EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,018 words- 0:00 – 0:26
Show kickoff and catching up in a post-election mood
- JRJoe Rogan
(drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.
- NANarrator
The Joe Rogan Experience. (drums playing)
Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (rock music)
- JRJoe Rogan
Nice to see you again.
- DSDave Smith
What's up, Joe? Good to be back.
- JRJoe Rogan
Good to see you my bro. Good to see you. Good to see you. What are you doing in town?
- DSDave Smith
I came in, I was, uh, doing my buddy Scott Horton's show, and uh, hanging out with him for a little bit. And uh, here.
- JRJoe Rogan
And you're looking for a place to escape.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah, exactly. (laughs)
- 0:26 – 3:15
Why politics feels unknowable: narratives, corruption, and limited expertise
- JRJoe Rogan
New York, uh, Schults told me that New York is like they just won World War III. People are dancing in the streets.
- DSDave Smith
I, I was there, um, in Union Square the other day. We did a show at The Stand, and it was the day they called it for, for Biden. And, uh, as much as I just despise Joe Biden and Kamala Harris-
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- DSDave Smith
... it was kind of nice for the city to just have one.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
Just to have a day. It's the only day that it, it's felt happy there since March.
- JRJoe Rogan
Here too. L- people are honking in the streets. I went, went to dinner with Tom Segura, he was in town, and we were driving down the streets, people were honking and cheering and people were so happy. I'm happy for people to be happy.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
I like that.
- DSDave Smith
E- even if they're happy for a stupid reason-
- JRJoe Rogan
Well-
- DSDave Smith
... you're like, "At least be happy."
- JRJoe Rogan
It's just ... It's too complicated, and you're a guy who knows a lot about politics and, and the way the world works, but it's too complicated to really go into depth about it for most people. So, so many people just have this sort of cursory understanding of politics, and then they follow a narrative. The narrative is, "Trump is bad, you get him out. Biden's good." And then you go, "Yeah, well what about the crime bill? What about the Iraq War? What about this and that and da?" And, "What about what she did?" And da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da. Nobody wants to hear it. Nobody wants to hear it.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
All they, all they want to say is that the good guys won, now we're gonna go back to being America again. (sighs)
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And then Pfizer announces a new vaccine. Ahhh.
- DSDave Smith
Well, it would be nice if we could go back to being America again.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
I think we're still far off from that happening.
- JRJoe Rogan
Totally.
- DSDave Smith
But you're, you're right that I think most people ... It, and this is ... It's not just politics, it's true with everything in life, like most people have expertise in very limited areas, um, and for everything else, you're kind of just trusting what somebody else tells you.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, it's uh ... And b- especially with politics, it's so ... I know very little about it, even though I've read a lot about it. I'm still, I'm like, "What is all this ... " You, d- y- j- you know there's some fuckery going on, and you know there's a lot of special interests and there's a lot of money and there's a lot of shenanigans, but it's like ... To really know how this stuff works, to really understand lobbyists, to really understand how bills get passed, to really understand Congress, to really understand the Senate, like w- you gotta deep dive for years.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah, and then you still don't know a lot of it. I mean, you know, y- you can go based off, say, like what's been declassified that the CIA has, has been doing.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- DSDave Smith
But what do we not know? I mean-
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow, yeah.
- DSDave Smith
... and there's, there's a whole lot that we don't know. But I think we know enough to go i- to know that it stinks.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- DSDave Smith
That there's a lot of corruption. And in many ways I think that's what Trump, at least the people who support Trump, saw him as, is the guy who was outside that system who was kind of fighting for them. Not saying that's the truth.
- 3:15 – 7:44
Conspiracies, Epstein, and the “cover” provided by real scandals
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, that was the simplistic comic book version of what Trump was to them, is like ... And that's where, like, that QAnon stuff all comes in and, you know, people thinking that it's really like this plot to stop child molesters and ...
- DSDave Smith
Yeah. Well, and t- and the, the system is always corrupt enough to give cover to the wildest conspiracy theory, because they are already ... Like y- you could say, "Okay, well, perhaps, you know, QAnon conspiracy theorists believe some really crazy shit." But then you just go, "But look at what happened with this Jeffrey Epstein guy."
