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The Joe Rogan ExperienceThe Joe Rogan Experience

Joe Rogan Experience #1353 - Rob Zombie

Rob Zombie is a musician and filmmaker. His new film "3 From Hell" is available in select theaters this week and everywhere in October.

Joe RoganhostRob Zombieguest
Sep 17, 20192h 6mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

  1. 0:03 – 1:18

    From metal icon to filmmaker: who recognizes you now?

    1. JR

      Here we go. Rob Zombie, ladies and gentlemen. How are you, sir?

    2. RZ

      Good, good.

    3. JR

      Thanks for being here, man. I appreciate it.

    4. RZ

      Oh, yeah, it's awesome.

    5. JR

      Uh, 3 From Hell comes out tonight.

    6. RZ

      Yes, finally.

    7. JR

      It's such a crazy s- leap that you've made. I mean, people know you as much now for your films as they do for your music.

    8. RZ

      Yeah, pretty much. Especially, w- I've really noticed that when I'd be, like, in an elevator. Like, the music fans, I can pretty much spot them, you know, but, like, when some guy comes up to me in an elevator, looks like he's a lawyer or something-

    9. JR

      (laughs)

    10. RZ

      ... which I, I have to get to grips with that 'cause I'm not, you know, I'm old, that every time a cop comes up to me, I'm like, "What does this guy want?" I'm like, "Oh, he's-"

    11. JR

      Right.

    12. RZ

      "... like a fan 'cause he's 30 years younger than me." Um, but, like, yeah, when normal people, like, "Oh, man, I'm so into this or that." 'Cause-

    13. JR

      Yeah.

    14. RZ

      ... you know, I figure, like, you know, heavy metal music's very specific, but everybody likes movies.

    15. JR

      Right.

    16. RZ

      So you can never spot the fans.

    17. JR

      You can see a metal fan.

    18. RZ

      Yeah.

    19. JR

      Yeah.

    20. RZ

      Yeah. The, I can pretty much spot them.

    21. JR

      What do you look for? A metal fan? Like, what-

    22. RZ

      (laughs)

    23. JR

      ... what do you see, and, like, what's coming your way?

    24. RZ

      Well, it's changed, but now it's always a guy with a shaved head and a long goatee.

    25. JR

      D- dude, that's very similar-

    26. RZ

      Nobody has hair any-

    27. JR

      ... to MMA fans (laughs) .

    28. RZ

      Yeah, nobody has hair anymore. It's like, I swear sometimes I'm on stage and a fan's like, "Who's, what's with the long hair?"

    29. JR

      That's funny. Yeah, right? That was rock and roll. It was synonymous.

    30. RZ

      Yeah. It's, like, not, not anymore.

  2. 1:18 – 4:37

    Early ambitions, shyness, and the fuel of being an outsider

    1. JR

      What made you make that leap into horror films?

    2. RZ

      Well, I always wanted to make movies. That was always my main goal in life.

    3. JR

      Really? Before music?

    4. RZ

      Well, it was... Well, let me back it up. I loved everything equally but, as a kid, it all seemed unattainable. So it was-

    5. JR

      Sure.

    6. RZ

      ... all fantasy. Like, "Oh, yeah. I'm gonna go to Hollywood and make movies. Oh, yeah, I'm gonna have a band." Like, no you're not. You're just living in some crap town and you're gonna do nothing, is what it felt like.

    7. JR

      You grew up in Haverhill?

    8. RZ

      Yeah.

    9. JR

      Yeah.

    10. RZ

      You, you're in Lut-

    11. JR

      I, I grew up in Newton.

    12. RZ

      (laughs)

    13. JR

      Newton, Never Falls.

    14. RZ

      Yeah, it's so funny. I think when I was a kid and played ice hockey, we would play against Newton.

    15. JR

      I'm sure.

    16. RZ

      (laughs)

    17. JR

      I think we wrestled you guys (laughs) .

    18. RZ

      (laughs) Oh, yeah. Yeah, oh God, wrestling, man. I hated having to wrestle.

    19. JR

      It's fucking horrible.

    20. RZ

      It was, like, so exhausting.

    21. JR

      It's the most exhausting-

    22. RZ

      Like, I would swim, like, 30 seconds. I'm like, "That was the worst 30 seconds of my life." Um, what was I saying?

    23. JR

      Oh, growing up.

    24. RZ

      Oh, yeah. No, I mean, growing up, I mean, it's like, you can have a crappy band in the garage with your friends, but it's not gonna do a thing, and then we had a Super 8 camera, so we'd make crappy Super 8 movies, but none of it seemed realistic. I thought my life was gonna be, you know, world's worst bike messenger-

    25. JR

      (laughs)

    26. RZ

      ... in New York City. That seemed to be what I was destined for. But then, as the band started taking off, and, which seemed odd in its own, and there was a chance to make music videos, I'm like, "Fuck it. I'm directing these music videos. This'll be film school for me." And that's what it sorta became.

