Joe Rogan Experience #1238 - Brian Redban

Joe Rogan 0:00 (sniffs) Four, three, two, one. (imitates light bulb turning off) Hey, fella. What's going on?

Brian Redban 0:10 Hey. How have you been?

Joe Rogan 0:11 How was it like to get that quick Quake fix?

Brian Redban 0:13 Oh, my God. Uh, uh, it's so amazing how fast it came back to me, like the addiction of playing that game over and over again.

Joe Rogan 0:19 (sniffs) It's a real problem.

Brian Redban 0:20 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 0:21 Yeah, we've been going crazy. Jamie's been fucking me up too.

Jamie Vernon 0:24 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 0:24 So today-

Jamie Vernon 0:25 Have mercy.

Joe Rogan 0:25 ... I got lucky that he had to help you get his shit together.

Jamie Vernon 0:28 Three early kills, I saw that.

Joe Rogan 0:29 Dude, he's been fucking me up.

Brian Redban 0:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:31 Not, not nice.

Brian Redban 0:32 And y- you don't really play Quake, right? You just... It's from-

Jamie Vernon 0:34 Yeah. I, uh-

Brian Redban 0:34 ... playing a lot of Fortnite and stuff?

Jamie Vernon 0:35 I tested myself a little bit 'cause I knew this was gonna happen eventually, so I had to get some practice with some rockets at, at some point.

Joe Rogan 0:41 Mm.

Jamie Vernon 0:42 And, yeah. But it helped... It honestly helps to warm up with Quake to play Fortnite or play PUBG or something like that 'cause the quick whatever it is of aiming, you don't do it that much. So, like, when you're doing it three times, you've already done it 55 times playing Quake just in one round.

Joe Rogan 0:54 Right.

Jamie Vernon 0:54 So like your little interaction you have with someone with a shotgun, you usually win, so.

Brian Redban 0:58 (sighs)

Joe Rogan 0:58 Quake is so fast-paced.

Brian Redban 1:00 Yeah.

Jamie Vernon 1:00 We're playing Quake 4. It's like, whoa.

Brian Redban 1:02 It's like-

Joe Rogan 1:03 Jesus Christ.

Brian Redban 1:04 I haven't played that game in maybe 15 years.

Joe Rogan 1:06 Me too. You know what I noticed?

Brian Redban 1:07 I didn't think they were ever gonna do it again.

Joe Rogan 1:08 I probably shouldn't.

Brian Redban 1:10 (laughs)

Jamie Vernon 1:10 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:10 What, what I noticed is my eyesight sucks now. My eyesight is not nearly as good. It's interesting. From like 42 to 46, there was a big drop off. And at 46, the fucking floor fell out. Now, it's like my eyesight's shit.

Brian Redban 1:24 Gamer glasses.

Jamie Vernon 1:25 Oh. It takes me a minute when I play games too. Like one game-

Brian Redban 1:28 Focus.

Jamie Vernon 1:28 ... isn't enough, yeah, it probably takes 10 minutes, maybe less, but like to just tr- start tracking things-

Joe Rogan 1:34 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Vernon 1:34 ... just getting your eyes up to speed, the distance you are away from that screen, all, all of... It takes a little bit of time to get in there.

Joe Rogan 1:40 Yeah, man. It's, uh... We're... Right now, we're just playing it on the local area network. But, uh, once you start going online and playing other people, that's when it gets super, super addictive.

Brian Redban 1:49 People that still play that game must be insane.

Jamie Vernon 1:52 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:52 Oh my God, I don't wanna be anywhere near those psychopaths.

Brian Redban 1:55 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:55 If they're playing that game, it's because they're really good at it probably.

Brian Redban 1:57 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:58 You know?

Brian Redban 1:58 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:58 Like who else... Like young kids aren't buying that game.

Brian Redban 2:01 Back in the day, you even had a Joe Rogan, uh, level that somebody created. Remember that?

Joe Rogan 2:06 Yeah, somebody created a level. That's right. Was that... What game was that with? Three or 4?

Brian Redban 2:10 I think it was 4.

Joe Rogan 2:11 Was it really?

Brian Redban 2:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 2:12 4 was '11 though. Didn't it come out in 2011?

Jamie Vernon 2:14 I think so, yeah.

Brian Redban 2:15 Yeah, maybe it was 3 then.

Joe Rogan 2:16 Might have been 3. Yeah.

Brian Redban 2:17 Wasn't, wasn't Rock- Rocket League-

Joe Rogan 2:18 Rocket Arena?

Brian Redban 2:19 ... Arena, Arena 4?

Joe Rogan 2:20 I don't know.

Brian Redban 2:21 Oh my gosh.

Joe Rogan 2:21 I don't remember.

Brian Redban 2:22 I don't remember either.

Joe Rogan 2:23 I know there was Rocket Arena for Quake 2, and there was Rocket Arena for Quake 3 'cause I started with Rocket Arena for Quake 2, which if you played today, you would think the graphics are hilariously bad.

Brian Redban 2:33 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 2:33 But, uh, it's a good game. It's a little slower. The fast game is like... Quake 1 was really fast, Quake 2 was slower, and then Quake 3 became more like Quake 1, a combination of Quake 1 and Quake 2.

Brian Redban 2:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 2:46 It was pretty fast. Quake 4 is probably perfect.

Brian Redban 2:49 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Vernon 2:50 (sighs)

Brian Redban 2:50 Miss it. And you tried to play the new Quake, but you didn't, you didn't like it as much. Is that-

Joe Rogan 2:54 The only problem is it's fun. We had a good time. The only problem is you have to do everything through their servers. So it takes time. It's gotta load.

Brian Redban 3:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:03 It's like it's not... I'm impatient.

Brian Redban 3:05 Right.

Joe Rogan 3:06 I'm a fucking child.

Brian Redban 3:07 That's crazy.

Joe Rogan 3:09 Yeah.

Brian Redban 3:09 And you, you, you refused to try any of the other ones, right? Like the-

Joe Rogan 3:13 Dude, they're all just new addictions-

Brian Redban 3:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:15 ... you know, waiting to happen. I just feel like once... if I got one addiction...

Jamie Vernon 3:20 Uh, this weekend, on Saturday, they had a concert in Fortnite.

Brian Redban 3:24 Yeah, Marshmello.

Jamie Vernon 3:25 It was, it was crazy.

Brian Redban 3:26 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:26 What does that mean?

Jamie Vernon 3:27 It's, it's, it's tough to explain, but they had... It's called an event. What they're calling it is like an event. So at two o'clock, everybody showed up at the game, and this fucking concert started. It, it was like-

Joe Rogan 3:39 So all the avatars were together like in one gigantic room?

Jamie Vernon 3:42 The normal mode, you, you played it just like normal, and then all of a sudden, like two minutes to go, they took everybody's guns away.

Joe Rogan 3:48 Whoa.

Jamie Vernon 3:48 And like you all just sort of congregated around the stage. And the music started, the show started, they started doing interactive things with all the avatars and everything. And like 10 minutes later, it just, it cut off.

Joe Rogan 3:58 Jesus Christ.

Jamie Vernon 3:59 But it turns out he was actually live. He, he was tweeting about it all day 'cause... for promotion and whatnot. But people were asking like, "How'd you do that? How'd you work it out?" His voice was going live to everyone who was playing. It was probably millions of people.

Joe Rogan 4:11 Whoa.

Jamie Vernon 4:11 Yeah.

Brian Redban 4:11 You know, it's just normal DJ voice stuff, like, "Hey, jump guys. Hey."

Joe Rogan 4:16 Was it?

Jamie Vernon 4:17 He was just like, "Hey, guys, come on." Like, he wasn't interacting too much, as much as he probably does during a normal set-

Brian Redban 4:21 Right.

Jamie Vernon 4:21 ... when he's playing to 20,000 people in Vegas or whatever it is.

Joe Rogan 4:24 So when he does it, he probably has like a really good microphone too. Like it's not like the microphone that you talk shit on, right?

Jamie Vernon 4:29 Well, yeah, yeah, yeah, they had something else set up. Yeah.

Brian Redban 4:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:31 When we first started doing Quake, no one... You had to type.

Brian Redban 4:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:35 That's how goofy it was. You had to ty-... You couldn't talk shit. Like now people are talking, like they're all in a group together talking shit, right?

Jamie Vernon 4:41 I have a voice changer now too.

Joe Rogan 4:43 But doesn't the talking shit get in the way? Like if you hear people talking, it gets in the way of hearing sounds, like sound cues.

Jamie Vernon 4:49 Yes. You tell your teammates, "Shut the fuck up."

Brian Redban 4:50 You can turn that off also.

Joe Rogan 4:52 Oh, you can?

Brian Redban 4:52 Yeah. I, uh, I like to hear the footsteps going arou- coming around the corner-

Joe Rogan 4:55 Yeah.

Brian Redban 4:55 ... and stuff.

Joe Rogan 4:56 It makes it scary.

Brian Redban 4:57 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:57 It's part of what's scary about Quake, is like y- you hear someone running, like, "Uh," and you know they're right around the corner.

Jamie Vernon 5:03 You can control all that. It's all up to you, vol- volume settings and all that kind of thing.

Joe Rogan 5:07 It's a very, very addictive game.

Jamie Vernon 5:09 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 5:09 So we should talk about this, uh, the Jack podcast 'cause everybody got so u- upset about it. And let's clear up a few things. First of all, the guy seems to be willing to talk about anything. It's not that I didn't wanna talk to him about those things. It's just he was being, um... I wouldn't say he's evasive, but he was basically just saying what he knew based on the company policy. I didn't know what else more to ask him. And people felt like I didn't press him hard enough. And he, to his credit, reached out to me and said that he would offer to do another one to ask more questions.

Brian Redban 5:45 That's cool.

Joe Rogan 5:45 And I said, "That'd be awesome." So I said... Well, this is the thing that people seem to be upset about. They seem to be upset about very specific cases where people showed, um... Like if, if people were right-wing and they were posting things, they were banned. Whereas people who are left-wing or maybe, uh, people of different races were allowed to post-... racist things or more offensive things and even doxxed people and didn't suffer any consequences for it. This is the argument. My problem is I don't spend enough time reading this stuff. I don't know. Like, this is like, when people get banned, like Anthony Cumia's a friend of mine. I don't really know why he got banned. I don't know what happened.

Guest 6:27 Okay.

