Jamie Kern Lima's Billion-Dollar Journey: From Denny's Waitress to L'Oréal's First Female CEO

Jamie Kern Lima 0:00 So this idea that your weight determines your worth is a lie, and it is a lie that is impacting so many of us right now as we speak. 89% of girls and women will opt out of meaningful activities, including interacting with friends or loved ones, when they don't like how they look. And self-doubt will kill more dreams than almost anything else. Don't wait on your weight to live your best life.

Jay Shetty 0:28 Hey, everyone. I've got some huge news to share with you. In the last 90 days, 79.4% of our audience came from viewers and listeners that are not subscribed to this channel. There's research that shows that if you want to create a habit, make it easy to access. By hitting the subscribe button, you're creating a habit of learning how to be happier, healthier, and more healed. This would also mean the absolute world to me and help us make better, bigger, brighter content for you and the world. Subscribe right now. The number one health and wellness podcast. Jay Shetty.

Speaker 1:06 Jay Shetty.

Jay Shetty 1:07 The one, the only Jay Shetty. [laughs] Hey, everyone. Welcome back to On Purpose, the place you come back to to listen, learn, and grow. I am so excited because today's guest is a guest who's on for her second time, but thankfully this time in person. Last time we recorded, believe it was during the pandemic, we were doing virtual interviews. I'm so glad we're not doing those anymore. I'm talking about my dear friend Jamie Kern Lima, a New York Times best-selling author, founder of IT Cosmetics, a company she started in her living room and sold to L'Oréal in a billion-dollar deal, becoming the first female CEO of a brand in its 100-year history. Jamie is also an active philanthropist who has funded leadership training in more than 100 prisons and shelters across the United States and has donated over $40 million in product and funds to help women face the effects of cancer with confidence. Jamie is donating 100% of her author proceeds of her new book, Worthy, to charity as well, How to Believe You Are Enough and Transform Your Life: Simple Steps, Life-Changing Results. This is the book that I want you to go and grab. Order it right now. The book is available as we speak. Please welcome to the show the author of Worthy, Jamie Kern Lima. Jamie, thank you for being here.

Jamie Kern Lima 2:31 Jay, thank you so much for having me. I am excited. This is gonna be an amazing episode. [laughs]

Jay Shetty 2:35 I know. I just want to tell people, just so you know, Jamie arrived an hour ago, and we have spent an hour just chatting and hanging out.

Jamie Kern Lima 2:42 Yes. I love it.

Jay Shetty 2:42 And I love it because I always love spending time with you.

Jamie Kern Lima 2:45 Mm.

Jay Shetty 2:45 We became friends through a mutual friend, Brendon Burchard, a few years ago, and I've always loved connecting with you, learning from you, hearing about how you have these divine downloads, as you call them-

Jamie Kern Lima 2:58 Mm

Jay Shetty 2:58 ... and how you channel in your work.

Jamie Kern Lima 3:00 Yeah.

Jay Shetty 3:00 And I remember when you actually told me, when you were divinely downloading this book.

Jamie Kern Lima 3:05 Yes.

Jay Shetty 3:06 And I wanted to start off by, there's so many things I want to talk about in the book, but, but the thing that's calling me to start with is do you feel worthy today?

Jamie Kern Lima 3:17 Our self-worth is our ceiling in every area of life, and Jay, I have to tell you, um, for the longest time in my life, like, I believed this lie that if I achieve enough, I will finally feel enough. And right now I can tell you I feel more worthy than I ever have, but it is a daily, it is a daily practice. It's a daily intention. And for anyone who is with us right now listening, watching, um, who's ever had a goal, like a big goal or a dream, and they thought, "You know, once I finally get that thing, then I'm gonna feel enough and happy and fulfilled," and then you get that thing, and maybe you worked for like a week or a month or several years, and then you get it, and you're like happy for a while, but you're like, "Why do I still feel like something's missing or like I'm not enough?" And that was me most of my entire life. And usually when that happens, we think, "Oh, I've just got to work harder. I've just got to level up and hustle more and get the next thing and the next thing." And so I spent, oh my gosh, decades of my life, um, kind of as an achiever but deep down inside not feeling like I was enough. Yet I thought I would solve that by doing all these things on the outside that the world told me makes you enough. And what's wild is even after, not to like jump way ahead, but, um, even after achieving some of these things that the days I was a Denny's waitress I could not have imagined selling my company for a $1.2 billion cash, right? Or becoming the first CEO of, you know, a brand in L'Oréal's history, any of those things. I couldn't have imagined those happening, and yet I found myself in a moment in my life where I was achieving all of these things-

Jay Shetty 5:11 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 5:11 ... and still feeling like I wasn't enough. And here's the thing. What I learned the hard way is when we achieve all these things, we build a lot of self-confidence, which is really important, but none of them build self-worth-

Jay Shetty 5:24 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 5:24 ... which is different. And I f- uh, when we have a lot of confidence, when we're crushing it on the outside, but deep down inside we don't feel like we're enough, it will show up in our lives, and it may not show up in our career; it might show up in our relationships. It might not show up in, you know, different areas. And I found myself, um, at this, in this moment in time where I was so confident and all these things were going right, and I had put decades of hard work, and I still didn't feel like I was enough, and I was still sabotaging things in my life. And, uh, it was really only three years ago where, um, there was a big moment that happened in my life with Oprah, actually, where I realized, "Oh my gosh, I am so confident- But I actually have a lot of self-confidence, but I actually don't have a lot of self-worth

Jay Shetty 6:10 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 6:11 And they're very different. And, you know, our self-worth is our ceiling, and, and it's why, you know, even if we arrive at that goal, whether it's, like, a career thing or getting married and having kids or finally getting a six-pack abs or, you know, whatever the things, we s- you still take you with you, which is why you still arrive there and you're like, "Why do I still feel like I'm not enough?"

Jay Shetty 6:35 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 6:36 And as you and I are talking, 80% of women don't believe they're enough, 73% of men feel inadequate and not enough, right? And then you look at other areas of life, 75% of, of, uh, women deal with imposter syndrome. More than 50% of men deal with it. When we believe we are not enough as we are, A, it is a lie, [laughs] it is a lie, but it impacts almost every area of our life. So-

Jay Shetty 7:03 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 7:03 ... uh, a big reason why I wrote Worthy is because I realized, oh my goodness, like, in life, y- we don't become what we want, we become what we believe we're worthy of, and that is the thing. Our self-worth is our ceiling.

Jay Shetty 7:18 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 7:18 And so it's really a book about, you know, Believe It, my first book, was my story of learning to believe in myself, and Worthy is really, like, the playbook. Like, how do you believe in you? It's packed with over 20 tools on it, um, on building self-worth, and it's just the one thing, 'cause it's the identity level.

Jay Shetty 7:34 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 7:35 Like, our self-confidence is, is really important, but it's, it's an internal trait, but it's based so much on the external, on, like, our willingness to try and go for it, you know, how we feel we stack up in compare to others, and how much of the world's definition of success we have, if we're winning or losing. Uh, a- and they show, you know, studies show the boxer who wins the fight is automatically 30% more confident. Our confidence is really important. It's an important part of our life, but it's fragile. It fluctuates. You know, our self-worth is different. It's that deep, internal knowing and belief that we are worthy of love and belonging exactly as we are.

Jay Shetty 8:13 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 8:13 Not as our past mistakes or failures or regrets, not as our future successes, but, like, innately and exactly as we are.

Jay Shetty 8:22 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 8:22 And a lot of people worry, "Well, if I believed I was enough as I am, will I lose my ambition? Will I lose my edge?" And it's like, oh, no, you don't l- you actually become more ambitious, 'cause when you learn to believe you are enough exactly as you are, you, you become fearless about going for things, because you know even if you fail or fall flat on your face or you're embarrassed or it doesn't go well, like, that might shake your confidence, but it cannot touch your self-worth.

