PivotCharlie Kirk Assassination: Condemnation, Division, and Conspiracies | Pivot
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
145 min read · 28,665 words- 0:00 – 0:30
Intro
- KSKara Swisher
Whoever did this was like, "I'm gonna take my gun. I am gonna climb up on that roof. I am gonna murder someone," and thinking it was the right choice. You know what I mean? Like, this is your only choi- why didn't you go down there and ask him a fucking question and yell at him? Hi everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher.
- SGScott Galloway
And I'm Scott Galloway.
- KSKara Swisher
So, today we should start very much saying what happened yesterday
- 0:30 – 31:47
Charlie Kirk Assassination
- KSKara Swisher
in Utah was, uh, a terrible and tragic situation. Um, I think, uh, there's been a lot of, like, a lot of anger, a lot of accusations, a lot of really ugly stuff going on. Um, but, uh, being able to speak even if you disagree with someone and, and as y- you might imagine, we, we, Scott and I have disagreed with Charlie Kirk many times. You can say what you want, but getting- having this happen is probably the most heinous thing, uh, that could occur in a country like the United States where we are supposed to be able to say the most horrible things and continue to debate. Scott?
- SGScott Galloway
That's all? Um... Yeah, look, I, I, I, uh, I've been thinking about this a lot, as most people have over the last, um, whatever, uh, 18 hours. Look, he... (sighs) I mean, i- this wa- uh, at the end of the day, or the begin- the beginning and the end is the following. A 31-year-old father of two was needlessly murdered, all right? That, that, that is a tragedy, full stop. Should not happen, and we should be thinking about, uh, tangible actions (laughs) to make sure it, it, it happens less. Um, Charlie Kirk, i- in my view, and we said this, uh, and just to be honest, in mi- you know, I, I won't speak for you. In my view, said a lot of divisive, hateful things.
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm. Absolutely.
- SGScott Galloway
At the same time, his format was really powerful and productive, and that is a lot of people on the far left and the far right go into their echo chambers in a studio somewhere behind a mic, and only listen to or respond to people who are supporting them. He went on campus, and he would have these open mic, you know, you know, uh, "Challenge me or debate me or prove me I'm wrong."
- KSKara Swisher
"Prove Me I'm Wrong" was his name.
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah, Prove Me R- And I thought that was really productive and courageous because he was subject to a lot of TikToks and videos that made him look bad, and a lot of times he would make great points and show that a lot of young people weren't being critical thinkers about their progressive views, and a lot of times young people would show up and say very intelligent things that, that, uh, counteracted in critical thinking and showed that he was wrong. That is a productive dialogue we should have on campus. Campuses are supposed to be, and this is one of the most upsetting things about A Very Upsetting Thing. University campuses are supposed to be an incredibly safe place physically, but a dangerous place intellectually, and that is-
- KSKara Swisher
Right. 100%.
- SGScott Galloway
And unfortunately this reduces both. People, I, I don't know about you. I'm rethinking (laughs) some of the campus appearances I've committed to. It-
- KSKara Swisher
Yep. Yep.
- SGScott Galloway
They are supposed to be physically safe spaces, not only for the speakers, but for the students, and, and, uh, I won't even get into, you know, some of the high school stuff, but you have to appreciate, he was a great businessman at a very young age, a father of two, and he, h- his dialogue and his format, I felt, was a productive, brave dialogue, right? It, it, this is a, this is a tragedy. Let me get to some of the second-order effects, and I wanna get your thoughts. It's just so disappointing that universities are becoming a place, because of violence in schools. They should be the safest places in the world for discourse. That's just super, super upsetting. What I find, and this is, this is where as progressives w- I feel a pressure to feel the other side. I think the reaction from the far right in this is so fucking bullshit.
- KSKara Swisher
I would agree.
- SGScott Galloway
Every person on the far left has said something along the... I don't care if it's Secretary Clinton, Vice President Har- everyone has said basically, "We condemn this violence. Our he- this is never the solution. Our hearts and prayers go out to, uh, Charlie and his family." The far right has had a very similar narrative for half of it. "Our thoughts and prayers go out to Charlie and his family, and this is the fault of the radical left."
- KSKara Swisher
Rough. That was-
- SGScott Galloway
That is, political violence only begets political violence, and Trump, our commander, our divider-in-chief, immediately goes on-
- KSKara Swisher
Right.