Joe Rogan 6:27 I know there was that incident with that, that woman that punched him and he wound up getting fired, he was drunk and he said a bunch of really stupid shit on, in, in, in Twitter and then later apologized for it. But I don't know if that's what got him fi- uh, kicked off of Twitter. But he's my friend. So, what I'm saying is, all these other guys that have problems, I don't know what the fuck happened, man. I'm busy. I really don't. I, I don't know. I don't even know what got Alex Jones kicked off, which is why I asked him, because that was one of the last platforms for Alex Jones, was Twitter. But something got him kicked off. Their take on it was that they never kicked him off before because he didn't violate their terms of service. And another thing that's very encouraging that Jack said, and I know it's, it's fun to get mad at things. It's fun to get mad at him, it's fun to get mad at me for it. I get it. I'd probably do the exact same thing. I totally understand it. But one of the things that he said was that he believes that the ability to communicate on the internet through Twitter or through these platforms is a basic human right. That's how he looked... Like, I said, "Do you think of it like, uh, a network like NBC?" Like if you're on NBC, they can decide what's on and what's not on. Or do you look at it like a utility? And he specifically said that he looked at it more like that. That he thought it was a basic right. That's very encouraging. He also said that he would bring on whoever it is in his team that's responsible for these things. So, we could hear from the actual person who decides who's getting banned and why they're getting banned and w- what, what is, what's the decision-making behind all these things, so we can go over all of them. Um, I didn't think the podcast would create such a controversy, but that's probably poor prior planning on my part. Because my thought about it was, hey, I wanna... Like, it's fucking crazy to be running Twitter. Like, it's crazy that this thing exists that the President uses it as a platform. I wanna talk about the dude who created this and what is this like to have this thing evolve to become what it's become? Because it didn't start out that way. It started out like fun shit, like, uh, @BrianRedBand's going to the movies. You know what I mean? Like that's what people used it for. And then along the way, it became this global m- method of distributing information where people use it in war zones, man. They use it to, to tell people where attacks are, they use it for all kinds of crazy shit. It's like a, it's a really powerful but strange medium. I didn't think about getting into the weeds with all the very specific people that got banned. I just wanted to find out why they ban people. That was my take on it. I know there's a lot of conservative voices that have never been banned. I don't think Steven Crowder's been banned. I don't think Cernovich has been banned. Has he been banned? There's qu- a bunch that have not been banned. Right? So it's not like they ban all right-wing voices. So what is it? I don't know what it is.

Guest 9:22 I think it's what he said, people reporting the tweet and then d- somebody's looking at it going, "Well, this does violate our, you know, policy."

Joe Rogan 9:31 Right.

Guest 9:31 And maybe, you know, all these people that, that got banned violated the policy somehow, you know? It's probably as simple and cut clean as that, you know?

Joe Rogan 9:39 It's, it's, it's not that simple, right? Because they make their own policies. And it's also not that simple if people are allowed to say similar things that are very racist and, and vast generalizations about white people, which seems to have been the case in at least a few instances, where people reported that people said fucked up things about white people but there was no repercussions. And (sighs) you know, that's where the argument becomes these people are more oppressed and so the white people are thought of as the oppressor, so you have this white privilege thing that people like to use now as a reason to, to decide to like silence someone, like check your white privilege. That's a, that's an interesting thing that's happening. So, if, if there's this genuine movement where people think that it's okay to say things about one race, whether you like it or not, that's racism. And if you're allowing that from any one side and not allowing it from another side, it seems hypocritical. Look, it's very distasteful. The idea of racism against Black people in this country is very distasteful to everybody, almost everybody who's not a racist, right? Because of the history of this country, because of slavery, because of all these things, it's a different connotation. But if you just l- allow people to say terrible things about any race, it's racism. You're g- you, you are allowing a, like a predetermined attitude about a race. Some people have done this. They have made generalizations, generalizations, r- uh, racist statements about white people. The, the really weird thing that people are throwing around these days is that you can't be racist against white people because racism is about power and influence. It's about using your, your r- and the b- that Black people are not powerful, that white people are powerful and the white people are the ones who are oppressed, so it's impossible to be racist against them. That sounds like horse shit to me. (sighs) I'm not buying that. That doesn't make any sense. It's not beneficial to anybody to generalize. This is what we gotta get in our head. It doesn't matter if you're Black or if you're white or if you're whatever the fuck you are, it is not beneficial to generalize, to take a p- a person out of the group that we, we think of as just human.... individuals. Y- you have to be an individual. I mean, it, I acknowledge the fact that people look different, they have different heritageses, they have... Heritageses?

Guest 12:11 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 12:11 They have different h- different ancestry, they have different occupa- ... There's different parts of the world. There's all these differences. But a- at the end of the day, the only way we're all gonna get true equality and true kinship and comradery as human beings is if we recognize we're just all a human being. That's it. There are very big differences in the way we look and the, the things we like. That's cool. But as soon as you s- you can say shitty things about white people or white men, (slaps table) (smacks lips) that leaves everybody who doesn't fit that description guilty in this weird way, or presumed guilty because of a racist statement. That's all it is. It's not good for anybody. I get it that it's different than racism against Black people in America, uh, a country that was built e- essentially in a lot of ways by slavery. There's a war for slavery in this country. I mean, that is a crazy reality that it's not your responsibility, it's not mine. I didn't do it, you didn't do it, but it's real. Therefore, as a person who's aware of hist- uh, h- history, the history of this country, racism against white people seems different. But it still sucks to be racist against, uh, races against Black people, rather. It seems different, but it still sucks to be racist against white people. It sucks to be racist against Puerto Ricans. (slaps table) It's not good. It's not good for anybody. It's ... That's what we have to understand about this social media thing. What actually did happen? And what is happening? And why is it happening? And if it's just some social justice warrior ethic that you're not debating, it doesn't seem fair. It seems like there should be a conversation about this. And I bet they're super reasonable, really intelligent people, and it's possible they can come to a- a- a- a good place that we can all agree to. That is possible. I'm not a cynical person. I'm sorry. I know a lot of you are like, "Fuck them. They just want this, they just want that." Guess what? They already have it. They have more money than they could ever spend. And my dealings with Jack as a person, he seems like a very nice guy and a very smart guy and, and a very empathetic guy. I just think he's in a crazy unmanageable situation to be running something like Twitter. Yeah, and there's probably people that did something that they shouldn't have done in terms of silencing people and moving things around. It's probably happened. It's a weird thing when people have influence over people. And there's, there have been videos that have been proven where executives from a bunch of different social media corporations have talked about how to silence certain voices, how to push down certain voices. Um, this is something that needs to be discussed. Like, is this, uh, a, as a policy as a whole? Is it, you know ... Is it, is it because you, you think you're pushing the right message? Like, as soon as someone thinks they're pushing the right message, but they don't have a ... there's no debate about that, right? They just decide our way is the right way. And they're pushing this, and there's a radical opposition to that message from half the country. Like, the, like ... But you, you're like, "No, no, no, but this is the one that's in cont- controlling the narrative. This is the one that's in c- c- control of social media." It's this far left-leaning ideology, and the other part gets pushed aside. That's a very bad situation for all of us. Because there has to be conversation, there has to be debate. 'Cause if there's not, it just shores up the differences between two people, and they fucking hate each other even more. I did not take that into account, and I fucked up. That's my mistake. That is my mistake when I made that podcast. But I didn't take it easy on him because I didn't want to discuss those issues. I just didn't think enough of it in advance. I'm not as involved in it as other people are. I'm aware that there's censorship in social media. I'm aware. M- my, my ideas going into that conversation were more about how insane this method is for distributing information. For the people that have been banned and for the people that were fans of the people that were banned, I can understand why they'd be upset at me. It has nothing to do with any preconceived notions that I had, it's just how the conversation took place. That's all it is. And if you felt let down by that, you didn't feel like it was as ex- extensive enough, I'm more than willing to do it and go further into it, and we're going to. And Jack offered it, and he's gonna bring someone else who's gonna explain things to us. I think this will be very beneficial for everybody. I also think that there should be a road to redemption. I think if you've got something that's important as Twitter or Facebook or Instagram, i- if you're not stealing someone's stuff, like, you know, u- using copyrighted music or something on, on an Instagram page where you get banned over and over again for doing it but you keep doing it, if it's not something like that, if it's, if it's a, an ideological difference, if maybe you crossed a line that they, they decided was a line, you should be able to work your way back. You should ... There should, there should be a way where you can sign up again.

Guest 17:14 You mean like get a new email address? (laughs)

Joe Rogan 17:16 I don't mean that, man.

Guest 17:17 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 17:17 I mean be the same person.

Guest 17:18 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:18 You should, you should be able to be the same person. There should be a way.

Guest 17:21 But there should be different levels, definitely.

Joe Rogan 17:23 Don't ... Well, well, we ... Everybody ... People fuck up, man. They, they fuck up and they make mistakes. Right? And people also grow. I mean, there's this, uh, guy that was on Sam Harris's podcast, um, Christian Piccolini I think is his name. He was a fucking white supremacist, a full-on white supremacist. And now, he is the exact opposite. He's, he's like this very progressive guy who gives speeches on the, the dangers of racism and that, and the ideo- ideology, how it caught up with him. Now, if, if he got banned when he was a young man and making terrible decisions and then became a better person, shouldn't we give a, a guy like that a chance to get back on a platform?... right? And without making a whole new screen name. Like, maybe it would be ... Um, and I, I don't think there's anything wrong with the anonymous model. There's some things that are really good about it, right? Like, peop- like, Jack even talked about this, that people can report news stuff and not worry about fear of retribution. That they can, you know, they can whistleblow and not worry about fear of retribution. If someone's life is on the line, but they're trying to provide a service to the general public, or they're trying to give people information that may be- might even save lives, but could put them at risk, especially in, like, third world countries or war-torn countries, that could be a huge problem if you have to post, you know, Brian Redban. If this is the only way you can get this information out, you have to use your whole name. But it'd probably be better off for everybody if people

Joe Rogan 18:55 had a, a, a way of communicating with each other like it's just person-to-person. And I think the, the real problem is when people try to engineer these conversations. And this is another conversation about YouTube. People have said that we're deleting comments on YouTube. We're not deleting anything. We haven't deleted any comments. I don't know how it works. I don't read them. I'm sure people say mean things. Have a good time. The thumbs up, thumbs down thing, look, we, we, we don't have to have that on there. You don't have to have comments on there. YouTube gives you the option to have comments on and to have the thumbs up, thumbs down. I'm not taking those off. G- have a good time with it. But we're not fucking with that. There's something that they're doing that's not, it's not, I post at 3:41 and Jamie posts at 3:42 and this is the line of the comments. It's not like that. They've got their own way of doing it. The question is, why does YouTube do it? What's their, what, what are they trying to do? Uh, is it, are they trying to block out spam? Are they trying to block out hate speech? Are tr- are they trying to engineer conversation?

Guest 20:03 Are you talking about comment order?

Joe Rogan 20:04 Comments on ... No. Do- comments disappear. They go away.

Guest 20:08 Uh, w- a lot of times, it's automatic. If somebody flags a comment, th- it will just take the comment away until it's, like, looked over upon.

Joe Rogan 20:16 Only one person?

Guest 20:17 Yeah. On, I think on YouTube, that, that happens quite often.

20:20 Yeah, it could probably be as l- little as one or two people, yeah.

Joe Rogan 20:22 So, that is probably what's happening to all you folks that think your comments are getting deleted. No one's deleting shit.

Guest 20:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 20:29 Look, I'm, I'm not attached to what I do in the sense that I'm unwilling to look at what I do wrong. I try to look at everything that I do wrong, including this. So, if you were upset at this podcast because you thought somehow or another I sold out because I didn't ask him any more questions, I just asked him the questions I wanted to ask. I understand you have more ques- more questions. And I do, too. I, I have more questions, too. Especially upon seeing people's reaction to it, and upon, you know, making myself pay more attention to all these various stories. Uh, Matt sent us a, a list of them. Some of them are really fucking crazy. There's some crazy things people have said and not gotten in trouble for. Whereas other people said things that really weren't that bad and got in trouble for it. Why is that? That's a good question to ask. So, we'll, we'll concentrate on that. We're just gonna work out a date. So, my humblest apologies to all of you. Don't- I'm not trying to let anybody down. I always try to do my best. That's it. And, and also, here's another clear one. No one tells me what to do. There's no one, there's no secret person behind the scenes. If I fuck up, it's because of me. It's my fuck up. I should have prepared more. I should have thought about it more. But I didn't realize, like, how upset people would be.

Guest 21:44 I think you did a great- I thought it was a great interview, and I didn't even think of that. I thought you kind of touched on it a little when you were talking about Alex Jones, and I think that was like, "Okay, you know, this is what happens with-" Yeah.

