Joe Rogan Experience #1262 - Pat McNamara

1. 0:00 – 1:06

   Meeting Pat McNamara: badass reputation, aging, and staying hungry

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      And four, three, two... Boom. And we're live, Pat. How are you, sir?

   2. PMPat McNamara0:10

      Welcome all. Good, Joe.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:10

      President of the University of Badassery.

   4. PMPat McNamara0:13

      (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:14

      (laughs)

   6. PMPat McNamara0:14

      I'm more like the, uh-

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      (laughs)

   8. PMPat McNamara0:16

      ... I'm more like the vice president, man. I mean, yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:17

      Oh. Who's the president?

   10. PMPat McNamara0:19

       Probably, uh, CJ Ortiz. He's the, uh, vi- he's the president of the University of Badassery. My, uh, co-host and, uh, of a little podcast we do.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       Dude, I fucking love your Instagram page. If there's a guy-

   12. PMPat McNamara0:30

       Thank you, sir.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:30

       ... that I'm gonna call when the shit hits the fan-

   14. PMPat McNamara0:32

       Oh, right.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:33

       ... it might be you. (laughs)

   16. PMPat McNamara0:34

       Woo! Rock and roll, baby. I'm there for you, brother.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:36

       I also like guys who are my age or older that still get after it in the gym, and your fucking page is filled with you getting after it.

   18. PMPat McNamara0:43

       Bro, we could go on. We could full a, uh, full segment on that alone.

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:47

       Yeah.

   20. PMPat McNamara0:47

       And, and the secret, the big secret behind it, which, uh, it's, there's not much of a secret, as you know.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:53

       Yeah.

   22. PMPat McNamara0:54

       I mean-

   23. JRJoe Rogan0:54

       The secret is to get after it.

   24. PMPat McNamara0:54

       ... the hard, hard work, sucks, and not everybody's cut out for it.

   25. JRJoe Rogan0:58

       Yeah. People just don't enjoy it.

   26. PMPat McNamara1:00

       (clears throat) Yep.

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:00

       They try to find a lotta, a lotta nice excuses-

   28. PMPat McNamara1:03

       Yep, yep.

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:03

       ... why they don't get after it.

   30. PMPat McNamara1:05

       Uh, (clears throat) and-
2. 1:06 – 2:21

   Battle-worn body: reconstructive surgeries and injury stories from a long career

   1. PMPat McNamara1:06

      And, and, yeah, yeah. (laughs) One of the big excuses is age.

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:10

      Yeah.

   3. PMPat McNamara1:11

      Um, I run into guys all the time, m- during my full-time training gig, where I'm training guys on the range who will say, uh, "You know, I'm 38 or 40 or whatever, and I'm getting old." I'm like, "Bro, l- l- l- let me tell you something." This is, this is something somebody told me when I was 30. (clears throat) And I've got affirmation, uh, uh, of this from guys like you who've stayed fit their entire lives. The fittest of a man's age is around, like, 44, 45. That's when you could be on the top of your game. And-

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:43

      Like ultra-runners and stuff like that?

   5. PMPat McNamara1:45

      Yeah, m- you know, th- the strongest, the fastest, um, the fittest, the smartest. You know, when it comes to, uh, knowing your body and, and how much you can do and how much you could take.

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:56

      Mm-hmm.

   7. PMPat McNamara1:57

      Um, (clears throat) after that, then you gotta start being a lot smarter. You know, your diet-

   8. JRJoe Rogan2:02

      Yeah.

   9. PMPat McNamara2:02

      ... how you work out, how often. You know, you, you, you, uh, like, I'm, I'm super tentative now not to overwork.

   10. JRJoe Rogan2:09

       Yeah, me too.

   11. PMPat McNamara2:09

       Um, because I've been told there is no such thing as overwork, but there is a such thing as under-recovery. Um, m- I, I err on the side of caution a lot.

   12. JRJoe Rogan2:20

       Yeah, me too.

3. 2:21 – 8:11

   From military rehab to Combat Strength Training: rebuilding the “combat chassis”

   1. PMPat McNamara2:21

      A lot more now. And, uh, I've got it down, man. I, I, I started, uh, this System Combat Strength training.

   2. JRJoe Rogan2:27

      Mm-hmm.

   3. PMPat McNamara2:28

      Um, when I retired from the military, because when I retired from the military, I retired with four reconstructive surgeries, 13 broken bones. And any ground pounder who's, you know, special ops guy, who did 20 plus years, there's a lot of freaking mileage on that combat chassis.

   4. JRJoe Rogan2:45

      Right.

   5. PMPat McNamara2:46

      You know, he's, he's jacked up.

   6. JRJoe Rogan2:47

      What'd you get reconstructed?

   7. PMPat McNamara2:49

      Uh, (clears throat) m- th- th- the first one was, uh, this bicep. I was a toe jumper. Doesn't have to make sense. Uh-

   8. JRJoe Rogan2:57

      What does it mean?

   9. PMPat McNamara2:59

      W- uh, w- uh, s- it's, it's related to static line jumping, uh, where you pass a static line off to a jump master.

   10. JRJoe Rogan3:05

       Mm-hmm.

