans do human stuff, right? Like we-
- CWChris Williamson
What's the bottom falling out in this scenario?
- BJBryan Johnson
Uh, it's the sturdiness of law and order, of hope that I, I-- my, my son, you know, my twenty-year-old son, he can go to school, he can get a degee-- a degree, he can get a job, he can make money, he can find his own apartment, he can get married, you know, if he wants to have kids. Like, the natural life progression. If he can't quite see that structure anymore, who is he? Or you take, like, my dad, who's, like, now in his early seventies. He's on the other side. He's in the legal profession. The tools are getting so good, like, he just can't hang. Like, it's, it's, it's hard for him to hang, and he's like: "What do I do? Like, I'm now out of the game, and I don't feel any worth. Like, I don't have any identity." He's really, really struggling. And so you take any person at any stage in their life-... you've got really serious existential challenges on. This is not guaranteed. It's just as like a thought experiment of like what could happen, and so what Don't Die could be is like this, this sturdiness be-beneath us to say it's okay. Like, our identities are not tied up in our profession. They're not tied up on our status in the community. It's, it's like actually tied up by this ex- this virtue of existence, that we're going to fight this new game as a species that don't die.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
And so it's trying to create sturdiness of identity, sturdiness of community, sturdiness of, like, "We've got this. We have a purpose. We have a mission. We're here for a reason."
- CWChris Williamson
If the mission of being alive is simply mortality, does that not, uh, drop down much of the complexity that people find beauty in? It's like simply being alive. Like, there's two parts to this that I see in my mind. One is one which is very whole. It's about enoughness, it's about being okay as you are.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Um, but that's not how humans are wired, you know this.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- 29:13 – 35:46
Why Longevity Fails Without Behaviour Change
- CWChris Williamson
What have been the biggest changes, uh, in your approach or beliefs about health and longevity over the last few years? We, we- you came on the show maybe three years ago, and then we got to hang out in Roatán a couple of years ago, but lots of research, lots of experimentation, self-experimentation. What have been the biggest pivots?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. Uh, I'd say one is do less. Like, most things in health and wellness and longevity don't work, and so people spend a lot of time doing stuff, and I would say save your time and money and don't do a lot of stuff.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm-hmm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Do a few number, uh, do a few things, and then, two, is the biggest yield is typically doing behavioural change. So, like, if a person has a, a ta- everybody has their thing. Let's say somebody's thing is like they, they love Skittles, and they just, you know, can't help themselves to have a bag late at night. Then, um, that's the biggest longevity therapy for that person, is to stop eating the bag of Skittles. And so what a person will typically do is, like, if they have that, if they're locked in on that battle, they will, um, to compensate for that, they'll go to a, a gym, they'll go get red light therapy, they'll do a cold plunge, they'll do all this stuff-
- CWChris Williamson
That isn't the thing.
- BJBryan Johnson
... Uh, but it, yeah, it's basically to compensate for the fact that they feel so powerless to stop the Skittles thing.... that they'll rather do those things. So most, so most people are doing that compensation, and even though, like, those things are good, they're not the higher yield thing. The higher yield thing is to stop the bad behavior.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
But that's the thing that most people feel very hard, and what they don't realize in doing that is, like, the reason why that's hard is because they're not sleeping. Uh, not sleeping well just destroys your willpower, and they're not sleeping well because, you know, like, five other preceding things are the case. So I, I try to help people understand, like, here's a five-step process to nail your sleep. When you nail your sleep, your willpower boosts. When your willpower boosts, you can tackle Skittles. That's your therapy.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay, so it's sleep numero uno?
- BJBryan Johnson
By far.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay, give me, after all of the experimentation, what's the thirty-thousand-foot view on how to get perfect sleep?
- BJBryan Johnson
You, you want to lower your resting heart rate before bed. It's the highest value biomarker you can track on a daily basis. So you'll find that everything that increases your heart rate before bed, besides sex, is bad for you, and everything that lowers your heart rate before bed is good for you. And so, for example, food, timing of food is really important. So if your bedtime is at ten PM, you want to have your final meal of the day at six PM, so four hours. Uh, I personally do, like, ten to twelve hours, because I really like that digestion time. It lowers my heart rate to, like, thirty-nine to forty beats per minute. So food, uh, four hours before, uh, sixty minutes before bed, screen's off. So that's very hard because we're all addicted to our phones, but hard cut, phone's off. Uh, because you want to avoid scrolling, texting, working, and that's very, uh, arousing for the body.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Um, red light, amber light in the house, so whites, blue lights, uh, are really bad for melatonin release. Um, you want to have a, like, a wind-- a sixty-minute wind down, so when screens are off, you want to use that sixty minutes to just calm yourself down. So this is very hard because people have... We've created these habits where we're glued to our phones, and if we're not on our phones, we don't know what to do with ourselves, and so it creates this panic. So the sixty-minute time window before bed is really precious in that you just need to kind of be with yourself. Now, you can hang out with a friend, a family member. You can go for a walk, you can do breathwork, meditation, a hobby, like puzzle, journal, like whatever, but you just need to learn how to be with yourself without stimulation, and that will naturally allow you to calm yourself down. I do this process where I talk to myself, so, like, I talk to my various Bryans. So, like, sleep Bryan comes on duty at seven thirty PM, because my bedtime's at eight thirty PM, and then all the Bryans line up, and they want to talk to me.