Joe Rogan 21:53 Well, it's a very specific group of people that are upset.

Guest 21:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 21:55 It's r- right wing guys.

Guest 21:56 Right.

Joe Rogan 21:57 It's, it's a lot of American flags, a lot of Pepe the Frogs. (laughs)

Guest 22:00 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 22:00 It's alt-right people. Which, look, man, easily could have been me at many points in my life. Easily. Especially being a troll online. You know, if you're working some fucking job and you're making Pepe the Frog memes and you're fucking with people, I get it. I get it. It's one of the things I like about the internet. Like, I don't, I don't wanna be comfortable. I'm li- I don't, I don't wanna be comfortable all the time. I want, I want a little bit of chaos. I like the fact that there's people, like, they're like, that fucking ... I was upset that that Radiolab podcast, they took it down, where they were fucking with Shia LaBeouf, with those guys from 4chan. And the way they took it down was they contacted Radiolab and said, "Those guys are white supremacists and they support white supremacy." You know, and th- and you just, you know, you made these people that are awful, terrible people, that write terrible things, you, you, you gave them props. But the thing about something like 4chan is, no, you might read some terrible things. But you gotta realize you're also reading terrible things from anonymous people that are working at their jobs most of the time, and they're trying to fuck with people's head. And they're trying to get people upset. They're, they're, they're having a good time fucking with people. If you want to take them as that- that's like them, like, giving, giving a talk to a dear friend, or them giving an affidavit in court, well, you're missing the whole thing. It's entertainment. Like, half of the whole reason why they're doing it is entertainment. They didn't go steal Shia LaBeouf's flag and go, and go right into the camera and go, "Fuck Shia LaBeouf," by using coordinates from photographs of th- the sky where they figured out where the fucking, where the, the constellations lie and then drove around honking their horn so that they could locate where it was by using the webcam and listening to how close they got to it. I mean, it's fucking genius shit. And it got taken down just by this accusation of them being racist. But the thing about a forum like 4chan or Reddit or anything, you have so many fucking people. You have thousands and thousands and thousands of people. If you just have 10 cunts posting-... jokes about Black people. That's all you need to ruin the reputation of thousands of people. So for someone to say that everybody that was like, "Fuck Shia LaBeouf," is some racist and white supremacist, that's a cheap way out. That's a cheap way out. I bet more likely, it's some dude who's bored, and he's sitting in front of his fucking computer, and he works all day, and this is where he, he escapes. He escapes and, and types, and writes things, then checks them later, and then goes back to it and types things and checks. And it keeps him sane in this stupid fucking cubicle. That's a lot of the people. So they pulled that whole amazing podcast down because of that. Look, what he... The Shia LaBeouf thing was ridiculous. "He will not divide us." Come on. Stop! Stop. We get to chant that everywhere. It's funny what they did. They mock something. That's their way of mocking it. Nobody got hurt. They made it out like it was this, like, awful crime they committed on this, this am- amazing person who's just trying to change the world. No, no, they, they pranked Shia LaBeouf, and they said, "Fuck Shia LaBeouf." Is, is that how you say it?

Jamie Vernon 25:11 Shia LaBeouf. (laughs)

Guest 25:13 LaBooth?

Jamie Vernon 25:13 LaBeouf.

Joe Rogan 25:13 LaBeouf, whatever it is.

Jamie Vernon 25:14 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 25:14 Shia LaBeouf.

Guest 25:15 I think it's better.

Joe Rogan 25:15 I'm sure he's a nice guy too. He probably did something silly. (door slams) It's a little silly. "He will not divide us." He wi-... They... What they did was funny. It's a funny reaction. I, I like that. I like that. Like, this is a... It's an important part of this thing. If it wasn't for people like that, there would be no podcast. Now, the like-to-dislike ratio that you see on YouTube videos is fascinating, right? Because it's weaponized, and they're thinking about trying to ban that now, because so many people use it to fuck with people. I hate to say this about you folks, but every time we have a chick on here, they get fucking tortured.

Guest 25:52 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 25:52 The like-to-dislike, right? Like, it's, it's ruthless. Except Rhonica Patrick. Except Rhonica Patrick.

Jamie Vernon 25:57 Right. But it's just... It's weaponized. It's the... They're just going to dislike it because-

Joe Rogan 26:01 'Cause it's fun, though.

Jamie Vernon 26:02 ... 'cause it's had thumbs down.

Joe Rogan 26:02 'Cause it's fun. 'Cause it's fun. Look, it's also fun to throw a rock at a window. It's fun. Yeah, I mean, and some of them probably didn't even watch the podcast-

Jamie Vernon 26:09 And it-

Joe Rogan 26:09 ... so thumbs down.

Jamie Vernon 26:10 ... gives them a l-... Disliking it gives a little bit of power in the algorithm of de-ranking it and-

Joe Rogan 26:15 Yeah, when but-

Jamie Vernon 26:15 ... thinks you affected something.

Joe Rogan 26:17 And people who liked it, there's probably a lot of them that didn't even watch it.

Jamie Vernon 26:20 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:20 It's a button you can press.

Jamie Vernon 26:21 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:21 People are weird, you know? But it's clearly... It shows by the amount of dislike that people moved on it and they were upset about it. Um, so... That's basically it. We'll see.

Guest 26:32 There's, there's a lot of cool interesting questions that... To ask him. Like I always thought shadow banning was a real thing, but I think he came out and said that that's not a real thing.

Joe Rogan 26:40 Mm.

Guest 26:40 But I've, I've, I've seen it in my... You know, in person where I'll type somebody's name in and usually it's supposed to come up on the, you know, searches, but it doesn't. You know, and-

Joe Rogan 26:49 Well, shadow banning is a w-... If it is a real thing, like, that's another one. Like, shadow banning for what? Like, if it... If it's not something that is... If you're, you're not doing something that you could get kicked off the platform for, right? You're not kicking them off. You're just pushing them-

Guest 27:05 Down.

Joe Rogan 27:05 ... some weird place. But if you're doing that, like, why are you doing that? Like what...

Guest 27:09 Because, like, uh-

Joe Rogan 27:10 What would be the justification?

Guest 27:12 From the ones that I have seen, there used to even be a website that you could type in somebody's username to see if they were shadow banned, so that's kind of interesting. But, uh... Like, a lot of porn stars are shadow banned 'cause they don't want... If you're looking up Christina Applegate, they don't want Christina C-... You know, Applebottom or something like that.

Joe Rogan 27:26 Mm.

Guest 27:26 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 27:27 Yeah.

Guest 27:27 So it's, it's like they're... I, I, I still believe that's a thing, but I'm pretty sure he came out and said it wasn't-

Jamie Vernon 27:33 Sure.

Guest 27:33 ... a real thing.

Jamie Vernon 27:33 Technically, shadow banning Justin Bieber from the trending topics, right? I mean, they-

Joe Rogan 27:37 Right.

Jamie Vernon 27:37 ... have publicly said that. That's not a shadow ban.

Joe Rogan 27:39 Right.

Jamie Vernon 27:39 That's a, a str- strategy.

Joe Rogan 27:42 Well, no. They were kind of forced into it-

Jamie Vernon 27:43 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:43 ... because Justin Bieber was so... His fans trend so hard, they hashtagged the shit out of that thing and they just took over the trending.

Jamie Vernon 27:51 It's probably happening for other equally popular celebrities too, like Taylor Swifts and Beyonces-

Joe Rogan 27:56 Kanye.

Jamie Vernon 27:57 ... and all this, yeah.

Guest 27:57 Yeah, yeah.

Jamie Vernon 27:57 Yeah, yeah.

Guest 27:57 You're probably right. You're probably right. So, whatever they're doing at YouTube with comments and whatever they're doing with Twitter, the... Here's the real conversation, right? The real conversation is: do we want that? Do we want them to curate? Do we want them to decide whose YouTube videos you could subscribe to and who is g-... I mean, do they unsubscribe people? Is that real or is that a glitch?

Jamie Vernon 28:24 Most... Yeah, who knows on that?

Guest 28:26 I don't think they unsubscribe you.

Joe Rogan 28:27 I don't think so either, but people have... Well, let's... Listen. If they're willing to move Justin Bieber from the number one trending because he number one trends too hard and they think it's ridiculous not to just acknowledge that our culture... That there's certain humans in our culture spending an exorbitant amount of time thinking about that beautiful man, right? There's a lot. But why do we want to lie and pretend that it's not as big? So if they just... I'm not saying they shouldn't. But if they did that, just if they did that, you go, "Okay, are we through the looking glass now? You can change the data?" Like what, what do you... When, when do you decide who gets pushed here, who gets pushed there? When do you decide?

Jamie Vernon 29:06 YouTube definitely... (clears throat) The trending page on YouTube is 100% controlled by a human. I don't know if they've said that, but there are videos that should be there-

Joe Rogan 29:15 Yeah.

Jamie Vernon 29:15 ... that aren't based off of the data you see.

Joe Rogan 29:18 Yeah.

Guest 29:18 YouTube's got some weird things going on with it. Like, there's a... The videos that they go, "You might like" type, uh, thing? They, they did a "you might like" to me a couple months ago where it was just videos of a guy towing cars in Dallas, like out of the parking lot.

Joe Rogan 29:34 Yeah.

Guest 29:34 And he made these funny cute little videos with a little commentary using, uh, videos from the security cameras. Anyways, I don't know why I liked it, but I started watching it and I was like, "You know, this is interesting." So I tweeted it out, like, "Random video I just got addicted to on YouTube." Everybody w-... Like, hundreds of people were like, "I just started watching that. YouTube recommended that to me." Like, how did that happen? You know, this little guy with a tow truck company is now pushed on everybody's laps. And now he just, uh, went over 100,000 subscribers the other day.

Jamie Vernon 30:03 Yes.

Brian Redban 30:03 And it was, like, months ago that he was just had, like, 10.

Jamie Vernon 30:05 That, that ha- that, that's the argument some people have made that t- that's how fast the Paul brothers, they grew and th- they grew so fast on YouTube that some people thought there was something up. They gained, like, millions of followers within a week or two of being on there. And they, they were coming from another platform.

Joe Rogan 30:19 Well, it's also, there's, coming from another platform is giant, but it's also, all it really takes is one person deciding that whatever the fuck you did was funny or weird or crazy, like that Cashew Outside girl.

Brian Redban 30:31 Yeah. Well, there's, that girl's, you know, managed by the same people that own TMZ.

Jamie Vernon 30:35 That-

Brian Redban 30:35 And that's why you see it on TMZ every day.

Jamie Vernon 30:37 Yeah, I was gonna bring up-

Brian Redban 30:38 (laughs)

Jamie Vernon 30:38 ... if you watch the Fyre, the Fyre Festival documentary, there's a, an explanation of, they show how they sp- uh, they spread the v- act- the Fuck Jerry guys, the marketing team spread that with the orange picture. It was a coordinated event over hundreds of different social media accounts.

Joe Rogan 30:52 For her? For the Cash me Outside girl?

Jamie Vernon 30:54 No, for, and then-

Joe Rogan 30:54 For Fye Fest?

Brian Redban 30:54 This is a s- yeah, for the Fyre Festival, yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:56 Fyre Festival. Keep saying Fyre.

Jamie Vernon 30:56 For, to catch everybody's... Because there are a team of people, there are agencies that have all these influencer accounts.

Joe Rogan 31:02 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Vernon 31:02 They pay them. They don't have to accept the money or d- accept the offer, accept the campaign, but oftentimes they do.

