The Secrets of British Football Culture - Peter Crouch (4K)

1. 0:00 – 8:39

   Why Do Ex-Footballers Turn to Podcasting?

   1. CWChris Williamson0:00

      Do ex-players turn to podcasts because TV punditry feels fake?

   2. PCPeter Crouch0:05

      (laughs) Um, God. I, I felt like I was maybe one of the first, like, to, to do a podcast. I only did a podcast 'cause I had a book to promote, bizarrely, and, uh, someone said, "Oh, do a podcast." And then I, I genuinely thought no one would listen to it, and then, um, you know, we, we had a laugh doing it, and I probably said a hell of a lot more than I probably should, and then I, and then I realized people were actually listening. You know? It was one of those where I, w- we weren't planning on having a huge following, and then it kind of arrived, and then, I don't know. It was, it was a bit more of, um, the fact that I was being open and honest in a, in a world of football where you're told to be guarded and, and secretive. You know? It's very much like, "Don't say the wrong thing," and, um, and I think the fact that we were open and honest gave it a platform, and people wanted to listen to it, and, um, the, the f- the punditry stuff, yeah, I think it's a little bit more still in that world of, um, stay guarded, don't say the wrong thing, um, whereas podcasts, as, as I'm sure you, uh, you know yourself, you can definitely be yourself a little bit more and show your personality, and I think that's, um, I think that's obviously the, the benefit of them.

   3. CWChris Williamson1:18

      What is it about the f- world of football that encourages the players to be so guarded? 'Cause you're right. I ...

   4. PCPeter Crouch1:26

      Mm-hmm.

   5. CWChris Williamson1:26

      I have an, I have an understanding of the, like, uh, psychology of the motivation of players from other sports, of rock stars.

   6. PCPeter Crouch1:36

      Mm-hmm.

   7. CWChris Williamson1:37

      Uh, and football players seem to be very sort of dead outside of the, uh, permitted interview at the end of the match, which is 30 seconds long. There's not much going on. What ...

   8. PCPeter Crouch1:50

      Mm-hmm.

   9. CWChris Williamson1:50

      Is that prescribed, top down?

   10. PCPeter Crouch1:52

       Mm-hmm.

   11. CWChris Williamson1:52

       Is that something that's cultural, bottom up? What, what's going on?

   12. PCPeter Crouch1:55

       I do think, I do think it's changing in, in a lot of ways, because I think certainly when I was playing, it was very much, "Go into an interview, do a press conference, but don't say anything." (laughs) And I think that, bizarrely, was our mentality, was, "I wanna come out of this interview having got through it and not said anything too controversial-"

   13. CWChris Williamson2:14

       Inflammatory.

   14. PCPeter Crouch2:14

       "... anything to wind anyone up." Uh, if we've got a derby game on a weekend, I don't want to get their supporters riled up by saying something negative about the other team. I want to go in there and say the, the plainest answers I can possibly say.

   15. CWChris Williamson2:26

       Well, there is a reputation among footballers for giving slightly bland answers.

   16. PCPeter Crouch2:31

       Yeah.

   17. CWChris Williamson2:31

       Yeah.

   18. PCPeter Crouch2:31

       Exactly right, and I think there are, there's an element of that. Oh, I totally understand, because, um, quite often, I think in a, in a world now where, uh, players have social media, players can have their own voice, um, players can get things across, there's, there's certainly a definite shift in that. I think certainly when I was playing, and before me, the kind of newspapers ran the, the media, really.

   19. CWChris Williamson2:53

       Mm-hmm.

   20. PCPeter Crouch2:54

       And I think something that you say in a newspaper, in a headline, as I'm pretty sure you would know, being on a podcast yourself, is someone takes something you say out of context and puts that in a headline, you know, that can look very different to what you're trying to get across, and I think if you're... Certainly, in, in Britain at that time, most people formed opinions through newspapers. And I think if I'm saying, you know, saying something tongue in cheek about a player on the o- opposition side, um, we all know it's a joke. Everyone in the room knows it's a joke. But if you put that in a headline and, and make it look like it's not a joke, people can get offended and, and people's opinion of you will be warped, and I think certainly, that was the whole, probably, reason behind the fact that we don't want to say anything and we're boring, and if... Most players used to give very boring interviews. I h- I happen to think it is changing a lot now. I think, um, certainly with, through the world of social media, we can see a lot more of players' personalities-

   21. CWChris Williamson3:53

       Mm-hmm.

