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The Joe Rogan ExperienceThe Joe Rogan Experience

Joe Rogan Experience #1571 - Emily Harrington

Rock climber and adventurer Emily Harrington is a five-time US National Champion in Sport Climbing. She has scaled some of the world's most formidable mountains, including Everest, Ama Dablam, and Cho Oyu, and is the first woman to free climb El Capitan via Golden Gate in under 24 hours. @DangerStikTV

Joe RoganhostEmily Harringtonguest
Nov 27, 20202h 11mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

  1. 0:02 – 0:55

    Meeting Emily Harrington: “Normal people” who do extreme climbs

    1. NA

      (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. (rock music)

    2. JR

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (rock music) Hello, Emily.

    3. EH

      Hi.

    4. JR

      What's happening?

    5. EH

      Not much.

    6. JR

      You seem very normal. And that's-

    7. EH

      (laughs)

    8. JR

      ... what always stuns me about people who do insane things. Like, they're just r- like, Alex Honnold, I've met him a few times, had him on the show a couple times. Super normal guy, but does what you do.

    9. EH

      Yeah. I would argue Alex isn't as normal as me. (laughs)

    10. JR

      Oh, really? How so? (laughs)

    11. EH

      I don't know. You, you met him. (laughs)

    12. JR

      I think he's normal. Like-

    13. EH

      He's pretty normal. He does-

    14. JR

      He's very mellow.

    15. EH

      He... What he does is exponentially more, um, (clicks tongue) dangerous than what I do, I would argue.

    16. JR

      Because there's no ropes at all.

    17. EH

      He doesn't use ropes. I do use ropes.

    18. JR

      Yeah.

    19. EH

      Yes. (laughs)

    20. JR

      It's, it's... Listen, it's dangerous. What you do is dangerous. W-

    21. EH

      We'll get there.

    22. JR

      Yeah.

    23. EH

      (laughs)

  2. 0:55 – 3:13

    What Emily did on El Cap: free climbing Golden Gate in under 24 hours

    1. JR

      Um, tell people what you did 'cause it's pretty crazy.

    2. EH

      Um, so I did what's called free climbing. I free climbed a route on El Capitan, which is a 3,200-foot cliff in Yosemite National Park, and I did it in under 24 hours.

    3. JR

      That is a long way to go.

    4. EH

      Yeah.

    5. JR

      Three thousand two hundred and-

    6. EH

      It's something. 3,200 feet is what I say. I think it might just be, like, a little more than that. (laughs)

    7. JR

      When you're halfway there, Emily Harrington becomes the first woman to scale El Capitan via its notoriously difficult Golden Gate route. Why is that route more difficult?

    8. EH

      Well, okay, so-

    9. JR

      Is it route or root?

    10. EH

      I don't think it really matters. I say root.

    11. JR

      It's a route. Yeah, it's a-

    12. EH

      Yeah. Um, so essentially, El Cap is this giant cliff face and there's, there's hundreds of routes up El Cap, different, like, pathways you can take. Um, and right now, there's currently only, like, 15 ways to get up it via free climbing. Free climbing being using only your hands and feet, uh, to ascend, and a rope in case you fall. Um, and I chose the route called Golden Gate, which is more difficult than the route Free Rider, which people are very familiar with, because that's the route that Alex Honnold free soloed, meaning he climbed it without a rope.

    13. JR

      Yeah, that seems insane. So you're less insane than him?

    14. EH

      Oh, yeah.

    15. JR

      (laughs)

    16. EH

      Definitely less insane than him. Alex is a dear friend of mine, but there are some things I don't understand about him. (laughs)

    17. JR

      Yeah, I don't know if he understands tho- those things about him.

    18. EH

      No. I mean, I have an enormous amount of respect for him, but, um, what he does is, is truly remarkable.

    19. JR

      Mm. Um, you bonked your head while you were doing it too, huh? I can see the, the mark-

    20. EH

      Yeah, you can see the scar.