- CWChris Williamson
How many are there?
- BJBryan Johnson
Oh, man, there's, like, probably a dozen. Like, probably loud.
- CWChris Williamson
It's like a Bonnie Blue meetup. Okay.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
All right.
- BJBryan Johnson
So the first one's ambitious Bryan. Ambitious Bryan is by far the loudest, right? He's always like, he shows up, and he's like-
- CWChris Williamson
Do more.
- BJBryan Johnson
"I got a banger idea. Brand-new idea. It's fucking amazing." And sleep Bryan says, "I love you, ambitious Bryan," right? "Doing this a real solid, like, doing great out there. Also, we're in sleep mode, so I'm gonna write down your idea, and tomorrow we'll talk about this."
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
And the next one is anxious Bryan. He's, like, doing all the checks, like, "Today, did you make any big errors? Did you, like, you know, [chuckles] do anything-
- CWChris Williamson
Upset anyone?
- BJBryan Johnson
... Do any, anything stupid, anything, say anything you regret?" And so, like, doing that internal reconciliation of, like, do you have good self-awareness? And they all just line up, but if you don't talk to them, then when your head hits the pillow, they show up, and they're like, "We're here, and we want to talk about our stuff." And then you go to bed finally, and you wake up at two AM, and they're like, "We're back!"
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
And so you've got to have some kind of reconciliation process to calm those voices. So, like, those, those are the big ones, like food, um, light, um, wind-down routine, screens off, um, the, um... Yeah, like, and then caffeine. So you want to have your final caffeine around noon each day, so it has a six-hour half-life. Those are the real big ones.
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- BJBryan Johnson
So, but what you want is, like, for a man, you want to like, be, like, fifty-ish heart rate. Same with the, same with the female. If you're in that zone, you're doing pretty well. If you can bump down a bit more, um... And once you get that nighttime routine knocked down, then you can start exercising very well. Like, if you sleep really well, your willpower s- skyrockets. If you sleep poorly, it, like, knocks your prefrontal cortex offline. You can't really have much will, willpower, so-
- 35:46 – 41:48
How to Stop Optimisation Becoming Self-Sabotage
- CWChris Williamson
How do you avoid an optimal routine becoming a fragile superstition?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. People, um, people try to, uh... They, they come back, they come with that argument, and that's great. Like, um, the body loves routine. Now, it does not mean that you have to always be in a routine, but the body is built for routine. So for example, if your bedtime is ten PM, your circadian rhythm, rhythm is locked in to ten PM, and your body expects sleep to happen at ten PM.
- CWChris Williamson
This is what jet lag is.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yes, exactly. And so, like, you have a garbage truck that rolls through your body around ten thirty PM, and it's there to pick up all the trash.
- CWChris Williamson
What is that?
- BJBryan Johnson
It's your, your, basically your cleansing system of, like, your... Your lymphatic system is cleaning all the trash from your body, and if you're not asleep at ten thirty PM and in your deep-sleep mode-... it's gonna, it's gonna not come. So you've got trash build-up. Like New York, you've got the trash bags all over the place. And so people think, "If I'm not in bed by ten, I'm gonna go to bed at one, that's okay. I'll sleep in tomorrow morning, make up." It doesn't work that way. And so the body has very specific rhythms that it wants to be on, and so when you lock in, it's good. And so when someone makes the argument like, "I'm gonna give my body hor-- some hormetic stress," right? I'm like, push it to one, and then it moves back. The body hates it. Like, inconsistent [chuckles] sleep is as bad as little sleep.
- CWChris Williamson
I was gonna say, do you-- when it comes to prioritisation, is duration more important than regularity, or are they equal?
- BJBryan Johnson
Reg- so regularity, by far, is the best one. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
More than duration?
- BJBryan Johnson
Uh, oh, so I'm sorry. You said duration. Um, I don't know. Uh, I'm not sure on that one.