    27. JR

      Did you have this thing that a lot of people have when things start going well for them, uh, you have sort of, like, imposter syndrome? Like, you kind of, you're, you're like, "Is this... What the fuck? Are they gonna find out?" Like, "I'm not so-"

    28. RZ

      Oh, yeah. My whole life is like, "Ah, fooled 'em again."

    29. JR

      (laughs)

    30. RZ

      (laughs)

  3. 4:37 – 6:49

    Stage confidence vs social anxiety: why big crowds feel easier

    1. JR

      It is super true, and it's also s- it's interesting that you said that you were, you had social anxiety. So many people that become entertainers also had some form of social anxiety when they're young.

    2. RZ

      Yeah. I had to do this thing last n- no, the night before last. I was presenting this award to somebody at this event, and, you know, I'm picturing how the stage will be really big and high, you know, I can get up there, it's super impersonal, doesn't matter. And I get there and the stage is, like, lower than this desk, and it's, like, all the tables with people eating dinner right there. I'm like, "Oh man, this is a nightmare." (laughs)

    3. JR

      (laughs)

    4. RZ

      I can't do this.

    5. JR

      Yeah.

    6. RZ

      You know, 'cause you have to sorta be normal.

    7. JR

      I used to freak out when I had to talk to bank tellers. I used to, like, you know, you're in the line.

    8. RZ

      (laughs)

    9. JR

      Doesn't make any sense, right? But the line of, like, I'd have to deposit my check, and I'd, I'd be in the line and, like, four more people and I gotta talk.

    10. RZ

      (laughs) I totally know that feeling.

    11. JR

      Three more people. Fuck. It's so crazy. (laughs)

    12. RZ

      (laughs) I was like that about every... I was like that with my own, not my family that lived in the house, but if, like, an uncle came over. I'd go, "I can't deal with dealing, talking to Uncle Bill."

    13. JR

      Yeah.

    14. RZ

      "I'll be upstairs. Call me when he leaves."

    15. JR

      Yeah. And then, it's crazy that a guy like you winds up singing in front of fucking thousands of people, playing guitar in front of thousands of people.

    16. RZ

      (laughs) I wish I could play guitar. Uh, but I will sing in front of people. Um, it doesn't bother me. It doesn't matter. Like, if it's like-

    17. JR

      Let me-

    18. RZ

      ... "Oh, it's a festival. It's 100,000 people." I'm like, "Who gives a crap?"

    19. JR

      It's crazy. So, so many of-

    20. RZ

      But if there's two people out there that wanna say hi, I'm like, "Oh, that's weird."

    21. JR

      Yeah.

    22. RZ

      Yeah. (laughs)

    23. JR

      Yeah, especially if they're right in front of you. Like, uh, one of the weirdest shows that any comic ever has to do is shows where there's a really tiny audience, like at The Comedy Store at 1:00 in the morning-

    24. RZ

      Oh.

    25. JR

      ... and there's like five people.

    26. RZ

      That's brutal.

    27. JR

      It's just so weird. It's like 500 people, no problem.

    28. RZ

      Yeah.

    29. JR

      Five people, ah.

    30. RZ

      That's why starting, like, when, when people are like, "Oh, do you ever want to go back and play clubs and more intimate settings?" I'm like, "No, no."

  4. 6:49 – 9:58

    White Zombie beginnings: Pee-wee’s Playhouse, CBGB-era DIY, and learning by failing

    1. JR

      W- what kind of music did you guys play in the very beginning?

    2. RZ

      Well, when I started, I was living in New York City and, um, when my first band, White Zombie, started, I was working at Pee-wee's Playhouse actually. I was a production assistant for Pee-Wee's Playhouse-

    3. JR

      No shit.

    4. RZ

      ... for the first season.

    5. JR

      Did you know Phil Hartman?

    6. RZ

      I, no, I was a production assistant.

    7. JR

      Oh, okay.

    8. RZ

      I knew who the-

    9. JR

      But did you see him?

    10. RZ

      I saw people around, 'cause it was Phil Hartman and it was Paul Reubens obviously.

    11. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    12. RZ

      And it was, uh, William Marshall, who played Blacula, he was the cartoon king at that point. And it was all these great people, um, Larry Fishburne. It was Cowboy Curtis.

    13. JR

      Oh, that's right, that's right.

    14. RZ

      Um-

    15. JR

      Wow, I forgot he was on it.

    16. RZ

      The only interaction I ever had with anybody, uh, was Paul Reubens. And I was standing there and he walked by and he goes, "Where's the bathroom?" I was like, "It's right there."

    17. JR

      That's it?

    18. RZ

      That was (laughs) that was it. So, uh, I forget what I was gonna ... Oh, but anyway.

    19. JR

      (laughs)

    20. RZ

      (laughs) I was getting side tracked.

    21. JR

      It's crazy that White Zombie was your first band too.

    22. RZ

      Yeah. And-

    23. JR

      I mean, what are the odds?

    24. RZ

      ... it was weird because we didn't play any covers and we sort of, nobody really knew how to play when we started. We sort of invented a sound based upon completely not knowing what you're doing.

    25. JR

      Really?

