Joe Rogan Experience #1174 - Vinnie Paz

Vinnie Paz 0:00 ... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 0:02 If they don't fuck up, I don't trust them.

Vinnie Paz 0:04 I... My father, my father used to say-

Joe Rogan 0:06 Who-

Vinnie Paz 0:06 ... if, if someone doesn't say the word "fuck," or if their name is an initial, don't trust them.

Joe Rogan 0:12 Yeah, that's a ch- creepy one. Initials are creepy.

Vinnie Paz 0:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:15 But you never know. It's like, it's not a hard fast rule.

Vinnie Paz 0:18 No, I give everyone the fair shake, but I'm looking-

Joe Rogan 0:20 Yeah. Hmm.

Vinnie Paz 0:21 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:22 If they frickin', if they're, all the time, it's frickin' this and frick-

Vinnie Paz 0:25 Or Mickey Ficky.

Joe Rogan 0:26 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 0:26 I heard that one time.

Joe Rogan 0:27 Oh, I never heard that one.

Vinnie Paz 0:28 Yeah, someone said, "Mickey Ficky."

Joe Rogan 0:29 Instead of motherfucker.

Vinnie Paz 0:29 Yeah, I wasn't happy about it.

Joe Rogan 0:31 "Shut the front door" is one, like, moms like to do around their kids.

Vinnie Paz 0:34 Yes. Yes.

Joe Rogan 0:35 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 0:35 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:36 Hmm. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 0:37 I come from a Wobbesau, Philly family, so it's like a fucking Richard Pryor...

Joe Rogan 0:42 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 0:42 You know? Uh, uh, uh, uh it's the seven fishes on Christmas Eve is like a Richard... Is like, uh, R- him on the Sunset Strip.

Joe Rogan 0:48 You know who surprisingly doesn't swear? Teddy Atlas.

Vinnie Paz 0:52 I know Teddy doesn't... I, I, I, I've seen... You know how animated he... I don't have to tell you.

Joe Rogan 0:56 He gets very animated.

Vinnie Paz 0:57 He's just on your show.

Joe Rogan 0:57 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 0:57 Very animated, but yeah, he doesn't really-

Joe Rogan 0:59 Yeah, it's like frickin' this and frickin' that-

Vinnie Paz 1:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02 ... and-

Vinnie Paz 1:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02 What the frick? He says, "What the frick?"

Vinnie Paz 1:04 It's nuts.

Joe Rogan 1:05 Yeah. You know who also doesn't swear? Henry Rollins.

Vinnie Paz 1:08 Rollins does not.

Joe Rogan 1:09 Does not swear.

Vinnie Paz 1:10 Yeah, but-

Joe Rogan 1:11 And he makes note of it. "Note that I don't swear."

Vinnie Paz 1:14 He, I mean... I feel like that happened in the second half of his life.

Joe Rogan 1:18 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 1:18 Because-

Joe Rogan 1:18 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:18 ... Black Flag records-

Joe Rogan 1:19 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 1:20 ... not so much.

Joe Rogan 1:21 Yeah, I think he's trying to, uh, get mo- uh, I don't wanna say more people to listen to him, like trying to be more mainstream. But he's trying to eliminate the noise-

Vinnie Paz 1:30 Sure.

Joe Rogan 1:31 ... in what he's doing.

Vinnie Paz 1:31 Sure.

Joe Rogan 1:32 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:32 He's a brilliant mind.

Joe Rogan 1:33 He is.

Vinnie Paz 1:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:34 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:35 Unlike me. I mean, you're really... Rogan, you've hit a, you've hit a w- uh, a, a little snag here.

Joe Rogan 1:41 Yeah?

Vinnie Paz 1:41 Teddy Atlas, Jordan Peterson, Shapiro, Henry Rollins, then this.

Joe Rogan 1:46 No, dude. Uh, I love your music.

Vinnie Paz 1:48 (laughs) Thank you, man.

Joe Rogan 1:49 Get the fuck outta here. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 1:50 No, I'm being...

Joe Rogan 1:50 We were saying, you were saying, you know, about fuck ups before the show. I was saying, I don't know anybody who's a artist who doesn't fuck things up. Like, if you're, if you really create... There's something about being, like, legitimately creative. There has to be something wrong with you.

Vinnie Paz 2:02 Well, you're wired differently.

Joe Rogan 2:04 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 2:04 So what, what we perceive as... What, what people see- perceive as b- fucking up isn't to us.

Joe Rogan 2:10 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 2:11 So it- it... Technically, it's a fuck up. But in reality, to us, it's just, um, just behavioral... It's just how it works, I think.

Joe Rogan 2:20 It's just traits.

Vinnie Paz 2:21 Yeah, sure.

Joe Rogan 2:21 Yeah, like if you were working in an office in human resources, you would... You, there, there's no way.

Vinnie Paz 2:26 I'd be gone in, like, three hours.

Joe Rogan 2:27 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 2:27 Yeah. But before that, I'd probably put a bullet through my head.

Joe Rogan 2:30 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 2:30 If I was in a cubicle. Just give up at that point.

Joe Rogan 2:33 (sighs) Some people can do it though. Some people, it's not a problem.

Vinnie Paz 2:37 No. I, I... They, they're just wired that way from b-... I knew f- from such an early age that I'm not wired this way. You know what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 2:46 Yeah, me too. Yeah, I, I was terrified of getting a job all... When I was a child.

Vinnie Paz 2:51 Y- y- yeah, it's fearful. But-

Joe Rogan 2:53 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 2:53 ... what you've done though, man, it's, um... I've told you how much of a fan I am, but I'm such a fan of how punk rock... You've built all of this outside of th- um, what you were expected to do. This show is a fuck you, really.

Joe Rogan 3:11 (laughs) It's just what it is. You know what I mean? This is the, this is what happens when you don't calculate.

Vinnie Paz 3:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:18 When there's no cal- you just do what you wanna do.

Vinnie Paz 3:20 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:20 This is what happens.

Vinnie Paz 3:21 But people don't have the balls to do that.

Joe Rogan 3:23 It's, uh, it's a little bit balls. It's a little bit Fear Factor gave me a lot of financial freedom.

Vinnie Paz 3:27 Sure.

Joe Rogan 3:28 That was, that wa- that helped too.

Vinnie Paz 3:29 Sure.

Joe Rogan 3:29 You know? When you're not worrying-

Vinnie Paz 3:31 NewsRadio?

Joe Rogan 3:31 Yeah. NewsRadio did a little bit, but Fear Factor did way more. It just gave you, gave me enough money, so I go, "Okay, the money part I got."

Vinnie Paz 3:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:38 So now let's just have some fun.

Vinnie Paz 3:40 Sure. But look what it's become.

Joe Rogan 3:42 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 3:42 You changed people's lives, man.

Joe Rogan 3:43 It's weird. That's the weird part. That, that wasn't an... That wasn't anticipated. It wasn't a- a part of the plan.

Vinnie Paz 3:49 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:50 It was just supposed to be smoking weed and having a good time.

Vinnie Paz 3:52 Yeah. Well, you're not aware until you're aware. Until people say, "Yo, you've helped me through tough times. This show has got..." You know, I... People tell me about your show. "Yo, that, that guy gets me through tough times." You know, and that's... What's more important than that?

Joe Rogan 4:07 Well, people need friends, you know?

Vinnie Paz 4:08 Sure.

Joe Rogan 4:08 And they, they need community. And one of the things that this show has shown, by having all my friends on all the time is like-

Vinnie Paz 4:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:15 ... this is a tight group of people.

Vinnie Paz 4:17 Sure.

Joe Rogan 4:17 They love each other-

Vinnie Paz 4:18 Sure.

Joe Rogan 4:18 ... and care about each other, and wanna promote that way of thinking-

Vinnie Paz 4:21 Right.

Joe Rogan 4:22 ... and being that you can do that. You can get through life and all support each other. Like, this backstabby bullshit that people get involved in, that is so detrimental to you, to them, to everyone, to the sense of community that you, you, you create around each other.

Vinnie Paz 4:37 A, a clip of yours went viral of you talking about, "Just get the fuck a- keep negative people the-"

Joe Rogan 4:42 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 4:42 "... fuck away from me." And I had that around me, and it was draining my spirit.

Joe Rogan 4:47 (sighs)

Vinnie Paz 4:48 You know?

Joe Rogan 4:48 It's one of the worst things.

Vinnie Paz 4:50 Uh, but you... When you're living a certain way and everything's fast s- ... It's the same with comedy and you're on the road-

Joe Rogan 4:56 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 4:56 ... and you're grinding it out. You can't always analyze... You can't always step back and say, "This is why things are fucked up."

Joe Rogan 5:03 Right.

Vinnie Paz 5:04 Because everything's moving so fast.

Joe Rogan 5:05 Right.

Vinnie Paz 5:06 You know?

Joe Rogan 5:06 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 5:06 And it wasn't until I took that time and said, "There's cancers in my life." That are-

Joe Rogan 5:11 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 5:11 They're, they're basically... They're emotional barnacles.

Joe Rogan 5:13 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 5:14 You know what I mean? They... And, and once you, once you cut the cancer out, you see how different things become. And it's, uh... It's kind of, um... I- I didn't realize it was that easy.

Joe Rogan 5:30 Yeah. You can do it.

Vinnie Paz 5:31 You can do it.

Joe Rogan 5:32 But to them too, it's a good lesson for them to be cast aside and for them... If they're smart or if they have some awareness or some objectivity, they're gonna look at themselves and say, "You know what? I'm a fucking mess."

Vinnie Paz 5:43 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:44 "Like, I'm negative all the time and people-"

Vinnie Paz 5:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:45 "... don't wanna be around me." I was real negative when I was younger.

Vinnie Paz 5:47 So was I.

Joe Rogan 5:48 Yeah. It's, it's, uh, it's not something that's insurmountable. You can get over it.

Vinnie Paz 5:52 Yeah. And, and it's... Whatever, whatever, uh, whatever hand you've been dealt, you have to realize the reality of the situation, bro. There's people living in mud huts and places-

Joe Rogan 6:03 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 6:04 ... that are smiling.

Joe Rogan 6:05 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 6:05 And though- and I have the balls to be complaining about...... your-

Joe Rogan 6:09 Your tour.

Vinnie Paz 6:10 Right.

Joe Rogan 6:10 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 6:11 And not getting enough sleep-

Joe Rogan 6:12 Right.

Vinnie Paz 6:12 ... or I don't like to travel, e-

Joe Rogan 6:15 Right.

Vinnie Paz 6:15 You just really have to assess that and say, "This isn't the way I should be thinking or processing information," because we're blessed-

Joe Rogan 6:25 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 6:25 ... to do what we do. You know what I mean? You make people laugh, bro, for a living.

Joe Rogan 6:29 I know. There's also, there's a balance that you can achieve between, uh, discipline and the creative people, like we were talking about, like yourself, who are just off. You know? Hand tattoos, wacky-

Vinnie Paz 6:40 Sure.

Joe Rogan 6:40 There's something about-

Vinnie Paz 6:40 Sure.

Joe Rogan 6:40 ... you know, this like, people see you. They go, "What the fuck is this guy doing?"

Vinnie Paz 6:43 Sure.

Joe Rogan 6:43 They follow you when you're walking through a store. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 6:45 For sure.

Joe Rogan 6:46 It's like, it's no... There's a balance between that and then real disciplined people, like, you know, fucking Navy SEAL-type cats.

Vinnie Paz 6:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 6:53 You learn from them too.

Vinnie Paz 6:54 Sure.

Joe Rogan 6:55 And you go, well, they... You can incorporate some of that into your life as well-

Vinnie Paz 6:58 Absolutely.

Joe Rogan 6:58 ... and it helps balance out all the wacky, creative aspects of it, and it makes you a little bit more productive, a little bit happier, a little bit... You know, uh, Dead Prez had a, um, they had a song, uh, Discipline Makes Things Easier.

Vinnie Paz 7:12 Yes.

Joe Rogan 7:13 It's a great fucking song.

Vinnie Paz 7:14 It is. It is.

Joe Rogan 7:14 It's a great song-

Vinnie Paz 7:15 It is.

Joe Rogan 7:15 ... because it, it's real.

Vinnie Paz 7:17 It is real.

Joe Rogan 7:17 It really does. Discipline makes things easier.

Vinnie Paz 7:20 It is real.

Joe Rogan 7:20 Organize your life.

Vinnie Paz 7:22 Like, for me, when, when, uh, I'm... I feel most ha- of course you know because of how you live, but your body feeds into your... how your mind works too.

Joe Rogan 7:35 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 7:35 When you feel... When, when I'm w- when I was talking about that, those na- um, horrible negative years, it was all so dictated by terrible diet, terrible-

Joe Rogan 7:44 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 7:44 You know, not that I'm in great shape or anything now, but I've changed things, and I felt it up here.

Joe Rogan 7:50 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 7:51 You know what I mean? And-

Joe Rogan 7:51 That's what people don't think. You feel it in your brain.

Vinnie Paz 7:54 I, I feel like a different person, man-

Joe Rogan 7:55 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 7:56 ... after I, after I spar a little bit or whatever it is.

Joe Rogan 7:58 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 7:59 I feel different. I, I, I, I get more energy, where you would think logic would dictate you would get tired.

Joe Rogan 8:05 Right.

Vinnie Paz 8:05 I'm like, "Now I'm ready to write. Now I'm ready-"

Joe Rogan 8:07 I know. Crazy, right?

Vinnie Paz 8:08 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 8:08 It's counterintuitive.

Vinnie Paz 8:09 It is. It's... But, but it's, um... But again, like you said, it's discipline. Uh, you know, it's... You know, my mother's making gravy and meatballs, it's, it's hard to say, "Mom, I, I... Sett-"

Joe Rogan 8:20 I know.

Vinnie Paz 8:21 "... settle down."

Joe Rogan 8:21 (coughs) You got... You can eat that once a week.

Vinnie Paz 8:24 Sure.

Joe Rogan 8:24 Once a week, you go... just go whole hog.