Joe Rogan 31:09 So it's like a talent agency?

Jamie Vernon 31:11 100%. Yeah. Yeah.

Brian Redban 31:12 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 31:12 Interesting.

Jamie Vernon 31:12 They need to share a new person, you know, launch the next-

Joe Rogan 31:14 Oh.

Jamie Vernon 31:14 ... the next voice and it's like, "Oh, here's a new song. Here's a new movie." It's just a new way to spread stuff.

Joe Rogan 31:18 What the fuck bro?

Brian Redban 31:19 Yeah. It's pretty cool watching how many people are unsubscribing to F- Fuck Jerry and, uh, Fat Joe though. That's int-

Joe Rogan 31:25 Yeah, but are they? I looked at it the other day. It was just, they have like 14 million.

Jamie Vernon 31:29 They lost 500,000 in like a week end.

Joe Rogan 31:32 Really?

Jamie Vernon 31:32 It's a significant amount.

Brian Redban 31:33 Last time I looked-

Joe Rogan 31:34 Did they really?

Brian Redban 31:34 ... it was 14.7, then it was 14.1. I haven't looked today, but yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:38 Whoa.

Jamie Vernon 31:38 That's coming from I think a video someone shared this week. I think Vic Berger made a video that got-

Joe Rogan 31:43 Mm-hmm.

Jamie Vernon 31:43 ... spread around and...

Joe Rogan 31:44 They took his video, right?

Jamie Vernon 31:46 I, maybe. I don't-

Joe Rogan 31:47 Yeah. I think that's what he said.

Jamie Vernon 31:48 It's not new info either.

Joe Rogan 31:48 I think I saw it on Vic Ber- Berger's page.

Brian Redban 31:50 There was a few comics that have posted videos like, "Hey, uh, F- you know, Fat Jew stole this." You know, and, "I tried to reach out, they never got back to me. He got 10 million."

Joe Rogan 31:59 Yeah.

Brian Redban 31:59 What, what, what do you think about this idea though? Like, that's kind of piracy, you know, like...

Joe Rogan 32:03 Yes.

Brian Redban 32:04 I- that, and so Instagram's allowing and T- and Twitter's allowing piracy?

Joe Rogan 32:09 Well, I think they're allowing these people to post videos because you don't really know where it came from. There's no proof, right? Like, if you find a meme, like how many times have you posted a meme? I po- I repost whoever sent it to me if someone sends it to me, but sometimes I'll just find it in a Google search and you gotta figure out who made that meme and if I find their Instagram account then I'll try to find it and repost it. But some people don't and I have in the past. Like, uh, I did that one with, uh, Baked Alaska got mad at me 'cause there was one with Alex Jones sitting in a hot tub and it's, uh, s- like s- when your friends are trying to chill and, but you have to keep dropping truth bombs.

Brian Redban 32:45 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 32:45 It was hilarious. I didn't know it was his.

Jamie Vernon 32:47 Right.

Joe Rogan 32:47 I just posted it 'cause someone sent it to me. Someone sent it to me in a text message I think. Um, but those things have a creator, right? And, uh, I know Pete, like, Eddie Bravo makes his own. He makes some sometimes, but he'll send some to me or post some online that he finds that are funny too and everybody tries to credit the person who did it, right? But now what they do is they, they take it and they credit the person, but they didn't for so long.

Jamie Vernon 33:15 A lot-

Joe Rogan 33:15 Like-

Jamie Vernon 33:15 They'll attempt, they're crediting fake accounts though. They'll make up-

Brian Redban 33:18 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 33:18 Yeah.

Jamie Vernon 33:18 ... a fake account.

Brian Redban 33:18 They have fake accounts.

Jamie Vernon 33:18 Put that meme there and just do it-

Joe Rogan 33:20 I've seen that too.

Jamie Vernon 33:20 ... so they, so they're not getting busted in the way you were just explaining.

Joe Rogan 33:22 W- I've seen that too. Well, what is that about though? 'Cause that seems like deception.

Jamie Vernon 33:26 It's just the way around the, that backdooring that, that qualification of it needs to be on an account. We need to point to somebody. Okay, well, we'll point to this account we just created.

Joe Rogan 33:33 But it's not even a real account.

Jamie Vernon 33:34 Right.

Brian Redban 33:34 And if they find, like, they, they'll post stuff and then later add the person 'cause the person contacts them-

Joe Rogan 33:40 Mm-hmm.

Brian Redban 33:41 ... and so they're almost like, that's admitting to piracy. Like, we- we did pirate.

Joe Rogan 33:44 Well, is it though? I mean, because it's, if they just reposted it, a lot of folks, including me, do that.

Brian Redban 33:49 Yeah. But they're making, they're making money, other people are not.

Joe Rogan 33:51 They're giving the person credit. They're making money. Yeah. Um, that's important. I don't make any money off my Instagram.

Brian Redban 33:56 Right. They're making millions. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 33:57 Yeah, I just, uh, I've been offered to post stuff up and I'm not saying that I wouldn't if something was fucking killer and they wanted to give me money. I'm greedy, I'll take some money. But I wouldn't lie about it. Uh, and I, and, uh, I haven't yet. I've never accepted any money yet.

Brian Redban 34:14 Yeah. 'Cause it's also, I think in Instagram's, uh, you know, law that you have to put that it's an ad if you're making money off of it.

Joe Rogan 34:22 Yeah.

Brian Redban 34:23 And so that's another thing that both Fuck Jerry and Fat Joe are not doing. They're not putting a ad.

Jamie Vernon 34:27 Is- uh, I just wanna, like, to devil's advocate this though. Is, is there a place for them, for those accounts? Like is there a place to ha- to be the retweeter of the memes, to be that guy, to be that account, you know? Like-

Joe Rogan 34:38 Um...

Jamie Vernon 34:39 ... isn't that valuable sort of?

Joe Rogan 34:40 Yes. It is a curator position. Yeah, it's kind of valuable but the question is like, if it, if it is valuable and it becomes something w- almost like redistributing your standup if you're doing a set. Like if, if standup sets were, you know, something that you just, you could get everywhere and you could just repost it on your page, but then your page became super popular because you have all these people's standup sets. You know, like, Spotify. Spotify gets ads, right? But they don't really, they pay the artists a little bit but mostly they make all the money.

Jamie Vernon 35:08 Yeah, I don't know if like you, if it's you, you s- like to say sorry later, you just do it and say I'm sorry I'm gonna figure it out after the fact or you get it all figured out

Joe Rogan 35:16 But these are all business oriented things that have art in them as opposed to art oriented things that start making money. They're two very different things. So this is not an art thing. This is a they find other people's art and they sell it, they're pushing it. They be, they create these accounts, the accounts get giant, people pass it around because they're just finding funny things and then they start profiting, but all the people that created all the intellectual property get zero money, which is weird.

Jamie Vernon 35:46 I don't remember but I only learned, uh, more about this when Exit Through the Gift Shop came out. Isn't that what Andy Warhol sort of did?

Joe Rogan 35:53 I don't know and I don't care. I mean-

Jamie Vernon 35:55 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 35:55 ... maybe he did. Maybe he did but the pro- the thing about it is that this is happening right now-

Jamie Vernon 35:59 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:59 ... on the internet. It's a totally different animal. I mean, Andy Warhol wasn't running around taking exact photo duplicates and putting them on his website for sale. Like these are, this is, when someone's doing on an Instagram page is like you could within seconds take a piece and put it somewhere else.... it's seconds.

Brian Redban 36:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:17 Brian posts something, I think it's funny, ha ha. I go to copy, I go to the fucking repost a- uh, app. I put it in there, rip, zip, repost it.

Brian Redban 36:26 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:26 It's seconds later. You could do that all day. And if you hire kids, and you... I don't know if he has people working for them, but if these guys do, they hire people for fucking 20 bucks an hour or whatever, and these people just do it all day long. They just find funny shit all day long. They look for certain hashtags.

Brian Redban 36:43 Meme factories are what they're called. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:45 Yeah.

Brian Redban 36:45 Yep.

Joe Rogan 36:45 And there's some people, like, you know, that have made some funny ones. All their own, you know? A lot of people that are just doing it all. I know D'Elia has done a bunch of them. And then there's also one that they do where they steal people's act and make a meme out of it, and then-

Brian Redban 37:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:00 ... post that on their page. That's where it gets even more slippery, because you're talking about, like, standups' acts that... And you- you're- you're making money off it. How much are they making off each post? I mean, I don't know, but these are multimillion dollar businesses, right?

Brian Redban 37:12 And the punchline. So now you're- you have this 10-minute joke that y- everyone knows the punchline 'cause they saw it on Facebook.

Joe Rogan 37:17 Yeah.

Brian Redban 37:17 That's like-

Joe Rogan 37:18 Yeah.

Brian Redban 37:18 ... like, spoiler alert, come on.

Joe Rogan 37:20 Well, and-

Brian Redban 37:20 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:20 ... for sure if you're still doing that material.

Brian Redban 37:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:22 Like, if it wasn't on Netflix or a Comedy Central special or something, for sure. That sucks.

Brian Redban 37:27 I guess it's- it's always happened though, hasn't it? TV shows have been, uh, accused of stealing, uh, like-

Joe Rogan 37:32 Oh, they have stolen.

Brian Redban 37:33 ... walking in, yeah. It's happened on-

Joe Rogan 37:34 Dude, they did it to Kevin James. I saw it happen. Kevin James was at the, uh, he had a development deal for NBC back in the days, eh? Back when we were young pups. Both of us were like 27 or some shit. Maybe he was a little older than that. Maybe he was... Actually, that was like during the News Radio days, so we were probably like in our 30s. Um, and he had this development deal, nice development deal. They were paying him a lotta, lotta cash, a lotta paper. And, uh, they were setting up a sitcom around him, so they had him do a set at a theater in Hollywood. And, uh, I was there, and he does his set, and there's all these writers from various sitcoms. And the very next season, one of his best jokes is on an episode of a television show that's very popular.

Brian Redban 38:22 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 38:23 Very popular.

Brian Redban 38:24 I've- yeah.

Joe Rogan 38:25 Yeah.

Brian Redban 38:25 I would watch that.

Joe Rogan 38:26 Yeah, yeah. And, uh, they fucking stole his bit, man.

Brian Redban 38:29 How- I guess that's where I was going with... 'Cause that was in the '90s, so like-

Joe Rogan 38:32 Mm-hmm.

Brian Redban 38:32 ... we're now 20, 20, 25 years later. The new popular medium is Instagram and social media.

Joe Rogan 38:38 Yeah, but-

Brian Redban 38:38 How different is that?

Joe Rogan 38:39 Well, it's different because there's accountability now. 'Cause now people know that if you wrote a meme, and you put it up on your site, and then, uh, Fuck Jerry comes along and steals your shit and doesn't credit you for it and just puts it up there, you know what they did, unless someone sent it to them and didn't a- attribute it to you, which is possible. But it seems much more, um, likely that what they're doing, they were doing on purpose for the longest time, and they just did... They thought that's what you could do on the internet. It's a wild west. You could just take memes and you could become famous. And look, that fat Jewish guy did it. I mean, that guy became famous. Wha- whether you, uh, agree with his methods or not, it worked. He- he's got his crazy hair, he shows you, you know, like he's this crazy-looking guy, and he has all these funny memes that somebody else wrote, and they're all up on his Instagram page, and it worked. And people don't like him now. There's a lot of people that don't like him. People get real shitty with him in person. They don't want him doing appearances. They know what he did. So there's a certain number of people that go, "Hey, man, you're a thief." Like, "This is not cool." Like, "What you did is not cool." But then there's certain people that don't care, and then there's certain people that think, "Well, what he did was just what anybody did back then. It was the wild west. No one thought about it." And once he established that business model and it was effective, it was probably very hard for him to- to slow it down, or to attribute things to people, or to admit that he didn't do it for all that amount of time.