- JRJoe Rogan
I know.
- DSDave Smith
I mean, there really was this child sex trafficking ring that, that was covered up. I mean, we have that woman on ABC News who was basically saying, "I broke the story and my bosses told me no."
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. I think it was NBC.
- DSDave Smith
Was it NBC?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, yeah.
- DSDave Smith
Oh, w- we broke the story but, you know, they wanted to protect, uh, access to the royal family. So we would let a powerful multimillionaire or billionaire child sex trafficking ring, uh, leader go, skate, because we wanted access to the royal family.
- JRJoe Rogan
What the fuck, dude? That, how about that video wh- where, the interview where Princess An- Prince Andrew? It's Andrew, right?
- DSDave Smith
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
Princess Andrew. Prince-
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I misgendered him, I'm so sorry. Prince Andrew was uh, on television with that lady, and they're asking him questions about whether or not he was there and what happened, and you could see this look in his face like he's never really been questioned before.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
He, he ... The fact that he agreed to do th- uh, is so weird. Like, it's almost like he doesn't understand what a trap is. "Look, I've never been trapped before."
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
"I'm a royal."
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Is he a royal anymore, or did they kick him out? Something happened?
- DSDave Smith
I, I'm not sure. I'm not sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
They can kick you out.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah, they can.
- JRJoe Rogan
They kicked out the, uh, the dude who hooked up with the actress.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah. He, he wanted to ba- ... I think he left. I think he-
- JRJoe Rogan
I think he left too, but he wanted to go back for something and they go, "Nah, son."
- DSDave Smith
(laughs) You're done.
- JRJoe Rogan
Wasn't this something recent, Jamie? Wasn't this one weird- Uh, 2020, uh- Which one's he? Harry? Yeah. 2020.
- DSDave Smith
Or is that uh-
- JRJoe Rogan
No, no.
- DSDave Smith
... Harry Potter? Am I thinking of Harry Potter?
- 7:44 – 9:46
Epstein properties, dark real-estate jokes, and the stigma of notorious locations
- JRJoe Rogan
... palanquin mansion to be demolished. Oh my God. "Local real estate developer says he's in contract to buy the waterfront estate and has planned to knock it down and build a new home." That's the smart move.
- NANarrator
$22 million house.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, shit.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, well, it's expensive down there. Meanwhile, it's gonna be underwater in, like, five years according to Al Gore. Right?
- NANarrator
But I also read he left it to a Christian group, which I was trying to find too. So it's kind of, I don't know which one of those two stories. This is in The Wall Street Journal, so I'll believe that over the, he left it to someone.
- DSDave Smith
Do you think they just have to knock it down just because it's his?
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- DSDave Smith
So they kind of have to?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
Do you think it'd be awkward if there was, like, part of it they wanted to keep?
- JRJoe Rogan
When I was looking at real estate in Boulder, the house where the little girl was killed... What is her name, the little girl who was in the, uh-
- NANarrator
JonBenét Ramsey.
- JRJoe Rogan
JonBenét Ramsey. Th- that house is, been for sale forever. They can't sell it. I think they even changed the address. They might have even changed the name of the street trying to sell it, and they just couldn't sell it. 'Cause I remember we were looking at it. We're like, "This house is nice." Like, "Why is it so cheap?" It's one of those deals. And then you find out and you're like, "Oh, fuck."
- DSDave Smith
'Cause if you can afford a nice house, you'd probably prefer not the one that a little girl was killed in.
- JRJoe Rogan
Nobody wants that house.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Nobody wants that house.
- NANarrator
They're gonna do it to the one in New York. It says it's listed at $88 million.
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm gonna buy it.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- NANarrator
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm moving to New York.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm moving to, moving the show to New York.
- DSDave Smith
All right.
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm buying it as long as it comes with a painting of Bill Clinton in the blue dress.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- NANarrator
(laughs) I've heard it's, it's set up with a lot of equipment, so we should be able to do a show out of it.
