Feel Empty No Matter What You Do? THIS Is Why (And the 3 Steps That Actually Work)

1. 0:00 – 0:47

   Happiness as a byproduct: the three-legged stool framework

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee0:00

      I heard your conversation with Mo in the hotel room last night, which was fantastic. So good. And I agree with what you and Mo were saying. Happiness is a choice when you understand what happiness really is.

   2. SPSpeaker0:15

      What is it?

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee0:17

      It's not a thing that you can get to. It's not something that you can pursue directly. It's something that ensues when you do the right things. And the right things for me are when you focus on the three... It, I, I call core happiness this three-legged stool. Alignment, contentment, control. You can apply it to anything in life. I, I think that's what happiness is, and I

2. 0:47 – 1:31

   Why meaning isn’t the same as happiness (and where purpose fits)

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee0:47

      think we are pursuing it. Like, people say we shouldn't be purs- uh, we shouldn't be going after happiness, we should be going after meaning.

   2. SPSpeaker0:53

      Mm.

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee0:53

      Have you heard that?

   4. SPSpeaker0:54

      Yeah. Yeah, all the time.

   5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee0:55

      Right. I have a different perspective.

   6. SPSpeaker0:58

      Mm.

   7. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:00

      Meaning and purpose is really important, no question. But I don't think that's happiness. It's meaning.

   8. SPSpeaker1:07

      Mm.

   9. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:08

      Right? It's a necessary ingredient for happiness, but it's not happiness in and of itself. And I don't mean to be controversial, but let's say, um, a soldier fighting in World War II against the Nazis, right? One might make the case that that has meaning. Doesn't mean they're happy.

   10. SPSpeaker1:31

       100%.

3. 1:31 – 2:34

   Ikigai: inspiring for some, demoralizing for others

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:31

      Right, so meaning and happiness are subtly different. Have you heard of the Japanese concept of ikigai?

   2. SPSpeaker1:35

      Yes. Yeah, yeah.

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:36

      Right. I love ikigai. This idea that, um, you know, we should be looking... not should be, but we could be looking for something in our life that we enjoy, that we're good at, that's what the world needs, and the, what pays us money, right? The, the kind of holy grail, as it were. And I, I remember writing about this in my second book on stress. I remember the book came out and I was in London, I was giving, uh, a talk, and at the end of the talk we were doing Q&A.

   4. SPSpeaker2:02

      Mm.

   5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:03

      I remember at the back right of the hall, this young lady had her hand up and she said, "Dr. Chatterjee, I'm an 18-year-old Japanese student living in London. I've grown up with the concept of ikigai my entire life, and frankly, I've found it demoralizing, demotivating, too high a bar for me to get to." And that stuck with me, mate, because I thought since then, "Okay, that's so interesting," 'cause I love this concept of ikigai. She grows up with it and finds it off-putting.

4. 2:34 – 3:55

   Alignment in everyday life: values-driven actions even in a job you hate

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:34

      I think the problem with these grand ideas of meaning, purpose, ikigai, as much as I like them, they're not for everyone. Someone, someone might be hearing that in a call center right now. They don't like their job. They're doing it and they're like, "What? Ikigai? Are you kidding me, mate? [laughs] I just wanna get through and, and pay the bills." Right? So I think, I bring it all back. Is this core happiness tool that I've created, is it applicable in all situations? I think it is, because if you look at it through the lens of what we're talking about, this comes under alignment. So that chap working in the call center, they do the exercise and they figure out kindness is something that's really important to them. Then if on the way to work they stop in the coffee shop and they're kind to the barista, they get on the bus to work and they're kind to the bus driver. They go to the job they don't particularly like, but they are kind to their colleagues and their boss. They're living an aligned life. They're living with meaning. It doesn't mean that the job that they're in currently is the job that they love and they're gonna be in forever, but they're living in harmony with who they are, and that's going to mean that meaning and purpose come naturally as a byproduct.

   2. SPSpeaker3:47

      Mm.

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee3:47

      So I want people to really focus on alignment. It's one pillar of happiness, and I think your meaning and purpose will come.