- SGScott Galloway
... highlights political violence against every Republican, forgetting to mention (laughs) the violence against Speaker Amber-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... Tard Pelosi's husband, against the lawmakers who were murdered in their home in Minnesota. You know, it, it, it accidentally slips past every Democrat and says, "Political violence has to stop," and then goes on to foment political violence.
- KSKara Swisher
Yes, I would agree. I was sort of like, "What?" I was like, "Okay, good. Yes, no political violence," and then shifting into the radical left thing immediately was shocking, especially 'cause there's... nobody knows. They haven't caught this-
- SGScott Galloway
They don't know what?
- KSKara Swisher
It's a guy apparently. What a shock, but, um, but it's, uh, you know, uh, they have, they've got the gun now. They have videos of the person who did it. Um, they believe it's a college-aged student. I don't know how they know that, um, but they must have, m- uh, videos of some sort. So, the question is why would you immediately, without any proof, say something like that at the worst... Now, I, let me give him one tiny little out. They were very close, and you could be very, very angry and very upset about this incredibly violent death-And it w- unfortunately, it was all over the internet. Um, v- extraordinarily, it was, it was an execution really, was what happened here. And, and everyone saw what happened as murder. And, ah, for him to sh-shift to that, the only thing I can give him is, okay, he was a friend, but this, you're also the president of the United States, right? That's the, that was, I, what I kept thinking is, like, "What in the world would possess you to immediately start with the vengeance?" Like, I don't know. I don't, I was sort of, like, shocked myself st- And I'm, I'm usually never shocked by Donald Trump, but this one was sort of shocking to me.
- SGScott Galloway
If you go online right now, onto any of these platforms, and you see the stuff that's getting 70, 80,000 likes, it's someone saying, "That's it. It's war on the fucking radical left."
- KSKara Swisher
Right. Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
Someone who is understandably outraged and upset. I'm like, "Well, okay, do we know the radical left was responsible for this? Are you forgetting what's happened to Democrats?" And the far left wants to feel-
- KSKara Swisher
Yes, they are.
- SGScott Galloway
... the far left wants to feel empathy and a call for taking the temperature down. I get it. The far right-
- KSKara Swisher
Not everybody. Let's be clear. There's some stupid people saying stupid things online a-about him. I mean, about his death.
- SGScott Galloway
I haven't seen any of what I'll call-
- KSKara Swisher
Not about him. About his death.
- SGScott Galloway
Oh, so you haven't seen that?
- 31:47 – 37:37
Political Violence in Nepal
- KSKara Swisher
sort of shocking in a lot of ways. The country's now under nationwide curfew after mass protests led by teenagers and young adults turned deadly. Uh, the unrest began after the government banned social media, but protestors also were calling out on unemployment, corruption and inequality. It was a bigger thing than just social media, but social media set it off about this sort of culture of elitism, um, and it sort of manifested itself and w- the only reason I'm talking about it is 'cause what I'm, I'm hearing from lots of sources that they're about to announce the TikTok deal. It's going, probably going to Larry Ellison and a bunch of investors. I, I noted this online, um, and one of the things, of course, was it was supposed to be banned, right? And this is supposed to be the solution to it, and I wondered what if it did get banned, would something like this happen with young people? Probably not in this country, but I don't know if you have any thoughts on what happened in Nepal. It was sort of ... Social media's what set it off. I don't think it was the root cause, but nonetheless.
- SGScott Galloway
I don't know that much about it other than i- typically it's young people that start revolutions because young people are more risk-aggressive and willing to go to a square and risk getting shot. And, but, (laughs) I mean, quite frank- I, I, I'm, I, I'm not trying to ... Obviously loss of life is, anywhere, is a tragedy, but I just thought, "Th- they got their Instagram." That's wh- that was the final straw. They got their Instagram taken away. It just feel, it felt like-
- KSKara Swisher
Right.
- SGScott Galloway
I would not have guessed that. I don't know anything about the Nepalese culture.
- KSKara Swisher
Right.
- SGScott Galloway
I don't ... But that's what started it.
- KSKara Swisher
Well, you know, the co- countries not, countries not this country use social media as everything.
- SGScott Galloway
Right.
- KSKara Swisher
Like, it's, it's TV. It's ... And so including business, right? That's the thing with business.