Jay Shetty 8:48 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 8:48 Because your self-worth is your ident- it's your foundation. It's alm- almost like our self-confidence is the house w- with all the rooms and the art and the, that we're building in our life, which is so important, but our self-worth is the foundation under it, and our house is only ever as stable and secure as that foundation.

Jay Shetty 9:07 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 9:07 So, uh, yeah, I have been, been obsessed with self-worth-

Jay Shetty 9:11 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 9:11 [laughs] With building it. It is just the w- the one thing that, that changes everything. Um, and it, for most of us, like, we can go into this if you want, but there's, like, three main areas it shows up in our life and when we're struggling with it, so.

Jay Shetty 9:24 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 9:25 Um, but I'm really passionate about it.

Jay Shetty 9:26 Yeah, I love it.

Jamie Kern Lima 9:27 Yeah.

Jay Shetty 9:28 I, I love the distinction you just made between confidence and self-worth-

Jamie Kern Lima 9:32 Yeah

Jay Shetty 9:32 ... because I think we often get those two confused so often.

Jamie Kern Lima 9:36 Yes, yes.

Jay Shetty 9:37 And we feel if I'm confident, then nothing else matters.

Jamie Kern Lima 9:40 Yeah.

Jay Shetty 9:40 And we're chasing confidence.

Jamie Kern Lima 9:41 Yes.

Jay Shetty 9:41 And you shared some of these just now, but when I read this, it really hit me, and it's on the first page of the book, so you can't miss it. But I'm just gonna share this, if you don't mind, because I-

Jamie Kern Lima 9:50 Of course

Jay Shetty 9:50 ... looked at these stats, and it just was like a punch in the gut when I read it-

Jamie Kern Lima 9:55 Yes

Jay Shetty 9:55 ... because I was like, this really hit me. So listen to this. This is reading from Worthy by Jamie Kern Lima, page one. It says, "For the 80% of women

Jay Shetty 10:04 who don't believe they're enough, the 75% of female executives who deal with imposter syndrome, and the 91% of girls and women who don't love their bodies, for the 73% of men who feel inadequate, and the 100% of men who come from a woman and likely have at least one girl or woman in their lives whom they care about, when you believe you're fundamentally not enough and unworthy as a person, it's a lie. The time to unlearn that lie has come. Together, let's leave no girl, no woman, no person left behind in knowing they are worthy." Oh, wow. Like, when I read that, I was like... Those stats just put it into perspective, because I think we often think of feeling worthy or self-worth as kind of like this soft thing.

Jamie Kern Lima 10:56 Right.

Jay Shetty 10:56 And all of a sudden, you read the statistics on it and you think, "But wait a minute, we're all dealing with this-

Jamie Kern Lima 11:03 Yes

Jay Shetty 11:03 ... like, in some way, in some area of our life."

Jamie Kern Lima 11:06 And exactly what you said, we, and me, my, most of my life, I thought self-confidence and self-worth were the same thing.

Jay Shetty 11:12 Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 11:12 So when we're struggling with not feeling enough, and maybe so many people listening to us right now have, you know, all of this stuff on the outside that everyone tells you should make you feel enough, and it's because we're all confusing, we think we just need more self-confidence.

Jay Shetty 11:27 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 11:27 But what we really need is more self-worth.

Jay Shetty 11:30 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 11:30 And they're so different, but we try to solve our feelings of not enoughness with things that just build self-confidence.

Jay Shetty 11:38 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 11:38 But none of them build self-worth, and they're so different.

Jay Shetty 11:42 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 11:42 Like, so many people think they need more self-confidence, which is important, but it's so, so, so different. And for self-worth, if someone's listening to, to us right now, and they're like, "Oh, wait a minute, is this why I don't feel fulfilled, or is this why I feel like it's never, I'm never enough?" For, for self-worth, um, I'm just getting so fired up-

Jay Shetty 12:01 Yeah, do it, yeah. [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 12:01 I'm gonna jump out of your chair. Um, but it shows up for so many of us. Like, you look at those numbers, and it's like, oh my gosh. Uh, three, three ways it shows up.

Jay Shetty 12:08 Yes, please.

Jamie Kern Lima 12:09 So, so if we have low self-worth, right? And again, you can be crushing it on the outside, and you can be hiding this really well. But if you have low self-worth, for a lot of us, it looks like we're stuck-

Jay Shetty 12:20 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 12:21 ... and we don't know why.

Jay Shetty 12:22 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 12:22 We're stuck, and we don't know why. And, and we tell ourselves like, for example, maybe we know we wanna write a book, or we wanna share our ideas at work, or we wanna put our art out into the world, or we wanna find a life partner, and, and, and, but we're not putting ourselves on the dating app, or we're not, like, going out and socializing, or we're not sh- raising our hand and sharing our idea on the Zoom call, or we haven't written the first word of our book. And we tell ourselves stories like, "Oh, I just need more experience," or, "I need to get more skillsets," or a- all these reasons why we're stuck. And they may be true, but what a lot of us don't realize is the reason we're stuck is 'cause deep down inside, we actually don't believe we're worthy of the thing.

Jay Shetty 13:04 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 13:05 And that will keep you stuck all day long and not knowing why. Because again, your self-worth is your ceiling, right? And we don't soar to the level of our goals and dreams. We stay stuck at the level of our self-worth-

Jay Shetty 13:18 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 13:18 ... every time. [laughs] And, uh, that's really how low self-worth, uh, often shows up. And then when you have a low to medium self-worth, what that looks like, maybe a lot of people listening can identify with this, it looks like you'll go for the thing, like you'll put yourself out there, but then you'll either hit a ceiling, a plateau, and you're trying for a breakthrough and you don't know why. Like, maybe you wanna grow your follower count, or you wanna grow your business to six figures, but you're hitting a ceiling at five figures, and you don't know why you can't break past it. Or, or you'll go for it, but you'll sabotage it-

Jay Shetty 13:52 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 13:52 ... right?

Jay Shetty 13:53 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 13:53 You'll go for it, and you'll sabotage it along the way. You'll meet a potential partner, and you'll be like, "They're amazing." And then you somehow are attracted to them, and you put them in the friend zone. Or you'll, you'll write the book, and then you won't send it out.

Jay Shetty 14:09 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 14:09 Like, you'll go for the thing, but you'll sabo- because deep down inside, you don't believe-

Jay Shetty 14:14 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 14:14 ... you're worthy of it. And the third most common way, and this is for people who are ambitious or achievers, this is very, very common, uh, this is me a lot of my life, you'll go for the thing, and you'll actually make it happen.

Jay Shetty 14:26 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 14:26 You'll actually achieve it. You'll actually a- but you arrive at it still feeling like something's missing-

Jay Shetty 14:33 Mm. Mm, mm

Jamie Kern Lima 14:33 ... still feeling like it's not enough-

Jay Shetty 14:35 Mm, mm

Jamie Kern Lima 14:36 ... still feeling like you're not enough. And so you feel unfulfilled, and then you think, "I've just got to achieve more, and more, and more, and more, and more." And the most beautiful part about building self-worth is that you realize, okay, I am... Which, this is the truth, Jay. Every single person listening to us right now, this is the most beautiful part. Every one of us, e- I do not care, your past mistakes, your past failures, what you think you got wrong, who you think you hurt that you wish you didn't, the, any of that, I don't, it, and I don't care how much success you have. It d- none of that matters. Every person right now is fully, fully worthy, exactly as you are. And this journey isn't about learning some stuff you gotta do to be worthy. This is about unlearning the lies-

Jay Shetty 15:22 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 15:22 ... that lead to self-doubt.