- JRJoe Rogan
Okay. Let's do it. Yeah, it streams right to the CIA.
- 9:46 – 16:25
New York governance, taxation concentration, and why lockdowns changed the value proposition
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't believe in New York City anymore. I don't. I think that de Blasio guy has ruined that place for a solid 10 years.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah. I think you're right. I think-
- JRJoe Rogan
And we got the fans on here, right? I can smoke the cigar?
- NANarrator
Uh, they were. I'll go double-check.
- JRJoe Rogan
Okay.
- NANarrator
Yeah, here it... It says it's for sale right now, "gargantuan New York City mansion."
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm.
- NANarrator
"Home to Epstein horrors."
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, you could rent it.
- DSDave Smith
That's...
- JRJoe Rogan
$30,000 a month.
- NANarrator
Yeah, bam.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's what we need to do. We need to just rent it.
- DSDave Smith
Go-
- NANarrator
Could do a month of podcast there.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know what we should do? We should fill it up with homeless people.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs) Then leave.
- JRJoe Rogan
Just rent it and just let it, let homeless people live there.
- NANarrator
Oh, yeah. Sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
Just tell e- tell them we want one room to do the podcast-
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
... and then we'll have security that makes sure the homeless people don't go in th- that room. Everything else, you do whatever you want.
- DSDave Smith
That... Now, that actually sounds like a Bill de Blasio plan that you're putting into effect.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, it's-
- DSDave Smith
That's more or less what he's been doing.
- JRJoe Rogan
... it's progressive.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's progressive.
- 16:25 – 22:51
Lockdown tradeoffs and the new taboo: shutting down debate
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, it's really important to have lively debate on these things. And one of the things that's going on now is people are trying to shut down debate. They want you to agree with their side, and this is something that social media has really reinforced, right? Like, uh, social media echo chambers. They want you to be on their side, and if you're not on their side, they just hit you with a bunch of bullshit about-
- DSDave Smith
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
... why you shouldn't and why you're on the wrong side of history and why you're a bad person and... We were talking before the podcast about lists that people are making, about people who supported Donald Trump or people who voted for Donald Trump or people who worked in the administration. They're making these lists and, uh, like, literally blacklists. Like, they have no irony about suggesting these blacklists.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, do you... You're, you're going to Soviet Russia type shit. Like, y- this is-
- DSDave Smith
Right. And, and meanwhile, Joe Biden is saying in his acceptance speech, uh, that, you know, "Well, now's the time to bring everybody together."
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
You know, like, "We all need to be one," yada yada, which is kind of a nice thought, um, but it's, it's a little hard to take seriously when all of these people in your party and who, who have been, you know, supporting you, uh, have been calling, uh, everybody else on the other side, you know, white supremacists-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
... Nazis for, for the last four years. So now that you're claiming you won, say, "Hey, we all have to come together." Meanwhile, other members of your party are saying, "We gotta create lists-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
... of people." So, like, this-
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, AOC said it.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
You know, a pretty, uh, influential member-
- JRJoe Rogan
Very.
- DSDave Smith
... of, of the Democrats.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
Which, you know, she's made herself, like, huge. Um...
- JRJoe Rogan
She gonna be president.
- DSDave Smith
I don't know about that.
- JRJoe Rogan
She could do it.
- DSDave Smith
She's not very popular outside of her district.
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't know about that. I think with young people, she represents, like, uh, this, uh, this idea that someone like her, young, hardworking, out there hustling, seriously progressive values, that you can get pretty far and certainly in the public eye.
- DSDave Smith
Well, you certainly can do what she's doing. I mean, she's proved that. Like, you could go to a very blue district and, and, uh, primary one of the most establishment Democrats and, and rise to national prominence. So, so she did that. I don't know, right now in the country, I think AOC would have a really tough time getting elected, uh, on a national level. But-
- JRJoe Rogan
Maybe.
- DSDave Smith
... who knows? Maybe it's just the future.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, she's only 30.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah, it's insane.