   11. PMPat McNamara3:05

       He secures it, and the static line, uh, at the end of the static line, deploys your parachute. So it's like, you know, it's like rookie jumping. It's real infantry-based jumping. Well, that static line got wrapped around my reserve and around my arm, and pulled me with the plane.

   12. JRJoe Rogan3:20

       Oh.

   13. PMPat McNamara3:20

       And it pulled my bicep into my forearm, broke ribs, dislocated shoulder, concussion. And this is when I was fucking 18 years old.

   14. JRJoe Rogan3:27

       Oh, Jesus.

   15. PMPat McNamara3:27

       (laughs) I had just joined, and I already got jacked up. Uh, next one was, um, a discectomy, L5-S1.

   16. JRJoe Rogan3:36

       Oh.

   17. PMPat McNamara3:36

       Just com- just, uh, uh, kind of an amalgamation of helo crashes and vehicle crashes and stuff like that. Uh-

   18. JRJoe Rogan3:44

       If people don't know what that means, it means your discs, they trim a little piece of it so it doesn't go against your nerve.

   19. PMPat McNamara3:50

       Yeah, and it was, it was a massive herniation, so they were a- able to take the big chunk out and then do that trim up as well.

   20. JRJoe Rogan3:56

       Mm-hmm.

   21. PMPat McNamara3:57

       Which is, that's the easiest surgery I ever had.

   22. JRJoe Rogan4:00

       Really?

   23. PMPat McNamara4:01

       Knee reconstruction sucked.

   24. JRJoe Rogan4:03

       Yeah.

   25. PMPat McNamara4:03

       I mean, that was a full freaking year. Six months of, (clears throat) you know, getting back on your feet, and then, uh, another year before I was, like, 100%.

   26. JRJoe Rogan4:14

       Right.

   27. PMPat McNamara4:14

       And I was, I think I was still in my 20s.

   28. JRJoe Rogan4:16

       Did you get a ACL reconstruction?

   29. PMPat McNamara4:19

       S- yeah, center patella tendon.

   30. JRJoe Rogan4:21

       Yeah, I did that one.
4. 8:11 – 11:54

   Range-life workouts: improvised training and who shows up to tactical courses

   1. JRJoe Rogan8:11

      But you're pieced back together again, I can tell. You know, you do a lot of crazy working out with like... I've seen a lot of shit you do with like cinder blocks-

   2. PMPat McNamara8:17

      Yep.

   3. JRJoe Rogan8:17

      ... where you make do with what's around you.

   4. PMPat McNamara8:19

      Well, that, so (sighs) my, my work tempo is pretty... It's off the charts. Last year and the year before, I traveled to a different state every week, and most of them were jet setting. So lugging all my shit to the airport every week, all my guns and everything.

   5. JRJoe Rogan8:36

      And this is for tactical training?

   6. PMPat McNamara8:37

      Right. Right.

   7. JRJoe Rogan8:38

      So is this... Is this for private individuals, military training? Like, how is it-

   8. PMPat McNamara8:42

      Uh, all of it.

   9. JRJoe Rogan8:43

      ... all the above?

   10. PMPat McNamara8:43

       The most, most of my courses are open enrollment. So I have all walks of life. I mean, the demographic is extremely wide and so is the skill set disparity-

   11. JRJoe Rogan8:54

       Hmm.

   12. PMPat McNamara8:54

       ... of these guys who come. You know, out of 14 guys who sign up, four of them would be cops, three military, the rest civilians. And in that civilian group, I mean, they're from... You know, you got computer programmers, you got surgeons, you got lawyers, you got, uh, uh, you know, uh, strip club owners and-

   13. JRJoe Rogan9:16

       Mm-hmm.

   14. PMPat McNamara9:16

       I mean, the demographic is pretty eclectic. It's pretty wide.

   15. JRJoe Rogan9:21

       Hmm.

   16. PMPat McNamara9:22

       And when I go, uh, to these places instead... I used to, like, go to a La Fitness or something, you know, like an LA Fitness after work. But I got tired of that, you know, just walking through, trying to navigate my way through an endless maze of bench presses, watching guys do concentration curls in the, in the mirror. So I started range workouts where I'll plan it during the day, and it became a thing where, like, fit guys in the class are watching me and they're going, "Hey, bro, what's the workout after, after training?"

   17. JRJoe Rogan9:52

       Oh.

   18. PMPat McNamara9:53

       "So can we do it with you?"

   19. JRJoe Rogan9:54

       So they see you on your Instagram?

   20. PMPat McNamara9:55

       Yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan9:55

       Yeah.

   22. PMPat McNamara9:55

       But then the guys in the course will say, "Hey, can I do the workout with you after, after training?" I'm like, "Yeah."

   23. JRJoe Rogan10:01

       Oh, nice.

   24. PMPat McNamara10:01

       "Yeah, yeah." Yep.

   25. JRJoe Rogan10:03

       So you just find whatever's laying around, tire-

   26. PMPat McNamara10:06

       Yeah. Yep.

   27. JRJoe Rogan10:06

       ... cinder block.

   28. PMPat McNamara10:07

       Yep. Anything.

   29. JRJoe Rogan10:08

       Tree.