    21. JR

      ... on your forehead.

    22. EH

      Um, I... That... Yeah, and that's actually the second time I hit my head, uh, trying to (laughs) , trying to do this. Uh, last year, I had a really bad fall, um, wound up in the hospital. Full concussion, the whole thing. This time, it was slightly less, uh, less serious, but maybe more dramatic 'cause it, it happened, like, way higher up on the wall.

    23. JR

      Oof. How high were you up?

    24. EH

      Um, 2,800 feet, I'd say. Like, almost to the top. It was a, it was a whole-

    25. JR

      (exhales)

    26. EH

      It was very dramatic. Um-

    27. JR

      What happened?

  3. 3:13 – 7:04

    Living on the wall: multi-day El Cap logistics, portaledges, and WAG bags

    1. EH

      I... So the day was actually going really well. Um, I've been trying to do this for a few years now. Probab- I would say three years I've been working towards this goal. Um, and I'd actually done the route in 2015 over the course of six days, and I really wanted to, like, do the same route in 24 hours. Um-

    2. JR

      But can I stop you there?

    3. EH

      Yeah.

    4. JR

      When you do it over six days, do you sleep on the route?

    5. EH

      Yeah, yeah. That's how most people climb El Cap. They sleep on the wall. It takes, like, five to seven days or so.

    6. JR

      That seems more sketchy. (laughs)

    7. EH

      It's-

    8. NA

      (laughs)

    9. JR

      (laughs)

    10. EH

      ... it's, it's different because there's a lot more logistics involved, right? Like, imagine you have to, like, live in the vertical world for days on end. So you think about everything you do, like, from when you wake up to when you go to bed.

    11. JR

      Including pooing?

    12. EH

      Oh, yeah.

    13. JR

      You have to poo vertically?

    14. EH

      Yeah. We use, like, we use WAG bags or, like, you know, little, like, plastic bags and you, like, go in that bag, and then you put it in another bag and-

    15. JR

      And then carry it with you?

    16. EH

      ... ziplock it shut.

    17. JR

      So you carry your poo for several days?

    18. EH

      Yeah, you put it in another bag, you put it in another bag and then you, like, hang it below everything and you take it up with you.

    19. JR

      Oh.

    20. EH

      And then you, like, you take it... Yeah, you don't leave it, obviously.

    21. JR

      Oh, no, I would imagine.

    22. EH

      (laughs)

    23. JR

      Stuff it in the crack up there. Is that someone pooing?

    24. EH

      Yeah, there you go. Um, no, that's just someone hanging out.

    25. JR

      Oh.

    26. EH

      That's, like, how you do it when you live on the wall.

    27. JR

      Okay.

    28. EH

      So you have that ledge. Um-

    29. JR

      Like the Michael Jackson song.

    30. EH

      What?

  4. 7:04 – 9:10

    Risk, fame, and why climbers aren’t chasing adrenaline

    1. JR

      Is there a danger in the climbing world, or not a danger, a concern, I should say, of people who are seeing people like Alex Honnold and yourself become famous and get all this attention from these very dangerous climbs, and they want to perhaps accelerate their progress and, and jump right in and try to do some really risky things?

    2. EH

      (sighs) I mean, I could see that being a danger, um, especially with, like, what Alex does, climb without a rope. I would still argue that what I do is a relatively safe form of climbing.

    3. JR

      (laughs)

    4. EH

      I climb with a rope. When I fall-

    5. JR

      But it's not.

    6. EH

      ... the rope catches me. It's super safe.

    7. JR

      Oh my God.

    8. EH

      When I fall, the rope catches me. Um, free climbing El Cap in a day, what, what I just did, I definitely cut some corners and, um, took more risk, but that's an achievement that not many people have done or really strive to do. Um, and so I think, I think for the most part, climbing is actually a very controlled, very safe activity, and you can make it as dangerous as you want it to be. Does that make sense?