    26. RZ

      Yeah. Because you're, that's like any band, like The Ramones, it's like, well, we know these three chords, but we understand... They instinctively understand catchy pop songs even though it doesn't make sense. 'Cause when you try to learn a Ramones song, it doesn't make sense, even though it seems like, oh these are really simple songs. 'Cause I've played them before, 'cause I've done this Ramones tribute thing. You're like, "Oh, verse, chorus. Wait, verse again, two choruses, then ano-" Like, they're so catchy but the structure is so odd, because you could tell they were just sort of inventing this thing they were doing. And that's how I felt with us. 'Cause I, I had this weird idea like, "Let's never play conventional drum beats," which is like saying, "Let's never make this song fun for anyone to listen to."

    27. JR

      (laughs)

    28. RZ

      Like I was, you know, I got over that, but, but it just, yeah, you just, uh ... I don't know what I'm talking about.

    29. JR

      Did you take any classes in the early days? Or did you just-

    30. RZ

      Well, I went to New York originally to go to Parsons School of Design for fine arts. But I got kicked out 'cause my grades dropped too low, because I went from Haverhill to New York. So I was like, "I'm just hanging out at Danceteria all night. I'm not going to school."

  5. 9:58 – 14:22

    Stubborn instincts and risky bets: turning down deals to land Geffen

    1. RZ

      I, I mean, I remember when I got kicked out of school. I was sitting in New Jersey. I was probably 19, maybe 20. And I was just sitting there thinking, "Well, I did it. I'm a fucking loser." 'Cause I had, you know, I was making like 100 bucks a week, I got kicked out of school and was sitting there in this crappy ghetto neighborhood in Jersey City. And you're just like, "What did I do with my life?" And-

    2. JR

      But it worked out.

    3. RZ

      Yeah, it worked out somehow.

    4. JR

      Isn't that crazy? Just things just eventually get better if you keep going.

    5. RZ

      Yeah.

    6. JR

      You, you-

    7. RZ

      I don't know how. I guess, I don't know how, because it never, there would never seemed like it was going to. Like White Zombie was a band it seemed like everyone hated. And no matter what, we had to be literally the last band in New York City to get a record deal. Maybe that's why we got it.

    8. JR

      (laughs)

    9. RZ

      They're like, "We are literally out of bands. We have to sign them." But even when that happened, there was always this weird thing, and maybe you could relate. We got a, offered a record deal with RCA Records. Now, we're a band that hasn't got anything. And I was like, "Nah, doesn't seem right." And I turned it down. And then we got MCA and I turned it down. I was like, "I think we should wait, hold out for Geffen Records." Now we have nothing. These are the people holding out for Geffen Records 'cause they were the biggest at the time, with no reason to be holding out. But we got signed to Geffen eventually, so-

    10. JR

      How did you have those kind of balls? 'Cause that seems like you would-

    11. RZ

      Well, I think it's balls mixed with stupidity.

    12. JR

      (laughs)

    13. RZ

      At the same time. Because I, I know I can be my own worst enemy, because even when I signed to Geffen, you know, I come up with an album title. They're like, "Really? You're gonna call it El Sexorcisto Devil Music Volume One? Is this just to guarantee we don't get any good placement on the album in stores?" I was like, "I guess." And then they're like, "Well, we're gonna hire, let's hire so-and-so to direct a video." Like naming, you know, he just did the naming some big, The White Snake video. I go, "No, I'm gonna do it." And they're like, "Oh, god."

    14. JR

      (laughs)

    15. RZ

      This idiot. (laughs) But it all worked.

    16. JR

      It's crazy though that you passed on two legitimate record companies. I mean, most kids when they're starting out are so, you know, you're like, "Holy shit, this is our chance."

    17. RZ

      I didn't think they were good enough.

    18. JR

      Wow.

    19. RZ

      Even though we weren't good enough for anything either. I don't know what that thought was.

    20. JR

      Well, maybe you just...I don't know, man, I'm not a believer in fate, but it kinda seems to fall into place for you.

    21. RZ

      (sighs) It... Yeah. I don't know. It's like, I feel like my whole life is just like, I coulda gotten hit by that car, I just didn't.

    22. JR

      (laughs)

    23. RZ

      You know? 'Cause I just stopped one second short from actually-

    24. JR

      Wow.

    25. RZ

      ... stepping in front of the speeding car and made it.

    26. JR

      So, you always wanted to make movies, though? That was always something in the back of your head?

    27. RZ

      That was always the thing I wanted to do, for sure. But that seemed completely undoable because it was just like, Hollywood and movies? I mean, it just, it feels so far, far removed. I mean, living on the Lower East Side playing CBGBs, like, and being broke, that seems doable, like-

    28. JR

      Right.

    29. RZ

      ... you know? And that actually what inspired me there is I would see so many bands, I go, "Well they suck." I mean, we f- at least better than they are.

    30. JR

      (laughs)

  6. 14:22 – 18:36

    Growing up on TV Guide, FM radio, and ‘monster movies’—before everything was niche

    1. JR

      What kind of films did you like when you were growing up?