Jay Shetty 15:24 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 15:25 And then igniting those truths that, that wake up worthiness in us. And that is the part I'm most excited about, why I'm jumping out-

Jay Shetty 15:32 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 15:32 ... of my chair. Because when I think about everybody listening, when I think about everyone listening and watching, you and I right now, the moment you learn to believe you are worthy-

Jay Shetty 15:43 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 15:43 ... oh, my gosh. Like, that is the moment where it feel, it feels like breakthrough. It feels like joy. It tastes like freedom. It's the moment when unhealthy relationships end.

Jay Shetty 15:53 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 15:53 It's the moment when you put your dreams and ideas out there, no matter how they are received. It's the moment you share your ideas. It's the moment businesses are launched. And I just, yeah, I'm so passionate about this, because, and I talk about this in Worthy a lot, that like, you know, we d- in life, in life, in our relationships, in, in, in, in our friendships, in our hopes and dreams, that, that we don't rise to what we believe is possible, right? And it's hard to believe things are possible. But even then, we don't rise to what we believe is possible. We still fall to what we believe we're worthy of.

Jay Shetty 16:27 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 16:27 It is that one thing at an identity level-

Jay Shetty 16:30 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 16:30 ... that we will always return to. And, and building it is everything, so.

Jay Shetty 16:35 Yeah. Well, I-

Jamie Kern Lima 16:35 Have you ever had a guest jump out of your chair before?

Jay Shetty 16:37 No, you're the first.

Jamie Kern Lima 16:38 I'm like jumping out of the chair-

Jay Shetty 16:38 You're like a rocket. It's like, pow

Jamie Kern Lima 16:40 ... because I'm so passionate about this. [laughs]

Jay Shetty 16:40 I love it. No, it comes across. And, and I'm glad that you raised that, because what I wanted to do with you, which I think would be really important, which was what resonated so strongly with me about your book, was these lies.

Jamie Kern Lima 16:52 Mm.

Jay Shetty 16:52 Like, as I sat here, and I read through the lies-

Jamie Kern Lima 16:55 Yes

Jay Shetty 16:55 ... I was just like, "I've told myself that one. I've told myself that one."

Jamie Kern Lima 16:58 Yeah.

Jay Shetty 16:58 "I've told myself that one. I've told myself that one." And I think our community who's listening to On Purpose right now, or watching, will definitely feel like these lies are relatable. So I'd love to dive into some of them-

Jamie Kern Lima 17:10 Yes

Jay Shetty 17:10 ... that really stick out to me. And I love that you've made it about unlearning lies-

Jamie Kern Lima 17:14 Yes

Jay Shetty 17:14 ... rather than building self-worth.

Jamie Kern Lima 17:16 Yeah, yeah.

Jay Shetty 17:16 Because it almost feels so hard to be like, "Well, how do I build my self-worth?" But when you recognize that actually we're trying to extract-

Jamie Kern Lima 17:23 Yes

Jay Shetty 17:23 ... and excavate through all of these lies, it makes a lot of sense. So let's start with, I wanna start, and we're not gonna go through all of them, because I want you guys to read the book, but I'm gonna pick out a couple that I, that really resonated with me. The first one that really resonated with

Jay Shetty 17:37 me was, of course, don't wait on your weight.

Jamie Kern Lima 17:40 Mm.

Jay Shetty 17:40 The lie, my weight impacts my worth.

Jamie Kern Lima 17:43 Yes.

Jay Shetty 17:44 This has been conditioned deeply into society and into culture, that their weight impacts their worth.

Jamie Kern Lima 17:52 Yes.

Jay Shetty 17:53 Everyone, even if they don't say it, subconsciously feels it in some way or another. There's comparison.

Jamie Kern Lima 17:59 Yes.

Jay Shetty 17:59 There's- ... envy, there's images that are put in front of you about what you should be aiming for and what you should be. Walk us through that personally and then how we unlearn that.

Jamie Kern Lima 18:12 Yes. The lie your weight determines your worth has cost so many of us, like, so much in our life, believing that lie. And I talk a lot about this idea of don't wait on your weight to live your best life.

Jay Shetty 18:28 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 18:29 And this is a whole chapter, um, in Worthy. Like you, like you said, I go into all these lies and how do you unlearn them, and this chapter is not about your weight. It's about the, if you've been waiting on your weight [laughs] to live your best life, um, or by the way, the weight of expectations, other people's expectations or your own. What weight are you, you know, letting hold you down? So this idea that your weight determines your worth is a lie, and it is a lie that is impacting so many of us. Right now as we speak, 89%, 89% of girls and women will opt out of meaningful activities, including interacting with friends or loved ones, when they don't like how they look. And Jay, most of my life, I believed this lie. Even, even when I was crushing it by all other measures, I still, even, even when I built a company that was inspiring and does inspire millions and millions and millions of people to embrace who they are, I was still believing this lie that my weight determined my worth, and I was still waiting on my weight for that. And, uh, the big way to overcome this lie, because first of all, it is a lie. Second of all, for anyone who has hit fitness goals or hit weight goal, they know you still arrive at that goal and you still don't feel enough.

Jay Shetty 19:55 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 19:55 It does not ma- it does not change who you are, right? Because, because it is an external thing that can fluctuate confidence, but it is, it does not impact your worth. That's the first thing. No matter what your weight is or isn't, it do- it, it is irrelevant to your self-worth.

Jay Shetty 20:11 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 20:11 And understanding that's really, really important. But then how to break free of this lie is to flip it on its head, [laughs] which is what happened to me in my life. And as human beings, as you know, we're wired to avoid pain at all costs, and we think, oh, if I... You know, we're waiting on our weight to, to live our best lives, and we think, oh, because I'm not what I think I need to look like, I'm gonna skip out on the event.

Jay Shetty 20:40 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 20:40 I'm not gonna go to the party.

Jay Shetty 20:41 I'm not gonna apply for the job.

Jamie Kern Lima 20:42 I'm not gonna apply for the job. I'm not going to put myself out in the dating world until I'm this or that. I'm gonna stand in the back of the photo, right? I'm not going to live my best life. And, uh, because I think I attach pain to that, I attach the pain of, oh, I might be judged. If I go out in a swimsuit, oh, I might get disapproval. I might be all of these things, and so we hide. When you flip this around, and this is for everyone listening right now, and this impacts men in a huge way, too, uh, a- as well as women, but the numbers are just staggering. But when you flip it around and go, "Well, wait a minute. What has waiting on my weight already cost me in my life?" That, that pain of the regret, when we flip it around and think of it that way, that pain is far more painful than, well, what happens if I'm judged at a party? And in my life, I spent decades, like, telling myself, "Oh, nothing fits. I, I'm just not gonna go. I'm just gonna miss out on this." And it was having my daughter, uh, and I remember this moment, Jay. I was at a public hotel, lots of people there, people I knew were there, and my daughter was one years old and gonna go swimming for the first time. And I was literally on the side of the pool. I looked so cute, but I was covered up, covered up in a c- I had a swimsuit, but I was covered up, covered up, covered up, sunglasses, h- all the things. And I was like, I'm just gonna watch my husband take her and swim. And I had this moment where I'm like, I know why I'm gonna sit here and watch. I'm about to miss out on the first moment my daughter's gonna swim, because I am still waiting on my weight to live my best life. And when I looked at, like-

Jay Shetty 22:31 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 22:32 ... what has this already cost me-

Jay Shetty 22:34 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 22:34 ... the memories, the joy, the all of it, right? And I also realized me doing this is actually me telling her-

Jay Shetty 22:43 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 22:43 ... she is not worthy of her, of her bo- right? And I'm like, the pain of that is far more, and that was the moment. I literally took my coverup off. I walked over to the pool in front of everyone. I shook my cellulite with joy.