Brian Redban 40:05 It just bugs me that companies pay these guys knowing that they do this, or like, as a Fat Jew, he's like s- he's like signed with CAA, who's signed with a bunch of comedians that he probably took, you know... They're taken from the same basket.

Joe Rogan 40:17 Yeah.

Brian Redban 40:17 So it's like...

Joe Rogan 40:18 It is weird, right?

Brian Redban 40:19 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 40:20 Now, if he was going on stage and doing their acts...

Brian Redban 40:23 He's been doing appearances, right? He's got a book. He's been on TV shows.

Joe Rogan 40:27 Well, I don't know what's in...

Brian Redban 40:28 B- I don't know what he's in doing. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 40:29 I don't know what he's doing.

Brian Redban 40:30 But maybe he's showing-

Joe Rogan 40:31 I don't want to assume that. But he's-

Brian Redban 40:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 40:31 Look, he's obviously used it for profit. He's figured out a way to profit. It's weird. He must be weirded out by this Fuck Jerry thing, too, because he might be sit- must be sitting there going, "Okay, I'm right here."

Brian Redban 40:43 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 40:44 (laughs)

Brian Redban 40:44 "Any of you guys gonna leave me alone?"

Joe Rogan 40:45 (laughs)

Brian Redban 40:46 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 40:46 It's, um... You know, Comedy Central was advertising on the Fuck Jerry page, which is like Jesus, folks.

Brian Redban 40:55 Wow. I didn't know that.

Joe Rogan 40:56 Yeah. Yeah. It was like Jesus, folks. Can I just sit you guys down? (laughs) Go over a little history of comedy?

Brian Redban 41:03 Well, I mean-

Joe Rogan 41:03 You know?

Brian Redban 41:04 Mayim Bensia, they didn't learn then, either, you know?

Joe Rogan 41:06 Well, that was while it was happening, though.

Brian Redban 41:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 41:08 They- they did learn eventually. They- they let it go eventually, but that was also because the ratings had dropped through the floor. You know, comedy's not fucking easy to make up, you know? Especially like meme kind of comedy that's done by folks that are working in offices. Meme kind of comedy is some of the funniest fucking comedy on Earth, and it's done by regular people. It's not like a... Just... It's not like most memes are written by high-level satirists that work for The New Yorker. No, they're fucking regular folks who think something's funny, you know?

Brian Redban 41:44 I think what's gonna happen is as technology improves the... Like, being able to scan a photo and go, "Well, we could tell the first time this was ever put on the internet was from this little girl. She took a photo of it." It has all the data in the picture, and it's now used on this meme that's making this much money, and this meme-

Joe Rogan 42:00 Yeah.

Brian Redban 42:00 And then it's gonna be kind of broken down like a, you know, any kind of artist position.

Joe Rogan 42:04 Yeah, I guess. I mean...

Brian Redban 42:06 That's the idea for the block- or the argument for the blockchain getting involved in here, because-

Joe Rogan 42:10 Right.

Brian Redban 42:10 ... you could tie... You can... I guess it can be in the data, in the bits.

Joe Rogan 42:13 Mm-hmm.

Brian Redban 42:13 Like-

Joe Rogan 42:13 Now, let me ask you this. What if someone uses a picture of, uh, your band? Say you have a band. They use a picture of your band and then they have a funny meme under the picture of your band.... who, who owns that, then?

Jamie Vernon 42:25 That's what hap- Like, I think Beyoncé tried to get that picture taken off the internet from her from the Super Bowl a couple years ago because it was, like, a bad picture. She didn't like how she looked in it.

Joe Rogan 42:33 That's hilarious.

Jamie Vernon 42:34 Yeah, man, it's-

Joe Rogan 42:34 How the fuck does that lady take a bad picture?

Jamie Vernon 42:37 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 42:37 And she doesn't do good with her hair.

Jamie Vernon 42:38 Somebody needs to talk to her and go- Yeah.

Joe Rogan 42:40 ... "Listen, it's good. It's not your best, but you look fucking great."

Jamie Vernon 42:43 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 42:43 Like, if that shit was on Tinder, you know, you wouldn't be going, "Eh."

Jamie Vernon 42:47 It's like sh- did they- who- if- if someone was paying for that meme, should Beyoncé get some of the money or...

Joe Rogan 42:53 Eh.

Jamie Vernon 42:53 That's- that's the question you would have with, like, a corporation, right? Which, should someone be able to grab photos that are out in the public domain, make something with it, and then profiting? That's the w- that's... There's been a lot of bands, I'm sure... That's why I said bands- Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:06 ... 'cause they're, like, really good at protecting copyright and their logo and shit. If you had, like, the KISS band logo, you don't think Gene Simmons would come at you? He's coming at you with some lawyers, 100%, right? That's just what he's gonna do. But it's who owns those photos if it's, like, Gene Simmons, like, spitting fire out and-

Brian Redban 43:23 I think if you took the photo and cameras were allowed inside the event, f- y- you took it, it's-

Joe Rogan 43:28 Right, but it's not-

Brian Redban 43:29 ... the photographer.

Joe Rogan 43:29 ... what it- the case is, though. Most of the photographs are people that are putting o- they're just putting them up online and someone takes it. It's like, say if you, Gene Simmons spitting fire and then it has a joke about eating a hooker's pussy or something.

Jamie Vernon 43:41 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 43:42 Like, whatever it is, like, f- filling, make something funny there. But, like, if that's online and that becomes this giant meme that gets all these likes and that somehow or another someone pro- how the fuck do you profit from y- from Instagram? You don't profit from individual posts, but those individual posts will boost your signal.

Jamie Vernon 44:01 Yeah.

Brian Redban 44:01 Some posts are profited.

Joe Rogan 44:03 Instagram?

Brian Redban 44:03 Yeah, yeah. You have to say ad on it, though, right?

Joe Rogan 44:05 Right, it has to say sponsored post, right?

Jamie Vernon 44:08 Right, yeah.

Brian Redban 44:09 What legally it's supposed to, but n- I'd probably say 90% of them aren't like that.

Joe Rogan 44:13 Right. A lot of people don't, right, especially if it's like-

Brian Redban 44:16 Instagram models.

Joe Rogan 44:16 ... you thi- you think you can get away with it, yeah.

Brian Redban 44:18 Oh, yeah. Instagram models talking about tea. "Oh, this is the best tea, eh."

Joe Rogan 44:21 Yeah. It's a- ho- that- the Instagram model is a fucking hilarious position. It really is.

Brian Redban 44:27 It's a powerful position.

Joe Rogan 44:29 Yeah. It's hilarious, though. It's just amazing how many of them there are and they make money. You know, it's smart.

Brian Redban 44:36 It's amazing how butts are such a big thing now.

Joe Rogan 44:38 Yeah.

Brian Redban 44:39 And, like, when I was a kid, that- no one cared about butts. If it was a big butt, you were like, "Ew, lose some weight."

Joe Rogan 44:44 Yeah, we talked about this before, I think.

Brian Redban 44:46 Oh, really? (laughs) Okay.

Jamie Vernon 44:46 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 44:46 I think you and I did.

Brian Redban 44:47 No problem.

Joe Rogan 44:47 It was where I said, "Sir Mix-A-Lot changed the game."

Jamie Vernon 44:50 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:50 Everybody's like, "What?"

Jamie Vernon 44:51 Was he though?

Joe Rogan 44:51 "Oh, you like big butts? Hey, I kinda do too."

Jamie Vernon 44:54 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:54 It's like, for whatever reason, it wasn't even an issue. Like, back then, girls would have giant fake boobs and tiny flat butts and they, they were perfect.

Brian Redban 45:03 My grandmother would have millions of (laughs) Instagram model hits.

Jamie Vernon 45:07 (laughs) Fat Bottomed Girls was before that slightly, but no one really-

Joe Rogan 45:10 Oh, right.

Jamie Vernon 45:10 It didn't catch on, right?

Joe Rogan 45:11 "You Make the Rocking World Go Round." That's a great goddamn song. I didn't see Bohemian Rhapsody, did you?

Jamie Vernon 45:16 I didn't see it either, no.

Joe Rogan 45:16 Did you see it?

Brian Redban 45:17 Nah.

Jamie Vernon 45:17 I don't think so.

Joe Rogan 45:18 What?

Brian Redban 45:18 I heard it wasn't that good.

Joe Rogan 45:19 What the fuck are you guys talking about? I heard it was amazing.

Jamie Vernon 45:22 Did you?

Joe Rogan 45:22 Yeah, I did. I'm a giant Queen fan though. I love them. That's my, uh, my number one cryogenic song when I'm in the cryo chamber is Dragon Attack. Do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do 'cause you gotta move around when you're in that 240 degrees below zero. It's hard to just sit still, do a little dancing in there.

Jamie Vernon 45:40 I read a, uh, he did a- Rami Malek I think is the, the actor's name that played him, Freddie Mercury.

Joe Rogan 45:45 Oh, yeah.

Jamie Vernon 45:45 He did a really good job, but, uh, before it happened, Sacha Baron Cohen was sort of in talks for it, but he, he wanted to take the character in a different direction that no one was really comfortable with.

Brian Redban 45:55 Ah, see, I would have rather have seen that.

Jamie Vernon 45:57 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 45:57 No, man. What would he have done?

Jamie Vernon 45:59 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 45:59 What was that? What does that mean?

Jamie Vernon 46:01 I don't know. I don't know.

Joe Rogan 46:01 See, that's a weird thing, man. You can't-

Jamie Vernon 46:03 'Cause it's been said too that to, to get spicy talk.

Joe Rogan 46:06 But you can't just add stuff.

Brian Redban 46:08 "My wife."

Jamie Vernon 46:09 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 46:09 Yeah, you can't just-

Jamie Vernon 46:11 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 46:11 It's not an art piece. Like, Bohemian Rhapsody, although it is an art piece, it's a documentary of a guy's life. Like, in some ways you're documenting it, right? Like, it's supposed to be his li- You can't make up things that never really happened or-

Jamie Vernon 46:26 Sort of. I forget what mo- But it's like a- it's the difference between, like, a biopic and an actual biography or a documentary.

Joe Rogan 46:32 Right.

Jamie Vernon 46:32 Like, it's...

Joe Rogan 46:32 Well, what is the difference?

Jamie Vernon 46:34 You're making a Hollywood movie versus-

Joe Rogan 46:35 Right, but what is the difference in terms of the story?

Brian Redban 46:37 Creative. I think creative contro- Like, like, being creative with something. Like, we know this event happened and this event happened the day before and in the middle what would happen.

Jamie Vernon 46:46 Like-

Brian Redban 46:46 Where one- one is knowing only the facts.

Joe Rogan 46:48 This is screwy. It's screwy to do.

Jamie Vernon 46:49 The Fo- The Foxcatcher verse is a documentary about Mark Schultz.

Joe Rogan 46:51 Yeah.

Jamie Vernon 46:51 Like, there were parts in there that you specifically know-

Joe Rogan 46:54 Yes.

Jamie Vernon 46:54 ... are, were fucked with for-

Joe Rogan 46:56 No reason.