    2. RZ

      I mean, when I was a kid, I would literally just get the TV guide, 'cause we're talking like, you know, the early 70s, and I would circle everything that I was gonna watch for the week. Like, I would plan it out. It wasn't random. It was like, "Okay, 1:00, White Heat's on. I'm gonna watch that. Beneath the Planet of the Apes comes on at 4:00, we're gonna jump to that then, you know, we're gonna take a break to watch Gilligan's Island. Then I'm gonna come back 'cause Good, the Bad and the Ugly is on tonight 'cause it's Clint Eastwood week," and I would just plan it out the whole week, and that's... I would just watch everything.

    3. JR

      Kids today will never understand TV guides.

    4. RZ

      No.

    5. JR

      They'd never understand. And the ones that would come with the Sunday paper, where you'd get the, the guide with the paper and you'd figure out what's, what's gonna be on-

    6. RZ

      It was the greatest thing ever.

    7. JR

      ... and you'd look forward to stuff. We would look forward to what was going to be on TV.

    8. RZ

      Remember as a kid, like, you knew Planet of the Apes was gonna be on? Like, the whole neighborhood was on fire-

    9. JR

      Yes.

    10. RZ

      ... 'cause Planet of the Apes was gonna be on. Now it's like, "Whatever, it's on my phone right now."

    11. JR

      It's always there.

    12. RZ

      You know?

    13. JR

      Yeah.

    14. RZ

      But I think there's something... I, I... Don't you think? And, and I don't know how this figures into comedy, but I'm sure it does. There was something about having to be exposed to everything 'cause there was nothing else, that I know as much about John Wayne movies as I do about horror movies.

    15. JR

      Right, you didn't get to choose.

    16. RZ

      Whereas now everything's so compartmentalized that-

    17. JR

      Hmm.

    18. RZ

      ... people just like, y- guess, like if you hear a band, you go, "Let me guess what your favorite band is, the band you sound exactly like," because you have no other influences.

    19. JR

      Right.

    20. RZ

      As opposed to a lot of metal bands I know that are huge, they go like, "Well, my favorite band was actually ZZ Top, so we just decided to play ZZ Top riffs really fast, and that's how we created this." But now everybody's just so like, "I only like this."

    21. JR

      Yeah. The, you get in those, those confirmation bubbles where everybody else likes what you like and-

    22. RZ

      Yeah.

    23. JR

      ... you just operate in the same circles and, yeah. Yeah, you can get real weird that way.

    24. RZ

      Where it's weird, like, you just, it... But if you're taking influences from everywhere or stealing things from everywhere-

    25. JR

      Yeah.

    26. RZ

      ... you can put them together in a new way. But if you're like, "I only like metal," then yes, you sound like metal.

    27. JR

      But that's the cool thing about the radio, right? That d- I mean, I've, I've been recently listening to Spotify, which I never listened before, but listen to streaming services-

    28. RZ

      Yeah.

    29. JR

      ... so I get exposed to, you know, there's like a channel. Like, there'll be a Rob Zombie channel and there'll be a bunch of other shit on it as well. Like y- you know, like, there's Led Zeppelin channel-

    30. RZ

      Yeah.

  7. 18:36 – 19:58

    From fandom to filmmaking: horror roots, John Carpenter, and the road to House of 1000 Corpses

    1. JR

      Um, so, like, mus- movies wise, movie wise, like, when you were a kid, do, were you into horror films back then?

    2. RZ

      I was into everything. But I, I love that for sure, but I, like, I don't even know if we, I, we definitely didn't call them horror movies. We thought everything, everything was a monster movie. Like, "Oh, man, check out this monster movie."

    3. JR

      Right, right.

    4. RZ

      Like, that's just what we'd call it.

    5. JR

      Yeah.

    6. RZ

      'Cause it was always, like, you know, we'd, we had Creature Double Feature on channel 56, do you remember that?

    7. JR

      Sure.

    8. RZ

      Yeah.

    9. JR

      Yeah.

    10. RZ

      Well that was like the every weekend, it's like, "Oh fuck, it's Destroy All Monsters."

    11. JR

      Pre-

    12. RZ

      "And, you know, whatever, Son of..."

    13. JR

      Creature Double Feature. (laughs)

    14. RZ

      "Kong." Yeah. On channel 56.

    15. JR

      (laughs)

    16. RZ

      Yeah. So that was, yeah, so, big time, that ruled our world.

    17. JR

      So watching them back then, that's when you got the idea?

    18. RZ

      Well, I got the idea that I loved it and I wanted to do it. But it was al- it was the idea, like, "Yeah, I wanna be an astronaut too." Like, it didn't seem like an idea that was ever gonna happen. It seemed-

    19. JR

      Right, but it was just something that you were really into.

    20. RZ

      Yeah, and it's really funny too, this funny, the weird things, 'cause at one time in high school, me and my friends filmed a sequel to Escape from New York, the John Carpenter film. And I don't know, couldn't have made it better. And then to be, like, however many, 20 years later, that I remade a John Carpenter film, Halloween, was just so bizarre. I guess I'd been thinking about it for a long time. But, you know.

    21. JR

      That is kinda crazy.

