Jay Shetty PodcastWORLD LEADING ASTROLOGER: If You Ignore THIS You Could MISS the Love of Your Life!
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
90 min read · 18,016 words- 0:00 – 1:01
Intro
- JSJay Shetty
[intro music] For anyone who's heard of astrology-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm
- JSJay Shetty
... but doesn't really know what it is, what is astrology and how does it work?
- CNChani Nicholas
So astrology is the study of how the sky mirrors what happens on Earth. Astrology and your astrology chart is a mirror of your life, of your life's purpose, of your soul. It's a mirror of the events that also happen on the Earth. And when you're born, somebody's astrology chart is literally like a map of their life. It's a map of your potential, it's a map
- 1:01 – 2:39
What Exactly Is Astrology?
- CNChani Nicholas
of your problems, it's a map of your growth edges. It's a map of all the ways in which you need to grow and work and change into yourself. And what it also signifies is that there's this kind of sense of you're an amulet of the exact time that you were born. So every single moment of life has its own chart. So us meeting today has a chart for it. And it is a crystallization, or the chart becomes a map of what we're crystallizing together. So you as a person, when you're born, we look at, we take a snapshot of the entire sky when you're born, and the exact loca- location and the exact time that you were born. And we see where everything was in the sky, and that is the amulet of you, if you so choose to work with it and look at it.
- JSJay Shetty
So you're looking at everything from the stars, the moon, the position of where you were born, the time of birth.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, we're looking at everything. So literally right now, if we were to take a snapshot of the sky, because we are in this place and because it's this time, there's a specific sign rising up over the horizon. The sun is in a specific place in the sky. And everything else out there in relationship to the Earth is in a specific place, and it's having a certain relationship. And so astrology is the study of those relationships. One of the longest-standing scientific documents is from ancient Babylon, and it's a 700-year documentation of the planets' movements
- 2:39 – 5:31
Understanding the Cycles We Live In
- CNChani Nicholas
and of what happened on Earth during those movements. So it's literally our longest-standing scientific record. Humans forever have been fascinated with what happens in the sky. And if you think about it, I was somewhere recently where there wasn't a lot of electricity, and I could have this, like, beautiful swath of sky. And I was like, oh, wait, remember... or think about what it was like before electricity. The sky, if you could see it, if it was a cloudless night, it was just, like, teeming with light. You could see galaxies. I mean, you can see the Milky Way. You can see... And then you can see the planets moving. And so we've always, until very recently, had a very specific relationship with nature, with all of life around us. And the sky has always been a part of our relationship with life. And the study of the planets and the study of the moon, the study of the sun, the study of the cycles that we live within also taught us how to count, taught us how to understand rhythms. I mean, it taught us math. [laughs] So it was always an integral part of how we came to understand who we were. And so through the study of the planets for, again, hundreds and hundreds of years, people came up with, the ancients came up with an understanding of what the planets did and kind of what they meant. And so we have this lineage of thousands of years of documentation and thousands of years of scholarship, and thousands of years of people examining what the sky was looking like and what it meant for people living that moment out. So you're a moment in time, and I'm a moment in time. And that moment in time had a specific essence. And then you as a person with free will, as a soul, you get to live that out and express that however you want. Like, but it is what it is, but you have free will within that.
- JSJay Shetty
We're gonna get to that.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
I'm gonna ask you about that. When, when did-
- CNChani Nicholas
I know it freaks people out.
- JSJay Shetty
No. When did humans, when did humans start to develop astrology or start to interact with this mindset that what we see in the sky has relevance to who we are? Because when you say who we are, are you talking about personality? Are you talking about, you know-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... what, what elements are you talking about?
- CNChani Nicholas
So the personality kind of test of astrology is fairly new in terms of astrology's long, long history. But humans have painted, like some of the earliest paintings we have from the caves of Lascaux in France, they are the stars, they are the Pleiades. They're the stars that would rise up around the spring, and so it was like the
- 5:31 – 7:42
How Astrology Evolved Over Time
- CNChani Nicholas
rebirth. And so again, we have to remember, like, as hunters and gatherers, as people, you know, just like figuring out how to live on the Earth, we would know what time of year it was because of, yes, where the sun was, but also because of what constellations were rising. So we were literally, like, it was part of our ability to-To find sustenance, to understand where we were in time and space. So in terms of understanding ourselves and our lives and how long that is, we can only go by what we have written down, so that's at least a couple of thousand years old. And I can only assume that it was much older than that because, you know, whatever was written down might have been lost and, you know, the written word is a fairly kind of newer technology in human history. But it's at least a couple of thousand years old that we've been making meaning of what it meant when you were born, that the sun was doing this or there was a, you know, this thing happening over here. And for a large part it was used to understand, like, rulerships, and it was, uh, used to understand the ways in which civilizations would kind of come about, and, like, when it was good for the king to do this [laughs] or the, you know, so-and-so that was in, in power to do that. And then slowly over a longer period of time it began to be much more about the person, and, like, it became more open to the greater public.
- JSJay Shetty
For, for anyone who's listening and they're skeptical about astrology-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... they have their doubts-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... they're cynical about it, what would you say to them?
- CNChani Nicholas
Great. I love it. Like, you should be cynical. And also, God forbid we all like the same thing. [laughs] I just like, I don't think that ... I don't really even wanna live in a world where we all, like, believe in astrology, whatever that might mean. I think diversity is really important. I think that the ma- my main agenda is that you understand what your life's purpose is, and you move towards that with the greatest efficacy possible, and that moves you towards serving the world in your own specific way. I think that for me,
- 7:42 – 11:34
Discovering Your Life’s True Purpose
- CNChani Nicholas
astrology is my quickest entry point into that, but there are a thousand, and they're all legitimate and wonderful. I just want you to find yours. And so if you don't like astrology, great. I don't know of anybody, and I, you know, I'm sure there is people out there, I don't know of anybody that has spent a significant amount of time studying astrology, like really thoroughly studying it, and then feeling like it had no merit whatsoever. Jung, the, the psychotherapist, psychologist, uh, famously thought it was ridiculous and studied it and converted himself, and then he actually became somebody who impacted the field greatly. But I feel like most people that don't like it are thinking about sun sign horoscopes, which are like a gateway drug [laughs] into astrology. Like, they're not the thing. Um-
- JSJay Shetty
Talk to me about the difference between what you're talking about and-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... sun sign horoscopes.
