EVERY SPOKEN WORD
130 min read · 25,702 words- 0:00 – 1:14
Intro
- KSKara Swisher
What does animate these people is the rigging of the 2016 election. The- this does satisfy them. It scratches their itch, and I don't know if it scratches their itch more than Epstein. (instrumental music plays) Hi, everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher.
- SGScott Galloway
And I'm Scott Galloway.
- KSKara Swisher
Scott, I'm in San Francisco, my beloved San Francisco today.
- SGScott Galloway
Oh, really?
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
What, wh- why are you there?
- KSKara Swisher
More filming. I ate, I ate s- uh, cell, cell-created salmon yesterday.
- SGScott Galloway
Oh, really?
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah. Cool.
- SGScott Galloway
Um, yeah, that, that, uh, well, good for you. And what does that supposedly do for you?
- KSKara Swisher
Uh, well, it's just the idea of that we have to have healthier foods, and they're trying to do all kinds of really interesting lab experiments, uh, on how-
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah.
- KSKara Swisher
... to create food. Uh, and, and it's really, uh, it is actually, and it's actually high in protein, all not additives-
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah.
- KSKara Swisher
... not all kinds of things. It's interesting. Um, how do we feed the world health- in a healthy way to make them live longer?
- SGScott Galloway
We g- we give poor people more money.
- KSKara Swisher
That's correct. That's the other way to do it, but there's not enough fish in the sea. Thank you, thank you.
- SGScott Galloway
There's my virtue signaling kicking in.
- KSKara Swisher
We've got (laughs) a lot to get to today, including Trump's AI action plan and Tesla and Alphabet's earnings.
- 1:14 – 4:51
Trump’s Epstein Mess
- KSKara Swisher
But first, uh, Elon Musk was right. Uh, Donald Trump is in the Epstein files. Uh, not a really big surprise, but Trump was reportedly informed by AG Pam Bondi back in May that his name appears multiple times in the files, probably quite a lot according to The Wall Street Journal. Bondi says nothing warranted further investigation for- or prosecution. In other Epstein news, the federal judge in Florida denied a DOJ request to release the j- grand jury transcripts, of course. The House Oversight Committee voted to subpoena the DOJ for Epstein files hours before the House adjourned for early, early for its summer recess. Mike Johnson did this on purpose so they didn't have to keep voting on the Epstein situation.
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah, "Nothing to see here. Go home."
- KSKara Swisher
"Nothing to see here. (laughs) Let's close down this door." The committee has, uh, subpoenaed Epstein associate Ghislaine Maxwell. Of course, it's another, you know, very performative thing with, uh, when the number two person at the Justice Department is taking his time to go talk to her, probably today. Um, we're gonna get to Trump's latest distraction move- maneuvers in a minute, which talk- Scott talked about, and boy did he land a big one, uh, another, another bearing wall of the MAGA movement around, uh, President Obama. But let's first talk about where things stand with Trump and Epstein. Uh, is there anything that he can do to stop the drip-drip at this point? Is it an opportunity for Democrats and, um, and we'll go through the... If you wanna go through those distractions first. Distractions is one way, but what else? And then we'll get to the distractions.
- SGScott Galloway
I think it's already underway. I think somebody has communicated to Ghislaine Maxwell in prison that if she exonerates the President, she'll get a pardon by the end of his term. I think it's already underway.
- KSKara Swisher
Which makes it worse though, right? Correct?
- SGScott Galloway
Mm...
- KSKara Swisher
Doesn't that make it even more of an-
- SGScott Galloway
I don't, I don't know. I think his base, I think if she, quote-unquote, I mean, think about how ridiculous this is, all of a sudden they've decided they might wanna speak to Ghislaine Maxwell. (laughs)
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
I mean, think about it. Uh, tha- that just dawned on the, the DE, uh, that just dawned on the Attorney General's office-
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
... that maybe they should go speak to her? Uh, so it's been, in my opinion, just logic has said, okay, if you provide us with information or credible information or just basically say he had, he was there, but make it, make it believable, like, he was there, but he never engaged in anything like that, um, y- before the end of the term, wink, wink, you're gonna be back in, in Long Island or wherever she's from. Uh, I just, um... And i- will it get worse? I don't know. His base seems to want... I, I, I can't... I, I, uh, I don't feel as if I really understand his base at all, and I've been more wrong on this than right, and you've been r- more right on this than wrong, so I'll, I'll throw it back to you. What do you think is going on here?