    22. RZ

      It's weird, yeah. It's weird shit like that.

  8. 19:58 – 24:32

    Universal dumps the movie: ‘unreleasable’ test screenings and ironic redemption

    1. JR

      What w- when, when your first actual film film was what, like 2004?

    2. RZ

      2000.

    3. JR

      2000?

    4. RZ

      Yeah, because the way it went down was... This is a funny story too. I made my first movie, House of 1000 Corpses, at Universal Studios, and it was 2000, it could've been even the tail end of 1999, I'm not sure. The only reason I know it was 2000, I was, I had a wrap gift somebody gave me and they put a date, and I was like, "Oh shit, it was 2000." So I made the movie with Universal Studios and once they screened it, we had our test screening, which I thought went, I thought went great. And what do I know? The, the, uh, head of S- Universal at the time came up to me and was like, "We have to talk tomorrow."

    5. JR

      (laughs)

    6. RZ

      I was like, "Oh man, that was not a good tone." That wasn't a, "You're so great, we wanna give you a five picture deal," tone of voice. So the next day, they dumped the movie, and, you know, just basically booted us out. And then-

    7. JR

      What was the conversation?

    8. RZ

      They were like, "We, basically this is unreleasable."

    9. JR

      (laughs)

    10. RZ

      I don't remember word for word, but-

    11. JR

      (laughs)

    12. RZ

      ... that was the conversation in a nutshell. But at the time too, you figure, there was no horror coming out of Universal. They were making, like, The Flintstones movie, and that was not the image they wanted, this really vile, sort of backwoods, hillbilly, murder fest, where there's, the bad people win, essentially. I mean, horror films were sort of like not even a th- commercial thing at that point, in a way. So then, um, which is funny now, if you go to Universal Studios Hollywood or Orlando, there's a huge House of 1000 Corpses thing, event going on, in both theme parks.

    13. JR

      That's hilarious.

    14. RZ

      I was there for the o- grand opening, like, "That's funny."

    15. JR

      (laughs)

    16. RZ

      Again, like, it's like a train, it's like, I get fired from here and now, you know, 20 years later, it's a theme park attraction in the exact place I got fired from.

    17. JR

      Wow.

    18. RZ

      Which is so weird.

    19. JR

      What was the conversation like before you decided to do that film? I mean, how did, how did they let you do it?

    20. RZ

      I don't, it wa- (sighs) you know, I ... (sighs) Again, I think getting to make a movie for Universal Studios was such an amazing experience, but I think I was too naive to understand what was happening. It'd be like you did one set of comms, it was like, "Oh yeah, we're gonna put you on tour with George Carlin." You're like, "Cool, I guess this is the way it happens, man." You know?

    21. JR

      (laughs)

    22. RZ

      And then it's after, you're like, "Wow, I didn't really appreciate just went down, did I?" Not that I was, took it for granted, but I, I had, I had met with someone at the theme park about doing a, a haunted maze during their horror, Halloween Horror Nights based on my album. And then, sort of by being in the offices, was meeting, meeting people and having just meetings about stuff where I just didn't wanna leave once I got in the studio. I just loved being there, even though I had no business being there. And somehow, I remember being in, the guy at the time, his name was Kevin Misher, his office, pitching him a movie I didn't have a pitch for. I had a title, but n- nothing else. And somehow, it progressed from there. I was like, "Really?" I told them kind of a cool title with a completely half-ass idea that I was making up as I was talking to him.

    23. JR

      (laughs) What did you say? Like how, what was the conversation?

    24. RZ

      I don't even remember. I wa- it was weird. I don't even, I, I can't rem- I wish I could remember it well 'cause it, it, after the fact, I'm like, "How did this happen? I don't remember."

    25. JR

      This is like, your story is like the anti-ambition story.

    26. RZ

      (laughs)

    27. JR

      It's like the anti-preparation story.

    28. RZ

      Exactly.

    29. JR

      But super successful nonetheless. It's-

    30. RZ

      Yeah, I guess the, the goal was just be vague with people.

  9. 24:32 – 32:07

    Why Rob’s horror is about outsiders: empathy for monsters, anti-society stories, and revenge energy

    1. JR

      But what attracted you to this ultra-violent, psychopath, like, uh, outcast, murderous style of movie that you do? Because you have, like, these almost, like, mutant society, psycho murder people that people-

    2. RZ

      I don't know.

    3. JR

      But people fucking love it, man. It was-

    4. RZ

      I've always dug, like, outsider mentality. Like, anything that involved, like, out... I think it started as a kid, as a kid, 'cause like, a lot of people can relate to this. I didn't feel like I fit in. Like, I was, like, weird. I didn't fit in. I didn't get, like, what were the cool shoes to wear or the right freaking Izod shirt. I didn't understand. I wasn't trying to be... You know, no one's trying to be weird, and they're like, "Oh, yeah. I want to be weird and hide away because I'm weird." No, it's like, I don't understand. And I think when I would watch the monster movies, the monster was always that mentality. Like, King Kong's like, "Hey, man, I'm just trying to get along. Why is everyone shooting at me?"