Vinnie Paz 8:26 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 8:27 You know?

Vinnie Paz 8:27 Right, right.

Joe Rogan 8:28 Gravy, that's such a East Coast Italian word.

Vinnie Paz 8:30 I know.

Joe Rogan 8:30 That was, uh, my grandparents in New Jersey. It was gravy. Everything was gravy.

Vinnie Paz 8:33 I apologize to everyone that's not in New York, uh, Philly, and Jersey right now.

Joe Rogan 8:38 It's barely New York. It's like, it's not Manhattan, right?

Vinnie Paz 8:41 They'll fight... Nah, they'll fight you. They'll say, "It's sauce." I mean-

Joe Rogan 8:44 Yeah. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 8:44 "Listen, man. It's fucking gravy, man." Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:46 "Let's not do this."

Vinnie Paz 8:47 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 8:47 Yeah, gravy's New Jersey. New Jersey, like old school Italian soprano style New J-

Vinnie Paz 8:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:52 That's, that's gravy.

Vinnie Paz 8:54 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:54 Philly's gravy.

Vinnie Paz 8:55 Yes.

Joe Rogan 8:55 Then you go south of Philly, it becomes sauce again.

Vinnie Paz 8:58 Yes.

Joe Rogan 8:58 Yeah. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 9:00 Yeah. And it's fucking good no matter what.

Joe Rogan 9:01 It is good.

Vinnie Paz 9:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:02 Dude, there's only a... It's weird how, like, if you go to I- have you been to Italy?

Vinnie Paz 9:06 Yes. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:07 They-

Vinnie Paz 9:07 My most... A lot of my family's still over there.

Joe Rogan 9:09 The food is fucking fantastic.

Vinnie Paz 9:11 Next level.

Joe Rogan 9:11 But it's a different kind of food.

Vinnie Paz 9:13 It's to-... I w- what Italian Americans did-

Joe Rogan 9:17 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 9:17 ... is, is a totally different cuisine.

Joe Rogan 9:19 Yeah, it's interesting, right?

Vinnie Paz 9:20 It is.

Joe Rogan 9:21 Like the meatballs, the lasagna.

Vinnie Paz 9:22 Yes.

Joe Rogan 9:23 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 9:23 They will put some shit in front of you that you, uh, you don't know what it is, but-

Joe Rogan 9:27 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 9:27 ... you know, "All right. Let's have at it."

Joe Rogan 9:28 Yeah, the Italian food in Italy is lighter-

Vinnie Paz 9:31 Yes.

Joe Rogan 9:31 ... you know? It's, uh, uh, a lot more fish.

Vinnie Paz 9:34 And then you have the regions. If you're north, if you're south-

Joe Rogan 9:37 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 9:37 ... if you're in Sigi, if you're in-

Joe Rogan 9:38 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 9:38 ... you know, it's, it's, it's, uh... Yeah, it's, it is odd. It's, it was culture shock just to think of what I've been eating for my mother's food and grandparents and... You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 9:49 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 9:49 And that's like... It's just different.

Joe Rogan 9:50 My grandmother was fresh off the boat, and she used to cook everything from scratch. Tomato sauce from scratch-

Vinnie Paz 9:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:57 ... everything. The pasta, she would roll the pasta herself.

Vinnie Paz 10:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:00 She would... Everything. She would make her own bread. She would do everything, everything from scratch. The bread wasn't al- there was... The bread was occasional, because a lot of the times there was, uh... When they lived in New Jersey, there was a store that they would go to, a bread place, that you would go and buy fresh bread basically every couple days.

Vinnie Paz 10:18 Sure.

Joe Rogan 10:18 And it would go bad, like, within hours.

Vinnie Paz 10:20 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:21 You know? 'Cause it was real bread.

Vinnie Paz 10:23 And without, without 8,000 preservatives.

Joe Rogan 10:25 Yeah. Dude, I had a piece of bread the other day, and it was sitting on the kitchen table for like a few hours. I left, I went back, it was still soft as fuck 'cause it's all filled with chemicals.

Vinnie Paz 10:33 Of course, man. Everything is.

Joe Rogan 10:35 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 10:36 Everything is. The w- it's like when you realize that there's fluoride in our drinking water and people are just all right with that.

Joe Rogan 10:42 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 10:43 Wh-

Joe Rogan 10:44 I'm not sure that that's r- that should be there, like-

Vinnie Paz 10:47 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 10:47 ... I've, I've read that. I've read about fluoride in the drinking water, like the pros and cons. The pros don't make any sense to me.

Vinnie Paz 10:53 (laughs) Not to me.

Joe Rogan 10:54 Like brush your fucking teeth, bitch.

Vinnie Paz 10:55 Yeah, man.

Joe Rogan 10:55 Like use toothpaste.

Vinnie Paz 10:57 Yeah. I'm not... I mean, uh, you know, I'm not the sh- I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, but I don't think it should be (laughs) in our drinking water.

Joe Rogan 11:04 Well, it's... You know, and then there's all... You get into all the conspiracy theories. That's when you gotta wade through all the bullshit. Like, "Okay, it was a Nazi plot to soften mines and..." Oh.

Vinnie Paz 11:14 Right. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:14 Was it? Or is it just like... I feel like somebody's just got a lot of fluoride they're trying to sell.

Vinnie Paz 11:19 (laughs) Sure.

Joe Rogan 11:19 And they got some sort of a deal with the government-

Vinnie Paz 11:21 That's-

Joe Rogan 11:21 ... to dump it into the water.

Vinnie Paz 11:22 That's probably more logical. But the thing-

Joe Rogan 11:24 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 11:24 ... the thing is with all that conspiracy shit, you have to sift through shit because there are kernels in there.

Joe Rogan 11:29 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 11:29 But-

Joe Rogan 11:29 That's the problem.

Vinnie Paz 11:31 Right. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:31 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 11:31 But they like that.

Joe Rogan 11:32 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 11:33 They, they li-... The more ridiculous, the more ridiculous the theories, the better it is for them because then y- it seems more ridiculous and that you're alone.

Joe Rogan 11:41 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 11:42 And-

Joe Rogan 11:43 Oh, you meanthey, like the government?

Vinnie Paz 11:44 Well, whoever.

Joe Rogan 11:45 Whoever's dumping the fluoride.

Vinnie Paz 11:46 Yeah, whoever they is.

Joe Rogan 11:47 Shitting them bags of fluoride in people's reservoir-

Vinnie Paz 11:48 Remember when your grandmama used to say, "They," and you'd go, "Gram, who's they?"

Joe Rogan 11:51 Right, right, right.

Vinnie Paz 11:51 "They, they say that you're not supposed to-"

Joe Rogan 11:53 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 11:53 I just go, "Who's they?"

Joe Rogan 11:54 "Who are they?" (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 11:55 "Who are they?" (laughs) But, but whoever they is, whatever they're doing, the more ridiculous things seem, it, it nullifies-... some more realistic things like-

Joe Rogan 12:06 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 12:06 ... what they're pumping into food, into cattle.

Joe Rogan 12:09 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 12:10 Uh, uh, steroids in cattle. Why, like for me, when we were younger, bro, white girls didn't have fat asses.

Joe Rogan 12:15 Yeah, but they learned squats.

Vinnie Paz 12:17 You think that's what it is?

Joe Rogan 12:18 I don't think it has to do with cattle.

Vinnie Paz 12:19 Oh, I, I... Okay.

Joe Rogan 12:20 I really don't.

Vinnie Paz 12:20 If you're thinking squats, then I'm gonna-

Joe Rogan 12:21 There's a lot of white girls out there with flat asses to this day.

Vinnie Paz 12:24 There is?

Joe Rogan 12:25 They're just lazy.

Vinnie Paz 12:26 All right.

Joe Rogan 12:26 (coughs)

Vinnie Paz 12:27 I'm gonna trust you because you-

Joe Rogan 12:28 I'm telling you, man.

Vinnie Paz 12:28 ... and I believe you. You're a w- you're a gym guy.

Joe Rogan 12:31 Most of what's going on with food is not steroids. Most of what's going on with food is antibiotics because they're getting sick from eating corn.

Vinnie Paz 12:38 Okay.

Joe Rogan 12:38 That, if you watch, um, (smacks lips) there's a great documentary, King Corn.

Vinnie Paz 12:42 Okay.

Joe Rogan 12:42 And it all, it documents how a lot of cows have huge issues digesting all that corn. It's not a natural thing for them. They're supposed to eat grass.

Vinnie Paz 12:50 Right. Sure, sure, sure.

Joe Rogan 12:51 It fattens them the fuck up and makes them quite tasty-

Vinnie Paz 12:53 Sure.

Joe Rogan 12:54 ... but it's really not what they're supposed to be eating.

Vinnie Paz 12:56 That's interesting.

Joe Rogan 12:57 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 12:57 I w- I, I thought... I mean-

Joe Rogan 12:58 (clears throat)

Vinnie Paz 12:58 ... I guess I always thought ch- ch- chemically speaking that that's what was being pumped into everything.

Joe Rogan 13:05 No, because it's expensive. They don't need to do it either. Like, in Mexico, they still do it. That's how Canelo got popped-

Vinnie Paz 13:10 Yeah, with the clen-

Joe Rogan 13:11 ... allegedly-

Vinnie Paz 13:12 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 13:12 ... and I, I air quote, "allegedly"-

Vinnie Paz 13:15 Yeah. I mean-

Joe Rogan 13:15 That's how he got clenbuterol in his system.

Vinnie Paz 13:16 ... if anyone thinks clenbuterol came from a steak, I got a-

Joe Rogan 13:19 (coughs)

Vinnie Paz 13:19 ... fucking bridge to sell you in Brooklyn.

Joe Rogan 13:20 But you can get it from a steak, unfortunately.

Vinnie Paz 13:22 Oh, yeah. No, there's fighters that say, "I, oh, no, I train a Mexican..." Someone recently said, I don't, I don't wanna say his name, a fighter said, "Yeah, I eat it and it's got clen in it." And they're like, "Then why didn't you get popped?" He's like, "'Cause I don't inject it." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 13:35 Oh, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 13:35 That, that was his line, you know.

Joe Rogan 13:36 Yeah. Well, without a doubt, there's some shenanigans going on in all combat sports.

Vinnie Paz 13:43 All.

Joe Rogan 13:43 And all professional sports.

Vinnie Paz 13:44 Sure, of course.

Joe Rogan 13:44 You get a little edge. That, just the money involved-

Vinnie Paz 13:47 Of course.

Joe Rogan 13:48 ... being able to, you know...

Vinnie Paz 13:49 Yeah, and, and Teddy loses his mind with that. You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 13:52 Yeah. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 13:52 But rightly so. He's so... When someone's that passionate about anyth- I mean, the guy is just like-

Joe Rogan 13:58 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 13:58 ... Jesus, man. Like I w-

Joe Rogan 13:59 Yeah, he's a treasure.

Vinnie Paz 14:00 He is. He's an American treasure.

Joe Rogan 14:02 Yeah, he is.

Vinnie Paz 14:03 Yes.

Joe Rogan 14:03 He is. He was great, man.

Vinnie Paz 14:04 Yeah, am- amazing.

Joe Rogan 14:05 His stories about his dad, did you, did you hear it? Did you hear the podcast?

Vinnie Paz 14:08 I watched half of it, but I read his book.

Joe Rogan 14:10 Oh.

Vinnie Paz 14:11 So, and fr- you know, Teddy B., Teddy was a goon, man.

Joe Rogan 14:15 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 14:15 You, you know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 14:16 Well, that's where he got that slice on the side-

Vinnie Paz 14:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:18 ... of his face.

Vinnie Paz 14:18 His, it was hanging, his face was hanging off.

Joe Rogan 14:19 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 14:20 Yeah, it's crazy.

Joe Rogan 14:21 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 14:21 But, um, yeah, well, the Jordan Peterson, man, I mean, it's just, I'm in awe of that guy.

Joe Rogan 14:27 Yeah, he's an in- very, really fascinating gentleman.

Vinnie Paz 14:30 He is. He is and just sc- scary smart.

Joe Rogan 14:33 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 14:34 You know, I, I, I would, I would, I would just, uh, crumble trying to have a conversation with the guy.

Joe Rogan 14:39 You wouldn't, though.

Vinnie Paz 14:40 I just feel like a nitwit.

Joe Rogan 14:40 You would catch up. That's what happens when you're around-

Vinnie Paz 14:43 Probably a couple of days later, my friend.

Joe Rogan 14:45 (laughs) But the thing about people like that is, like, if you are around a certain caliber of thinker, then your vibration sort of matches their vibration.

Vinnie Paz 14:54 Sure. Sure.

Joe Rogan 14:54 When you're around people that are way smarter than you, you realize, like, "Oh, there's some shortcuts to thinking that I'm taking."

Vinnie Paz 15:00 Yes.

Joe Rogan 15:00 "And then there's some, there's some pitfalls in the way I analyze things, and these people don't have those things. And then my vocabulary is stunted. Maybe I should increase my vocabulary."

Vinnie Paz 15:09 Sure.

Joe Rogan 15:09 "Maybe I should start reading more or reading the things." And that, it just, w- with most people, it's, it's the same thing as with fitness. It's the amount of how much time you put in for how long.

Vinnie Paz 15:18 Right.

Joe Rogan 15:19 And that's the same thing with your intellect. It's the same thing with your emotional stability. It's how much energy and effort and focus have you put into it and for how long?

Vinnie Paz 15:27 Yeah, of course.

Joe Rogan 15:28 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 15:29 But, like, like you said, though, to be around someone like him, it, you're naturally gonna fall into a, a line of thinking where, "Wow, this guy's got a lot of shit." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:40 Right.

Vinnie Paz 15:41 His understanding of the... Hi- his calmness, man, it's like, it's just, I, I can't see that guy being rattled. I've watched debates and he's just, he's so confident in, in what he believes.

Joe Rogan 15:55 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 15:55 You know what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 15:56 Well, he's thought things through.