- KSKara Swisher
I think he's not going away. I think he'll c- he's, he's sort of... Uh, I think the Obama thing, which we'll talk about in a second, is s- is the smart one because if, there's two things this group is, is enamored with, which is that there was a Russian hoax to stop, the, you know, the, the election was stolen. But, uh, I am not sure which one is a bigger bearing wall for this group, the Epstein stuff or this, and I, they're intertwined in the idea of a deep state. So it's hard to know if this one will work, um, and especially when it's being led by such an idiot like Tulsi Gabbard. Let's, let's talk about these distractions. You said last week we should track his attempts to distract the public and, um, media from Epstein. Let's get, go into what he's been up to, most of which is pointless and doesn't work. Taking credit for Stephen Colbert's cancellation and sending a warning to The View. I think that's a nothing burger. Threatening to block a deal for the Washington Commanders' new stadium if the team doesn't go back to their old name. I'm not even sure he can do that. Another nothing burger. Releasing over two thou- uh, 230,000 pages of files related to MLK's assassination. Again, uh, I think that went, came and went. Visiting the Federal Reserve, another came and went. Um, they're also proposing to rename the Kennedy Center's Opera House after Melania Trump. I, I don't even
- 4:51 – 14:58
Trump Goes After Obama
- KSKara Swisher
understand that. But the one that seems to be the big one is Trump accusing former President Barack Obama of committing treason, claiming he rigged the 2016 election, which is also, uh, uh, as I said, a bearing wall of the MAGA movement's, uh, conspiracy theories. Uh, Trump told, uh, reporters in the Oval Office this week that it's time to go after people calling out Obama, Biden, Comey, and others. He cited declassified materials recently released by Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard which seem to fall apou- apart on initial scrutiny. Gabbard says the documents detail a years-long coup by, in Obama's intelligence officials against Trump. Uh, Obama is finally pushing back. I actually talked to, uh, people m- m- with him, and I was like, "Are you finally gonna say something 'cause I told you that he was coming here." Uh, his spokesman described, uh, Trump's comments as bizarre allegations and called this a ridiculous and weak attempt at distraction. I think it's not a weak attempt. I think it's actually a strong attempt at distraction and probably the only one that has any legs. Your thoughts, Scott? You were-
- SGScott Galloway
My thoughts are-
- KSKara Swisher
... 100% right about all these distractions, of course, and there are lots of them.
- SGScott Galloway
My thoughts are that you've never heard a heterosexual woman use the term bearing wall.
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
Um-I was with a group of women last night, uh, that used terms like fractal laser-
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
... uh, brow lift, Kegels, but no, I've never heard a straight woman use the term-
- KSKara Swisher
I've done Kegels.
- SGScott Galloway
... bearing wall.
- KSKara Swisher
I've done Kegels.
- SGScott Galloway
I mean, could you be a bigger lesbian? I'm in San Francisco-
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
... and every metaphor is, is a construction term. (laughs) A bearing wall.
- KSKara Swisher
Well, you, you got my point, didn't you? Did I make my point clearly?
- SGScott Galloway
No, uh, yeah, it makes sense. It's-
- KSKara Swisher
Okay.
- SGScott Galloway
... it's why you are-
- KSKara Swisher
Pillar.
- SGScott Galloway
... who you are.
- KSKara Swisher
The pillar.
- SGScott Galloway
Lean into it.
- KSKara Swisher
Structure.
- SGScott Galloway
Lean into... You like you.
- KSKara Swisher
What is it? Uh-
- SGScott Galloway
Look, I don't-
- KSKara Swisher
Foundation. Foundation.
- SGScott Galloway
I think Obama, I would've thought Obama was nearly bulletproof. Again, th- these distractions are becoming so... They're so ridiculous, and yet, every day, I turn on CNBC or CNN or Fox and they're just-
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
... going for it. They're like-
- 14:58 – 24:50
Earnings: Tesla, Alphabet, GM
- KSKara Swisher
Scott, we're back with more news. Time for a quick roundup of earnings. First up, Tesla. Elon Musk said Tesla could, quote, "uh, probably have a few rough quarters," unquote. You think, Elon? After the company's latest earnings, the Musk company reported a 16% year-over-year decline in automotive revenue, which is hard 'cause it's an automotive company. Adjusted net income fell 23% to 1.4 billion. It makes Twitter look like a great business. Sales of Model Y and Model 3 fell 12%, and Cybertruck sales fell 52%. I mean, that's f- that's gone right through the ground. Um, I'll just mention the others. Alphabet's overall revenue grew 14% year over year, but the company increased its capital expenditures forecast by $10 billion, citing demand for its cloud products. Uh, revenue for Alphabet's cloud computing business increased 32%. That was impressive, finally. I had a many year ago discussion with Sundar Pichai about why they're not in the cloud computing business as much as they were a long time ago, and they seem to be right there. They're also pushed by, obviously, AI and stuff. For GM, the auto company said its profits fell by more than a third in the second quarter due to tariffs costing the company over a billion, and as Scott pointed out, um, uh, that it's, uh, gonna get hit further with this Japanese deal. Scott, any thoughts on any of these?