Jay Shetty 22:59 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 23:00 Like, jiggled my cellulite with joy, Jay Shetty.

Jay Shetty 23:02 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 23:03 And I got right in the pool. I swam with my daughter, Wonder, and I'm like, I'm done. I am done waiting-

Jay Shetty 23:09 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 23:09 ... on my weight. And here's the thing, y'all. First of all, no one cares. Y- you know what I mean? About even, even people that are really high profile, the p- At the end of the day, it, it cannot impact your worth.

Jay Shetty 23:22 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 23:22 And to unlearn this lie, the most important thing first of all is to realize it has been a lie impacting you.

Jay Shetty 23:29 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 23:30 And then to go, wow, okay, let me really understand the difference between self-worth and self-confidence-

Jay Shetty 23:36 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 23:36 ... and understanding the difference, and then understanding, okay, this lie is impacting my self-confidence. It doesn't-

Jay Shetty 23:42 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 23:42 ... touch my worth, but it is impacting my self-confidence. Now, how do I unlearn it there?

Jay Shetty 23:46 Yes.

Jamie Kern Lima 23:47 How do I unlearn it?

Jay Shetty 23:48 Yes, yes.

Jamie Kern Lima 23:48 And this is how you unlearn it, and I go deep into how to do this in the book because-

Jay Shetty 23:51 Of course

Jamie Kern Lima 23:51 ... when we can reframe a lie and believe, and not only associate more pain with believing it than with just going for it-

Jay Shetty 23:58 Yeah

Jamie Kern Lima 23:58 ... that's when us human beings will go for it.

Jay Shetty 24:00 No, I think that question that you asked is

Jay Shetty 24:03 huge, that question of what has it cost me?

Jamie Kern Lima 24:06 Yes, yes.

Jay Shetty 24:07 And to think that you could've- Never had that experience with your daughter, who's adorable, but, like, to have that moment with her

Jamie Kern Lima 24:17 Do you remember-

Jay Shetty 24:17 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 24:18 Do you remember, I'm gonna share this moment with you

Jay Shetty 24:20 I know exactly. I know exactly what you're gonna say

Jamie Kern Lima 24:21 So, so we were at an airport together, and my daughter, the first time she met Jay, she walks up to you, and she calls you Dad.

Jay Shetty 24:27 Yeah. She's adorable as well.

Jamie Kern Lima 24:28 [laughs]

Jay Shetty 24:28 So I was like, "I'll take it. I'll take it." She's so cute. I'll-

Jamie Kern Lima 24:31 And she's so sh- she's really shy.

Jay Shetty 24:33 Yeah

Jamie Kern Lima 24:33 And she just walks right up to you and calls you Dad.

Jay Shetty 24:35 I know.

Jamie Kern Lima 24:35 I'm like, "What's happening right now?"

Jay Shetty 24:36 I know. It's so funny. I love it.

Jamie Kern Lima 24:38 Remember my husband Paul who comes, I'm like, "Paul, I promise you, don't worry."

Jay Shetty 24:41 Yeah. [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 24:41 Like [laughs] so funny.

Jay Shetty 24:42 She's so cute.

Jamie Kern Lima 24:44 Yes

Jay Shetty 24:44 And it's like, to think, I love that question because I think it's really practical for everyone listening and watching right now to ask yourself, what has it already cost you?

Jamie Kern Lima 24:52 Yes. That's it.

Jay Shetty 24:52 And what is it gonna cost you? That memory with your child-

Jamie Kern Lima 24:54 Yes

Jay Shetty 24:55 ... that potential job that fulfills your dream, that-

Jamie Kern Lima 24:58 Yes

Jay Shetty 24:58 ... great memory with friends, that-

Jamie Kern Lima 25:00 Yes

Jay Shetty 25:00 ... whatever it may be, like, we're all missing out on something-

Jamie Kern Lima 25:03 Yes

Jay Shetty 25:04 ... because of that, and that is such a great, just that one question-

Jamie Kern Lima 25:08 Just that question

Jay Shetty 25:08 ... is a great way to reframe it

Jamie Kern Lima 25:10 And, and, and I know we're gonna dive into some of the lies. This whole book, when, when, when, oh, my gosh, Jay-

Jay Shetty 25:14 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 25:15 ... this is the thing, when you ask yourself, what has self-doubt already cost you in your life?

Jay Shetty 25:20 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 25:20 Right? And then you look at it from that perspective, and a lot of us, we spend so much time building skillsets and this and, and those are important. You know, you and I, you and I was talking about it's important to put in the reps and get the experience and all the things, but also learning how to, uh, unlearn the lies that lead to self-doubt.

Jay Shetty 25:38 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 25:38 Oh, my gosh.

Jay Shetty 25:39 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 25:39 Because again, our self-worth is our ceiling.

Jay Shetty 25:41 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 25:41 And so just, it's so powerful.

Jay Shetty 25:43 Yeah, and we've had that doubting voice, whether it's come through teachers, family members-

Jamie Kern Lima 25:49 Yes

Jay Shetty 25:49 ... whether it's come through your friend at school, whatever it was, we've all adopted doubting voices over time.

Jamie Kern Lima 25:58 Yes.

Jay Shetty 25:58 And now we replay them to ourselves in our own voice, and we think they're us-

Jamie Kern Lima 26:03 Yes

Jay Shetty 26:03 ... when in fact they've just been conditioned and trained.

Jamie Kern Lima 26:06 Yes, and self-doubt will kill more dreams than almost anything else.

Jay Shetty 26:12 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 26:12 Like, literally, and it is a lie, right? And self-doubt lives in our head. It's our thoughts, but it is not you.

Jay Shetty 26:19 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 26:19 It is not you.

Jay Shetty 26:20 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 26:20 And it's like our knowing, our truth, our worthiness, I feel like it's in our soul. It's innate.

Jay Shetty 26:25 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 26:25 I remember, uh, a moment, Jay, where my whole life, I, as a little girl, I would sit there home alone, and I'd watch Oprah. And she was like my hero, right? And I dreamed of meeting her one day. So for everyone listening, maybe you had a, like a, maybe your hero was Superman or, like [laughs] we all have different... I dreamed of meeting her. I'd watch her, and I'm like, "One day I'm gonna host a show and share other people's stories with the world," and she was just my, my hero my whole life. And I remember this moment as a little girl where I'm like, "I'm gonna meet her." I just had this knowing, "I'm gonna meet her," which made no sense.

Jay Shetty 26:56 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 26:56 I'm in the middle of a suburb of Washington State, like, "I'm gonna meet her." I just knew it, and I dared to believe it was gonna happen.

Jay Shetty 27:03 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 27:03 I dared, I prayed it would happen. Fast-forward 39 years, and I had the chance to meet her at an event, which is a long story I won't go into. It was amazing, and then af- it went by so fast, I wrote her a letter after and sent it to her chief of staff, which is one in a billion that she would read, that the chief of staff would read it. Amy was her name. Then one in a billion she would share it. Then one in a billion Oprah would read it. All those things happened, and Oprah invited me to her house for lunch. And I'm sharing this because everyone listening, I think, is gonna have an aha in their own life with how we handle and how we sabotage things we don't believe we're worthy of. And now, this was my dream my whole life, and I went to her house for lunch, which is like, what in the world, right? And, and we had a three-hour lunch, just me and her. At the very end, this is my, my lifelong dream. At the very end of it, she gave me her cellphone number, and she said, "Call me anytime. You can call me anytime." And Jay, in this moment in my life, and I just want everyone to put theirselves in these shoes 'cause we all do this, I was really confident. I did not know there was a big difference between self-confidence and self-worth. And everything was going right in my life, right? Like, I just sold a cosmetic for all this money, like the Forbes list, all these things were... And I was really confident. And the day she gave me her number, I did not call her for four years. Literally didn't call her for four years. And in that four-year stretch, I told myself stories of, that I thought were true, like, "Oh, I just need to have the perfect thing to say, then I'm gonna call her," or, "I bet everyone wants something from her. I'm gonna prove I don't need anything. I'm not..." You know, I'd tell myself. And literally four years later, it hit me like this light bulb that burst where I was like, "The real reason I have not called her was because deep down inside I didn't believe I was worthy of being her friend."