    5. JR

      (laughs)

    6. RZ

      And Frankenstein's like, "Hey, I was just born yesterday. Why are you trying to kill me?" Like, and I think as a weird kid, you relate to the monster. So as life went on and, you know, the... I would always relate to the outsider. Then I would always relate to movies like Taxi Driver, Bonnie and Clyde, and be like-

    7. JR

      Yeah.

    8. RZ

      ... "Yeah, Travis Bickle, you know, he's, he's the fucking man." You know, and I would always be like, anything anti-society, anti-... fuck you, fuck everything that's normal.

    9. JR

      Right, like revenge.

    10. RZ

      Yeah.

    11. JR

      (coughs) Yeah.

    12. RZ

      I was just into it. And I, you know...

    13. JR

      I felt real similar when I was a kid. I was always into monster movies.

    14. RZ

      Yeah.

    15. JR

      I was always into something that just r- just tore all the normal people apart, and just ripped apart all the-

    16. RZ

      Yeah.

    17. JR

      ... preconceived notions of what everybody thought was gonna happen.

    18. RZ

      And then around the... and towards the end of high school when I discovered punk rock and you figure out there's an entire form of music where they're just like, "Go fuck yourself."

    19. JR

      Yeah.

    20. RZ

      "That's why we're here." I was like, "I'm in." (laughs)

    21. JR

      (laughs) And so many other people as well.

    22. RZ

      Yeah. And it just, like, it just... it, it flips your whole idea of what life is. And then when I moved to New York, I was like, "Wow, there's an entire city of people who don't give a fuck."

    23. JR

      (laughs)

    24. RZ

      (laughs)

    25. JR

      Yeah, that's why they come. Yeah.

    26. RZ

      Nobody gives a shit about anything here.

    27. JR

      It, it's- it's amazing how your movies resonate with people, (coughs) like to, um... like in a fanatical way. Like, the... read the comments on just the trailer for, uh, 3 From Hell, you know, just people are so fucking pumped.

    28. RZ

      Yeah. It's- it's great. And I mean, it's been a- it's been a long journey because, like, when my first movie came out, I think every review basically said something along the lines of, "Worst movie ever made. I hate this movie." And now people are, "Dude, like, that's your best movie. You know, like, you've been chasing it ever since." So it's just weird how... Same with White Zombie. When our first Geffen... I still remember this. Our first Geffen record came out. I saw the first review. It was this magazine, Alternative Press, who two years ago gave me this lifetime achievement award, and I had to read the review while I accepted the award. The review said, "This is the worst band ever."

    29. JR

      (laughs)

    30. RZ

      I was like, "Ever?" (laughs) Come on.

  10. 32:07 – 39:17

    Collecting the past: 42nd Street grindhouse, rare films, and a 20,000-movie ‘vault’

    1. RZ

      Well, I guess, since the first thing I made was that and I k-... I was into it. I mean, I liked... 'cause what happened too was when I moved to Manhattan in, like, 1982 or something, I discovered when, when New York City was all 2nd run theaters and double features, so I could finally see the laundry list of films I'd never been able to see. I remember the first time I s-... like, 8th Street Playhouse was a good example, where it's the first time I saw Texas Chainsaw Massacre was on a double bill with Jimmy Plays Berkeley, the Jimi Hendrix movie. I don't know why-

    2. JR

      Oh, wow.

    3. RZ

      ... that was the double bill, but, um-

    4. JR

      I forgot about double bills.

    5. RZ

      Yeah. And I would go see, like, "Oh my God, Ilsa She-Wolf Solveil of the SS is playing with Faster Pussycat. Oh my God, this is..." And I could... 'cause I could never see them 'cause there was no VHS yet or m-... or it was so new that those movies weren't around that I just had books and I was just staring at books 'cause back in the day, you know, (laughs) it's k-... 'cause with the, uh, this new movie 3 From Hell, you know, it's playing on about 1,000 screens, so it's not, like, everywhere, like, you can't walk two feet and it's on five screens. And people are like, "Fuck man, it's like a 15 minute drive from my house." I was like...

    6. JR

      (laughs)

    7. RZ

      I would literally drive for five hours as a kid if there was a movie I wanted to see. It didn't matter. I'd ride my... so one time I rode... before I could drive, I rode my bike for, like, three hours to see Night of the Living Dead at a midnight screening 'cause I'm like, "I'm gonna see this no matter what." 'Cause if you didn't see it, it was just gonna evaporate.

    8. JR

      That's one of the things I love about people from Canada. Canada-

    9. RZ

      (laughs)

    10. JR

      ... they, they drive everywhere. Like-

    11. RZ

      Yeah.

    12. JR

      ... I, I have friends in Alberta, they'll drive seven hours to go see something.

    13. RZ

      Yeah.

    14. JR

      'Cause y-... that's what you have to do.

    15. RZ

      Yeah, it just-

    16. JR

      You get up in the morning and that's your day, you're driving somewhere.

    17. RZ

      And that... and when I was younger, that was, like, part of the fun. I didn't care. It's like-

    18. JR

      Yeah, it's an adventure.