- SGScott Galloway
It's basically like shutting down the newspapers and the TV stations when they take away your social media.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah. Uh, yeah. So, I, for people who don't understand it, and I think this was a hugely corrupt sort of nepo economy where these people had just about had it, and then they were like, "Now you can't say anything." And so ... And it's, it has a culture of free speech, this country. Anyway, just, just-
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah. But I'll bet anything-
- KSKara Swisher
... interesting to watch these movies.
- SGScott Galloway
You, you just summarized it. I don't even know what happened and I think I know what happened and that this was the excuse, but I'll bet you anything it's a lack of economic opportunity for young people. That was the kindling-
- KSKara Swisher
Yep.
- SGScott Galloway
... and them taking away their social media was the spark. Uh, almo-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
If you reverse engineer almost any uprising among youth, it's that they get pissed off that there's a group of people sucking oxygen out of the room from them and that, that, "Okay, we're fed up. We don't see, we don't see a future for us to, to find a family, be treated fairly, and it's a group o- it's a group of old people who are aggregating too much information. Or, I'm sorry, too much, too much power."
- KSKara Swisher
Uh, you know, I often don't say this, 'cause I do think some speech is indeed hateful and damaging, um, but the solution to a lot of this is more speech and more dialogue.
- SGScott Galloway
Mm-hmm.
- KSKara Swisher
And I think, uh, one thing that really kind of stuck in my craw was that N- MSNBC let go of Math- Matthew Dowd, who said some very factual things on the air, perhaps not good timing, um, uh, about Kirk, and he seemed to blame Kirk for his own death. I, I listened to it. I wasn't really clear if he actually said that. Um, what he was talking about was, you know, what w- we were just saying is that there's so much hate that ... He was essentially saying if you put hate out in the world, don't be surprised if you get it back.
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah.
- KSKara Swisher
Which is probably not the nicest thing to say at the moment.
- SGScott Galloway
He said you raise the temperature, he said you raise the temperature like on that, you might get, you might get burned, right?
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
I felt like this was ... When I saw his comments, I felt that MSNBC was essentially, um, the Democratic Party virtue signaling-
- KSKara Swisher
Blaming.
- SGScott Galloway
... and kicking out Al Franken. I just thought, "Okay, good for us. Good for us." I, I-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
I don't ... I mean-
- 37:37 – 46:58
Larry Ellison: Richest Person in the World
- KSKara Swisher
His net worth climbed t- to, uh, 393 billion dollars Wednesday after Oracle shares skyrocketed on a blockbuster earnings report, up 42% at one point. Oracle said it won several billion-dollar contracts in the latest quarter, quadrupling bookings from a year before. The company also is forecasting that revenue from its AI-powered cloud business will jump from 18 billion to 144 billion by 2030. On top of all that, OpenAI just signed a deal to purchase $300 billion in computing power from Oracle. And again, I am understanding he's gonna get control of TikTok or somehow be the lead, uh, person in that, and he's obviously very close to President Trump. And they had been involved with TikTok before, let me be fair. Um, they were part of when they're- th- the last time they were trying to figure out what to do about TikTok. Who knows? We'll, we'll talk about that when it happens. Um, but, you know, this is sort of Nvidia too. I, I don't know. This is... Oracle is now a major AI player. Um, what do you, what do you think about this?
- SGScott Galloway
Uh, uh, I think Ellison is a visionary, and he doubled down. I think he figured out that, okay, there should be one... The most valuable company in the world, Nvidia, uh, it would be okay to be the, the second-biggest infrastructure company centered around AI. And he made a massive investment, and it's paying off like crazy. Their cloud revenue is projected to increase 77% to 18 billion. Um, they expect their cloud revenue... It was their projections that got the market excited. They project that their cloud revenue will hit 144 billion by 2030. That's a 14-fold increase versus the 10 billion it brought in last year. It said, credibly, the CEO said, "We're gonna increase our cloud revenue 14X in the next four years." Now, what's interesting here is, a great deal of that comes from a deal with OpenAI, who will purchase $300 billion computing over five years. So get this. Essentially, OpenAI has said, "We're going to pay Oracle $60 billion a year for compute," despite the fact we are currently, OpenAI, only making 10 billion a year. They are so confident in their growth that they've just committed to spend $60 billion a year on compute-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, I noticed that.
