Parul Singh Details Late AuDHD Diagnosis

1. 0:00 – 2:48

   Trailer

   1. PSParul Singh0:00

      So talking therapies is too subjective for an autistic person. You're like, "How do you feel about that?" I don't know. Why don't you give me an emotion wheel? Maybe that will help

   2. APAlex Partridge0:07

      Parul Singh

   3. PSParul Singh0:08

      Founder of Parallel Minds A neurodiversity consultancy On a mission to build a bright future for people in tech

   4. APAlex Partridge0:15

      You've had a autism diagnosis.

   5. PSParul Singh0:17

      Yeah.

   6. APAlex Partridge0:17

      Was that a surprise?

   7. PSParul Singh0:18

      I cried after my autism assessment, actually. But the thing which really hit me hard with that one is my difficulty with friendships. There's a lot of people who I know who are still friends with people from school. That always hit me with a little bit of sadness 'cause I was like, "Did I do something wrong?" I never felt like I was the friend that people felt was worth actually keeping. I spend 95% of my waking time accommodating and adapting to the people around me, and doing things like their way or saying things that they want to do, and just really overthinking things. So if you're worried about people treating you, like, differently, are those your people? Now, my only genuine friendships have come after being open with my neurodivergence because they're with other neurodivergent people who just get it.

   8. APAlex Partridge1:05

      This episode is dedicated to anyone with amazing intuition, so when that person who everyone loves turns out to be a plonker, you're there saying, "I told you so." [upbeat music] Just a gentle reminder that tapping the subscribe button helps us here at ADHD Chatter much more than you might realize. As our audience grows, it helps increase our chances of booking even more brilliant guests, full of amazing stories and helpful information. We're so proudly building a community here, and each and every one of our subscribers are valued members of our exclusive ADHD club. The more our community grows, the less we feel alone, so please subscribe. It will help us remind you that you're not broken, that you are and always were enough. Parul, thank you so much for coming back on the podcast. How have you been?

   9. PSParul Singh1:56

      I've been good, thank you, Alex. It's been just over a year and a bit. Whole world has changed, but you look exactly the same.

   10. APAlex Partridge2:04

       [laughs] Last time it was through a webcam, wasn't it? This is a little bit, it's a little bit of an upgrade in, in the setting, I suppose.

   11. PSParul Singh2:10

       Yeah. And when we recorded the last one, I actually... You did tell me, so it wasn't your fault, but I actually forgot that we were recording video, and I had my really big headphones on with, like-

   12. APAlex Partridge2:19

       Yes, you did

   13. PSParul Singh2:19

       ... the mic and stuff.

   14. APAlex Partridge2:20

       Yeah. Yeah

   15. PSParul Singh2:20

       And I looked like, I looked like I was like an air traffic controller or something, and I was like, "This is a lot more aesthetic, this amount, I think."

   16. APAlex Partridge2:27

       [laughs] Was it? Yeah, I do remember now. We covered quite a lot of fascinating stuff in the first episode.

   17. PSParul Singh2:31

       Mm.

   18. APAlex Partridge2:31

       Um, you've, you've, you've had a bit of a development-

   19. PSParul Singh2:34

       Mm-hmm

   20. APAlex Partridge2:34

       ... since our last chat. Um-

   21. PSParul Singh2:36

       Just a little one.

   22. APAlex Partridge2:37

       Just a little one.

   23. PSParul Singh2:38

       [laughs]

   24. APAlex Partridge2:39

       It's interesting. I usually ask everyone the same question, which is, what's your earliest memory of feeling different? But considering the development, I'm gonna start with another question.

2. 2:48 – 11:45

   When was your first memory of feeling like you might have ADHD?

   1. PSParul Singh2:48

      Mm-hmm.

   2. APAlex Partridge2:48

      And that's, what's your earliest memory of feeling like you have ADHD?

   3. PSParul Singh2:54

      Probably high school, I think, because I was very quick to pick things up in, in primary school, so there wasn't really any indication of, like, academic impact, actually. And it was only in, like, secondary school when I was forced to do things like history and art and stuff like that. And I have nothing against those as subjects, but my God, teachers really know how to make them boring.

   4. APAlex Partridge3:18

      [laughs]

   5. PSParul Singh3:19

      So I hated them, hated them so much. Terrible school reports. We talked about that a lot-

   6. APAlex Partridge3:23

      [laughs]

   7. PSParul Singh3:23

      ... I think in, like, the last podcast, so again, I won't sort of like actually like repeat it, but, um, the indication started to be, like, the, the academic impact actually, um, because what was impacting me inside internally was then becoming, like, externalized, and I knew I was very smart, and, you know, you get those, like, typical... Probably most people on here have had said a similar thing. Um, bright, doesn't apply themselves, has bags of potential. Like, that's a universal ADHD school experience, I think.

   8. APAlex Partridge3:56

      If there was like a, a s- a snippet of your school report, do you... What would that, if you could summarize it in the briefest way?

   9. PSParul Singh4:02

      Very good, um, glowing reports for things like science and maths-

   10. APAlex Partridge4:06

       Mm

   11. PSParul Singh4:06

       ... 'cause I loved them, and I didn't cause any trouble, but all the other ones were like, distracts herself, distracts others, doesn't do her homework, um, missing, missing lessons, causing trouble, et cetera, et cetera. So it, it wasn't actually consistent, but that's ADHD, isn't it? Inconsistency.

   12. APAlex Partridge4:25

       Do you re- like, do you remember feeling a sense of being different to other people at that age?

   13. PSParul Singh4:33

       I mean, I think I already f- felt and had experienced being different as somebody from, like, an ethnic minority already, um, because that's obviously, like, quite visible. You can't really, can't really hide it. But then feeling different because you maybe don't behave and interact with, like, the other children in, like, the same way. Like, maybe you want to do different things during, like, the break times, or maybe you have, like, different interests, and then maybe you're just actually like a little bit, like, a little bit weird. It's, I think it's very hard to put your finger on, like, that feeling and, like, quite sadly, actually, I don't have a lot of memories of my, like, childhood or probably even, like, pre-18, and I am, like, 28 for, like, reference, um, just in case. I know I've, like, I've covered up my grays, actually. But-

   14. APAlex Partridge5:20

       [laughs]

   15. PSParul Singh5:20

       ... you know, it can be a bit hard to, to tell the age a little bit sometimes. So, you know, for, for the last 10 years I probably remember a lot more, but prior to that, I actually, I don't remember a lot, and this is anecdotal, 'cause I, I can't remember the research, so don't, don't quote me on it. But I know that, like, a lot of, um, neurodivergent people have, like, very patchy memory of their childhoods because of blanking it out sometimes, which is actually quite sad.

   16. APAlex Partridge5:44

       Mm. It, it is very relatable. I mean, I, I've very patchy memories of, of my very early years. There's-

   17. PSParul Singh5:53

       Mm.

   18. APAlex Partridge5:53

       Are there any core memories that come to you if you, if you think back?

   19. PSParul Singh5:58

       I think some of my core memories would probably be, um, my mom having to put me on, um- Like, basically a child harness, um, in shopping centers because she was like, but even at, like, an age where you, you probably shouldn't really need it anymore because I would just run away, and I'd just be like, "Ooh, ooh, what's this?" Ooh, I just knocked the mic. I should probably remember that's there-

   20. APAlex Partridge6:18

       [laughs]

   21. PSParul Singh6:19

       ... otherwise the sound's gonna be terrible. Um, so yeah, so she's had to put that on me so that, like, I actually wouldn't run away, and then getting older, going with her, and I would always make her go to, like, this, um, the, like, the arts and crafts shop because I loved arts and crafts. Um, please don't ask me to draw anything because I don't have a creative bone in my body. I'm very science-y and very mathematical and very logical, but, like, I loved putting all the different things together, even if they didn't look good. Um, and that was definitely a very, like, core memory, and I used to love, like, making cards for, like, for people. I think one of the other things which I remember is, um, like, le- starting to learn piano, actually, which I've done for about, um, like, 20 years now. So we had a music open day in the primary school where there's basically, like, um, you know, like, the assembly hall, and they had, like, um, the teachers with all the different instruments, and you could go around, and you could try them, and then you could say which one you wanted lessons with, and then you have that in, like, school time. And I went round, and my mom said, um, "Which, like, okay, which one, like, do you like?" Um, 'cause obviously, you know, I, I really wanted to learn something. And I said, "Uh, the drums." And she went, "Could you pick something a bit quieter-

   22. APAlex Partridge7:35

       [laughs]

   23. PSParul Singh7:35

       ... and a bit more portable? That would be great." And I was like... Obviously, I was very cross 'cause I was like, "I really wanna learn the drums." It's something which I might do because I'm an adult, and I've got grown-up money, and I can buy drums if I want to. Um, but, so I ended up settling for the keyboards 'cause I was like, "Yes, I'll do that," and I just didn't realize, like, how amazing that was to actually have that opportunity to, like, do it 'cause we didn't have, like, lots of extra money, like, growing up, but you had to pay for the lessons, and it was one thing which I've probably done most consistently throughout my, like, my entire life pretty much. It's the one thing which I've always come back to. I find so much peace in music. Um, I used to be able to play by ear, so I used to be able to listen to a song. Um, it'd have to be a relatively straightforward, like, pop song, but I would be able to play it on, like, the piano. I did up to, like, grade five, and I think that's something which w- when your life is, like I said, so inconsistent and you don't really know who you are or, like, what you like or what you're actually good at because there's so much change constantly, like, every season of my life is so different, but that's one thing which I've always had.

   24. APAlex Partridge8:45

       What do you think it is about music that gives you that sense of calm?