   30. PMPat McNamara10:08

       Wall. You know, if I have a wall, I could do a lot with that. Let's say it's a five, six-foot wall.
5. 11:54 – 17:19

   Functional training philosophy: transverse plane, “life-saving and ass-kicking” fitness

   1. PMPat McNamara11:54

      You, y- you know, it's, it's... (sighs) It's funny, you get... E- even today I read... I'm reading some comments about whatever it is.There's a lot of stupid people out there when it comes to, like, not understanding the right way to work out.

   2. JRJoe Rogan12:10

      Right.

   3. PMPat McNamara12:11

      And, uh, I want to tell these guys, "Hey man, two things. One is if you do, if you do what you've always done, you're gonna get what you've always gotten. Number two, I didn't go home last night and smoke a bunch of crack and dream this shit up."

   4. JRJoe Rogan12:22

      (laughs)

   5. PMPat McNamara12:22

      I mean, there's ... I, I've, I've done a lot of freaking research, a lot of ... Um, there's a lot of time and effort-

   6. JRJoe Rogan12:28

      Yeah.

   7. PMPat McNamara12:28

      ... that's gone into this. And, um, they'll say, "Hey man, you're gonna throw your back out doing that stuff." No, motherfucker. That's, that's building your back.

   8. JRJoe Rogan12:38

      Yeah.

   9. PMPat McNamara12:38

      You know, working that transverse plane is what guys neglect a lot. See here, here we go. I'm gonna get on this freaking soapbox, I swear to God.

   10. JRJoe Rogan12:46

       Go ahead, go. Get on the box.

   11. PMPat McNamara12:47

       Um ... (clears throat)

   12. JRJoe Rogan12:48

       Do a box jump first. (laughs)

   13. PMPat McNamara12:49

       When most guys, (laughs) , when most guys work out, they live in a s- what I call a sagittalistic environment. You know, three planes of motion, frontal, sagittal, transverse. So they're li- in this sagittal world, doing bench press and, and concentration curls. Um, out of the three planes of motion, I would say that transverse is most important. Additionally, when we work out, I would also argue, with confidence, that it's the plane of motion that is most neglected, that transverse plane. I like to tell guys that (sighs) in the transverse plane lives life-saving and ass-kicking.

   14. JRJoe Rogan13:26

       Mm.

   15. PMPat McNamara13:27

       There are four reasons why we should, why we should exercise. This is max opinion.

   16. JRJoe Rogan13:33

       Okay.

   17. PMPat McNamara13:33

       One, self-preservation, longevity. Good for your health. Stronger, longer. Motion is lotion. Number two, the ability to save your own life. Having that confidence knowing, "Yep, I can pull myself out of that burning car, or over that wall," or whatever. Number three, more importantly to me, is being Batman. The ability to save somebody else's life. So there's three reasons. The last one, kicking somebody's fucking ass. So when I look at workout, I look at those four things right there. Not, like, cosmetics or anything. Cosmetics is a cool byproduct. If you work out right, you're gonna look better. You look better, you feel better, you're more confident. You're more confident, you perform better, 'cause confidence and performance work hand-in-hand.

   18. JRJoe Rogan14:18

       Sure.

   19. PMPat McNamara14:19

       So, I mean, it, it ... There's no freaking magic elixir to it, you know? It, it ... Ha- And, and it's, and it's hard.

   20. JRJoe Rogan14:27

       Yeah, people like to see the res- Like, if you do bench press, you see your chest puff up-

   21. PMPat McNamara14:31

       Mm-hmm.

   22. JRJoe Rogan14:31

       ... and they've s- see those results. I always tell people that there's one exercise I would recommend, like people who do jujitsu. Turkish get-up.

   23. PMPat McNamara14:37

       Right.

   24. JRJoe Rogan14:38

       It's the least romantic.

   25. PMPat McNamara14:38

       I did those last week. (laughs)

   26. JRJoe Rogan14:39

       It's the least romantic of all workouts.

   27. PMPat McNamara14:41

       Yes. (laughs)

   28. JRJoe Rogan14:41

       Nobody wants to do-

   29. PMPat McNamara14:42

       Yep.

   30. JRJoe Rogan14:42

       ... those goddamn things.
6. 17:19 – 27:15

   Cardio, warmups, and shooting under stress: interval conditioning with purpose

   1. JRJoe Rogan17:19

      Do you do much cardio?

   2. PMPat McNamara17:20

      (clears throat) Here's how I knock out cardio, is, uh, I have a, a formula. (sniffs) Um, with this, this ... I have a program, Combat Strength Training. I got an e-book and a website, you know, all this. And-

   3. JRJoe Rogan17:34

      So is your program something that people could sign up for?

   4. PMPat McNamara17:36

      Oh, yeah.

   5. JRJoe Rogan17:36

      Okay.

   6. PMPat McNamara17:36

      Yeah, they can buy the e-book, um ...

   7. JRJoe Rogan17:39

      Is it ... What's the website-

   8. PMPat McNamara17:40

      Uh-

   9. JRJoe Rogan17:40

      ... so Jamie can pull it up?

   10. PMPat McNamara17:41

       Combatstrengthtraining.com.

   11. JRJoe Rogan17:43

       Mm-hmm.