- SGScott Galloway
Well, you covered the, I mean, Tesla's earnings again. Uh, no, no automobile company in the world trades at a PE of 180 and has a trillion dollar market cap, and at the same time, their revenues are declining faster than any automobile company in the world. And Musk knows those two do not stay in unison for very long. At some point, he either has to massively reignite growth, or the stock is gonna crash, and it feels like the latter.
- KSKara Swisher
Or do some merger of some sort.
- SGScott Galloway
Or, say, xAI or, um-
- KSKara Swisher
SpaceX.
- SGScott Galloway
... announcing a diner or, "We're not a car company. We're doing robots." Uh, uh, it's no accident they announced, by the way, which is a really cool idea. It will add no shareholder value, but it's an amazing marketing idea. This Tesla diner, it's no acci- uh, I said this on Property Markets-
- KSKara Swisher
We should go.
- SGScott Galloway
... yesterday. The fact that he opened this diner just days before these earnings came out is, again, no accident. I'm, I'm not exaggerating. 40 hours, 48 hours ago when it came out, I said to Ed Elson on Property Markets, I said, "That means he's about to puke on the earnings call, and he's trying to get everyone to look away."
- KSKara Swisher
Right.
- SGScott Galloway
Their revenues are down 12%. Their bright spot was their services or their supercharging station. But this thing's trading at a trillion dollar valuation, and it's, it's declining faster than Ren- I mean, there's no car company in the world that's posting these numbers this bad. On a more meta level, I think what's happened here ... I think 2025 will be the year that, uh, late night TV w- turns out the lights, and also, I think this is the year where we kind of officially cede anything resembling leadership to the automotive industry. I think the automotive industry now in the US is, uh, on a, kind of The Green Mile death march. And what do you have? You had our nash- you have our national champion, Tesla, which is worth more than the rest of the automobile industry combined, starting to throw up. And they released the worst product, car product of the year, the Cybertruck. They're, they're, they're grasping at straws right now saying, "We're AI. We're this." Th- uh, so that is a huge blow to the American automobile industry 'cause Tesla was the national champion. And then the traditional player, General Motors, just announced that their earnings were taken down by a billion dollars because of tariffs, and then you have Japanese car companies ... I love that Trump announces it's a big victory that they won't charge any tariffs on our cars going into Japan. Okay. Let's just talk about what a give that is.We buy about $54 billion of the Japanese cars in the US. Do you know how many, do you know the dollar volume of cars the Japanese buy from the US?
- KSKara Swisher
$26.
- SGScott Galloway
Two billion.
- KSKara Swisher
Right, what is it? What car is it?
- SGScott Galloway
Like a, a few Japanese billionaires buy Escalades. That's it.
- KSKara Swisher
Escalades, yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
We don't sell ... The Japanese want nothing to do with our cars. So for them to say, "Fine, no tariffs," it's not a give. And they are now, this trade agreement is gonna keep flat or lower the tariffs coming to the US. So what do you have? You have more pressure from amazing manufacturers, specifically Japanese manufacturers. You have our national champion going into the shitter. And you have our old guard, General Motors, announcing that these tariffs are really hurting them. And then if you want validation of just how bad this deal is for America, the ultimate neutral arbiter that absorbs millions of points of lights and is not politicized, it's totally focused on fear and greed, is the markets. And what happened in the market when these tariffs, this Japanese big beautiful deal was announced yesterday? Toyota was up 16 or 17%.
- KSKara Swisher
And he's made it worse, he's made it worse if he's talking about protecting manufacturing here. He's decided not to protect them, actually making it worse for them. Um, what about, uh, Alphabet?
- SGScott Galloway
Uh, staggering. Uh, and I'm talking about my own book here.
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
Every year, I make a big tech stock pick.
- KSKara Swisher
You did this month.
- SGScott Galloway
And it's based on, it's based on valuation. And, uh, okay, the existential threat, you know, quote-unquote, "search" is being undermined by AI. Search revenue, search revenue grew 12%. (laughs) Their search, this company that, this, quote-unquote, "technology" that is supposedly being disrupted by AI, it grew double digits. YouTube up 13%, Cloud up 32%. They have five different businesses-
- KSKara Swisher
As you've noted.
- SGScott Galloway
... that could be independent, independent companies.
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
And they have Search, uh, an unbelievable display ad network, YouTube, subscriptions, and seven products that have o- over two billion users. Search, Maps, Gmail, Android, Chrome, Play Store and YouTube. And now their new growth vehicle is Waymo, which is by far the most dominant autonomous player with more than 100 million total miles logged on, on public roads. In addition, this company trades at, I think the average S&P company trades at a PE multiple of 26. So Google, which is growing faster than the S&P, much faster, and has this incredible, incredible leadership, is cheaper than the average S&P company. And pick your average S&P company. I always say it's Dow Chemical or PNG. Great companies, call them the average. Would you rather have autonomous and YouTube than, you know, uh, Tide? I mean, it, this company relative ... The existential threat or the overhang of the existential threat of AI has been vastly exaggerated at Alphabet. And then if you look at the IP they have and the investments they're making, and they announced, they announced massive CapEx here that, you know, they're just gonna, they're gonna build. We're gonna get there just on money. They've announced that they're increasing their CapEx up to 85 billion from 75. Microsoft is at 80. Meta is between 64 and 72, and Amazon is up to 100 billion. But if you wanna talk about CapEx going into AI, you know, a lot of Amazon CapEx goes into boring shit like f- you know, like distribution centers and planes and things. Uh, so what do you have? You have unbelievable businesses that continue to grow. You have, uh, th- the, probably some of the deepest IP around AI, you have a cloud business growing 33% a year, and a company that's trading at a lower multiple than the S&P. So anyway, I'm very bullish.