   25. PSParul Singh8:49

       I think it's the sensory thing sometimes for me, um, because when I'm very, very stressed, I need to, I need to actually do something, which is why I end up doing, like, household chores during breaks during work because it's the concept of actually, like, moving. Um, I have a walking pad, which is basically a mini treadmill which goes kind of under your, like, walking desk, and I used to do that, like, you know, throughout sort of, like, the workday, so it's the sense of actually moving your fingers but, like, a nice sound comes out most of the time as well. So it's kind of a bit of a win-win situation, and because I've spent 20 years and, like, hundreds of thousands of hours into it, I would say I'm quite good, so I do get relative instant gratification 'cause again, that's the ADHD thing. I remember you did a post once about your graveyard of unfinished hobbies-

   26. APAlex Partridge9:47

       Yeah, yeah [laughs]

   27. PSParul Singh9:48

       ... actually, and reading through the comments on that post, I think I maybe added, like, some of, like, my own as well. I'm reading through that post, and we were like, "Oh my God. I have not had a unique experience in my life ever," because we just, a lot of us have the same experiences, so you know, the reason why we have a lot of unfinished hobbies-

   28. APAlex Partridge10:07

       Mm

   29. PSParul Singh10:07

       ... is because they are, they are, some of them are quite hard. They're a harder skill to learn. An instrument particularly is, is quite difficult. Um, obviously, it depends if it's the, the harmonica or, like, the violin. Um, but because we don't get that gratification, we tend to abandon it. So I also enjoy it because I'm very good at it. I can learn a song in a day.

   30. APAlex Partridge10:30

       I'm, uh, quite envious actually of your ability-
3. 11:45 – 20:36

   And since you were last on, you were diagnosed with Autism too, so the second part of the question. When was your first memory of feeling like you have autistic traits?

   1. APAlex Partridge11:45

      have had a development, uh-

   2. PSParul Singh11:47

      Yeah

   3. APAlex Partridge11:47

      ... I briefly mentioned earlier, since our last interview, and that's you've had a autism diagnosis.

   4. PSParul Singh11:51

      Yeah.

   5. APAlex Partridge11:52

      So was that a surprise?

   6. PSParul Singh11:55

      Eh, not at the point which I got it 'cause I was... I kinda went into it, and I was like, "Okay, tell me something I don't know," um, because I spent a year really wrestling with myself, um- Because, because I didn't actually really understand what it was completely, and you just think that, like, this... It, it doesn't even cross your mind. It didn't cross my mind for a very long time. There were o- just over three years between my ADHD and my autism diagnosis, which is actually quite long, because some people, once they have one, sometimes it's the other way around, um, the other one comes a little, like, fairly quickly. But I didn't realize it until, oh, like, you know, like two years later or something. So it was, yeah, completely different. Spanner in the works-

   7. APAlex Partridge12:42

      Mm

   8. PSParul Singh12:42

      ... but it answered a lot that was left. Actually, I had s- more questions after my ADHD diagnosis than I had answers, I feel.

   9. APAlex Partridge12:53

      How did your parents take the news? Was, was there a difference between how they reacted to the ADHD diagnosis as opposed to how they reacted to the autism diagnosis?

   10. PSParul Singh13:02

       Yes, but not in the way that you might think, actually. So, um, which, you know, we'll go into, like, the, the family stuff in a bit more detail, but, um, m- my mom was actually in denial [laughs] of my ADHD diagnosis. Um, on the part of the questionnaire which she had to fill in, uh, she put zero on everything, and I was like, "Why are you lying?"

   11. APAlex Partridge13:23

       [laughs]

   12. PSParul Singh13:24

       I was like, I was very, I was very cross. I was like, "You know this isn't right. I've got... I have all the evidence to prove that," like, and putting zero on everything, I mean, it seems a li- seems a little bit, a little bit sus. But I think, like, she's tried to do her whole life, that was her way of trying to, like, protect me, because she didn't know what that would mean for me. It's a, it's a different cultural background, so I, I don't, like, resent her. I'm very, very close to my... My mom is my best friend, right? Um, so but then, like, I talk- I talked to her about it, and I went through that and, like, the assessment. Um, but after my diagnosis, there was no discussion, and my mom and dad are doctors as well. My mom's a psychiatrist. So it's very interesting that it was like it was never spoken about in our home at all post-ADHD diagnosis. Not, "Oh, can you tell me more about it?"

   13. APAlex Partridge14:10

       [laughs]

   14. PSParul Singh14:10

       Like, "How do you feel about it? What does this mean for you? Can I read anything?" Nothing. And I did resent that a little bit actually, because I was like, that's all I wanted. I think just a, "Oh, this explains a lot. Like, I'm really sorry. This probably explains why we argue too much," and all of those sorts of things. I think that I probably didn't really get the closure of. My autism diagnosis came after I had set up my business running a neurodiversity consultancy. So now this was, like, my whole world, and when you talk about working, you talk about these kinds of things. Um, so it actually formed a part of that. So that was the reason it was maybe a little bit more in, like, the conversation than, like, the other one, but it was, it was a very different response. But they were also three years apart.

   15. APAlex Partridge14:59

       But why do you think the ADHD diagnosis wasn't spoken about much after you got your, uh, diagnosis?

   16. PSParul Singh15:05

       I think, um, so I originally... I'm originally from India, and it's very... Neurodivergence is very stigmatized there. Um, it's significant more than like it is here, and I think we do sometimes forget a little bit how... I don't wanna say, like, how good we have it, because w- we definitely, we do struggle. We still have a lot of work to do. Um, but when you look at, like, how far back other countries are, like, we, we have made strides in terms of, like, progress. So I think it was just, like, the cultural background. I think they maybe didn't want to accept that there was a reason for, like, my, like, my behavior, and, like, lashing out, and, like, causing trouble in school, and, like, at home, and all of those kinds of things. Because then when you get to put something on it, then you maybe have to, like, forgive a little bit.

   17. APAlex Partridge15:57

       And since that, since your new diagnosis, has there been any positive movement towards a more open conversation, like, say, around the dinner table?

   18. PSParul Singh16:04

       Mm. Oh, yeah, definitely. Well, these are things that me, me and my family don't really talk about around the dinner table. I don't know whether this is, like, a normal thing for, like, other people, but it's definitely not for us. But, um, interestingly enough, it was about a year ago, and I was, um, I was at home in Liverpool, and I was blow-drying my mom's hair, and that was when I said to her, and I said, "Um, I think Dad's autistic." [laughs] And she was like... So I, I... So actually, I should go back a little bit. I'd really worked myself up to this in my head, 'cause I was like, I'd spent a lot of time thinking about it, and the more I read about it, and I was like, "This is, this is it. This explains so much. Like, he is autistic. Like, I just... I'd be willing to bet my small life savings on it, like, he is." And I thought, "I'm gonna need to tell them, because, like, I don't know." So I really worked up in my head, and it, and it just kinda came out when I was drying her hair. And she went, "I know." And I was like, "Excuse me. What?" And she went, "Well, like, what's the point in telling him now? You know, he's, like, in his, in his early, like, 50s." Sorry, Dad, I've told everybody your age.

   19. APAlex Partridge17:15

       [laughs]

   20. PSParul Singh17:15

       But, like, I think... But I think it's... I, I've not said the specific age, so please forgive me. But I think it's important, because that's, that's, like, obviously the, the bulk of your life, and, like, your school, and education, and your working life is actually, like, past. So she said, "What's the point in telling him?" And he is also very stubborn, so he might not really want to hear it, because some people don't. Like, you don't usually go around just telling people, like, "You know, you're autistic." Do you know what I mean? So I was like, "Okay." Um, so then we kind of left it at that, but I always had it in my head, having a conversation with my dad. I was like, "This is, this explains a lot." And then, um, fast-forward to, obviously, I got, like, my diagnosis, like, all those kinds of things, and, like, I let, and I let them know, of course. And then we were sat at home. It was 8:00 AM in the morning. We're having our morning cuppa. We're all morning people, by the way, 'cause I told you, I was like, "I'm a morning person." I get it from them. Um, and I said to my dad, I said, um- 'Cause he's more curious about my work, again, because it is my work-

   21. APAlex Partridge18:17

       Mm

   22. PSParul Singh18:17

       ... and they're very, very supportive, whereas this wasn't my full-time job before, so it's more of their world now. And I said, um, I think word for word I said, "You're, you know you're autistic."

   23. APAlex Partridge18:29

       Mm-hmm.

   24. PSParul Singh18:30

       And he went, "Mm..." And I could see him thinking a little bit. And I said, and then what I did to break it down for him and help him understand it a little bit is I said, "Uh, so you know that time when blah blah blah, that's your, that's your sense of justice, actually. And you know that time when this happened and then, um, or you know when you do that, that's your challenges with reading social cues and, like, with, like, communication. And you know when you do this is..." And with every single thing that I said, it was like a little light bulb moment, and he didn't ar- for the first time in any discussion ever, doesn't matter whether it's about dinner, he didn't argue back. Didn't argue anything back. It was very, I don't know how to describe that conversation. It was incredibly cathartic for all three of us, and I wish my brother would've been there as well just to experience it, but he was revising for his exams. And it was such an open conversation, and like since then, we've all been a lot more open with each other.

   25. APAlex Partridge19:33

       Mm.

   26. PSParul Singh19:33

       'Cause obviously I get my autism from my dad, my ADHD from my mom. My brother, I'm not sure, maybe some flavor of, some light flavor of neurodivergence in there. But we are all very different people, and actually that's enabled, like my diagnoses have enabled us to be more, more compassionate to each other. Like, when somebody asks for something or says something and it's not maybe what you thought or maybe what you want, like, there might be a reason for that. You don't understand it, but like, but it's okay, and we've never really had that. And my mom always used to tell me when I was, like, younger, she said, "You are so much like your dad." And I would say, "You're, that's not true. I'm like you. I'm a carbon copy of you." Um, everybody says it, and I never, ever saw it until now. I'm actually more like my dad, and that feels so weird to say. [laughs] So, so weird. I am like my dad, but I think I get the best parts of both of them.

   27. APAlex Partridge20:35

       The bits that are

4. 20:36 – 24:16

   How do you find Autism manifests itself in your social and professional life?

   1. APAlex Partridge20:36

      similar to your dad, how, what are those, and how do you think those show up in your social life and professional life?

   2. PSParul Singh20:44

      He gets very hyperfixated on things. Um, fortunately for him, a lot of that is his career, so that's b- his career, he's made a special interest his career, which is great. So he's an anesthetist.

   3. APAlex Partridge20:57

      Mm.

   4. PSParul Singh20:58

      So this is the thing as well, it's like people don't detect it when you don't have, like, weird special interests, because this is a normal thing, and you make money from it.