   12. PMPat McNamara17:44

       Yep. And, um, the formula is work in, work in anaerobic chunks in circuit to near metabolic threshold to meet an aerobic goal. And then, like, 30, 35 minutes. So that doesn't include warmup, you know, so you good ... Whatever it is. For me it's, like, bag work or something-

   13. JRJoe Rogan18:03

       Mm-hmm.

   14. PMPat McNamara18:04

       ... for warmup, just to make sure everything's loosey-goosey. The older you are, the more-

   15. JRJoe Rogan18:07

       Yeah.

   16. PMPat McNamara18:07

       ... you have to warm up, man.

   17. JRJoe Rogan18:08

       Yep. Yep.

   18. PMPat McNamara18:09

       Damn. Don't jack yourself up. It's called fitness, not brokeness.

   19. JRJoe Rogan18:13

       (laughs) Yeah, people d- that's another thing that people don't like to do because it's not glamorous and because the- people get lazy. They don't want to do that workout-

   20. PMPat McNamara18:22

       Mm-hmm.

   21. JRJoe Rogan18:22

       ... or the- the pre-workout. They don't want to do all the skipping rope and-

   22. PMPat McNamara18:26

       Yeah.

   23. JRJoe Rogan18:26

       ... all the just switching stances and jumping jacks and all that stuff. But you really need to break a sweat, a real sweat-

   24. PMPat McNamara18:32

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan18:33

       ... before you actually start lifting weights. And then even if you lift weights or do anything, like say if you're gonna do k- kettle bells, I'll start off with 35 pounds. I'll do everything nice and light at first.

   26. PMPat McNamara18:42

       Yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan18:42

       I don't- I don't start off heavy.

   28. PMPat McNamara18:43

       Nope. Yep. That- that- that I- I- uh, well, that's, um, that's also wisdom.

   29. JRJoe Rogan18:49

       Yes.

   30. PMPat McNamara18:49

       You know, that's- (laughs) that's-
7. 27:15 – 34:51

   Coaching everybody: modifying courses for seniors, disabilities, and Parkinson’s shooters

   1. PMPat McNamara27:15

      Nah, it- it- it- it's good. I talk a lot, uh, during my cour- w- now, during my courses, I don't do this stuff. You know, I'm not ... 'Cause I have, I'll have 60-year-old women in it.

   2. JRJoe Rogan27:24

      Right.

   3. PMPat McNamara27:24

      I'll have, uh, guys with Parkinson's even, man, come to my course. I'll have guys in wheelchairs.

   4. JRJoe Rogan27:30

      Really?

   5. PMPat McNamara27:30

      Yeah. I'll have guys-

   6. JRJoe Rogan27:31

      What, how do you, how do you stabilize a guy when they have Parkinson's? What do you-

   7. PMPat McNamara27:34

      That's good. That's g- so I- what- I showed this guy a trick. What was his name? See if I can remember his name. It doesn't matter. But he was 77 years old, and, uh, he said, "Well, I could either come to your course and train or lay on my couch and die." (laughs)

   8. JRJoe Rogan27:47

      Whoa.

   9. PMPat McNamara27:47

      I was like ... So, you know, it was to that effect, 'cause he liked to shoot. And I said, "Bro, anytime," but I have to modify the course to him now.

   10. JRJoe Rogan27:56

       Right. Okay.

   11. PMPat McNamara27:56

       'Cause he can't even lay in a prone to zero.

   12. JRJoe Rogan27:59

       Right. Right, right, right.

   13. PMPat McNamara28:00

       So I would sit him on, um, on a cooler, and then I used, uh, you know what furring strips are? They hold up a target?

   14. JRJoe Rogan28:07

       Oh, okay.

   15. PMPat McNamara28:07

       They're just two s- one-by-twos, you know.

   16. JRJoe Rogan28:09

       Okay.

   17. PMPat McNamara28:10

       About five foot long. I had him criss-cross those and hold them, and then to V-notch them.

   18. JRJoe Rogan28:16

       Oh.

   19. PMPat McNamara28:16

       And then put his rifle in that V-notch.

   20. JRJoe Rogan28:18

       Oh, okay.

   21. PMPat McNamara28:19

       'Cause he could sit up pretty good with ... He, he couldn't get into prone. He can't stand-

   22. JRJoe Rogan28:24

       Mm-hmm.

   23. PMPat McNamara28:24

       ... and shoot, but sitting? Pretty good. And, you know, when, uh, when guys like that are concentrating more, you see that shake go away too.

   24. JRJoe Rogan28:36

       Mm-hmm.

   25. PMPat McNamara28:36

       Hey, that's something we do at my gym too. We train Parkinson's, uh, how to box, Parkinson's patients.

   26. JRJoe Rogan28:41

       Really?

   27. PMPat McNamara28:42

       It's a, it's a, it's a national program called, um, Rock Steady Boxing.

   28. JRJoe Rogan28:46

       Huh.

   29. PMPat McNamara28:47

       They come in, uh, twi- uh, three times a week.

   30. JRJoe Rogan28:50

       Where's your gym?
8. 34:51 – 42:56

   Rock Steady Boxing: Parkinson’s training, purpose, and the end of excuses

   1. JRJoe Rogan34:51

      What do you do for recovery? Do you, uh, fuck around with cryotherapy or saunas or anything like that?

   2. PMPat McNamara34:55

      I do noth- nothing.