    9. JR

      Yes. I understand what you're saying. Um, so if you're a person like Alex that's deciding, you know, he's, he maps these routes, he does them with ropes, and then he's like, "I can do this."

    10. EH

      Yes. And Alex, Alex is so unique in a way. And I think anyone that watches the movie Freestyle or anyone that talks to Alex understands that what he does is he... it's so well thought out and it's so well planned. And every single decision he makes is very calculated. And I, I think that that's just h- And I think that that's a testament to, to what climbing is truly about. Like, we're not, like, we're not out to go feel an adrenaline rush when we go climbing. Like, if you're feeling adrenaline, it essentially means, like, you messed up.

    11. JR

      Yeah.

    12. EH

      Like, something's wrong. Um, and climbing is very much more about, like, the movement and the challenge and the mental challenge of all of it than, than going out and, like, trying to get a thrill.

  5. 9:10 – 12:56

    How Emily started: Boulder childhood, competitiveness, and instant “this is it” feeling

    1. JR

      How did you get involved in this?

    2. EH

      I started climbing when I was 10 years old. Um, I was at... I grew up in Boulder, Colorado, and my parents used to take me to the Boulder Reservoir, this lake, me and my cousins.

    3. JR

      Do you have a Subaru?

    4. EH

      Uh, I did have a Subaru. (laughs)

    5. JR

      Everyone in Boulder has a Subaru. (laughs)

    6. EH

      I got a Subaru for my 16th birthday.

    7. JR

      Uh, that's like 70% of the cars out there.

    8. EH

      An Outback. It's true. Yeah, green Subaru.

    9. JR

      Because they're so practical. They work-

    10. EH

      Yeah.

    11. JR

      ... in the snow.

    12. EH

      Yeah, I had it for years. Um, (laughs) so anyway, uh, my parents took me to the lake and they had this little festival there. And I grew up... I'm an only child, I grew up with my two cousins who were boys, and we were just like super competitive with each other all the time. Like, all I wanted to do was be better than them at, like, literally anything. It didn't matter what it was. Um, so we were at this lake and they had a little festival with one of those tower, rock towers. You know, the ones that you, they let the kids climb on. And, uh, we all tried to climb the wall and I just remember it was like, "Well, I have to go to the top because they went to the top." And, you know, there's like no other option. Um, but the interesting thing that happened when I was climbing was, it was just this feeling of like, "Oh, I... This is what I'm, this is what I'm meant to do." Like, it was like I b- I just felt like I belonged up there. And I remember the feeling so vividly even now, 23 years later. Um, I was like, I was scared, but I kind of liked it. And I just really... I got down and I was like, "Dad, I want to go climbing." Like, "That, that's what I want to do. I want to quit everything else." I was a gymnast, I played soccer, I was a ski racer. I was like, "I don't want to do, I don't want to do any of that anymore. I just want to climb."

    13. JR

      Why? What, what, what about climbing, like, canceled all those other things out in your interests?

    14. EH

      I think, I think part of it was because I was, I was good at it and I, like, kind of knew that I was good at it. Um, like, I could feel... Like, I felt... I was strong from gymnastics, I had a lot of body awareness. Like, it just felt like something that I could be good at. And I really enjoyed just the, like, feeling of being up high, the feeling of the exposure. And I really enjoy, enjoyed the process of, like, solving it. Like, I loved that cerebral, like, "How, how am I gonna get to the top? Like, how am I gonna solve this puzzle?"

    15. JR

      So what was the course of progression? You started out... Did you start out just climbing small things with friends? And then did you eventually get a coach? Like, how did you get into, like, serious hardcore climbing?

    16. EH

      I was among the first generation of kids climbers who started out in a climbing gym, so, like, in an artificial setting.

    17. JR

      Oh.