- SGScott Galloway
... despite only currently (laughs) making 10 billion. So, he became the richest person in the world for a brief moment. Biggest one-day gain in history, 36%. He owns approximately 40% of Oracle. And i- i- a- a- and this is a good bridge to, to Apple. What he has done is... Larry's gangster move was Oracle was becoming a mature company, very profitable, and they were buying back shares. When the company went public, he owned 34%. Now he owns over 40% because they've used that excess cash flow to buy back shares. Until two years ago when he said, "Uh-uh, the future's in AI. It's an arms race."
- KSKara Swisher
Yep.
- SGScott Galloway
"I'm going to massively invest in AI." Who did not do that, Kara? Trivia question.
- KSKara Swisher
Apple.
- SGScott Galloway
100%. Correct for 20.
- KSKara Swisher
Okay.
- SGScott Galloway
One guy said-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... "It's time to put back on our growth pants, so to speak, and start massively investing in AI." And this was the gangster strategic move arguably of the last five years, was an old company-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... saying, "Fuck it."
- KSKara Swisher
And an old guy. (laughs) And an old guy-
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah.
- KSKara Swisher
... and an old company.
- SGScott Galloway
"We need to start dancing again. You may have gotten used to our dividend, you may have gotten used to our share buybacks. Uh-uh. I'm going large because there's no number two to Nvidia, but there's gonna be." And now squarely-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... Oracle is, has basically put their elbows out and crashed the party and said, "Oh, no. You may think we're old and dodgy or whatever. W- we're not. We're hip. We... Elephants can dance." And now, you know... Uh, uh, I mean, this was an incredibly smart deft move of Larry Ellison.
- KSKara Swisher
I would never count him out. And also his CEO, Safra Catz, um, she is really also very sharp. I mean, I think it's really interesting. I think, of course, they did also see the writing on the wall with the Trump administration backing AI. You know, they've been very aggressive at showing up at these AI events. A- and you remember he showed up at that event with Sam Altman, with the president, that pissed off Elon Musk and everything else. And at the same time, he, he put a big investment into Twitter, and probably he's about to double-cross Elon by owning TikTok, right? Or, or at least controlling TikTok. So, this guy just whatever it takes... And of course, his son, he, he funded the- his son's purchase of Paramount. And so, this guy is just very vibrant for an, for an elderly man, I'll say.
- SGScott Galloway
Okay, well, just in the price increase from yesterday, I mean, 36%. Wha- what is that? Um... I don't know what they're increase. I- I'm pretty sure they could buy 30 or 40 Paramounts with just the increase in Ellison's net worth yesterday. I mean, he said to his son, "Go play in traffic. Here's five or seven billion dollars. I've just increased my r- you know, I've just increased my net worth by..."... a hundred billion, right? So yeah, go, go have fun with Paramount. I mean, the numbers here are so staggering, it, it's, uh, I mean, let's do the ba- math. He's worth about $400 billion. He, he, uh, the stock was up 36%, so went up a third, so he made $130 billion yesterday.
- KSKara Swisher
I know.
- SGScott Galloway
What did they buy Paramount for? Five or seven?
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, something around that.
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah, so they could go buy 20 Paramounts with his increa- his son... He could... If he has 20 kids out there, which is, uh, a possibility given what I know about Larry Ellison-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, give me a smoothie studio.
- SGScott Galloway
... he could say to all of them, "Go buy your own Paramount-"
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
"... with the gains from yesterday."
- 46:58 – 51:56
Apple Introduces iPhone Air
- KSKara Swisher
Apple. It rolled out its newest iPhones this week, including the iPhone Air, which Tim Cook is calling a game changer. I do not agree with this. It's the thinnest phone ever, about a third slimmer than current models, though there are trade-offs in battery life. Um, Apple also unveiled a new watch model as well as AirPods that can translate foreign languages. That was pretty cool. Meanwhile, AI barely came up at the event, a big shift from last year when Apple Intelligence took center stage. Let me say, this iPhone with the bump on the back, I saw it... I ran into Eddy Cue at this morning show event, and he showed it to me, and I was like, "It has a bump on the back." It's a big bump. It wobbles. Like, it's skinny, but then it has this big bump. Um, which I'm ma- people are making, um... they're making a, uh, uh... People are talking about it online a lot. It's also... Uh, it doesn't... I, I don't want to buy it, I have to say. I don't know why. Maybe I'll buy the 17, but the skinny one is not attractive because it has the bump. I don't, I don't know what to say. Anyway, um, do you think it's a game changer from what you saw?