   3. JRJoe Rogan34:56

      Do nothing? Really?

   4. PMPat McNamara34:57

      N- no. I ... Nope. Nothing. Uh-

   5. JRJoe Rogan35:00

      How come?

   6. PMPat McNamara35:00

      I, uh ... I don't know. I ... 'Cause I haven't n- really, like, needed it.

   7. JRJoe Rogan35:05

      Yeah.

   8. PMPat McNamara35:06

      Um ...

   9. JRJoe Rogan35:07

      You should just get a sauna.

   10. PMPat McNamara35:08

       (clears throat) Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan35:08

       Get a sauna in your gym.

   12. PMPat McNamara35:10

       Yep.

   13. JRJoe Rogan35:10

       Just that alone.

   14. PMPat McNamara35:11

       Mm-hmm.

   15. JRJoe Rogan35:12

       Get a sauna and a, a fucking ice bath.

   16. PMPat McNamara35:14

       Yeah. I drink ... I think I ... you know, I drink beer for recovery.

   17. JRJoe Rogan35:18

       (laughs)

   18. PMPat McNamara35:18

       I do. That, that's a, that's a n- nightly ritual. I won't ... I will not be able to function if I don't get a couple-

   19. JRJoe Rogan35:24

       How many beers?

   20. PMPat McNamara35:25

       Uh, usually around four. But they're, like, good quality pints, you know?

   21. JRJoe Rogan35:29

       Mm-hmm.

   22. PMPat McNamara35:29

       I'm not, like, chug-a-lugging NASCAR soda by the case.

   23. JRJoe Rogan35:34

       Right.

   24. PMPat McNamara35:35

       Um, barley pops, but, like, good quality, uh, IPA, stouts, porters. You know, that kind of thing.

   25. JRJoe Rogan35:42

       You just live for it?

   26. PMPat McNamara35:43

       Yeah, love it.

   27. JRJoe Rogan35:44

       (laughs)

   28. PMPat McNamara35:44

       I love ... I'm a hobbyist, man.

   29. JRJoe Rogan35:45

       Right.

   30. PMPat McNamara35:46

       I'm a hobbyist. That or bourbon. So I- I- I- I ... (sighs) I-
9. 42:56 – 58:29

   Recovery, lifestyle, and diet discipline: beer, bourbon, and “eat food” simplicity

   1. JRJoe Rogan42:56

      (coughs) When you retired from the military, was this, um... Did you envision yourself doing something along these lines?

   2. PMPat McNamara43:02

      (laughs)

   3. JRJoe Rogan43:02

      Like teaching tactical stuff, or?

   4. PMPat McNamara43:04

      Oh, man. I went through some rough patches, um.

   5. JRJoe Rogan43:07

      As most guys do, right?

   6. PMPat McNamara43:08

      Yeah, man. Man, it was... Ooh. No, I, I morphed into who I am o- only in like the past six or seven years. I retired in '05. I got hired p- before I even retired, by a corporation, to do training stuff. And, um, I kind of fell... I was almost falling into that rut of accepting mediocrity. (clears throat) Plus, what I didn't know is that, uh, I had depression. I hadn't known that, I... 'Cause you... No idea. You know, which is common, especially in, like, the, the spec ops world, guys retire.

   7. JRJoe Rogan43:50

      Mm-hmm.

   8. PMPat McNamara43:50

      Because you've been there in, in, in units with guys, with the same guys for a long, long time. And you've... There's a level of intimacy there that can't be replicated with another human being. And then, when you retire, you, you, you miss that camaraderie.

   9. JRJoe Rogan44:09

      Yeah.

   10. PMPat McNamara44:09

       That connection. Um, so I had... Working for a corporation, um, I was, uh... I had a really bad relationship. I was living in the bonus room of my garage. I lived there for five years.

   11. JRJoe Rogan44:23

       Mm-hmm.

   12. PMPat McNamara44:23

       'Cause I had a, a ex who was, um (smacks lips) on chemistry. You know, prescription meds. Go big pharma. Um, (clears throat) and so the neuroreceptors were freaking gone. I mean, delusional and, and, uh, it was, it was real bad. Uh, and then I started boozing, uh, with the depression. Um, and I, you know, it, it, it didn't even occur to me that, "Dude, you got a fucking problem, man." It didn't even occur. I guess, which is common with a lot of guys. But I had an epiphany. A lot of things happened at one time. My local cop saved my life. They said, "Bro, you need to get the fuck out of there." Um, and, uh, uh, a bunch of things happened all at once, and this was in 2013. Um, I didn't want to leave because I had little kids. (clears throat) So I didn't want to l-... I was, I was gonna stay there and, and just wither, wither away. Um, I b-... And I almost capitulated, you know, to darkness. Uh, but I got up what... Before I went to sleep one night, my, my kid is sleeping with me and I'm hammered and it's like 8:00 at night, you know. And, uh, and, um, I had an epiphany. I said, "You know what? I can't, I can't do this and I will not." I remember saying this to myself, "I will n-... I will not be defeated. I will not be defeated." And I put my running shoes by the side of my bed (clears throat) and some shorts, set my alarm clock, got up early next morning, and went for a run, à la Forest Gump. (sniffs) Uh, and I pounded the pavement for about 10 or 12 miles. And I'm not a runner, you know. I like to run, I like to sprint. And when I came back from the run, worked out in my driveway for about an hour, and, uh, my local cops came. Uh, uh, all happened at the same time. And, uh, they came and said, "Hey, bro. Get the fuck out. The kids will be all right. You need to do this and that." And, um, (clears throat) then I started, uh, kind of figuring out a r-... Uh, re-evaluating my path in life. Oh, back up a step. I got... also got laid off-

   13. JRJoe Rogan46:35

       Mm-hmm.