Vinnie Paz 15:57 Clearly.

Joe Rogan 15:58 He's not, he's not a silly person, you know.

Vinnie Paz 15:59 I mean, I think I am, so that's the problem there.

Joe Rogan 16:01 Yeah, I am, too.

Vinnie Paz 16:02 Yeah, I'm a nitwit.

Joe Rogan 16:03 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 16:03 So watching him, it's, it's, you know, it's, um, it's humbling-

Joe Rogan 16:09 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 16:09 ... to watch someone like him that's got it together and has that level of understanding because I spend a lot of my life trying to get to that level of understanding. So to watch someone that's there-

Joe Rogan 16:21 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 16:22 ... it's like, uh, uh, it's just humbling that, uh, to, I, I, I'm just curious where he's gonna go because, uh, w- him being known to, to, you know, to uh- is relatively new.

Joe Rogan 16:33 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 16:33 You know?

Joe Rogan 16:34 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 16:34 He's not, this isn't a guy who's been, you know. It's a couple of years, right? Like-

Joe Rogan 16:37 Well, he's a, what, what you would call, like a public superstar intellectual now.

Vinnie Paz 16:41 You're right.

Joe Rogan 16:41 That's a, that's a new thing.

Vinnie Paz 16:42 It is.

Joe Rogan 16:43 It really, and it really hasn't existed over the last decade or so.

Vinnie Paz 16:47 No.

Joe Rogan 16:47 It hasn't been, and now they're starting... And I think because of YouTube and podcasts and things along those lines-

Vinnie Paz 16:52 Sure.

Joe Rogan 16:52 ... these guys are getting super popular. I mean, he's selling out places where fucking Iron Maiden plays.

Vinnie Paz 16:57 Absolutely.

Joe Rogan 16:58 I mean, he's-

Vinnie Paz 16:58 Absolutely.

Joe Rogan 16:59 It's crazy. And he, he talks about philosophy in life.

Vinnie Paz 17:01 The book is, the book, yeah. And if you told me that it, that a place where Maiden would sell out, someone would, would go talk to a modern day philosopher-

Joe Rogan 17:09 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 17:09 ... I wouldn't believe that. You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 17:11 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 17:11 Because we're, it's Idiocracy now.

Joe Rogan 17:13 You know he only eats meat? It's all he eats.

Vinnie Paz 17:15 No.

Joe Rogan 17:16 Yeah, he's on this carnivore diet.

Vinnie Paz 17:17 Really?

Joe Rogan 17:18 No vegetables at all.

Vinnie Paz 17:19 Wow.

Joe Rogan 17:19 Nothing. Salt and meat and water.

Vinnie Paz 17:22 Wow.

Joe Rogan 17:22 Yeah, he's so wacky with it. He told me that he had, like, a cu- a glass of cider and he couldn't sleep for 24 days. Like he's-

Vinnie Paz 17:31 Oh. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 17:31 He's not okay. He's, he's eccentric.

Vinnie Paz 17:34 No, I-

Joe Rogan 17:35 Like, you know, in a, in a heavy way.

Vinnie Paz 17:36 Yeah, he's a, he's a heavy guy. Yeah. But, um...

Joe Rogan 17:40 It's an, it's, it's a burden. Being that guy is a burden.

Vinnie Paz 17:43 Well...

Joe Rogan 17:43 And I, and I don't, I don't mean that in a negative or derogatory way. I mean, to be that smart and that-

Vinnie Paz 17:48 Well, don't you feel historically that th- that they're the people who are the most-

Joe Rogan 17:51 Yes.

Vinnie Paz 17:52 ... sad and broken and, and-

Joe Rogan 17:54 'Cause they know too much. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 17:56 There's nothing worse than knowing shit.

Joe Rogan 17:58 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 17:59 The dumbest people I know are happy as a fucking clam, man.

Joe Rogan 18:03 Yeah, right.

Vinnie Paz 18:04 It's, uh, and-

Joe Rogan 18:05 Simple people.

Vinnie Paz 18:05 Sure. And it's, uh, obviously, his level of intellect is, uh, next level. But even if... Being a bright guy or seeing, just being a reader or, or, or reading Kafka and, and Salinger and whoever, and just becoming aware of certain things, you realize-... certain times, realizations (laughs) aren't always the greatest things. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 18:28 I used to say that, say that to kids-

Vinnie Paz 18:30 (clears throat)

Joe Rogan 18:30 ... when I was coaching them, when I was coaching, um, martial artists.

Vinnie Paz 18:33 Uh-huh.

Joe Rogan 18:34 I would say, "You're scared because you're smart."

Vinnie Paz 18:36 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:36 "You see these people around you that aren't scared?"

Vinnie Paz 18:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:38 "They're stupid."

Vinnie Paz 18:39 Of course.

Joe Rogan 18:39 "They don't understand the possibilities."

Vinnie Paz 18:41 Of course.

Joe Rogan 18:41 "You're aware of the dangers and all the variables. You gotta put that aside-"

Vinnie Paz 18:45 Yes.

Joe Rogan 18:46 "... and just concetrate on your technique and your task at hand."

Vinnie Paz 18:48 Sure.

Joe Rogan 18:49 "But the reason why you're scared is because you're smart."

Vinnie Paz 18:51 Everything, m- my, my life exists around fear. Uh, it's not good. It's not healthy. I'm not healthy mentally because of it, and I don't know how to shake that. But it's-

Joe Rogan 19:02 But what kinda fear?

Vinnie Paz 19:04 Um, my father died-

Joe Rogan 19:05 (sighs)

Vinnie Paz 19:05 ... when I was 10, so I have the, like... M- so my mom's my best friend, you know? And she's f- 72 now, so like, I just... Every day is worried about her.

Joe Rogan 19:16 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 19:16 About, uh, in every way. Th- it's not even driven by anything that's rational.

Joe Rogan 19:21 Right.

Vinnie Paz 19:21 It's not like she's sick. She's the best. She, you know what I mean? She's 72, listens to Jay-Z and wears Jordans.

Joe Rogan 19:26 Does she? (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 19:27 Yeah. She's, she's the best.

Joe Rogan 19:30 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 19:30 But it's just-

Joe Rogan 19:30 Does she sing along?

Vinnie Paz 19:31 Y- of course.

Joe Rogan 19:33 (laughs) I gotta get a video of this.

Vinnie Paz 19:34 Yeah, no problem.

Joe Rogan 19:36 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 19:36 No, but it's-

Joe Rogan 19:37 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 19:37 ... it's, um, fear of not having her, f- fear of what, w- the unknown. I, bro, I fe- really, I fear the unknown. I fear, "What if this all ends?"

Joe Rogan 19:46 Right.

Vinnie Paz 19:47 I've li- I've, uh... My adult life has been what I do, which is music. It's-

Joe Rogan 19:51 Right.

Vinnie Paz 19:52 I, yours has been too. I don't... Bro, I don't know how to do anything.

Joe Rogan 19:55 Right.

Vinnie Paz 19:56 I don't know how to fix a fucking car.

Joe Rogan 19:58 Right, right.

Vinnie Paz 19:58 Like, I can't be a mechanic. I ca- I don't know how to... I don't... I literally don't how to do anything, bro.

Joe Rogan 20:03 But that, that fear is for mechanics too, because they're like, "Fuck, what if there's no more cars? What if these electric cars come along? I don't know how to work a computer. Everything's gonna be computer-controlled." I mean, th- people's business... Look, think about the poor bastard that opened up Blockbuster. He's like, "We got this."

Vinnie Paz 20:17 (laughs) "We got it locked."

Joe Rogan 20:18 "We got this forever."

Vinnie Paz 20:19 Right.

Joe Rogan 20:19 He's just spending money like it's growing, then one day, they're like, "Oh, we got this, uh, this new thing. It's called, uh, uh, uh, Apple TV." People are like, "Fuck Apple TV."

Vinnie Paz 20:27 Yeah, Mike-

Joe Rogan 20:27 Where's that gonna go?

Vinnie Paz 20:28 Michael Blockbuster is now living in a box somewhere.

Joe Rogan 20:31 Prob- Yeah, probably.

Vinnie Paz 20:32 Yeah, poor-

Joe Rogan 20:33 Well, he probably sold-

Vinnie Paz 20:34 ... fella.

Joe Rogan 20:34 ... if he's smart. He probably saw the writing on the wall.

Vinnie Paz 20:36 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 20:36 But, I mean, there's a lot of things that just go away, and people find a way to make do. You get through. Whatever made you a successful rapper, you could be successful at anything.

Vinnie Paz 20:46 I don't know that I, I want that. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 20:49 (laughs) Well, you don't have to, luckily.

Vinnie Paz 20:50 I, I don't... I, I don't wanna be a successful (laughs) mechanic.

Joe Rogan 20:53 I know. I don't wanna be either.

Vinnie Paz 20:55 I, I don't want... Uh, uh, it... The f- the fear of not being able to continue the way I continue.

Joe Rogan 21:01 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 21:02 I know, um, f- again, from being a fan, how you look... You do what you want, essentially.

Joe Rogan 21:06 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 21:06 Of course work is work, and even though we love it, it's still work, and I think we both have people in our lives that don't get that.

Joe Rogan 21:13 Yes.

Vinnie Paz 21:13 They think the f- it's w- when we talk when you were in Philly. I know... People hit you up the day of the show, "Can you get me-"

Joe Rogan 21:19 Right.

Vinnie Paz 21:19 "... two passes back, bud?" Right. Like it's a fucking party.

Joe Rogan 21:21 Right.

Vinnie Paz 21:22 It's your job, man.

Joe Rogan 21:23 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 21:23 It's, it's how you... It's, it's how you f- you know what I mean? Put food on the table. And I think there's a disconnect there with people that don't live in that world, that they think e- everything we do is a p- a party.

Joe Rogan 21:35 Yeah, uh, well, there...

Vinnie Paz 21:37 And, and-

Joe Rogan 21:37 (coughs) I'm sorry, it goes back to discipline, what we were talking about earlier. That you gotta love it, but you also have to have the discipline to get the work done.

Vinnie Paz 21:43 Of course.

Joe Rogan 21:44 You know?

Vinnie Paz 21:44 Of course. Bu- but I, I have a problem with people that don't understand that, that there is-

Joe Rogan 21:51 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 21:51 ... discipline involved.

Joe Rogan 21:52 Right.

Vinnie Paz 21:52 They think that it is not, that it... That we got lucky.

Joe Rogan 21:55 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 21:55 We didn't.

Joe Rogan 21:57 Well, we did and we didn't. We did get lucky. We found something-

Vinnie Paz 22:01 We created... We created our own luck, though.

Joe Rogan 22:03 There's a little bit of that, for sure. (coughs)

Vinnie Paz 22:05 (coughs)

Joe Rogan 22:05 We're lucky we live in America.

Vinnie Paz 22:07 Sure.

Joe Rogan 22:07 We're lucky we w- weren't born in a shack in Ethiopia.

Vinnie Paz 22:10 Sure, sure.

Joe Rogan 22:10 There's luck, but then there's also y- you, you have to put in the work, and you have to figure out... Y- y- there's a... It's a puzzle. It's this open-ended puzzle. You, you make what... You make it. You turn it into something.

Vinnie Paz 22:21 But you did it. You did it. You started, you got your shot, and you took it and had the balls to run with that shot. Some people fumble the ball.

Joe Rogan 22:30 Yeah, there're def... There's a lot of fumblers out there.

Vinnie Paz 22:32 They-

Joe Rogan 22:32 But I fumbled a bunch too.

Vinnie Paz 22:33 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 22:33 You just get back up-

Vinnie Paz 22:34 I, I-

Joe Rogan 22:34 ... and figure out why you fumbled.

Vinnie Paz 22:35 I fumbled, but I knew that I had to get back up. These people fun- f- fumble the ball and then go into, "Woe is me."

Joe Rogan 22:42 (coughs) Yeah, they-

Vinnie Paz 22:42 Into the "Woe is me," the w-

Joe Rogan 22:43 Can't catch a break.

Vinnie Paz 22:44 ... "The universe is out to get me."

Joe Rogan 22:45 (coughs)

Vinnie Paz 22:46 "I can't catch a break." This doesn't... A- a- and that's all... I, I can't say all, but a lot of it is self-inflicted.

Joe Rogan 22:52 Yeah, it is. Well, instead of looking at it that way, what they should look at, okay, now I know how not to do it. I learned. Now this is ma- gonna make me better.

Vinnie Paz 22:59 You have to learn.

Joe Rogan 23:00 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 23:00 You have to learn from everything that happens. If you're not... If, if, it, it's... Y- my father would say, "It's not a mistake if you learn from it."

Joe Rogan 23:08 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 23:08 You, you have to, um, be able to... Uh, look, it's adapt or die, like, with Blockbuster, right?

Joe Rogan 23:14 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 23:14 So adapt or die. Everything's changing w- with us. You know what I mean? Th- this podcast is bigger than shows on terrestrial radio. If you told me that back when I was listening to Stern, I'd be like, "What? What are you even talking about?" That a podcast could ne- what is a podcast? How big could that be? And you're bigger than radio p- person now.

Joe Rogan 23:33 Well, I thought that when I did it too. When I first started doing it, I never thought it was gonna be a thing. I thought it was just a goof. I was doing it for fun.

Vinnie Paz 23:40 Right.

Joe Rogan 23:41 Like, I would, like, respond to someone on Twitter, like, "Just fuck it."

Vinnie Paz 23:44 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 23:44 "Just have some fun."

Vinnie Paz 23:45 Yeah, and it... But you've, you've changed culture. You've shifted culture and how people communicate with this show. Y- I mean, you should be very proud of that, man, if you're not already. (tongue clicks)

Joe Rogan 23:55 I don't think about it. I think if you think about it, you'll, you'll trip over your own feet.

Vinnie Paz 23:59 Oh, I don't think about it. Someone could give me the best compliment ever, and I'm like-

Joe Rogan 24:02 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 24:02 ... "I'm a piece of garbage."