Jamie Vernon 46:57 ... artistic sake, sort of leaving-

Joe Rogan 46:58 Well, not just the parts that I know, but I didn't even talk to Mark about the movie, um, but there was a bunch of parts that I think he was furious about where it made it look like they were doing blow and maybe doing some gay stuff.

Jamie Vernon 47:08 Oh, wow.

Joe Rogan 47:09 It- it looked... It was a- it was a- there was a lot of weird scenes that things were implied or it just seemed odd, like, how do you know this happened unless Mark told you? And so, and Mark was furious at the end, uh, after it was released. And then on top of that, I s- like, the big one was that they changed his opponent when he fought in the UFC. They gave him a Russian guy when he in fact fought Big Daddy Goodrich, who's a, uh, a legend. Like, Big Daddy Goodrich is an MMA legend. He was a pioneer. He was in the early UFCs. The giant yoked Black dude with the gi. I mean, he, he would fight with the gi on. He has one of the most brutal knockouts in the history of the sport where he w- ha- fought this wrestler, Paul Herrera, and Paul took him down and they got into a position where, uh, Big Daddy Goodrich was lying on him sideways and he elbowed him in the face, like, 10 times in the course of, like, three seconds. And it's so horrific. You're watching his head just bounce off before they stop the fight. It's fucking brutal, like, one of the most brutal KOs you'll ever see in your life. So this guy wasn't just a regular guy, like, you just substitute him out and make the guy's name Tom instead of Bob. No, it was Big Daddy Goodrich. That's who Mark Schultz fought when he fought in the UFC. Watch this. Watch this. Boom, boom, boom, boom-

Jamie Vernon 48:30 Wow.

Joe Rogan 48:30 ... boom, boom, boom, boom.

Jamie Vernon 48:31 Jesus.

Joe Rogan 48:33 ... I mean, that guy is-

Brian Redban 48:34 Car accident.

Joe Rogan 48:34 ... fucking-

Brian Redban 48:35 Car accident. Car accident.

Joe Rogan 48:36 ... out.

Brian Redban 48:36 Car accidents. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 48:36 Out. And his arms are trapped and his legs are trapped. Big Daddy's got him in, like, a, uh, like, a crucifix position. And it's from Paul trying to take him down. I mean, that was, uh... So that guy, Big Daddy Goodrich, is a, he's a famous fighter. It's not like they took some nobody and removed him from the movie and changed the name of someone where it was d- didn't really matter. It was a historical eme- event in MMA.

Brian Redban 49:03 That's the reason you think no one knows?

Joe Rogan 49:05 Some crazy producer. "I think he should fight a Russian guy because this is, we're in the Cold War again, baby. I don't know, you know, fuck Putin."

Brian Redban 49:12 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 49:12 "I don't know how you feel about politics." No, some producer just wanted to jizz on the soup.

Brian Redban 49:16 Right.

Joe Rogan 49:17 Some writer just wanted to cup his own balls and squirt one off into the fucking stew. That's probably what happened.

Brian Redban 49:23 (laughs) Yeah, I don't know. They screenplay to make it t- to watch better, who knows?

Joe Rogan 49:26 The only other thing that makes sense is maybe they would have had to pay Gat- Daddy Goodrich.

Brian Redban 49:30 Right. His name.

Joe Rogan 49:31 And they didn't want to pay him, maybe. I don't know.

Brian Redban 49:34 That makes sense.

Joe Rogan 49:34 That makes sense.

Brian Redban 49:35 I mean, like Mike Tyson, you know, he, uh, he would have had that video game a long time ago, Nintendo. And they had to pay him to, to use Mike Tyson's, uh, Punch-Out!!

Joe Rogan 49:44 Punch-Out!! Yeah.

Brian Redban 49:45 And then after, like, a couple of years, he was like, "I'm done with this." And then so now, then it was just called Punch-Out!!

Joe Rogan 49:50 Mm-hmm.

Brian Redban 49:50 It wasn't even Mike Tyson in the game anymore. They had to, like, take it off.

Joe Rogan 49:53 Some new dude.

Brian Redban 49:53 Yeah, just...

Joe Rogan 49:54 Yeah. Have you done the, uh, VR boxing game yet?

Brian Redban 49:58 I haven't done the VR boxing game, but, but it looks cool. Like the rocky one, is that what it is?

Joe Rogan 50:02 There's a whole bunch of them.

Brian Redban 50:03 Yeah, there's a whole bunch of them.

Joe Rogan 50:03 Dude, they're amazing.

Brian Redban 50:05 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:05 It's cra- ... Like, a regular boxing game you're playing on TV is so stupid.

Brian Redban 50:09 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 50:09 I mean, they're fun, but in comparison to a VR game? In a VR game, you're boxing.

Brian Redban 50:14 Right.

Joe Rogan 50:14 You're, you see your hands in front of you. The guy's throwing jabs, you're slipping. You're, like, standing in front of him. You can catch punches with your hands. You can throw shots to the body. It's crazy. You get tired doing it.

Brian Redban 50:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:25 Like, you could really get a workout doing it. It's amazing.

Brian Redban 50:28 I need-

Joe Rogan 50:28 This is it right here. This is what you would see.

Guest 50:30 I think this is the new Rocky one, they just updated on-

Joe Rogan 50:31 Oh, Jesus.

Brian Redban 50:32 Yeah.

Guest 50:32 Yeah, this is the one I found.

Joe Rogan 50:33 Oh, Clubber Lang.

Brian Redban 50:34 Mr. T is in it.

Joe Rogan 50:35 Yeah.

Brian Redban 50:35 Or is it just random guy with mohawk?

Joe Rogan 50:37 Well, that's Clubber Lang. But look, look how jacked everybody is.

Brian Redban 50:40 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 50:41 Can you imagine if people were really that jacked?

Brian Redban 50:42 Wow. So...

Joe Rogan 50:45 I mean, this is, so what is that, Drago?

Brian Redban 50:48 I think so.

Joe Rogan 50:48 And he's fighting, there's Drago versus Rocky. Yeah, but we can't see.

Brian Redban 50:51 Rocky. Oh, I see.

Joe Rogan 50:51 You want to see what it looks like from your eyes.

Guest 50:54 Looks like it, yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:54 And this is a, um, that's a regular video game or that is a virtual reality-

Guest 50:59 No, no, that's the VR. That's the VR game.

Joe Rogan 50:59 Oh.

Guest 50:59 This is just the teaser they showed, I guess. I was looking for the updated, uh, video.

Joe Rogan 51:03 Yeah, you want to see what it looks like when you've got those gloves in front of you.

Brian Redban 51:06 Have you tried VR pool yet?

Joe Rogan 51:08 Don't. No.

Brian Redban 51:08 No.

Joe Rogan 51:10 I like regular pool.

Brian Redban 51:12 (laughs) VR is so great. I, I love it. I just need to, uh, get it out of my living room. It's just too much for my living room.

Joe Rogan 51:18 There's things that you couldn't do with VR pool that you need to, uh, understand if you're actually playing pool. With real pool, you need friction.

Brian Redban 51:26 Wow, this looks great.

Joe Rogan 51:27 It's crazy how good that looks.

Guest 51:29 Yeah, this looks... See a little bit of haptic feedback for this to, to get-

Joe Rogan 51:32 Yeah.

Guest 51:32 ... maybe the next step to...

Joe Rogan 51:34 Look how he's using his hands to block too.

Guest 51:37 That's cool.

Joe Rogan 51:37 It's crazy. The thing is, man, when, when someone's swinging on you, when this fake person in front of you is f- ... It's nerve-wracking. You think you're going to get hit, and when you do get hit and y- you see red or you see white rather. Look, he just KO'd him. It's funny watching the guy.

Brian Redban 51:52 It's pretty amazing how VR really gets immersive. Like, where you-

Joe Rogan 51:56 Yeah.

Brian Redban 51:56 ... like the, what was it? Resident Evil video game. I mean, that's scary as fuck.

Joe Rogan 52:00 Yeah.

Brian Redban 52:00 You really think zombies are coming after you.

Joe Rogan 52:02 Yeah, you really do. You know, that game, the thing about that game, though, it doesn't neces- ... This boxing thing, does not necessarily reward perfect technique. It just, you can kind of just do this.

Brian Redban 52:12 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 52:12 And just do that. So you'd have to, like, be, if you wanted to use it as a workout, you'd have to actually be disciplined and use good technique. What you should probably do is put gloves on, put some Velcro gloves on, and put the, the, the little fucking hand thing in the glove.

Guest 52:27 They'll probably be close to there, but in the next year or two, you'll get there.

Brian Redban 52:29 You could just duct tape it.

Joe Rogan 52:30 Year or two, it'll be in the glove-

Guest 52:32 Yeah, 'cause-

Joe Rogan 52:32 ... itself.

Guest 52:33 ... there's, there's actually a, uh, I think it's called the knuckle controller is the next version of the Vive controller. It fits around your hand like a glove. It's not, it doesn't ...

Brian Redban 52:40 Mm-hmm.

Guest 52:40 It just goes around your knuckles kind of-

Joe Rogan 52:41 Right.

Guest 52:41 ... so you, it f- ... You don't have to grab sort of in the same way.

Joe Rogan 52:43 Right. Yeah, because, um, when you have your hands this way, like, uh, with thumbs up, thumbs up shows the, the gloves like this on the screen for some strange reason. So when you're throwing punches, it doesn't look right. They need to change that. But other, 'cause they, they, it's like they want you to just do this.

Brian Redban 53:03 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 53:04 But that's freaking me out.

Brian Redban 53:05 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 53:06 It's like...

Brian Redban 53:06 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 53:06 But when you're actually doing it, though, if it looked like your hands, in the same position as your hands, it would be a worthwhile way to learn. Like, a guy like Freddie Roach could literally do a game where he showed you, "All right, I want to see the jab, pap. And then, like, right here, right here, right, pap. And then here comes the hook, duck under, and then w- go to the body, go to the head." And you could do that and do drills with the guy and actually ... You could pick up real skills in a VR game, especially with boxing. Boxing particularly. Kickboxing maybe a little less because you're moving your legs, you're not just moving your hands. Like, you'd have to have some sort of sensors on your legs so I could know what you're doing to make sure you're not showing bad technique, like your knee might be down or you might be doing something funky. But if you have boxing, those two things are just like gloves. All you need to learn is all the other things. You need to learn how to punch and how to move around, but you can effectively, with just holding on to those things, you're, you're staying in the same position that you would be if you were really boxing. And you can move around the ring too. Like it's a, it's an area like the size of this desk, maybe like a little bit more. So it's not like you're in one place and you don't have footwork. You could actually develop footwork too. So they could have, like, Vasily Lomachenko doing, like, foot will drills, footwork drills rather, where you would learn on a virtual reality thing where to step. That'd be fucking badass.

Guest 54:25 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 54:25 All that stuff, it, that ... You could learn some shit from those things.

Brian Redban 54:29 I like how the, the VR is going ... Like, there, there's amusement park or, uh-... buildings now, kind of like Chuck E. Cheese where it's just VR rides now-

Joe Rogan 54:37 Yeah.

Brian Redban 54:37 ... where you're just like, "Oh, you're parachuting or you're on a rollercoaster," and stuff. I like how they're doing that now a lot, like-

Joe Rogan 54:43 Yeah.

Brian Redban 54:43 ... a lot of malls have that now.

Joe Rogan 54:44 Yeah, yeah. I've done those. I've done the, like, little spaceship ones too, when you roll a dune buggy around on the-

Brian Redban 54:50 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:50 ... surface of the moon.