   14. PMPat McNamara46:35

       ... from this corporation. And, you know, with a guy in the military, you don't, you don't ever think about job security. And when I retired, I'm working for a corporation that was mostly reti- made up of, uh, retired military guys. So you get laid off and you're like, "What the fuck am I gonna do now? What does that even mean, getting laid off?"

   15. JRJoe Rogan46:51

       Right.

   16. PMPat McNamara46:51

       "I don't... What am I gonna do?" Um, so all that shit happened at the same time. It was like a... It was like a... this massive spiral of bad events. And, uh, man, I was able to, um... I was able to rekindle my own, my own, my own fire. 'Cause I recognized, "All right, bro, you still got an ember, you still got this. All you need to do is just nurture that ember, turn it into a flame. Turn that into a flame, and then just start adding wood, adding wood, adding wood until it becomes just a perpetual, uh, blaze." And, uh... Which led me to this thing that I tell people now, you know, is that, uh, you gotta keep the blaze alive. Um, I've got that on T-shirts, even. Because I, I like, I like to kick people in the ass who are willing to sustain their own fire once they get that ass kicking. If they can't, if they can't keep their fire going, then it's not worth... it's not worth it for me, you know, to, to keep kicking them in the ass. (clears throat) Um, but, uh, uh, yeah. So ever since, uh, that point in time, you know, getting laid off, the depression, the boozing, uh, I was able to rediscover me and rebrand and, and, um, pretty much start from scratch. I mean, I had to start life all over again when I was 48 years old.

   17. JRJoe Rogan48:27

       Wow.

   18. PMPat McNamara48:28

       Yep, the whole thing, from scratch. And I discovered, like, social media and all this stuff 'cause I met a gal and, um, w- I'm married to her now and she's probably the best pers-... one of the best human beings I've ever met, you know.... all-around human being. Um, so she was able to help me with that and said, "Hey, you need to do this. You need to get, uh, th- this social media platform or that one." And so it's, it's, it's detonated pretty well, considering I've been on it a short amount of time. Um, but apparently, uh, the message is resonating.

   19. JRJoe Rogan49:01

       Yeah.

   20. PMPat McNamara49:02

       So-

   21. JRJoe Rogan49:03

       (coughing) Well-

   22. PMPat McNamara49:03

       ... I'm happy that it's-

   23. JRJoe Rogan49:04

       ... and it's genuine. It's a genuine message.

   24. PMPat McNamara49:05

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan49:05

       That's why I picked up on it, you know?

   26. PMPat McNamara49:06

       Oh, right on. Yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan49:07

       You know? But I, I love that you figured your shit out. I love that. That's my favorite thing, when, when... I mean, look, everybody's prone to mistakes and prone to depression, and people are prone to hitting rock bottom.

   28. PMPat McNamara49:19

       Yep.

   29. JRJoe Rogan49:20

       Your life can go down a series of bad roads, and-

   30. PMPat McNamara49:23

       Yeah.
10. 58:29 – 1:04:43

    Rebuilding after retirement: depression, rock bottom, and the decision to fight back

    1. JRJoe Rogan58:29

       So let me take you back to when you decided to get your shit together again.

    2. PMPat McNamara58:32

       Mm. Yeah. Yep.

    3. JRJoe Rogan58:32

       So you- you decide to get your shit together again, you begin the process.

    4. PMPat McNamara58:36

       Yep.

    5. JRJoe Rogan58:37

       And then how did you get to where you're at now?

    6. PMPat McNamara58:39

       Well, I, um... Getting laid off was scary as hell. But sometimes, you know, when you're in crisis mode like that, you- you think most efficiently.

    7. JRJoe Rogan58:49

       Mm-hmm.

    8. PMPat McNamara58:49

       There's a- there's a- there's a- there's a series of things that happen. One is, you know, you get scared to death, right? Laid off. Scared- I think that was the first one. Scared and then angry, and this is over a couple days, you know? And then focus. When I got focused, I built m- my company, TMX. Um, I mean, I just thought of everything, you know? I just had one epiphany after the other. I said, "What am I gonna call it?" You know? I don't know. Let me just make up an acronym that sounds cool and then cover all the bases. Trading, marksmanship, adventure, concept, security. I covered everything. TMX. And then, um, uh, and then, um... Man, shit just... I mean- it... I was so freaking fortunate 'cause shit fell into place for me. I had guys who were... who I trained for this corporation call the corporation and say, "Hey, we want, uh, you know, Pat Mac to come train us again." And they said, "Well, he's no longer here, but we could have somebody else do it." And they were like, "No, we don't want somebody else, you know. We want... And we don't care what it's called or what you're branding it, we want this guy doing it." (clears throat) So they were able to get in contact with me. It was a big contract. And then another one came up, and then another one, all in the same year. I was like, "Are you freaking kidding?"