   22. PCPeter Crouch3:54

       ... podcasts like this. People do want to come on, and you can kind of... You, you're not just a footballer, um, you know, who does a boring interview at the end of the game. You can be a little bit more than that now.

   23. CWChris Williamson4:03

       Mm-hmm. Well, I think about UFC fighters who, maybe more of what they do is outside of the sport.

   24. PCPeter Crouch4:14

       Mm-hmm.

   25. CWChris Williamson4:14

       Right? Al- almost all of what they do, boxers too-

   26. PCPeter Crouch4:16

       Mm-hmm.

   27. CWChris Williamson4:16

       ... it is all about the press conference. It's all about the podcast. You know? Look at someone like Ariel Helwani, (inhales) who will have each different fighter from a card that's coming up on UFC or, you know, BKFC or whatever, and, um, that is what they do, and, uh, I, I still... I don't know. E- are we seeing footballers change because they can now counter the narrative in the mainstream press?

   28. PCPeter Crouch4:40

       Mm-hmm.

   29. CWChris Williamson4:40

       They can always just put up an Instagram story or they can address these things directly.

   30. PCPeter Crouch4:43

       Mm-hmm.
2. 8:39 – 18:37

   What Archetype Shapes Most Footballers?

   1. CWChris Williamson8:39

      too.

   2. PCPeter Crouch8:39

      (laughs)

   3. CWChris Williamson8:39

      Um, so I think ... I said before, I think there's archetypes of psychology in, in some sports, you know, sort of golfers being very precise, maybe a little bit autistic, baseball players being sort of superstitious and maybe a little bit obsessive. What is the psychological archetype, the common psychological archetype, of top-flight footballers in your experience?

   4. PCPeter Crouch9:01

      Yeah, I think, um ... Look, I got to a, to a top level, right? I got to, you know, Premier League. I played for my country. I played in the Champions League, and, you know, I've, I've won a small amount, but I ... You know, I'm very proud of the career I had. But I still class myself as, yeah, I got to a top level, but I would not class myself as, as, as elite, um, because I, I saw the elite, and that was, that was a different mentality to what I had. I, I, I enjoyed myself. I, I won games, and I enjoyed it, you know, whereas, you know, we'd win something, or I'd get to a final, and I'd get, I'd sit back afterwards and go, "That was fucking amazing. Loved it," whereas the players ... I'm just talking certainly the players I played with for England, Gerrard, Lampard, Rooney, um, John Terry, that kind of player, um, who was multiple, and multiple winners, you know, Rio Ferdinand. They just did not look like they enjoyed it ever, and, um, like, their ... It was always the next thing. It was like, you know, "Well, yeah, we've won that game, but we could've done that," or, you know, the, "We've won that, but tomorrow we're training again." And the ... And, and not, not just that. It rubs off on everyone else around you, um, and if you look at the, you know, the, certainly the team in 2005 that, that won the Champions League with Liverpool, um, in Istanbul, um, not the greatest team to ever win a Champions League. Let's be, let's be perfectly honest, but, you know, that, that mentality that Gerrard had, I thought, and, and Jamie Carragher certainly at that time, kind of dragged that team to success. And I think that rubs off on other people, and, uh, that wo- that is the mentality that I would say is, is the best of the best, is, is, I think they would ... There's probably regrets in there, and there's a little bit of pain.

   5. CWChris Williamson10:42

      Yeah.

   6. PCPeter Crouch10:42

      Because they probably look back, some of those players now, and think, "I wish I'd just enjoyed that."

   7. CWChris Williamson10:47

      Mm-hmm.

   8. PCPeter Crouch10:47

      You know?

   9. CWChris Williamson10:48

      But they'll look at you with a sense of envy-

   10. PCPeter Crouch10:51

       (laughs)

   11. CWChris Williamson10:51

       ... and think, "God, Peter just had so much fun."

   12. PCPeter Crouch10:53

       Yeah.

   13. CWChris Williamson10:54

       You know, he looks back with fond playfulness, and I have this sort of weird reverse stoicism, where I didn't let myself feel the wins, but I did let myself feel the failures.

   14. PCPeter Crouch11:05

       Yeah, and I, and I don't know what's right or wrong there. Do you know what I mean? Like, yeah, if I had, if I had that kinda mentality ... And don't ... I'm not ... I wasn't unprofessional. Do you know what I mean? I, I was ... Obviously, the minute I walked through to training ground, I'm switched on. But I did sit back and go, like, or w- you know, I'd watch match of the day and go, "I was great there," you know? (laughs) "I f- I did really well there"-

   15. CWChris Williamson11:25

       Mm-hmm.

