Joe Rogan Experience #1634 - Jack Carr

1. 0:00 – 0:38

   Intro

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. (drumbeats) Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (rock music) Good to go. All right. I have officially read more fiction from you than any ... There's like, there's two other people, JRR Tolkien-

   2. JCJack Carr0:22

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:22

      ... and, uh, Stephen King.

   4. JCJack Carr0:24

      Ah, wow.

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:24

      Is the only other two people.

   6. JCJack Carr0:25

      I'm on that. That's quite a, that's rare air right there-

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:28

      Yeah, dude.

   8. JCJack Carr0:28

      ... to be in, so-

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:29

      They're great though.

   10. JCJack Carr0:30

       Thank you, man. Thank you so much.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:31

       They're fucking page-turners. I've been listening to the audio book of, I won't, I won't lie. Which is odd because the guy does the g- the girl voices-

   12. JCJack Carr0:36

       I know, it's tough.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:37

       ... and the guy voices. (laughs)

   14. JCJack Carr0:37

       Yeah,

2. 0:38 – 2:40

   Ray Porter

   1. JCJack Carr0:38

      Ray Porter.

   2. JRJoe Rogan0:38

      (laughs)

   3. JCJack Carr0:38

      He plays, uh, he plays Darkseid in the new, uh, Snyder Cut of Justice League, so-

   4. JRJoe Rogan0:43

      Oh, really?

   5. JCJack Carr0:43

      For those people that have, like, four and a half, five hours on your hands to watch that, uh, apparently it's incredible and he's such a, such a great guy too.

   6. JRJoe Rogan0:48

      Is the new cut four and a half, five hours?

   7. JCJack Carr0:51

      Something like that. Four, at least four.

   8. JRJoe Rogan0:52

      'Cause I be-

   9. JCJack Carr0:52

      'Cause I went to watch it 'cause he's a friend of mine, so I went to watch it and saw, 'cause I'm in the middle of all these interviews and doing stuff for the book launch and I saw how long it was. I'm like, "All right, Ray, I'm gonna look, I'm gonna watch this in a couple weeks for you."

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:01

       (laughs)

   11. JCJack Carr1:01

       "'Cause, uh, it looks wonderful but I just can't sit down for four hours."

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:04

       Well, supposedly Tarantino made a 20-hour cut of Once Upon a Time in Hollywood.

   13. JCJack Carr1:08

       Oh, my gosh.

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:10

       (laughs)

   15. JCJack Carr1:10

       (laughs) People will watch it too.

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:12

       Oh, fuck you. I'll watch it.

   17. JCJack Carr1:13

       People will watch the 20 hours.

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:14

       If they just played it.

   19. JCJack Carr1:14

       If I sat down for, like, an hour and a half in my house and watched some old movie from the '80s or something like that, I can only imagine th- the looks I'll get from, from the rest of the family. Like, sitting there having a beer watching, like, you know, First Blood or something that I enjoyed watching as a kid.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:26

       Right, right.

   21. JCJack Carr1:26

       Like, that's not happening. 20 hours? That's rough. I don't know.

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:29

       Well, you got ... I think the, the move to do, if they wanted to do, is to release it, like, on Netflix as a series.

   23. JCJack Carr1:35

       Totally.

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:36

       That was, that's a great idea.

   25. JCJack Carr1:37

       Yeah, yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:37

       Like, Tarantino should ... I don't know what his deal is in terms of, like, his financial situation, like, how, you know, how they have, uh, who has ownership or how it would do.

   27. JCJack Carr1:45

       Ah.

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:45

       But if they could sell it to Netflix or HBO Max or whatever and just put it as a series.

   29. JCJack Carr1:50

       Oh, totally.

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:51

       Fuck yeah.
3. 2:40 – 7:06

   Home Theater

   1. JCJack Carr2:40

      the way to do it. I think it's one of the last movies I saw in a theater before COVID hit, um, 'cause with kids we just don't get out that often anyway, so, uh, but that was one of the last ones that we sat down and actually had that experience, um-

   2. JRJoe Rogan2:51

      Yeah.

   3. JCJack Carr2:51

      ... but it was great. I love, especially the end. I love the end of that movie.

   4. JRJoe Rogan2:53

      The thing-

   5. JCJack Carr2:53

      It's so crazy.

   6. JRJoe Rogan2:54

      It's a great movie.

   7. JCJack Carr2:55

      Yeah.

   8. JRJoe Rogan2:55

      It's a really fun movie.

   9. JCJack Carr2:56

      Flamethrower at the end, it's fantastic.

   10. JRJoe Rogan2:58

       Yeah. The thing about movies is if you go to the movies you have to trust that your fellow humans are not gonna be retarded.

   11. JCJack Carr3:05

       Mm-hmm.

   12. JRJoe Rogan3:05

       You're gonna have to-

   13. JCJack Carr3:07

       It's tough.