- CNChani Nicholas
So sun sign horoscopes were developed around the time of the p- printing press so that people could have an easy access point, an e- easy entry point into understanding their astrology. 'Cause basically if you knew the day that you were born, give or take, you knew what sun sign you were. But before that, it was very, very focused on the rising sign, and the rising sign's so specific because, again, it's about where you're born and the exact time, 'cause that's the exact piece of sky that's rising up over the eastern horizon. And that's your marker of life. Like, that's your yes, I'm here, I'm saying yes to this life. I am, you know, separate from the body that brought me here, all of that. So your sun sign is like something you share with people that are born within a 30-day span as you. It's very general. There's a lot to be gleaned from it, but it's not your chart. Only your rising sign can tell us your entry point, and then it sets up the entire chart. It sets up the meaning of everything else for you. So it's like looking at a sliver of a picture or, like, even a, a pixel instead of looking at the whole thing.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
So yeah, if you are like, "I don't wanna be boiled down to a couple of tropes about my sun sign," I agree with you. I don't either. That's why-
- JSJay Shetty
Okay
- CNChani Nicholas
... I don't even like talking about my chart [laughs] in public because I don't like having people think that they understand who I am by something so surface level.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And your chart is so much more complex than that. I mean, there's like, there's like fractals of fractals that you can get into of meaning that people, again, spent thousands of years developing, and like, uh, and, and pouring their, their life into. And so your sun sign is, like ... It's fun to share. It's very meme-able. It's very game-able. Um, it's very shareable. And so it's an entry point, but it has so little to do-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm
- CNChani Nicholas
... with the reality of what we're actually looking at when we look at your chart.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. That's relieving.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
That's good. Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
It's, it's-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... really helpful because I feel like you're absolutely right that it's shareable, it's interesting, it's fun to talk about, but then when you look at how valuable it is or how accurate it is, naturally it's never going to feel that way.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
It's the same as a broad personality test that divides you into-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... four core personality types.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
It's like, of course we're far more complex and layered than that.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And we all believe that, especially as we get older. Can you explain ... You've been referencing birth chart and chart.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
- JSJay Shetty
Can you explain what that birth chart is? I imagine it's when you're born, as you were saying, where everything lands in the sky, but can you explain how someone can read that chart? What does that mean to read someone's birth chart?
- 11:34 – 14:52
How to Read and Understand a Birth Chart
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. So it's a snapshot of the sky the moment that you were born from the exact location and time that you were born. And everything in it is in relationship to each other. So you're actually describing all of the relationships that make up your life. And-It is ... You know, you can look at it through the lens of your personality, which is one thing. I think it can be quite reductive when we do that. But what, like, ancient or traditional astrology is more about is looking at the quality of each area of your life. Like, where can someone expect to have success? Where can someone expect to have maybe some difficulty? What are the things that are, like, working for them, and what are the things that are gonna be a challenge, and therefore a growth edge, and therefore an opportunity to develop themselves? And so you can glean somebody's, like, nature from it, but it's really about, like ... You know, if someone's struggling to find love in their life, and you look at their chart, and you see, like, "Oh, yeah, I can understand why that's a struggle," it doesn't mean that they're gonna be in a struggle forever. It means that they're ... The chart is gonna distinguish what the thing is, and therefore, once we know what the issue is, we can work more clearly or more definitively towards the solution for that thing. And so it can be a really great aid in terms of, like, what's, what is the pain that you're carrying? Like, what are the things that you're burdened with in this life? Your chart will reveal that. And that can also be a real solace, 'cause it can feel sometimes like we have this thing that's, like, against us in life. Like, why do- why won't this thing work out for me, or why doesn't this ever kind of take shape for me? And when you can see it in the chart, you can be like, "Oh, okay, that's just a, a setup, but there's other ways to work with that thing. But I have to know what the issue is first." And so I think that astrology helps us to identify ... If you have somebody, you know, adept looking at your chart, or if you have, you know, good education around, like, what it actually is, then we can use the chart to really open up those doors for us. Because without knowing what the issue is, it's really hard to try to meet it.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
So you can do that through therapy. You can do that through a lot of different avenues. Again, astrology-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... is one of them.
- JSJay Shetty
How much of, how much of this is ... Is it so important? You just said that the practitioner needs to be adept.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And it almost feels like to me that the recipient needs to be adept as well.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yes. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
And [laughs] what I, what I, what I mean by that, what I mean by that is, like, I- I've always looked at ... So I never studied this, but as part of my teachings in the monastery-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm
- JSJay Shetty
... we had people who practiced Vedic astrology-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm
- JSJay Shetty
... which is thousands and thousands of years-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... years old. People had incredible experiences of, uh, using ... There's places in India where they use leaves, and there's writings on leaves. There's charts with literally, like, strings attached. I mean, it's, it's spectacular-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... the, the culture and the history of it. But what I found was that, for example, if I
- 14:52 – 19:04
Why “Bad Astrology” Isn’t Real
- JSJay Shetty
know it's going to rain tomorrow, and there's an adept weather forecast with ... By the way, I don't know who does good weather forecasts anymore anyway.
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
But let's say it's gonna rain tomorrow.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
As an adept person who's looking at that forecast, I know tomorrow I better take my umbrella, my b- uh, uh, boots that I'm happy to get wet in the rain, and a raincoat.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And so it requires me to adapt to the information.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
- JSJay Shetty
Whereas often what I've found today is when people feel like they're going through a bad phase-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm
- JSJay Shetty
... or there's something not working for them, it's kinda like, "Well, I can't do anything right now 'cause I'm going through a bad phase."
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And that's like me saying, "Well, I can't have fun tomorrow 'cause it's gonna rain."
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
So talk to me about that. And I, and if I'm wrong, feel free to correct me. I'm just sharing it from what I've heard and seen.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. Yeah. It is the human problem. [laughs] It is the human condition, I think, to try to reduce things down to something that's simple enough to either blame life on or to try to, like, figure out really quickly. And we also try to, I think, have one answer for everything. So you know, I mean, I get why it's so annoying, 'cause everyone'll be like, "Ugh, Mercury retrograde," and you're like, "No, that's not what it's about." [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
I'm gonna get to ... I'm gonna ask you about that in a bit.
- CNChani Nicholas
That's not ... You can't do that. Like, you can't blame every- Or I hear people say, "Well, you know, I'm a Scorpio," and I'm like, "That has nothing do with being a Scorpio." [laughs] Like, I, I get the desire to do that, but that's not ... You're using a hammer to do everything, and you need a feather sometimes, and, like, you need different tools. So yeah, it's, um ... It is a ... It, it's a, it's an interesting thing, because when we're going into a time period that looks really complex astrologically, you wanna hold it with like, "Okay, this looks like it's gonna challenge us. It looks like it's gonna require a lot of mindfulness from us, and it looks like it's gonna require a lot of tenacity, and it looks like it's gonna require more from us than general times. Great. So now we know that, so show up." How can I help people show up to that moment, not reducing it down to, "Everything's gonna be awful," or, "This is why this is happening"? Because if we lived in a world where compassion and, you know, thoughtfulness, and community, and people's health and wellbeing were front and center, then bad astrology wouldn't be that bad. It's not the astrology that's making things bad. [laughs] It's revealing, or it's, it's giving you a kind of understanding of, of, again, certain cycles and timings of things. And so if we can see, like, well, what happened the last time this cycle happened and what, what worked, then we can use it as something that's empowering. If astrology isn't empo- empowering, I don't think you should use it.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
If you feel like astrology is reducing you to something or freaking you out or making you paranoid, I don't think it's working. I think you should put it down and not pick it up again-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm
- CNChani Nicholas
... until that passes, or maybe for the rest of your life. Like, it shouldHelp you to feel like you're more located and you're better prepared. Like, it's... I love the rain. So if it's gonna rain tomorrow, great. Maybe I can, like, have, you know, a moody day where I drink tea and write in my journal. [laughs] That's my fantasy. I have a child, so I can't do that. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
[laughs] I love that. No.
- CNChani Nicholas
I remember days like that. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
I love that. No. Uh, what's the difference between your sun, your moon, and your rising? Because you hear people use this language all the time.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
What's the difference? What does it mean?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. Well, your rising sign is the marker of your life. It is the marker of your yes to life. So it's the marker of your motivation. It is what you're motivated to do here in the world, and it is your yes. It's like, "Okay, I'm here. I'm born." Your sun is how you shine. It's, like, part of how you illuminate, how your soul illuminates things. It's, like, what lights you up. And your moon is your body. Your moon is the physical world. If you think of the moon as the reflector of the sun's light, the moon in our chart reflects the light of our
- 19:04 – 20:16
What Does Your Sun, Moon, and Rising Actually Mean?