   5. APAlex Partridge21:04

      [laughs]

   6. PSParul Singh21:04

      Like, this is great. Um, but he is, he's so into it, like, he does, like, research around, like, new, um, like, you know, like anesthetic, like, techniques and even, like, almost kind of like invents little, like, thingamajiggies to make it actually, like, better and, like, new developments and stuff, and he's, he's won awards in it. He goes to India at least once a year to run conferences, workshops, and everything. He runs a massive Facebook group. He is in that 24/7. This man lives and breathes anesthesia, right? Um, I have never seen somebody be able to be so fixated on one thing and never get bored of it, but he knows that inside and out, and that is all he will, he has done through his career, and it's all he will ever do. To me and you, that sounds like absolute insanity, 'cause I'm like, "I will do something two years, bored."

   7. APAlex Partridge21:56

      Mm.

   8. PSParul Singh21:56

      Move on. But that's actually a concept within autism which is called monotropism, if you've heard that before.

   9. APAlex Partridge22:03

      Monotro- so that means, like, an obsession with one thing over a long period of time?

   10. PSParul Singh22:07

       Yeah. It, I mean, maybe, yeah, a little spin on that. So mono meaning one, and then tropism is a, and I hope that I, like, get this right, 'cause sometimes mix up my words, is, um, like a reaction to an external, um, stimulus by an organism. So obviously that's a very, like, biological thing, but translating the, to that into kind of like layman's terms is it means that you have a more narrow focus of interests or skills. So not necessarily, like, one. It can be, like, like a few, but that's why, like, autistic people have, like, a v- usually a very niche but specialized, like, set of skills. Um, you can ask me how to do many day-to-day things, I won't know, but I can do a master sudoku in seven minutes. Very, very good with numbers. Um, always have been. But, like, my dad's example of that is this, which is again, it's, it's not normal, because, like, allistic people, which is non-autistic people, have, like, a wider spread of, like, interests and kind of like skills. But, um, people really like the monotropism theory, because it's a lot less, like, medicalized and, like, pathologized, that it's not necessarily, like, a deficit. It's actually just a different lens-

   11. APAlex Partridge23:23

       Mm

   12. PSParul Singh23:23

       ... that you see things, like, through the lens. And if, if I could, like, show it somehow, that would be amazing, but I'll describe the image, which actually visualizes it very well. So like imagine the sun pointing down on, um, like a patch of, like, grass or, like, land or something, and it doesn't do anything. Um, but if the sun is directed through a magnifying glass, what happens, the sun's rays get, and I'm trying to, like, show it to, like, the camera, they get narrowed down, um, and it concentrates, um, the rays of the sun, um, into very intense heat, and it can cause fire. So that's what's happening within monotropism.

   13. APAlex Partridge24:02

       I've done that before. You get a magnifying glass and you can burn a hole in a leaf-

   14. PSParul Singh24:05

       Yeah, basically

   15. APAlex Partridge24:05

       ... by concentrating the sun, yeah.

   16. PSParul Singh24:06

       Yeah. Was that what you did as a child?

   17. APAlex Partridge24:08

       Yeah, yeah. [laughs] Yeah. It's coming back. So y- so you, you think you, you've got a bit of your mom and a bit of your dad.

   18. PSParul Singh24:14

       Yeah.

   19. APAlex Partridge24:14

       Like, I had

5. 24:16 – 25:53

   We had Jay Beech on the show who also has AuDHD and he said that the ADHD brain and the Autism brain are like 2 siblings pulling each other by the hair and dragging each other across the room, is this true for you?

   1. APAlex Partridge24:16

      a- A guest called Jay Beech on, and he had, similar to you-

   2. PSParul Singh24:20

      Mm-hmm

   3. APAlex Partridge24:20

      ... ADHD and autism, and he described it as, um, two siblings pulling each other by the hair-

   4. PSParul Singh24:25

      Yeah

   5. APAlex Partridge24:25

      ... dragging each other across the room.

   6. PSParul Singh24:27

      Mm-hmm.

   7. APAlex Partridge24:28

      Do you relate to that description?

   8. PSParul Singh24:30

      Yes. But I think, I think the reason why neither were, like, detected for a very long time is that I think they've actually lived in harmony for quite a while, and they kind of like, they don't cancel each other out, but I think a lot of the time for me they've complemented each other. So whereas, like, people wouldn't have thought that I'm autistic because I'm good at talking and communicating with people, and some of that is, of course, the scripting element of it. Um, but then, like, my ADHD makes me, it, like, uh, like I'm very involved, and I'm very a little bit more kind of like, like energetic as well. Um, my ADHD wants kind of like the, the, the novelty and, like, the dopamine and the, and the new and everything, whereas the autistic side wants, wants like the structure, and it wants a little bit more of like a considered approach. So actually, um, my life is like everything is in a filing cabinet, basically. It is so organized to a T, because if it's not like I will miss it. Um, so yeah, I think that's kind of how they, like, present. Like it is, it is a little bit of kind of like, like push and pull, but I think a lot of the time they actually work very well together, which I understand is maybe not the experience of like some people.

   9. APAlex Partridge25:47

      Mm.

   10. PSParul Singh25:47

       And I understand it can be a lot more, like, difficult, but I think it's served me very well to this point.

   11. APAlex Partridge25:52

       Has your

6. 25:53 – 30:55

   Has this more recent diagnosis made a lot of sense of previous struggles you've had in the past?

   1. APAlex Partridge25:53

      most recent diagnosis made sense of previous struggles that you've had in your life?

   2. PSParul Singh25:58

      Yeah, definitely. Um, and I do have my actual autism report, which has some very, very interesting things. So if you wanted, I can read a few snippets from that, because my memory is like a sieve. But I think the most profound thing after that diagnosis, again, comparing it to the ADHD diagnosis, because, you know, there's such an overlap, and I think there might be people watching this who were me two years ago, and you didn't suspect autism. Um, and you might, you might do after this and start looking into it, or maybe you've had a recent diagnosis. But after my ADHD diagnosis, I felt like it explained a lot of the, as I said to you earlier, like the academic struggle. And, like, my mum and dad are doctors. My younger brother has now just finished med school. He's just started as a junior doctor exactly two weeks ago today, and I'm so incredibly proud. But I talked myself out of applying for medicine at university because I was like, "I don't have the discipline. I can't be responsible for people's lives when I can't even, like, rely on myself to, like, do my homework, like, every week." And it was quite sad because that was kind of all I knew, and I really wanted to do that and, like, save people's lives and make my mum and dad, like, really, really proud. So, like, the perception of, like, not meeting my academic potential was, was quite difficult and obviously doing some impulsive things and, like, very, very silly. I don't really know how I'm alive at this stage, to be honest.

   3. APAlex Partridge27:26

      [laughs]

   4. PSParul Singh27:26

      Like some of the things which I probably shouldn't really go into, but yeah, let's just basically leave it there. Just getting myself into situations. So that was the ADHD diagnosis. Um, and I came to terms with it quite quickly. And I was like, "Hey, like, that's okay. I'm doing well now from a career perspective. I'm in a very happy, loving relationship, got a relationship m- like, with my family and everything." The autism diagnosis, um, I didn't cry after my ADHD diagnosis. There wasn't, there wasn't any emotion apart from like, kind of like, oh, a little bit of resentment, a little bit of like, kind of like, "Oh, I wish I knew sooner, but this is good. I'm gonna start medication. Everything is going to be fine. It might not feel like it now." I cried after my autism assessment, actually, but it took me, like, over 24 hours because I had to go straight into an event, something like that. I didn't have time to process it. And the day afterwards, I was sat on the sofa, and I was, like, completely overcome with, um, emotion. And I messaged my boyfriend, and I was like, I was like, "Can you come downstairs? I've got the big sads. I need a big hug." And he's trying to, trying to ask me, like, what, like, what was wrong, and I couldn't verbalize it, which I'll talk about in a moment, about emotions. Um, but the thing which really hit me hard with that one is my difficulty with friendships and retaining friendships. There's a lot of people who I know who are still friends with people from school and people from, like, university, and it almost, it feels very vulnerable and embarrassing to say that, like, I barely have any contact with any of those people. At 28 years old, the majority of my friends are people that I've known for the last kind of like three years, which is not, not what the norm is. You see people's weddings. Oh my God, it's wedding season, isn't it? And they've got all the people, and they're like, "My best friend from, like, five years old." And I'm like, "I don't even remember who that is. How do you still have all these friends?"

   5. APAlex Partridge29:19

      [laughs]

   6. PSParul Singh29:20

      But that always hit me with a little bit of sadness 'cause I was like, "I don't, I don't have those people," but, like, did I do something wrong? Like some of them, like, I fell out with, but some of them I just drifted away from. I never felt like I was the friend that people felt was worth actually keeping. Um, and I had situations where I'd argued with my group of girlfriends on, like, holiday because I'd said something to somebody else which genuinely meant to, like, com- actually, like, comfort them. And it, and it, and it actually wasn't anythi- anything horrible. I won't say specifically what it was, but they took it completely the wrong way, and they all, um, had to have this, like, really big argument with me, and I was like, "Oh my God." And also, I'm not that kind of person who actually says things which are just really mean, and I'm completely, like, unaware of it. I'm not that kind of person, and never really have been. Um, but that really, that really hurt because I was like I had no idea how that could've been, like, misconstrued, like, the wrong way, because I didn't think there was any other way to actually, like, read it. So actually, that diagnosis hurt a lot more, because it's impacted me. And when people have said that I'm, um, like, self-centered, um, that I'm really, like, controlling, that I'm very, like, demanding, all of those kinds of things, they're not because of my ADHD. I might have been called loud or erratic or overwhelming, um, or, like, difficult or whatever, but those are things that I can, that I can get over. The other things, they cut quite deep.

   7. APAlex Partridge30:48

      I think it's very relatable, particularly the, the friendship issue-

   8. PSParul Singh30:52

      Mm-hmm

   9. APAlex Partridge30:52

      ... with neurodivergence and maintaining friendships.

   10. PSParul Singh30:54

       Yeah.

   11. APAlex Partridge30:54

       Since

7. 30:55 – 33:25

   Since your diagnosis, have you found your tribe?

   1. APAlex Partridge30:55

      your diagnosis, have you found your tribe? Have you, have you found it easier to, to-

   2. PSParul Singh31:00

      Actually

   3. APAlex Partridge31:00

      ... make and maintain friends?