   16. PCPeter Crouch11:25

       ... whereas they, they would always be look at the negatives and try and improve, and of course, I tried to improve as well, but I did enjoy the fact that we were having success.

   17. CWChris Williamson11:34

       In your experience, did those people just have that for football, or did that bleed into the rest of their life? And then to compare that to you too-

   18. PCPeter Crouch11:42

       Mm-hmm.

   19. CWChris Williamson11:43

       ... is that something that you find relatively easy with the other stuff, with playing with the kids-

   20. PCPeter Crouch11:48

       Mm-hmm.

   21. CWChris Williamson11:48

       ... with doing the podcast, with starting a business, with y- y- enjoying your time on holiday and work and all the rest of it? My, my point being, I wonder how much of that is you are an elite performer within this pursuit, and this is the mindset that's made you so.

   22. PCPeter Crouch12:00

       Mm-hmm.

   23. CWChris Williamson12:00

       So ... And you are a obsessive, typically negatively focused person-

   24. PCPeter Crouch12:07

       Mm-hmm.

   25. CWChris Williamson12:07

       ... which means that you pay a lot of attention to where things are going wrong and you improve, but that's just you-

   26. PCPeter Crouch12:12

       Mm-hmm.

   27. CWChris Williamson12:12

       ... and that is global. That's across your entire life. Is that how you-

   28. PCPeter Crouch12:15

       Mm-hmm.

   29. CWChris Williamson12:15

       Like, these people are like that in and-

   30. PCPeter Crouch12:17

       Mm-hmm.
3. 18:37 – 24:25

   The ‘Man-Up’ Mentality of Changing Rooms

   1. PCPeter Crouch18:37

   2. CWChris Williamson18:37

      Mm-hmm. What did being inside of Premier League dressing rooms treat- teach you about masculinity?

   3. PCPeter Crouch18:43

      Um, pshh, well yeah, that... I mean, a- a hell of a lot. Like, uh, you had to grow, had to grow up very quickly. Um, I mean, I remember being 14. I mean, it's totally different time now, but I mean some of the, some of the, the dressing rooms I was in, in- in that age and you're playing with kind of men, you know. And I, I kind of didn't... I didn't develop till a little bit later, you know. I'm 14, 15, very skinny, very tall, um, and I'm, I'm in dressing room with, with men who are, you know, just hard men, you know. And like the coaches were, were incredibly tough, you know. Like, the-

   4. CWChris Williamson19:20

      What youth set-up were you in?

   5. PCPeter Crouch19:21

      I was at, um, I was at QPR for a little while, and then I went to Tottenham, um, when Gerry Francis moved there. And I went... I ended up back at QPR and I made my debut. But yeah, I was at Tottenham and it was hard. And, and also, you know, I, I grew up in a, in quite a nice environment, you know. And, um, you know, m- my dad obviously said to me quite often I was too nice. I had to, I had to change. I had to be someone different on the pitch-

   6. CWChris Williamson19:42

      Yeah.

   7. PCPeter Crouch19:42

      ... um, because I'm playing in an environment where, you know, people are fighting for their lives, you know. And their... You know, that tackle that means something to me is life or death to them. Do you know what I mean? I had... So I had to make that life or death for me.

   8. CWChris Williamson19:56

      Mm-hmm.

   9. PCPeter Crouch19:56

      Um, so I had to just change my mentality and be a different person when I went over the white line-

   10. CWChris Williamson20:00

       Mm-hmm.

   11. PCPeter Crouch20:00

       ... and change the, the kind of character I am off the field.

   12. CWChris Williamson20:04

       Mm-hmm.

   13. PCPeter Crouch20:04

       Kinda always tried to remain the person that I was, but just be a different person on the pitch. Um, and, and I think that environment definitely helped me, um, certainly become the, yeah, become the person and the, um, and the player that I was, definitely.

   14. CWChris Williamson20:20

       I played a lot of cricket as a kid. I played for- to a pretty high standard. I played for Durham and then I did some training stuff with England. And, uh, that's the same. I mean, even maybe younger, because the thing that you get to do with cricket, as a sport which isn't as much about physicality and is much more about technique, you can, as a 13... I- I started playing adults at 13.

   15. PCPeter Crouch20:39

       Mm-hmm.

   16. CWChris Williamson20:39

       And, you know, I'd be playing maybe fourths at 13, and then I probably start... I think I had my first seconds game when I was 14. And then, you know, you're playing twos and ones, and then you're gonna play... You're already playing county at youth set-up, and then you're playing, you know, Durham Academy, Durham Seconds.