- SGScott Galloway
I'm just sitting here thinking, am I allowed to be crude the day after a murder?
- KSKara Swisher
Yes, go ahead.
- SGScott Galloway
Whatever. I mean, uh, okay, the announcement, uh, what Cook called a game changer, I would call a hand job and an Advil. I'm just like, "Eh, all right."
- KSKara Swisher
Okay.
- SGScott Galloway
I don't-
- KSKara Swisher
That's good. Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
Fine. I, I...
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
Was anyone begging for a thinner phone? I don't-
- KSKara Swisher
If it was without... If it was a thinner phone with, with capabilities and without the bump, sure, why not?
- SGScott Galloway
The most exciting thing-
- KSKara Swisher
Kind of.
- SGScott Galloway
... and it's available on other platforms, is real-time language translation for the AirPods. I think the AirPods are the most-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, that was cool.
- SGScott Galloway
... underrated tech product of the last 10 years.
- KSKara Swisher
That was cool.
- SGScott Galloway
I think, essentially, they're not even a tech product. They're the most ubiquitous, expensive, high-margin piece of jewelry in history. People are now roaming around full time with a pair of earrings called an AirPods that cost $300 and probably $110.
- KSKara Swisher
I ordered them last night.
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah, I just leave them in now. I, uh, they're just everywhere.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
The... What this signals though, and where they will get scrutiny, per our most recent conversation, is that over the last decade... Essentially, Jobs is... Jobs was a builder. He did not believe in share buybacks. He wanted to ma- amass a huge cash hoard and then such that they were durable and enduring, and if they wanted to, they could take big swings, either acquisitions or go very deep after a certain product development. Tim Cook is an operator. And by the way, you got to give it to Tim Cook. He's taken the company from 300 billion to three trillion.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, he has.
- SGScott Galloway
The question is, have those $700 or $800 billion in share buybacks to date... They have bought back approximately 40% of their outstanding shares, meaning over a 25-year period, they're effectively taking the company private. The question is, when you have these meh product announcements, have they gotten to a point where they, quite frankly, should be a little bit more aggressive, a little bit more promiscuous, and be spending some of that unbelievable cash generation and taking more big swings? 'Cause yesterday, there were no big swings. There was nothing that compelling-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, I agree.
- SGScott Galloway
... and this is the difference. It's easy to play Monday morning quarterback, but let's do it. The difference between what Ellison did, was a couple of years ago he said, "Oh my God, AI is a once-in-a-lifetime generational tech innovation. I am shifting from being a share buyback company to, uh, an R&D company, and I'm going to take a massive swing here." And he became... And the stock was up 30- 38% yesterday. Apple has basically said, "We are a mature company." And the problem with Apple being a mature company is that its stock right now does not trade as if it's a mature company. It trades as if it's a growth company at a PE of 33. So where there will be a lot of second-guessing, as I'm doing now, is Tim Cook, quite frankly, not keeping up with his peers, because he's decided, "We're going to go into kind of a rest home. We're going to continue..." Icahn started this by putting pressure on them for share buybacks and a dividend.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
They did both. And unfortunately-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... they aren't taking the big swings they used to under the Jobs tenure.
- 51:56 – 58:51
Epstein’s Birthday Book
- KSKara Swisher
President Trump's contributions to Jeffrey Epstein's 50th birthday book. Obviously the murder of, uh, Charlie Cook has sort of pushed that off, but it was getting a lot of attention. As previously reported, there was a letter from Trump to Epstein feeb- featuring a cryptic conversation within a hand-drawn woman's body. I would say a, a teenage girl's body is what it looked like. There was also a photo of an oversized check appearing to be signed by DJ Trump with a note s- uh, Epstein saying, "Showed early talents with money and women," and had sold a fully dis- depreciated w- woman to Trump for $22,000. Um, President Trump is calling it a dead issue when asked. Um, uh, you know, I think probably this Charlie Kirk situation is going to push it out of the headlines, but at the same time, I still think this Epstein thing has staying power. Um, they're really... Uh, Thomas Massey looks like he has the numbers to, uh, force, uh, force a release. And in fact, Kirk, before he sort of went backwards a little bit had said, "There should be a..." I- I was watching a speech where he said it should be full and... Full release of... Unredacted release, uh, to the public. Um, so I don't know what you thought. I thought it just... Trump pretended he didn't draw, and then they showed him drawings. He pre- he said this birthday book didn't exist. It exists. He said he didn't write a letter. It looks like he wrote a letter. Um, I think the idea that it's fake is kind of ridiculous. Ba- Way back then, someone knew he was going to be president and decided to do a fake thing? This seems ridiculous. Um, I think he did it, and he should just say he was sorry, and he won't do that. Um, and they're doubling down on hoax and whatever. I still think it's very damaging to him. This s- remains damaging. What did you think?