    19. RZ

      So the concert's 30 hours away, so?

    20. JR

      Yeah.

    21. RZ

      (laughs)

    22. JR

      Um, did you w-... study, have y-... or y-... have you watched a lot of, like, really old horror?

    23. RZ

      Yeah, I mean, I watch... sometimes I feel like I- I'm searching for things to watch because I w-... try to watch literally everything and I wanna own everything. So I have, like, a vault at home that has, you know, 20,000 movies in it.

    24. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    25. RZ

      Because I never... if somebody mentions something and I don't know what it is, I'm like, "Ah, fuck." And I, like, write it down and I immediately have to go, like, investigate it 'cause it's like-

    26. JR

      So when you say a vault, like an actual vault? Like, a bank vault?

    27. RZ

      No, no. (laughs)

    28. JR

      (laughs)

    29. RZ

      I just... (laughs) I call it a vault. It's just a room that I built that just is nothing but, like, a movie library 'cause I wanna own everything.

    30. JR

      So you have a physical copy of all these?

  11. 39:17 – 46:05

    Violence close to home: carnivals, riots, and the stories that end up on screen

    1. RZ

      Yeah, the only thing I remember, right towards my end of being there, there was the Tompkins Square, you know, downtown?

    2. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    3. RZ

      And that was where it was just like wherever homeless people lived. The, it was alphabet city. It was like the worst. Um, well h- wait, I want to back it up. When I first moved to New York, the first night I was there, this sounds like I'm making it up and I'm not. The first night I was there, the dorm that I was in with all my roommates overlooked, um, Union Square Park, which is like Needle Park. You just went there to buy dope and that was it. It was, now you go there for the, 'cause it's a farmer's market and it's beautiful. And I heard this guy screaming and screaming and screaming. I was like, "Jesus Christ, what is going on?" 'Cause it was like 100 degrees and of course there's no air conditioning. I look out the window and I watch these cops beat up this guy. And I was like, and then they drag him down to the subway. And the next day, all these cops showed up at the dorms. And it was that, it was this guy Michael Stewart. It became a really famous case. He was a, they called him a graffiti artist and he had been beat to death by the cops. And me and all my roommates saw it.

    4. JR

      Whoa.

    5. RZ

      And the next day they came and took our statement and we all had to testify in front of the grand jury. This is my first day out of Haverhill. (laughs)

    6. JR

      Wow.

    7. RZ

      We, I witnessed a murder. But again, it's like the same thing with like m- my deal at Universal. I was like too naive and weird to really comprehend what I'd seen.

    8. JR

      Were you kind of pumped? Like, "Wow, things are happening."

    9. RZ

      I just was like, I'm so jaded. It didn't disturb me or seem like... I don't know. I don't know what's wrong with me, but I am desensitized-

    10. JR

      (laughs)

    11. RZ

      ... by all the violence I've witnessed as a, as a child I guess. (laughs)

    12. JR

      Well, I g- well that wou- would you see more violence before that?

    13. RZ

      Well, there's one famous f- thing I remember as a kid besi- there's two famous things, I just thought of them. When I was a kid, the family business that my mom came from was like carnivals. Like, you ever see that movie Carney-

    14. JR

      Yeah.

    15. RZ

      ... with Gary Busey?

    16. JR

      Yeah.

    17. RZ

      That's exactly the life as a kid that I remember. When I saw the movie I was like, "This is, this is what, this was our life." We were absolutely-

    18. JR

      So that makes sense-

    19. RZ

      Yeah.

    20. JR

      ... this attraction you have to these drifters.

    21. RZ

      Yeah, it was always what I was surrounded by. So that was the thing I remember as a kid except, and r- it was around 1977 I think, 'cause I remember Kiss Love Gun had just came out 'cause I was all pumped-

    22. JR

      (singing)

    23. RZ

      (laughs) I was all pumped about it. And, uh-

    24. JR

      (singing)

    25. RZ

      And the family worked at, my mom and dad and we, me and my brother had to work and sell food and stuff and I hated... I used to, we, we used to have to dip the candy apples and hand them to people. And they've c- healed now, but I, all my ha- I had, I had burns all over my hands 'cause the apple candy would be so hot it would drip on my hand-

    26. JR

      Ugh.

    27. RZ

      ... and burn my hands. Um, anyway, I digress. But one night there was the gambling tents which were all rigged, of course, and someone had, some guy had gotten fleeced for all of his money and came back and lit the tent on fire. And then suddenly shit hit the fan. Everybody that me and my l- little brother had been around all the time, it's like foom, all these guns start coming out.

    28. JR

      Whoa.

    29. RZ

      And you start hearing guns popping off and then the tents just fooh, went, like nothing was fireproof so everything's on fire. It's complete chaos. And I was probably in fifth grade and my brother was probably in second grade. And everybody's screaming and running around and my, and, and this guy was like, that I don't remember his name but he worked there, he was like, "Hey, you guys should come over here." And before he finished his sentence, somebody ran up and hit him in the face with a hammer and broke his whole face open and it was just gushing blood and we were like, (laughs) -And then eventually my parents got us in the car and we left, which was, that was my parent... My mom was like, "We're done. This is, we're not doing this anymore." That was the last time we ever did it. Um...