- KSKara Swisher
I would agree. One of the things you, uh, everyone focuses so much on Mark Zuckerberg overpaying for talent. I would look at Google. Like I think he's gonna maybe blow the money in that regard, in, in terms of catching up. He thinks he can do it by this brute force research essentially. It's just not possible.
- SGScott Galloway
Are you talking about-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
... Sundar or, or-
- 24:50 – 30:23
XAI Raising Capital For Nvidia Chips
- KSKara Swisher
Anyway, let- speaking of which, Elon's xAI is working to raise up to $12 billion in debt for a massive supply of Nvidia cli- uh, chips to help train and, uh, power Grok. Valor Equity Partners, whose founder has close ties to Musk, has been working with lenders to secure capital to lease the chips for the company. This is a big fucking play. First of all, Musk doesn't partner with anybody like OpenAI and the o- uh, and, and, uh, and the others. Anthropic. Uh, secondly, they're losing $13 billion.... it's, like, crazy how much money this thing is losing and almost no revenues. Um, and they're raising the money. And by the way, speaking of which, his money-making thing over at, at, uh, SpaceX. Paperwork sent to investors discussing a tender offer included an interesting risk factor that Elon Musk may return to politics. Uh, this feels like-
- SGScott Galloway
(laughs) I love that.
- KSKara Swisher
... this feels very-
- SGScott Galloway
I hope so. I hope so.
- KSKara Swisher
... shaky to me. Like, I can't believe-
- SGScott Galloway
He's running on the Hot Topic ticket.
- KSKara Swisher
I know. But one of the things is, this is a lot. The $13 billion he's raising 12. I mean, it's always good to bet on Elon, but I was like, "This guy's a high-wire act of all high-wire acts here," um, around the m- around all, everything he's doing. And then he over at SpaceX, which would y- we would assume would be his, his, uh, seat, cornice, um, his bearing wall, so to speak. Uh, he's really kicking it, kicking it in the foundations in a lot of ways with this political stuff. I don't know.
- SGScott Galloway
I, I don't think he has any choice. If you look at, uh, the guy's a brilliant guy, and there's... The reason he's the wealthiest per- there's, there's a myth, and I hate it when usually venture capitalists or entrepreneurs say this, they get on stage and someone references their wealth or money or the stock price and they say, "You know, I never really thought about money. I just wanted to build-"
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
"... something great." These guys would fuck their sister for a nickel.
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
These guys are obsessed, obsessed with money. And let me be clear-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah. (laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
... if you want to have a lot of money, you need to be thinking about it all the time. Roger Federer thinks about tennis a lot. You know, these, y- you have to be... And I, I, I think young people, I love it when they talk about stocks. I try to be very open and transparent about my investments and how much money I've made or lost. You need to be financially, financially literate. And this guy understands the relationship between, uh, the means of production, revenues, profits, and also in an era of perception where essentially the multiple you get on whatever revenues you have is purely a function of the perception of you as an innovator. And this is where he has, between SpaceX, Tesla, and Twitter, he has about $1.4 trillion in value. The lion's share of that is $1 trillion in value from Tesla, and he looks at it and goes, "This is a $50 billion company pretending to be a trillion"-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, oh shit.
- SGScott Galloway
"... dollar market cap company."