- CWChris Williamson
It's kind of like picking your favorite child, I suppose.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, yeah, because you kind of need both.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm-hmm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, like, the, the lesson here is, uh, 'cause these are bad habits people have, you need to be on time. You can't make it up. You can't, uh, skip during the week and then make it up on the weekend. It doesn't work that way.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
So you miss a garbage truck every day, it doesn't come back. Like, sure, maybe on the weekend, but then you're so, you're so off on your circadian rhythm that, like, now is the garbage truck even in service?
- CWChris Williamson
Mm. Mm-hmm. Okay, um, so, uh, I understand what you mean with regards to the timing, but the sixty-minute window, what if you don't get it? What if this... You're out at dinner, you're doing something with friends, you're hanging out, you don't get to-- you're around some bright light. I've got a great, a great story from a friend. When he was in his hyper, hyper optimizer zone, which everybody goes through, where it's like y- the stress of trying to be perfect kills you more quickly than your imperfections do.
- BJBryan Johnson
[chuckles] Yeah. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
And, uh, he had this sixty-minute wind-down routine, which was blue light blockers on and the mouth tape and the nose strip and the magnesium bisglycinate and the, everything else, and he'd been sort of winding down for sixty minutes, and his girlfriend at the time had been downstairs, and he was brushing his teeth in the dark so that he wouldn't have any light on, and she just comes, like, tinkering in, hits the light in the bathroom. Like, the lights come on. He's like, "Ah!" He's blinded. He hasn't looked at light for, for an hour, goes to bed, and he's raging. He's like, "Argh, my entire routine's been messed up," and he's laid there sort of staring at the ceiling, doesn't sleep, and she drops off-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... within five minutes-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
- having just come in from, like, you know, scrolling TikTok or whatever.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Um, the example is about the fragility of reliance on that and the fear that without it, what does that create? "Oh, I mean-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
- how am I s- gonna be able to write my book today? I didn't get my..." You know, like-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... as you said, like-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- 41:48 – 56:18
Is Existence the Highest Moral Virtue?
- CWChris Williamson
Okay, give me your formula for behaviour change. Behaviour change is so important. Let's assume someone's taken the first red pill, which is sleep, and I now have access to, uh, the amount of willpower that I'm supposed to have, as opposed to however much is diminished-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
- by my shit sleep from the night before.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
I've arrived. Look at, behold my litany of shitty [chuckles] habits.
- BJBryan Johnson
[chuckles] Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Like a guy-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... in a side, a side alley going, "Would you care to-
- BJBryan Johnson
[laughs] Exactly
- CWChris Williamson
... peruse my wares of shitty habits?"
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Um, someone has a shitty habit. Maybe it's the Skittles, maybe it's-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... whatever. Pick whichever you think is a good one. Talk me through your James Clear approach to the Bryan Johnson's James Clear approach.
- BJBryan Johnson
Okay, so actually, I, I'll show you mine, but I wonder if this resonates or not with people, but I had this issue where at seven pm, I would overeat every night.
- CWChris Williamson
... Mm-hmm. Yeah, evening eating for me is the only time. And no, no one ever overeats in a, a breakfast.
- BJBryan Johnson
Exactly.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, yeah, it was just 9:00 AM, and I gorged myself on Snickers.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, exactly.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, fuck, dude.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, like, maybe like in a, a weekend brunch where you order, you know, pancakes, and you're like, "Oh, my God!"
- CWChris Williamson
It's a one-off, yeah.
- BJBryan Johnson
One-
- CWChris Williamson
That was a bad idea. I don't want to do that again.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, [chuckles] exactly.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- BJBryan Johnson
So awful. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- BJBryan Johnson
So, like, your willpower goes down all day. It makes sense. Like 7:00 PM, like, you have stress, you're worn down, like, you just wanna like, whatever. So that was my issue, was I overate at 7:00 PM, and so I did it every day for years, and every night was the same battle, right? Like: I'm not gonna do it. I'm not gonna do it. [chuckles] I do it, and then, like, you know, my-- the top button on my pants, I can't be buttoned up, and I'm like, "Fucking hate myself. Like, this is so tight. I'm so uncomfortable." So I tried so many things to stop that, and I couldn't. And so the one thing that I did is one day I just kind of said in jest, "Evening Bryan, you're fired. Like, y- you, Bryan, who occupy me from 5:00 PM to seven-- to 10:00 PM, you're an unreliable thing. Like, every day-
- 56:18 – 1:05:11
The Tool Bryan Refuses to Live Without
- BJBryan Johnson
right.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay, tell me about your sauna experiments.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
I was watching those unfold with intrigue.