Jay Shetty 29:00 Mm, mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 29:01 And this is what-

Jay Shetty 29:03 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 29:03 ... self-worth, low self-worth will do to you.

Jay Shetty 29:06 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 29:06 You can have a lot of confidence. You could be crushing it everywhere, but you sabotage an opportunity. You sabotage your marriage. You sabotage a friendship. It shows up in different areas.

Jay Shetty 29:16 Yes.

Jamie Kern Lima 29:16 And that was the day, you reminded me of this story 'cause we were talking about our thoughts and our self-doubt. That was the day when this happened, and I realized it. I literally l- I imagined myself turning down the dial, uh, like almost like a volume dial in a, of a radio, of my thoughts and my self-doubt that says, "You are not worthy of being her friend." And I imagine, like, turning up the volume on my soul, like my knowing, 'cause I am a kickass friend.

Jay Shetty 29:43 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 29:43 I know I am worthy of being her or anyone. I am such a good friend, and I know that. And, and, and, and, and I remember turning the volume up on that knowing, and that was the moment I called her. When I learned to, to turn down the volume on my, on the, on the lies that tell us we are not enough and unworthy and, like, tune into our soul and to our knowing-

Jay Shetty 30:04 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 30:04 ... and that was the day I called her. At first I called her, she did not answer. I was like, "Oh, my gosh, four years,"

Jay Shetty 30:09 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 30:09 "and she didn't answer." But then I called again, and she did. Um- And, and, and that was the day I became obsessed with studying self-worth.

Jay Shetty 30:16 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 30:16 Because I realized, oh, my gosh, while self-confidence is so important, while I've worked so hard and I'm so proud and I believe we always need to be building self-confidence and growing and contributing to something bigger than ourselves to feel fulfillment, all of those things are multiplied by our level of self-worth.

Jay Shetty 30:34 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 30:35 And anything times zero is zero.

Jay Shetty 30:37 Yes.

Jamie Kern Lima 30:37 So if we do not feel we are enough deep down, it is why we will be perpetually unfulfilled-

Jay Shetty 30:43 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 30:43 ... no matter how much we achieve. And what is the point of all of it if we are unfulfilled and don't enjoy it?

Jay Shetty 30:49 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 30:50 And so became obsessed with studying self-worth, and I just think about how, you know, I taught a course with her this last year, and now it's... And it almost didn't happen. And when I think about what has self-doubt already cost you, like, for everyone listening and watching us right now, what hasn't happened? What, like, I almost so many times, Jay, doubted myself out of my own destiny, right? And, like, this is why building self-worth is so important. I'm a little passionate about-

Jay Shetty 31:18 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 31:18 ... about Worthy, the book. [laughs]

Jay Shetty 31:19 A little passionate, yeah, a little passionate. I love it. No, but you, you have a chapter in here called

Jay Shetty 31:25 Change Your Relationship With Rejection.

Jamie Kern Lima 31:27 Yes.

Jay Shetty 31:27 And I think what's really interesting about that is that rejection is a reminder that we don't have self-worth, right?

Jamie Kern Lima 31:35 Mm.

Jay Shetty 31:35 That's the root of why it hurts so much-

Jamie Kern Lima 31:38 Mm

Jay Shetty 31:38 ... is because when someone rejects us, it reminds us of how we've been rejecting ourself-

Jamie Kern Lima 31:44 Yeah

Jay Shetty 31:44 ... time and time and time and time again. We haven't showed up for ourself. We haven't lived our authentic self. We have rejected ourself.

Jamie Kern Lima 31:53 Mm.

Jay Shetty 31:53 And so when someone rejects that part of us-

Jamie Kern Lima 31:55 Mm

Jay Shetty 31:55 ... it causes so much pain. So when you're telling us to change your relationship with rejection-

Jamie Kern Lima 32:02 Yes

Jay Shetty 32:02 ... how does one even start? Because I think whether someone's trying to become an actor, or whether someone's trying to get a job, whether-

Jamie Kern Lima 32:11 Yes

Jay Shetty 32:11 ... someone's trying to find a partner, rejection is almost the path.

Jamie Kern Lima 32:16 Yes.

Jay Shetty 32:17 But we don't always see it that way.

Jamie Kern Lima 32:18 Yes, and I love what you just said, said, which is so insightful. Every single time we show up inauthentically too, every time we're not who we are, every time we, you know, show up as our-

Jay Shetty 32:29 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 32:29 ... representative in a room-

Jay Shetty 32:30 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 32:30 ... or the, or the people pleaser and we say yes when we mean no, or any time we show up as someone who we think other people want us to be but not as who we are, we are telling ourselves we are unworthy-

Jay Shetty 32:42 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 32:42 ... of being who we are.

Jay Shetty 32:43 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 32:43 And we slowly but surely chip away at our self-worth. There's a whole chapter in here called You're Not Crazy, You're Just First.

Jay Shetty 32:49 [laughs] Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 32:49 And it's all about the power and the data behind it of, oh my gosh, about how so often the things that we think are wrong or odd or quirky or off or different or strange or, or wrong about us are actually the things that are most right about us.

Jay Shetty 33:02 Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 33:03 And literally, I built a billion-dollar business figuring this out.

Jay Shetty 33:06 Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 33:06 This is, this, this tastes like freedom. When you embrace this, this tastes like freedom. I'm so excited for everyone to read that chapter, and also the one you're talking about. When you change your relationship with rejection, you change your life, and exactly what you said. So, uh, again, so a, so a lot of us associate so much pain with, with getting rejected or failing, right, that that will stay stuck. And, and to your point, it can hit deeper. So here's the thing. Whether we've been rejecting ourselves by not showing up authentically or a lot of us are unaware of past rejections or failures, and, and when we build self-worth, what's beautiful is rejections and failures, they just shake our confidence for a bit, but they cannot touch our self-worth. But for a lot of us, we've had past rejections or failures that, yes, have hurt our confidence, but we've let them take root at an identity level, and we've started to believe we're a failure.

Jay Shetty 34:03 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 34:04 Or we're a reject, and that is when they crush your self-worth. And so I go into a four-part framework called the four Rs in this chapter, and it is, oh my gosh, this might be my favorite chapter because this was almost its own book.

Jay Shetty 34:20 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 34:20 When you change your relationship with rejection, you change your life. I did not want to wait two and a half more years to put it out, which as you know as an author, you have to wait.

Jay Shetty 34:27 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 34:27 I'm like, "No, people need this now." So it's now chapter two in the book. [laughs] Um, but here's the thing. When I was building IT Cosmetics, what a lot of people don't know, they just kind of read the press headline, "Oh, Denny's waitress builds billion-dollar company," but it was hundreds and hundreds of rejections along the way. It was so many people that I just love, and I used to save my Denny's tip money to buy a lipstick at Sephora and in the department s- like, I love shopping there, and all of a sudden they're telling me no, that my idea's not gonna work, the brand's not gonna... And this was no after no after no after no. And from the point I launched this business in my living room, it was three years before I could even af- afford to pay myself a penny, but then hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of nos. And here's the thing. A lot of people, maybe they know IT Cosmetics today, and they see it at Sephora or at Ulta Beauty or at, you know, in the department stores, on QVC, uh, and they don't realize it was actually years of all of them saying no. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. And Jay, sometimes it wasn't just no. It wasn't like, "No, come back later." It was like-

Jay Shetty 35:32 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 35:33 ... "No. N-" Like, some of the nos were so painful I would cry myself to sleep under the covers.