    30. JR

      Wow, what a great way to go out though. (laughs)

  12. 46:05 – 58:54

    Classic horror craftsmanship: silent films, Lugosi/Karloff, and why practical effects endure

    1. JR

      (laughs) That is... So when you were saying that you collect films and you have, uh, films, did you, do you go back to like the really old ones, like Nosferatu-

    2. RZ

      Oh, yeah.

    3. JR

      ... and shit like that?

    4. RZ

      I love silent movies.

    5. JR

      Yeah.

    6. RZ

      And now they're easier to get, 'cause I always loved Lon Chaney, but so many of the films-

    7. JR

      Yes.

    8. RZ

      ... are hard to get.

    9. JR

      I was showing my kids Lon Chaney two nights ago.

    10. RZ

      What, w- what movie did they watch?

    11. JR

      Well, we, I was showing them the, um, the original Wolf Man and I was showing them Jekyll and Hyde. I was showing them some of the... Lon Chaney Jr. was in-

    12. RZ

      Well, Lon Chaney, Jr. was Wolfy-

    13. JR

      ... I think the original Wolf Man.

    14. RZ

      ... but his dad-

    15. JR

      But yeah.

    16. RZ

      ... who was in like Phantom of the Opera-

    17. JR

      Phantom of the Opera.

    18. RZ

      ... and Hunchback of Notre Dame.

    19. JR

      Wasn't he in Jekyll and Hyde as well? That was Lon Chaney, right?

    20. RZ

      It was... No.

    21. JR

      Was it-

    22. RZ

      Fredric March.

    23. JR

      Oh, was it?

    24. RZ

      Well, it depends what... There's the John Barrymore silent Jekyll and Hyde, but you probably didn't show your-

    25. JR

      Oh.

    26. RZ

      The, the Fredric March one is great. It's so perverted.

    27. JR

      Is it really?

    28. RZ

      And he's like with the prostitutes and stuff. Isn't that the one you showed your kids, like from the thir- (laughs)

    29. JR

      Oh yeah, for sure.

    30. RZ

      (laughs) From the '30s. Is that what-

  13. 58:54 – 1:08:12

    Modern filmmaking problems: CGI overuse, green-screen acting, and studio meddling (Halloween era)

    1. JR

      It's some... It's, it's cool to see, though, like, uh, uh... Those films, they did what they could do with what was available. Whereas with now, the problem with CGI is they use it.

    2. RZ

      And they overuse it.

    3. JR

      Yeah.

    4. RZ

      And I think that... I don't, I don't... I mean, CGI can be phenomenal.

    5. JR

      For sure.

    6. RZ

      But it's a tool, and it's turned into a crutch.

    7. JR

      Yeah.

    8. RZ

      And I see it with actors. Like you see actors a lot of time, and I feel bad for the actors, because you'll see the actors that you go, "I know these guys are great, but they're awful in this movie, because they didn't train to stand in a warehouse that's green and pretend to look at stuff."

    9. JR

      Yeah, right? Yeah.

    10. RZ

      So they really... Like, (laughs) like when you watch The Phantom Menace, you go, "Why does it suddenly seem like Liam Neeson can't act?"

    11. JR

      Right, right, right.

    12. RZ

      Because he's like, they're like, "Look at that dot on the wall." I mean, I c-... And you know these guys are incredible actors. I was talking to somebody once, a kid that was in my movie, who was in all the Spy Kids movies. And he said it was so hard, because they'd be on a green screen, and they'd be like, "You're looking at that... Well, we're not sure what you're looking at, but just stare at that dot and react." He's like, "Well, what is it?"

    13. JR

      (laughs)

    14. RZ

      You know? Is it a dragon or is it my mom? What am I reacting to?

    15. JR

      (laughs)

    16. RZ

      Like, we haven't figured it out yet. And he said he was always in a constant state...

    17. JR

      Oh, God.

    18. RZ

      ... of confusion as to what he was reacting to.

    19. JR

      Oh, well it's hard too when you go back and you look at some of them. Like, uh, you know what movie got it right, that sort of didn't get enough respect in its time, but in, in, in time, like as time passed, it's become more respected? Is Starship Troopers. So-

    20. RZ

      Yeah. I don't re-... I don't remember that movie that well.

    21. JR

      It's, uh, you know, it's all like-

    22. RZ

      I thought you were gonna say Forrest Gump.

    23. JR

      ... killer bugs. Oh. (laughs) Sure.

    24. RZ

      No, but I like, they're like removing Major Dan's legs.

    25. JR

      Yeah.

    26. RZ

      I mean, that's like when CG is awesome. I thought, "Oh shit, they found a guy with no legs who's a great actor." (laughs) 'Cause I didn't know which Gary Sinise was back then.

    27. JR

      How about the ping pong scene?

    28. RZ

      Yeah, right.

    29. JR

      There's a lot of CGI shit.

    30. RZ

      Stuff like that's amazing.

Episode duration: 2:06:01

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