    18. EH

      Like, a lot of people before me started, you know, in Yosemite-

    19. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    20. EH

      ... uh, out- outdoors, like in the mountains. But I, I grew up, like, in the '90s, and that was sort of, like, the beginning of climbing gyms. And so I, I started in a gym on plastic. And my dad took me to the local, the local climbing gym in Boulder. It's called the Boulder Rock Club. And he enrolled me in, like, a kid's class. And they sort of noticed a little bit of talent, I think, in me, and they invited me to join their junior climbing team. Like, there's junior climbing teams. Now every gym in the country has a junior climbing team.

    21. JR

      Is there a benefit to learning on plastic first?

    22. EH

      I, I mean, I think access, for one. Like, if you, if you live in a place where there's no rocks, um, it's pretty easy to go, still go climbing. You could go to the gym. Um, that said, it's very much become its own discipline, gym climbing. Um, and I use gym climbing still for training. Like, I think it makes you strong. It's a really easy, it's a easy way to get a workout in. Like, the, the body awareness factor. You can kinda, like, distill down all the, like, the movements and in a really controlled setting. It's also super safe.

  6. 12:56 – 26:51

    From gym kid to serious climber: training on plastic, teams, and early development

    1. JR

      When, when you say training, so like if you're gonna practice for a big climb, something like you just did, do, do you have like a training schedule? Like, do you try to peak like an athlete would for the Olympics or for s- some other kind of event? Like, how do you, how do you train?

    2. EH

      Yeah. I do. I do try to train so that I am peaking at a certain time. I'm ... It's a little bit experimental though, honestly. I've, I've been working towards this goal in particular for, for many years, really experimenting with how, how to train for it because it does require such a, a variety of skills. Like, you need the strength and endurance of, of technic-, like of a technical rock climber in order to like climb the pitches cleanly. But you also need logistical support. So it has to be like the right time of year. You need the right partner. You need the good weather. And then you need like the stamina to be climbing for 21 hours. Um, and so a lot of it, a lot of it was just trial and error for me. But I did spend a lot of time in the gym, training on plastic, and then I would supplement that with like really long trail runs and big days in the eastern Sierra, like climbing bigger routes. Um, and then also there's a mental component. So I had to sort of get my head back, especially after my accident last year. I had to get my head back in the game and, um, you know, feel comfortable leading on runout terrain with big fall potential again. So there was just like a lot. Um, and I did, I think this year in particular because of, of COVID, I was actually able to focus a lot more. Like, I think that was sort of the key for me. I stopped traveling. I was at home. I had like a routine. Um, I had like a good sleep schedule going on. I had like my days that I was training and I was able to like have a, a really good routine, and then when the season started, I felt really well-prepared.

    3. JR

      When you train, do you have someone who is a coach who sets aside a training schedule or do you just do it yourself? Is it an intuition? Like you just, like have a sense of what you need to train? Like how- how do you decide what you do?

    4. EH

      I used to have a coach. Um, I ... Because when I first started climbing I was basically just only doing climbing competitions so I just was a competition climber. So I have a really solid base in, in training and how to train. I no longer work with a coach. Um, but I definitely, like, read a lot and I kind of like grab bits and pieces of information from my friends. Um, and so yeah, I do ... I, I do have a set training schedule approach that I kind of like build out in my head and try to stick to it. That said, I'm like pretty, I'm pretty flexible. But I do not just climb, like, if that's what you're asking. I do a lot of specific, specific training. Um, mostly I try to train what I'm weakest at, which is like pure power, pure strength.

    5. JR

      So you're saying that you do trail runs too and you find that that helps you?

    6. EH

      I do think running helps me. M- a lot of climbers would say that running is like not that good for climbing, but-

    7. JR

      Why is that?

    8. EH

      Because it, it makes you tired, essentially, and it decreases your power and your ability to like really pull hard. Um, like you're not really supposed to go running on your rest days but I do it anyway.