Jay Shetty 35:39 Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 35:39 And most of us have so much pain attached to rejection that we give up after one no or five nos.

Jay Shetty 35:47 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 35:47 Or we start to think that someone else's rejection or no or disbelief in us or whatever it might be is some indication of our potential-

Jay Shetty 35:56 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 35:56 ... or some indication of our idea or our dream or our talent, and it is not. It is not. And so what I, what I, uh, my intention behind this chapter- Was I was like, "Okay, let me break down at a granular level what are the tools on how to reframe rejection so that you actually embrace it in a way-

Jay Shetty 36:16 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 36:16 ... where you become fearless over it?" And I break down the four Rs, which is how I went from, you know, going through hundreds of rejections and literally not letting them take root, literally deciding, like, oh, you know, this is no indication if my business is gonna make it, if my idea's right. And there was one moment after this really painful rejection from QVC, and I knew in my knowing, right? We talk about our knowing. In my knowing, Jay, I knew, like, I'm supposed to be doing this, and every time I'd pray or get still, I just felt this knowing like I'm supposed to be doing it. But everyone around me was telling me no.

Jay Shetty 36:54 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 36:54 Potential investors were telling me no. All these retailers were telling me no. And two things for anyone who needs this today, what I

Jamie Kern Lima 37:02 realized is, okay, I'm getting all these nos, but when I get still, and for some people that's meditation, for some people that's prayer, when I get still and I pray, I will hear a knowing. And every one of us has a knowing, and your knowing is more powerful than anyone else's advice.

Jay Shetty 37:19 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 37:19 And in this case, I had this journey of all these nos, and I had my knowing.

Jay Shetty 37:24 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 37:24 And I believe which one you listen to, do you listen to the nos, and sometimes our thoughts, we're the ones telling ourselves the most painful nos. Or do you listen to your knowing, right? And whether you listen to the nos or the knowing, I think your life, your business, your relationships-

Jay Shetty 37:39 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 37:39 ... can come down to which one you listen to.

Jay Shetty 37:42 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 37:43 But when we're in the journey of understanding that, the nos can be really painful. So there was one particular moment I was crying under my covers-

Jay Shetty 37:50 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 37:50 ... from another rejection from QVC, and I started googling every thought leader, every person who has helped move humanity forward, every person in business who's ever built incredible things. Every single one of them has faced countless rejection-

Jay Shetty 38:04 Yes, yes

Jamie Kern Lima 38:04 ... countless failures, countless setbacks. They're just the brave ones willing to keep going anyways.

Jay Shetty 38:10 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 38:10 And what I realized in that moment was every time I had been getting a no up till then, the first thought I'd have is, "Yep, there's proof I'm not enough," right? And so, and why that's important is for everyone listening, if you imagine yourself getting rejected or imagine yourself putting yourself out there, telling the person you want to be more than just friends, or putting an idea on social media, or going for the business, or applying for the job, and, and, and you imagine yourself getting rejected or failure, or failing at it, think about the first thought you think. Like for me, most of my whole life, it was, "Yep, I'm not enough. Proof I'm not." For a lot of us, that first thought is so painful. And by the way, that first thought is actually your current definition of rejection or failure. That is the meaning, whether you know it or not, that you're assigning to rejection or failure, and that meaning for so many of us is so painful that it will keep us stuck.

Jay Shetty 39:05 Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 39:05 We will quit.

Jay Shetty 39:06 For so long.

Jamie Kern Lima 39:06 We will give up, right? And so for me, my whole life, it was, "Oh yeah, there's proof I'm not enough." And in this single moment, crying under the covers, then googling all these people and realizing, wow, they've all had a million rejections. They're just the brave ones willing to keep going anyways. And that day I wrote down, "Rejection does not mean I'm not enough. Rejection means I'm one of the brave ones." Like, it's a victory. I'm one of the brave ones willing to keep going for it-

Jay Shetty 39:34 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 39:34 ... anyway. I am not one of the ones sitting on the sidelines w- in regret, right? No, I'm one of the brave ones. And so I reframed it, and then every time I got another no, I committed, right? 'Cause right away I would think, "Oh yeah, proof I'm not enough." Like, no, no, no.

Jay Shetty 39:48 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 39:48 I intercept that thought, replace it with this new definition.

Jay Shetty 39:52 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 39:52 Like, this is a victory, means I'm one of the brave ones willing to go for it, and, and I believe that to be true. Um, and so this four-part R framework is to reveal your current definition of rejection, which we all did, right? The first thought you have when you get rejected or failure, that's actually your current definition.

Jay Shetty 40:09 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 40:09 And for a lot of us, it's real painful. When I ask groups of people this, it's like, "I shouldn't have even tried. I'm a loser."

Jay Shetty 40:15 Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 40:15 "I'm stupid. Why'd I go for it?" That's your current definition.

Jay Shetty 40:18 I knew it wasn't meant to happen.

Jamie Kern Lima 40:20 Exactly. And so then when you redefine it-

Jay Shetty 40:23 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 40:24 ... which is what I started to do in that moment where I wrote out, um, "Oh, rejection doesn't mean I'm not enough. It means-

Jay Shetty 40:29 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 40:29 ... I'm one of the brave ones willing to go for it," and then I started building a toolbox in my life-

Jay Shetty 40:33 That's such a great tool

Jamie Kern Lima 40:34 ... right, of new definitions. So another one I love is rejection's God's protection, right?

Jay Shetty 40:40 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 40:40 Rejection is the universe's protection. Rejection, uh, uh, means I'm one step closer to that yes. Rejection is I'm putting in the reps.

Jay Shetty 40:49 Yeah.

Jamie Kern Lima 40:49 I'm, I'm getting strong enough to carry the weight of my success when it does happen. Uh, rejection means like, okay, I'm excited for what's coming 'cause this is not happening to me, it's happening for me, and I cannot wait to... Right? So when y- so I go through in the book how you do this-

Jay Shetty 41:04 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 41:04 ... a- a- and build this new set-

Jay Shetty 41:07 That's huge

Jamie Kern Lima 41:07 ... of definitions that you're committed to. And then the third R is my favorite, and it is called revisit, and this is the one that will change everything. It's gonna be really emotional for everyone likely who does it. But Jay, a lot of us have past rejections or failures, the person that broke our heart, the person that we wanted it to work out so bad and it didn't, or the job we wanted so bad and they didn't see our value and we don't know why, or, or the partner who betrayed us, or the friend that pulled the rug out from underneath you, or the new friend that did not invite you to the party and you don't know why. And, and the third R is revisit, and this is where you go to rejections that have happened that you've let take root-

Jay Shetty 41:51 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 41:51 ... into your identity and tell, a- a- and convinced you you're somehow a reject or you're somehow a failure. And then you apply these first two steps to them.

Jay Shetty 41:59 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 41:59 You reveal what your meaning is you're giving to them.