- KSKara Swisher
He knows it, yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
The only thing he can do to possibly keep that trillion-dollar balloon from bursting is, is two words. First is A, second is I. So he is doing anything he can to try and figure out a way to establish the perception of AI leadership and wrap it around all of this shit. So he, he is not afraid to spend, he, he has... The only way this, his empire stays worth $1.4 trillion and he maintains his status as the wealthiest man in the world is to figure out a way for Tesla to get some perception or to get wrapped in an AI glove. So he doesn't care what it costs, and 13 billion, uh, Tesla, Tesla was down, what, 7%? Tesla lost 70 billion yesterday after their earnings. So 13 billion, uh, he can't spend money fast enough. Uh, if it, if someone comes in and says, "You know, I think this will give us a slight little bit of, little AI-"
- KSKara Swisher
Edge, yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
"... juju, but it's gonna cost a billion dollars and I have no idea if it's gonna work," green light it.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
Green light it.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
He has to get the AI veneer over this $1.35 trillion enterprise that is worth... SpaceX, I believe is worth 350 billion, Tesla 50, Twitter 10. I mean, he, he-
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
All he's thinking about is, "How do I keep Tesla, uh, in the limelight?" And the only thing he can do, again, is the AI Botox, brow lift, fractal laser here.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, I know. The o- the thing is with SpaceX, I think Trump can still do damage to it. There's, even though they said, "We can't live without it," I think they're trying to figure out a way to live without it, right? Now they're on that path. And so, that's even, uh, you know, and especially as he, if he returns into US politics, w- and it will be loudly, by the way, so it will take focus off of it. And, uh, I, that'll be a problem. And, and by the way, Peter Thiel is back spending money on politics, which he said he was getting out of quietly, right? Speaking of confi- quiet confidence, he, you know, that's what he's doing, um, where nothing is at risk. But I don't think E- Musk can resist himself. I think he's just the most high-wire act I've ever seen, and in some ways it's, I don't want to use the term admirable, but it's like Je- when I saw that number, I was like, "Jesus, this guy's..." Uh, good luck. I don't know if it's the galas that-
- SGScott Galloway
What number? The number he's on, on-
- KSKara Swisher
The $13 billion in losses.
- SGScott Galloway
Oh, I see.
- 30:23 – 37:08
Trump’s AI Action Plan
- KSKara Swisher
around AI. Scott, we're back with more news. Trump says he's removing the red tape around AI. The President spoke about his AI action plan, signed three executive orders at a summit hosted by the All-In Podcast in Washington this week. I wonder why they didn't invite us? The orders aim to fast-track, uh, permitting for data centers, which okay, promote American technology abroad, hmm, okay, and ban ideologically based AI systems from federal contracting. That's just stupid, but a little, a little meat for his base. Uh, one other thing Trump thinks is holding AI back, copyright law, incredibly. Let's, so he's kicked, uh, one industry in the, in the nuts. So let's listen to a clip.
- NANarrator
You can't be expected to have a successful AI program when every single article, book, or anything else that you've read or studied, you're supposed to pay for. "Gee, I read a book. I'm supposed to pay somebody." And, you know, we, we appreciate that-... but just can't do it because it's not doable. (screen whooshing)
- KSKara Swisher
Okay. This is amazing. I thought that was amazing. I thought the, the, the, the whole thing was kind of ridiculous hand-wavy stuff, and it was sort of basic basics of like, yes, we could have less regulation. But it essentially was Silicon Valley getting back its money first spending on Trump. That's what it looked like. And then he also went off script a number. He talked about trans athletes, he talked about tariffs, he talked about everything. But it looked like, uh, Silicon Valley was getting its bit. Um, D- David Sacks was sort of the leader of that and he's, he's on the All-In podcast. Um, but it's, uh ... Uh, that to me it, it was sort of a nothing burger. I think a lot of people didn't pay attention to it. It was very showy. Um, but e- essentially his minions, um, eh, his minions in tech getting the payback for what they've gotten. I don't think there was anything here except for the copyright law which was, like showed an astonishing lack of, of, of knowledge about the real problem here. So he's sort of giving the green light for tech to do what it did before. What are your thoughts?
- SGScott Galloway
I see this as just nothing but a, kind of a long term transfer of wealth from Los Angeles and New York to Silicon Valley. And that is if, if late night TV could go back in time, they would've partnered with every other high end, um, TV show and said, "We can't have YouTube crawl. We've all gotta bind together and license it for more money." 'Cause they'll take ... Uh, basically with YouTube, I can go see the best two minutes of Colbert and I don't have to endure 22 minutes of advertising through the hour. So they're basically ... And they let 'em do it, and the time to stop it would've been 10 or 15 years ago. And e- effectively what they're saying here is they're going back in time and saying, "Okay, these are ..." They're opting for Facebook's right or Google's right to crawl IP, slice it, dice it, and to a certain extent, probably make more shareholder value than the traditional media companies have been able to do. The problem is, is that journalism is weakening. The, an industry that employs more people is weakening. So it's, it's disruption but it's also ... All right. W- what is the incentive to do good work and create original IP and do investigative journalism if the asset-like companies that don't have to hire people or hire gaffers or sound people can just come in