- 22:51 – 32:14
Understanding Trump’s appeal: culture war backlash and economic abandonment
- DSDave Smith
-you don't want that. So, the idea of toning that down is, is a good idea, but I think the only way to do that is to understand why Donald Trump was president to begin with. And that, like ... To me, the big story of all of this isn't that Joe Biden looks like he's gonna be the president. That's kinda boring to me. It's like, yeah, Joe, uh, Joe Biden got elected. He's been getting elected for fucking almost 50 years. Like, what? Uh, uh, okay. The story is still that Donald Trump won the presidency and then it ... Four years later, got, like, millions more votes than he got the first time, and almost, by the, by, by a hair, almost won it again.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh.
- DSDave Smith
I mean, that's, like, pretty fucking crazy. Did you see, uh, when he was in Pennsylvania, and he drew 53,000 people to his rally in Central Pennsylvania?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
And their start off ... The first, like, four minutes of it are a chant, "We love you. We love you." I mean, like, what the fuck is that?
- JRJoe Rogan
(sighs)
- DSDave Smith
What's going on here? And to just kind of dismiss it, like, the corporate press attitude is like, "Well, it's racism." I think it's-
- JRJoe Rogan
I think it's-
- DSDave Smith
-I think there's a little bit more.
- JRJoe Rogan
-Failure of the education system.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- DSDave Smith
I mean, I-
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't-
- DSDave Smith
-I always, I always agree with failure (book slaps) of the education system. That is always an acceptable answer. But I think a big part of it-
- JRJoe Rogan
It's rejection of looting. It's a rejection of the woke culture. It's a rejection of being called a racist and being called a, a fascist.
- DSDave Smith
That's a big part of it.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's, it's a lot of the what ... This, this-... call for a radical shift in the identity of America.
- DSDave Smith
Well, that, I think that's a huge part of it. I also think that if you're ... It, the, the woke lecturing is almost like just the insult on top. Like, if you're one of these people who, who lives in these towns, uh, you- you've seen for, for decades now, like, factories disappear, jobs get outsourced, the- the- the life expectancy has gone down, suicides have gone up. You know, you're one of these, the- the ... Some guy in central Pennsylvania, or, or all over the country, and what ... You know, you probably lost your job. Now you're working a shittier job. Uh, you never really came back from where you were after 2008. Uh, you, maybe you got a son who's addicted to opioids. You got another son who like, you know, has never been the same since he got back from one of these stupid wars. Um, and then after all that, the people who sent you there are now lecturing you about your white privilege. And then Donald Trump, all it really took was Donald Trump came in and said, "You know what? I'm for you."
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
"I'm for you. I'm not for the Mexicans or the Muslims. I'm not for this woke sh- I'm for you, and I want you to win." And that's, like, and- and they-
- JRJoe Rogan
It's a s- like a simplistic message.
- DSDave Smith
Sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's one of the things that he got across.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
He, he boiled down the whole thing to, like, make America great again. Like, that's a simplistic message, and to people that wanna sorta, like, they really ... You know some, some country music songs? I- I ... By the way, I'm a fan of country music. I like a lot of country music. But a lot of country music I don't like, because I know what you're doing. You're just trying to box everything into this real simple-
- DSDave Smith
(laughs) Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
"We're gonna go down to the lake. We're gonna have ourselves a drink."
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, like, you know what I'm saying? "We're gonna ... Take my truck."
- 32:14 – 38:11
Media credibility crisis: anonymous sourcing, activist journalism, and narrative building
- JRJoe Rogan
That's not the same thing. Yeah. That's not the same thing. He's just ta- telling the truth. Yeah. See, that's the other thing too. This, uh, this quote that they keep is sta- they keep reiterating this thing. "He had disparaged American troops who died in wars as losers and suckers." Is there... They, but they're saying this in quotes.
- DSDave Smith
Yes, because-
- JRJoe Rogan
How is-
- DSDave Smith
... it was quoted by some anonymous source who claims that he said that.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. But that is... How do you do that? Multiple sources. See, but you can say that. You can say multiple sources. But unless the people go on record, it seems like a very disingenuous thing to say.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah. Well, did you see the one... the guy who was, uh, uh-
- JRJoe Rogan
Wait, isn't that... Am I wrong about that?