   17. PCPeter Crouch20:55

       Mm-hmm.

   18. CWChris Williamson20:56

       And, uh, yeah, you're right. You're 14 years old in communal showers-

   19. PCPeter Crouch21:01

       Mm-hmm.

   20. CWChris Williamson21:02

       ... with, with guys. And another interesting quirk in the game of cricket is that you're in the pavilion for 50% of the game.

   21. PCPeter Crouch21:12

       Mm-hmm.

   22. CWChris Williamson21:12

       Unless you're batting. Uh, your time in the dressing room is maybe more than any other sport except for baseball. But the difference with baseball being that their dressing room is on the pitch, so it doesn't have as much privacy.

   23. PCPeter Crouch21:24

       Mm-hmm.

   24. CWChris Williamson21:24

       So yeah, it's a real fucking baptism of fire. You know, there was one day where my head got shaved. Like, I was in-

   25. PCPeter Crouch21:30

       Mm-hmm.

   26. CWChris Williamson21:30

       You know, I'm in the pavilion, and I, I... My dad saw me go into the dressing room with hair, and then by the time that we'd finished batting, we hadn't lost too many wickets, so no one had come out. I came out without hair. (laughs)

   27. PCPeter Crouch21:41

       Mm-hmm.

   28. CWChris Williamson21:42

       And so... (laughs)

   29. PCPeter Crouch21:43

       I did the... I had the exact same thing. I went on to a, a, a, the mil-... We played the Milk Cup in Ireland, but we were still at school. I was, uh, I was playing the under-16s and, and that, that team, those lads, they were, they had already gone full-time. Um, so like I was still at school and we were kind of part-time, so they had a, a real tight bond.

   30. CWChris Williamson22:00

       Squad.
4. 24:25 – 35:40

   Why Don’t Players Want to Come Out?

   1. CWChris Williamson24:25

      What about m- masculinity and that sort of male posturing thing when you get to-... everybody being a professional player.

   2. PCPeter Crouch24:34

      Mm-hmm.

   3. CWChris Williamson24:35

      Um, I have no idea what this looks like inside of the dressing room or on the training ground. Lots of big squad, big-ish squads.

   4. PCPeter Crouch24:43

      Mm-hmm.

   5. CWChris Williamson24:43

      You know, got a bunch of physios, some S&Cs, et cetera, et cetera. Looks like a big group of people that are all moving around.

   6. PCPeter Crouch24:49

      Mm-hmm.

   7. CWChris Williamson24:49

      Um, it's, our basketball team, which has got a much smaller team-

   8. PCPeter Crouch24:53

      Mm-hmm.

   9. CWChris Williamson24:53

      ... and squad size. What's that like? What does masculinity in professional-

   10. PCPeter Crouch24:56

       Mm-hmm.

   11. CWChris Williamson24:56

       ... football look like?

   12. PCPeter Crouch24:57

       Um, well, it's, it's incredible. It's, it's how you imagine it, I think. It's very kind of macho, dog eat dog world, you know? I think people want to take your place. Um, you know, any weakness is preyed upon. Um, the, the, the, if you look at the masculinity side of it, I suppose it's very much, um, you know, we... You, you have to man up basically, and I think, uh, certainly things, uh, nowadays it's a lot, it's a lot better. But, you know, if I went in to see the manager and said, "You know, I'm struggling a little bit mentally," it'd be like, "Well, you, you drop then," you know? That y- you obviously can't, you can't deal with it, you can't... You know, that kind of struggle, I think it's very, was very old school. I think it's very different now. Um, but I wouldn't, I- I wouldn't show any weakness whatsoever. Even if I was feeling down about anything-

   13. CWChris Williamson25:45

       Mm-hmm.

   14. PCPeter Crouch25:45

       ... you, you just don't show it, and I think that was, you know, s- kind of environment that I grew up in and the environment that, uh, I played in. Um, but I do think, I do think it's much better now and, you know, certainly men in general talk about things more now, don't they?

   15. CWChris Williamson25:58

       But is that the same inside of the dressing room? Have you got any indication that it's changed when it gets to football?

   16. PCPeter Crouch26:03

       Yeah, I think so. I think it, I think it's a lot more accommodating than you would expect now. I think, you know, it's very multicultural. Like, you know, everyone's very d- from very different walks of life, um, all over the world, um, different beliefs, religions, um, you know. Certainly when I was in the youth team and coming through, it was very, it was very English, um, kind of British culture that-

   17. CWChris Williamson26:27

       Yeah.

