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Adam Brown — Bubble universes, space elevators, & AdS/CFT

Adam Brown is a founder and lead of BlueShift which is cracking maths and reasoning at Google DeepMind and a theoretical physicist at Stanford. We discuss: destroying the light cone with vacuum decay, holographic principle, mining black holes, & what it would take to train LLMs that can make Einstein level conceptual breakthroughs. Stupefying, fascinating, & terrifying. Enjoy! 𝐄𝐏𝐈𝐒𝐎𝐃𝐄 𝐋𝐈𝐍𝐊𝐒 * Transcript: https://www.dwarkeshpatel.com/p/adam-brown * Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dwarkesh-podcast/id1516093381 * Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4JH4tybY1zX6e5hjCwU6gF 𝐒𝐏𝐎𝐍𝐒𝐎𝐑𝐒 * Deepmind, Meta, Anthropic, and OpenAI, partner with Scale for high quality data to fuel post-training Publicly available data is running out - to keep developing smarter and smarter models, labs will need to rely on Scale’s data foundry, which combines subject matter experts with AI models to generate fresh data and break through the data wall. Learn more at https://scale.com/dwarkesh * Jane Street is looking to hire their next generation of leaders. Their deep learning team is looking for ML researchers, FPGA programmers, and CUDA programmers. Summer internships are open for just a few more weeks. If you want to stand out, take a crack at their new Kaggle competition. To learn more, go to https://www.janestreet.com/dwarkesh * This episode is brought to you by Stripe, financial infrastructure for the internet. Millions of companies from Anthropic to Amazon use Stripe to accept payments, automate financial processes and grow their revenue. Learn more at https://stripe.com 𝐓𝐈𝐌𝐄𝐒𝐓𝐀𝐌𝐏𝐒 00:00:00 - Changing the laws of physics 00:26:53 - Why is our universe the way it is 00:38:22 - Making Einstein level AGI 01:01:19 - Physics stagnation and particle colliders 01:12:07 - Hitchhiking 01:29:48 - Nagasaki 01:37:07 - Adam’s career 01:44:18 - Mining black holes 02:00:30 - The holographic principle 02:24:13 - Philosophy of infinities 02:32:30 - Engineering constraints for future civilizations

Adam BrownguestDwarkesh Patelhost
Dec 25, 20242h 44mWatch on YouTube ↗

At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Vacuum decay, holographic universes, and AI that aces grad physics

  1. Dwarkesh Patel and physicist/AI researcher Adam Brown explore the far future of cosmology, including vacuum decay, bubble universes, and whether advanced civilizations could alter the cosmological constant to escape heat death.
  2. They discuss black holes, entropy, and the holographic principle, leading into AdS/CFT as the clearest example of a consistent quantum gravity theory, and what it might imply for universes like ours with a positive cosmological constant.
  3. Brown also examines physical limits on computation, energy extraction (black hole mining, black-hole-powered ‘batteries’), and galactic-scale civilizational constraints, then pivots to how rapidly AI is advancing in mathematical and physical reasoning.
  4. Interwoven are concrete anecdotes—from nuclear weapons command failures to hitchhiking truck-stop therapy—used to illustrate risk, governance, human behavior, and how AI is already being used by working physicists.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Dark energy likely dooms us to heat death unless the cosmological constant can change.

An eternally positive cosmological constant drives accelerated expansion, permanently cutting us off from most of the universe and capping future free energy; if it can be bled down or transitioned to a lower-vacuum state, our descendants could avoid heat death.

Vacuum decay might be both a natural process and a future technology—with huge governance risks.

Quantum mechanics implies that if lower-energy vacua exist, spontaneous transitions (bubble universes) will eventually occur; advanced civilizations might deliberately trigger such transitions to reduce the cosmological constant, but any attempt effectively rewrites the future light cone for everyone, making “libertarian utopias” incompatible with physical reality.

Black holes define the maximum information density and motivate the holographic principle.

Bekenstein–Hawking entropy shows that the information in a region scales with surface area, not volume, suggesting that quantum gravity in N dimensions is dual to a non-gravitational theory in N–1 dimensions—realized concretely in AdS/CFT, our cleanest example of a well-defined quantum gravity theory.

You cannot rapidly ‘mine’ large black holes; material limits enforce slow evaporation.

Although proposals exist to scoop Hawking radiation with near-horizon “space elevators,” Brown shows the required tensile strength-to-mass ratio would exceed absolute physical bounds (set by relativity and the speed of sound in materials), so evaporation still scales ~mass³ in time and cannot be drastically sped up.

Black holes could, however, be near-perfect matter-to-energy converters for advanced civilizations.

Unlike electromagnetic or nuclear processes, black holes can in principle destroy baryon number and convert almost all rest mass (mc²) into radiation (photons, gravitons, neutrinos), enabling extremely efficient power plants if one can safely control small, hot black holes and capture the output.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

If it is possible for people just to wipe out their entire future light cone, libertarian fantasies can't really happen.

Adam Brown

These are the two most beautiful theories of 20th century physics. These two theories seem to be inconsistent with each other.

Adam Brown (on quantum mechanics and general relativity)

Three years ago, zero. A year ago, a weak student. And now they essentially ace the test.

Adam Brown (on LLM performance on his Stanford GR final)

Nothing is ever a coincidence.

Adam Brown (on deep physical bounds like black hole mining limits)

I can certainly imagine a scenario in which it's five years.

Adam Brown (on being automated as a physicist by AI)

Ultimate fate of the universe, dark energy, and cosmological constantVacuum decay, bubble universes, and multiverse interpretationsBlack holes, entropy bounds, holographic principle, and AdS/CFTPhysical limits on energy extraction, black hole mining, and computationAI progress in reasoning, physics problem solving, and research assistanceGovernance and existential risk from vacuum engineering and nuclear weaponsHuman stories: hitchhiking, truckers, and Nagasaki bombing decision-making

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