Joe Rogan 24:03 (coughs) You're better off that way. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 24:05 Yeah, I-

Joe Rogan 24:06 Keep going. (laughs) Just keep pressing forward.

Vinnie Paz 24:08 Oh, trust in... Jo- Joe, we don't have a problem there.

Joe Rogan 24:09 Well, that... Like you were saying about your fear of it all going away, I think that fear is what makes you show up-... at the studio 10 minutes early. That fear is what makes you get out that notebook and start writing.

Vinnie Paz 24:19 Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:19 That fear is what makes you sit alone thinking about how you're gonna structure this or w- you know, write your next this or-

Vinnie Paz 24:26 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:26 ... that's, that's imp- it's all important. People think that, like, like a guy like you who's a, a successful rapper or a comedian that's successful, that you, you just got no worries anymore. That's bullshit. I have more worries now than I've ever had in my life.

Vinnie Paz 24:39 I have way more worries than when I had nothing in my pocket in high school and I was rapping on street corners. I think about it all the time.

Joe Rogan 24:46 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 24:47 How, how would that... And now I look at the worries I had then and they're laughable.

Joe Rogan 24:51 Oh, wow. Right?

Vinnie Paz 24:52 I crack, I crack up at the shit that used to, used to bother me.

Joe Rogan 24:55 You know what's interesting? Could you imagine going back to the first day, starting over from scratch? Knowing what you know now, how much better you would be, right?

Vinnie Paz 25:03 Oh, I can't even imagine, man.

Joe Rogan 25:04 But think of that in the future as of now.

Vinnie Paz 25:07 That's a... That's heavy.

Joe Rogan 25:09 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 25:09 That's heavy.

Joe Rogan 25:10 You know-

Vinnie Paz 25:10 But-

Joe Rogan 25:10 ... if you could look back on yourself, like, if you're a 60-year-old man looking back at yourself, you're like, "Vinnie, you had the world by the balls."

Vinnie Paz 25:16 Balls. Of course. Uh, the problem is, um, I have a problem with living in the moment. I'm always thinking about the ramifications of that moment while the moment is happening.

Joe Rogan 25:28 Hmm. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 25:29 And it's, it's, it's-

Joe Rogan 25:31 (clears throat)

Vinnie Paz 25:32 ... um, it's detrimental to my-

Joe Rogan 25:35 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 25:35 ... mental health to think that way. You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 25:37 Yeah. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 25:37 I know. I can't... I, I see people live in the moment. I see people that just are able to, to let things wash over them, and I'm envious of that because everything is over-analyzed in, in every way possible, and it eats at me, you know?

Joe Rogan 25:55 Yeah, but I think that that's one of the reasons why your lyrics are so good. It's like a s-

Vinnie Paz 25:59 Thank you, man.

Joe Rogan 25:59 ... a person, a person has that sort of the, the, the, this, the over-analyzing aspect of you is also what makes you go over all these details and f- find better hooks and find a better way to phrase things.

Vinnie Paz 26:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:13 And this is like, you can't be complacent. You just can't.

Vinnie Paz 26:17 I just wish I could just only exist in that part of my life. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 26:20 (laughs) To... I don't think it works, man. Everybody that I talk to that's successful is the same way. They're all a mess. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 26:25 Yeah. What are we gonna do about that, man?

Joe Rogan 26:28 There's nothing you can do.

Vinnie Paz 26:29 How do we fix that? How-

Joe Rogan 26:29 You just gotta keep fucking... You just gotta not give a fuck and keep pressing forward and k- know that this is just part of who you are.

Vinnie Paz 26:35 I mean, if we go back historically, everyone's a loon that was brilliant. (laughs) Like, look at Lennon.

Joe Rogan 26:40 Yeah. Yep.

Vinnie Paz 26:40 Look, you know, look, like, look at all these... You know what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 26:42 They're all crazy.

Vinnie Paz 26:42 Every-

Joe Rogan 26:43 Every comic that's ever lived-

Vinnie Paz 26:44 Oh, my god.

Joe Rogan 26:44 ... is one crazy as fuck.

Vinnie Paz 26:45 I think Stan hopes one of the brilliant-

Joe Rogan 26:47 (clears throat)

Vinnie Paz 26:47 ... most brilliant minds ever. Batshit crazy.

Joe Rogan 26:49 Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 26:50 You know?

Joe Rogan 26:50 He's a good buddy of mine.

Vinnie Paz 26:50 Yeah, I know he is. Um, you know, you look at, you know, whether it's Bill Hicks, whether it's Louie, whoever, you know what I mean? Like-

Joe Rogan 26:58 Hennerson.

Vinnie Paz 26:58 Yeah. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:59 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 26:59 I mean, Sam was the most troubled person in the world.

Joe Rogan 27:01 Well, that's my defense of Roseanne. You know, all these people are coming after Roseanne. I'm like, "You don't understand."

Vinnie Paz 27:05 She, she's batshit.

Joe Rogan 27:06 She's not just batshit. She got in a car accident. He, she has severe brain damage.

Vinnie Paz 27:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:11 She's on all sorts of medications. She has multiple personality disorder.

Vinnie Paz 27:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:15 She's drinking, she's on Ambien, and she's 70 years old. What the fuck do you want?

Vinnie Paz 27:20 Right. The, I, like-

Joe Rogan 27:21 What do you want from this lady?

Vinnie Paz 27:22 You, y- you know, and you spoke that way and so did Norm.

Joe Rogan 27:25 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 27:25 You know, Norm talked about Louie and Roseanne.

Joe Rogan 27:28 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 27:28 And, and the same way you... Like, yo, man-

Joe Rogan 27:30 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 27:30 ... she's batshit crazy-

Joe Rogan 27:32 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 27:32 ... first of all. Like, d- if you're going to her for, for, uh, uh, e- e- e- you know, if you're going to her for political discourse-

Joe Rogan 27:39 Yeah. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 27:40 ... you might wanna reevaluate your life on some-

Joe Rogan 27:42 The problem's on you, man.

Vinnie Paz 27:43 Yeah, yeah. That's your fault.

Joe Rogan 27:44 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 27:45 That's your fault-

Joe Rogan 27:46 It's not her.

Vinnie Paz 27:46 ... at some point.

Joe Rogan 27:46 It's you.

Vinnie Paz 27:46 Yeah. And that doesn't mean either one of us agree with exactly what she wrote. It's just how she got there.

Joe Rogan 27:52 But i- that's w- also why she's so funny. You know, if you go back and watch Roseanne in the early days, b-

Vinnie Paz 27:58 Bro, that show was fucking heavy, man.

Joe Rogan 28:00 It was a great show.

Vinnie Paz 28:01 I-

Joe Rogan 28:01 And her standup, bef- even before that, was fantastic.

Vinnie Paz 28:04 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:05 I, I put her in the top 20 of all-time standups.

Vinnie Paz 28:07 She was brilliant. She was brilliant, man.

Joe Rogan 28:09 She was also a monster, man. Like, there was nobody like her before. Like, where she was just as brash, "I don't give a fuck."

Vinnie Paz 28:16 Yep.

Joe Rogan 28:16 She was like a man.

Vinnie Paz 28:17 Yeah, man.

Joe Rogan 28:18 Like, she'd kill like, like a, like, like a world-class standup.

Vinnie Paz 28:22 Sure. I mean, I remember, like, when that show came on, just seeing that house. I was like, I had never seen-

Joe Rogan 28:28 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 28:28 ... a house like that on television before.

Joe Rogan 28:30 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 28:30 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 28:31 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 28:31 Like, closer to what we knew-

Joe Rogan 28:32 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 28:33 ... than, than what I had ever seen. I, I... My house didn't look like The Cosbys.

Joe Rogan 28:37 Right.

Vinnie Paz 28:37 My house d-... You know what I mean? I was like... Maybe Archie Bunker, you know, was like a little bit-

Joe Rogan 28:41 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 28:41 ... like, closer. But it's w- when people are batshit crazy and someone reacts to that, uh, with confu... not confusion, with contempt, I'm like, "You understand they're batshit crazy."

Joe Rogan 28:54 Right.

Vinnie Paz 28:55 And it's part of why they got to where they're at.

Joe Rogan 28:58 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 28:58 Don't, don't act-

Joe Rogan 28:59 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 28:59 ... surprised now that, that, that someone said something loony-

Joe Rogan 29:02 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 29:03 ... this many years after... You know what I mean? It, it, it just seems strange to me that now you're blown away. She's been saying batshit crazy shit for a long time.

Joe Rogan 29:11 I think it's also part of this new culture that we have in where people just... they find a target and they attack.

Vinnie Paz 29:18 Of course.

Joe Rogan 29:19 It's like i- if, if you have... if there's any sort of weakness, like if you have chickens and one chicken gets sick, that's what that pecking order thing is.

Vinnie Paz 29:29 Sure.

Joe Rogan 29:29 One chicken doesn't feel good, the other chickens just (cawing noises)

Vinnie Paz 29:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 29:33 They don't, they don't, like, make moral judgments on this chicken.

Vinnie Paz 29:36 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 29:36 They just find a target.

Vinnie Paz 29:37 Right.

Joe Rogan 29:38 There's something wrong with that chicken, so they start fucking it up.

Vinnie Paz 29:40 Right.

Joe Rogan 29:40 And this is what happens with dogs. It h- it's a hu- it's an animal thing.

Vinnie Paz 29:45 It is.

Joe Rogan 29:45 And human beings, we have to... If we're gonna be real, if we're gonna, if we're gonna be compassionate, we're really gonna be compassionate, if we're really gonna, like, try to engineer a better culture-

Vinnie Paz 29:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 29:57 ... and a better community, we gotta stop doing that.

Vinnie Paz 29:59 I agree.

Joe Rogan 30:00 We've got to just stop attacking people. I- like, she didn't... I believe... I talked to her on the phone, just me and her.

Vinnie Paz 30:06 Uh-huh.

Joe Rogan 30:07 She did not know that lady was Black.

Vinnie Paz 30:09 I bel- I, I believe she didn't know that.

Joe Rogan 30:10 When, when she, when she looked at that lady, she goes, "She looks Jewish. She looks like me."

Vinnie Paz 30:13 (laughs) Right.

Joe Rogan 30:13 She... That's what she said.

Vinnie Paz 30:14 I believe you. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 30:15 I believe her too. I think she was just cracking a joke, fucked up on Ambien-

Vinnie Paz 30:19 Sure.

Joe Rogan 30:19 ... been drinking and smoking weed all night.

Vinnie Paz 30:21 Sure.

Joe Rogan 30:22 And, but no one cares what her intent was.

Vinnie Paz 30:24 Right.

Joe Rogan 30:25 All they care is, "I got a green light. That's a target."

Vinnie Paz 30:27 Sure.

Joe Rogan 30:27 "We're gonna go in."

Vinnie Paz 30:29 Well, here's my issue with the mo- the modern, the modern left, is...... is they talk compassion, but they don't, they pounce.

Joe Rogan 30:38 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 30:39 It's, I feel like a man with no country now because-

Joe Rogan 30:41 Me too.

Vinnie Paz 30:42 ... 'cause I don't, I don't, the modern left isn't something that I gravitate towards and neither is the right. And when I grew, was growing up and listening to Public Enemy, you know, and, and that left of, uh, uh, uh, it changed, it changed and I didn't.

Joe Rogan 31:01 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 31:02 So-

Joe Rogan 31:03 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 31:03 ... and you, and you have these people, um, I, I don't know where I'm, I stand anymore, man. It's like-

Joe Rogan 31:10 Well, I think there's a, there's rational, left-leaning people that are against discrimination and for welfare and for foo-... Uh, look, I was on welfare when I was a kid. If people say I shouldn't be on welfare, well, what the fuck, man?

Vinnie Paz 31:24 Right.

Joe Rogan 31:24 Uh, my parents were on welfare.

Vinnie Paz 31:25 No, I came from a poor family, so-

Joe Rogan 31:27 We, we, t- we had food stamps.

Vinnie Paz 31:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:29 And eventually they did better and we got off of it.

Vinnie Paz 31:31 Sure.

Joe Rogan 31:32 But if you wanna tell me that that doesn't help, that fed me.

Vinnie Paz 31:34 Absolutely.

Joe Rogan 31:35 So how could I ever go against that?

Vinnie Paz 31:37 Absolutely.

Joe Rogan 31:37 When that was a part of my childhood.

Vinnie Paz 31:38 Absolutely.

Joe Rogan 31:39 Like, this, this, all these things that people want to associate with being, you know, like, with left or right, uh, I, I think there's just a gigantic problem with pe- people being tribal.

Vinnie Paz 31:50 Uh, that's what it is. It's, it's tribalism at its, uh, at its highest degree, which in my, in since I've been alive, I haven't seen.

Joe Rogan 31:58 Never seen it like this before.

Vinnie Paz 31:59 It's, um, I think we know why, but-

Joe Rogan 32:01 Well, it's facilitated not just by Trump, but, and, but it's also by the ability to communicate instantaneously.

Vinnie Paz 32:06 Of course.

Joe Rogan 32:07 Without any consideration. And you can just tweet something or make a YouTube video about something instantaneously.

Vinnie Paz 32:12 Sure.

Joe Rogan 32:13 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 32:13 Roseanne's ability to tweet that-

Joe Rogan 32:15 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 32:16 ... that quickly with the phone is why-

Joe Rogan 32:18 Sohnke show cost millions of dollars.

Vinnie Paz 32:21 Yeah. Peo- people lost their jobs. ABC ju- you know, it's like-

Joe Rogan 32:24 Yeah, now they're gonna do The Conners. Guess what? That show's gonna fucking sink like the Titanic.

Vinnie Paz 32:28 Of course, it's gonna-

Joe Rogan 32:29 No Roseanne? Get the fuck outta here.

Vinnie Paz 32:30 Three episodes, max.

Joe Rogan 32:31 It's Roseanne without Roseanne.

Vinnie Paz 32:33 Right, three episodes, it'll, it'll-

Joe Rogan 32:34 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 32:35 ... max.