   4. PSParul Singh31:02

      Yeah, because they're all neurodivergent. Like, literally all of the people around me, whether they know it or not, or they found out, like, afterwards, like, we just kind of, like, attract each other. But I think when you're at, like, a young age, you don't actually, you don't actually really know. So because I'm very public with my, like, neurodivergence, I've actually attracted a lot of those people. And one thing which I should mention, actually, is one of those people is the reason why I started to think I might be autistic, um, a lady called Amy. And hope she'll be watching this, 'cause I'll probably send it to her, 'cause I'll be like, "Hey, I gave you a shout-out." So, um, Amy met up with me when I thought I was just ADHD, and she said that she's also, like, diagnosed as, like, autistic, and started talking to me about it. And I was like, "You're not stereotypical, like, in the slightest." I was like, "You're like me. I would never have thought that." And the more that I started to unpack it and I was like, "Oh, my God." And I went home and I started looking into it and I was like, "Could it, could, could it? No, it can't. Yeah, it must be." And that's actually what started that cycle, because she came into my life and showed me that not everything is how it seems or how you actually perceive it to be or how you, like, stereotype it to be. So I have a lot of people like her in my life, and do you know what? It's the best feeling ever just knowing that you don't have to apologize for being yourself. Like, I met my friend today, 'cause I've traveled from Manchester to London, and I was gonna work in my friend's office. And, um, it was gonna be lunchtime, so we needed, we needed to grab some lunch. And I said to him, um, 'cause he's got ADHD, and I said, um, "If it's okay, I don't... Because I'll have just come off a train, and I'm, I'm really over, I'm really dysregulated usually. So if it's okay, can we grab lunch, eat a wrap, eat it and walk, or can we take it into the office? 'Cause I don't wanna sit in a food place that is gonna be really busy, 'cause that'll be really super overwhelma- o- overwhelm for, like, six hours straight." And because I was able to say that, but some people don't quite get that. They're like, "Why can't you just sit in the Shake Shack and eat your food like a normal person? Like a very normal thing to do." But, like, firstly, I was able to say it, and secondly, like, he just kind of, like, got it. So those people which I've, like, surrounded myself with, either I don't even have to explain it, 'cause, like, they just know, or I'm able to explain it and not feel guilty about having needs that are just often not met by, like, other people.

8. 33:25 – 36:26

   Has your diagnosis made sense to those closest to you?

   1. APAlex Partridge33:25

      And those closest to you-

   2. PSParul Singh33:26

      Yeah

   3. APAlex Partridge33:26

      ... like your family, your partner-

   4. PSParul Singh33:28

      Yeah

   5. APAlex Partridge33:28

      ... um, do they fully understand the, the diagnoses and, and all that comes with those things?

   6. PSParul Singh33:34

      Um, I think he's learning as, as I am, like, every day. Like, my ADHD diagnosis is almost, uh, three and a half years ago now. I still learn new things about myself. Like, obviously I have, like, the coaching and the therapy and, like, the counseling and all of those kinds of things, um, because it's a never-ending journey. But, like, I feel like he's really, he's really been on that with me. And I'm under no illusion that it's easy, because it's not. And I think sometimes, obviously, we don't want to applaud a fish for, for swimming, really, because I think that's what a good partner does, and they just really, like, grow with you. But, like, it, it, like, it is difficult. Do you know what I mean?

   7. APAlex Partridge34:13

      Mm-hmm.

   8. PSParul Singh34:14

      It's like you can tell me something this many times and I, and I will still forget. I will leave the things in the thing. I'll promise that I'll do something. I'll commit to something. I'll just completely forget about it. Um, so I understand, like, and it can be tiring, but he knows and he says that, like, it's worth it, like, like, 10 times over. Because you take that as, I think you really take it as, like, a package. So it's really cute, 'cause, like, um, like, we tag each other in, like, Instagram things, like TikTok videos and stuff like that. And, like, at the end of the day, we sometimes, we have, like, TikTok time. [laughs]

   9. APAlex Partridge34:47

      [laughs]

   10. PSParul Singh34:47

       Which I don't know if, like, anybody else actually does this. I think I might have seen a post. But instead, because we tag each other in lots of things, it's like we'll just show each other the stuff which we've kind of, like, watched or saved, and just kinda, like, scroll through it together in bed, which is really cute. So obviously, for me, a lot of the time, that's, like, neurodivergent stuff-

   11. APAlex Partridge35:05

       Mm

   12. PSParul Singh35:05

       ... because it's called the For You page for a reason. Mine is full of it, all neurodivergent stuff-

   13. APAlex Partridge35:10

       [laughs]

   14. PSParul Singh35:11

       ... obviously, um, because it knows that's what I interact with. So I show him those things-

   15. APAlex Partridge35:15

       Mm

   16. PSParul Singh35:15

       ... and it's maybe other people's experiences. 'Cause if I can't explain it well, there's somebody else out there who, who actually, who actually can. And I think he starts to get it, kind of, like, bit by bit, but... And I don't expect it to be, like, an overnight thing. But, like, he's, he's very, he's very flexible, and he's very, very, like, compassionate and very open-minded. It does take time, though, 'cause I have to remind him. I was like, "I do this because of this. I need this information ahead of this. Like, if you're saying that somebody's having a flat warming and you can't even tell me what time it starts, I'm not going." And he gets it eventually.

   17. APAlex Partridge35:54

       The memes thing is so relatable.

   18. PSParul Singh35:55

       Yeah.

   19. APAlex Partridge35:56

       Um, my partner sends me, I think it's 10:20 every day. She, I-

   20. PSParul Singh36:00

       [laughs]

   21. APAlex Partridge36:01

       ... I go to bed often earlier than she does, and I-

   22. PSParul Singh36:03

       Yeah

   23. APAlex Partridge36:03

       ... I think she stays up for a few more hours.

   24. PSParul Singh36:05

       Mm.

   25. APAlex Partridge36:05

       And I wake up, without fail, to a DMs, like, 10, 15-

   26. PSParul Singh36:09

       Yeah

   27. APAlex Partridge36:09

       ... reels. R- And it's often, actually, it's like, I don't know if you relate to this, it's often- Can be used in a way to articulate a struggle-

   28. PSParul Singh36:18

       Yeah

   29. APAlex Partridge36:18

       ... that is difficult to verbally articulate, but a meme does it so well. Um-

   30. PSParul Singh36:24

       Mm-hmm
9. 36:26 – 44:47

   How do you communicate the everyday struggles of being AuDHD to those around you, those people by which your relationship relies heavily on your strength to communicate things to them. i.e friends, family and partner?

   1. APAlex Partridge36:26

      articulate the struggles that you might face as an AuDHD woman to your partner, particularly when-

   2. PSParul Singh36:33

      Mm

   3. APAlex Partridge36:33

      ... I imagine the s- the s- the strength of your relationship is so dependent on you being able to communicate effectively?

   4. PSParul Singh36:39

      Uh, which I struggle with. So with the verbalizing the emotions, um, that's actually very difficult. Um, I forget the pronunciation. I think it's like, like, Alexthymia something, something like that.

   5. APAlex Partridge36:50

      Yeah.

   6. PSParul Singh36:50

      Alex-

   7. APAlex Partridge36:50

      Alex-

   8. PSParul Singh36:51

      Yeah

   9. APAlex Partridge36:51

      ... Alexthymia, I believe.

   10. PSParul Singh36:52

       Yeah, that's it.

   11. APAlex Partridge36:52

       Yeah.

   12. PSParul Singh36:52

       That's it.

   13. APAlex Partridge36:52

       I got that, too. [laughs]

   14. PSParul Singh36:53

       Something... Yeah, exactly.

   15. APAlex Partridge36:54

       Were you, were you diagnosed with that?

   16. PSParul Singh36:55

       So, um, well, it's, it's often linked with... It's in my, it's in my autism report, actually.

   17. APAlex Partridge37:00

       Mm.

   18. PSParul Singh37:00

       So I know somet- I think, like, can be, like, a separate diagnosis.

   19. APAlex Partridge37:03

       Yeah, yeah.

   20. PSParul Singh37:04

       I don't know if it's in the DSM-5, actually. A few notes over there.

   21. APAlex Partridge37:07

       Uh, I, I don't think it is. I, my, I... The psychologist who diagnosed me said that sh-

   22. PSParul Singh37:12

       Mm

   23. APAlex Partridge37:12

       ... it's, she diagnosed me with it.

   24. PSParul Singh37:14

       Yeah.

   25. APAlex Partridge37:14

       And she didn't really t- say too much about it, but I've since spoken to g-... Yeah, it's, it's an inability-

   26. PSParul Singh37:18

       Yeah

   27. APAlex Partridge37:18

       ... to recognize and to understand your own emotions.

   28. PSParul Singh37:20

       Your own emotions, yeah, absolutely. The reason I say that as well, is that there's a lot of things which are not covered in the DSM-5, so I wasn't asking that to basically say that it's, if it's not in the DSM-5, it's not real. And because it absolutely is, 'cause there's a lot of things which, which actually just aren't in there, which, which need to be accounted for really, but, you know, it gets updated-

   29. APAlex Partridge37:39

       Mm

   30. PSParul Singh37:39

       ... hence the, the five. So hopefully have a six coming. But, um, with that, and in my autism report specifically, it does say that, um, I struggle to identify emotions beyond good, bad, and maybe neutral. So I only... I can only identify an emotion often if it has, like, a physical reaction to it. So what happens when you're happy? You smile. Give us a smile.
10. 44:47 – 46:08

    ‘Pebbling’ explained

    1. PSParul Singh44:47

       pebbling is, like, an autistic love language where you might give a physical thing to somebody, but it can also be giving, like, pieces of information, and you're like, "Oh, I saw this, and I thought you might like it," or like, "I know that, um, one time three years ago you said that you like Mexican food. Um, here's all the Mexican restaurants in Manchester-"

    2. APAlex Partridge45:07

       [laughs]

    3. PSParul Singh45:07

       ... with, like, the hyperlinks.

    4. APAlex Partridge45:08

       Mm.

    5. PSParul Singh45:08

       Obviously, that's, like, a very exaggerated, like, example, but it's giving little things to somebody because, and it's named that way because that's what penguins do, because they collect pebbles and they give them to other penguins. It's the cutest thing I've ever heard.