- DSDave Smith
Oh, no, you're absolutely right. Did you see the guy who revealed his identity? Who was the guy who was behind that New York Times story?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Anonymous.
- DSDave Smith
And they said high-level... Yeah. Anonymous.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
They said high-level executive. And then there were all these people in the media speculating and they were like, "Well, the New York Times wouldn't do this unless this was a really high-level person." It was basically like wink, wink, this might be Pence, this might be, you know, Jared Kushner. This could be anybody saying this shit. And then it turns out it's like, oh, this was like some guy who was once a chief of staff at the Department of Homeland Security. Now, I'm not saying that's nothing, but it's not at all what you were kind of making people think, so... I think it's a very shady way to do journalism.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
And that's one of the things that I think is like one of the bright spots of the Trump administration. One of the best things that he was able to draw out was how agenda-driven the corporate press is. And you can agree with their agenda on hating Donald Trump, maybe that's how you feel, but it's still something to... Everybody knows now that they are agenda-driven. They're not here like, "We just give you the information."
- JRJoe Rogan
They're activists.
- DSDave Smith
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
That, that's the rise of the activist journalist is, uh... I understand from their perspective that they feel like they have this platform to do a good thing. But I feel like you do the best thing by telling the cold hard facts and letting people who are actually advocates, or, uh, actually advocates, uh, uh, activists rather, do the, the activist work with those cold hard facts.
- DSDave Smith
I, I have no problem with that.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
If you want to be an activist, go be an activist.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. But I think the honest-
- DSDave Smith
But just be honest.
- JRJoe Rogan
As a journalist though, I think it's very... you're r- it's real slippery when you do things like that. Like, like the, those quotes, "losers" and "suckers." Unless you know who said it, unless they're willing to go on record and say, "I heard him say it," then you don't necessarily have a story.
- DSDave Smith
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's not the same. And w- how did he say it? What did-
- DSDave Smith
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
What were the... what was the-
- DSDave Smith
And particularly if he denies it.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
So if, you know, like if I were to just say, "Oh, Joe told me this thing-"
- 38:11 – 45:40
Hunter Biden laptop and platform censorship: what gets suppressed and why
- DSDave Smith
Well, kind of. I mean, it starts with that. And then they'll use that as an example, but then usually they also go to other things, like, "Look, this, uh, this, this New York Post story about Hunter Biden's laptop was called fake news from the day it came out, to the point that not only would all of the corporate press not report on it, but that social media companies were banning the link and Twitter froze the New York Post's Twitter account."
- JRJoe Rogan
One of the CNN journalist on Twitter called it Russian disinformation.
- DSDave Smith
Yes. There's a bunch of people called it Russian disinformation.
- JRJoe Rogan
But I wonder if it was Russian disinformation that the, the photo of the girl giving him a foot job-
- DSDave Smith
Yes. Russia-
- JRJoe Rogan
Was that Russian?
- DSDave Smith
That was all ... She was Russian and the foot was Russian.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- DSDave Smith
It was a Russian foot job.
- NANarrator
Wh- d- what happened to that? I kinda lost track of what was happening with the laptop, but they've like have, have they shared information of it? Or-
- JRJoe Rogan
Rudy Giuliani sold it on eBay.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- NANarrator
Is that what's going on at the landscaping thing?
- DSDave Smith
Made a killing. (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't know. (laughs)
- NANarrator
At the Four Seasons landscaping?
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't know. This, this is the thing-
- DSDave Smith
Well-
- JRJoe Rogan
... that's going on. There's almost like too much information is coming at us.
