Savannah Guthrie Opens Up About Faith and Family

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   Savannah Guthrie is the…

   1. KSKara Swisher0:00

      Savannah Guthrie is the co-anchor of the Today Show and NBC News' chief legal correspondent. She's also the author of Mostly What God Does: Reflections on Seeking and Finding His Love Everywhere. I wanna be clear, this is the real Savannah Guthrie we're talking to, not the AI or deep fake Savannah Guthrie. We'll talk about that in a minute. But I first wanted to talk about the impetus for the book because when you told me about it, um, we text from time to time, you said your, "It's not what you think it's gonna be," and y- you were almost apologetic. It was interesting. Um, and that this would surprise people who know you as Savannah Guthrie, journalist, interviewer, you do tough interviews, uh, you're on the Today Show, you're very well-known. Ta- you're talking about your faith here. Ta- talk to me about what the impetus was 'cause I was surprised actually. I had no idea.

   2. SGSavannah Guthrie0:45

      I know. I was surprised too, and I mean, almost apologetic is just my zone, you know. That's where I s- live, that's where, that's the p- the emotional space I inhabit for, um, (laughs) most of my day. But, you know, honestly, I, my faith has been important to me, it always has been, and all my close friends and my colleagues, everyone knows that. So I don't mean that they would be surprised, but more that I was surprised that it was something I wanted to write about or put out there publicly, not because I was ashamed but because it's so, it's so personal. It's so vulnerable. I mean, if you're gonna write a book about faith and it is in any way authentic then you're more or less putting your heart out there. And in this world, which I don't have to remind you, that's really terrifying. And so for me to put it out there like that, um, I'm certainly not holding myself up as any kind of model of behavior or anything, I'm not any kind of theologian or biblical scholar, it's just reflections from a, a real person, a real life, more, learning more from disappointments and setbacks than any triumph, that's for sure.

   3. KSKara Swisher1:44

      Sh- sure. So one of the things though is, uh, becau- let's leave aside the performative people who talk about religion, who do it for some other reason. Um, you were a quiet, faithful person, as m- as most people are. You know what I mean? That people, they don't... Do you think people are scared? D- not scared and ashamed to talk about it, but you d- 'cause it's so personal, that's why you didn't wanna, you don't talk about it. Or publicly, I guess.

   4. SGSavannah Guthrie2:06

      Yeah, well, I mean, first of all, everyone knows... Yeah, publicly. I mean, I have talked about it, you know, from time to time, which is how this opportunity-

   5. KSKara Swisher2:13

      Mm-hmm.

   6. SGSavannah Guthrie2:13

      ... to write about it came to me. You know, I've, I've certainly never-

   7. KSKara Swisher2:15

      Mm-hmm.

   8. SGSavannah Guthrie2:16

      ... run from it. But, you know, I think people are quiet about their faith because for one thing, our, isn't the mantra you're not supposed to talk about religion or politics?

   9. KSKara Swisher2:22

      Well, yes it is, but that doesn't happen. That doesn't happen.

   10. SGSavannah Guthrie2:25

       Well, I mean, one of those has to hold. (laughs) Yes. It doesn't, it doesn't. But also because, you know, this isn't, I'm not out here trying to proselytize or persuade. I'm, I, the, the truth of the matter is, I never thought I would write a book about God. I, I never thought I'd write any book. And I, and I didn't want to, really. I was happy to just have this be something personal to me. But when the opportunity came up, I found myself not able to say the immediate no I've said to every other offer of any kind of writing whatsoever. And the reason was, was because it seemed-

   11. KSKara Swisher2:58

       Mm-hmm.

   12. SGSavannah Guthrie2:58

       ... intriguing, it seemed challenging, it seemed terrifying, and it's the subject I'm most passionate and interested in. And I'm always telling, you know, especially young producers or interns or people that have ever asked me for advice, I always say, "You know, get outta your comfort zone." Anything interesting you do in your life will be outside your comfort zone. It's on the other side of a big risk that you take. And it had been a while since I had taken-

   13. KSKara Swisher3:21

       Right, right.