    6. APAlex Partridge45:23

       Oh. [laughs]

    7. PSParul Singh45:24

       But that's what I actually do. That's how I show people that, like, I care for them, but it's a very, it's a very specific way, 'cause I know acts of service-

    8. APAlex Partridge45:32

       Mm

    9. PSParul Singh45:32

       ... is, like, a love language, but it's, it's, it's a little bit more, like, niche. I think for me, I give people pieces of information. I'm like, "Oh, I know that, like, you like this book," or like, "Did you, did you see this?" I'm constantly sending things to people that, like, I know that they'll like or they'll benefit from.

    10. APAlex Partridge45:48

        It's almost like, um, a love language.

    11. PSParul Singh45:50

        Yeah.

    12. APAlex Partridge45:50

        It's like saying, "I love you"-

    13. PSParul Singh45:52

        It's an autistic love language

    14. APAlex Partridge45:53

        ... in AuDHD or Au- Autism.

    15. PSParul Singh45:54

        Yeah.

    16. APAlex Partridge45:55

        So-

    17. PSParul Singh45:55

        So when the autistic or AuDHD person in your life-

    18. APAlex Partridge45:58

        Mm

    19. PSParul Singh45:58

        ... you don't know whether they like you or not-

    20. APAlex Partridge46:00

        Yeah

    21. PSParul Singh46:00

        ... they probably like you. They're probably just showing it in a little bit of a different way.

    22. APAlex Partridge46:05

        Going back a tad, in general, do you think it's

11. 46:08 – 50:16

    In general, do you find it hard to draw out empathy from a person who has a brain that just thinks in a totally different way?

    1. APAlex Partridge46:08

       m- more difficult to get empathy out of someone who has a brain that works-

    2. PSParul Singh46:15

       Mm

    3. APAlex Partridge46:16

       ... a, a bit different to the sort of standard, typical standard?

    4. PSParul Singh46:20

       I think it, it depends how you define that, because sometimes empathy is defined by how somebody actually presents and the perception of how they're, like, actually showing that, that, like, empathy, and I think the neurotypical definition of that is very, very different. Just kind of like what I talked to you earlier, like empathy is maybe how, like, you respond to something and something it requires picking up on, you know, the unspoken cues or reading, like, between the lines a little bit. So when you, when you're judging somebody's empathy based on how they can do those certain things, it's probably going to look a little bit different. Um, it can seem a little bit, like, self, like, self-centered as well. So when somebody's talking about something, can they... They're almost, like, opening it up for you to ask them more questions about it, um, you know, kind of like, you know, you do on, like, a podcast, for example. But as an autistic person not picking up on that unspoken cue, and I think the conversation's done and I divert across from it, and then they think they're not being empathetic, they don't care. But I'm like, I, I didn't know that because it wasn't, it wasn't spelled out for me, and it wasn't-

    5. APAlex Partridge47:31

       Mm

    6. PSParul Singh47:31

       ... really in, like, black and white. So it just, you know, lack of empathy is coming across as, like, not caring, and that happens quite a lot, unfortunately.

    7. APAlex Partridge47:41

       I think the way I sh- could show empathy could be described-

    8. PSParul Singh47:46

       Mm

    9. APAlex Partridge47:46

       ... as masking. The other, last week, somebody who I know told me that a, a close family friend had passed away, and I don't know how to react in those situations, so I did what I think-

    10. PSParul Singh47:55

        Mm

    11. APAlex Partridge47:55

        ... is what you're meant to do and say-

    12. PSParul Singh47:56

        Yeah

    13. APAlex Partridge47:56

        ... "I'm so sorry. I'm terribly sorry."

    14. PSParul Singh47:58

        Yeah.

    15. APAlex Partridge47:58

        But it came across incredibly insincere-

    16. PSParul Singh48:00

        Mm

    17. APAlex Partridge48:00

        ... because it just doesn't come naturally to me.

    18. PSParul Singh48:02

        Mm.

    19. APAlex Partridge48:03

        Um, but a couple of, couple of days later, I sent them a long email with, with, like, a picture collage I had made of-

    20. PSParul Singh48:09

        Oh

    21. APAlex Partridge48:09

        ... them with the person-

    22. PSParul Singh48:10

        Yeah

    23. APAlex Partridge48:10

        ... who had passed away. That's how I show empathy.

    24. PSParul Singh48:13

        Yeah.

    25. APAlex Partridge48:14

        But in the moment, I masked-

    26. PSParul Singh48:15

        In that moment

    27. APAlex Partridge48:16

        ... and showed empathy in the way that I have learnt-

    28. PSParul Singh48:20

        Mm

    29. APAlex Partridge48:20

        ... you should show it. And when I do that, it actually comes across as quite insincere. 'Cause I just, I just, I really struggle to react, uh-

    30. PSParul Singh48:28

        Appropriately
12. 50:16 – 53:00

    What part does "Stockholm Syndrome" play in this? And can you briefly explain what Stockholm syndrome is?

    1. APAlex Partridge50:16

       Stockholm syndrome come into all of this?

    2. PSParul Singh50:19

       Stockholm syndrome.

    3. APAlex Partridge50:20

       Stockholm syndrome.

    4. PSParul Singh50:21

       Yeah.

    5. APAlex Partridge50:22

       Because-

    6. PSParul Singh50:23

       Mm

    7. APAlex Partridge50:23

       ... I suppose, can you explain what Stockholm syndrome is firstly?

    8. PSParul Singh50:27

       Isn't that the one that people have, uh, with the kidnappers? [laughs]

    9. APAlex Partridge50:32

       It's, it's being accustomed and almost not wanting to-

    10. PSParul Singh50:35

        Oh

    11. APAlex Partridge50:35

        ... leave a, a situation even after you've been set free.

    12. PSParul Singh50:39

        Ooh.

    13. APAlex Partridge50:40

        Is that correct?

    14. PSParul Singh50:40

        Yeah. But if you explain it with the metaphor of basically, like, a kidnapper, 'cause that's what happens to people. So when people are kidnapped-

    15. APAlex Partridge50:47

        Mm

    16. PSParul Singh50:47

        ... um, they develop Stockholm syndrome, and they, they start to think that they're not the bad person, even to the extent they start to think that they are, like, the good person.

    17. APAlex Partridge50:56

        Mm.

    18. PSParul Singh50:56

        So if we use that as, like, a metaphor for, like, the ADHD and, like, the autism kind of, like, post, like, diagnosis, um, you become so attached to the masking because it's allowed your survival for so long.

    19. APAlex Partridge51:12

        Mm.

    20. PSParul Singh51:14

        And you can't unlearn it, like, overnight. Like, a diagnosis doesn't... Like, you don't wake up the day afterwards and you're like, "The mask is gone. I am free. This is amazing." You're so attached to that version of you sometimes because you don't know what the other version is.

    21. APAlex Partridge51:29

        Mm.

    22. PSParul Singh51:30

        Um, and that's, I think, what I also felt very difficult after both diagnoses, is the loss of, the loss of identity. Because what the person that I had become until 25 or 28 was basically, like, um, you know, like, those, like, little patchwork blankets which they have all different pieces of fabric sewn together?

    23. APAlex Partridge51:52

        Yes.

    24. PSParul Singh51:52

        Is, is that what you call them, patchwork blanket? Um-

    25. APAlex Partridge51:55

        We, we can call them that, yeah. [laughs]

    26. PSParul Singh51:56

        My whole identity and personality was a patchwork blanket of all the people I'd interacted with, down to my, like, dialect, like, my tone, my mannerisms, everything, my, some of my, my, um, short-lived interests. All of those kinds of things are made up of those people. I didn't know who I was actually. Um, but then what was the alternative? So that's the Stockholm syndrome. So I was like, but I could stay with this though, because, because I like it, and it's, you know, it's a mix of all of those things. But the result of being so attached to that-

    27. APAlex Partridge52:30

        Mm

    28. PSParul Singh52:30

        ... is then I had a, I felt a complete loss of identity. I was like, "I don't know who I am. I don't know what I speak like." I spend too long with somebody who says certain phrases or speaks with a certain accent, I start to do that, and I've done that all my life. That's basically, um, it's just like mimicking what you have around you.

    29. APAlex Partridge52:49

        Mi- mirror, mirroring.

    30. PSParul Singh52:50

        Yeah, mirror-
13. 53:00 – 56:46

    How much of your AuDHD do you think might be caused by complex PTSD?

    1. APAlex Partridge53:00

       How much of your AuDHD do you think might be caused by complex PTSD?

    2. PSParul Singh53:07

       Um, I would say it's probably the other way round, um, because, um, autism, ADHD are, in the majority of cases, um, with you, like, from birth. It's, you know, neurodevelopmental. Um, although there are small cases where, um, it can be acquired neurodivergence, like, later in life. Um, but a l- a lot of people do actually have, um, like, PTSD or CPTSD as a result of going through life through that neurodivergence, and mine was only uncovered in November actually. 'Cause what happens with CPTSD, um, because I've started some s- initial sessions for, um, EMDR, which is basically like a sledgehammer version of, like, therapy, and it's what you have to do when talking therapies and CBT hasn't actually worked. Because you have to uncover the deep-set trauma which you've experienced consistently, like, throughout your life. Talking therapy is not even gonna scratch the surface of that. Um, and they said, like, that's why it basically doesn't work. Also, talking therapies is too subjective for an autistic person. You're like, "How do you feel about that?" I don't know. Why don't you give me an emotion wheel? Maybe that will help. So it actually doesn't, it actually does make, so all of those experiences which I've actually, like, encountered and- Like, not actually having, like, a safe space or any, like, consistency or friendships that I could, like, rely on. Like, and there's a lot of things which, again, I won't go into for this. I'm gonna save it for the therapy. Um, that's all compounded, and it all came out after a trigger that I experienced in like November. Um, but people don't know, because people think that PTSD is basically when you have one big, bad thing happen to you, and that's what it is, but this is actually not the case. So, like, you know, there might be people who might be, like, watching this might be like, "Could it be that?" But I had, I actually had all of the signs, and I only knew when I started doing actually some... I, I started having some very scary, vivid dreams, and I started, um, actually woke up one morning, my boyfriend's gone away, and I think he's like my safety blanket. So the first night when he went away, the next morning, I actually woke up with a bruise on my wrist. Um, and I hadn't hit myse- I hadn't hit, like, you know, knocked it on anything, um, because I, I tend to remember. I also have darker skin, so I don't bruise easily. And I don't wear my watch when I sleep, and I thought, "That's really weird." Um, and I actually worked out I'd done it to myself in my sleep, and the only way that could have happened is I'd flung my arm so back, so far back and hard into the wooden top part of my headboard, 'cause that was the only way that it could have happened. Um, another night, I woke up on my s- side in the fetal position, clutching my water bottle, and it was all s- like seeping out of it, um, because it kind of, it has, like, a lid and, like, a straw. It doesn't really, like, close, and I only woke up because I was like, "Oh, my God. What's happening?" And I was like, "This is, um, like, this is a little bit worrying," like it's not normal.