Joe Rogan 32:35 That's like flavor-free Diet Coke.

Vinnie Paz 32:38 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 32:38 Tastes like water. Just have water, motherfucker. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 32:43 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 32:43 You know. (laughs) It's Diet Coke, but without the flavor.

Vinnie Paz 32:46 It's true.

Joe Rogan 32:47 Wait, what? (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 32:48 It's true. Uh, and I don't, um, it's just, the, it's, it's the hypersensitivity and it's like, the ability for anyone, right or wrong, to be able to say something right then.

Joe Rogan 32:58 Right.

Vinnie Paz 32:58 Where you would have, you know, if, if, if, uh, you're doing Fear Factor and Rolling Stone interviews you, there's a thought process there. Where, and, and there's editing and you're sitting there and you're talking with a, a journalist. All of that's gone, man.

Joe Rogan 33:12 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 33:12 It's like it-

Joe Rogan 33:13 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 33:14 ... that, that's what it's, it, it, it's come down to. Uh, you know, we are all, we, all three of us have phones in our pockets-

Joe Rogan 33:20 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 33:20 ... we can say something crazy right now if we stubbed our toe. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 33:23 Right, it's not-

Vinnie Paz 33:23 It's like, it's, oh, fuck this for about, about... And all of a sudden you're done, you're sunk.

Joe Rogan 33:27 But there's good in that because the tyranny of these gigantic organizations, like, if they were tyrannical, if they did have an agenda-

Vinnie Paz 33:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 33:34 ... if they were trying to smear you, you were fucked. You had no recourse.

Vinnie Paz 33:37 Right.

Joe Rogan 33:37 And they did that to many people, I'm sure.

Vinnie Paz 33:39 Right.

Joe Rogan 33:39 There's unscrupulous journalists.

Vinnie Paz 33:41 Sure.

Joe Rogan 33:41 But also journalistic integrity takes a backseat too because now they have to get clicks. Like, these people are j- real journalists are fighting for their lives.

Vinnie Paz 33:50 Absolutely.

Joe Rogan 33:50 Because these publications are going under. I mean-

Vinnie Paz 33:52 Well, real journalism is almost dead. It's not totally dead, but real-

Joe Rogan 33:56 It's hurtin'. It's hurtin'.

Vinnie Paz 33:57 ... it's bad.

Joe Rogan 33:57 It's hurtin'.

Vinnie Paz 33:58 But, like, I was-

Joe Rogan 33:59 It's got emphysema.

Vinnie Paz 34:00 Like, (laughs) like the Alex Jones thing, right? Whether I agree with shit he says or not, corporations shut him down. And that, to me, that's scary that th- th- the corporations can decide what we are able to hear-

Joe Rogan 34:16 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 34:16 ... really.

Joe Rogan 34:17 Well, I was having a good conversation about this last night with some friends, and they were talking about whether or not things like YouTube or Twitter or Instagram should be regulated like utilities-

Vinnie Paz 34:27 Okay.

Joe Rogan 34:27 ... where anybody can use it.

Vinnie Paz 34:29 Okay.

Joe Rogan 34:29 You know? Like, you have the right to get the power. Like if you have, if you have a, a house-

Vinnie Paz 34:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:34 ... you're, you have the right to, you pay your money, you get your power turned on. It's a utility.

Vinnie Paz 34:38 Yes.

Joe Rogan 34:39 Maybe a channel like that, whether it's, uh, YouTube or whether it's Twitter, maybe a channel should be treated like a utility. But then the question is like, what is it exactly that is good enough to get you kicked off? 'Cause I've seen some horrible shit-

Vinnie Paz 34:55 Well, I wanna-

Joe Rogan 34:55 ... that people have read or, or written, rather, on Twitter that, and they're still on.

Vinnie Paz 35:00 I, I've seen shit, whatever he's being, uh, whatever, you know, is why he was brought down, I've seen people say much worse shit.

Joe Rogan 35:08 The big thing was the Sandy Hook.

Vinnie Paz 35:10 Right.

Joe Rogan 35:10 And it was that, the Sandy Hook thing was, he said that he thought that it was fake. He's since disavowed that.

Vinnie Paz 35:18 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:18 But they don't care if you disavow things.

Vinnie Paz 35:20 No, of course not.

Joe Rogan 35:20 It's like they have this thing on you now.

Vinnie Paz 35:22 Of course.

Joe Rogan 35:22 "You said that the kids didn't die."

Vinnie Paz 35:24 Of course.

Joe Rogan 35:24 "They definitely did."

Vinnie Paz 35:25 Of course.

Joe Rogan 35:25 "Let's get rid of you." But it, but are you saying that people aren't allowed to make mistakes? Are you saying that people aren't allowed to evolve their thinking? Are you saying that people aren't allowed to say things that are wrong? Because a lot of people say things that are wrong. But is it only things that are wrong about children? Like, where, what standards?

Vinnie Paz 35:41 Where's the line?

Joe Rogan 35:42 Where's the line?

Vinnie Paz 35:42 I don't know where lines are anymore.

Joe Rogan 35:43 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 35:43 And, and I don't know who's the one drawing them.

Joe Rogan 35:46 Well, it's these people that either are the CEOs or the stockholders or, you know, the CFOs, whoever it is that-

Vinnie Paz 35:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:53 ... that is, uh, in the meeting that's dictating these standards. They're deciding, and these are gigantic corporations that, we were just talking about this, I don't think they ever anticipated this. I think when they made Twitter, they thought it would be, like Jamie was saying, it was a, a fun way to, like, uh, tell your friends, you know, uh, you know, Vinnie Paz and Joe Rogan are going to the movies.

Vinnie Paz 36:13 Sure.

Joe Rogan 36:13 And that's what you would do.

Vinnie Paz 36:14 Of course.

Joe Rogan 36:14 That's what Twitter was.

Vinnie Paz 36:15 Of course.

Joe Rogan 36:15 It was just like, "I'm at, um, I'm eating pizza at the mall."

Vinnie Paz 36:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:17 It wasn't anything crazy.

Vinnie Paz 36:19 Right. And then people started using it as a platform for, I, I don't know what.

Joe Rogan 36:23 Well, Sam Harris has been tweeting to Jack. He's been trying to get Jack to ban Trump. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 36:28 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 36:29 He's like, "Look," he's like, "he's clearly violating your standards of practice."

Vinnie Paz 36:33 Wow, that's great.

Joe Rogan 36:33 "He's, he's clearly doing that."

Vinnie Paz 36:35 Right.

Joe Rogan 36:35 And he's like, "Jack just won't respond to him anymore." (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 36:38 Wow. (laughs) God this is-

Joe Rogan 36:39 Jack's going radio silent on him.

Vinnie Paz 36:40 Yeah, he went radio silent.

Joe Rogan 36:41 Yeah. He's like, "Fuck this." (laughs) I can't-

Vinnie Paz 36:43 I don't need to deal with this in my life.

Joe Rogan 36:45 I mean, you d- you don't wanna do that right now. Maybe when he gets impeached, then you ban him. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 36:49 Oh, the fact that, yo, if you read that guy's Twitter-... the fact that he's the leader of the free world-

Joe Rogan 36:55 It's crazy.

Vinnie Paz 36:56 ... is batshit crazy what he's wri-

Joe Rogan 36:59 He calls people losers.

Vinnie Paz 36:59 Yes.

Joe Rogan 37:00 The leader of the free world calls people losers.

Vinnie Paz 37:01 Losers and-

Joe Rogan 37:02 He's threatening nuclear war.

Vinnie Paz 37:03 I love, um, my favorite is very sad with the exclamation point.

Joe Rogan 37:07 Yes. (laughs) All caps.

Vinnie Paz 37:09 Yes, that's like my f- that's my favorite thing, man.

Joe Rogan 37:12 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 37:13 Uh-

Joe Rogan 37:13 If we get through this without getting blown up, we're going to look back and laugh at the Trump days. They're going to be fun.

Vinnie Paz 37:18 I'm s- I don't know how long we're in to his presidency, but when I walk by the TV and hear someone say "President Trump," I still have a little chuckle.

Joe Rogan 37:27 I know. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 37:28 You know? It-

Joe Rogan 37:29 I know.

Vinnie Paz 37:29 It might not be a hearty laugh, it might not be a belly laugh, but I still crack up.

Joe Rogan 37:33 Well, it's been two years.

Vinnie Paz 37:34 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:35 'Cause I, my la- this is how I know, I know by Netflix specials.

Vinnie Paz 37:38 Oh. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:38 'Cause my last Netflix special was t- exactly two years ago, and during that special, I was like, "We are that close to President Trump." And people were laughing, like, "Ha ha ha."

Vinnie Paz 37:47 I was laughing.

Joe Rogan 37:48 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 37:49 I was like, I went to bed or whatever, whatever happ- knowing that there was zero chance.

Joe Rogan 37:54 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 37:54 You know? And I didn't think Hillary was a great candidate, but I thought a fucking b- I, I thought a b- a cardboard box would beat him.

Joe Rogan 38:01 Yeah, I thought people would think of him as more of a liability than anything, but the thing is this, people in middle America just don't feel represented. They feel disrespected-

Vinnie Paz 38:10 Yes.

Joe Rogan 38:10 ... and not represented-

Vinnie Paz 38:11 Yes.

Joe Rogan 38:11 ... and he figured that out and tapped into that.

Vinnie Paz 38:14 He did. Well, I, I saw Jordan Peterson say something in this interview, and, uh, it made me think because obviously we're joking right now and, uh, eh, the joke about him is how dumb he is. And, and Jordan Peterson said, "The b- the reason he's in and the biggest mistake Americans have made is underestimating him and thinking he's dumb."

Joe Rogan 38:33 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 38:33 You know what I mean? Because-

Joe Rogan 38:34 He's not dumb. He just does dumb shit.

Vinnie Paz 38:37 Yes.

Joe Rogan 38:37 And he's definitely an egomaniac.

Vinnie Paz 38:39 Well, he, I think he has narcissistic personality disorder.

Joe Rogan 38:42 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 38:42 And that's, but that doesn't mean he's stupid.

Joe Rogan 38:44 Right.

Vinnie Paz 38:44 You know what I mean? But he, um, uh, he took advantage of exactly what you said. There's a, a big portion of this country. You've been there, I've been there, there's... Well, you're an East Coast guy, I'm an East Coast guy. Now we're both on the West Coast. We, because of what we do, these are the worlds we know and what we're surrounded by and that, uh, my father used to say, "If you don't live near a coast, you're a retard."

Joe Rogan 39:10 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 39:11 (laughs) Now, now, now I have the c- more than half the country hates me. I don't believe that, but my father said that, but anyway. And you, when you go through the middle of the country on tour and you meet people, you, I'm, I've been like, "Yo, I've never met anyone like this before." Not in a good way or a bad way. I just-

Joe Rogan 39:27 You're not around them. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 39:28 I'm not around them and you, and they probably feel like no one has ever spoken for me.

Joe Rogan 39:35 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 39:36 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 39:36 Right.

Vinnie Paz 39:36 And even if a dimwit does, that's better than no one speaking for me.

Joe Rogan 39:41 Right, that's better than someone just calling them flyover states and-

Vinnie Paz 39:44 Sh- sure.

Joe Rogan 39:44 ... disrespecting them.

Vinnie Paz 39:45 Of course. Of course. And I, and when I was younger, I did it too. I talked that way.

Joe Rogan 39:49 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 39:50 I tal- you know, when tours would get booked. "Oh, I don't want to go there." But it's just youth, it's just, um, it's ego of being where you're from.

Joe Rogan 39:57 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 39:57 Being from the East Coast. Well, obviously, everyone on the East Coast is very proud of that fact. Everyone in the West is very proud of that fact. You know?

Joe Rogan 40:03 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 40:04 It's just, you know, I don't, I don't, I don't know anything about Arkansas pride. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 40:08 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 40:08 You know? It's just naivete. It's bec- I just don't know anyone there, bro. There's no fucking Italians there. I don't know. I, I, that's what I am.

Joe Rogan 40:14 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 40:15 I'm a Wop for, uh, my family's from Italy, you know? So like, it's just naivete and it's, uh, being ig- an ignorant American. I, I, I spent a lot of time like that until I saw the world, not the country, the world. And, and being on different continents, it, it changes your thinking, man. It cha-

Joe Rogan 40:33 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 40:33 You know, the thing you were talking about with diet and discipline. Like, you know, these people run, wal- walk everywhere, run everywhere, ride bikes everywhere. The m- McDonald's is eaten like once a year as a crazy...

Joe Rogan 40:48 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 40:48 ... you know, night out. Like, my son lives overseas, you know? He, he, he's had McDonald's like three times in his life. You know, little kids here, it's like, every day, "Mommy, Chicken McNuggets." Blah, blah, blah.

Joe Rogan 41:02 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 41:02 You know, you just, you see cultural shifts and, and why there's no, um... Like, I've talked to people over there who d- didn't know what autism was. They never heard of it. Legitimately, like, "What is that?" And I had to explain it. And that shit got me thinking too. It's like, wha- okay, wha- how, how, why? Why is th- why is that not happening there? Wha- What could be the reason?

Joe Rogan 41:27 Artism?

Vinnie Paz 41:28 Autism.

Joe Rogan 41:29 Artism, autism.

Vinnie Paz 41:30 Yes.

Joe Rogan 41:30 Autism.

Vinnie Paz 41:31 Yes.

Joe Rogan 41:31 Oh, the disease.

Vinnie Paz 41:32 Yes.

Joe Rogan 41:33 Yeah. Okay, I thought you were saying artism.

Vinnie Paz 41:34 Oh, I'm sorry.

Joe Rogan 41:35 I was like, "What is that?" I don't know what it is either. Shit. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 41:37 No. You were l- you were looking at me like, uh-

Joe Rogan 41:40 I was trying to fig- I thought w- I was trying to figure out if you meant artisan.

Vinnie Paz 41:43 Oh, no.