- BJBryan Johnson
So we really d- we discovered quite a few things that I didn't... I shouldn't say discover. Um, we found out a lot of, quite, quite a few things. So one is, for those who are new to sauna, um, dry sauna has the most evidence, because you're trying to get your core body temperature up, and so infrared does not get hot enough, and wet sauna, uh, will basically burn you at the temperatures you need. So dry sauna is the right-
- CWChris Williamson
Traditional dry sauna?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- BJBryan Johnson
Uh, 20 minutes a day at 200 degrees Fahrenheit. Ni- uh, 83, is that 83 Celsius? 93 Celsius. All right, 200 Fahrenheit. Um, so th- three things we found: One is, I was in LA during the LA wild- wildfires, when, like, 20,000-
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, that'll heat you up, if you go close to them.
- BJBryan Johnson
So yeah, so I was measuring my toxins in my body, uh, when, before the fires happened, and then after the fires happened, and I was absolutely baked in toxins. So I was in, like, the 99th percentile, as I'm sure other people in LA were, too, of toxins. You could, like, go down the list and be like, "This chemical is used in PVC pipe for [chuckles] for housing. This-
- CWChris Williamson
Geez
- BJBryan Johnson
... this chemical is like a, a countertop. This chemical is-
- CWChris Williamson
[laughing]
- BJBryan Johnson
Like, you could, like, you could, like, literally see the burned houses and cars.
- CWChris Williamson
Breathing in Teflon and-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... yeah, whatever else.
- BJBryan Johnson
And you could, like, down the list, you could look at the industrial solvent.
- CWChris Williamson
There's a Kia Sorento.
- BJBryan Johnson
[chuckles] Yes, exactly. So my body was full of all these houses, uh, and cars that were burnt, and the sauna annihilated the toxins. It was remarkable, so that was cool.
- CWChris Williamson
Great.
- BJBryan Johnson
Two is, we have been trying to get my microplastics, uh, down-
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah
- BJBryan Johnson
... because microplastics live in the body and the brain, and we were measuring microplastics in my blood and also in my semen. And so microplastics, uh, hang out in the testicles, and that has all sorts of negative effects on testosterone, on, uh, fertility. Uh, you just don't want them hanging out there. So I have over a 90% reduction in my blood and my semen-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm
- BJBryan Johnson
... of microplastics, and that was a first-in-world demonstration of... No one had ever done that before.
- CWChris Williamson
It's because the microplastics test is actually kind of hard to do, right?
- BJBryan Johnson
Exactly.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- 1:05:11 – 1:20:32
Does HBOT Actually Work?
- CWChris Williamson
Okay, HBOT, talk to me about that. I was messaging you... The day that I-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... started my HBOT-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... was the day that you put your video out, and I'm in there, and you were like... I can't remember what the fuck you-
- BJBryan Johnson
[laughing]
- CWChris Williamson
... you replied with, like, a, a, a, a twenty-fifth, twenty and five.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Uh, eighty-three percent with natural blah, blah, blah.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Just... 'Cause I'm in this big fucking metal dildo, and the guy that's there, Vance from Beam Hyperbarics in Austin, if anyone wants to go to a great hyperbarics place, it's fucking sick. You can book it by the hour. Uh, Vance is great, and I'm, like, knocking on the little-
- BJBryan Johnson
[laughing]
- CWChris Williamson
... this tiny little porthole out of my submarine, and [chuckles] he comes in, and I just showed my phone. I'm like, "Uh," I couldn't be bothered to use the radio to get outside. I'm like, "Is- uh, Bryan, Bryan messaged. Did you-- Are we doing this?" And he sort of went-
- BJBryan Johnson
[laughing] That's so funny.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, put his thumb up like that. So, uh-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... hyperbaric-
- BJBryan Johnson
I mean, so-
- CWChris Williamson
Red pilled me
- BJBryan Johnson
... I was, when you messaged me, I was worried about you because-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm
- BJBryan Johnson
... uh, like, a week before, somebody had blown up in Arizona. So yeah, so-
- CWChris Williamson
What does that look like?
- BJBryan Johnson
Well, so in, in hyperbaric, the idea is you pressurise. So, uh, you're actually-- So at atmosphere, at, at sea level, we're about fifteen pounds per square inch of, of concentration of oxygen.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
At two atmospheres, you're at thirty. So you, you pressurise, and some hyperbaric chambers, they pressurise, and then they just push one hundred percent oxygen into the chamber. So you're just hanging out and breathing the oxygen, but if you're doing that, you're sitting in a pressurised chamber, and you're basically a flammable ba- ball-
- CWChris Williamson
You're a candle wait.