    3. APAlex Partridge56:10

       Mm.

    4. PSParul Singh56:10

       So I spoke to my GP, and it's quite scary accepting that that's, that's kind of actually, like, the reality. That, like, I'm, I actually have, um, trauma, and it's very, very serious. But again, if, like, anybody's watching this and you think that, "But it wasn't that bad. It wasn't that bad, and it was a really long time ago, and, like, I'm over it," um, you know, obviously, there's always, you know, bigger things that happen to people and things that are actually, like, worse. But it took me getting to that point to actually accept that something was very, very wrong, and the prevalence is really high, actually.

14. 56:46 – 1:00:19

    The ADHD Item segment

    1. APAlex Partridge56:46

       I wanna find out what's underneath this cloth. I'm fascinated to find out what your ADHD item is-

    2. PSParul Singh56:52

       Mm

    3. APAlex Partridge56:52

       ... or in this case, perhaps autistic item as well, or maybe both.

    4. PSParul Singh56:56

       Yeah.

    5. APAlex Partridge56:56

       It's underneath this cloth.

    6. PSParul Singh56:57

       Okay.

    7. APAlex Partridge57:00

       Glasses. [laughs]

    8. PSParul Singh57:02

       Ooh.

    9. APAlex Partridge57:02

       I'm gonna pass these to you, and-

    10. PSParul Singh57:05

        Thank you so much

    11. APAlex Partridge57:06

        ... why, why glasses?

    12. PSParul Singh57:07

        Can I put them on?

    13. APAlex Partridge57:08

        Absolutely, yeah.

    14. PSParul Singh57:10

        Um, you know, when I said glasses, I thought Alex was gonna get me, like, these funky, trendy, like, you know those blue light glasses that you have? They just look like normal ones. I didn't think I was gonna get, like, a throwback to, like, 2010, but, like, I love this. So if anybody remembers, if you were a UK kid and you grew up, you were a teenager in like 2010, you will recognize these glasses. Um, it's a very specific nostalgia. So the reason I picked glasses is because they actually represent what medication ex- what, like, the experience of medication was like for me. Um, and I think somebody actually used this analogy when I was pre-diagnosis, and it made so much sense. So basically, um, like kinda going through your life, and this is for people who take medication and they, they respond well to it. By the way, I know that's not everybody. Um, but, like, in my case, I was going through life not knowing that my eyesight wasn't actually quite right. So it was, like, maybe a little bit off. Obviously, not to the point that I couldn't maybe read, but I'd maybe, like, there's a YouTube sign there, so maybe I'd have to squint a little bit just to actually, like, read it. But I thought everybody had to do that-

    15. APAlex Partridge58:21

        Mm

    16. PSParul Singh58:21

        ... and, like, that was, like, completely normal. And it was only upon going for, like, an eye test and realizing that, like, oh, um, my eyesight's a little bit off and I just need glasses. And then you put the glasses on for, like, the first time, and you go, like... Well, this is very funny 'cause I can see these lines. But, you know, you put the glasses on, and you're like, "This is how I was supposed to see the whole time, and nobody told me." And that's actually what it feels like because it's, it's so slightly off that you maybe didn't actually detect it.

    17. APAlex Partridge58:53

        Mm.

    18. PSParul Singh58:54

        Um, I actually asked, told this to my boyfriend, and I said, "What do you think the glasses represent for me?" And he said, "'Cause you lose them all the time."

    19. APAlex Partridge59:01

        [laughs]

    20. PSParul Singh59:01

        And I went, "Okay," 'cause I've gone through three pairs of glasses-

    21. APAlex Partridge59:04

        Mm

    22. PSParul Singh59:04

        ... in the last five years. Um-

    23. APAlex Partridge59:05

        Only three?

    24. PSParul Singh59:06

        I've... So the first one, I rolled over them while I was asleep and I broke them, and I thought, "It's too much effort." And the other ones, I left on holiday. And the other ones-

    25. APAlex Partridge59:16

        [laughs]

    26. PSParul Singh59:17

        ... I think I lost them while I was, like, moving. Um, so that's what he thought it was.

    27. APAlex Partridge59:22

        Mm.

    28. PSParul Singh59:22

        So it's a very, very different interpretation really, isn't it? But he, that actually has representation for him of my ADHD, too.

    29. APAlex Partridge59:30

        That's a lovely analogy.

    30. PSParul Singh59:32

        It's nice, isn't it?
15. 1:00:19 – 1:02:31

    The ADHD Agony Aunt segment (Washing Machine of Woes)

    1. APAlex Partridge1:00:19

       Machine of Woes quickly.

    2. PSParul Singh1:00:20

       Yeah. Okay.

    3. APAlex Partridge1:00:20

       Um, my, I, my ADH- my ADHD item is a washing machine.

    4. PSParul Singh1:00:24

       Okay.

    5. APAlex Partridge1:00:24

       Because for me, it represents my biggest woe, which is memory loss.

    6. PSParul Singh1:00:27

       The washing. [laughs]

    7. APAlex Partridge1:00:28

       Do you leave your washing in the machine?

    8. PSParul Singh1:00:30

       Yeah.

    9. APAlex Partridge1:00:30

       Yeah.

    10. PSParul Singh1:00:31

        And then you have to wash it again-

    11. APAlex Partridge1:00:32

        Exactly, yeah

    12. PSParul Singh1:00:32

        ... 'cause it smells weird.

    13. APAlex Partridge1:00:33

        Yeah.

    14. PSParul Singh1:00:33

        All the time.

    15. APAlex Partridge1:00:33

        Good to know I'm not alone.

    16. PSParul Singh1:00:35

        Yeah.

    17. APAlex Partridge1:00:35

        Um, I ask my community every week to send me their biggest woes-

    18. PSParul Singh1:00:38

        Mm

    19. APAlex Partridge1:00:38

        ... and I put them in the washing machine, the Washing Machine of Woes.

    20. PSParul Singh1:00:40

        Yeah.

    21. APAlex Partridge1:00:41

        Genius name. Um-

    22. PSParul Singh1:00:42

        [laughs]

    23. APAlex Partridge1:00:44

        I've been diagnosed with ADHD since childhood, and lately, due to TikTok, I'm starting to think I might be autistic too, but I'm too afraid to get a diagnosis because I feel like people might exclude me if I'm seen as autistic. Do you think they will?

    24. PSParul Singh1:00:59

        Well, my question is, are they excluding you already? Because a lot of the time it might not have the label on it, but when people know that you're different but don't quite know why, and if they are treating you differently... Like they might not do, like you might be absolutely fine.

    25. APAlex Partridge1:01:16

        Mm.

    26. PSParul Singh1:01:17

        Um, but if they are treating you differently anyway, um, it wouldn't necessarily change it. Because this is the issue with people saying that, "Oh, I don't want a label," but like you, you already have a label. You have several. Um, you are, you are weird, you are difficult, you are overwhelming. Um, you are not very nice. You are s- you are self-centered. Um, you are controlling. The difference is that label is then something else. Um, so if you're worried about people treating you like differently, um, I understand that, but maybe think about how are they maybe treating you now. 'Cause all it would maybe do is give a little bit of like an explanation, and also are those, are those your people? Like how I talked about earlier in like the podcast about not really having those true friendships and actually carrying them with me, but now my genuine, my only genuine friendships have come after being open with my neurodivergence because they're with other neurodivergent people who just get it.

    27. APAlex Partridge1:02:13

        Mm. Find your tribe. Brilliant.

    28. PSParul Singh1:02:15

        Find your tribe.

    29. APAlex Partridge1:02:16

        Brilliant advice. Thank you very much.

    30. PSParul Singh1:02:17

        You're so welcome. Thank you. I like the washing machine, by the way.
16. 1:02:31 – 1:11:35

    What is the difference between a shutdown and a meltdown? And why might one occur over the other?

    1. APAlex Partridge1:02:31

       can you help me understand the difference between a shutdown and a meltdown, and why might one occur over the other?

    2. PSParul Singh1:02:38

       Um, okay, so this again is something which I had learnt relatively recently. So a meltdown, um, people might be, might have maybe like seen one or they've, they've kind of like stereotypically, um, very, very like angry, maybe like, maybe like throwing things. Um, maybe actually like hitting yourself, repetitive movements, et cetera. Banging your head like against a wall. Um, not everybody who has a meltdown, um, actually experiences, um, or exhibits it in that kind of way. So it's, um, y- your nervous system's basically having like, it's, it's going into like overdrive, so it could be like external like stimuli. It could be like, um, something, something like changes, but you react to it like disproportionately to what people think you should actually like react to it. Um, so it's all very like externalized, obviously shouting, physical, et cetera, et cetera. Um, a shutdown is the opposite. It's just, it's just a complete shutdown. It's a blank. Um, you, you might even have like a little bit of like a, a memory blank. You can't process anything, you maybe can't, you can't say anything or even when... You, you might be able to speak. So this is why sometimes they're not detected, right? Because for people who are very, uh, verbal, like me, um, which you'll know when you try to edit this podcast down-

    3. APAlex Partridge1:03:59

       [laughs]

    4. PSParul Singh1:03:59

       ... um, I can manage to get some words out, but it's very, very hard. It's like drawing blood from a stone. Um, so they are kind of very different like reactions to, to things, um, in sort of a very, very different way. They're, they're very difficult because sometimes you, you don't really know when they're actually going to happen, and again, if I experience a shutdown during an argument with my boyfriend, and he's like, it, it appears to be... If you Google stonewalling in like arguments, that's basically what like a shutdown is. So again, and people say that constant stonewalling, and this is why sometimes like autistic behaviors can be, um, and I say this very carefully, sometimes can be misinterpreted as abusive. Because if somebody's constantly stonewalling, but then they're actually having a shutdown and they have no option but to freeze you out because they are frozen, they don't have any control over that, and this is the, this is the importance of being diagnosed. Because I can say to him, like if I can get it across, like, "I'm having a complete shutdown. I can't talk to you about this right now." Um, or even if I can't, he will understand it, but without a diagnosis it looks like stonewalling.