and crawl our data? And they claim that you couldn't do this. Well, actually the music industry's figured out a way to do it. Every radio station in America can crawl any song and then play it. But they pay a small fee, like probably a quarter of a cent, and every year they send a check to a royalty or an artist group that then says, "Okay, Madonna, here's your check for $685,000 from the radio stations in the Southeast." So they could've figured out h- ... In my opinion, this is him m- ... Uh, this is payback for Silicon Valley who said, "We wanna continue to, (laughs) to crawl and molest other people's data that they've spent money on, that they've risked their lives sometimes going into hotspots to cover reporting or ..." I mean, it's just a transfer of wealth to, uh, Silicon Valley by saying, "Okay. AI needs to run, you know, needs to run flat out with no friction, not have to pay anybody else, crawl books, crawl music and it, it ... We get to do it." And y- the argument you would make is that Ame- part of America's leadership from market capitalization standpoint, innovation standpoint is that we err on the side of a lack of regulation. So that is a real argument. And also you could argue, "Okay, so we're stealing a dollar from the garage of Warner Brothers but we can take that dollar we're stealing and turn it into seven whereas they can t- ... They turn it into 50 cents." So there is sort of an economic argument or an innovator's argument that this is good for AI. Let our, let our thoroughbreds run. But we've been to this movie before folks. Just keep in mind, don't let your kids go into original IP or art or creative because now AI can just crawl it and doesn't have to pay you back.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah. Well, the problem is I don't think he's necessarily gonna ... I, i- he's just saying this whether it's g- ... N- you know. Everything he says like, "I'm gonna take the commanders out." But he's not. He's not. And the l- for example, on Monday, Josh Hawley and, uh, from Missouri and Senator Blumenthal, uh, Richard Blumenthal from Connecticut, Democrat, Repub- Republican, Democrat, unveiled legislation that would require AI companies to, to, to get consent of individuals for using their content and data and developing it. This is not going to ... Copyright law is quite robust in that regard. And so just 'cause Trump says it's not so, first of all, he's as dumb as a box of hammers but, um, but they also didn't ... By the way, they didn't mention deepfakes in this thing which is supposed to be their big thing. They didn't mention like so many things were out of this thing. It was just a show. It was such a, such a nothing burger of a, of an everything. Um, and one of the things that n- you know, especially around ... And I have to say G- Governor Newsom who is, has on point social media these days, um, wrote, "President Trump's executive order on AI threatens to defund states like California with strong laws against AI generated child porn. Some might say that's an interesting priority, particularly in light of his close ties with Jeffrey Epstein." I thought that was (laughs) quite good, this picture of him with Jeffrey Epstein. Um, so I don't know if this is gonna be such an easy thing that I know the, the tech companies would like to get out of this, but I don't think they are. I don't think ... In this case, copyright is quite strong. I think there's a lot of supporters of that even if ... And not just, uh, you know, media. I think it's movies. There's lots and lots and lots of s- pe- people that still have some juice. Um, and we'll see if they can do that. They also were showing some signs of weakness. SoftBank and OpenAI's $500 million Stargate project intended to boost USAI is facing setbacks over disagreements about key terms of the deal including where to build data centers. The companies pledged to immediately invest $100 billion in the project in January but they only plan right now is to build a small data center by the (laughs) end of the year. It's pretty pathetic actually. It would have probably cost tens of millions of dollars, maybe 50. Like just 'cause Trump says it, like a lot of things, doesn't mean it's happening and this AI thing was incredibly weak sauce I thought. I was sort of like, "Well, I wasn't invited but I'm kinda glad I wasn't." Um,
- 37:08 – 46:24
Columbia Makes a Deal with Trump
- KSKara Swisher
and it just looked like a payoff to me. Um, um, the one that I thought was more disturbing was Columbia University agreeing to pay $200 million fine to resolve the Trump Administration's investigation into alleged violations of federal anti-discrimination laws and all this kinds of stuff around DEI. It essentially gave, uh, Trump an ability to-... to me- the government an ability to meddle in, in emissions. And so I just love your thought on that, uh, because I, you know, I, I know you, you, you know, you, you talk about the over, uh, use of DEI programs, et cetera. This seems like, uh, like a first th- The first, uh, th- uh, the founding fathers did not, like, were not worried about woke, they were worried about this. This is what they actually ... I mean, they're, they ... It's annoying, but it's different than what is happening here, which is a clear violation of the government meddling in private enterprise. But go ahead.
- SGScott Galloway
Well, we've never had a president that's more socialist. He demands a golden share to control a steel company. He's doing one-off deals with companies. And now he's decided, if you want to appoint Supreme Court justices that overturn, uh, race-based affirmative action, which has happened, I get it. You may agree or not agree with that decision, but it's meant to be a thoughtful, slow, grinding process that affects every university. But when you show up and start threatening, using the full weight of the DOJ and government to go after individual universities, and then just make these vague statements that you want to have input into less politically correct admissions, that's just not how you run a government. It's not how ... It's so- it's, it's socialism, and then it's kind of th- thought control, uh, at-
- KSKara Swisher
Exactly.