- SGScott Galloway
Well, the question is, is there a red line? Like, we knew he was a rich kid. Okay, that's a reason not to like him. We knew he was not a very good businessman. We knew he took companies bankrupt. We knew he didn't pay subcontractors. Um, we knew that he was accused of sexual assault. We know he's an insurrectionist. I mean, is... And now there seems to be evidence everywhere that he was at a, at a minimum cohorting with a known and convicted pedophile. And the notion that this is a forgery is like, well, okay, you mean somebody 21 years ago broke into the Epstein estate and decided to frame the president, who at that time was a Democrat, thinking when he's president, this will embarrass him? I mean, it's just like the logic-
- KSKara Swisher
Unbelievable.
- SGScott Galloway
The math ain't mathing here. And-
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
(laughs) ... I liked what, um, Representative Moskowitz I s- I think said in the, uh, one of the congressional hearings, said-
- KSKara Swisher
Jared Moskowitz.
- SGScott Galloway
"Why don't..." You guys, this is outrageous. Why don't we... Why d- Let's move to bring in, um, forgery experts and have them opine on this." I mean, the whole thing is just sort of like, at what point are we gonna fin- find out the guy is literally the Dark Lord. I mean, what gets... Look at the things... (laughs) Every time he's suspected-
- KSKara Swisher
I know.
- SGScott Galloway
... of something, uh, we find out it's true.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
And it doesn't seem to matter. The question is, is this...... is this the, you know, is this the red line? And I am convinced that, I'm going on The Times of London Radio tonight, I'm convinced the only reason he's supposed to come to the UK, uh, I typed into AI last night-
- KSKara Swisher
Stay in the camp.
- SGScott Galloway
... name, if I were a president trying to keep Epstein out of the news, please name actions and policies that would push Epstein out of the news cycle every 48 hours. And it gave me a playbook for everything he's doing. Some of which he's already done, some of which he, I think he's try- he's going to do. But he's coming over here to talk about free speech, and which I think is ridiculous. But anything that pushes, um, Epstein out of the news cycle is what he's doing. But I, I don't know. I don't have a, I think this is... It feels like this is the one thing that is sticking to the guy.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
Um-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
But...
- KSKara Swisher
'Cause it's, 'cause he was a friend of his. Like, I don't, what I don't get... Now look, I have no idea what happened. I don't have any idea if he's guilty of anything. But why not just say, "Ugh, I was so, it was such bad judgment. I'm so sorry."
- SGScott Galloway
Profane, stupid, locker room talk.
- KSKara Swisher
"Ugh, gross, that was dumb. I," locker room talk, yeah, that worked last time. "And I shouldn't have written this, and it was before anybody really knew, and I didn't know, I wasn't paying attention." And, and, and just say, "Ugh, I'm so sorry, that was so dumb." Like I, that's what Gates did, that's what like, everyone who's been there had, Clinton said it. Um, and it doesn't s- I mean, it sort of sticks to them, but not like this. This is, and I know he's president, but just the drawing was so like, I absolutely think he threw that, (laughs) like I looked at it and I was like, "Yes." This sounds-
- SGScott Galloway
The, the creepiest thing about, the cr- I, I don't know how... When I first saw it, everything about it supposedly being pubic hair, supposed to be a, a, a, an underage girl.
- KSKara Swisher
No.
- SGScott Galloway
I didn't even get it. I looked at it, I'm like... And the thing, the creepiest thing about it is, he clearly hired creatives, he organized resources...
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... to put this thing together. It wasn't like...
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah. Yeah. Same thing.
- SGScott Galloway
... a stupid note between friends where you, you... an error in judgment.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
He gathered creative professionals around and said...