- BJBryan Johnson
Like, you're, you're a bomb. Like, so if something, if, if there's a spark of any type-
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah
- BJBryan Johnson
... you just blow up.
- 1:20:32 – 1:26:12
Bryan’s Top Longevity Tips
- BJBryan Johnson
it. I, I can do that."
- CWChris Williamson
What are the big moves? We've already said sleep, and you've given a good breakdown there. If there was a top three, top five, however many you need for, okay, the Pareto-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... Eighty percent of the results come from these things.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
What are those things?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, so I'd, first, I would frame this in a moral philosophy. So I'd say if-
- CWChris Williamson
Believe.
- BJBryan Johnson
[chuckles] Well, I guess, first, like, um, your most prized possession is agency. Nothing valued more than your agency, and right now, most people's agency is compromised, that they are not the architects of their life because they compulsively scroll, they compulsively eat fast food, they compulsively, uh, do all these addictive behaviors. And then when pressed on it, they rationalize it as virtue because they're trapped. And so I would challenge everyone here to say, like, "Reclaim yourself. Don't do anything you don't wanna do, and that the enemy is the motherfucker who's trying to get you to do something that is not in your best interest. Fuck them." That is the enemy. And so, like, that gives you real moral power. Don't be puppeted. Now, once you have that principle, like, I'm going to set my bedtime, I'm not going to doomscroll, I'm not gonna eat that fucking bag of Skittles, right? Like, I'm not gonna eat the fast food. That's, it's poison. They're gonna trick me into thinking it's a treat or something, you know, like... But, like, that's what I think, for me, the boundary conditions of, like, how you create the kind of, um, energy state of like, I can do this, and I have a moral will to do it, not just because of self-help, but I'm, like, fighting an enemy, I'm overcoming adversity, I'm a man standing on my agency or woman. Like, that to me, gives it the juice to, like, I have the, the willpower to do it.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay, now that we've got the moral framework, what are the tactical things?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. So you-- once you have agency, you wanna reclaim your willpower. You, you need to have juice in the tank to say, like, "I can make decisions, that I can do it." So one is you wanna master sleep. You wanna build your entire life around sleep. That is very counterintuitive, but you want to plan when you go to bed, when your wind-down routine is, you wanna set strict rules, you wanna, um, plan your lighting. Like, again, like, you can choose your archetype, whether you're really regimented, whether you're, like, more flexible, like, whatever your thing is, but just build your entire life around sleep. And if you need, uh, justification, realize those not doing that are ten to twelve points stupider than you. Like, they're actually dumb, so they're-- it's like a retardation exercise for them. You're actually gonna be smart. Once you do that, exercise, 'cause that also is going to boost your willpower. So boost it with sleep, boost it with exercise, and then once you get those two down, then tackle food, 'cause food is the most complicated. Food is where we go to, like, soothe ourselves, to do, like, the, the self-therapy. So only tackle then. Try to start just having a bit more good things for you and a few, uh, less bad things, like, slowly walk your way into it. Radical change is hard for a lot of people, but just, like, slow walk into it. And then if you, again, have that in the back of your mind, like, uh, a rule, you will never, ever eat fast food ever again. Like, none is better than some. So there's no moderation, there's no once a day. Like, the cheat-- the idea of a cheat meal is the worst idea in history. Like, don't do cheat days, don't do cheat meals, don't do cheat weeks, don't do cheat anything. Don't cheat.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm. [clears throat] Uh, when it comes to exercise, well, for longevity, most people are already doing, uh... Almost everybody that's listening is gonna have some sort of training regime, uh, I would imagine.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
The vast majority of them are going to be something like a push pull leg split, and maybe other people are runner boys and runner girls.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yep.
- CWChris Williamson
Um, if you were to design the minimum effective dose, this is where I think the blind spots are for people. What would you say, exercise-wise?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, I mean, I-- because everyone's got their jam, whether it's Pilates, weights, body, whatever, just do it. Like, just be active for, uh, roughly an hour a day. Do cardio, do strength, do balance, do flexibility. Everyone's got their own preferences, but I think, uh, I don't go after the details here because there's, like, endless material to go after. Just be active and commit to be active.
- CWChris Williamson
Some people like chicken, some people like salmon, some people like kale, some people like spinach.
- BJBryan Johnson
Exactly.
- CWChris Williamson
Right.