   18. PCPeter Crouch26:27

       ... was policing the dressing rooms.

   19. CWChris Williamson26:27

       I mean, it's superbly diverse now.

   20. PCPeter Crouch26:29

       Yeah, that's what I mean. I think, you know, there's, uh, uh, the, the... I think all corners of the globe is covered in the dressing room now, and I think, um, certainly when I was coming through that, that kind of British, it was this macho, almost drinking culture, if you like, um, I think that's gone now.

   21. CWChris Williamson26:46

       Talking about diversity, there are no publicly gay Premier League players.

   22. PCPeter Crouch26:51

       Mm-hmm.

   23. CWChris Williamson26:51

       Each Premier League club can register a squad of up to 25 players plus unlimited under-21s. 20 clubs, that's 500 registered first team players any given time. If you include all of the under-21s who make senior appearances, the number rises to about 600 to 650 active players across a season. Currently, zero active Premier League male players are publicly out as gay. Statistically speaking, there should be 20 to 35, same in LaLiga, same in the German league, ch- same in the French league, and there is one gay guy in Serie A in Italy.

   24. PCPeter Crouch27:24

       Mm-hmm.

   25. CWChris Williamson27:24

       Why?

   26. PCPeter Crouch27:26

       Oh, God, I could not tell you. I think, I genuinely think now if someone came out as gay in, in the dressing room, I'd, uh, I think they'd be very well supported. I think in those, in a Premier League dressing room, yeah, of course you're gonna have idiots in the crowd. I think people that are, you know, maybe stuck in the Dark Ages, we've seen it with racism, um, you know, it's still, it's still not completely kicked out, is it?

   27. CWChris Williamson27:52

       Mm-hmm.

   28. PCPeter Crouch27:53

       I think, you know, we've seen, uh, an incident recently, um, at a Liverpool match, um, with Bournemouth, that would, you know... That, that, that proves that. Uh, I think it's got far better. I think there's, you know, there's still a way to go. Um, but with, with regards to, to someone coming out, I genuinely believe that, um, you know, if there is someone out there, you would urge them to come forward and-

   29. CWChris Williamson28:13

       Mm-hmm.

   30. PCPeter Crouch28:14

       ... if they want to. And, and of course it's their decision because if they don't want to, that's, that's-
5. 35:40 – 43:21

   Does Success Breed Toxicity in Elite Sport?

   1. PCPeter Crouch35:40

   2. CWChris Williamson35:40

      Mm. Yeah, going back to the sort of football culture thing, it certainly seemed like if you're a very successful player, Ronaldo-esque, uh, you can get away with a little bit more. Does that encourage or tend teams who are winning to continue to sort of s- um, turn the screw of maybe toxic, uh, culture in terms of, uh, work rate, how hard and unforgiving people are, that sort of backbiting-

   3. PCPeter Crouch36:13

      Mm-hmm.

   4. CWChris Williamson36:14

      ... uh, ruthlessness, which doesn't necessarily bind a team together. It's 11 individuals or, what, 25-

   5. PCPeter Crouch36:21

      Mm-hmm.

   6. CWChris Williamson36:21

      ... squad group of individuals as opposed to a 25 squad group that are all working together. But if, um, everything is going well and you're moving up through the rankings, uh, everyone's sort of, "We, we don't wanna change what appears to be working at the moment."

   7. PCPeter Crouch36:35

      Mm-hmm.

   8. CWChris Williamson36:35

      I have to assume that, uh, success permits, uh, things to become a little bit more extreme-

   9. PCPeter Crouch36:41

      Mm-hmm.

   10. CWChris Williamson36:41

       ... in that way.

   11. PCPeter Crouch36:42

       Yeah. I, I think, I've, I've actually been in both scenarios, you know, the, the side that when you're, when you're losing games that can be obviously very toxic as well. Um, but, but also winning games as well and, like, the players that aren't playing, um, that, that kind of atmosphere, like, I don't envy managers trying to deal with so many big personalities and, um, I think nowadays it's very much more, like, the players will let their agents deal with, with not playing and things like that but-

   12. CWChris Williamson37:10

       Mm-hmm.

   13. PCPeter Crouch37:10

       ... um, back, I think when I was playing it was definitely much you'd knock on the door o- of the manager and you'd have to-

   14. CWChris Williamson37:16

       Direct relationship.

   15. PCPeter Crouch37:17

       ... you'd, you'd have a direct relationship. It's like, "Why am I not playing?" And, you know, you'd have to actually-

   16. CWChris Williamson37:21

       So that's the agent now that speaks to the manager now?