- 58:51 – 1:05:36
Kamala’s Upcoming Book
- KSKara Swisher
An excerpt from former Vice President Kamala Harris' upcoming book, 107 Days, was published in The Atlantic, and it is spicy. In it, Harris says recklessness allowed President Biden to make the decision, uh, to run again. She also said the decision should not have been left to an individual's ego. The former vice president also said the president's staff fueled negative stories about her performance and often refused to defend her. That is true. I saw that in real time, you know. Um, uh, what do you think? I mean, I'm gonna interview her, just so you know, uh, at, at a live event in Washington in a coup- uh, two weeks, I think. Um, I'm excited to talk to her. This book was also written with the help of s- a very good author who's also a friend of mine, Geraldine Brooks, who is also a Pulitzer Prize winner and everything else. Uh, she's sort of going the Agassi route by hiring a really great writer. Um, so thoughts? Uh, she really went there. I did not think she would, but there she did.
- SGScott Galloway
Well, okay. Thanks, Captain Obvious.
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
I, I, I feel the same way about Vice President Harris as I feel about all these Republicans who grow testicles...
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... after they leave office.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah. That's a fair point.
- SGScott Galloway
We don't need you to decide it's reckless now. Had you sh- demonstrated the leadership capabilities we hope from a president, you should have walked in and said, "I don't think you should run again, and I'm not gonna support you to run again. Maybe you don't anoint me, fine, but I have an obligation duty to the pres- a duty to the country, and you should not be president. This is fucking ridiculous." And she saw up close and personal, but instead, like a lot of people around him, she decided to whistle, you know, whistle past the graveyard. Uh, and quite frankly...
- KSKara Swisher
She does talk about it in the thing. She, it's like, I think there is, when you're in those situations, everyone's like, "Well, it's up to Jill and Joe," right? You know what I mean? Like, even if it... Same thing with Trump if there's something, and no one will do anything. Like, those, those environments create overly cautious, very reticent people saying, "It's up to him." Like, even, you know, Newsom did it. They all did it. Newsom also did it. So did like all the Democratic...... everyone did.
- SGScott Galloway
Also, uh, someone who probably deserves, uh, s- uh, more credit than they deserve was, uh, Representative Dean Phillips, who very early said, um, "I'm running because I don't think President Biden is fit to run again." And he got pretty swiftly pilloried and swept away. He didn't get a lot of traction, but he does deserve some credit for coming out early. I'd like to roll with that dude. Representative Phillips, coll-
- KSKara Swisher
You met him.
- SGScott Galloway
I did meet him. He came on-
- KSKara Swisher
We met him at the DNC. He came over to us.
- SGScott Galloway
He came on my pod and came over. Actually, he seemed like a nice man.
- KSKara Swisher
He also-
- SGScott Galloway
Seemed like a good man.
- KSKara Swisher
... I think he came over to us.
- SGScott Galloway
Look, if two podcasters can say-
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
... a year and a half before, "He's too fucking old."
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
The vice president and the-
- KSKara Swisher
I get it.
- SGScott Galloway
... people around him should have enough fidelity to the White House or Democratic ideals-
- KSKara Swisher
Correct.
- SGScott Galloway
... to realize Popop, it's time for Popop to, to get a gold watch-
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
... and retire. This is-
- KSKara Swisher
I know.
- SGScott Galloway
I mean-
- 1:05:36 – 1:11:26
Predictions
- KSKara Swisher
Okay, Scott, let's hear a prediction.