- BJBryan Johnson
Like, just... And then, I-- same thing with food. Like, I don't, uh, get into the game of carnivore versus vegan versus paleo versus whatever. They're abstractions which are irrelevant. Eat what you want, measure your body, make sure you're good, and then fine-tune yourself. Like, I have a Don't Die food guide. We tried to look through all the scientific evidence to say, "What are the very best foods in existence with the highest value evidence that you can put into your body?" So we just said, "By a power law perspective, here's what I'd put on, so I can share that as a plate."
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- BJBryan Johnson
Outside of that, like, do your thing. Like, just eat what you want, just measure your body, make sure you're good.
- CWChris Williamson
Right, okay.... methylene blue, how'd you get on with that?
- BJBryan Johnson
You know, I stopped it because I started 25 milligrams a day, and then... Oh, it was conflicting with-- we started a therapy doing, uh, altitude training. So you take your, your blood oxygenation down to 80%. We did it, and the two have conflicting mechanisms of action, and we realized it on day three, so we're like: "We better stop methylene blue to do the therapy," so.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, okay. Is methylene blue, it's like nicotine derivative, right? Or it's something to do with nicotine?
- BJBryan Johnson
I mean, it's a synthetic, synthetic dye. Initially, it was built because the surgeons wanted to see, like, where they're actually in the surgical body. Uh, but it was actually FDA-approved for, um... What was it? Um, I forget now. Yeah, it was FDA-approved quite a while ago, but overall, um, we don't think that's really, uh, we don't think it's worth it-
- CWChris Williamson
Okay.
- BJBryan Johnson
-as a therapy.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay.
- 1:26:12 – 1:30:08
Why We Need to Focus on Testosterone
- CWChris Williamson
Uh-
- BJBryan Johnson
Brain health.
- CWChris Williamson
Testosterone.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Testosterone, the, the fucking hormone of the twenty-first century.
- BJBryan Johnson
It is.
- CWChris Williamson
What have you come to learn about testosterone?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, um, so I'm in, like, the seven hundreds naturally, so just by doing all the basic stuff.
- CWChris Williamson
What were you when you, when you started? Do you know?
- BJBryan Johnson
Um, I, I guess like, hmm, when I was 42. I don't know.
- CWChris Williamson
Right.
- BJBryan Johnson
I need to look at my data. Um, yeah, but if, if, if a man is low on testosterone, and the natural approaches are not addressing it, it probably makes sense to do something about it.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Like being low in testosterone just has really negative consequences, so-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
-yeah, a good one to watch after.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm. What are the ways to intervene naturally, or what are the biggest mo- needle movers that you-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, I mean, all the basics, right? Like sleep. Like, I think poor sleep, uh, four hours of sleep a night, uh, will knock you down something like ten to twenty percent on testosterone. Uh, so like really big drop.
- CWChris Williamson
Less of a man, again.
- BJBryan Johnson
Again, yeah, like high social status. So then sleep, exercise, nutrition, like all the basics.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm-hmm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Uh, there's-- I don't think there's a lot of proven, um, supplementation that can move the needle. I think people-
- CWChris Williamson
Without getting into pharmacology?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, I think people have played with a bunch of stuff. Uh, I don't... If I'm not mistaken, I'm not sure the clinical evidence is very strong there, but I need to look at it.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
I guess I have never had low testosterone, so I've never had to look at supplementation as a means-
- CWChris Williamson
Yep
- BJBryan Johnson
-to do it.
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- BJBryan Johnson
So I guess I would be cautious, and my knowledge is limited in terms of, like, the true evidence for clinical, uh, interventions.
- 1:30:08 – 1:38:59
Does a 15-Second Call Strengthen Relationships?
- CWChris Williamson
Talking of daily practices, what's this fifteen-second phone call thing you're doing?
- BJBryan Johnson
Oh, yeah, [chuckles] with my friends. Yeah, so, um, a, a friend of mine introduced it to me, so he-- I became friends with this person, and he, he's, he's very powerful, and, uh, he would call me, and he'd be like, "Bryan," like, blank statement. I say something to him, and like: "All right, man, I love you. See you." That's it. And I was like: "That is amazing." It, it was so clean. It feels so good, and we just did that through, like, a couple months, and we built this amazing friendship. And, um-
- CWChris Williamson
Fifteen-second friendship.
- BJBryan Johnson
Fif- like, and it was like, it, but it was like this deep, um... And I guess I, I imagine in my mind, like, I imagined what his day must be like. Uh, like, he's juggling all kinds of crazy things. He clearly does not have time for, like, sit down, hang out, do this and that, but yet he does such a great job of maintaining really meaningful, like, deep relationships.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
So when he says he loves you, it's like, you feel it. It's like he's not, like, just saying it.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- BJBryan Johnson
And so I, I appreciated his model of b-- of friendship so much because I, before I was stuck in this idea that, "Hey, Chris, you wanna hang out?" You know.