    9. JR

      Hm. Why do-

    10. EH

      And for me, sanity-wise, like I just love running.

    11. JR

      Oh. Just good for the head.

    12. EH

      Yeah.

    13. JR

      Yeah. What, so they think that just exhausting your legs from running will mess you up when you're climbing?

    14. EH

      Yeah.

    15. JR

      You love the idea?

    16. EH

      Yeah. I think so. I think it just like depletes your ability to like he- pure power. You know, like if you're doing like a, I mean, I don't know, if you're doing like a weightlifting workout, it doesn't see- it seems like you're not supposed to go run a few miles before you try to like bench press your hardest weight.

    17. JR

      Y- yeah. Is there two schools of thought on that? 'Cause it seems like another school of thought would be if you can condition your body to run and climb, you'll, you'll have a stronger body than one that just climbs.

    18. EH

      Well, that's my philosophy, yeah.

    19. JR

      Yeah.

    20. EH

      (laughs)

    21. JR

      And obviously you're out there kicking ass.

    22. EH

      Well, I mean I'm, I'm try- I'm still, eh, I'm a work in progress.

    23. JR

      Well.

    24. EH

      (laughs)

    25. JR

      Aren't we all? (laughs)

    26. EH

      Yeah.

    27. JR

      So you basically are self-trained in that sense where you-

    28. EH

      Mm-hmm.

    29. JR

      ... you don't have someone who sets a schedule aside for you like, "Today you're gonna lift weights. Today you're gonna run. Today ..."

    30. EH

      No.

  7. 26:51 – 42:39

    The big-wall head injury on Golden Gate: what happened at 2,800 feet and why

    1. EH

      Um, e- yeah, so for me it's... I think, for example, when I, when I hit my head this time, the time I got the scar, um, I was on one of... My day had gone so perfectly. Like I was climbing super well, everything was great. I-

    2. JR

      There's your rib.

    3. EH

      There it is.

    4. JR

      Ouchie.

    5. EH

      Um, yeah, that was the rock bottom moment. So I was climbing and I was in the sun, I slipped off, I felt like I was just gonna have a really normal fall, super safe, like nothing bad was gonna happen, and then I hit my head. And I instantly, like, just felt the blood pouring down my face and it was super dramatic, and it was super scary. And I lowered down and Adrian sort of assessed me for concussion symptoms and tried to, you know, figure out if there was anything super serious, and turns out that there wasn't really. Um, and so it, it came time to decide, like, "Oh, should I keep going or should I, should I give up?" Like what, you know, what, what's the best course of action now? And honestly, in my head, I was like... Part of me was like, "I don't wanna keep climbing." Like, I'm emotionally kind of destroyed and, and drained, and I don't think I can do this.

    6. JR

      Tell me, tell me how it happened. Like, what-

    7. EH

      I mean-

    8. JR

      ... what was the sequence of events?

    9. EH

      I was... So I, I was climbing this pitch, and it's a pitch that I've never fallen on before. Um, and the next pitch is the hard one, which is where I think I went wrong, because I was sort of thinking ahead.

    10. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    11. EH

      Like, I wasn't focusing on what was happening in front of me, I was thinking about the, the next pitch. And I was like, "I need to get this one out of the way so that I can focus on the hard one." And therefore, I was climbing in the sun when it's too hot. Like, the friction's not as good, it's more slippery, all those things. Um, and I was rushing it, I didn't rest enough.

    12. JR

      The friction is not as good when it's hot?

    13. EH

      Yeah.

    14. JR

      Why is that?

    15. EH

      You want it to be cold.

    16. JR

      (laughs)

    17. EH

      Because your skin sweats.

    18. JR

      Oh, s- okay. It's just a...

    19. EH

      And like, the rubber on your shoes isn't as sticky. Like, it's just...

    20. JR

      Oh.

    21. EH

      The heat, the heat radiates off the rock. It just gets more slippery. Like, imagine like a, a granite face just like baking in the sun.