    9. JRJoe Rogan1:00:03

       This is all tactical training?

    10. PMPat McNamara1:00:04

        Yeah. And it was all... Uh, uh, uh, so that year was complete. Um, and then I had a bunch of different, uh, you know, lessons learned, like government contracts, shit like sequestration. Remember that? 2013 when the... (laughs) Anyway, sequestration. So government contracting and stuff like that, it all went away.

    11. JRJoe Rogan1:00:25

        Mm-hmm.

    12. PMPat McNamara1:00:25

        So there was a time in '13 where I didn't work for six months, you know? It was just... It's- it's scary when you're working on your... when you're doing everything for and by yourself.

    13. JRJoe Rogan1:00:35

        (clears throat)

    14. PMPat McNamara1:00:35

        Uh, all your own admin and everything like that. It could be... It's very exciting, but scary as shit.

    15. JRJoe Rogan1:00:42

        Yeah.

    16. PMPat McNamara1:00:43

        And it's like, "Damn, man." You know? I keep ja...

    17. JRJoe Rogan1:00:46

        (coughs)

    18. PMPat McNamara1:00:46

        I don't care how much stuff in- I have in the pipeline, I keep jamming more shit in there, man. (laughs)

    19. JRJoe Rogan1:00:50

        Yeah. Yeah.

    20. PMPat McNamara1:00:51

        Um...... all right, (clears throat) but once, uh, so I had those government contracts, then (smacks lips) I just, I just built momentum, and then started learning. "All right, let's get rid of this. Let's do more of this. Let's not do focus on that. Let's focus on this." Uh, and, um, it grew, it grew into a, um, (clicks tongue) into a very r- m- it's like s- self-fulfilling machine.

    21. JRJoe Rogan1:01:20

        Mm-hmm.

    22. PMPat McNamara1:01:20

        You know, it's a, uh, it's, it's, it's, it's running, running very well right now. But it was not easy getting there. I mean, there was a lot of bumps and obstacles in the road. But (clears throat) I tell guys that all the time, man, any, any, any road worth traveling, it, y- you're probably ... you're gonna have obstacles in it. There's gonna be temptation, like shortcuts, you know. Nope, stay on that road, bro. Stay on that road. Go through those potholes. Go over those freaking bumps. Um, this road, it's gonna suck, but after a while, it'll smooth out. And sure enough, you know, my road's smoothed out, and the bumps are few and far between right now. Um, so yeah, man, I'm, I'm, I'm the happiest I've ever been in my life, probably, right now. You know, 54 years old, and, uh, I've, I've ... It's like I've grown up. (laughs)

    23. JRJoe Rogan1:02:13

        That ... But that's smart.

    24. PMPat McNamara1:02:13

        Yeah.

    25. JRJoe Rogan1:02:14

        I mean, that's ... If you're a person who's thinking and trying to do better with your life, you should be a- at your best right now.

    26. PMPat McNamara1:02:21

        Yep.

    27. JRJoe Rogan1:02:21

        Should be at your best with how you perceive things, how you decide to approach things, how you look at things.

    28. PMPat McNamara1:02:26

        Mm-hmm.

    29. JRJoe Rogan1:02:26

        So when you're doing these, uh, these tactical courses, and you're tr- you're traveling so much, um, w- that, that's very hard on your body.

    30. PMPat McNamara1:02:34

        Oh. Yeah.
11. 1:04:43 – 1:12:19

    What Pat enjoys most: motivating through fitness and helping others find momentum

    1. JRJoe Rogan1:04:43

       I don't know. Do y- so do you ... Uh, what do you enjoy the most? Do you enjoy doing the social media stuff? Do you enjoy doing the tactical training? Like, what do you enjoy doing the most?

    2. PMPat McNamara1:04:52

       (laughs) Um, I, I, I, I like doing, I like doing the, the, the workout stuff-

    3. JRJoe Rogan1:04:57

       Mm-hmm.

    4. PMPat McNamara1:04:57

       ... more than anything. Uh, because I think with that, I reach and help more people. (clears throat) Even if they could be, um ... It's amaz- it's, it's amazing. It's, it's like, you know, I, I have so many ... I don't know how this has happened, but I've be- I have morphed into this guy who people rely on to motivate them, and they tell me, "Bro, you're, you're motivating the hell out of me," which fires me up. As my buddy CJ says, "What motivates a motivator? Tell him you're motivating him." You know? So, um, so I love doing that stuff because it touches a lot of people regardless of their age or their physical ability. And a lot of guys may be, um, you know, bedridden with an illness or something like that, and, uh, it'll fire them up. So I like doing that stuff. (sniffs) Uh, I think next would be the, um, the s- the shooting thing. I mean, I love ... I, it, it, it, it ... I love running courses and meeting new people. I meet a dozen new people every week, and from all walks of life, and, uh, guys-

    5. JRJoe Rogan1:06:00

       And all different reasons-

    6. PMPat McNamara1:06:02

       Yep.

    7. JRJoe Rogan1:06:02

       ... motivations for doing it.