- DSDave Smith
Well, look, r- the ... It's basically been verified that this was Hunter Biden's laptop. I mean, with- within any reasonable standard for, for a journalist to verify something, I mean, number one, the Bidens didn't deny it. Like nobody actually came out and denied that this was ... They had a signature at the repair shop, which they matched up to his signature. They've had other people on the email chains confirm that they were, these were emails between them and Hunter Biden. So it's been pretty reasonably kind of verified that this was Hunter Biden. Now, I don't know about the crazier accusations that were made there. I mean, Rudy Giuliani said that there were pictures of underage girls and stuff like that. I don't know if that's true or not. But Rudy Giuliani did turn it over to the Delaware police. That is true because the Delaware, a spokesman for the attorney general said that they received the laptop and that they sent it to the FBI. Now, I don't know why they would, he would turn this over claiming this stuff was on there and then they would send this to the FBI if there wasn't something, but I don't know. I don't kn- ... But what you do know, right, is that this was a story where they had these emails about Hunter Biden, who is very clearly a swamp creature, who was selling his father's name to rake in money from foreign companies. Now truth be told, that's a kind of run-of-the-mill scandal as far as politics go.
- JRJoe Rogan
Normal.
- DSDave Smith
It's normal. E- every senator's kid, family, wife, they all do stuff like this all the time. It's a corrupt swamp, you know? But it's a story, nonetheless. It may not be the ... But to s- but to just make the conscious decision that we are a few weeks out from a presidential election, this can harm Biden, and therefore we're not mentioning it, we're not covering it, we're not trying to debunk this to a bunch of people, we are trying to make sure people never get their eyes on this.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, I think they felt-
- DSDave Smith
That's creepy.
- JRJoe Rogan
... the heat ... They felt the heat from 2016, from the Hillary Clinton email debate, you know-
- DSDave Smith
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
... whether or not she should have deleted those emails, and the, the fact that Comey then opens up the investigation again in the middle of the campaign. And that was basically what a lot ... Even though she won the popular vote, uh, a lot of people felt like that was, that was a bad move.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And so this year they said, "We're gonna do everything we can to get rid of Donald Trump." Again, they become activists instead of just journalists.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah. That's-
- 45:40 – 1:01:32
Election integrity, voter fraud claims, and why democracy feels structurally unstable
- DSDave Smith
Oh, sure. That he'd planned to sell 50 advanced F-35 fighters to the United Arab Emirates as a part of a broader arms deal worth more than 23 billion. That's the weird thing about someone on the way out. They can do so much. Well, I don't know that he's on the way out (laughs) . I mean, he's-
- NANarrator
You don't think he's on the way out?
- DSDave Smith
Well, yeah. He's o- he's almost certainly on the way out.
- NANarrator
Do you know-
- DSDave Smith
But he's gonna fight it.
- NANarrator
Yeah, but do you know how insanely difficult it is to prove, first of all, to prove that there's voter fraud, and then to prove there's enough voter fraud where they could overturn it?
- DSDave Smith
It's, uh, it's incredibly difficult. And it's not just that he would have to do that. He'd have to do that in a few different states.
- NANarrator
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
And so, it's an incredibly difficult task. Uh, but it's pretty interesting. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before where you have one president just saying like, "No, this was bullshit."
- NANarrator
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
"And I'm gonna fight it legally." And another thing that I thought was really weird, uh, from the press is that they... So, they're, I saw it twice now, um, was on MSNBC and CNN where he was giving a press conference tell- saying how the votes were stolen from him and the system was unfair.
- NANarrator
Mm-hmm.
- DSDave Smith
And they cut away. They say, "We will not show this, because he's lying." And then just the other day on Fox News, Neil Cavuto cut away from, uh, Trump's press secretary saying there was voter fraud and he goes, "Well, you know, we can't verify that, so we can't air this." I don't under- And it's like, look, man. Whatever you want to say, this is a story.
- NANarrator
Right.
- DSDave Smith
The fact that the president is claiming voter fraud is a story. So, air this and then debunk it afterward. But what is this thing where you go, "No, we won't show people."
- NANarrator
Right.
- DSDave Smith
"You can't see this story."
- NANarrator
Well-
- DSDave Smith
'Cause the lies could poison you or something. I, I-
- NANarrator
What if it's proven to be true? What if there is voter fraud?