5. 3:55 – 5:59

   Control: the overlooked pillar that reduces stress and improves health

   1. SPSpeaker3:55

      Can you talk to me about control as well?

   2. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee3:58

      I thought long and hard about this word control, and I ummed and ahhed. Was it the right word to use? And I spoke to some of my patients, I spoke to some of my friends, and I really think it is when we understand. It's about what are the things that I can do in my life that gives me a sense of control? We know from the scientific research, when you have a sense of control, right, you have better relationships. You have longer relationships. You're healthier. You have lower stress levels. You live longer. So it's that sense of control and, and that could mean many things to, to different people. You know, for me, I'm really big on morning routines, right? I know for me, if I get up early, if I have time to myself to have a little routine, I've, I've almost got this, like, resilient bubble around me. Doesn't matter what's going on in the world, doesn't matter how bad work may or, or may not get that day, I've got an element of control because I've, I've sort of nurtured that routine for myself. So that's one, that's one way that people can think about control. An- another way people might wanna think about control is- If it feels like you've forgotten how to feel joy, like you're surviving and not really living, I've created a free guide to help you. Because happiness isn't something you chase. It's something you train your brain to feel. I've created a free guide, The Happiness Prescription, 5 Daily Rituals That Rewire Your Brain for Joy. These are the exact rituals I've used with many of my patients to help them feel alive again, even in the middle of stress, fatigue, or loss. To get your free guide now, click the first link in the description box below or scan the QR code on screen. Um, there's a, and there's a chapter in the book called Talk to Strangers, which is basically this idea that actually relationships are very important, of course,

6. 5:59 – 7:44

   Small social interactions that rewire safety: sociometer, strangers, and control

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee5:59

      but there's kind of two different kinds of relationships. There are the, the deep, nurturing, intimate relationships, but there's also the... There's also those kind of-Almost trivial interactions that we have day to day.

   2. SPSpeaker6:12

      Mm.

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee6:13

      Right? So when you say hi to the barista or, you know, I said hi to your work colleagues when I got here, those little things, they are not trivial. There's a network in your brain called the sociometer, right? It's constantly detecting your external world for threats. And when it receives positive information like a smile, like a, you know, a, a bit of a nod, a handshake, you know, it, it, it sort of relaxes. You, you, your, your stress levels go down. You feel a sense of connection with the world around you. Coming back to control, you feel that the external world is safe.

   4. SPSpeaker6:52

      Safe. Yeah.

   5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee6:52

      I've got a degree of control. There is order in the world. Let's focus on these simple things you can do each day. If you say hi to the Amazon delivery driver and smile at them, say thank you to the barista and say a few nice words to them, say hi to the bus driver and smile at them, thank the postman, you are working on your happiness.

   6. SPSpeaker7:13

      Mm.

   7. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee7:14

      You know, it seems trivial, but it's not. The research is so, so clear, right? Because it gives you a sense of control. Second pillar of the three.

   8. SPSpeaker7:23

      And we've got to touch on the third pillar before I start getting into all of these topics, 'cause so f- it's so interesting that these are the things that, you know, we're talking about today because I think I spent all weekend, um, reading about studies on the importance of, you call it the sociometer in the brain, but just that, that thing that connects you with your tribe. But please do get into the third point, which I think you said was contentment.

7. 7:44 – 8:11

   Contentment: calm, peace, and being at peace with your choices

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee7:44

      Contentment. Yeah.

   2. SPSpeaker7:45

      Yeah.

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee7:46

      Contentment is about feeling calm and that sense of peace when you're at peace with your life and you're at peace with your decisions. So what things in your life give you that sense of contentment? And I, and I really feel it's these three things, when you put them all together, the side effect of doing them-

   4. SPSpeaker8:08

      Mm

   5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee8:09

      ... is you're happy.

   6. SPSpeaker8:10

      Yeah.

8. 8:11 – 9:14

   Redefining happiness: pleasure vs core happiness (including grief)

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee8:11

      Right? But, but also happiness is not often what we think it is, that, that big billboard image of the, the happy family on the beach with a smile on their face and the ocean behind them, right?