- CNChani Nicholas
soul, the light of our sun, and we can only have this incarnation through the body. And so it, it's the holder, the keeper of memory. It is about the physical world and the physical realm, and how sacred it is to have a body, to have incarnated into. And we get to do our life purpose through our body a little bit every day. Come the tiredness and the joy and all the things, but the body keeps the score of all of that, so to speak.
- JSJay Shetty
So when you're reading someone's birth chart-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... you're seeing all of these. Could you give examples of what would fit into each one for anyone that you've read before? Randomly, obviously, you know.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, yeah. Um, well, like when someone has a Leo rising, then they're motivated to show up and really shine in the world. They're motivated to illuminate something, to be charming, to be adorable, to be, like, a recipient of people's adoration or attention. But what it also does, the rising sign gives you a key to the meaning of your life because it, the planet that rules that sign is the planet that steers the ship of your life. And so if
- 20:16 – 25:30
Living in Alignment With Your Chart
- CNChani Nicholas
you feel lost, if you feel like you're not sure what your purpose is, one of the quickest ways to understand it astrologically is to understand where the planet that rules your rising sign is. And so if your, the ruler of your rising sign is in your 10th house of career, then that's, it's gonna be a major part. If it's in your sixth house of service, then maybe your, your volunteering is gonna be... You know, it's like where are the planets located and what job are they doing?
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
The planet that rules your ascendant is literally at the helm of the ship of your life. And so quite often when I give people readings, and over the years I've given mostly strangers readings, and, you know, back before Zoom, before the pandemic, when we were all on Skype, I wouldn't even see the people. I mean, I guess we could have cameras, but mostly it was like, I was almost, like, on the phone with people, and, like, all over the world. And so I d- didn't know them. I had never seen them. "I don't know anything about you. I'm just gonna read your chart." I'd start there, and 99% of the time people would be so relieved to hear that that's what that was because quite often they hadn't been fully living into it, or it was just so innate that that's always what they did, and they're like, "Oh, that's... [laughs] Yes, that is that thing."
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
"That's what I've always been known for." And so when you're not living in accordance with these, these kind of, like, signs, to me, in your chart, if you're not living in accordance with your purpose, then everything is gonna feel wrong and everything's gonna feel misaligned. Like, for myself, I never thought I would write a book. It's not anything I would ever think of, but nothing in my life was working, and I felt so stuck, and I felt so... I felt like such a failure. I felt like I couldn't figure out my place in the world. And I started writing, and people started reading it, and it started to take off, and I was like, "What is this? This is wild." And it wasn't until I started working with my teacher, the person who would, like, really teach me about the lineage that I practice in, that I understood how important it was to follow that mark in my chart because the ruler of my ascendant is in the third house of writing and speaking and teaching. But that's nothing I had put together before. Like, you can look at your, you know, own chart. You can look at yourself in the mirror. You can read your... You know, you can look at yourself all the time and not get it. The beauty of having a therapist or a guide or a coach or an astrologer, somebody that's got some wisdom, is that they hold that third space for you so that you can have that kind of self-reflection. So coming to know that, like, that natural inkling in me was there in my chart gave me the permission to just fully do it.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And then everything started to work, like, overnight. I... People started to pass my stuff around. I met my wife within six months. I mean, like, things just blew up, and it was because of that. I remember the moment where she was like, "Well, the ruler of your ascendant's in the third house." And I was like, "Oh." And it all just clicked. And I'd always wanted to write, but I never thought I was smart enough. I didn't think I was educated enough. I didn't think I was able to do it. And it's literally one of the things that changed my entire life, and it's right there plain as day in my chart, and I didn't see it [laughs] for, like, 20 years. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Wow.
- CNChani Nicholas
'Cause I started looking at astrology and understanding my chart at, like, age 12.
- JSJay Shetty
Wow.
- CNChani Nicholas
So, but I didn't really-
- JSJay Shetty
What did you miss here?
- CNChani Nicholas
I didn't really know what I was looking... because I didn't have traditional astrology.
- JSJay Shetty
Right, right, right.
- CNChani Nicholas
So and, you know, when you meet your teacher-Also everything really starts to come into practice-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... and into place. And so when I met my astrology teacher and she taught me this really ancient, traditional way of doing astrology, it just landed everything, and it was like this whole rubric that was so clear and so concise and so specific. And so not about my intuition or not about, you know, what I felt about the chart or anything like that. Not about like, "Oh, I knew this Scorpio once, and they did this."
- JSJay Shetty
[laughs]
- CNChani Nicholas
It's like really like, "No, if this is here, this means this."
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
"Do this and see what happens."
- JSJay Shetty
So, so you're actually saying that astrology is guiding us. When you say purpose-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm
- JSJay Shetty
... but really you're talking about activity, task, methodology. Like you said, writing, speaking, teaching.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
Those are very occupational in that they are an activity that someone can take out.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
So you're saying that astrology... Am I right in saying that you're saying astrology shares your purpose, and it defines purpose as activity of greatness?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yes, and it can get more complex than that. So say if the ruler of your ascendant's in your eighth house, the eighth house is a place of loss and grief and mental anguish.
- 25:30 – 27:34
When Your Chart Shows the Areas You Struggle Most
- CNChani Nicholas
It's also a place of inheritance and other people's money, and there's a lot of things connected to it. And so when you see somebody's... You know, when you see a significant placement in a part of the chart that's really difficult, you have to wonder if they've got there yet. But often when I see really significant placements in difficult houses in the chart, I'll ask, like, are you a, are you a grief doula? Are you someone who does trauma-informed counseling?
- JSJay Shetty
Mm-hmm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Are you... You know, do you feel really receptive to other people's pain and suffering?
- JSJay Shetty
Mm-hmm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And so it's not as clear someti- Like sometimes it is. Like you could go and study and be, you know, a, a someone who does hospice work or something like that, if that called to you. But sometimes it's a little bit, uh, less specific. But it's very important still for that person to be able to move towards that area of life and know that the inklings that they have towards that area of life are very much embedded in their life's purpose. And I've just seen time and time again, once they, once you take that action towards that, that things just start to-
- JSJay Shetty
Right
- CNChani Nicholas
... open up and fall into place. And then you find your way to do that signature in your chart.
- JSJay Shetty
Can your astrology tell you whether you're gonna be a millionaire or a billionaire?
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs] Well, there's a famous quote attributed to JP Morgan that says, "Millionaires don't use astrology, but billionaires do." And it's not clear if he actually ever said that. But he worked with an astrologer, Evangeline Adams, for a very long time, and he was actually, like, a student of hers. He got readings from her, and she taught him. And so he used astrology to do his banking. So I think that there are definitely signatures that can tell you when somebody is really adept at working with the material world.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm. And whether they engage with that
- 27:34 – 29:12
Can Astrology Reveal Future Wealth?
- CNChani Nicholas
or not is also their choice.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
I see a lot of people that have a lot of talents in their chart, in their life, and they don't necessarily engage with it. You also have to have the friction.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
You also have to have the thing that spurs you into action to make use of the gifts that you've got.
- JSJay Shetty
But your astrology doesn't tell you whether you have that part?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, it does.
- JSJay Shetty
It does.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
So, so your astrology could literally say you have talent, but you have no spark.
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs] Well, I wouldn't say that to somebody.