   17. PCPeter Crouch37:23

       Yeah, I mean, I-

   18. CWChris Williamson37:24

       Really?

   19. PCPeter Crouch37:24

       ... I, I, I've seen things now that I p- p- but I'm, I'm basically, I'm glad that I kinda got out when I did. I, uh, when, when I was 37, 38 I was still playing and I just saw, you know, agents up in the, in the, in the canteen every day, you know, going in to see why a player wasn't playing or, um, and I'd just be like, "Why can't you just go and do it yourself? Why don't you just go and knock on the door and say-"

   20. CWChris Williamson37:46

       I didn't know that was happening.

   21. PCPeter Crouch37:47

       Yeah, a hell of a lot more now. Um, and I think players hide behind their agents a little bit now, um, which is a shame. Um, and yeah, they've got a, they've got a role to play agents, but, uh, I do think those conversations need to be visi- you know, f- certainly y- you can have them yourself with the, with the manager. But with regards to the, yeah, that toxic atmosphere, yeah, definitely when, when you're losing games that can be really bad, everyone pointing fingers and no one wants to look in a mirror.

   22. CWChris Williamson38:12

       Mm-hmm.

   23. PCPeter Crouch38:12

       And, um, there were certain, you know, players, individuals where you'd just be like... Uh, the other thing is when you're losing and, and, and people aren't playing and you, with social media now you can put out... I mean, I've watched cer- one certain player do nothing in training. You know, he'd, he'd be the fir- he'd be the last in, he'd be the first out, uh, every single day. He wouldn't even tie his laces when he was training and then he'd go home and he'd, he'd have someone filming him on Instagram and he's running up some stairs, he's, you know, he's d- he's running round his drive and he's doing shuttles and all the fans are like, "Why is he not playing?" You know, he-

   24. CWChris Williamson38:46

       He was working even harder at home.

   25. PCPeter Crouch38:46

       Look how hard, look how hard he's working.

   26. CWChris Williamson38:48

       He's not doing anything at work.

   27. PCPeter Crouch38:49

       And he's not doing anything in training and I'm like-

   28. CWChris Williamson38:51

       Wow.

   29. PCPeter Crouch38:51

       But, you know, that just shows you that, how the wool can be pulled over fans' eyes and, you know, that, that you're not really getting the, the full story.

   30. CWChris Williamson39:00

       This is another disadvantage of that direct form of communication, right?
6. 43:21 – 1:00:55

   The Importance of Enjoying the Journey

   1. PCPeter Crouch43:21

   2. CWChris Williamson43:21

      What gets considerably better about life when you stop playing?

   3. PCPeter Crouch43:26

      Um, (sighs) it's hard. I mean, it's, it's a tough one to stop because it's all you've ever known, right? And, um-

   4. CWChris Williamson43:35

      Since you're a child.

   5. PCPeter Crouch43:36

      Yeah. I think when I first retired, I was very much like, "Oh, I'm my own boss now. I can do whatever I like." I can, y- you know, go on a holiday at Christmas, things like that. I can, you know, do something on a Saturday. Um, you know, there, there's certain little things like that, like e- the first Christmas dinner was amazing. Like, genuinely as a footballer, um, in a hotel New Year's Eve, didn't see a new year in ever. I'd been asleep by 10 o'clock. Um, Christmas Day very much like-

   6. CWChris Williamson44:05

      Ready for Boxing Day.

   7. PCPeter Crouch44:06

      Yeah. I'd train Christmas Day. Um, I mean, you know, I'd, I'd have a sandwich-

   8. CWChris Williamson44:11

      Yeah. (laughs)

   9. PCPeter Crouch44:11

      ... f- like turkey sandwich maybe, that was about it. Um, I'd eat pasta, chick- dry chicken. I wouldn't, I wouldn't have a Christmas dinner, certainly no alcohol 'cause we play 26th, 28th, 1st, um, you know, 7th. There'd be consistent games over Christmas. So yeah, that, that first, when I retired, it was like, "Right, I'm gonna go for it Christmas Day." And I did, you know? (laughs)

   10. CWChris Williamson44:35

       (laughs)

   11. PCPeter Crouch44:36

       Um, you know?

   12. CWChris Williamson44:37

       My stomach didn't know what hit it.

   13. PCPeter Crouch44:37

       Oh my God, I ate what, you know, what I could. I drank a hell of a lot and I had a great time. But then that wears thin, right? I'd... You're like, after the first Christmas, yeah, that was a, that was, that was great. I'd rather be playing. I genuinely would rather-

   14. CWChris Williamson44:50

       Mm.