    5. APAlex Partridge1:05:17

       So just, just quickly, stonewalling, it just-

    6. PSParul Singh1:05:19

       Is that the right word?

    7. APAlex Partridge1:05:21

       I think so. Do you-

    8. PSParul Singh1:05:22

       Yeah

    9. APAlex Partridge1:05:22

       ... if you were just-

    10. PSParul Singh1:05:22

        It's just shutting somebody out. It's basically like when you have an argument with somebody, and like maybe you're losing or you're not happy with how it's going, you'll go, "Oh, fine, just leave it then." Storm off, like just completely-

    11. APAlex Partridge1:05:33

        Mm

    12. PSParul Singh1:05:33

        ... just completely ignore them and like shut them out. But that's, the difference is that's very intentional. Like you know you're doing it.

    13. APAlex Partridge1:05:40

        And how has like a meltdown or a shutdown, have you got any examples of how that's impacted your everyday life?

    14. PSParul Singh1:05:46

        Oh, I've got one fun example actually, which I've been saving for this podcast actually.

    15. APAlex Partridge1:05:50

        [laughs]

    16. PSParul Singh1:05:50

        So I was like it's an AuDHD Chatter special. So a couple of months ago, we're due to go on holiday, um, towards the end of June, and if anybody from Manchester or around there remembers, um, Manchester Airport had a massive power cut which basically shut do- completely shut down two of like the terminals. So we got there, 6:00 in the morning. I thought, "Brilliant, we've got time before our flight. I've got everything. This is all good." Got into the terminal, havoc. Complete... I've never seen anything like it, and that's saying something for Manchester Airport because that is, I think all three terminals are in the top five worst for the UK.

    17. APAlex Partridge1:06:24

        [laughs]

    18. PSParul Singh1:06:24

        I'm like, "How have you managed that?" Um, so I was like, "What's going on?" So yeah, then that's when I found out about the power cut. Massive like delay in the flight. We're just sat there waiting, waiting, waiting, 'cause they won't even let us go to bag drop and security 'cause we don't know what's going on. Eventually get told, got called to go through. Um, sat in the lounge. Everything's fine. We're just about three hours delayed. Then we go to the gate. And I overheard some people sat down talking. Um, this information I'd got from other people, and they, and I heard something. I said, "Excuse me, did you just say that no hold luggage is going with the flights?" And she said, "Yeah, they only told us at the gate." I went, "Nobody's told me this. I'm finding it out from you. Are you kidding me?" And he went... And I looked at my boyfriend and went, "Oh my God. Oh my God, this is not good." So I got up and I spoke to the people on the, on the gate thingy, and I was like, "Can you, uh, what's going on here?" Like, I started freaking out and I was like, "Okay, this is not good." And I was like, "Okay, what, what choice do I have at this point?" 'Cause they were like, "You can either get on the plane or you can't." But I was like, "Am I gonna get a refund? Can I change it?" Like, this isn't fair. Why are n- no bags were going with any flights that day because of it, but they decided not to tell anybody, which is just classic Manchester Airport fashion. Um, so I thought, like, y- we can't lose all of this money. Um, I'm just gonna have to suck it up. I didn't even have anything in my little suitcase with me. Um, I wear contact lenses, didn't have contact lens case, solution, glasses, underwear, skincare, nothing. Absolutely nothing. Um, I did, however, have my Kindle, my Remarkable, my laptop, my Nintendo Switch, but none [laughs] of the essentials that I needed to get through the night. So anyway, so we got on the plane and I thought, "Okay, it's fine. We'll go there, buy stuff." Then the panic set in that we're actually three hours delayed, so by the time we land in Turkey, everything's gonna be shut. I don't know what's on there. So we all sat. We had the very front two seats, possibly the best seats I've ever had on a, on a plane, um, really. And I realized that, like, everything started going through my head, like the logic. And I was like, "Okay, but what if this happens and that happens?" And my brain started going into complete overdrive. So it wasn't a panic attack, it was a meltdown. And, like, everything in, like, my, like, body, and I was literally like, and I couldn't, I was, I was like this, and I was, and I had to get off. I had to get off the plane. So I got off the plane 'cause I thought, I thought, "I'm gonna be sat on that for 4 hours and 15 minutes, and I'm gonna wanna open up that emergency exit and jump straight off it-

    19. APAlex Partridge1:08:45

        [laughs]

    20. PSParul Singh1:08:45

        ... if you trap me on that plane for that long knowing I'm gonna go to my destination without my luggage now." So I made the decision to get off the plane, um, but I couldn't speak, um, at all, um, because I was like, um, completely dysregulated. And I had to sit down, um, with my, um, AirPods in, and I did breathing exercises for a full five to seven minutes while my poor boyfriend spoke to the people. So I got off that plane without knowing what the consequences would be, whether we were gonna get a refund. So massive shout-out to TUI because they were very, very empathetic, and they gave us a full refund. So we came out, we took our bags, we went home. After eight hours of trying to leave this cursed country, we came back home. We booked to go two days later. But I think in another life, well, pre-diagnosis life, I wouldn't have got off that plane 'cause I wouldn't have recognized my feelings. I would have put it down to, "You're being dramatic. You're being difficult. Other people are doing it. Why can't you just do it?" But I actually knew the magnitude of the problem had I have got on that plane. They didn't tell us how long the bags were gonna take to get to us. They didn't say how much compensation we'd get. I didn't know if I could take my contact lenses out when I actually landed. And all of those factors actually put together just created a horrible mess of things, and I'm, I am so glad I got off that plane. Do you know what? Even if they hadn't have refunded us, turns out I would've been without my luggage for three out of the seven days, and they would've given us 100 pounds-

    21. APAlex Partridge1:10:11

        Mm

    22. PSParul Singh1:10:11

        ... or 150 pounds for it, which in Turkey doesn't actually go very far. It's very expensive now, actually.

    23. APAlex Partridge1:10:16

        [laughs]

    24. PSParul Singh1:10:17

        But that was m- that was my first experience of a meltdown, and I realized my life, I've probably been suppressing them the whole time. It wasn't... I said, "I don't think I've ever experienced one." I says, "Well, you did now."

    25. APAlex Partridge1:10:30

        And you have any other sim- any other horror flight stories since then, or has everything been smooth?

    26. PSParul Singh1:10:36

        It's been smooth. It's been smooth, yeah. Since then I went to Prague with my family, and it was honestly absolutely fine. So do you know what? Like, you just really-

    27. APAlex Partridge1:10:45

        Mm.

    28. PSParul Singh1:10:45

        You couldn't make it up. It was just a, such a learning experience. Travel is difficult. I think we talked about it last time in, like, general. But I think I was just really, I was so grateful to myself in that moment-

    29. APAlex Partridge1:10:56

        Mm

    30. PSParul Singh1:10:56

        ... because, like, I spend 95% of my waking time accommodating and adapting to the people around me, and doing things like their way or saying things that they want to do and just really overthinking things. But the 5% of the time where I don't or I can't, I'm often punished for it. But this was the first time in my life I didn't, I didn't and I couldn't think about anything else, and I actually recognized and I put my needs first. And I'm so glad that I did it, and it's something that I will continue to do for myself moving forward. I hope I don't have to get off any more planes, but if I have to, that's what I'm gonna do.
17. 1:11:35 – 1:13:32

    How have you learnt to harness both your ADHD and Autism to become a successful individual?

    1. APAlex Partridge1:11:35

       amazing ability to recognize your, your, your meltdowns and advocate for yourself and make changes, like in that example, has that played a part in the success that you've experienced as an AuDHD woman in business?

    2. PSParul Singh1:11:48

       Yeah, I think so. I think when I work with, um, when I work with my clients, I'm quite, like, transparent about my needs. Um, I actually do have a bit of, um, it's called like a working with me manual, manual of me. You might have heard of a user manual, whatever, like, people call it different things. You often actually use them in the workplace to explain how you prefer to communicate, how you like to take feedback, how you like to collaborate on projects, like what you're driven by, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Um, but nobody thinks that you can use them as somebody who runs a business, because I interact with people all the time, but my problem is, is that I no longer just interact with the same 15 people within my team. I now interact with so many different people, and to be able to advocate for your needs requires that kind of trust and builds a nice rapport. So in my manual of me, I basically say things like, "If you could avoid asking me, um, very important things or asking me for stuff on, like, LinkedIn, because I might miss it, like, please email me. Um, I really struggle with meetings which are longer than, like, an hour. And, like, how I like to receive information, please don't bury key information in a block of text because I will miss it. Please put it on bullet points or bold. If an email is urgent, please tell me if it's urgent," et cetera, et cetera. So actually, I still do those things now, even though I'm not doing it to, like, colleagues that, like, I work with-

    3. APAlex Partridge1:13:09

       Mm

    4. PSParul Singh1:13:09

       ... and I found different ways to actually, like, advocate for myself. And it's, like, very freeing. And what you find is, I always say to people that, like, "These are my needs, but, like, I would really like for you to tell me if you have needs, so it's not me just saying it's my way or the highway." It kind of opens up that conversation for people to say, "Oh, do you know what? Actually, I really like to do things this way." I'm like, "Brilliant. Thank you for letting me know."

    5. APAlex Partridge1:13:31

       Does your ADHD-

18. 1:13:32 – 1:14:28

    Does your ADHD ever mask your Autism or vice versa?

    1. PSParul Singh1:13:32

       Yeah

    2. APAlex Partridge1:13:32

       ... ever mask your autism-

    3. PSParul Singh1:13:34

       Yeah

    4. APAlex Partridge1:13:34

       ... or vice versa?

    5. PSParul Singh1:13:35

       Yeah, all the time. I think, I think it dominates a little bit. It's very chaotic.

    6. APAlex Partridge1:13:42

       A day that autism wins, what does that look like?