    22. JR

      Hmm.

    23. EH

      Like, everything's more slippery, and you're, you're all sweaty. And so it's just not ideal. Um...

    24. JR

      Hmm.

    25. EH

      And I coulda waited, but I didn't. So I clim- I was climbing and I was like kind of traversing, and so I was trying to do this move and I rushed it and I slipped and I fell. But I had like a piece of gear down and to my right, and I just didn't, I just didn't anticipate like the physics of how I was gonna fall, and I kinda fell sideways, and I couldn't get my feet out in front of me in time. And we watched the footage later. It was just like, it was kinda like my head just like bounces off the wall like a-

    26. JR

      (laughs)

    27. EH

      ... (laughs) like a basketball. Um, and I must've just hit like a crystal or something with my forehead, like some sort of... something sticking out of the rock. Um, and there was just blood everywhere. Like head wounds, they just, you know, they bleed a-

    28. JR

      Foreheads. Yeah.

    29. EH

      They bleed a lot.

    30. JR

      Yeah.

  8. 42:39 – 48:13

    The 50-foot fall the year before: simul-climbing, gear strategy, and rebuilding confidence

    1. JR

      Now, do you do this professionally?

    2. EH

      Yeah. This is my job.

    3. JR

      Is this all you do? How long has that been the case?

    4. EH

      Um, I ... Well, I guess I, I should say that I s- became like a true professional rock climber when I joined the North Face team and that was in 2008.... um, right after I graduated from college.

    5. JR

      That's a long time.

    6. EH

      It's a really long time. Yeah.

    7. JR

      Yeah. So you've been a pro for 12 years?

    8. EH

      Yeah, 12 years. And before that, I was, like, doing a lot of competitions and, you know, ma- had sponsors, and, and stuff like that. But I was also in school, and then I went to university and, uh, I wanted to be a lawyer, actually. Um, so I (laughs) graduated from the University of Colorado in Boulder, and I was gonna, like, study for the LSAT. And that's when the North Face approached me, and, uh, I was like, "Okay, well, I'll try this for a little while and see how it goes." Like, it's a cool opportunity to travel and see the world and keep climbing, and then I just didn't-

    9. JR

      Were you-

    10. EH

      ... ever stop.

    11. JR

      ... were you hesitant to... so, like, it seem like-

    12. EH

      Not at all. No.

    13. JR

      But you went to school for something else, and then-

    14. EH

      Yeah. I, I mean-

    15. JR

      ... you're, you're doing something physical. That's always weird, right?

    16. EH

      Yeah.

    17. JR

      Because you're relying on your body, which kind-

    18. EH

      Yeah.

    19. JR

      ... of can break.

    20. EH

      But you can always go back. I, my, my mindset, I think, I was 20 years old. Like, I didn't really, you know, I didn't have, like, a super good, like, ten-year plan or whatever, you know? I was like-

    21. JR

      Hmm.

    22. EH

      ... "I'll do this for a few years, and then I can just go back to school."

    23. JR

      Right.

    24. EH

      Like, that's f- that's great. Um, but now, being a professional athlete, like, has sort of, like, morphed into this viable option to make a living. Well, for me, at least.

    25. JR

      And when you're sponsored, like, how does that work? Do you, are you required to do a certain amount of climbs per year? Are you required to make social media posts? Like, how do, how do they... how does that work?

    26. EH

      Yeah. So I work with a bunch of companies, but the North Face is the main one. And it, it's essentially, I mean, yeah, it's essentially like kind of a... it's like a marketing job. Like, we're... we are expected, I wouldn't say required, but expected to, um, participate in social media, um, tell our stories, like, be, you know, be open about that. And then we do a lot of photo shoots. We do a lot of, um, expeditions, a lot of big trips, um, and then personal projects as well. And, and yeah, kind of expected to tell the stories of those, and to, to work with the brand to, you know, make it worth their while as well.