- DSDave Smith
Well, there is. It's a question of how widespread it is, 'cause there's always voter fraud. Which is another secret that they don't fucking like to tell. But there's always fucking some degree of voter fraud.
- NANarrator
Do, do you find it odd that everybody insist that it's impossible to vote like safely and accurately online?
- DSDave Smith
Uh, yes, I find that odd. I also find it really, really odd that we, um, overhauled the way we do voting in this country.
- NANarrator
Mm-hmm.
- DSDave Smith
And that now it's almost an entirely different process where both candidates are getting way more votes than they would normally get. And i- it's just very weird.
- NANarrator
Right.
- DSDave Smith
There were a lot of things that were weird about this election, like the actual logistics of it.
- NANarrator
Doesn't it seem like if we can bank online, we should be able to vote online? And doesn't it seem like if you could use like Apple Pay or Samsung Pay or something like that and go buy something, you know, you use your fingerprint.
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
- NANarrator
And it registers your fingerprint and then you could, you could buy a house.
- 1:01:32 – 1:05:09
War, Bernie Sanders’ best issues, and the Yemen humanitarian catastrophe
- DSDave Smith
Well, okay, what I love about Bernie Sanders is that he voted against the war in Iraq, as I just said. He was great in the Senate about the war in Yemen and trying to bring that to an end, which is just this godawful nightmare that's still going on, that Obama started and, and Trump continued. I, I mean, what's happening in Yemen is like one of the biggest tragedies in, in my lifetime.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, explain it to people.
- DSDave Smith
So Yemen is a ... I mean, Yemen is the poorest country in the Middle East, uh, which is saying something. You know, they were already the poorest country in the Middle East before any of this happened, and the Saudis basically went to war with, with the Houthis in Yemen, um, and America backed the Saudis, uh, under Barack Obama. Uh, what b- Obama administration said to placate the Saudis. Uh, basically they ... The Saudis were pissed off about a lot of things, um, and they're a big business partner with us. And so they were pissed off about the war in Iraq. The Saudis didn't want the war in Iraq. They kind of foresaw what would happen, that it would give Iran control of the region and it would be a, a nightmare, but the Cheneyites really wanted the war in Iraq, Israel really wanted the war in Iraq and the Neocons won and they got the war. And so they were already pissed off about that, and then they were really pissed off that, uh, Obama made the Iran deal with Iran. And so to a ... To placate, which I believe was the direct quote, to placate the Saudis, um, Obama decided to back them in this war against Yemen and they put a full blockade around the country, which was already the poorest country in, in the Middle East, and this led to just disa- ... I mean, the UN said it was the worst humanitarian crisis in the world. Uh, this was before COVID, but I, I think it's still probably up there. Uh, there were, there were well over a million cases of cholera, which is basically, I mean, curable with, I think, liquids. Like I think Gatorade could solve cholera. I don't know. You might need antibiotics or something like that. But it was children and old people just dying in massive numbers. I still don't think they know the exact numbers. It's gonna be somewhere on the scale of what the war in Iraq was, hundreds of thousands of people dead. And Bernie Sanders really led the effort to try to end it in the Senate and he did a great job on that. Like, phenomenal. Um, he also has a great... He had a great, uh, bill proposed to, uh, decriminalize marijuana on a federal level, um, which I th- think would be phenomenal. Um, and so there were, there were several thing ... Like those would probably be the ones I'd pick that I thought were really great about Bernie Sanders. So I think running on issue ... My ... Probably one of my big criticisms of him is that he doesn't (laughs) he doesn't really lead with those issues. Like he didn't ... Those aren't the things he talked about a lot on the campaign trail but he was excellent on all of those. Um, so I think you could run ... He could run on his principles, you know? But I think you have to, at some point, have a little bit of a killer instinct to, to become the alpha monkey, to become the leader of this country, and I thought that Bernie Sanders could have won the whole election with the tone that he started-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- DSDave Smith
... in the primary and he didn't. And I think that Bernie Sanders ... Like, look, the, the corporate press completely came down to try to ruin it for him. Who knows what the DNC did this time? I mean, it was exposed in 2016. Who knows what they were doing behind the scenes? But-
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, we know what they were doing. We know that that was the reason why Klobuchar and Buttigieg dropped out.