Jay Shetty 42:02 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 42:02 And then you redefine them. And this is like, oh my gosh, so many of us are letting past Rejections and failures stick to us-

Jay Shetty 42:13 Yes

Jamie Kern Lima 42:13 ... like, like labels that we-

Jay Shetty 42:15 Yes

Jamie Kern Lima 42:15 ... think are permanent, that are like lead balloons on our wings when we're trying to fly and we're trying to soar, and, but we're holding ourselves down. And, and I have done this with so many things in my life, and it has been huge because two quick things. I'm so excited. [laughs]

Jay Shetty 42:31 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 42:31 Like, right ... But, you know, I was adopted, and, um, and I was raised by parents who, oh my gosh, I feel so blessed, but they worked a lot, and I was always home alone watching Oprah in my living room. Uh, but all growing up and later in life I found out I was adopted, and I always had this, told myself this story that, or I always felt abandoned or unwanted. And the way that that came out in my life, oh my gosh, like, I would stay in toxic relationships 'cause I didn't want to abandon the person. Later on when I'm crushing it in business and have over 1,000 employees in my company, I would not fire employees soon enough when, like, they really, really deserved it-

Jay Shetty 43:09 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 43:10 ... because I didn't want to abandon them. And I, I went through this process in the book, and I'm, a- a- and I realized the meaning I was giving to being adopted, the meaning I was giving to growing up alone a lot, and I realized, okay, I can tell myself that story, or I can actually redefine it in a way I know is true.

Jay Shetty 43:28 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 43:29 And I just decided, okay, you know what? My birth mom and dad were together one time ever. Like, God chose me-

Jay Shetty 43:35 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 43:35 ... to be conceived. And then my birth mom's life would've been so much easier if she did not have me.

Jay Shetty 43:40 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 43:40 But she chose to bring me in the world, and my parents chose to raise me. I'm like, "I'm not unwanted. I'm chosen."

Jay Shetty 43:48 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 43:48 And, like, I believe that to be true.

Jay Shetty 43:50 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 43:51 And it has shifted how I show up in friendships.

Jay Shetty 43:53 Wow.

Jamie Kern Lima 43:54 It has shifted how I believe I'm worthy of friendships. Um, and my all-time favorite, just in

Jamie Kern Lima 44:00 case someone needs this today, 'cause I think so many of us have, have been hurt by other people, have been hurt, have people have not loved us the way we need, or we're just hurt 'cause we feel like we're not included, or our friend doesn't see our value, or we're trying so hard to put ourselves out there and it's not working. Uh, I will tell myself this definition, and this is for someone who needs this today. I feel it in my soul. I will literally imagine God saying to me, "Oh, you weren't rejected. I hid your value from them because they're not assigned to your destiny." And I will believe it. And even to this day, it helps me, like, let rejections roll right off me.

Jay Shetty 44:41 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 44:41 Like, if I'm not invited to a party, Jay, the old me wants to think I'm not enough, that I... Like, and right away I'm like, "Oh, okay. God's blocking my value from that person 'cause I don't know why, but they're not assigned to my destiny, and I'm gonna trust it, I'm gonna believe it." And it helps me not let these things take root in my identity.

Jay Shetty 44:57 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 44:57 And it helps me just, like, break free from them. And so I go through the whole four-part framework of, of how to do this. But I, I can tell you, it's almost never an accident when someone has been able to create, or build, or succeed in something. And, and while I have made so many mistakes and I have a lot of issues in my life right now, fear of rejection and failure-

Jay Shetty 45:19 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 45:19 ... is not one of them.

Jay Shetty 45:20 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 45:21 It is literally one of the tools on how I endured hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of rejections.

Jay Shetty 45:26 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 45:26 And then, Jay, like what's so kind of cool, this is cool, is, um, just 'cause I know someone needs to hear this today, that someone else's doubt about you is no indication. It's no indication-

Jay Shetty 45:37 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 45:37 ... of your potential, of if your dream's gonna work, of if your idea's gonna work, if, if you're gonna make it, if, if your business is gonna succeed. And I look back and every single person that told me no along the journey of building IT Cosmetics, and sometimes it was years, even after we built the number one brand in QVC, number one beauty brand in their history. After they said no for years, even after that, I think it was like, I don't know how many more years before Sephora finally said yes.

Jay Shetty 46:02 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 46:02 It was no after no forever, and every single one of those nos turned into a yes. Every single one of them. And it's just like, I don't know who needs to hear this, but n- if you have a knowing, if you have a knowing-

Jay Shetty 46:18 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 46:18 ... that you are supposed to be doing what you're doing, whether it's putting your art or your talent out there in the world, or going for that job, or launching that business. Like, other people's nos-

Jay Shetty 46:29 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 46:29 ... cannot compete with your knowing.

Jay Shetty 46:31 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 46:31 You, and you've gotta trust your knowing. The second you start trusting all those other nos or the nos that get in your head, that will take you down all day long.

Jay Shetty 46:38 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 46:38 Right? It will. But those, that rejection, those nos are no indication of your potential. And so it was just really important for me to go through... It's really like a masterclass in that, in Worthy on how do you reframe rejection and learn to believe it so it does not have power over you, and it doesn't take root in your self-worth, and it doesn't hold you back. So I hope, um, I can't wait for, to hear how this blesses people, and I want them to share this. First of all, anyone listening, share this episode with someone who's like, "Oh my gosh, if they knew how to, like, reframe-

Jay Shetty 47:09 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 47:09 ... a no or reframe rejection." But then, then post and tag Jay and tell him-

Jay Shetty 47:13 [laughs]

Jamie Kern Lima 47:13 ... how this is impacting your life because this is, um, yeah, it just tastes like freedom. And it's all a lie, you know? The, someone else's rejection impacts our potential. That is a lie.

Jay Shetty 47:24 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 47:24 That is a lie. And when we learn not to believe it, it's just, it's freedom.

Jay Shetty 47:28 [laughs] You can see the freedom on your face.

Jamie Kern Lima 47:32 [laughs]

Jay Shetty 47:32 And I want everyone to know, just so that you know some of the other lies that I think you'll love to read when you get the book. Uh, lie, I don't have anything special to offer. You're gonna love that chapter. Another lie, I need to please them to love me. That's gonna be another lie. That chapter's gonna blow your mind. And there are so many other phenomenal insights, tools. Jamie has just shared a tip of the iceberg version of some of the amazing tools that are inside this book. And Jamie, I wanna ask you one last question that I'm, I'm sitting with as I'm looking at your beautiful cover. I'm, I'm witnessing you like a rocket ship flying off of this seat.

Jamie Kern Lima 48:09 [laughs]

Jay Shetty 48:10 Uh, and which lie

Jay Shetty 48:13 are you still trying to unlearn?