   2. SPSpeaker8:24

      Mm.

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee8:25

      That to me is not happiness. That's a pleasurable experience.

   4. SPSpeaker8:30

      Yeah.

   5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee8:30

      It can form part of a happy life, but that's not happiness. You can be sad and happy. The way I look at happiness, core happiness... I was thinking about this last week. I was chatting to someone who, who was going through grief. You know, someone very close to them had died. And, you know, we were having a really long, deep conversation, but they were present with their grief, and they were able to share with me exactly how they were feeling. No masks on at all in terms of these kind of metaphorical masks that we put on. They were just being themselves. That's core happiness.

   6. SPSpeaker9:13

      Mm.

9. 9:14 – 11:37

   Living intentionally: define success for yourself, not society

   1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee9:14

      Because they're aligned, right? Their inner thoughts are, "I feel sad, upset, frustrated for my loss," and their external actions are completely aligned with that. So I kind of feel really what happiness is about is living an intentional life.

   2. SPSpeaker9:35

      Mm.

   3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee9:36

      It's about taking the time to understand who you are, defining for yourself what happiness is or what success looks like, not using society's definition. You posted a few days ago, "Don't use society's definition of fun."

   4. SPSpeaker9:49

      Mm.

   5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee9:49

      Right? That was a great post. You know, just 'cause society says to have fun you need to go to a bar, have loud music on, and get drunk, well, if you like to sit at home in the bath reading a good book, that, that's great. And if you don't, that's fine as well. But it's got to be you. It's your values. So one of the most important pillars for our health is, of course, nutrition. But I think because of our busy, stressed out lives, so many people are struggling despite their best intentions. So many patients over the years have told me that they know what they should be doing, but they're struggling to actually do it. And that's why I'm a fan of AG1. AG1 is a daily health drink that contains over 70 vitamins, minerals, and other ingredients that are designed to make nutrition really easy. It's been in my own life for over six years now. It's simple, it's tasty, it's convenient, and it forms a part of my morning routine. People will routinely tell me that taking AG1 regularly has improved their focus, their cognition, their energy. Some people even tell me that they drink less coffee when they're taking AG1. And there's research out there showing us that taking AG1 regularly can improve specific markers of your gut health, which is really good for your immune health. So if you're looking to upgrade your own nutrition in a simple, tasty, and convenient way, try AG1. To get a free bottle of vitamin D and five free travel packs, go to drinkag1.com/livemore. I can't tell someone what they need to necessarily do in all aspects of their, of their life to be happy. But be intentional about your life.

10. 11:37 – 12:27

    Healing and self-awareness before change: insecurity as a ‘counterforce’

    1. SPSpeaker11:37

       You know, when people give, um, advice in their books and, you know, when I do it online with my content, there's something which I realize has to be done first. So as much as you could have told me to get into alignment, the, the counterforce that was saying, "Fuck that," was this deep sense of insecurity and that piece of work I had to do, as you describe it, to heal first before I could start looking with a clear view at, um, the way I was living my life. Because if you'd asked Steve Bartlett at 18 years old what his values were, you know, he would've said, "Lamborghini. Next question." He would've said, "Money," right? I know those aren't even values, but that's what would, he would've said, right? So I'm interested to, to know how you think someone can go on the journey of healing, um, and understanding themselves and self-awareness, which I think is the foundation-

    2. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee12:24

       Yeah

    3. SPSpeaker12:24

       ... of then all the, the pillars you mentioned of happiness.

11. 12:27 – 14:35

    Step 1—Awareness: all behaviors serve a need (why willpower fails)

    1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee12:27

       It's a great question. Um, I don't think it's gonna be you listen to this conversation, you watch it on YouTube, you get the book, whatever. I don't think it's that you do that and then you're like, "Oh, I've got it. I've figured it out now. I know my values." Okay, great. No, no, this is a journey.

    2. SPSpeaker12:45

       Mm.