    8. PMPat McNamara1:06:03

       Yep. And, and, um, guys, you know, they'll ask me during the classes. The- they say, "Bro, what ... How do you stay motivated to do these-"

    9. JRJoe Rogan1:06:10

       Mm-hmm.

    10. PMPat McNamara1:06:10

        "... almost every week?" And I say, " 'Cause I get to meet guys like you, bro." I mean, it's as simple as that. It's fun.

    11. JRJoe Rogan1:06:16

        Yeah, if you find enthusiastic people-

    12. PMPat McNamara1:06:18

        Yeah.

    13. JRJoe Rogan1:06:18

        ... and you're teaching them, that helps a lot.

    14. PMPat McNamara1:06:20

        (clears throat) Yep.

    15. JRJoe Rogan1:06:20

        Yeah.

    16. PMPat McNamara1:06:21

        So, you know, uh, y- I like to fire people up, but I like to get it in return.

    17. JRJoe Rogan1:06:25

        Do you find a lot of guys that are also retiring from the military, they, they want to talk to you about this 'cause they're trying to figure out their path?

    18. PMPat McNamara1:06:32

        Uh, a couple of them have hit me up and I am, man, open arms. I'm like, "Let me show you, whatever you wanna know, 'cause I figured this out."

    19. JRJoe Rogan1:06:40

        Mm-hmm.

    20. PMPat McNamara1:06:40

        So yep, I'm your Huckleberry.... uh, (clears throat) it's not many of 'em, but there have been... There'll be, you know, a half dozen a year who, who will ping me, "Hey, I want to get into the training industry, man."

    21. JRJoe Rogan1:06:53

        Right.

    22. PMPat McNamara1:06:53

        Like, there's plenty of room for it.

    23. JRJoe Rogan1:06:55

        Every guy that I know-

    24. PMPat McNamara1:06:56

        (laughs)

    25. JRJoe Rogan1:06:56

        ... that's either been Spec Ops, SEAL, whatever they've been, when they retire, it's one of the hardest moments of their life.

    26. PMPat McNamara1:07:02

        Yeah.

    27. JRJoe Rogan1:07:02

        It's so hard for them to find some purpose.

    28. PMPat McNamara1:07:05

        Mm-hmm.

    29. JRJoe Rogan1:07:06

        And there's, there... It's hard for them to find roots to, just to, to really feel like they belong again-

    30. PMPat McNamara1:07:12

        (inhales deeply)
12. 1:12:19 – 1:22:29

    Building the brand: social media platforms, impersonators, analytics, and community

    1. JRJoe Rogan1:12:19

       And your wife helped you with this stuff? Did she-

    2. PMPat McNamara1:12:20

       Yeah, she helped me set stuff up just 'cause I didn't know what-

    3. JRJoe Rogan1:12:23

       Right.

    4. PMPat McNamara1:12:23

       ... any of this stuff was. (clears throat) So we got married and s- uh, we met in thir- uh, uh, like fall of '13. And then the first social media platform I had was Facebook 'cause somebody's posing as me.

    5. JRJoe Rogan1:12:36

       Oh, that's hilarious.

    6. PMPat McNamara1:12:37

       (laughs)

    7. JRJoe Rogan1:12:38

       (laughs)

    8. PMPat McNamara1:12:38

       So I, in order to, uh, report them, I needed to get an account on Facebook.

    9. JRJoe Rogan1:12:44

       Oh.

    10. PMPat McNamara1:12:44

        And then once I did, a friend requested this guy who's posting, uh, posing as me and anyway...

    11. JRJoe Rogan1:12:49

        What, what did he say?

    12. PMPat McNamara1:12:50

        But-

    13. JRJoe Rogan1:12:51

        Why was he doing it?

    14. PMPat McNamara1:12:51

        Uh-I figured it out. I did some detective work. But he was posing as me because he wanted to bash somebody else in the gun industry and pose as somebody credible-

    15. JRJoe Rogan1:13:01

        Oh.

    16. PMPat McNamara1:13:02

        ... in the industry.

    17. JRJoe Rogan1:13:03

        Oh.

    18. PMPat McNamara1:13:03

        So this guy that he was bashing contacted me and said, "Hey, why are you saying this?" And I don't talk shit (laughs) about anybody.

    19. JRJoe Rogan1:13:11

        Right.

    20. PMPat McNamara1:13:12

        So, like, "Bro, I think you got the wrong guy." And, uh, I said, "Just call me up. Here's my number."

    21. JRJoe Rogan1:13:17

        That's hilarious.

    22. PMPat McNamara1:13:18

        Yeah. And, uh, we had a chitchat and he goes, "Oh, man, I got some bad news for you. You do have a Facebook account." And he-

    23. JRJoe Rogan1:13:24

        (laughs)

    24. PMPat McNamara1:13:24

        ... sent me a link and everything. And, yeah. Man. But, um, so I started that one. I already had a couple YouTube, uh, videos up.

    25. JRJoe Rogan1:13:33

        Mm-hmm.

    26. PMPat McNamara1:13:34

        But then, um, I just went full bore with it, you know? Went, went kind of batshit. And then the, uh, the IG was fun, man. When Rebecca, my wife, showed me that, that was probably, I think, uh, about fi- I think five ... I'm five years into that. And I figured it out, you know, what my audience wants.

Episode duration: 1:42:11