   15. PCPeter Crouch44:50

       ... be doing what I love doing. I mean, going, actually thinking about it now, the Christmas Day training ga- it was the, some of the best times I've ever had in my life. It was-

   16. CWChris Williamson44:56

       Why?

   17. PCPeter Crouch44:57

       ... just no one on the road. Everyone's with, you know, with their families. And I love my family to bits, but it's nice getting away from them sometimes. (laughs)

   18. CWChris Williamson45:05

       (laughs)

   19. PCPeter Crouch45:05

       Just getting that fresh air, playing a sport. When everyone else is sitting around hungover, you are... You're ready to go.

   20. CWChris Williamson45:11

       You're getting after it.

   21. PCPeter Crouch45:12

       Yeah, it's, it... There is something smug about being so fit in a, in a time when-

   22. CWChris Williamson45:16

       The self-righteousness was as nourishing as the Christmas meal.

   23. PCPeter Crouch45:19

       Almo- almost so, yeah.

   24. CWChris Williamson45:20

       Yeah.

   25. PCPeter Crouch45:20

       And I think being my own boss was lovely, but I'll be honest with you. I, I work better in a, in a kind of regimented environment.

   26. CWChris Williamson45:28

       Me too.

   27. PCPeter Crouch45:28

       Yeah.

   28. CWChris Williamson45:28

       Me too. It's, uh, it's so trite, right? But the reason that clichés exist is because they seem to be sticky enough to be fucking accurate.

   29. PCPeter Crouch45:36

       Mm-hmm.

   30. CWChris Williamson45:37

       Um, the grass always been greener. You know, you, when you were on the training ground, not fully appreciating how nice it were, fresh cold air, like that snappy British-
7. 1:00:55 – 1:09:48

   How Peter Used Nerves and Anxiety as Fuel

   1. CWChris Williamson1:00:55

      Well, there's, uh-... certainly a case where if you already live a comfortable life and are choosing to reduce your quality of life in order to make more money, then it's a bad trade.

   2. PCPeter Crouch1:01:10

      Yeah. Totally disagree with that. I think you, you, the, the happiness is the most important thing. I think having a household that you, you, you enjoy coming back to is so important. Um, you know, when you walk through the door, are you going, "Oh, fuck, I've got to go in there"? (laughs) You know, because there are people that do that, you know. And, and, and thankfully, I don't. I go home, and I think, I look around and I'm happy, and I, and I want, you know, I just ho- you just hope everyone else feels that way. But, you know, it's, it's hard, and they, you know, they probably, probably don't. It's, it's a difficult, a difficult situation to navigate.

   3. CWChris Williamson1:01:40

      Before we continue, if your sleep's not right, you're taking ages to nod off, waking up at random times and feeling groggy in the morning, Momentous's sleep hacks are here to help. They're not your typical knock-you-out supplement overloaded with melatonin? Just the most evidence-based ingredients at perfect doses to help you fall asleep more quickly, stay asleep throughout the night, and wake up feeling more rested and revitalized in the morning. I'm banking on you not being able to hit me. That's why I take these every single night, especially when I'm on the road, and why I trust Momentous with my life. All right. Okay, there we go. Or at least my sleep, because they make the highest quality supplements on the planet. What you see in the, on the label is what's in the product and absolutely nothing else. And if you're still unsure, they've got a 30-day money back guarantee. So, you can buy it and try it every night for 29 nights. 30 nights, in fact. And if you don't like it for any reason, they will give you your money back. That's how confident they are that you'll love it. Plus, they ship internationally. Right now, you can get 35%. He's run out of ammo. R- Right now, you can get 35% off your first subscription and that 30-day money back guarantee by heading to livemomentous.com/modernwisdom (laughs) with code "modernwisdom" at checkout. That's L-I-V-E (laughs) M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S dot com/modernwisdom at checkout. (laughs) Talking about emotions and sort of casting that stuff off. How did you deal with anxiety, adrenaline, performance, stress-

   4. PCPeter Crouch1:03:15

      Mm-hmm.

   5. CWChris Williamson1:03:15

      ... when you were playing?

   6. PCPeter Crouch1:03:16

      Yeah, uh, uh, it's such a... I've, I've overcome it in lots of different ways. But, um, the nervousness used to get to me bad.

   7. CWChris Williamson1:03:24

      Mm-hmm.

   8. PCPeter Crouch1:03:24

      Like I, I-

   9. CWChris Williamson1:03:25

      When were you most nervous?