    27. JR

      So they just kinda want you to be cool and wear their stuff. Like, you're out there doing cool stuff, and-

    28. EH

      Yeah, and-

    29. JR

      ... you're wearing the North Face-

    30. EH

      ... and be active within-

  9. 48:13 – 53:11

    Making climbing a career: sponsors, storytelling, and imposter syndrome

    1. EH

      ... I, I mean, yeah. I love it. I think it's so cool that people now have access to, like, experience climbing in, in the inner city if they want to. I think it's rad. And it also, now it's an Olympic sport, so... or, it will be in the Olympics next year. It was meant to be in Tokyo.

    2. JR

      How do they do it as an Olympic sport? They have a particular path that you have to try to climb up and-

    3. EH

      So, it's three disciplines, um, because it's new, it's a new sport. Um, they've essentially combined, like, the three main disciplines of competition climbing into one, so there's one medal, and they combine the scores. And they have, uh, lead climbing, which is with a rope, but, like, the, the routes are longer, like, say, I don't know, 50 feet or so. Um, so it's sort of, sort of like an endurance challenge, and it's like they set a path and that it's meant to be difficult, and each person gets one try, and whoever gets the highest wins that discipline.

    4. JR

      Hmm.

    5. EH

      And then there's bouldering, which is, like, shorter, no ropes. The movements are, like, more powerful, more explosive. There's a little bit of a, a parkour element. There's, like, a lot of jumping around. Yeah, there you go.

    6. JR

      Whoa!

    7. EH

      Um, lots of, like, big features, like volumes. Um-

    8. JR

      Where is that guy going? (laughs)

    9. EH

      Yeah, exactly.

    10. JR

      Where does he-

    11. EH

      It's really confusing.

    12. JR

      Where does he go? How did- but, but you-

    13. EH

      It's super entertaining.

    14. JR

      If you're hanging in that position, what is your next viable option?

    15. EH

      He's gonna, he's gonna throw his feet up to where his, uh, left hand is and then he's gonna bring his left hand into his right hand.

    16. JR

      What?

    17. EH

      Yeah.

    18. JR

      What?

    19. EH

      Just, that's my, that's my estimate. Well, that's me reading it.

    20. JR

      And then where does he go?

    21. EH

      And then he's gonna do that next red one-

    22. JR

      Other than straight down?

    23. EH

      ... with the sticker on it.

    24. JR

      That one?

    25. EH

      Yeah.

    26. JR

      Really?

    27. EH

      It's incredible. Like, bouldering competitions are so cool.

    28. JR

      Oh, my God.

    29. EH

      They're super entertaining.

    30. JR

      And they all have that sort of-

  10. 53:11 – 57:01

    Climbing in the Olympics: lead, bouldering, and speed explained

    1. JR

      I would imagine that hand strength is one of the most important things. Like, the ability to hang onto stuff.

    2. EH

      Yeah, that's why I, I, like, travel with my hang board and hang all the time and, like, do a lot of- (laughs)

    3. JR

      But where do you put the hang board when you travel? Like door-

    4. EH

      Uh-

    5. JR

      ... door-

    6. EH

      Yeah, I bring those, uh, pull-up bars that-

    7. JR

      Mm-hmm.

    8. EH

      ... you, like, screw on between the doorjamb and then I hang it from there.

    9. JR

      Wow.

    10. EH

      Yeah.

    11. JR

      And then you just hang?

    12. EH

      Yeah. I do-

    13. JR

      So if you're staying in a hotel, you just, like-

    14. EH

      You do.

    15. JR

      ... hang in the bathroom wall?

    16. EH

      Mm-hmm.

    17. JR

      On the door?

    18. EH

      Yeah.

    19. JR

      Wow.

    20. EH

      Yeah.

    21. JR

      And do you do it for time? Do you do reps? Do you do chin-ups? What do you do on that?