Joe Rogan 41:43 Like handcrafted.

Vinnie Paz 41:44 Yes, yes, yes. Autism.

Joe Rogan 41:46 Autism. Yeah, it's that accent, bro.

Vinnie Paz 41:48 Sorry, my friend.

Joe Rogan 41:48 That Philly accent. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 41:49 Sorry, buddy. No, but-

Joe Rogan 41:50 Yeah, well, they, you know, it's, it's more common I think, uh, now than ever before, but the, the question is whether it's more common because it's more diagnosed or whether it's more common because there's more incidents of it.

Vinnie Paz 42:03 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 42:04 There's a lot of questions as to why. Uh, one of the big ones is apparently older people having kids, people waiting and putting off the children.

Vinnie Paz 42:11 Uh-huh.

Joe Rogan 42:11 And, uh, particularly men. Apparently there's a big risk for older men. Older men a lot of times have autistic kids.

Vinnie Paz 42:17 I have more than a couple friends with autistic children, man.

Joe Rogan 42:21 Me too. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 42:22 And, and, uh, I just, it, like, do you remember when we were young? I me- I think like the first time I even was aware was probably the movie Rain Man.

Joe Rogan 42:31 Yeah, me too.

Vinnie Paz 42:31 I'm not even being funny about it. Like-

Joe Rogan 42:32 No, me too. 100% first time I was aware.

Vinnie Paz 42:34 Did it exist and wasn't diagnosed? Or is it something it ha-

Joe Rogan 42:37 Well, they wrote a movie about it. I don't think they made it up for the movie.

Vinnie Paz 42:39 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 42:39 It's like the disease came along and got the movie.

Vinnie Paz 42:41 Right, right, right, right. (laughs) Right. But, but what happened, what happened? Chemic- uh, is it chemical? Is it, uh, people that were on drugs? Is it, is it things... Uh, uh-... or did it just, was it undiagnosed?

Joe Rogan 42:54 I think there's, uh, a bunch of factors. I think undiagnosed is one of them. I think also the ability to exchange information now allows you to be aware of it much quicker because of the internet, because people, you know, text and tweet and do these things on phones. Now, you hear conversations about autism and all these different things that you don't hear about before. And then I think it's entirely possible that... Well, first of all, there's definitely more people-

Vinnie Paz 43:16 Sure.

Joe Rogan 43:16 ... than ever before.

Vinnie Paz 43:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:17 So because of more people, you're gonna have more incidences of all-

Vinnie Paz 43:20 Sure.

Joe Rogan 43:20 ... sorts of diseases, cancer or whatever it is.

Vinnie Paz 43:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:22 And the question is, is it more per capita or is it more period?

Vinnie Paz 43:27 Right.

Joe Rogan 43:27 Because there's more people. And that, that I don't know the answer to.

Vinnie Paz 43:29 Sure. Well, what you said about more knowledge and information being able to be shared.

Joe Rogan 43:33 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 43:33 I have a dissociative disorder, it's called depersonalization disorder.

Joe Rogan 43:37 What does that do?

Vinnie Paz 43:38 So basically, I'll be sitting here talking to you and I'll just... My b- my mind, my mind, body, and soul will remove itself from my body. I'll feel like I'm floating down over my body. I'll look at my hands and they won't feel like mine.

Joe Rogan 43:51 Do you smoke weed?

Vinnie Paz 43:52 No.

Joe Rogan 43:53 That's the problem.

Vinnie Paz 43:54 No. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 43:54 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 43:55 It'll, it'll trigger it.

Joe Rogan 43:56 Will it?

Vinnie Paz 43:57 Yes. Um-

Joe Rogan 43:58 Like right now, if we got high, you would, you would-

Vinnie Paz 43:59 I-

Joe Rogan 43:59 ... float above yourself?

Vinnie Paz 44:00 I would fucking take that deer head and put it through my ear.

Joe Rogan 44:05 (laughs)

Narrator 44:07 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 44:07 I would lose my shit-

Joe Rogan 44:08 Really?

Vinnie Paz 44:08 ... and I'm envious... I'm envious of how weed has helped so many people and that it can't help me. Um-

Joe Rogan 44:15 What does it do to you?

Vinnie Paz 44:17 It makes me... I smoked when I was young, and what happened was something triggers, uh, DPD in people. It's, uh, you know, it could be a traumatic event, it could be PTSD. You know what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 44:28 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 44:29 Gun to my head, I would say it was my father dying, but it, it didn't happen right away-

Joe Rogan 44:33 Right.

Vinnie Paz 44:33 ... 'cause he died when I was 10 and this started when I was 14. I smoked a blunt of dust.

Joe Rogan 44:38 Oh.

Vinnie Paz 44:38 Yeah. A- and lost my shit. And for about 18 months, I... No lie, I thought I was in purgatory.

Joe Rogan 44:47 Whoa! How old were you? 14?

Vinnie Paz 44:50 14. I was like-

Joe Rogan 44:51 Whoo!

Vinnie Paz 44:51 ... "I'm definitely not in hell, I'm definitely not in heaven," whatever those might be.

Joe Rogan 44:56 Wow.

Vinnie Paz 44:56 Yo, man. And this is... So this is back then, there is no Twitter and I didn't even know what it... I, I went to a doctor, told him what happened, he was like, "Oh, it was, it was what you smoked." You know-

Joe Rogan 45:08 (sighs)

Vinnie Paz 45:08 ... "Don't, don't do that again." And it never left. And then I get these epis... I'll, I'll be in the shower on tour in the Czech Republic, washing my hair, closing my eyes, and I'll open them and not know where I'm at. No clue where I'm at and I'll feel like I'm floating outside of my body. Could... You know when you would hear the stories of people dying in an out-of-body experience?

Joe Rogan 45:28 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 45:28 That's li- literally my disorder.

Joe Rogan 45:30 I had an out-of-body experience once when I took salvia. It was like I was, I was, I was over here, like, floating above my... Pulsating-

Vinnie Paz 45:38 Were you scared?

Joe Rogan 45:38 ... floating above myself. No, I was tripping balls. I didn't know what was wrong with me.

Vinnie Paz 45:40 Yes, I get... I, I think, I think it's it, like I'm doing the Fred G. Sanford, Elizabeth, I'm coming to see you. I think I'm-

Joe Rogan 45:47 When you hear those, uh, those drug stories where a guy gets fucked up for like a year, those scare the shit out of me.

Vinnie Paz 45:52 Well, it happened to me.

Joe Rogan 45:53 Marc Maron was telling us about that, like he did coke with Sam Kinison for like a couple of days, they didn't sleep, and he was fucked up for a year.

Vinnie Paz 46:00 See-

Joe Rogan 46:00 For a whole year he heard voices.

Vinnie Paz 46:02 I would trade being fucked up for a year to do coke with Sam Kinison. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 46:08 (laughs)

Narrator 46:09 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 46:09 No, but it's what... It ha- It was like, it was like 18 months of my life.

Joe Rogan 46:12 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 46:12 And, yo, how do you tell your Italian mother that?

Joe Rogan 46:15 No, you can't. You gotta keep your mouth shut.

Vinnie Paz 46:16 And when you come from that culture, man, like my family, like old school Italians, they don't believe in mental... You have, you have to see it.

Joe Rogan 46:24 Right.

Vinnie Paz 46:24 They believe in cancer because they see it destroy your body.

Joe Rogan 46:26 Right.

Vinnie Paz 46:27 If you say, "I'm bipolar, I'm depres-..." Do you know what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 46:30 Right.

Vinnie Paz 46:30 Like, "I'm diagnosed depressed, I'm diagnosed DPD, I take medication for it." That still isn't enough for these people.

Joe Rogan 46:37 Right.

Vinnie Paz 46:38 It's, it's the shake it off.

Joe Rogan 46:39 Right.

Vinnie Paz 46:40 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 46:40 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 46:40 I cannot... If my father, if my father was alive, he'd probably throw me up the s- the flight of stairs for, for that, you know?

Joe Rogan 46:45 (laughs) That's what Joey Diaz calls immigrant mentality. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 46:49 Immigrant mentality is real-

Joe Rogan 46:51 It's legit?

Vinnie Paz 46:51 ... and I'm gonna steal that because it's real.

Joe Rogan 46:53 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 46:53 They, they want no fu- a- again, if it's not tangible, they don't believe in it, man.

Joe Rogan 46:59 Right.

Vinnie Paz 46:59 If I broke my leg, that woman would do everything for me. If I'm in the middle of a fucking breakdown, she's like, "You want gravy and meatballs?" I'm like-

Joe Rogan 47:10 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 47:10 ... "Ma, I'm losing my shit. I need to be hospitalized."

Joe Rogan 47:14 Right.

Vinnie Paz 47:15 Can't process it.

Joe Rogan 47:16 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 47:16 Been the best woman in... I love no one in the world more than my mother and she's... No one has been more supportive of me, um, and that's rare too with the immigrant mentality. You'd think I'd get to get a job, go to college.

Joe Rogan 47:29 Right.

Vinnie Paz 47:30 And she was like, "Baby, you do you. Like if that's what you want, do it."

Joe Rogan 47:34 That's am- that's amazing.

Vinnie Paz 47:35 Do it, but you better do it.

Joe Rogan 47:36 Right.

Vinnie Paz 47:37 Don't do it half-ass and don't bullshit.

Joe Rogan 47:40 Right.

Vinnie Paz 47:40 You know? The, the, this drinking 40s and smoking blunts rap shit looks good in the video, but you gotta work.

Joe Rogan 47:46 Right.

Vinnie Paz 47:46 You know what I mean? And, and it's, um, the work ethic, the, you know, like Joey said, the immigrant mentality, but it helps you in other places because when you, when you have relatives that didn't have shit and, you know, they're dressed in potato sacks (laughs) as they... You go, "Yo."

Joe Rogan 48:03 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 48:03 "I can't let my father down. He's not with us anymore."

Joe Rogan 48:06 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 48:07 "But I can't let him down because, um, I carry his name."

Joe Rogan 48:13 Right.

Vinnie Paz 48:13 "I don't wanna embarrass him. I don't wanna embarrass my mother. I want her to be proud, you know?" And, and that drives everything, man. Like I'm getting choked up talking about it because it's like I do everything for her and my son. And, and when you're driven by that, it doesn't have to be your mom or your s- it's... When you're driven by something that you care about, it changes everything, man. That-

Joe Rogan 48:36 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 48:36 We have people in our industries, in the entertainment industry, that just have this fucking sense of entitlement, man.

Joe Rogan 48:43 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 48:44 It's, it's plagued. I know you know comics with a fucking sense of entitlement. When they're rude, when you go backstage, I k- I know from how you are that you shake everyone's hand, say, "How you doing?" Thank you when they bring you something, please, thank you.

Joe Rogan 48:59 Sure.

Vinnie Paz 48:59 People, yo, people don't do that, man.

Joe Rogan 49:01 I know. You know what drives me crazy? When they don't do that to waiters.

Vinnie Paz 49:04 Oh.

Joe Rogan 49:04 Waiters and waitresses.

Vinnie Paz 49:05 Bro-

Joe Rogan 49:06 They don't say thank you and they don't tip or they don't tip well.

Vinnie Paz 49:08 I, last night the bill was, uh-... $130 in the bar and I gave them $230, and the guy, like, chased me to stop me.

Joe Rogan 49:17 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 49:17 And I'm, I'm a, you know-

Joe Rogan 49:18 He thinked he made a mistake.

Vinnie Paz 49:19 The, he, he did. He said-

Joe Rogan 49:20 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 49:20 ... "Did you..." He was like, "Yo, yo, yo, yo, yo, did you mean to do this?" I'm like-

Joe Rogan 49:23 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 49:23 ... "You took care of me all night, man."

Joe Rogan 49:25 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 49:25 "And I know that people are shitting on you-

Joe Rogan 49:27 Right.

Vinnie Paz 49:27 ... and leaving a dollar or maybe not even that."

Joe Rogan 49:29 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 49:29 And same with waitresses, man. No one gets shit on more than them.

Joe Rogan 49:32 No.

Vinnie Paz 49:32 What do they get, like, $2 an hour or something?

Joe Rogan 49:34 And you know when you really appreciate them? When you go overseas and they don't get tipped.

Vinnie Paz 49:37 Yes.

Joe Rogan 49:38 'Cause those people barely pay attention to you. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 49:39 Those motherfuckers don't care. I, you'll sit in Amsterdam, they won't even come over to give you your soda for an hour.

Joe Rogan 49:45 And in Italy, uh, we were eating at some nice restaurants, and the service was terrible. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 49:50 Awful. Awful. 'Cause they don't give a fuck.

Joe Rogan 49:53 They don't give a fuck.

Vinnie Paz 49:53 Why would they?

Joe Rogan 49:54 And you paid the exact same amount.

Vinnie Paz 49:55 If they're, they're, they're, they... Why would they a- act any different than someone at Burger King?

Joe Rogan 49:59 You know what the lady said to me at the restaurant? She goes, "The, this, the, we don't include a tip, but if you want, you can leave one."

Vinnie Paz 50:03 That's right. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:04 And I said, "Listen, baby, I'm gonna leave you one."

Vinnie Paz 50:05 That's right.

Joe Rogan 50:06 "Take care of us."

Vinnie Paz 50:06 Right.

Joe Rogan 50:07 She goes, "Okay."

Vinnie Paz 50:07 There-

Joe Rogan 50:07 So we had, like, a little American exchange there.

Vinnie Paz 50:09 There you go.

Joe Rogan 50:10 Don't worry about it, baby, I got you.

Vinnie Paz 50:11 If you set it up-

Joe Rogan 50:12 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 50:12 ... if there's a preamble-

Joe Rogan 50:14 Yeah. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 50:14 ... then it works.

Joe Rogan 50:15 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 50:15 But sometimes-

Joe Rogan 50:15 That's what you gotta do. Like, and when they're sitting you down, you say, "Listen, I'm from America. We tip in America, you know what I'm saying?"