   10. PCPeter Crouch1:03:26

       Um, I think I, I, uh, it mellowed towards the, the end of my career. Like, certainly when I got to a level where I was comfortable, I was playing for Liverpool, I was playing for England, uh, uh, people knew who I was. So, I didn't have to keep proving myself. I think when I was young, I had to prove myself in every single match. It was very much like, "He can't play."

   11. CWChris Williamson1:03:47

       Mm-hmm.

   12. PCPeter Crouch1:03:48

       And I was like, "I'll show you." That was my whole life until I was about 24. And then when I was playing for England, when I was playing for Liverpool, everyone kind of, "Oh, he can play." I had to kind of stop. Obviously, I still had to keep proving myself, but, uh, made, it became a little bit easier. Um, but the nervousness, yeah, I mean, in the early days, certainly my first... I mean, I remember, I've, I've told this story before, but I was on the... Like, I got in my first England squad, and I'm, I got... No, I, I was, um, I was starting the game, and I remember we were going... When Wemb- the new Wembley was getting built, and we were playing at Old Trafford. And I'm in the... I'm on the bus, and I've got... You know, I'm sitting next to Steven Gerrard, um, Wayne Rooney's here, uh, Rio Ferdinand, David Beckham, Gary Neville, um, Michael Owen. All, you know, household names, right? And I'm sitting on this bus. I'm just thinking to myself. I'm looking around. I'm going, "Right, I'm starting now for England. I've got the number nine." And I'm looking around at all these players. I'm thinking, you know, "So, basically, how did I get here, number one?"

   13. CWChris Williamson1:04:45

       A bit of impostor syndrome.

   14. PCPeter Crouch1:04:45

       Yeah, a little bit. I was thinking, "Well, like, these players are..." You know, I watched these on the TV, you know? Yeah. S- world-class players, and now I'm, I'm one of them, right? And then I remember sitting down, and I remember looking down at this, um, pub. We were stuck in traffic on the way to Old Trafford, and there was a fella there with a... He had a pint and a paper. And I just thought, "Cor (laughs) , I'd love to be him right now." (laughs)

   15. CWChris Williamson1:05:09

       Any escape to get off the bus.

   16. PCPeter Crouch1:05:10

       Well, I just thought... The nerves that were going through my body, and, and, and then... And I'm thinking, "The whole nation's watching this." It's all... All this stuff is going through my brain. Like, you know, all my friends and family.

   17. CWChris Williamson1:05:19

       Mm-hmm.

   18. PCPeter Crouch1:05:20

       Don't, don't mess this up. I'm thinking... I'm looking at this fella now. He's got a pint of Guinness, and he's not got a care in the world.

   19. CWChris Williamson1:05:26

       No pressure.

   20. PCPeter Crouch1:05:27

       No pressure. But obviously at that time, I, I would, I would think, "Well, I wonder if I could swap with him." But then after the game, when you do... when you overcome those nerves, and you, you've done well or you've scored, and you thought back to your thought process before the game, and then the thought process after. And the, the buzz, the natural high that I've got, you just wouldn't change it for anything. It's the best feeling that you could ever have and I've ever had in my life.

   21. CWChris Williamson1:05:55

       Mm-hmm.

   22. PCPeter Crouch1:05:55

       And then, you know, uh, and then the next game, I'm back to square one.

   23. CWChris Williamson1:06:00

       (laughs)

   24. PCPeter Crouch1:06:00

       (laughs) I'm, I'm at that nervous energy again.

   25. CWChris Williamson1:06:04

       Yeah.

   26. PCPeter Crouch1:06:05

       But there's something special about it. And, uh, you know, I've, I've, I've managed to do it in my, in my life since. I think we did a show for, uh, the BBC, and it was, um, f- f- for the Euros. It was, uh, it... And it was live just after every England game. And, um, you know, I was the host of it, and, uh, it was... You know, someone was in your ear and... And basically, I'm going live on BBC, and I'm thinking, "There's millions who are gonna be watching this." And that adrenaline kind of... Even though I'm not playing football anymore-

   27. CWChris Williamson1:06:32

       Mm-hmm.

   28. PCPeter Crouch1:06:32

       ... I kind of still got it. It was like, "Right, 10, nine," and you're getting the countdown, right?

   29. CWChris Williamson1:06:35

       Yeah.

   30. PCPeter Crouch1:06:35

       And you... And then I'm thinking, "Don't swear. Don't fall over. Don't..." (laughs)

Episode duration: 1:35:24