   14. SGSavannah Guthrie3:21

       ... my own advice. And so I thought, "I'm gonna try."

   15. KSKara Swisher3:23

       So you write a lot about, um, some deep... By the way, it's a bestseller, so it's doing, people are responding to it. Um, in the book you write about some deeply personal topics, including the loss of your father who died when you were teenagers, you also talk about your husband and your kids and how you see both marriage and parenthood as metaphors for relationships with God. Um, d- talk a little bit about this, h- why you wrote it the way you did.

   16. SGSavannah Guthrie3:46

       Well, the big revelation is mostly what God does, that's the title of the book, and the rest of the sentence is mostly what God does is love you. And I grew up in the church, I, I had a ba- traditional kind of Baptist upbringing and there's a lot about that that I still love and treasure, but there was also a lot of guilt and shame and rules and a sense for me of always failing, never measuring up, and always kinda wondering what this looming God figure might have thought of me. And through a life of, again, more mistakes than anything else, what I came to realize is that mostly what God is doing at any given time is loving us. The, it comes actually from Scripture, it comes from a verse in Ephesians that was retranslated by a scholar named Eugene Peterson. And this, the verse goes, "Watch what God does, and you do it too, the way children learn proper behavior from their parents. Mostly what God does is love you." When I read that sentence years and years ago, it was a radical reframing of how I thought about God, rather than this angry taskmaster scolding or s- being disappointed-

   17. KSKara Swisher4:54

       Mm-hmm.

   18. SGSavannah Guthrie4:54

       ... or w- you know, having a bill of particulars of all the ways we and all of humanity fails. Mostly what God is doing is loving you. That's true for me, it's true for you-

   19. KSKara Swisher5:05

       Mm-hmm.

   20. SGSavannah Guthrie5:05

       ... it's even true for Scott, who's very silent during this conversation.

   21. KSKara Swisher5:06

       He's gonna ti- he's gonna talk in a minute. He comes in with the big...

   22. SGSavannah Guthrie5:10

       (laughs) I'm, uh, (laughs) I'm, I'm, I'm teasing. But the, the thing is, is that I, I wrote about it in the, in the terms of parenthood because that was another moment where when I had kids, I was in my 40s, I was so lucky to get to have kids-

   23. KSKara Swisher5:23

       Mm-hmm.

   24. SGSavannah Guthrie5:23

       ... at that late date, long after I thought I had screwed up everything and would never have my chance. And h- to have a child is truly the most, I think the closest we'll ever get-

   25. KSKara Swisher5:32

       Mm-hmm.

   26. SGSavannah Guthrie5:32

       ... to understanding how God relates to us. You know, we love our kids, we're amazed by our kids, we delight in our kids, we relish their little accomplishments, we delight in their milestones. We not only love them, we often like them, we adore them. Well, that's how God feels about every human being.

   27. KSKara Swisher5:50

       This is a good

   28. NANarrator5:50

       Come to our, yeah. This is where-

   29. SGSavannah Guthrie5:50

       And I'm not making this up.

   30. KSKara Swisher5:51

       There's other versions.
2. 15:00 – 23:36

   How do you incorporate…

   1. SGSavannah Guthrie15:00

      that faith is a, is, it's intellectual, but it's also spiritual and emotional. We're on multi-dimensional realms here, okay? So, you know, you can't ... Nobody can sit here and prove it to you and give you a set of facts. Even if they gave you incontrovertible facts, that wouldn't be enough. Faith is, in the end, a leap, and I, if I had older kids, I think that's what I'd say to them. My little kids, you know, these, these, they're seven and nine now, as they start to ask questions, my view is, I've told them what I know, they will choose for themselves their faith or no faith at all, and their ... That will be their choice. I only know my responsibility is to expose them-

   2. KSKara Swisher15:40

      How do you incorporate the Jew-

   3. SGScott Galloway15:41

      ... to the God that I know.

   4. KSKara Swisher15:41

      Your husband being Jewish, is he ... How do you incorporate? 'Cause there's a lot of families like this.