- JSJay Shetty
Right, yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
I would say if someone has a really, like, easy setup, I would say the most important thing for you to do is to embrace the struggles in your life.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Is to, like, really lean into what is gonna challenge you and who is gonna challenge you and what's gonna help you to struggle to find your own way.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And don't lean on the things that are necessarily so easy.
- JSJay Shetty
It's fascinating, 'cause I can think of so many people in my life who-
- CNChani Nicholas
Right?
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. And it's interesting that astrology also, I assume by what you just said right now-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm
- JSJay Shetty
... believes in growth being critical for humans to live a great life. The holidays are all about connecting with each other. That's why we exchange gifts. That's why we have holiday parties. It's part of what makes this time of year so special. You know what else is about connecting? Facebook. It helps you stay connected with friends, maybe get to know them a little better, and that can help you pick out a perfect gift through Facebook Marketplace. And a little connection goes a long way. Let's reconnect this holiday season with Facebook. I believe that travel is one of the greatest gifts that we've ever been given,
- 29:12 – 32:42
Asking Yourself What You Truly Want
- JSJay Shetty
and Chase Sapphire Reserve has been my gateway to the world's most captivating destinations. When I use my Chase Sapphire Reserve card, I get eight times points on all the purchases I make through Chase Travel, and even access to one-of-a-kind experiences like music festivals and sports events. And that's not even mentioning how the card gets me into the Sapphire Lounge by the club at select airports nationwide. Travel is more rewarding with Chase Sapphire Reserve, trust me. Discover more at chase.com/sapphirereserve. I have a lot of friends who say to me, and they're not, they're not speaking astrologically-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... they're just speaking in self-awareness.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And they're saying, "Jay, this is just who I am." They're like, "Jay, you're ambitious. You're driven."
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
You know, I'm not.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And so, you know, this is just my life. And I'm like, "Well, I don't know if I was always ambitious or driven. I feel like there were skills I learned and habits I developed, and there were coaches and mentors in my life who taught me certain things." And you can build confidence, and you can build skill sets that allow you to live a better life. And I don't just mean materially-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... I mean spiritually as well.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And they'll be like, "No, no, no. But, you know, some of us are wired like you, and some of us are not." So-Is that true? Is that-
- CNChani Nicholas
I mean, there's ... I think there's some truth to that.
- JSJay Shetty
Okay. To- yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
But I think you can choose to not s- rest there, right? Like, it's do y- what do you want from this life? It's really about that. Like, are those people happy? Or are they suffering-
- JSJay Shetty
Generally not.
- CNChani Nicholas
Right. [laughs] But are they interested in their suffering enough to do something to change it? And so what I'll look for is, is time periods that will come along and kinda put the pressure on-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm
- CNChani Nicholas
... and be like, "This ... You're gonna ... If you haven't done your work, if you haven't individuated, if you haven't really tried to build something in yourself of your own efforts, then this period of time is gonna really be rough."
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
But that's good for you. [laughs] Like-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah, yeah, yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... you know? Like, Saturn will come along as a planet of boundaries and structure, and it will come along and hold you in place until you figure out h- how to either m- find another way to move or to, like, lift the weight that's on you enough times until you get strong enough to move it completely.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And Saturn's a, a planet that you can also look at in terms of your life cycles. So Sa- Saturn comes along every seven years and does something really important. So at age seven, it comes along and helps you to distinguish yourself a little bit from your parents, helps you to find, like, your own s- And then at age 14, age 14's usually, it's ... That's called a Saturn opposition, and it's usually a time where something happens in our life. And, you know, we're 14, so it kind of makes sense psychologically speaking. But something happens where we're like, "Wait a minute. This is what I want. This is what you want. These are the expectations you have on me. This is what ... " And then at 21 we have another one, and it's part of the adult cycle. And then from 28 to 30, Saturn closes the loop and we go through something called a Saturn return, and that's where we move through our first really big threshold, where we move from whatever remnants of being a child or whatever remnants of being a young adult kind of, like, have to trickle away, and we're asked to move and cross a threshold into our true adulthood and to take responsibility for our decisions and our actions. And so if you
- 32:42 – 36:06
What’s the Difference Between Fate and Free Will?
- CNChani Nicholas
miss that, if you're like, "Nah," it's gonna be harder and harder, and you'll have ... Like, in the next seven years, you'll have another moment of struggle. And so that, like, saying the seven-year itch is interesting 'cause it is, like, a Saturn cycle.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. And even in marriage, right? Like-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... most divorces happen at five to seven years.
- CNChani Nicholas
Oh.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
That's interesting.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. It's that friction point.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm.
- JSJay Shetty
Fascinating. Okay. Well, you write in your book that our chart isn't our fate, it's an invitation. And I think this idea of fate and free will, and you mentioned it earlier, but what does astrology believe about fate and free will? Do we have agency, or is everything predetermined?
- CNChani Nicholas
You and I right now are in this city. We're not in a city ... We're not in France. We're here. And so there's certain conditions here. We can't do everything here. But we can do all the things in, in this city that we can do. And so it's the same with your chart. It's like you're given a landscape. What do you wanna do with that? How do you want to approach it?
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And how do you wanna work with these really specific skills and this really specific setup?
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. It's almost like I was born in London-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... you were born in Canada.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And that created a certain environment-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... of what was available-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... what I was aware of-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... what was possible.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
But somehow I've ended up in LA.
- CNChani Nicholas
Right.
- JSJay Shetty
You lived in LA and you live in New York now.
- 36:06 – 38:41
What Astrology Shows About Your Relationships
- CNChani Nicholas
and I look and see I'm in a challenging aspect, then I can be like, "Oh, okay." Then it's not just out of the ... It doesn't feel random, I think-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm
- CNChani Nicholas
... for some people.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm-hmm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And so that's the other side of, like, "Mercury's retrograde, so nothing's gonna work out." [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
We don't wanna do that, but we do wanna use it and be like, "Oh, okay. It's just a time period. It's just a cycle that we're in-"
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... that I'm in."
- JSJay Shetty
Does your astrology tell you who you're gonna fall in love with?
- CNChani Nicholas
No. It tells you, though, what you need out of a relationship.
- JSJay Shetty
Interesting.
- CNChani Nicholas
So it tells you the quality and the nature of the person that you need. So for me, also, I didn't realize this until after I had met my wife, but I really need somebody to, like, work with me. I need someone to be like ri- I need someone to partner with me in every single way possible. And when we met, she just did that instantly. And I was working with my teacher at that point, and she pointed that signature in my chart out to me, and I was like, "Oh my God, that's what she does." Like, me and my wife met, and I didn't even know how to put a PayPal button on my website, like, on my blog, and she put it on there in, like, two seconds. And I was just like, "Wow, you're a magician." [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
[laughs]
- CNChani Nicholas
And we just became business partners, like, immediately. And so then we grew this business together, and then we created an app and, you know, the, the rest is kind of history. But she was an immediate partner for me, and that is a very specifically, uh, accurate, you know, like, read of my chart. So you, you can see, like, what kind of qualities and what kind of nature you need from somebody.
- JSJay Shetty
Does it predict when you're gonna fall in love?