- CWChris Williamson
It's a big deal. Let's fucking get a fucking Airbnb. I'll book a week off work.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, then it's like a four-hour thing, right? Versus calling you like, "Hey, man," like, "What's up? How you doing?" And, like, you, you can answer because you know I'm not gonna t- be on the phone for twenty minutes.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.... I, I mean, the, uh, I did this series Life Hacks on the show when I first started, and we do one every year now at Christmas. And, uh, back in the day, when that was one of the big thrusts of the show, we'd often get asked, "Okay, what of a five hundred or a thousand life hacks that you do-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
-what are the, the highest impact ones?" Uh, the first one is always sleep with your phone outside of your bedroom.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. Um, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
But it's, it's an instant ten to fifteen percent improvement in quality of life-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
-in that one thing. Uh, so that, that's actually before sleep. [chuckles]
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Let's take the charging cable-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
-outside of your bedroom-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
-and put it in the kitchen. Uh, but the second one was text your friends when you think of them.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yes.
- CWChris Williamson
And, uh, this is my equivalent of the fifteen-second friendship.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Um, and it's just, "Hey, man, like thinking of you. Hope, hope you're well," like-
- BJBryan Johnson
That's it
- CWChris Williamson
... whatever. Uh, or a photo that you-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- 1:38:59 – 1:48:26
Does Bryan Wish He Started Earlier?
- CWChris Williamson
When we first ever spoke, however long ago that was, I asked you a question about, um, I didn't use this word, but the grief of not starting earlier.
- BJBryan Johnson
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
The potential resentment that you can, uh, place at your caregivers, and your friends, and your culture of, "This didn't happen earlier," and the entropy. You- you started on the other side of the rollercoaster, right? You're like: "Oh, fuck!"
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Like, I'm fighting against it-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... as opposed to improving it.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
You know, like, I can't get younger-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... in the same way as I could have gotten younger, or at least slowed it down or whatever.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
I'm interested in your relationship with that dynamic now, a few years hence, more time to think what could have been, but also to think: Well, I can't-- by focusing on that, I'm-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... losing the very time which I'm claiming is now being more limited.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
That seems like a very stupid way to spend my life.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Uh, where have you come in to land with... You said before, and I think it's a really good point, you are-- it's not too late. You can reverse or you, you slow down, like you can really, really make great progress no matter where you are. But the emotional connection to what could have been, had I started earlier, what I've done to my body, the grief-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
... that stuff, what's your relationship with that like now?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. I mean, as you might guess, you know, I now-- I view this question through the moral frameworks, right? Like, basically, the premise of the question is that, um, I'm in a low status position because of these preceding events. You know, that I, I didn't, uh, I didn't have parents that knew health and wellness when I was a kid. I didn't understand health and wellness my- myself in my twenties. I fell prey to cultural norms that say, that said, "Destroy yourself," right? And so the way I'd evaluate any person answering your question is, how skilled are they in taking a low-status position and converting it to high status?
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Like, how do you flip the question-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm
- BJBryan Johnson
... for me to find virtue in my place and attribute, you know, charity to what's, what's preceded? Because really it never makes sense for a person to wallow in grief. Like, yes, it makes sense to reconcile, like, be honest, like we can acknowledge that may have been a mistake. You know, we can contemplate, you know, we wish it wouldn't have happened, but really, uh, you're, you don't want to sit in negative emotions. It's just not good for you. It's-- You don't want to beat yourself up. And so you can either take a, a, a, a step where you say: "I'm reconciled, I'm neutral, like I'm, I'm fine with it," or you can say, "I'm going to invert it." But that's what I've really learned, uh, more than anything in my life. This is what I try to train my kids is: Don't be subject. Don't lose your agency and be subject to pain that is self-induced. You can choose how you feel. This is kind of like Viktor Frankl's Man's Search for Meaning, right? He's in the concentration camp, and he's like: "I'm not going to let these conditions determine my state of mind. I'm going to choose that state of mind myself." But that's really ultimate agency. And so I'd take your question, and, and I, I would invert it and be like, um: This is the most interesting time in the history of four-point-whatever billion years that we've been on this planet. I am so fortunate to be alive right now, and I'm, like, in my forties, where I'm still, like, in my prime, and I can have a meaningful impact on what happens to the human race. Like, that is a possibility. So I wouldn't trade anything, under any circumstance, to trade the position I'm in right now because it's the coolest moment-
- CWChris Williamson
Yep
- BJBryan Johnson
... in the history of the human race. And so, like, quick inversion, and now I'm like: Damn, pretty cool.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- BJBryan Johnson
I'm pretty- I'm pumped about the situation.