Vinnie Paz 50:19 Set the precedent. Set the pre-

Joe Rogan 50:21 "We tip. I tip big."

Vinnie Paz 50:22 Right.

Joe Rogan 50:22 "Okay? Let's make this wonderful for everybody."

Vinnie Paz 50:24 You're setting the Rogan precedent.

Joe Rogan 50:25 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 50:25 "I'm taking care of you."

Joe Rogan 50:26 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 50:27 "So take care of us."

Joe Rogan 50:28 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 50:28 Yeah, man. But, but, but that, it's, um, just, you know, when a kid brings in a case of water-

Joe Rogan 50:33 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 50:33 ... I'm like, "Hey man, thank you." I've had those kids say to me, "Yo, I've been doing this 15 years. No one's ever addressed me."

Joe Rogan 50:40 Right.

Vinnie Paz 50:41 And I'm like, "Uh, that's awful, A, and I'm, I'm sorry for that, but it's not gonna be from me." If a kid that brings the towels for the stage, "Hey, thank you. Thank you so much for having us. I appreciate you. I hope we did good."

Joe Rogan 50:54 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 50:54 "I hope, uh, I hope the bar did well because my fans are degenerates. I ho- I, I hope this went well."

Joe Rogan 51:00 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 51:00 You know?

Joe Rogan 51:01 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 51:01 And I think, um, I think that goes a long way, bro, in life, you know?

Joe Rogan 51:05 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 51:05 I don't wanna get into, like, a karma discussion, but I think whether it's a comic, a rapper, a, a metal band, if you, if you treat people like shit for a long time, that gets around, bro.

Joe Rogan 51:15 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 51:15 Co- co- like, com- comic promoters know each other.

Joe Rogan 51:19 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 51:19 Music promoters know each other. They'll fucking call and be, "Yo, this guy's a fucking dick face, man."

Joe Rogan 51:23 I get those stories. You know, like, I was talking to a promoter the other day and he was telling me about some guy who's an asshole and was, like, yelling at the sound guy at the sound check and yelling at the promoter, made them fly to New York to s- for something 'cause the sound wasn't right or he wasn't happy with something, and, you know, they have to accommodate this guy, but they're, they're shaking their head and then every chance they get, they're gonna tell everybody else-

Vinnie Paz 51:46 Of course.

Joe Rogan 51:46 ... what a prima donna he is.

Vinnie Paz 51:48 And, and I don't... And if he's popular right now, when he starts to wane, those motherfuckers will remember that.

Joe Rogan 51:54 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 51:54 Now, when dudes like me and you, if we start to wane, we'll still get love-

Joe Rogan 51:58 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 51:58 ... because of the way we treated people, and that's reciprocated. Like, yo, uh, maybe he did 5,000 people last time. This time, if he's d... You know-

Joe Rogan 52:07 Right.

Vinnie Paz 52:07 ... I'm talking 20 years down the line or something.

Joe Rogan 52:09 Right. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 52:09 And then you only do half, they're still gonna have you because of the way you behaved, the way you were raised.

Joe Rogan 52:14 Well, it's also, you got an opportunity when you interact with people, like if you're working with someone and you guys are doing something together, you got an opportunity to just put smiles on faces.

Vinnie Paz 52:24 Yes.

Joe Rogan 52:24 And they, they put smiles on other people's faces because of that. Everybody's smiling.

Vinnie Paz 52:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 52:28 Then you got a nice little-

Vinnie Paz 52:29 Trickle-down effect, man.

Joe Rogan 52:30 ... community. Yeah, it's a nice community.

Vinnie Paz 52:31 And watch... Wa- it's, it takes more energy to be an asshole. It does for me-

Joe Rogan 52:35 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 52:35 ... 'cause I can be an asshole, and when I am, I feel drained.

Joe Rogan 52:39 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 52:39 It drains the shit out of me. I don't feel good about it. I just have a temper. I have a wop temper, but I try to curb it. And I realized when I'm, I, I treat people the way that they deserve to be treated, everything changes. The energy in the room changes. They might bring you... I, I don't know if you, you drink or smoke before you perform?

Joe Rogan 52:58 Both.

Vinnie Paz 52:59 Both. Okay. So if you, if on your rider is two bottles of Grey Goose, you might look over and there might be four, just because you a sweetheart, not 'cause you asked for it.

Joe Rogan 53:08 Right.

Vinnie Paz 53:08 It's just li- it's just little shit. I'm not even saying it's a big deal and that it's life changing. There's just little shit that, that, that people will, uh, you know, it'll, it makes their day just by us being polite instead of the guy that they had the last night that was a ball breaker and saying, "The, the, uh, the sound man, the, the buh buh buh du du."

Joe Rogan 53:29 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 53:29 First off, the guy don't...

Joe Rogan 53:30 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 53:30 You don't ever fuck with a sound man as a performer.

Joe Rogan 53:32 No. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 53:33 That motherfucker will get you. That motherfucker's got a ponytail. He fucking listened-

Joe Rogan 53:38 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 53:38 He, he smokes weed. To the Allman Brothers.

Joe Rogan 53:40 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 53:40 He's been around the block.

Joe Rogan 53:41 Yep.

Vinnie Paz 53:41 And people don't no- realize that shit.

Joe Rogan 53:43 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 53:43 That motherfucker is 60. He fucking listened to the MC5.

Joe Rogan 53:47 Yep.

Vinnie Paz 53:48 He fucking did sound for everybody you and I probably worship.

Joe Rogan 53:51 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 53:52 He is not impressed... He's probably impressed by you. He's definitely not impressed by me, a rapper from Philly. He don't give a fuck. He don't wanna be doing my sound.

Joe Rogan 54:00 Right. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 54:00 So the last thing I need to do is be like, "Yo, Schmohawk."

Joe Rogan 54:03 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 54:03 "Turn this up. This is gonna..." You know?

Joe Rogan 54:05 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 54:05 It's a, it, it, it, it, it-

Joe Rogan 54:06 But there's a mentality with, that a lot of people, uh, uh, adopt that when they become successful, they want to be a prick. They want, they wanna let everybody know. They wanna be that guy who yells and wrecks hotel rooms.

Vinnie Paz 54:20 Yes.

Joe Rogan 54:20 And you know that kind of shit?

Vinnie Paz 54:21 Yeah, I, oh, I do.

Joe Rogan 54:23 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 54:23 I, but, but I can't... I don't understand it.

Joe Rogan 54:26 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 54:26 You know?

Joe Rogan 54:26 I understand it.

Vinnie Paz 54:28 Do you?

Joe Rogan 54:28 It's a weakness. And it's just, they waited for so long to make it. Now they finally make it, they want everybody to suck their dick. That's-

Vinnie Paz 54:35 But, but do you think that things like that can be controlled by upbringing?

Joe Rogan 54:39 Yeah, they can be, but it's also-

Vinnie Paz 54:41 Like, Momma... I hear... If... All right, so I'm ready to smash something in a hotel.

Joe Rogan 54:44 Right.

Vinnie Paz 54:44 I hear my mom.

Joe Rogan 54:45 Your mom. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 54:45 "If you do that to those people, that p- that, that maid is gonna have to spend all day..." You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 54:52 Right, right. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 54:52 She tells me, when I'm cranky about a show or I'm leaving for tour and there's no sleep, she said, "You talk to every one of those kids, you sign every autograph, and you take every picture, or I'm going upside your head with the wooden spoon."

Joe Rogan 55:04 Ah.

Vinnie Paz 55:04 And the wooden spoon still has the crack from my head from back then, and it's still the one she stirs the gravy with-

Joe Rogan 55:09 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 55:09 ... but it's still cracked. But she said, she said, "You are here for a reason, and these people look up to you and these people respect you, and you do your best to..."... could not just continue that, but to have them think you're a better person than they already do because that's going to trickle down and then maybe they'll treat people better.

Joe Rogan 55:32 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 55:33 You've said it. All of this- all this energy travels, man.

Joe Rogan 55:36 It does.

Vinnie Paz 55:37 You know? If someone was in here right now just f- all three of us would get miserable real quick-

Joe Rogan 55:42 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 55:42 ... if someone was in here bitchin'.

Joe Rogan 55:43 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 55:43 "Everyone's out to get me."

Joe Rogan 55:45 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 55:45 "Everyone this and that." It's everyone's fault, man, except theirs.

Joe Rogan 55:49 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 55:49 You know that type of motherfucker?

Joe Rogan 55:50 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 55:51 It's never their f- Every fucking decision they made is self-inflicted-

Joe Rogan 55:55 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 55:55 ... but they can't self-examine and say, "Maybe it's me. How about just give me a maybe, motherfucker?" Some of these people I know, that's not even in their head.

Joe Rogan 56:04 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 56:04 It's all of us. It's you, it's me. "You didn't give them a break. You didn't let them on this show." Motherfucker, maybe it's you.

Joe Rogan 56:11 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 56:12 Maybe your energy-

Joe Rogan 56:12 I think it's also our responsibility to cast those people aside-

Vinnie Paz 56:15 Agreed. Ag-

Joe Rogan 56:16 ... as a lesson.

Vinnie Paz 56:17 Agreed, but-

Joe Rogan 56:17 I mean, that's what tribes would do.

Vinnie Paz 56:18 But when you're talking about a lesson, I think when you're too deep into it, you're not learning. I think when you hit a certain age and you're still like that-

Joe Rogan 56:25 Right.

Vinnie Paz 56:25 ... I think you're done, man.

Joe Rogan 56:26 Some people, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 56:27 I just think you're done. I know that's a negative way and we're talking about not being negative, but sometimes just reality's reality.

Joe Rogan 56:32 Well, if you're being pragmatic and you want to talk about, like, the good use of your time, yeah, you're not going to fix a 45-year-old guy who complains every day and-

Vinnie Paz 56:40 And, and that's what I'm talking about.

Joe Rogan 56:41 ... he moves with the times. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 56:42 A 25-year-old kid might be going through some shit.

Joe Rogan 56:44 Yeah. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 56:44 It could be a breakup, a loss of a fa- a parent.

Joe Rogan 56:47 Bad pattern that they're in.

Vinnie Paz 56:48 Yeah, of course.

Joe Rogan 56:48 There's some bad mental patterns.

Vinnie Paz 56:49 And you have to break patterns and if you don't break them, you end up being that 45-year-old guy.

Joe Rogan 56:54 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 56:54 I was a shitty friend to people, man. I'm- I've always been loved and, like, in my 20s and shit, I was just selfish. N- like, nothing crazy. I never did anything, like, horrible to someone. But just- just I thought about myself first and I was-

Joe Rogan 57:07 Right.

Vinnie Paz 57:07 ... probably, like, not maybe the, like, best friend to some of these people-

Joe Rogan 57:11 Right.

Vinnie Paz 57:11 ... and they're still in my life. And I had to make a conscious effort to-

Joe Rogan 57:16 To evolve.

Vinnie Paz 57:17 ... to evolve and break patterns, man.

Joe Rogan 57:19 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 57:19 And breaking patterns is hard as fuck.

Joe Rogan 57:21 It's hard as fuck, but that's part of growth, you know? And, uh, that's one of the reasons why it's important to be around people that are also doing the same kind of thing. You feed off of each other.

Vinnie Paz 57:31 Yes. Yes.

Joe Rogan 57:31 And when you're around people that are just real negative, that feeds off of it too-

Vinnie Paz 57:34 Of course.

Joe Rogan 57:35 ... and you- you want to be negative as well.

Vinnie Paz 57:36 Yeah. And- and you don't feel the need to break that cycle because you're around motherfuckers that are thinking like that too.

Joe Rogan 57:43 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 57:43 So it becomes this- this pity party where you're all-

Joe Rogan 57:46 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 57:46 It's a circle jerk of misery.

Joe Rogan 57:47 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 57:48 You know what I'm saying? And- and when- and the circle jerk of misery, it's just- it- it's- it's never ending, man. It's, uh-

Joe Rogan 57:53 Don't you think that one of the things that really expands your understanding of people and life i- is just being in a bunch of different places and understanding that where you grew up is just one part of the world?

Vinnie Paz 58:04 Yes.

Joe Rogan 58:05 That the world is this massive pla- Like, I just got back from Thailand. I was in Thailand this summer. I've never been around so many friendly people.

Vinnie Paz 58:12 Right.

Joe Rogan 58:13 Friendly, nice, smiling people that I think they call it the Land of the Smile or Land of a Thousand Smiles or some shit like that.

Vinnie Paz 58:19 Oh, it's- it's beautiful.

Joe Rogan 58:19 But that's what it's like. When you're over there, people are just so friendly and I was like, "Wow. Okay, if you grew up here, something about whatever-"

Vinnie Paz 58:27 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:27 "... momentum that these people have developed in their culture, their culture is, like, smiley and friendly to each other."

Vinnie Paz 58:32 Yes.

Joe Rogan 58:32 Like, this is, uh- this is just the w- the vibe, the way they do it, but if you around some real aggro, super shitty-

Vinnie Paz 58:40 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 58:40 ... insulting, aggressive culture, then that would be what you had to adapt to.

Vinnie Paz 58:44 Bro, Philly was voted the most hostile city in America by Time Magazine.

Joe Rogan 58:49 Oh, it's up there.

Vinnie Paz 58:50 So... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 58:51 (laughs) You know, I was- I was always, when I was in-

Vinnie Paz 58:53 Philly loves you though.

Joe Rogan 58:53 ... Philly, recently, when I said, this is how I describe Ph- said, "They're very smart people who will punch you."

Vinnie Paz 59:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 59:02 Like-

Vinnie Paz 59:02 That's a good description of me.

Joe Rogan 59:03 Yeah. That's- (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 59:04 Not the very smart, not the very smart. Uh, medi- of- of average intelligence that will punch you.

Joe Rogan 59:09 But it's- Philly's a sophisticated city. It's a real city, but they're all... They're hard people.

Vinnie Paz 59:15 Goons, man.

Joe Rogan 59:16 Yeah. There's- they're hard people there.