- CNChani Nicholas
I mean, I'm sure those Vedic astrologers at the ashram would say yes. There's certainly definitely timing techniques. There's, like, ancient timing techniques for everything. I think that, um, they're correct. They don't necessarily ... I don't know if they'll always say, like, how long it will last. Some astrologers are excellent at doing that. But I think that what's more important is understanding yourself, understanding the qualities that you need in a partner, and finding that energetic match with somebody else before you really even touch the astrology. I don't know. I, I think I'm not as interested in finding out when something's gonna happen in my life as I am in understanding who I am-
- JSJay Shetty
Couldn't agree with you more. Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... and what I've got to give this moment,
- 38:41 – 47:13
Choosing the Best Timing for Big Decisions
- CNChani Nicholas
and, like, what's possible here. Like, what, what could I ... what could I do with what I have? Because I think that our agency is the greatest power that we have. And so I, again, I never want the astrology to get in the way of you understanding your agency.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
So those predictions can be right, but I don't know if they're helpful to know.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. It see- I, I imagine, though, that that's the kind of questions people ask you. Because when I, when I talk to my friends who-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... go to astrologers, it's constantly to figure out, like, when am I gonna meet the guy, or, you know, when, when should I ... you know, when should I think about selling my company? Or-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... when should I start my company, or ... Those are the questions that I'm hearing that they're asking-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... and then they tell me what their astrologer said.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And sometimes people will be as specific as, "You should marry someone whose name begins with R, and you'll probably meet them in the next six months."
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
Or, or they'll get an answer that's like, "Well, you're not gonna find someone for two years."
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And, and so what do you make ... You're saying that that could be accurate, but you're saying that's actually a, not the best use of astrology almost.
- CNChani Nicholas
Well, that's, that's up to you.
- JSJay Shetty
Right.
- CNChani Nicholas
Right? It's like, what do you wanna use it for? I don't use it for that because I don't think that's helpful for the people I work with.
- JSJay Shetty
Right.
- CNChani Nicholas
I think that picking a time to launch your business-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... is great. If you, like, give me a timeframe. If you're like, "I wanna launch it in the next three months," I'll give you the best day and time within the next three months to launch it.
- JSJay Shetty
Talk to me about that. So how is that calculated, and why is that important?
- CNChani Nicholas
You just look for the best signature within the timeframe you're given.
- JSJay Shetty
And what is-
- CNChani Nicholas
You don't have, like, forever. You just have, like, the timeframe. So if people wanna get married, I'm like, "Well, what's the best day in August to get married?" And then I have to look at a time that's, like, reasonable to get married. [laughs] Like, I'm not gonna say 4:00 in the morning. I'm gonna say ... I'm gonna look for, like, an evening period or an afternoon period, and then look to see ... I want the conditions of the planets associated with the event to be good. So if a wedding, I want Venus to be good. And if Venus is really not in a great situation the month you wanna get married, then I'll look for something else. Like, I'll ask you, like, is it really ... Do we have to do August? [laughs] Could we do July, or is that totally out of the question?
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And if it's out of the question, then it is. You just ... You have to live your life.
- JSJay Shetty
And how does that impact the quality of a marriage or a business?
- 47:13 – 52:46
Staying Grounded in What You Feel
- JSJay Shetty
on people we've dated, family, experiences. So to go back to that and expand my compassion, it's like, well, actually, the question we're asking is based on this deep feeling of just not being loved.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And therefore we're not ... We're not really asking, will I find love in three months? We don't really care about that.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
But we're just like, will I ever find love is really-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... the question I'm asking.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And I would like to have, have it to happen tomorrow-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... 'cause that would make my life better.
- CNChani Nicholas
I think it will.
- JSJay Shetty
How, how would you ... Yeah, so how would you guide someone who is going through that experience that I just mentioned to you when you're reading their charts? And of course their chart is gonna say what it's gonna say.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm.
- JSJay Shetty
Which we, you know, you can help me hypothetically, but-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... what, what happens? What, what are you guiding them?
- CNChani Nicholas
If someone comes and they're really-
- JSJay Shetty
They're just like, "Look, I got broken"-
- CNChani Nicholas
Is that like they're trying to make something happen?
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah, so like, "I got broken up with-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... two years ago."
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
"I am still getting over it. I've been dating this guy. I don't know if he's into me. I can't even tell. But I just really wanna settle down. Like, I just wanna fall in love and get married and have kids and have a great life. And I'm a good person, and I've got my career sorted, and that seems to be going well. But-"
- CNChani Nicholas
Like every straight woman out there. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Totally. Totally. And I have a lot of friends who are in that position right now.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And they're coming to me, so I'm asking you.
- CNChani Nicholas
It's rough out there. [laughs]
- 52:46 – 54:27
If You’re Not Ready, Focus on Inner Work First
- CNChani Nicholas
I've lost." [laughs] "I'm too old now," or, you know, all the things that, that come with being out of sync in those kinds of ways. So we each have our own journey. We don't know why it is. And yes, the chart will speak to it. But I first and for- foremost wanna hold you as a human and acknowledge what you're struggling with.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And then that's a real struggle, and those are real fears.
- JSJay Shetty
Can people miss the love of their life, success, that moment because they weren't prepared at the right time?
- CNChani Nicholas
Ooh, gosh. That's... [laughs] I, I think that for me, I have certainly done things to delay my own success and my own arrival. I have burned bridges. I have done things in the past that I look back on and I'm like, "Oh my God." But I was so full of insecurity. I felt so unlovable. I felt so all the things, that I didn't know how else to act. I was coming with my best, and it wasn't meeting the situation. So in one way it's like, well, I wasn't ready for it, and I had to learn and grow and, you know, really, like, kinda wrestle with life and learn. And so I wasn't quite ready for it. But I don't know if you can miss it.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
I don't know. I think, I feel like that's kinda fatalistic.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
I f- I just feel like when you... That you w- you won't catch the other relationships maybe, or
- 54:27 – 57:45
Noticing the People Who Changed Your Life for the Better
- CNChani Nicholas
the other job opportunities. Like, you will lose some stuff if you don't know how to show up for it.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
But it doesn't mean that it won't come back in-
- JSJay Shetty
Right
- CNChani Nicholas
... a different iteration.
- JSJay Shetty
It doesn't mean it will never exist.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
It just means it could be delayed.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And-
- CNChani Nicholas
And then you gotta wait for the next bus to come. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Right.
- CNChani Nicholas
And then you gotta, like, figure out what you're doing with yourself. Are you gonna read a book? Are you gonna waste your time on TikTok? I don't know.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah, yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Like, what are you gonna do in the in between?
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. Does astrology believe in the idea of the one? That there's one perfect person for you, or that there are many people who it could work with?
- CNChani Nicholas
I don't think it ... It doesn't have that kind of judgment. It looks at the chart. Like, you can see when someone will have multiple significant partnerships. You can see when people have multiple children. You can see ... Like, there's are, there are ways of seeing those things. And then there's ... You know, it's really important for us to understand, like, how, how we work, right? So, like, if I understand how I work, then every relationship I'm showing up to is gonna have a greater potential for me to learn from. And so the one ... I don't know. Like, every- everyone that I'm in a relationship with is so important to my life and my understanding. Like, every single friend, everyone in my company. Everyone teaches me so much 'cause I'm always learning about how I'm dealing with another human being given the conditions [laughs] I'm dealing with them in. So I think everyone is the one that we're ... If we're in a relationship and we're in contact, like, that's it. And then there are these people ... Like, no one else in my life made me feel seen the way my wife did, ever. No one got me. I don't trust anyone like I trust her. Like, her talent, her, her instincts, her intuition, her knowledge, her wisdom is, for me, just unparalleled. So the synergy between us when we met was just undeniable. There was too many things that happened that were like, "That was ... How did you know that I was gonna say that?" Or, "How did you pull that book out? I was gonna give it to you." You know, there was just so many things that occurred that I was like, "This is bigger than the two of us. This is something else. This is a third thing."