Brian Redban 54:50 Have you done the Star Wars one in Vegas yet? I guess you actually have, like, five people in your group that you can see in the game and there's, like, uh, you know... Have you played-

Jamie Vernon 54:59 They have it, they have at the Glendale Galleria if you wanna go check it out, yeah.

Brian Redban 55:01 They do?

Joe Rogan 55:02 Dude, the dopest one they have is at the Disneyland...

Jamie Vernon 55:06 I think it's the same thing.

Joe Rogan 55:06 Disneyland Village. But the Disneyland Village one is, there's a Star, Star Wars one, and then there's also a Wreck-It Ralph one.

Jamie Vernon 55:13 Yeah.

Brian Redban 55:13 Wow.

Joe Rogan 55:13 The Wreck-It Ralph one is fucking amazing.

Jamie Vernon 55:16 The same company.

Brian Redban 55:16 Wow.

Joe Rogan 55:16 Is the same company?

Jamie Vernon 55:17 Yeah, The Void is what it's called.

Joe Rogan 55:18 Yeah, that's it. Same place. So they have, uh, the Star Wars one sometimes. So they'll, they'll have, like, one game set up for, like, a couple o' weeks-

Brian Redban 55:26 Shit.

Joe Rogan 55:26 ... and then they'll have the other game. Dude, we went to Disneyland and that was the dopest thing at Disneyland.

Jamie Vernon 55:30 (laughs) Really?

Joe Rogan 55:30 Yes, by far.

Brian Redban 55:31 That's the future.

Joe Rogan 55:32 It's fucking amazing. Du- dude, you wear the suit, okay? So you have this vest on, so you're feeling when you get hit.

Brian Redban 55:39 Oh, wow.

Joe Rogan 55:39 You feel it in your chest, you feel heat. They, they have mo- places where you walk through and it's, like, lava below you, you feel heat.

Brian Redban 55:46 No way.

Joe Rogan 55:46 The Star Wars one, when you're getting shot, you feel it in your chest.

Brian Redban 55:50 No shit.

Joe Rogan 55:50 You pick a gun up off-

Brian Redban 55:51 Oh, man, I gotta go.

Joe Rogan 55:51 ... the wall and you've got, like, Stormtrooper arms. You see you're holding the gun in front of you. It's crazy.

Brian Redban 55:55 That's awesome. I didn't know that was in Glendale.

Joe Rogan 55:58 Dude, they're getting so good. There's still, you still are super aware that you're in a game-

Brian Redban 56:03 Right.

Joe Rogan 56:03 ... for now. But this, you know, go from Pong to fucking wha- what's the best... Red Dead Redemption? That's probably the best graphics. I mean, fucking insane graphics.

Brian Redban 56:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 56:13 That's, what is that, 30 years? 30 years they went to that. These virtual reality games, 10 years from now, are going to be insane. No one's gonna wanna be in regular life. Regular life's gonna suck.

Brian Redban 56:26 Yeah, there's not gonna be a Disneyland or a Disney World anymore, it's just gonna be VR. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 56:30 It'll still be there but you'll be able to get on every ride. (laughs)

Brian Redban 56:33 Yeah.

Jamie Vernon 56:34 I haven't watched this myself yet but the NBA makes, uh, viewing in VR available now.

Joe Rogan 56:40 Whoa, the whole game?

Jamie Vernon 56:40 So they have a whol- it's not every game but it's, like, once a week they have a particular game you can, you can log in and watch. They c- they changed the cameras a little bit. I don't think it's perfect yet.

Joe Rogan 56:51 Holy shit, though, dude.

Jamie Vernon 56:52 It's very cool, though.

Joe Rogan 56:53 Dude, how about watching this on the floor?

Jamie Vernon 56:55 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 56:55 You're on the floor.

Jamie Vernon 56:56 And they'll b- they'll move you around so you can... So you're in the footage too, and I think they have a separate announcing team so they're, they're talking about what you're seeing versus, like, listening to the normal TV.

Joe Rogan 57:05 Oh, wow.

Brian Redban 57:06 It, it's quite not there yet. We filmed a couple episodes of Kill Tony in VR and we had some of the top of the line cameras for it, and it still wasn't there yet. It was more hassle than it was worth.

Joe Rogan 57:16 This seems like something that would be fucking amazing for the UFC, though.

Brian Redban 57:21 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:22 I mean, this would be amazing.

Jamie Vernon 57:23 Yeah, you'd basically have your view.

Joe Rogan 57:25 Yeah.

Brian Redban 57:26 Except you'd... The cage.

Joe Rogan 57:27 The cage would be in the way but there's gotta be a way that they could film through the cage. If they just had a camera in a reinforced position where it was far enough back behind foam that there's no way, um, it could im- interfere if someone crashed into it, but yet close enough that it could see through an actual hole, you could get the entire octagon if you did it with several, several different ones of those.

Jamie Vernon 57:53 They have... They had, or they had it, at least, that, like, it was gr- uh, this isn't it, I guess. But it was ground level, I think they called it the phantom cam, but maybe it w- had a different name.

Joe Rogan 58:00 And it was VR?

Jamie Vernon 58:01 (clears throat) It wasn't VR. No. The UFC's used it a few times. They always try out things. They're, they're very experimental. They don't always show everything they're trying out, though, but-

Brian Redban 58:08 Th- the problem with it-

Jamie Vernon 58:09 ... it'd be cool to try maybe one time.

Brian Redban 58:10 ... i- ideally, you'd want it right in the middle, like, not above or too below, c- and it would have to have cam- 'cause it has cameras all around it, so, you know. That, that w- that's hard to do with the cameras, I guess, uh, without getting in the way of everything.

Joe Rogan 58:32 Yeah. You would have to, uh, you'd have to find a good spot for it.

Brian Redban 58:36 Put it on, uh, Bruce Buffer's head and let him just go to town.

Joe Rogan 58:39 Well, they used to do that with Pride. Pride used to have, like, they would wear glasses with, like, uh, cameras next to the glasses and you'd get the referee vision.

Brian Redban 58:47 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:47 It was crazy.

Brian Redban 58:48 That's kinda cool.

Joe Rogan 58:49 You'd see them, like, separating fighters and breaking it up and, and waving the fight off, yeah.

Brian Redban 58:53 That's kinda cool.

Joe Rogan 58:54 Yeah, it's pretty badass. Yeah. It's weird-

Jamie Vernon 58:57 Oh, here, here it is. It's, uh, I guess it's this little teeny Marshall Cam is what it's called.

Joe Rogan 59:01 Mm.

Jamie Vernon 59:01 POV cam.

Joe Rogan 59:02 Oh, that shit's pointed at me, man.

Jamie Vernon 59:05 That one?

Joe Rogan 59:05 Sometimes. Yeah, there's one like that that's pointed at me.

Jamie Vernon 59:08 Oh, yeah, I guess you're right. I have seen that there.

Joe Rogan 59:09 Yeah, that's... They use that sometimes when, uh, you know-

Jamie Vernon 59:12 To iterate reactions.

Joe Rogan 59:13 ... when we go crazy, when we jump up if a fight's happening. I didn't know it was even... I didn't know that's what they did it for until one day I saw it online, I go, "Oh, that makes sense." That's a smart thing to do because sometimes we do get animated. There's been several fights where me, Anik and, and DC, or Dominic Cruz, we're all standing up. Like while, while the, like at the end, like Amanda Nunes. When Amanda Nunes knocked out Cris Cyborg, we just w- we were like, "What the fuck?"

Brian Redban 59:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 59:39 Like, your whole body's like, "Jesus! What the fuck did I just see?" Sometimes you just can't sit down, you just ha- your, your body's just like, "God dammit!"

Brian Redban 59:49 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 59:50 It just goes. You don't, you're not even trying to control it. You just let it go. When you see somebody do something fucking insane, like there's some wild, crazy Francis Ngannou knocking out Alistair Overeem type punch, yeah. (laughs)

Jamie Vernon 1:00:06 (laughs)

Brian Redban 1:00:06 I was...

Joe Rogan 1:00:07 Yeah, it's me and Dominic and Jon Anik and Anik's up and I'm leaning back. It's... Crazy job, man. It's a crazy job. So that was the, the moment.

Jamie Vernon 1:00:17 Oh, DC one, yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:00:18 And you see the one below it? See that v- g- go back to that. See that one below it where I'm staring at the camera in the upper right h- no.

Jamie Vernon 1:00:26 Oh, yeah, yeah. That- yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:00:26 That one there. That fr- was a video taken by John Wayne Parr. Jon Wayne Parr, who's a multiple time world Muay Thai champion and friend of mine, a great guy who lives in Australia, was there at the fights in Australia when Holly Holm knocked out Ronda Rousey. And he filmed Holly Holm head kicking Ronda Rousey and then turns to me and I turn to him and I was like, "What the fuck just happened?"I was like, "Whoa! Whoa." But when you see it, like, in that moment, when you see, when you see something that's, that's fucking nuts in that moment, you're like, "I can't even believe what I saw." Like, that was me, like, I looked at him and he looked at me and we were both like, "Whoa, dude."

Brian Redban 1:01:09 Hmm.

Guest 1:01:10 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:01:10 "That was crazy." There's no sport like that. S- s- some sports just, you know, they just have this, uh, this moment f- where everybody gets a jolt of a drug. You know? Everybody just gets this, "Wha!"

Brian Redban 1:01:29 You mean that didn't happen last night at the Super Bowl for you?

Guest 1:01:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:01:32 I left before it ended. I was at a friend's party.

Brian Redban 1:01:34 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:34 Went to a Super Bowl party. It was fun.

Guest 1:01:36 The lowest viewed one in the last 10 years.

Brian Redban 1:01:39 Are you serious?

Guest 1:01:39 Yeah, but not by a lot, but yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:41 It's 'cause they knew that that handsome man was gonna take his shirt off.

Brian Redban 1:01:44 Oh, gosh.

Joe Rogan 1:01:44 What's his name?

Guest 1:01:45 Adam Levine.

Brian Redban 1:01:46 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:01:46 This beautiful man.

Brian Redban 1:01:46 There's no nipples or ... Everyone's talking about his nipples.

Joe Rogan 1:01:49 He doesn't have nipples?

Brian Redban 1:01:49 No, he has nice brown nipples but then you're like-

Joe Rogan 1:01:51 What's wrong with them?

Brian Redban 1:01:52 ... Janet Jackson, like, the big, you know, that went crazy.

Joe Rogan 1:01:55 Yeah, right, that's true. Right. Why does he love to show his nipples?

Brian Redban 1:01:56 He, he showed both.

Joe Rogan 1:01:57 This is bullshit. Sex is bullshit.

Brian Redban 1:01:59 And his dick root.

Joe Rogan 1:02:00 This is se- oh my God.

Brian Redban 1:02:01 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:02:01 He had dick root showing? That is bullshit. He just wanted everybody to know he's got beautiful tattoos.

Brian Redban 1:02:07 I love that.

Joe Rogan 1:02:08 And a fairly good body.

Brian Redban 1:02:10 Yeah. People are-

Joe Rogan 1:02:11 Doesn't look like he does a lot of squats though, right? That's what's interesting. He's around, like, the greatest super athletes in the known univ... Actually looks pretty good right there.

Guest 1:02:19 Well, for today he was.

Brian Redban 1:02:21 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02:21 He looks pretty good.

Guest 1:02:22 Look at those random tattoos.

Joe Rogan 1:02:23 What do you mean for today he was?

Guest 1:02:24 That's it. I mean, he's not always around the greatest super athletes.