    3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee12:46

       It's the best journey you'll ever take, but it's a journey. It's not a one-hit. The first step in any change is awareness. All behaviors serve a need. Right? Every behavior we have is there for a reason. You can't just... I can't just tell a patient, "You should drink less alcohol," without helping them understand why do they need to be drinking that alcohol in the first place, right? It took me ages to, to figure this out with dots. I think, "Why, why, why am I struggling? Why do they stop for two weeks and then they, they get back on the horse?" It's like, oh, we've not dealt with the underlying need. It's like New Year's resolutions, right?

    4. SPSpeaker13:29

       Mm.

    5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee13:29

       No one has a problem going spending four times a week for the first two weeks in January.

    6. SPSpeaker13:34

       [laughs]

    7. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee13:34

       But third week, fourth week, when life gets busy and life gets stressful, or, or they can give up booze for a couple of weeks, and then they just can't keep it going. It's like, "You know, I need it to unwind from my workday." That's because your alcohol consumption is a symptom of the way you're living your life. If you want to change that, you can try and white-knuckle it and reduce it. Sure, you might be successful for a short period of time, but you'll always go back unless you understand the behavior. S- same thing kind of works for food cravings a lot of the time. So if someone's listening to this and they go, "Okay, I wanna know what to do," but even if they're starting to challenge themselves already and go, "You know what? I'm pretty interested in what these two guys are saying. You know, I don't kind of know what my values are, but I've got a feeling that I'm not living life in accordance with them. Like, I think I'm chasing the wrong stuff, but I don't quite know what to do about that." Even that awareness is progress, right? So I think that's really important. We, we can't always just

12. 14:35 – 15:35

    Practical tools: the Identity Menu and values check-in

    1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee14:35

       find it out, get to the solution, go and live happy lives. It doesn't work like that. So step one is awareness. Now, if you have that awareness and you want to go further, a simple thing you might wanna do is what I call the identity menu in the book. You might literally want to try and write down three values or even one value. Start with one. Right? Start with one. Right? Just write down one value, and then in a week's time, ask yourself how often in that week did you live in accordance with that? How often in that week did you live in a way that was not in harmony with that? Okay, it's not about beating yourself up. It's not about holding yourself to this, uh, unattainable ideal. It's just ask yourself the question. Just gently start compassionately probing what's going on, right? So I think that's a useful exercise, and build up to three values if you can. And, you know, these things need reassessing. The other exercise I like, uh, which I think is really practical, it, it's got two parts. It's called define

13. 15:35 – 19:06

    The ‘Happiness Habits’ and ‘Happy Ending’ exercises (live example)

    1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee15:35

       your happiness habits and write your happy ending, right? And if, if you want, we could try it actually.

    2. SPSpeaker15:41

       Let's do it.

    3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee15:42

       If you're up for it. So-

    4. SPSpeaker15:42

       I love doing this one.

    5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee15:44

       So I would ask you, Stephen, think of three things-

    6. SPSpeaker15:47

       Yeah

    7. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee15:48

       ... that really bring you a sense of happiness, deep calm and contentment, and that you really feel good.

    8. SPSpeaker15:54

       Um, so I think one of them, which I've actually read about in your book, is about h- serving others and helping others. It, it feels to me like a, a h- a happiness rush or a sense of fulfillment or contentment that I can't seem to get anywhere else. The other one is, like, pursuing my artistic interests. So things like when I... You can see my DJing equipment over in the corner there. When I do my DJing or when I s- give, give time to myself to write or create works.

    9. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee16:21

       Okay.

    10. SPSpeaker16:22

        I call that, like, expression. That's like-

    11. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee16:24

        Yeah.

    12. SPSpeaker16:24

        Um, and then I think the third one is, is what I think you call in your book, like, movement. So moving. So, um, exercise.

    13. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee16:33

        Okay.

    14. SPSpeaker16:33

        When I go to the gym and I... And I'm not sure why that is, 'cause this might fit into a number of categories because in, in part it's, like, meditative. When I'm on the running machine or on the, on the Peloton, it's really meditative. On the other part, it's, has its obviously physiological impacts-

    15. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee16:46

        Yeah

    16. SPSpeaker16:46

        ... and biological impacts of the exercise. And then on the third part, it might just be because I'm giving time to myself. So I'd say those are the three that came to mind straight away as-

    17. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee16:54

        Yeah.