Vinnie Paz 59:17 Look, man, we threw, you know, we threw those snowballs at Santa Claus.

Joe Rogan 59:20 Yeah. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 59:21 Mi- Michael Irvin broke his leg and we cheered. You know?

Joe Rogan 59:24 Well, the famous Bill Burr rant-

Vinnie Paz 59:26 Yes.

Joe Rogan 59:26 ... when they booed-

Vinnie Paz 59:27 Yes.

Joe Rogan 59:27 ... Dom Irrera-

Vinnie Paz 59:28 Yes.

Joe Rogan 59:28 ... and then Bill Burr-

Vinnie Paz 59:28 Yes.

Joe Rogan 59:29 ... went on and tortured Philly for 10 minutes. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 59:30 Yes. Yes. And I love Dom. I love Dom. Me and Dom eat at the same restaurant.

Joe Rogan 59:34 I'm working with Dom tonight-

Vinnie Paz 59:36 Are you?

Joe Rogan 59:36 ... at the Icehouse.

Vinnie Paz 59:37 Big Petey-

Joe Rogan 59:37 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 59:37 ... Little Petey, and Little Petey?

Joe Rogan 59:38 Yeah. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 59:39 Yeah, he's pr- and Dom's great, man.

Joe Rogan 59:40 He's the best.

Vinnie Paz 59:41 We eat at a place called Poppy's in South Philly and I see him all the time. He's a sweetheart.

Joe Rogan 59:44 Oh, yeah?

Vinnie Paz 59:44 Sweetheart.

Joe Rogan 59:45 He's a great guy.

Vinnie Paz 59:45 Great guy, man. Legend.

Joe Rogan 59:47 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 59:47 Um, I just saw him on the, uh, the Bruce Willis roast and he murdered-

Joe Rogan 59:52 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 59:52 ... on that.

Joe Rogan 59:52 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 59:52 He murdered, but he's tr- great guy. I, uh, but, um-

Joe Rogan 59:56 I've been friends with Dom for, like, 25 years.

Vinnie Paz 59:59 Have you?

Joe Rogan 1:00:00 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:00 Wow.

Joe Rogan 1:00:00 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:00 You know he's a Philly guy, right?

Joe Rogan 1:00:01 Oh, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:02 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:00:03 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:03 Okay. Um, but yeah, w- what you were, like... There's also a level, uh, o- guilt though in cutting some of these people off that you were talking about.

Joe Rogan 1:00:12 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:12 That's kind of hard for me-

Joe Rogan 1:00:13 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:13 ... because, like, loyalty is a big thing too when you're talking about all these p-

Joe Rogan 1:00:17 You got to tell them.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:18 ... these pa- No, they don't listen.

Joe Rogan 1:00:19 Well, then you got to tell them again. Then-

Vinnie Paz 1:00:21 Then-

Joe Rogan 1:00:21 If they don't listen, then you got to cut them off and you go, "Look, I told you."

Vinnie Paz 1:00:24 That's what's happening now, but I still... It's st- it eats at me. I feel bad, like I should be... Like, uh, it's a savior complex.

Joe Rogan 1:00:31 Mm-hmm.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:31 You know what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 1:00:32 I know.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:33 Tha- that, ah, I don't want anyone to be fucked up, man. And I have a hard time being like, "Yo, this person is detrimental," and they, th- their... My energy is fucked up with them being in my life, but when it's time to cut them off, I still feel like, am I being a shitty person by doing that?

Joe Rogan 1:00:53 Yeah, well, that's what they want you to think 'cause they don't take care of themselves.

Vinnie Paz 1:00:56 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:00:57 Like, you got to take care of yourself before I take care of you. I mean, you got to at least want to.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:00 I'll help you if you want to.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:02 But if you're not taking care of yourself and you want me to do it for you, hey, hey, you got to get your own shit together first.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:08 At least get- make an attempt. You can't just ask everybody to carry your bags. Like, come on.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:13 They want you to carry their emotional bags-

Joe Rogan 1:01:16 Exactly.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:16 ... all the time and- and again, like I said, there's no, there's no introspection. There's no, "Well, maybe this many years and all of this shit happened to me, maybe it's me and I'm a dickhead."

Joe Rogan 1:01:28 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:28 ... when you can't see that, I feel like... I don't know, man. I- I- I- I... Calling people lost causes seems very dark and grim, but I think they exist.

Joe Rogan 1:01:37 Well, I think you probably have this attitude because your dad died when you were young and you were left alone.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:42 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:42 You know, and I have a lot of that because my father, uh, and my, my mother split up when I was real young and I haven't seen my dad since I was seven. So, it's the same sort of thing.

Vinnie Paz 1:01:51 Oh, wow, yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:51 You, you feel abandoned-

Vinnie Paz 1:01:52 Of course.

Joe Rogan 1:01:52 ... and so you don't want to leave anybody behind. So, I always rescued stray dogs and feral cats and took in crazy friends and th- this... My whole life has been like that.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:02 Yeah, you-

Joe Rogan 1:02:02 Like, taking in the misfits.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:03 And your father made that decision and that weighs on you. And my father made the decision to die. He had thr- he had bypass surgeries. They told him, "Stop smoking. Stop doing this. Stop doing that." He had my older brother bring cigarettes to the hospital.

Joe Rogan 1:02:21 Ugh.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:21 He drug the IV down to the bathroom and was smoking out of the window.

Joe Rogan 1:02:24 Oh, Jesus Christ.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:25 He, he had a, a young son and made a choice not to live for him.

Joe Rogan 1:02:28 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:28 My other brothers are 11 and 12 years older, so they got him for-

Joe Rogan 1:02:32 20.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:32 They were 21 and 22.

Joe Rogan 1:02:34 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:34 You know what I mean? Like, bro, I can't remember his voice.

Joe Rogan 1:02:36 Right.

Vinnie Paz 1:02:37 You know what I mean? And that shit weighs heavy because you... Uh, it is like, did he not love me enough to live for me? You know, and those things manifest themselves in different ways as you get older that you don't even know. You're not-

Joe Rogan 1:02:48 But you know what's crazy? It's a gift in some ways. And the gi- gi-

Vinnie Paz 1:02:51 It's a gift and a curse.

Joe Rogan 1:02:52 Yeah. The gift is that you, you have this energy that comes from this lack, this lack of something in your life when you're young.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:01 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:01 You know? I mean, this is something that I struggle with with my kids because I try to give my kids everything. Always give them love, always be around them, love them.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:07 Sure. Yeah, hug, kiss all the time, make sure they know.

Joe Rogan 1:03:09 But we were talking about this yesterday. All of my friends that are interesting came from fucked up childhoods.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:15 All my favorite friends.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:16 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:03:16 All my favorite friends, their life was chaos when they were growing up and it... They became these really interesting people.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:21 I, I, I hate that that's what created us.

Joe Rogan 1:03:24 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 1:03:25 But, but you're r- y- I mean...

Joe Rogan 1:03:26 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:26 You couldn't be more right.

Joe Rogan 1:03:27 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:27 I mean, you're talking about your favorite friends that are... I mean, my favorite everything.

Joe Rogan 1:03:32 Everything. Artists...

Vinnie Paz 1:03:33 My favorite ar- painters, musicians-

Joe Rogan 1:03:34 Yep, yep.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:34 Rock bands, punk, metal.

Joe Rogan 1:03:36 All of them. All of them.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:37 And all of them were fucked in the... I don't know any well-balanced people that are... That I feel like, "Oh, that, that guy is a brilliant mind. He came from a two-parent home in the suburbs of Connecticut." I don't know anyone like that.

Joe Rogan 1:03:47 Pressure creates diamonds.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:48 Yeah, man.

Joe Rogan 1:03:49 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:03:49 It busts pipes too.

Joe Rogan 1:03:50 It does bust pipes. (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 1:03:51 (laughs) But the thing... Yeah, but, uh, but, you know, I wonder, like, how much of that stuff haunts me and create... You know, like, uh, w- uh, you know, your parents splitting and being seven. Like, how many of the, the fucked up things that go on in your head now relate back to that and you're not even aware? Because the mind is so complicated.

Joe Rogan 1:04:10 Oh, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:11 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 1:04:11 There's a lot of it. You know, and I started realizing it when I was smoking weed. I didn't really sm- start smoking weed seriously until I was 30.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:18 Okay.

Joe Rogan 1:04:18 And then when I started doing it and then I started to... Thinking about all sorts of different patterns of my behavior...

Vinnie Paz 1:04:23 Uh-huh.

Joe Rogan 1:04:23 And why I was angry all the time.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:24 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:04:24 And I think a lot of it came from this resentment of being abandoned when I was young. Like-

Vinnie Paz 1:04:28 Well, some of your early stuff is fucking super dark. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:04:32 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 1:04:32 Like, so... I mean, I love... I think you're a brilliant comic, so I love all of your stuff.

Joe Rogan 1:04:36 Thank you.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:36 But some of that earlier stuff, man. It was-

Joe Rogan 1:04:37 Yeah, well, I was young and angry.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:39 ... pretty fucking dark place.

Joe Rogan 1:04:40 It was also... I was, uh... That was also, like, just a few years after I was done fighting. Like, I was a different person.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:47 Yes.

Joe Rogan 1:04:47 I just... I had a different mindset.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:48 Sure.

Joe Rogan 1:04:49 And I- I... Yeah, that's a very strange transition between, um, competition and then standup comedy.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:55 Of course. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:04:56 It's just a very different kind of mindset.

Vinnie Paz 1:04:59 Of course.

Joe Rogan 1:04:59 And I, and I carried a little bit too much combat with me in my early days.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:01 Yeah. Well, you were still fighting.

Joe Rogan 1:05:03 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:03 You were still fighting and, and sometimes when you don't know what you're fighting-

Joe Rogan 1:05:08 Yeah, it's worse.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:09 ... it's worse.

Joe Rogan 1:05:09 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:09 Because you start internalizing it and you don't know what the wa-... It's war with self.

Joe Rogan 1:05:13 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:14 And the war with self... Because you don't... You want to t-... This needs to... This energy needs to be channeled and, and how can it be?

Joe Rogan 1:05:22 Right.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:22 And you, and you went batshit on the mic.

Joe Rogan 1:05:24 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:24 And went really dark with it. And I've done that too. But for us to be healthy... Uh, uh, here's the other question though. If we were to get healthy, would we just suck?

Joe Rogan 1:05:33 Yeah. Well, I used to worry about that when I was young. I used to worry about being... My idea was that if I became somehow, you know, "enlightened"-

Vinnie Paz 1:05:41 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:05:41 ... that I wouldn't be funny anymore.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:43 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:05:43 Because all the funny people I knew were fucked up.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:45 Of course. I don't-

Joe Rogan 1:05:46 I thought that I needed to be a drug addict. I'm like, "Damn, Kinison was a drug addict. Pryor was a drug addict. Maybe I need to be a drug addict."

Vinnie Paz 1:05:51 I... You, you look at these people-

Joe Rogan 1:05:53 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 1:05:53 I mean, historically. Look at Hendrix.

Joe Rogan 1:05:55 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:55 Look at... You know what I mean? Look at, look at Bukowski.

Joe Rogan 1:05:57 Morrison.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:58 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:05:58 Janis Joplin.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:59 Yes.

Joe Rogan 1:05:59 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:05:59 Bukowski.

Joe Rogan 1:06:00 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:00 These... Bukowski is a fucking-

Joe Rogan 1:06:02 Sure. Mess.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:03 The, the town drunk.

Joe Rogan 1:06:04 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:04 And one of the best.

Joe Rogan 1:06:05 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:06 It's... I, I thought and think the same way. I'm like, "I might need to pick up a habit."

Joe Rogan 1:06:09 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:09 Just to-

Joe Rogan 1:06:09 Do you drink?

Vinnie Paz 1:06:10 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:06:11 Just a little bit?

Vinnie Paz 1:06:11 I shouldn't. I drank a lot and had a epiphany. I woke up one day and cold turkeyed it.

Joe Rogan 1:06:19 Really?

Vinnie Paz 1:06:19 Yeah, yeah. I drank a lot for a lot of years.

Joe Rogan 1:06:22 And now you don't drink at all?

Vinnie Paz 1:06:23 No, no.

Joe Rogan 1:06:23 Or just, just drink a little?

Vinnie Paz 1:06:24 Just, like, cas'.

Joe Rogan 1:06:26 A little, a little bit.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:26 You know, a little bit. A little bit. A little bit. But, uh, i- i- it's... It's more like when I perform.

Joe Rogan 1:06:33 Right.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:33 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 1:06:34 Just loosen up?

Vinnie Paz 1:06:35 Yeah, but I was drinking two bottles of Grey Goose alone every night.

Joe Rogan 1:06:38 Oh.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:39 Yeah, alone. Dolo.

Joe Rogan 1:06:40 Oh.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:41 Every night.

Joe Rogan 1:06:41 That's a lot.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:41 Seven days a week.

Joe Rogan 1:06:42 That's a lot.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:43 Two bottles to the head.

Joe Rogan 1:06:44 That's, uh, Bert Kreischer.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:46 Love Bert. Love the Bert.

Joe Rogan 1:06:48 (laughs)

Vinnie Paz 1:06:48 I know the Bert.

Joe Rogan 1:06:49 He's, he's got a bottle in his hand, "What?" While he's listening to you.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:52 What?

Joe Rogan 1:06:53 Who?

Vinnie Paz 1:06:54 Love the Bert.

Joe Rogan 1:06:54 Yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:55 Yeah. You guys are close, yeah?

Joe Rogan 1:06:56 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Vinnie Paz 1:06:57 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:06:57 We're doing Sober October. We're trying to figure out the bet.

Vinnie Paz 1:07:00 Who cracks first?

Joe Rogan 1:07:02 Well, who knows what it is. Yeah, well, we're trying to figure out what to do. Tom Segura's got some great idea. Instead of, uh, yoga classes, there's some application that you, uh... Let me find out what that is.

Vinnie Paz 1:07:10 Are you