Joe Rogan 1:02:27 Right. No, no. Yeah, yeah. Um, yeah, he looks pretty good. He looks like he's in good shape. Happy to take his shirt off with his California stomach tattoo.

Guest 1:02:35 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:02:35 But the point being, um, that guy's around freaks. He's around 6'5", 290 pound super athletes who could jump over his fucking head. They literally could run through a hundred of him like they were paper walls.

Brian Redban 1:02:51 Yes.

Joe Rogan 1:02:51 Just, "Ra!" That's what he's around. He's around the fucking Super Bowl. The greatest physical specimens in the known universe. And he takes his shirt off. Like, "Hey, bitches, I'm here too."

Brian Redban 1:03:05 They had an event set up-

Joe Rogan 1:03:06 (laughs)

Brian Redban 1:03:06 ... over the, over the weekend, uh, so people could test their 40 speed, uh, up against other NFL times, whatever they had, like a list.

Joe Rogan 1:03:13 Oh, that's hilarious.

Brian Redban 1:03:13 Usain Bolt did it in his, in his shoes. Like, they said street shoes or whatever-

Joe Rogan 1:03:17 Right.

Brian Redban 1:03:17 ... but he didn't have cleats on. He tied the fastest ever NFL 40. Or 4.22.

Joe Rogan 1:03:21 Yeah, he probably did it with a full stomach.

Guest 1:03:22 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:03:23 He probably just ate, drank a couple of beers. "Fuck it, I'll, I'll show these bitches what's up." (laughs)

Guest 1:03:29 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:03:30 Yeah, it's just, it was weird, like watching it on TV, this dude with his shirt off, you know. Like, like, oh, this is a different thing now. Now this is like a sexy concert.

Brian Redban 1:03:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:38 Before it was like a football game.

Brian Redban 1:03:39 That's th- that's what I think he's getting shit for because y- he didn't need to take his shirt off, right? You know, he, he had his shirt on and then, like, after the second song, he's like, "You know what? Let's get sexy in this Super Bowl." You know?

Joe Rogan 1:03:49 Did he say that?

Brian Redban 1:03:49 No, no. But I mean, why else would he take off his shirt?

Joe Rogan 1:03:52 If he did say that, ha- ... Hash- we should make a hashtag. Hashtag sexy in the Super Bowl. (laughs)

Brian Redban 1:03:57 Let's get, let's get sexy up in this bitch.

Guest 1:04:00 Well, he's a sexy man. You can't ... Don't be hating. Beautiful man.

Brian Redban 1:04:03 Yeah. I mean, but, but that's the whole thing. Your, your audience is a bunch of guys, you know. (laughs)

Guest 1:04:09 Started with a jacket on.

Joe Rogan 1:04:10 Started with a jacket on. Well, it was cold out at first, but then you start to warm up and sweat.

Brian Redban 1:04:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:04:14 Never trust white men with necklaces. That's my, my message.

Guest 1:04:18 More than one?

Joe Rogan 1:04:18 (laughs)

Brian Redban 1:04:18 Oh, no. Oh, no. He's got the little necklaces and the bracelets for the falcons to land on.

Joe Rogan 1:04:23 Oh, wait a minute. Those are spiritual necklaces.

Brian Redban 1:04:25 Okay.

Joe Rogan 1:04:25 If you have wooden beads for whatever reason, that makes you spiritual.

Brian Redban 1:04:28 Is that hemp or gold? I can't even tell.

Joe Rogan 1:04:29 You're allowed to wear wooden necklaces 'cause like people go, "Oh, you're like really into organic stuff. You're really into macro." But that's gold.

Brian Redban 1:04:38 Is that ... Yeah, that is gold.

Joe Rogan 1:04:38 That looks like gold.

Brian Redban 1:04:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:04:39 That's like ... The other one was just weird lighting.

Brian Redban 1:04:42 I, I, I c- I can't wear necklaces, man. I, it bugs me. Did you ever wear necklaces? Did like-

Joe Rogan 1:04:46 I've worn necklaces, sure.

Brian Redban 1:04:48 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:04:48 Yeah. It's never been a staple. But it's, uh, it's a, it's a weird thing. I- i- first of all, if it's, if it's big enough, it's like this target. Right? If you have like a big old gold necklace, people wanna steal it.

Brian Redban 1:05:00 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:05:00 There's a lot of necklace snatchers out there, Brian. I don't know if you know that.

Brian Redban 1:05:03 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:05:04 But then the other thing is, uh, u- what are you doing? What are you doing with that big old shiny thing around your neck? What are you doing? What are you, a chick?

Brian Redban 1:05:11 I remember in the '90s chokers were a thing.

Guest 1:05:14 (laughs)

Brian Redban 1:05:14 And I used to wear a choker. How gross is that? (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:05:16 Like a dog choker?

Brian Redban 1:05:18 Just a really tight necklace.

Joe Rogan 1:05:20 Mm.

Brian Redban 1:05:20 Ugh.

Joe Rogan 1:05:20 Yeah.

Brian Redban 1:05:21 Hemp necklaces.

Joe Rogan 1:05:22 Oh, yeah. Those, with the little bead.

Brian Redban 1:05:24 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:05:24 The bead at the bottom. The bead's critical. Gotta have the bead.

Brian Redban 1:05:27 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:05:28 Mo- multi-colored bead. Make it look like you're cool.

Guest 1:05:31 Oh, geez.

Joe Rogan 1:05:32 Yeah, like, it's weird. Like, with, like, some guys will wear like little anklets with like beads.

Brian Redban 1:05:38 Oh, god.

Joe Rogan 1:05:38 And they tie them off and they'll walk around barefoot and you're like, "Okay." Hmm.

Brian Redban 1:05:43 Well, it's kind of like that look that I, that you know.

Joe Rogan 1:05:44 Yeah.

Brian Redban 1:05:44 That shop look, where you have like the really tight, th- like your pants go up so you can see your socks, you know. You, you show a little leg.

Joe Rogan 1:05:51 Y- you know why they do that?

Brian Redban 1:05:52 Why?

Joe Rogan 1:05:52 Sneakers. Those guys are all into sneakers.

Brian Redban 1:05:54 Oh, to show off the sneakers?

Joe Rogan 1:05:55 Yep.

Guest 1:05:55 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:05:55 Full s- that's what Schaub told me.

Brian Redban 1:05:57 Do you do that, Jamie?

Guest 1:05:58 Yeah, that's what my f- my pants have that actually for you.

Brian Redban 1:06:00 Oh my God, you do.

Joe Rogan 1:06:01 (laughs)

Guest 1:06:01 (laughs)

Brian Redban 1:06:02 Why? Why?

Joe Rogan 1:06:03 Because people-

Guest 1:06:03 That's how, that's how the pants are made.

Joe Rogan 1:06:05 Ah, that's funny.

Brian Redban 1:06:06 That's how the pants are made?

Guest 1:06:07 Yeah, they're made-

Brian Redban 1:06:07 That's why you don't buy those pants, man.

Guest 1:06:09 Then the- then you're not buying pants in the last four years.

Brian Redban 1:06:10 Where do you buy your pants? What lady's store do you buy ... You buy it at Coach?

Guest 1:06:14 Nike.

Brian Redban 1:06:14 You buy those pants at-

Guest 1:06:14 Nike.com.

Brian Redban 1:06:15 Gosh.

Joe Rogan 1:06:16 That's hilarious.

Brian Redban 1:06:17 You don't do that, do you?

Joe Rogan 1:06:18 No, how dare you?

Guest 1:06:19 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:06:20 How dare you? I have a pair of, uh, very comfortable Under Armor running shoes on.

Guest 1:06:24 Uh-

Joe Rogan 1:06:25 Very comfortable.

Guest 1:06:26 How are those?

Joe Rogan 1:06:26 Those Yeezys?

Guest 1:06:26 Uh, those were your new shoes the other day.

Joe Rogan 1:06:27 Um, they're a little too tight for me.

Guest 1:06:29 Okay.

Joe Rogan 1:06:29 They li- they bind my feet a tad bit.

Brian Redban 1:06:32 The top.

Joe Rogan 1:06:32 When I got to the store, I had to swap them out for, uh ... I had a pair of, uh, Converse All Stars.

Brian Redban 1:06:36 You get-

Joe Rogan 1:06:36 Which are my go-to.

Brian Redban 1:06:37 You got Yeezys, right?

Joe Rogan 1:06:39 Jamie gave me a pair of Yeezys about a year ago.

Brian Redban 1:06:41 (laughs) And you just wore them?

Joe Rogan 1:06:42 And I wore them the other day.

Guest 1:06:42 He just, uh, he just undead socked them. He's keeping them on ice for a while.

Joe Rogan 1:06:45 Undead socked them. Is that what it's called?

Guest 1:06:46 Dead stock.

Joe Rogan 1:06:47 Dead stock. Dead stock. Oh, do you know what deadnaming is? Do you know what deadnaming is?

Brian Redban 1:06:51 Is that a shoe thing?

Joe Rogan 1:06:52 No.

Brian Redban 1:06:52 No.

Joe Rogan 1:06:53 It's a new thing that's illegal on Twitter. This is something I wish I knew. I didn't know until after the podcast, but deadnaming is, uh, it's banned. So say if you decide tomorrow that ... to become a woman, and you're like, "I'm not no longer Brian. I'm Brianina." Uh, they'll be like-

Brian Redban 1:07:10 Briana.

Joe Rogan 1:07:10 Briana?

Brian Redban 1:07:10 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:07:10 That's what you're ... your thoughts too?

Brian Redban 1:07:12 Of course.

Joe Rogan 1:07:12 Okay. So I'd be like, "Uh, okay, Briana, but you're still a man." And then boom, that's deadnaming. You can't call someone something other than their preferred gender. So, like, if they identify as a woman, but they're biologically male, you're not allowed to say they're biologically male.

Brian Redban 1:07:34 Oh.

Joe Rogan 1:07:36 You're not allowed to call them a man because that's deadnaming. You're not allowed to call them, like ... Y- y- you couldn't call Caitlyn Jenner Bruce. If you called her Bruce, you would be deadnaming her.

Brian Redban 1:07:47 But that's just, like ... That's not illegal or, I mean, like, you're not gonna get banned.

Joe Rogan 1:07:50 It's banned from Twitter.

Brian Redban 1:07:51 Oh, it's a Twitter rule then?

Joe Rogan 1:07:52 It is a new ... Pull ... Please pull that up.

Brian Redban 1:07:54 (laughs) Oh, God.

Joe Rogan 1:07:55 I did not know this. I did not know this.

Jamie Vernon 1:07:57 I ... I searched it. It's been around for a while, but I'm checking the Twitter thing.

Brian Redban 1:07:59 That's kinda weird.

Joe Rogan 1:08:00 Deadnaming's been banned for a while or the, the term-

Jamie Vernon 1:08:02 No, no, the, where the term has been around, yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:08:04 I just found out about the term maybe a couple weeks ago. I'd heard the term for the first time. Somebody wrote deadnaming and I was like, "What? What is that?" And then I had a look it up. (laughs)

Brian Redban 1:08:15 So ridiculous, all the new rules we have to deal with. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:08:17 Dude, uh, there's a fucking article-

Brian Redban 1:08:19 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:08:19 There's an article that I was reading. Go ahead.

Jamie Vernon 1:08:21 I'm looking right at their terms of service. It's directly word for word in there.

Joe Rogan 1:08:25 Okay, where does it say that? Okay. Deadnaming of transgender individuals. Repeated or nonconsensual slurs, epithets,