Jamie Kern Lima 48:15 Whew. Which lie am I still trying to unlearn? I think, um, every single day I work to unlearn them. Mm. The, the one I will say that I, that feels the best to be unlearning right now, um, I, I mentioned it a little bit earlier but didn't go into it, and maybe this is exactly for someone right now. It's so funny. I'm not even thinking about you and me. I'm thinking about the person listening who is just gonna break free with this. That's why I'm getting so excited. Um, but my whole life, Jay, for anyone who has felt like they're a little odd or different or maybe they don't quite fit in with their family or they're, like, the one that likes to read books when no one else does, or they're the one that, you know, I used- Listens to podcasts. [laughs] Yes, listens to podcasts or has big dreams. I always felt like I had to kinda change who I was- Mm ... to fit in. Mm. And that who I was, if I was fully me, I would not belong. Mm. And I always kind of felt like that, and I always felt a little bit different. And I remember growing up, I would have these big, wild ideas about, you know, things that could impact the world. And, and, and again, I have loving, blessed, loving family, but, uh, I would often hear things like, "Things like that don't happen to people like us." Yeah. Or, you know, things like that, right? And, and I, and- Mm ... and I remember, um, and I'd always hear, like, "You're crazy. You're crazy," and it was a term of endearment, but you know, "You're crazy. Who do you think you are?" And I just got really good at dimming my own light to make everyone comfortable. Mm. Um, I got really good at people-pleasing, and, uh, in my 20s, I was the first person in my five families that I'm aware of to go to therapy. No one had ever gone to therapy that I am aware of, and I remember flat out asking my therapist, I said, "You know, I'm... Am I crazy?" [laughs] Like, my family's always said these words as terms of endearment, but, like, I feel like I'm very different, and I don't fit in. And I, and I asked her, and she said, "You're not crazy, but I'm really glad you're here." [laughs] And, um, she explained to me that when you are the first in your family or your peer group or the people you were raised around or your colleagues, when you're the first to actually be brave enough to be who you authentically are and be willing to think different or love different or vote different or create different, right? Uh, uh, that you will... It often comes with feeling othered or feeling like you don't quite fit in or you don't quite belong, uh, because you are the first-ever you. Mm. And I remember this moment that hit me like a light bulb, like so bright it burst, when I realized I'm not crazy. Mm. I'm just first. Mm. I'm not crazy. I'm just first. I'm the first-ever me, and every person listening to you and me right now, like, you are the first- Mm ... ever you. And if you are one of the brave ones willing to show up in this life as who you truly, authentically are, you are first. Mm. There has never been another you before. There will never be another you again. Like, no one in this world has your unique fingerprints or tongue print or, or iris of your eyes, or we all have a unique heartbeat. But also, if you think about this, right, for everyone listening, no one else has, you know, the experiences you have and, and the emotions that you feel or sees art or beauty in the world the way you do. And so when you show up authentically as who you are, do not be surprised if not everyone gets it. Like, they've never seen another you before, right? There's no social proof that your- Mm ... idea's gonna work if you're doing it authentically 'cause it's never been done before. Mm. And when we talk about that lie, about, oh, I have nothing special to offer, okay, I walked into a beauty industry with tens of thousands of brands, a- and I, and I launched a concealer, then a foundation. That has been done a million times before, but guess what? I dared to do it authentic to me, right? And that has never been done before. And so for every person listening- Mm ... who thinks someone's done my idea, someone's done it better than me, someone's done it smarter than me, that is a lie. Mm. Because when you are willing to be the brave one and show up as who you authentically are, you cannot prove me wrong. It has never been done before. Yeah. Your idea has never been done before the way you're gonna do it, and that is why it is your superpower to be fully, authentically you. Because we think, oh, those things are wrong, if they found out, uh, who I really am, if, uh, you know. Oh, uh-uh. The second you are not you, you, there's an automatic barrier of disconnection between you and customers, you and a potential partner, you and friends. When you are who you fully are, even the quirks and all, that is your superpower. You are not crazy. Mm. You are just first. Mm. And, and, and that has been, I think, the, of all the lies- Mm ... that is the one that is the most freeing. It is the most liberating. It has brought me so, so much closer in my friendships, right? And, and walking into this room with you, Jay Shetty, a friend who I love and adore, if I am thinking about, oh, I need to be a great guest and say the right things, an idea, there's now a barrier of disconnection between me and you, between me and every single person listening and watching right now. And there's probably a billion things I've said that I could do such a better job at, but guess what? I said them fully me. Yeah. I was jumping out of my chair because that is fully me, but this is how people connect. And so every person listening who feels like they have to be something slightly other than who they are, uh-uh. [laughs] Uh-uh. You are not crazy or odd or different. You're first, right? And, and, and the last thing I'll say to that, Jay, when I was, finally got one shot on QVC after years of them telling me no, and, and we sold out in 10 minutes, which is a wild story, and then I eventually did over 1,000 live shows, right? We were selling over $200 million in product a year, just me to a camera on QVC. I mean, the whole thing was wild, but I sat in that green room for over eight years, over 1,000 shows, and I met tens of thousands of entrepreneurs, of brand founders- Of, of celebrities, of people that came in to sell their product on air. One out of every, I don't know, thousand ever come back because it is so hard to hit the sales numbers. 'Cause you're live on air, and they know by the second if you're hitting sales numbers. And I remember watching this, and this is for everyone listening right now, I remember watching, uh, over an eight-year window going, "What is that commonality with the very few who make it?"

Jay Shetty 54:51 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 54:51 What is that? The very few who get vi- and, you know, h- hit numbers, get invited back another time, and eventually build something that lasts. What is that commonality? And I would just watch, watch tens of thousands of, from every- the biggest brands in the world, the most famous people in the world, the greatest founders. And literally, it was not who had the best product. It was not who is the most famous. It was not who's giving the best discount or deal of the day. None of that. And it was not who's the most seasoned salesperson or television professional. The only thing they had in common, the very few who made it, was that they are the same on air when they are talking to customers and selling their pro- as they are off air-

Jay Shetty 55:32 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 55:32 ... in the green room. And it did not matter if they're extroverted or introverted, if they're quirky and out there and big personality or, like, really quiet and very, like, meticulous. It didn't matter. It's the ones that were the exact same.

Jay Shetty 55:45 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 55:45 Because you cannot fake authenticity, and, and, and, and customers and people sense it and feel it, whether it's your online community or it's the people buying your pr- it doesn't matter. And when I watch that, I'm like, "This is the most freeing thing ever."

Jay Shetty 56:00 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 56:01 Because it takes all the pressure off of feeling like you gotta be something you're not-

Jay Shetty 56:05 Mm-hmm

Jamie Kern Lima 56:06 ... or you gotta show up as your representative. And I saw proof before my eyes in the form of literally success, of, of conversion to sales, of people trusting that person, like, right before my eyes, year after year after year, that it does not matter how you show up.

Jay Shetty 56:24 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 56:24 You just have to be authentic.

Jay Shetty 56:25 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 56:26 Like, that's it, and how few people are. And what I realized, the last thing I'll say [laughs] is that, that

Jamie Kern Lima 56:32 I realized this lesson that I try to live by every single day, 'cause I think this applies to every area of our lives, that while authenticity alone does not automatically guarantee success, inauthenticity guarantees failure.

Jay Shetty 56:47 Mm.

Jamie Kern Lima 56:47 Every time, over time.

Jay Shetty 56:49 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 56:50 In every area of our life.

Jay Shetty 56:52 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Kern Lima 56:52 But when we embrace that, it's just all the pressure comes off-

Jay Shetty 56:57 Mm

Jamie Kern Lima 56:57 ... and it just tastes like freedom. It feels like joy. It's when we live in alignment with our assignment.

Jay Shetty 57:04 Jamie, I want to thank you for revealing and releasing so many of the lies I have within me during this conversation, too.

Jamie Kern Lima 57:13 Mm.

Jay Shetty 57:13 I really felt that sitting here and consuming and deeply immersing myself in what you were saying, there were so many wonderful releases that happened just-

Jamie Kern Lima 57:27 Mm

Jay Shetty 57:27 ... just in that process, and I'm sure that I'm not the only one. And so if you've been listening or watching, I would love for you to grab a copy of Jamie's book, Worthy: How to Believe You Are Enough and Transform Your Life, Simple Steps, Life-Changing Results. The book is available now. The link is available in the caption below. Please go and grab a copy of this book. You're gonna love it. Uh, and I said earlier, Jamie is donating 100% of her author proceeds for Worthy as well, and so you'll also be supporting a good cause. Jamie, thank you for coming-

Jamie Kern Lima 57:57 Thank you so much

Jay Shetty 57:58 ... onto On Purpose today. So grateful to call you a friend.

Jamie Kern Lima 58:01 Mm.

Jay Shetty 58:01 So grateful to have you in the studio with us, and so grateful that you put this book together. So thank you for being here.

Jamie Kern Lima 58:07 Thank you, Jay. Thank you.

Jay Shetty 58:08 Thank you so much. Thank you. If you loved this episode, you'll really enjoy my episode with Selena Gomez on befriending your inner critic and how to speak to yourself with more compassion.

Speaker 58:20 My fears are only going to continue to show me what I'm capable of. The more that I face my fears, the more that I feel I'm gaining strength and gaining wisdom, and I just want to keep doing that