   5. SGSavannah Guthrie15:45

      Well, we s-

   6. KSKara Swisher15:45

      There's like my-

   7. SGSavannah Guthrie15:46

      Yeah, of course.

   8. KSKara Swisher15:46

      My wife is Jewish but we haven't done anything at all and I wouldn't bring them to church, although with my older kids what my ex-wife did was, um, she took them to all different churches all the time. Like, she would go to a temple, she would go to a Sikh temple, she would go to a Bapt- she brought them to a lot ... Uni- Unitarian was where she tended to zero out on, but, um, she took them to a lot of places, which I thought was-

   9. SGSavannah Guthrie16:12

      I think-

   10. KSKara Swisher16:12

       ... kind of a great idea. I couldn't. I didn't.

   11. SGSavannah Guthrie16:14

       I think s- I th- I mean, look, I've, my view is sort of give God some access to their hearts and let him do the rest. I mean, why do we act like we're gonna, what we say is somehow going to be what they end up believing anyway?

   12. KSKara Swisher16:27

       Mm-hmm.

   13. SGSavannah Guthrie16:28

       So, I feel a responsibility because I do feel my faith so strongly that I wanna share with them what I know. My, my husband, he comes from a, a, the Jewish tradition and he shares his traditions and we let those all live alongside each other. Now, look, I- we don't have to get into chapter and verse why at some point, although there's so much in common-

   14. KSKara Swisher16:47

       Mm-hmm.

   15. SGSavannah Guthrie16:47

       ... between our faiths, why at some point there may be questions and a conflict, and when that day comes, I hope that we can answer it with as much love, understanding, grace, and humility as possible, for all we know and all we don't know. But, you know, there's a ... My kids used to go, they don't go to this school anymore, but it wasn't a religious church, a religious school, but it had religious ... It was an old religious school, but 100 years later in New York City, it didn't. But they still had chapel every week and what I loved about it was, you know, the chapel had nothing religious in it, but it was space and time for something other than the here and now, for something other than what's right in front of you. So, maybe this is a long-winded way of getting to something of an answer, Scott, which is to, however you do it, to leave a little space and if God chooses to enter that space, well, won't you be lucky, even though, Scott, you'll be in despair. (laughs)

   16. KSKara Swisher17:38

       (laughs)

   17. SGScott Galloway17:38

       (laughs) Why should anything change?

   18. SGSavannah Guthrie17:40

       But, you know, that's kind-

   19. SGScott Galloway17:41

       Why should anything change?

   20. SGSavannah Guthrie17:42

       Well, you know what, Scott? All I, uh, my big view, and I write about this in the book, is God speaks our language. Like, y- you open your heart and you give a little access point, then let God do the rest. He's God, you're not.

   21. KSKara Swisher17:54

       Or not.... or not.

   22. SGScott Galloway17:55

       Mm-hmm.

   23. SGSavannah Guthrie17:55

       Or not, if you're you, but-

   24. KSKara Swisher17:56

       I think, you know, as you were-

   25. SGSavannah Guthrie17:57

       ... you may be surprised. (laughs)

   26. KSKara Swisher17:58

       Yes. As you were sitting here thinking, the reason I am i- interested, uh, I- I was ... grew up Catholic. And I ... they hated g- gay people. They did, they did, they did. And that was what reje- made me reject it so strongly. One of the thing ... and I thought they were horrible in so many ways, the people that ran the church, including around, uh, sexual assault and stuff. Um, but one of the things that I think I'm attracted to is the quiet. It's so quiet in there. And I think you're right, being quiet is a very difficult thing these days. Um, I'm gonna ask you one more question. Scott may have one more, but I do have to ask you about these AI-generated companion workbooks being sold to accompany your book. Mine are ... I ... there's full books of Kara Swisher with really creepy-looking, uh, Kara Swisher faces on them. Um-

   27. SGScott Galloway18:38

       You look hot.

   28. KSKara Swisher18:38

       What-

   29. SGScott Galloway18:39

       You look-

   30. SGSavannah Guthrie18:39

       Th- I don't look ho-

Episode duration: 23:37