- SGScott Galloway
... the places that are supposed to have the most freedom of thought. That is why they are so successful, is that we provide this ridiculous thing called tenure, which is very expensive, and, and occasionally someone says so- something so stupid they'd be fired anywhere else and we can't fire them, because the whole idea is, we built universities outside of the city center so people could say crazy shit like, "Well, maybe the world isn't flat," and not risk being burnt at the stake. And so when government starts coming in and telling the Admissions Department ... I th- Look, I do think that if you are going to provide millions of dollars in assistance and federally backed student loans, you do have some input, but that input should be systemic across all universities. I do believe that if you are not growing your freshman class faster than population growth, uh, and you have an endowment over a million dollars, you should lose your tax-free status, 'cause you're no longer a public servant, you're a hedge fund offering courses. And, and, and then I like the carrot idea. Offer, instead of student debt relief, offer, uh, capital investment if they, one, keep their tuition flat for 10 years, and two, increase their enrollments by 3%. What do you end up with? College in the '80s, where the admissions rates are double what they are now, and on an inflation-adjusted basis, tuition comes down by a third. And then force them to have non-four year degrees in things like nursing and specialty construction. So I am very much up for the federal government providing both sticks and carrots to, to reformat higher education such that it returns to its original mission of increasing the likelihood that middle class, unremarkable kids have a shot. I'm, I'm all about reform, and quite frankly, I'm all about showing up and saying, "Oh, we're not asking." But the way you do that is by passing laws.
- KSKara Swisher
Mm-hmm.
- SGScott Galloway
And then everyone is subject-
- KSKara Swisher
That's correct.
- SGScott Galloway
... to these laws. Not going after-
- KSKara Swisher
But they-
- SGScott Galloway
... Columbia 'cause they-
- KSKara Swisher
That's the same thing.
- SGScott Galloway
... pissed you off.
- KSKara Swisher
Let me tell you, with the Epstein things, they're not interested in the victims. They're not. That, that's no-
- SGScott Galloway
Yeah, that's not why they're there.
- KSKara Swisher
That's not why they're there. And you know why? Trump is not at these universities to make them better. If they made a mistake around not protecting Jewish students, fine them for that, like, and tell them they have to fix something. That's a very s- easy fix, right? And this, but this is something very different, and it's a, it's a, uh, the, the government should not be telling universities who to, who, who, what to, what to say. Just period. Period, period, period. And again, this, the ... I think you're e- exactly right. It should be based on, on finances versus race, maybe, and that will fix the problem anyway probably. Um, but it should certainly, um ... This is such an overreach, it's crazy. And go to Columbia. I went to Columbia, by the way, for graduate school, and I, uh, they will never see another ... I, I don't give them money anyway, so they'll never ever see m- money from me. It's, they're embar- they're an embarrassment to their, to their long and storied history. But it's an embarrassment for Columbia. And I hope Harvard and others, as much pressure as they're under, do- don't fall prey to this kind of nonsense, 'cause it's not ... It doesn't make these universities better to let more white people in (laughs) . It just doesn't. It just, it's not, it's not, it doesn't solve the problem that we have here. But they don't care. They don't care about the victims and Epstein, they don't care about ... They don't care about AI and having a really robust AI system. They just want to get what's, what's good for them.
- SGScott Galloway
Their instincts in some ways are correct. It's again the execution is wrong.
- KSKara Swisher
Not the government's business.
- SGScott Galloway
60 years ago, 12 Black people at Harvard, Princeton, and Ye- Yale combined, that was a problem, race-based affirmative action. Now, 60% of Harvard's freshman class identifies as nonwhite, but the problem is-
- KSKara Swisher
Rich.
- SGScott Galloway
... 70% of those nonwhites come from upper income households.
- KSKara Swisher
Right.
- SGScott Galloway
Most, most Republicans and all Demograts- Democrats agree that there are some people who face such incredible headwinds through no fault of their own, that if the government gives them a hand up, okay, we're down with that. The question is, and all the argument is over, is who qualifies for the hand up? And Tyler Perry and Trevor Noah's kids should not get a hand up.
- KSKara Swisher
Right.
- SGScott Galloway
There has been, quite frankly, and this triggers people, too much advantage shoved into the kids of nonwhite parents. Those are the ones getting the most advantage right now. And a lot of good kids have been pushed out by foreign students and by, quite frankly, wealthy, wealthy nonwhites, and they've said, "Okay, uh, fine. Uh, w- we need to, we need to reconfigure affirmative action," as the University of California did, and they made it an adversity index. But this says to the white community who's poor and from single parents, "You got the same shot. We're gonna lift you up," and at the same time says, "Okay, okay, you know, uh, Tyler Perry's kid, sorry, you have the same advantages as a rich white kid."
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah, but except Scott, they never address the white kid rich kids, right? They never like go, "Oh, wait a minute." Like, it's always like, "Okay, now-"
- SGScott Galloway
Well, they're talking about doing away with legacies.
- KSKara Swisher
Yeah.
- SGScott Galloway
They're, the-
- KSKara Swisher
Yes.
- SGScott Galloway
They-
- 46:24 – 1:00:07
Predictions
- KSKara Swisher
Um, all right. We have to take a quick break and we'll be back for predictions. Okay, Scott. Let's hear a prediction. I just wanna ... Uh, I ... There's one that I could throw out at you. President Trump met with Jeff Bezos at the White House last week in a meeting that lasted over an hour. What do you predict they were talking about?