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And that is so unique and so special that you might call that the one, and that's fine if that's the language. I just think it's really important to recognize when those things occur. There are some people that come into your life, and they just change the entire trajectory of it. I've had teachers like that, and I've had, you know, this relationship that has been like that.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And everybody else was really helpful [laughs] .
- JSJay Shetty
[laughs]
- CNChani Nicholas
You know, like, I did great. It was g- ... You know, I did ... It was fine.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
But this is a distinct category in and of itself, I think, when ... And that's my calling.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Like, that's my life story.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah, yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
I know people that don't have that story. They have a different story. And so some people's one is their career or their art.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- 57:45 – 1:03:52
Inspiring Others Through Your Own Growth
- CNChani Nicholas
... I want us to live in, like, a village full of really distinct, different humans that do life in all kinds of different ways so that we can share childcare and [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
[laughs] I love that. [laughs]
- CNChani Nicholas
Not everyone should have children.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Not everyone should get married.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
You know? Like, some of us should live on the outskirts. Some of us should live in the center. Like, some of us are cooking for everybody. Some of us are teaching. Some of us are-
- JSJay Shetty
Will your astrology tell you that's better for you?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yes.
- JSJay Shetty
Like, does astrology, does astrology predetermine whether you're gonna have kids or not?
- CNChani Nicholas
Uh-
- JSJay Shetty
Like, how many kids you'll have.
- CNChani Nicholas
I've had a Vedic astrologer tell me that I wasn't gonna have kids, and I do.
- JSJay Shetty
How do you ... How ... So how do you reconcile that, someone who practices, who believes in-
- CNChani Nicholas
I understand why he said that, and yet it's not true. So it's like-
- JSJay Shetty
Why did he say it? What?
- CNChani Nicholas
It's a certain condition in my chart, and it's, like, not great for having kids. And you could ... I mean, I'm queer, so the way we had a kid is different than how heterosexuals have kids. So if he was trying to look at my chart through a heterosexual lens, then yes, he's right. But-
- JSJay Shetty
Interesting. Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
You know? So it's really about the astrologer and where they're coming from. I've had an astrologer look at my chart and be like, "I don't know how you're ever gonna find love. Like, basically you're doomed." [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
But how does that ... So how is ... So how do you reconcile that?
- CNChani Nicholas
I was like, "That's a really awful thing to say to somebody. That's not helpful. Even if you think that's true and you think you're right, I don't know how that's ever gonna help me."
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
So as an astrologer or a coach or a therapist, even if my person in front of me takes it all with a grain of salt, I have a tremendous responsibility to be very encouraging of somebody's best to come forth. I don't need to make them feel doomed.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
That's ... Everybody already does feel doomed.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah, yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Like, we already go there. So what can I do to help fortify that person? To help them find their power, their creativity, their special thing in this life, and to move from that place?
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Um, I don't need to make you feel like you've got a lack of anything.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- 1:03:52 – 1:10:51
What is Your Saturn Return?
- CNChani Nicholas
well. And I think that, you know, we're humans, and so you have to take that into account, that when you're going to another human for advice or for their expertise, you're gonna have your own relationship with them. You're gonna walk into the room, and they're gonna have a reaction to you. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely.
- CNChani Nicholas
And it's up to them whether they deal with that in a-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... productive way or not.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
So many people talk about Saturn return.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
What is it actually?
- CNChani Nicholas
It's when Saturn comes back to the same place it was when you were born. And because Saturn is the planet that to the naked eye is the last planet in the, in our little solar system, it was thought as such a big moment because every 28 years you go through this closing of a loop. So between the age of 27-ish, 28, 27, to 30, you go through this kind of closing of a door, and a threshold experience into a new stage of life. Saturn is the planet of responsibility and of adulthood. And it's also the planet that's of mortality. It's like, "Hey, I'm the time lord." Like, you don't have all the time in the world. So at 30, you should be going through some kinda crisis, some kinda like, "Oh, [laughs] I guess I'm gonna get old too." And you should also be doing things that require everything from you. Saturn is a planet of discipline and hard work. And so this is the time to put your money where your mouth is, to like, be in the game fully, and to, again, own your choice, and to say, "I chose to do this." And it's also a planet of separation. So in some way, shape, or form, we usually separate from our family of origin. Maybe that's psychologically, maybe it's physically, maybe we get married, maybe, you know, some kind of big life transition happens at that time that distinguishes us from our family of origin. Not that we're not still part of it, and we could still be living at home even, and well, and, you know, for the rest of our lives. But there's something here that's like, I have to build a s- really solid foundation in the world that is mine, that is apart from the thing that I come from, or apart from the convenience or the comfort-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm-hmm
- CNChani Nicholas
... of the people that ... You know, hopefully you have people that love you, and you can really, can fall back on them. But you need to understand that you can go out there and do something for yourself, or that you can separate in the ways that you need to separate, psychologically, emotionally, sometimes physically, sometimes monetarily.
- JSJay Shetty
So that's not a negative thing at all.
- CNChani Nicholas
No, that's really good.
- JSJay Shetty
But then why do we talk about it in such a-
- CNChani Nicholas
Because the internet. [laughs] Because people are like, "Oh, my Saturn return was awful."
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And then they blame everything on the Saturn return. But a Saturn return should be a time of, of a kind of like, again, discipline, awareness, strictness almost. Like, severity sometimes. But also, like, so much joy.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Like, in my Saturn return, I moved to LA.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And I was ... I didn't know anybody here. I didn't have any money. I didn't have any contacts. I didn't have anything. And I was-Like elated
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
I really did walk out of my life. I was living in Toronto, and I, I left, and I started this whole new chapter here, and it was on my own terms, and I had to really prove myself to myself-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... that I could do this. And there were days where I didn't have anybody to call, and there were financial struggles, and I didn't have a car. And like, it was a whole thing, but I did it. And that, no one could ever take that away from me.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah, yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And as much as I believe in community and I believe that we shouldn't live in an individualistic kind of culture, we have to do those things that help us understand what we're made of-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- 1:10:51 – 1:14:19
Why You Don’t Need to Fear Your Saturn Return
- CNChani Nicholas
discipline, [laughs] and some of us really have a hard time with it. You know, there are signatures in the chart, I have, I have some friends like this, that they're just so good at having fun.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And so it's hard to, like, gather them and to, like, help them to focus.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Because part of the signature of their life is to, like, enjoy things.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And then you have to kinda, like, work against that somewhat.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. So if someone's about to enter their Saturn return-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... what would you recommend they do?
