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What Do BDSM & Meditation Have In Common? | Professor Paul Bloom | Modern Wisdom Podcast 120

Paul Bloom is an author and a Professor of Psychology at Yale. Why is suffering a cause of pleasure for some people? What do BDSM, being robbed, extreme sports and meditation have in common? How does pleasure work? Why is empathy bad and what is the case for rational compassion? Why do we love people who have died? One of my favourite conversations this year, do not miss this. Extra Stuff: Follow Professor Bloom on Twitter - https://twitter.com/paulbloomatyale Buy Against Empathy - https://amzn.to/32G5SD3 Buy How Pleasure Works - https://amzn.to/2CHRteQ Starting Therapy Video - https://youtu.be/jK-mw8rXziY Check out everything I recommend from books to products and help support the podcast at no extra cost to you by shopping through this link - https://www.amazon.co.uk/shop/modernwisdom #psychology #empathy #paulbloom - Listen to all episodes online. Search "Modern Wisdom" on any Podcast App or click here: iTunes: https://apple.co/2MNqIgw Spotify: https://spoti.fi/2LSimPn Stitcher: https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/modern-wisdom - Get in touch in the comments below or head to... Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chriswillx Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/chriswillx Email: modernwisdompodcast@gmail.com

Paul BloomguestChris Williamsonhost
Nov 14, 20191h 5mWatch on YouTube ↗

At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Paul Bloom Explores Empathy’s Flaws, Tribalism, and Productive Suffering

  1. Chris Williamson interviews Yale psychologist Paul Bloom about empathy, morality, tribalism, and why we sometimes seek out suffering. Bloom argues that emotional empathy (feeling others’ pain) is biased, exhausting, and often a poor moral guide, and proposes “rational compassion” as a better foundation for ethics and helping others. They discuss in‑group/out‑group psychology, the naturalness of tribalism and revenge, and how modern society increasingly tries to transcend some of our evolved instincts. Bloom also previews his upcoming book on why people willingly pursue painful experiences—from BDSM and horror films to intense exercise and challenging life projects—and how suffering is intertwined with meaning and the good life.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Distinguish clearly between empathy and compassion in your own life.

Empathy (feeling what others feel) is not the same as compassion (caring and wanting to help); you can be highly compassionate and effective without emotionally absorbing others’ distress, which often leads to burnout and poor decisions.

Don’t rely on empathy as your primary moral compass.

Empathy is inherently biased toward people who are similar, close, or salient, which means it can skew fairness (e.g., favoring a vivid individual story over a just waiting list) and even amplify in‑group favoritism and racism.

Cultivate ‘rational compassion’ for better decisions and policies.

Use your head to decide who most needs help and what actually works, while keeping genuine concern for others; this allows you to care beyond your immediate circle and avoid being captured by the loudest or closest plea.

Recognize that tribalism is natural—but not automatically right.

Humans effortlessly form us-versus-them groups, even over arbitrary differences, so overcoming prejudice requires conscious rules, institutions, and self-scrutiny rather than assuming our gut reactions are morally trustworthy.

Seek meaningful challenges instead of pure comfort.

Deep projects—raising children, building a career, athletic feats—are valuable partly because they involve effort, risk, and discomfort; when life becomes too easy, people often feel restless or empty rather than fulfilled.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

Empathy pushes you to the close, to the similar, and as moral reflective beings, we say, ‘We could do better than that.’

Paul Bloom

What we want in friends is not somebody to multiply our sadness, but somebody to replace it with happiness.

Paul Bloom

There’s no such thing as not giving a shit. There’s just signaling you don’t give a shit.

Paul Bloom

If there’s one thing we know, it’s that a propensity to break the world up into us versus them comes natural.

Paul Bloom

If you told me about something you did and you said, ‘It was easy-peasy, no pain at all,’ I would guarantee you you’re not gonna take much of value from it.

Paul Bloom

Difference between empathy and compassion (and why Bloom is ‘against’ empathy)In‑group/out‑group psychology, tribalism, and the roots of bias and racismMoral reflection versus natural instincts (revenge, favoritism, stealing)Evolutionary perspectives on caring, altruism, and parental empathySuffering as a source of pleasure, flow, identity, and social signalingBDSM, meditation, extreme sports, and escaping self-consciousnessNuance, signaling, and the distortions of social media versus long-form conversation

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