- SGScott Galloway
I, I predict Trump wants in on the bachelor party. I don't-
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
(laughs)
- KSKara Swisher
Didn't that already happen?
- SGScott Galloway
Um, did it? I didn't hear about that. I would've been so good at that.
- KSKara Swisher
Would you have a post-marriage bachelor party? Lauren's not putting up with that shit.
- SGScott Galloway
Oh, yeah. It's called a mid-life crisis. It's called a second marriage and daddy getting together with his friends every six weeks. My prediction ... I already made my prediction. The fix is in. Someone has communicated to Ghislaine Maxwell that if, i- i- if she were to provide states' evidence or testimony that in any way reflects well on the president, that the president has a habit of pardoning people towards the end of his administration. And there's nothing like jail to convince you to lie and do whatever you need to do to get out of jail. Uh, I think the fix is in. Uh, the ... What we're gonna have is something resembling a ... It'll be a kangaroo court where they took testimony and pretend to take it seriously, pretend they're pursuing the truth. And all evidence from Ghislaine Maxwell will show that the president, while was a friend and, uh, showed errors in judgment, was not involved in any illicit or illegal activity. And then on the eve before Trump, uh, uh, you know, takes off and JD Vance is elected president or, or in my opinion, if I were to bet on anyone right now, and I might do this on polymarket, is someone you mentioned earlier. People vastly underestimate Governor Newsom. He is the only one pushing back right now. I believe if I had to bet on anyone, he would be the president. But anyways, whoever 30 days before the, the president, uh, the next president is inaugurated, she will be pardoned.
- KSKara Swisher
Uh-huh. Okay. Well, we'll see. Um, just so you know, two things. Ghislaine Maxwell's a li- is a liar. She faced two perjury charges stemming from these accusations. She lied under oaths around Epstein. They dropped those things because they, they had a ... She also had sex trafficking convictions she received in December 2021. So, let me just say, she's a sex trafficker. So, think about that, people, that he's gonna let off a sex, a convicted sex trafficker, uh, who is probably just as equally, um, uh, uh, uh, uh, e- e- she doesn't get as much attention, but she was equally culpable in what happened.
- SGScott Galloway
We need a special counsel with Matt Gaetz.
- KSKara Swisher
(laughs)
- SGScott Galloway
I mean, are we in a simulation here?
- KSKara Swisher
Uh, I know.
- SGScott Galloway
Literally, are we in a simulation?
- KSKara Swisher
I, I just am like, Ghislaine Maxwell's a terrible person and should die in prison. And, um, and she, uh, and again, the focus is off the people it should be on, which is these young women who are terrified now 'cause the president is trying to cover this up. And that's what the president's doing. He's trying to cover up a sex trafficking, uh, scandal, uh, that, that hi- where his name is involved. And so, uh, the, th- everybody ... Uh, all this stuff, whether you're gonna get Trump or not get Trump, just remember all these possibly a hundr- uh, po- hundreds of women they think were sexually abused here and that, that is lost in this entire thing.
- SGScott Galloway
Even, even worse. Hundreds of girls.
- KSKara Swisher
Girls. Exactly.
- SGScott Galloway
Uh, people have-
- KSKara Swisher
And-
- SGScott Galloway
People have correctly corrected me and said these are not underage women. They're girls.
- KSKara Swisher
That's correct. They're girls. And that is what we should be focusing on and we never have, and these, these p- they're women now. They're older. They, th- they're not here ... They, they have been traumatized and, and Trump is further traumatizing them with this fucking circus. And that's what we need to focus in on. That's my ... Uh, and we won't. My prediction is we won't because we don't value the lives of young women.... um, as we, much as we do, is rich, old, syphilitic. These are syphilitic men. Anyway, your prediction? Th- that she's gonna be the, th- th- that this is gonna happen. That she's gonna-
- SGScott Galloway
The fix is in.
- KSKara Swisher
... fix is in.
- SGScott Galloway
She's gonna be pardoned 30 to 60 days before the end of his term. And, uh-
- KSKara Swisher
Tell everybody she's a liar and a sex trafficker, so take it that for the, for the thing. Anyway, okay. All right. But it won't come till the end, you're saying? Won't come till the end of the administration.
- SGScott Galloway
Well, I, uh, I, I, I think he, uh, that he'll create some distance to try and lower the volume on the outrage. But the fix was in, and this woman basically came out and lied and took the heat down. Yeah, what the fuck do you care? Pardon her. That... The fix is in.
- KSKara Swisher
It's repulsive.
- SGScott Galloway
The fix is in.
- KSKara Swisher
I lo- all I'll just say is remember the girls, of all of them.
- SGScott Galloway
And, usually-
Episode duration: 1:00:07
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