- CNChani Nicholas
Do the things that are hard, that are gonna, that are going to require everything from you, that are going to be worthwhile in the long run. Like, what is gonna be satisfying to you seven years from now? Do not think about instant gratification. Do not ... This is not a social media game. Like, this is about if you only had seven years left, what would you do? Like, what do you wanna make sure you've left here? And what would move you deeper into your integrity so that you were proud of even having attempted it? And if it's not that serious, then it's not really either part of your Saturn return, or it's not gonna last for that long. And so if you ... It's ... A lot of times people will get to that age, and you'll start to see their life crack because they've spent their 20s in an industry that maybe wasn't the industry of their dreams or that took everything from them, and they realized it's not really their calling. And so they've been locked in this maybe, like, corporate thing, or they've been locked in this other, you know, relationship. And you start to feel the cracks show-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm-hmm
- CNChani Nicholas
... at around 28, 29, 30. And so this is your chance. This is like a portal of time. I mean, any day is your chance, but this is a time where the pressure and the gravity of what doesn't feel good in your life will become really acute. So if you're fearing your Saturn return, you're actually fearing the truth of your situation, and you're fearing confronting what you actually need to do and the work it will take to do it. And that's fine. You can fear it, but you can also just, like, embrace it-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm
- CNChani Nicholas
... and move into itAnd, and be okay with ... I think you also have to be okay with being alone, going it alone. You have to be okay with doing something that wasn't expected. You have to be okay with disappointing people.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And it's a time where you're supposed to learn about boundaries. And so if you can't have a boundary with yourself, which is to say, "I will not abandon myself," then it's gonna be really rough.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
But if you promise that you will not abandon yourself, you will not abandon your gifts and your talents and your inner knowing, then the Saturn Return will really set you on a course that feels like liberation.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Because it's stripping you down and being like, "It's this, or it's gonna be ... Like, what pain do you wanna choose?"
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
You wanna choose the pain of choosing the thing you know you need to choose, or do you wanna choose the pain of denying that?
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And that's kind of the crossroads that the Saturn Return finds us at.
- JSJay Shetty
You have totally redefined my perspective
- 1:14:19 – 1:18:58
Is Mercury Retrograde Actually That Bad?
- JSJay Shetty
of Saturn Return.
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs] Oh, good.
- JSJay Shetty
Brilliant. It's so much more powerful as well. It's so-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, it is. It's so powerful
- JSJay Shetty
... yeah, it's so power- it's so empowering.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
It's so clear.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
It's so, it's so, it ... Better than cl- It's so clarifying-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm
- JSJay Shetty
... to know what you need to focus on and what this period of life is about, and also just, like, the willingness to get on with it and build-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... and, you know, create.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And so the other, the other word that's thrown around is Mercury retrograde.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah, yeah. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
And so I was like, so what is Mercury retrograde?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. It's-
- JSJay Shetty
And how does it actually affect you?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. It's very common. It happens three to four times a year for three weeks a year, three weeks each time, so that's, like, at least nine weeks a year out of 52 it's gonna be retrograde. So because it's so common, th- it is so prevalent, and it is so misunderstood. So ... [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Please clarify.
- CNChani Nicholas
I wish no one ever mentioned Mercury retrograde. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Because I think it's the main reason why people hate astrology, because someone at the office will be like, "I told you everything was gonna go wrong because Mercury is retrograde." Um, it is the planet of communication, and is the planet that can rule every ... And we, you know, rely on gadgets and technology, and that's all, uh, a- the ways in which we communicate. So there's some very famous, you know, things that have happened during a Mercury retrograde with tech companies that are kind of comical. I'm sure they're really difficult for the people that are working in them, but for, like, sites to go down and for communication to be bumpy is what is supposed to happen during Mercury retrograde.
- JSJay Shetty
Interesting.
- CNChani Nicholas
But it becomes this catch-all for everything. It becomes a catch-all for everybody's every emotion. It becomes a catch-all for every single thing going wrong ever in the universe. And so then it loses its definition, and it loses its specificity, and it loses its meaning. So it's something really common that happens, and what it's trying to teach us is stop, pause, and turn around and look at what just happened. Review where you just came from. Review the document. Do you need to send that text? Like, it's a good time to practice, even whether or not you believe in astrology, it's just, like, a good time to practice mindfulness and thoughtfulness and reflection, and that's really what it's about.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
Or it's supposed to be about. It's just, like, a good time to be reflective. And I find that it's a, it's a ... I also have a tech company, so, um, I think that sometimes we feel it a little bit more acutely than other people. If something's gonna break, it generally does break during Mercury retrograde.
- JSJay Shetty
[laughs]
- CNChani Nicholas
And I hate it because I'm always telling people it's not ... You know, I'm like, "Don't make such a big deal about it."
- 1:18:58 – 1:20:22
Don’t Use Your Sign to Excuse Bad Behavior!
- CNChani Nicholas
a certain way that I don't wanna do that, but I might be doing it unconsciously? So it's a good time to also think about the ways in which we speak to each other.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And I think because our culture is so, like, go, go, go and forward, forward-Um, these are just invitations-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm
- CNChani Nicholas
... to be more reflective and considerate of what we're saying and how we're saying it.
- JSJay Shetty
Do you think sometimes we use charts and signs as an excuse for our bad behavior or-
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs] Yeah, always
- JSJay Shetty
... acting a certain way? [laughs]
- CNChani Nicholas
Always. I wish, I wish, I wish we didn't do it 'cause I, I- it's not what it's about. It's never, um... [clicks tongue] It's never the reason why someone's acting badly.
- JSJay Shetty
Interesting. Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
It's not 'cause their sign.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
It's because a need isn't being met, or, you know, there's some- they're dysregulated or, you know, there's something else happened before they walked in here. They might do it in a certain style that might be in accordance with what you think their sign means, but it's not that. As humans, we're always looking for patterns. And of course, as an astrologer, I love to look at patterns because I look at cycles, and I try to see like, oh, what happened 300 years ago when Pluto was in Aquarius? Oh, we had an industrial revolution. Oh, Pluto just went back into Aquarius in March of 2023. Oh, that's when ChatGPT exploded onto the scene. [laughs] Like, that is another
- 1:20:22 – 1:23:14
Are Certain Signs More Compatible?
- CNChani Nicholas
industrial revolution. And there's a million signatures that you can look at like that, so it's interesting to see, like, these big cycles. But because humans always wanna find pattern recognition, what we tend to focus on is, like, that Gemini broke my heart, and so I'm gonna see that characteristic in every other Gemini that I ever meet, you know? And that's... I just don't think it's helpful.
- JSJay Shetty
We often hear about how certain signs are compatible-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm
- JSJay Shetty
... and certain signs are not.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm.
- JSJay Shetty
Based on what you just said.
- CNChani Nicholas
Awful advice. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Not good?
- CNChani Nicholas
Every sign is compatible. There are-
- JSJay Shetty
No way.
- CNChani Nicholas
There are specific ways in which the signs will re- like, say... So when people talk about that, they're often talking about their sun sign, so that's again one tiny part of someone's whole entire chart. I really wanna look at the moment that you were born, you have this full picture of the sky, and the moment they were born, there's a full picture of the sky. How do those two pictures line up? Because there's all those different points. I need to know if your... what style is your Venus, what style is their Venus? There's no bad combination of Venus signs. There's just styles. Like, your style of being your sun sign and my style of being my sun sign will have a relationship in a certain way, but that's also obviously based on us. But it's, it's not about there being good and bad matches.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
There's about being... There's certain resonances with certain signs. But y- you shouldn't be with somebody just because there's ease. Like, that's silly.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
And it really is about the whole entirety of somebody and their chart, and the whole entirety of you and your chart, and how those full two things go together. But I don't think you should look at somebody's chart until you know them.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm, because we'll make assumptions.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. I think there's such a negativity bias that we have obviously naturally as humans-
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah
- JSJay Shetty
... that as soon as you hear, like you said, "Oh, my last ex was a Gemini-"
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
"... this one is, too," or, "Oh, the chart said this, and this is why."
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. Yeah. I don't... I just don't think it, it's helpful when you're trying to meet somebody and get to know them.
- JSJay Shetty
So when you're dating, you'd suggest we actually just date the person.
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs] Yes, I would love that.