    18. SPSpeaker16:54

        Yeah.

    19. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee16:54

        Okay. So you've, you've picked what I call three happiness habits.

    20. SPSpeaker16:58

        Yeah.

    21. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee16:59

        Right? So each week, and please correct me if I've misinterpreted any of this.

    22. SPSpeaker17:02

        Mm.

    23. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee17:04

        Um, each week if you could do something that serves others-

    24. SPSpeaker17:06

        Yeah

    25. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee17:06

        ... if you could engage in your artistic, um, passions-

    26. SPSpeaker17:11

        Yeah

    27. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee17:12

        ... and you could do a form of movement you enjoy-

    28. SPSpeaker17:14

        Yeah

    29. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee17:15

        ... they are three things that would give you, you know, a real sense of happiness.

    30. SPSpeaker17:18

        So I believe. [laughs]
14. 19:06 – 22:21

    Bringing it together: alignment without shame, one step at a time

    1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee19:06

       This is something I think we can all benefit from, myself included, on a regular basis. It doesn't mean you can automatically change the entire trajectory of your life, but it does mean, this is about intention, right?

    2. SPSpeaker19:16

       Mm.

    3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee19:16

       It's like, if that's what the goal is at the end, well, like for me, I know three happiness habits for me are what, number one, spending undistracted time with my wife and my children each week.

    4. SPSpeaker19:32

       Mm.

    5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee19:32

       That's really important. Number two, doing something that helps improve the health and wellbeing of others.

    6. SPSpeaker19:38

       Mm.

    7. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee19:39

       Really important. Number three, having time to pursue things that I'm passionate about. That's kind of my three. I'm doing the, the, the final piece.

    8. SPSpeaker19:50

       The 30,000 foot.

    9. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee19:51

       Yeah.

    10. SPSpeaker19:52

        Yeah, the 30,000.

    11. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee19:52

        So I know each week then, for happiness habits, if I have, let's say, five meals around the dinner table with my wife and kids, that's where there's no phones and we're totally undistracted and in the moment, right? I know that I'm, I'm doing that. I know if I record an episode of my podcast each week, I know that I'm doing something that's gonna improve the lives of other people.

    12. SPSpeaker20:17

        Mm-hmm.

    13. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee20:17

        And if I have time to, I don't know, play guitar, play snooker, um, you know, whatever, you know, I've got all kinds of creative passions each week, then I know that if I just consistently do that just a little bit each week, I'm getting to the happy ending that I want.

    14. SPSpeaker20:34

        Mm.

    15. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee20:35

        And for that person who may be listening to this and struggling, that may be something else that they can start doing, you know? And it, what's really interesting, Steven, is we think, we, we think we're all quite different. There was a study from last year which showed us that actually, despite all our differences, we feel as if we're being our true, authentic selves when we're being kind, compassionate, doing things for others, enthusiastic, present, and in the moment, right? All of us. And what, what, what I love about these exercises, they really bring awareness and intention to your life. You could say, "Yeah, I really value health. I really value my health and wellbeing." And then they can assess their life and go, "I'm doing nothing each week to support that. I say that's who I am, but I'm not." You can say, as I did for many years, "I valued my friends. You know what? I got so busy with work, I wasn't making time to see them." And again, it's not about beating yourself up. This is really, really important point. This is about honesty and awareness, right? You're never going to become the person who you want to be until you know who is the person you are right now. It's not about guilt. It's not about shame. It's about just transparency, going, "Okay. All right. I'm not aligned at the moment. Okay, fine. No problem. I'm gonna take one step this week. I'm going to make an effort once a week. I'm gonna phone one of my best mates just for 10 minutes just to say hi." Even that is, it's helping you become more aligned. It's helping you get to that happy ending. So, you know, maybe there's some useful stuff in there for people to kind of take and actually start applying.

    16. SPSpeaker22:09

        Mm. If you enjoyed that short clip, I think you are really going to enjoy the full conversation, which you can check out here. [upbeat music]

Episode duration: 22:30