- 1:48:26 – 1:53:46
What’s Next For Bryan?
- CWChris Williamson
Bryan Johnson, ladies and gentlemen. Dude, you're great. I really appreciate you. I appreciate your friendship. Uh, what can people expect next however long of yours, months, what's, what's coming up?
- BJBryan Johnson
Well, I, this is my prediction. Um, AI is centre stage already for society. It will continue to be centre stage. Uh, I'm not talking about timeframes of six months or twelve months, but, like, over the next few years, it's gonna just continually to be evolved to be the primary thing of our attention, and as that happens, we are going to want the stability to understand the world in ways that makes us feel safe, that we have meaning and purpose, that things are stable, and I think this is where Don't Die will step in. It, it will be a structurally sound, coherent, emotionally resonant ideology and, and moral philosophy that actually answers the most important questions for us as a species, individually, collectively, with AI, with the planet.
- CWChris Williamson
Mm.
- BJBryan Johnson
Like, we're just due for a revolution. So yeah, in the coming years, that's what I hope to bring to the world, is like, that we actually can c- find coherence-
- CWChris Williamson
Mm
- BJBryan Johnson
... in our existence and realize the spectacular nature of this moment, the most precious thing that's ever existed, and it's, like, really ours. So we-... so I guess an invitation to like sober up, realize how special this is, and for us, like, we, we need to prove ourselves worthy of the future. We oftentimes don't think about it. Like, we, we want to be- we want to demonstrate our value to our peers, to our, to our coworkers, to our family, to our partners. I think that same relationship exists to the future, that it really does ask us to rise up. And so I hope, um, above all, I hope I'm a, a positive influence in people's lives, that, um, when they find themselves in moments of, of struggle or weakness, they've got somebody in their court saying like-
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah
- BJBryan Johnson
... "You can do this." And, um, yeah, so I, I'm just, uh, really excited about what's happening. I feel like I've been working my entire life for this moment, and I'm excited to play the game.
- CWChris Williamson
I'm excited to see what happens, man. Just don't do the fucking-- Don't start wearing white robes, grow your hair out. Like, I don't want to see the cult leader pivot, but, uh, what I do think is cool is the, um, like, sanguine self-awareness thing. I think that's really important to like, [exhales] -
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah
- CWChris Williamson
- just breathe it out. Uh, you mentioned a couple of resources, like a, a, a, a food guide or something. Is there any-- Are there any cool lead magnet-y bits that people can snag that-
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
-?
- BJBryan Johnson
So I'll give you, I'll give you the food guide.
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- BJBryan Johnson
Um, I'm also, I'm publishing... I have a website protocol.bryanjohnson.co, um, .com, and I'm hopefully in the next couple weeks, I'll repost all my updated stuff. So if you want to just see my journey and what I'm doing now and why, I'll have it there for you. So like a free guide.
- CWChris Williamson
Yep.
- BJBryan Johnson
And I'm also writing a book, so, uh-
- CWChris Williamson
Holy fuck. Unreal.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah, don't die. So I'm halfway through, and it's basically going to be like, hopefully, a guide. And then, um, yeah, I'm trying to make this easy. I know it's a lot. And then also, I'm-- I just, we just raised sixty million for Blueprint, and so-
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, yeah, what's going on with that? What is that?
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah. So basically, uh, Blueprint is don't die in action.
- CWChris Williamson
Right.
- BJBryan Johnson
And so in the same way where you say, "If I want to go to this destination, I put in an address, go," and it tells me what streets to go down or where's the construction, where's the, the crashes, Blueprint is going to be basically like AI, uh, for your health. It's like you say: "I want to be healthy," and we say, "Come on in. We got you." And so it will take us some time to build that, but that's what I have today with my team of doctors. Like, I just follow a practice where we measure me, we, we get the data, we look at evidence, and we say, "Do this, do this, do this, do this."
- CWChris Williamson
Doing this at scale.
- BJBryan Johnson
Exactly. So I don't have to chase all these esoteric, hard things. So Blueprint is basically like autonomous health for humans-
- CWChris Williamson
Wow
- BJBryan Johnson
... where I just say, like, "I want to be healthy," and you get into a system, and now we just run the data, evidence, repeat it again. So hopefully, like, that's like the-
- CWChris Williamson
Exciting times.
- BJBryan Johnson
Yeah.
Episode duration: 1:53:46
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