- JSJay Shetty
And if we-
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
... if we happen to like them and things are getting more serious, and we believe in astrology and value it, then that should come later.
- 1:23:14 – 1:25:32
Making “Incompatible” Charts Work Together
- CNChani Nicholas
someone and really, again, try to feel what it feels like to be with them. What is the energy between you? Like, do you feel safe? What is your body saying? Like, what are they telling you? [laughs] What are the little things they're telling you that you would normally not listen to? Are there red flags? Like, there's a million things to look at and pay attention to before you get to an astrology chart.
- JSJay Shetty
Can astrology charts tell you about some of the long-term red flags?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
Like what?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. Like where you'll, uh, have, like, communication issues down the road. Where, like, your Venuses, like our... my Venus is in a certain sign, your Venus is in a certain sign. So if it's really different, or if they don't have a relationship with one another, then we're gonna have to work to kind of like connect it. You know? There's things that will eventually aggravate you about any person that you're with long term, and those differences and disparities are in the charts, but they're also in the relationship so you know what they are. The chart will just kind of confirm that, that those are differences, and this, these are where you come together, and this is where you kind of go your separate ways. [laughs] Or this is where you will generally tend to, like, miss each other. Like, my wife and I have very different incompatible charts, and a lot of things just don't go together. There's obviously places where it's like full harmony, but then there's places where we're just like kind of alien to each other almost. [laughs] And it's not that I don't relate to those parts of her, or she doesn't relate to those parts of me, it's just we do it so differently.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And that's what makes our relationship. You know? It's like, oh, that's what... She's doing the thing, or I'm doing the thing, and that makes me have to struggle to, like, appreciate and understand somebody else, and there's always gonna be that disparity in any relationship.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.Yeah, I couldn't agree more
- CNChani Nicholas
I feel like we always want everything easy and-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... simple and prepackaged, and it's like-
- JSJay Shetty
Well, I, yeah, I, I couldn't agree more. It's almost like that balance between it shouldn't be excruciating or torture you, obviously.
- CNChani Nicholas
No. Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And then it, it can't ever be fully seamless and easy.
- 1:25:32 – 1:33:04
Who Are You as This Year Comes to a Close?
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah.
- JSJay Shetty
And-
- CNChani Nicholas
That's only when we're first born-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- CNChani Nicholas
... hopefully with our parent, you know? Like-
- JSJay Shetty
If that.
- CNChani Nicholas
If that.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yeah. Most of us don't even have that. But that's what we're, I feel like, trying to get back to.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
That totally... To that total union, and that's not what being a human is.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
We s- have to separate from each other, and we have to find those places, um, of difference.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah. As, as it's coming up to the end of the year, and-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm
- JSJay Shetty
... people may be looking back and thinking this year didn't go the way they wanted to.
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
Maybe they didn't make the progress in their career that they wanted. Maybe their relationship is just about surviving. Maybe they haven't found a partner that they're looking for.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm-hmm.
- JSJay Shetty
How would you encourage them to release this year so that they can truly move into the next year with a healthier mindset and approach?
- CNChani Nicholas
I think that one of the things that's important to remember about this time of year, at least in the Northern Hemisphere, is that we're moving into more and more darkness. We're moving away from the great activity of summer, and we're moving into the quietness and the stillness. Which, again, is hard for most of us because life is so busy, but I think it's really important to allow yourself to think about this frame of time, especially as we move closer to the winter solstice, as being a time where we're just allowing a waning of energy to occur, and we're allowing that waning of, of conscious activity to help us transition into a, a place of, of stillness and regeneration. And then if we don't allow those times of release... Like, if the year was hard, it was hard for, I think, most people in a lot of different ways, in a, a lot of different places. And so if we don't allow certain times, especially at the end of the year, to unwind and to, to fully kind of just, like, let it be. Like, whatever this year has been for you, that happened. It impacted you. What is it that you're left with now? And just allowing some days, especially, you know, in December, especially as we move towards the 21st of December, the solstice, to just be with what was. Who were you at the beginning of last year? Who are you now at the end of this year? And have those moments of reflection because you know, like, the year will change, and things will open up, and it'll be busy, busy, busy, and it'll be a lot of things. But astrologically speaking, 2025 was one of those, like, game-changing years where all of these major planets changed signs, and so it was a signal that this year was gonna be very different than years that we've had in the past. And there was gonna be things that were gonna happen this year that were gonna impact us for decades to come. So if you feel like you haven't been able to do all the personal things that you wanted to do, yes, like, we're in the midst of a massive transition and a lot of change. And so you're also caught up in a greater cycle of things, right?
- JSJay Shetty
Mm-hmm.
- CNChani Nicholas
We're in a collective thing right now, and so the world is working and looking differently. And so allowing yourself time to just reflect, and not even so much with your mind, but just, like, allowing your body to decompress in any way, shape, or form, to just deal with the impact of what this year has brought, I think is a huge gift to yourself. And allowing yourself some time... Again, if you don't have kids. [laughs] Allowing yourself some time to write, to reflect, and to reset. Like, you can reset. We can take-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm
- CNChani Nicholas
... a pause. We can, you know, turn the off switch off. Like, let it drop down, and give yourself a minute-
- JSJay Shetty
Mm-hmm
- CNChani Nicholas
... to be a human.
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah.
- CNChani Nicholas
And just, like, let the reckoning kind of happen. But allow yourself to be human-
- JSJay Shetty
Yeah
- 1:33:04 – 1:37:35
Chani on Final Five
- JSJay Shetty
your success and your ability to help so many people because I can easily tell from sitting with you for the past couple of hours that everything you're doing is coming from a great place, but also is truly trying to guide people towards their greatness and-
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm
- JSJay Shetty
... their best self.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm.
- JSJay Shetty
And, you know, through, through all the amazing teachings and studies and resets that you've done.
- CNChani Nicholas
Mm.
- JSJay Shetty
So thank you so much.
- CNChani Nicholas
Thank you so much for having me.
- JSJay Shetty
It's such a joy. Uh, we end every episode of On Purpose with a Final Five.
- CNChani Nicholas
Yes.
- JSJay Shetty
These questions have to be answered in one word-
- CNChani Nicholas
Oh, gosh
- JSJay Shetty
... to one sentence maximum.
- CNChani Nicholas
One word, okay. [laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
So you have a sentence. You have a sentence.
- CNChani Nicholas
Okay.
- JSJay Shetty
Uh, so Chani Nicholas, these are your Final Five.
- CNChani Nicholas
Okay.
- JSJay Shetty
The first question is, what is the best advice you've ever had or received?
- CNChani Nicholas
If you choose it, do not feel sorry for yourself about it. Your agency is your greatest gift and your greatest power. The moment you feel sorry for yourself, you decouple yourself. You do the, yourself the greatest disservice. If you choose it, do not feel sorry for yourself about what it takes to make it happen. You can un-choose it, but if you're choosing it, this is what it is. Do you still want it?
- JSJay Shetty
Such a great answer. I love that.
- CNChani Nicholas
That's so many que-
- JSJay Shetty
So good
- CNChani Nicholas
... so many sentences.
- JSJay Shetty
No, that was great. That was great.
- CNChani Nicholas
[laughs]
- JSJay Shetty
I loved it. Second question: What is the worst advice you've ever had or received?
- CNChani Nicholas
Someone telling me they didn't know how I was ever gonna find love.
- JSJay Shetty
Mm.
- CNChani Nicholas
I don't know if that's advice, but-
Episode duration: 1:37:35
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