    7. PSParul Singh1:13:45

       Oh, it's heaven. It's heaven. I have color-coded my diary. I've actually probably planned it the night before. Um, and I know when I'm having breakfast and when I'm going to the gym, I know what outfit I'm wearing, I know what exercises I'm doing in the gym, I know what lunch I'm eating, I know when my chill time is, um, I know when the laundry is going in, I know who is cooking dinner, I know who is washing up. Everything is planned to a T, and it might sound very excessive, um, but that's actually my day, my i- my idea of an ideal day-

    8. APAlex Partridge1:14:16

       Mm

    9. PSParul Singh1:14:16

       ... actually. That sounds like hell to some people, but I find a lot of comfort in consistency and, like, routine actually. But if I let the ADHD win, that is out the window.

    10. APAlex Partridge1:14:26

        Mm. What's

19. 1:14:28 – 1:16:10

    What is your relationship with alcohol like at the moment and how has that journey been over the years?

    1. APAlex Partridge1:14:28

       your relationship like with alcohol, and what's the journey been like there-

    2. PSParul Singh1:14:33

       Mm

    3. APAlex Partridge1:14:33

       ... over the years?

    4. PSParul Singh1:14:34

       Mm. Yeah, I think we touched on this a little bit in, like, the last one, so that's adds to the interest in development, is that I talked about the fact that I... Obviously the alcohol, like, the, the addictive, like, nature and, like, the, the bars and stuff like that. But didn't I specifically say the noisy bars? That's not an ADHD thing.

    5. APAlex Partridge1:14:55

       [laughs]

    6. PSParul Singh1:14:56

       How did I not know?

    7. APAlex Partridge1:14:57

       There's a bread cr- crumb trail of clues.

    8. PSParul Singh1:14:59

       There's a breadcrumb trail. I have left it. The crumbs-

    9. APAlex Partridge1:15:02

       [laughs]

    10. PSParul Singh1:15:02

        ... are all the way there.

    11. APAlex Partridge1:15:03

        [laughs]

    12. PSParul Singh1:15:03

        Um, interesting. Yeah, so what I think happens, um, which, which I, I, I drank a lot, like, when I was, like, younger. I'm, like, sober curious now. I don't drink very much at all, but I do like, you know, occasions, have a bit of fun, but it's, it's not all the time. Um, the, the sensory overload and the needing alcohol to almost seem normal to people, um, that's the autistic side.

    13. APAlex Partridge1:15:28

        Mm.

    14. PSParul Singh1:15:28

        The ADHD side is the, um, is the, the dopamine. So I'm like, "Oh, drink, dopamine, more drinks, dopamine. Shots, why not?" Um, and it just kind of escalates from there, so, like, the impulsivity and, like, hyperactive nature. So the autism is making me wanna drink, and the A- ADHD-

    15. APAlex Partridge1:15:43

        Mm

    16. PSParul Singh1:15:43

        ... is making me drink more and more and more till I black out.

    17. APAlex Partridge1:15:46

        Mm, yeah. That's hugely relatable.

    18. PSParul Singh1:15:48

        Mm.

    19. APAlex Partridge1:15:49

        Hugely relatable. Um, you could do a whole episode on alcohol I think. I think-

    20. PSParul Singh1:15:53

        Mm

    21. APAlex Partridge1:15:53

        ... um... Getting towards the end now.

    22. PSParul Singh1:15:56

        Mm-hmm.

    23. APAlex Partridge1:15:57

        That was very autistic, wasn't it?

    24. PSParul Singh1:15:58

        Yes. [laughs]

    25. APAlex Partridge1:15:59

        Get... This is showing through.

    26. PSParul Singh1:16:01

        Are you- [laughs]

    27. APAlex Partridge1:16:02

        Getting quite near the end now, Parul.

    28. PSParul Singh1:16:03

        You've, you've got a lot to think about.

    29. APAlex Partridge1:16:04

        Yeah, yeah. Maybe we'll come back in a-

    30. PSParul Singh1:16:05

        [laughs]
20. 1:16:10 – 1:18:41

    The Alien scenario

    1. APAlex Partridge1:16:10

       new scenario segment I wanna run by you.

    2. PSParul Singh1:16:13

       Mm-hmm.

    3. APAlex Partridge1:16:13

       And this is the first time I've done this, so, um, it could go horribly wrong, or it could go quite well. We'll see. The aliens have landed, and we've allowed them to live here with us on Earth, but they have to fit in and therefore have to choose a type of human brain that they want to experience the world through.

    4. PSParul Singh1:16:32

       Oh.

    5. APAlex Partridge1:16:32

       You have been chosen and put in charge of neurodivergent people-

    6. PSParul Singh1:16:37

       Oh, God help them

    7. APAlex Partridge1:16:38

       ... and have to get the alien to choose to have a neurodivergent mind.

    8. PSParul Singh1:16:43

       Mm.

    9. APAlex Partridge1:16:44

       What's your pitch?

    10. PSParul Singh1:16:47

        Ooh, so we're gonna tell them how to, like, behave so that the alien can, like, blend in with people?

    11. APAlex Partridge1:16:54

        You have to sell-

    12. PSParul Singh1:16:55

        [laughs]

    13. APAlex Partridge1:16:55

        ... the neurodivergent mind to the alien-

    14. PSParul Singh1:16:58

        Ooh

    15. APAlex Partridge1:16:58

        ... who's undecided whether to be a neurodivergent or neurotypical.

    16. PSParul Singh1:17:02

        Oh, that's really easy. Um, so you know when neurotypical people say that, um, neurodivergent people, autistic people are, like, really confusing and, like, hard to understand?

    17. APAlex Partridge1:17:11

        Mm.

    18. PSParul Singh1:17:11

        But when we say we're fine, we're actually fine.

    19. APAlex Partridge1:17:14

        [laughs]

    20. PSParul Singh1:17:14

        When neurotypical people say they're fine, there's 47 different meanings to that. So take your pick. Do you wanna be confusing, or do you wanna be straightforward?

    21. APAlex Partridge1:17:24

        Sold.

    22. PSParul Singh1:17:24

        That's my pitch.

    23. APAlex Partridge1:17:25

        Hammer goes down.

    24. PSParul Singh1:17:25

        Yeah.

    25. APAlex Partridge1:17:25

        There we go.

    26. PSParul Singh1:17:26

        I didn't even have to think-

    27. APAlex Partridge1:17:27

        Yeah

    28. PSParul Singh1:17:27

        ... about that. That was, like, that was immediate. Like, when I say something, I mean it. I'm really tired of trying to decipher people. Like, what do you mean you were annoyed? What do you mean that you're upset with me? What do you mean that that was actually supposed to be rude? Like-

    29. APAlex Partridge1:17:41

        What if you've got all the aliens who are like, "Oh, that sounds good, I'll be neurodivergent," but there's one at the back who's unconvinced.

    30. PSParul Singh1:17:46

        Mm.
21. 1:18:41 – 1:21:01

    Most impulsive thing

    1. APAlex Partridge1:18:41

       the most impulsive thing they've ever done?

    2. PSParul Singh1:18:44

       Hmm. How long have you got? I've got a lot, I've got a lot of, I have a lot of things. Um-

    3. APAlex Partridge1:18:51

       [laughs]

    4. PSParul Singh1:18:51

       ... I think mine sh- uh, mine's probably just, like, impulsive, like, purchases.

    5. APAlex Partridge1:18:56

       Okay.

    6. PSParul Singh1:18:56

       Because sometimes, like, 'cause, like, in my last, like, full-time job I actually had, like, like, a, a very reasonable disposable, um, income-

    7. APAlex Partridge1:19:05

       Mm

    8. PSParul Singh1:19:05

       ... fortunately. So which meant I had, like, no constraints. I don't have a, I don't have a kid, I don't have mortgages and all that nonsense which grown-ups have to deal with. So I was like, "Oh, this is my money. I can spend it on, like, whatever I like." So yeah, I think... But I don't regret it. I bought my walking pad 'cause I was like, "Do you know what? I've seen it on TikTok." Straight in my basket, 300 odd pounds, like, gone. Uh, but I actually use it every day, so, like, the impulse is not that bad. That's not me telling people to do impulsive things-

    9. APAlex Partridge1:19:32

       [laughs]

    10. PSParul Singh1:19:32

        ... by the way. Disclaimer, I have no legal responsibility for what you do on that basis.

    11. APAlex Partridge1:19:36

        On a scale of one to 10, how would you say are you responsible with money?

    12. PSParul Singh1:19:41

        Well, I am now. I've gotta be. We've got a cost of living crisis, Alex.

    13. APAlex Partridge1:19:44

        Yeah. [laughs] What was, what, what was the last, um, impulsive thing you bought?

    14. PSParul Singh1:19:50

        Um, a car on a four-year finance 'cause I just needed a new car, and I left the, the-

    15. APAlex Partridge1:19:57

        Mm

    16. PSParul Singh1:19:57

        ... lease too, um, late, so I had a week to sort one out. So I ended up with a really nice white A-Class Mercedes on a four-year lease, which I definitely don't need.

    17. APAlex Partridge1:20:05

        [laughs]

    18. PSParul Singh1:20:07

        I don't regret it, though. She's cute.

    19. APAlex Partridge1:20:09

        No. Amazing. Amazing. God, I bought a car on lease when I was 18, which was the most biggest financial mistake I've ever made, I think. But, uh, but I l- I learned a valuable lesson from it-

    20. PSParul Singh1:20:20

        Mm

    21. APAlex Partridge1:20:20

        ... and that's don't buy a car you can't afford.

    22. PSParul Singh1:20:22

        Yeah, that's a good point, to be fair.

    23. APAlex Partridge1:20:24

        Yeah.

    24. PSParul Singh1:20:24

        I mean, to be fair, it wasn't actually that expensive.

    25. APAlex Partridge1:20:26

        No.

    26. PSParul Singh1:20:26

        No. No.

    27. APAlex Partridge1:20:28

        This has been fascinating. Thank you so much.

    28. PSParul Singh1:20:30

        I know, sorry [laughs] we've, like, gone over, like, so much.

    29. APAlex Partridge1:20:33

        [laughs] No, it's been brilliant.

    30. PSParul Singh1:20:33

        But, um, yeah, no, I've really enjoyed it. Thank you so much for having me back, and it just, it feels completely... Like, I feel like a different person being here, but it also feels, like, completely different, like, actually, like, sat here-

Episode duration: 1:21:06