- SGScott Galloway
Well, it's the boring stuff that moves the needle, but, um, we have become kind of the master... We, we are the Messi of own goals. And for those of you who don't know Lionel Messi, greatest football player in the history of the game. And the most recent one barely got any coverage, but, uh, earlier, or last week, um, uh, I think it was, okay, on September 4th, the Hyundai Motor Group, um, Meta plant in America was raided by ICE. About 475 people were detained, including 300 South Koreans who were here on a B1 visa, visitor visa, which don't normally authorize certain types of manual or long-term work, but they're used all the time for the type of work they were doing. And legal representations argue that many workers' contracts had the required specifications. So, it's up for debate whether they had the right visa or not. And they're saying that Homelands, Homeland Security, Georgia State Patrol, that they, actions followed a warrant, an investigation into unlawful employment practices at the plant. So what happened? Uh, these people who were incarcerated, South Korea immediately chartered a plane, has brought them all back to South Korea, and by the way, this factory?... is part of a, you know, this was going to be a $7.5 billion factory. This is exactly what the president claimed he was going to do, bring manufacturing and greater investment into America. South Korea is a fantastic ally. What if we, what if Germany said, "You know, the US, US, you're just cleaning up with an AI. We need some of your great American companies to invest in Germany." And we opened an NVIDIA plant there, and we had people over there under what looks to be a legal visa, and then German police raided it, incarcerated our engineers. How would we respond? So, this is how, this is how South Korea's going to respond. LG, Samsung, Hyundai, they're going to substantially curtail any plans for capital investment in the United States. Th- this was not only stupid, but it's basically going to set us back economically. So, this was again, yet again, another own goal. And then my other one is, um, Russian drones. Russia is, everybody says, uh, you know, Trump was fond of saying, "Oh, I, they, they would, Russia would have never done this if I was president." Russia is poking Trump in the eye right now. First, a cyberattack on an EU plane with an EU minister. Fine. That's a test. And most recently, they have flown attack drones-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... into Polish airspace.
- KSKara Swisher
Seeing what we do.
- SGScott Galloway
And, and to see how, how we or the EU-
- KSKara Swisher
We react.
- SGScott Galloway
... respond. And, uh, I'm not going to get in... Uh, my prediction isn't a geopolitical prediction. My prediction is the following. The best stocks for the second half of the year or the last quarter of the year are going to be European defense stocks. Because Russia sending attack drones into Poland? By the way, Poland is protected by Article 5 of NATO, meaning if they're attacked, all 32 member nations of NATO are attacked. What does this mean? Russia is contemplating or toying with military action against NATO, so what is the economic implication of that? You're about to see... Poland has already increased its percentage of GDP going to defense spending. By the way, Poland is an economic miracle. It's gonna go to defense, oh my gosh, you're gonna see, uh, an increase in defense spending coming out of the EU nations. And they're going to say, "You know what? We're not spending it on Northrup Grumman. We're not going to spend it on Anduril. Uh, we're not going to spend it on Boeing. We're going to spend it on European defense companies." And guess what? There aren't that many of them. So, the publicly traded, the 10 or 15 publicly traded European defense stocks are about to see the mother of all capital inflows. So, the best performing stocks for the last quarter of the year are about to be European defense stocks because of these drones that Putin sent into Polish airspace.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah. Wow. Y- y- you're going geopolitical investing. That's really good.
- SGScott Galloway
There you go.
- KSKara Swisher
I love it. Um, uh, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about biz and tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot to submit a question for the show or call 855-51-PIVOT. Elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe this week, Prof G Markets, Scott spoke with Justin Wolfers. I love Justin. Professor of Public Policy and Economics at the University of Michigan. Let's listen to a clip.
- LELarry Ellison
I happen to think that AI is the most interesting technology of my lifetime, and we may be on the cusp of one of the great technological revolutions. I also might be wrong. That's fine too. That debate is arguably the most interesting and most important economic debate, how to regulate AI, what role it'll play in our lives, how to cushion people for its impact, how to turbocharge it so that we get everything we want out of it, may be the most important economic debate of our lifetimes, and instead we're sitting around talking about tariffs.
- KSKara Swisher
Ah, fascinating. Fascinating. You've interviewed Russell Crowe, that's great. Uh, okay-
- SGScott Galloway
(laughs)
- KSKara Swisher
... that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot-
- SGScott Galloway
I am Maximus or whatever he said.
- KSKara Swisher
He's coming out with a new movie where he plays, I think, Goering, Hermann Goering, uh, during the Nuremberg trials. It looks amazing.
- SGScott Galloway
Wow.
- KSKara Swisher
With Rami Malek. Oh, it looks so good. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot, and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. We'll be back next week. Scott, read us out.
- SGScott Galloway
Today's show was produced by Lara Nehm and Zoe Marcus, Taylor Griffin and Kate Gallagher. Aalia Jackson engineered this episode. Jim Mackell edited the video. Thanks also to Drew Barros, Miss Siverio, and Dan Chalon. Nishad Kuraz, Vox Media's executive producer of podcasts. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thank you for listening to Pivot from New York Magazine and Vox Media. You can subscribe to the magazine at nymag.com/pod. We'll be back next week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Kara, have a great weekend.
Episode duration: 1:11:26
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