    22. EH

      Yeah, b- all of that. There's, like, little ... there's exercises you can do. There's a lot of research now that's been done on finger strength and, um-

    23. JR

      So that's one of the things you use, like that?

    24. EH

      Yeah. I- the one I have is wood because the wood is actually a little bit friendlier for your skin.

    25. JR

      Mm.

    26. EH

      Um, but yeah, similar. You do different hand positions and sometimes you'll hang for, like, five seconds and then take 10 seconds off and do it again and then sometimes you put weight on your body.

    27. JR

      One? Mono? What?

    28. EH

      Yeah, mono.

    29. JR

      Someone can hang from one finger?

    30. EH

      People can do crazy stuff. People can do m- pull-ups from one finger.

  11. 57:01 – 1:12:15

    Finger strength and hangboarding: the weird world of one-finger feats

    1. EH

      Yeah. It's an- it's an interesting subject, because climbing is, like, a strength-to-weight ratio sport.

    2. JR

      Yeah.

    3. EH

      It does benefit you to be lighter. But at the same time, um, it's really easy to take it too far. And I think-

    4. JR

      Right.

    5. EH

      Um, and then once you take it too far, it- it's- it can be very bad, like injuries.

    6. JR

      Just even weaker. Yeah.

    7. EH

      Weaker, um, and it- eating disorders is, like, kind of a- yeah, it's definitely a thing in climbing, um.

    8. JR

      Yeah, that's what I was gonna get to.

    9. EH

      That's- and I've suffered from it when I was younger, when I was in com- heavily involved in competitions. Like, and it's like once you start to experience a little bit of success from losing weight, like, there's so much more incentive to just, like, keep going down that road.

    10. JR

      Hmm.

    11. EH

      Um, and I think it's actually a pretty dangerous road, and it's something that we're- climbers are starting to talk about more, which I think is- is super good and super healthy. Um, especially, like, with the growth of climbing competitions and with the growth of- of youth, like, becoming more interested in climbing.

    12. JR

      Right. That- that- the edge that you get from doing that is not worth pursuing, 'cause there's a lot of negative drawbacks to it.

    13. EH

      It- it is, and it's pretty temporary, and it's not very sustainable. And, you know, in a lot of ways, I feel lucky that I came out of that period and, like, kept climbing. Because it's hard- it's hard to- to go through that phase and then sort of come out of it and have to deal with, like, not climbing as well for a while, and what does that mean? And h-

    14. JR

      Hmm.

    15. EH

      You know? It's- it's kind of a mind fuck. Um, and so that's why- that's what I s- why I talk about data the way I do, 'cause sometimes it's like I just can't- I can't, like, emotionally handle it. I need to, like, take a step back and just be intuitive.

    16. JR

      Hmm. Yeah. Sometimes, there's too much data-

    17. EH

      Yeah.

    18. JR

      ... and not enough just being.

    19. EH

      Yeah.

    20. JR

      You know?

    21. EH

      And I was one of those- I was one of those athletes, when I was younger, that I was, like, obsessed with the number on the scale. I was obsessed with how much I ate. I was obsessed with every little thing. And it got to the point where it just almost destroyed me, if that makes sense.

    22. JR

      That's a giant problem with people, right? Like, the-

    23. EH

      Yeah.

    24. JR

      ... just in general, being obsessed with the scale, and-

    25. EH

      Yeah.

    26. JR

      ... and the numbers.

    27. EH

      Yeah.

    28. JR

      And if you're in a- a sport where you're literally carrying your body weight up a mountain-

    29. EH

      Mm-hmm.

    30. JR

      ... it's not just ... Like so many girls are obsessed with the scale for whatever reason. Even if they look good, they don't like the number. Like, "You look great, but you weigh 145 pounds." Like, "Shit, I hate that. I wanna be 135." Like, but you don't. Like-

Episode duration: 2:11:41

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