- DSDave Smith
Well that we know, yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
We know that Warren stayed in to siphon votes off of Bernie.
- DSDave Smith
No question.
- JRJoe Rogan
And we know they gave their delegates over to Biden.
- DSDave Smith
No question, we know that much. We know that right ... Now, we don't know exactly who made the phone calls. I think there was reporting that Barack Obama had called a couple of them to like get them-
- JRJoe Rogan
That sounds good.
- DSDave Smith
That ... Yeah (laughs) it sure does. Uh, but so that ... But you're right, so all the competition with Biden drops out right before Super Tuesday, Bernie Sanders competition Elizabeth Warren stays in til the bitter end for-
- 1:05:09 – 1:19:25
Student debt, the higher-ed “guaranteed loan” machine, and ideological capture on campus
- JRJoe Rogan
I think it felt like with Bernie, even though th- th- there's talk that they couldn't control him, right? There's also talk that he couldn't win 'cause there were certain key states that he's never gonna win because even though that message resonated with a lot of people, including me, what resonated with me is first of all absolving peop- people of student debt. I know a lot of people that are wrapped up in student debt and I think it's one of the best examples of ... First of all, you have, uh, essentially children, right? You have someone who's 17, 18 years old, they're going into school and they're taking on enormous debt and they don't ... I- I think you could make the real argument that they don't have the intellectual capacity to understand the ramifications of this. Maybe some do, maybe some don't, but when you're talking about people that are in debt hundreds of thousands of dollars by the time they get outta school and then they get outta school and they get a job that pays 40 grand a year, do the math, how long before you catch up? You never catch up. There's people to this day that are getting Social Security, that are getting their Social Security docked because they owe money for student loans. I mean, you're at the end of the fucking game.
- DSDave Smith
Is that tr- ... Are people-
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh yeah.
- DSDave Smith
... they're old enough for Social Security-
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh yeah.
- DSDave Smith
... and they have student loan debts like that?
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh yeah.
- DSDave Smith
Wow.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh yeah, that's going on right now. Make sure that's true, Jamie.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm pretty sure. Sounds really good what I'm saying.
- DSDave Smith
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Pretty sure it's true. Um-
- DSDave Smith
Well that is ... And, and they are victims-
- JRJoe Rogan
But, but-
- DSDave Smith
... of a corrupt scheme, for sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yes. It's a ... Well, it's a bad system and I think if we have all this money to go to Afghanistan and, and put on these endless wars, y- the idea that we don't have enough money to provide a reasonably priced education. I'm not saying it should be free. Maybe it should cost a little bit because I think people work harder when they have to work for something, but the idea that you should be hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt by the time you get out and, and the reality of the economy is that even before COVID, if you got out, the odds of you getting a job that's like gonna be able to even put a dent in that debt in your chosen field, they're not that good.
- DSDave Smith
Oh yeah. Oh no-
- JRJoe Rogan
So that's-
- DSDave Smith
... no question about all of that.
- JRJoe Rogan
Here it is. 19% of their Social Security payments can be garnished to repay a student loan debt.Your monthly benefit cannot sink below seven hun- Well...
- DSDave Smith
Okay.
- JRJoe Rogan
Good luck living on 750 bucks a month.
- DSDave Smith
And this is also for people who are, what, like, 35 now when they retire?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- DSDave Smith
Like, what's that gonna be worth?
- JRJoe Rogan
So, I mean, th- that's not that long ago, man. If you think about someone who's 65, right? So once, once... No, look at this.
- DSDave Smith
Hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
"Are student loans forgiven after 65?" "There are no student loan forgiveness programs specifically for senior citizens. Elderly student loan borrowers are eligible for the same loan forgiveness programs as other borrowers." Well, that's crazy. It's crazy. It's crazy. If you're that old-
- DSDave Smith
Yeah.
Episode duration: 3:08:16
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Transcript of episode 5PrLGhJnO7I