   14. JRJoe Rogan3:07

       You gotta trust that they're not gonna look at their phones, you gotta trust that they're not gonna, like, talk to each other, be loud, or be ... People are so goofy.

   15. JCJack Carr3:15

       The home theater is the way to go.

   16. JRJoe Rogan3:17

       Yeah.

   17. JCJack Carr3:17

       That's the, uh, it, it, (laughs) if things continue on this track, we're having a home theater.

   18. JRJoe Rogan3:21

       (laughs)

   19. JCJack Carr3:21

       And I get nervous now, of course. You know, there's probably, you know, the chances of something happening are so slim but I get in there, you know, I look where the exits are. Okay, if something goes off in here-

   20. JRJoe Rogan3:28

       Bum. Right.

   21. JCJack Carr3:28

       ... if there's a fire or a bomb or something like that, okay, we're gonna move down this aisle, put your hand on the wall and move down so you can find that exit rather than just, like-

   22. JRJoe Rogan3:35

       (sighs)

   23. JCJack Carr3:35

       ... chaos. So, I identify those things, (laughs) I talk to the kids about that stuff-

   24. JRJoe Rogan3:38

       Yeah.

   25. JCJack Carr3:38

       ... and then I'm ready. So, if someone strange walks in, like, I'm like, "Mm-hmm."

   26. JRJoe Rogan3:41

       Yeah, well that's-

   27. JCJack Carr3:42

       All right.

   28. JRJoe Rogan3:42

       ... the Navy SEAL in you.

   29. JCJack Carr3:43

       I guess, but even before that.

   30. JRJoe Rogan3:44

       You never really get called out. (laughs)
4. 7:06 – 12:37

   The Written Word

   1. JCJack Carr7:06

      that anymore.

   2. JRJoe Rogan7:06

      Well, there's something about, like, the written word that seems to be... it seems to have a life outside of this digital world. Like, you have to have someone write these things out, right? If, the a- even if it's gonna be a film, you have to write the script. And if you're modifying a script from a book, like your books, someone has to a- And, so it's, it gives me hope that the written word is still valuable, that the r- uh, that fiction... Like, when you, you can get caught up in a man's i- or a woman's ideas-

   3. JCJack Carr7:41

      Mm-hmm.

   4. JRJoe Rogan7:41

      ... and, and they take you on this journey of creativity. And, and there's something to it, man. Like, when you're reading it, it's not just that you're getting enthralled with this, this story and you're, you're, you know, you're being taken on this journey. But it's also, for me at least, I know that as a guy who wrote this, or a woman who wrote this, I know that I'm, I'm being... I'm, uh, this is someone's f- someone's labor. Like, I know they sat down. Like with you, we're friends, so it's cool. So I, I know that y- I know you. I've seen pictures of your office. I know-

   5. JCJack Carr8:12

      (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan8:12

      ... you're sitting there typing away. And as I'm getting this experience out of your books, it's like there's something about... It, it still fuels the imagination without, you know, to... There's something great about movies, where you see it all and it's wild-

   7. JCJack Carr8:28

      Mm-hmm.

   8. JRJoe Rogan8:28

      ... and you know it's creative, but there's also something great about having your imagination fill it all in for you.

   9. JCJack Carr8:34

      Yeah. And some of that's, uh, it's, uh, it takes effort. Like, growing up, it was effort. You, you sit down, you read these books, you know? And the movie's more passive. You're there, you're enjoying it, you're a part of this experience, but, uh, you, your imagination, like, some of those things are filled in. You know what the trees look like, you know what the-

   10. JRJoe Rogan8:47

       Yeah.

   11. JCJack Carr8:47

       ... cliff looks like, you know what the water looks like, 'cause you're seeing it. But in a book when you're describing a mountain range or, you know, someone walking into an office, you're plugging in all these little pieces from your own experience through your own filters and, you know, biases and all the rest of it. Uh, so you're actually an active participant in that creation, which is, which is kinda cool. Um, but... And I loved that. I loved that growing up. I love being a part of that, as, uh... The magic of these books. And that's what I'm trying to, to recreate today with these. But also going to movies has helped huge. And growing up, I thought it was just fun. I just loved going to these movies, especially the ones that had main characters, that had backgrounds that I wanted in real life one day. So I just naturally gravitated to, you know, all those movies. Um, but, uh, but it helped in that it helped me with my storytelling. It helped me look at a... Like, read a book like First Blood, created in 1972 by David Morell. Then we have the Stallone movie. Two very different things, both fantastic.

   12. JRJoe Rogan9:35

       Is the... How different is the book than the movie?

   13. JCJack Carr9:37

       It is very different. I feel like we should be able to talk about it because it came out in 1972 without spoilers.

   14. JRJoe Rogan9:42

       Yeah, we can, we can get that.

   15. JCJack Carr9:43

       Uh, yeah. So at the end of the, the novel, Rambo dies.

   16. JRJoe Rogan9:47

       (gasps)

   17. JCJack Carr9:47

       Yeah. He doesn't even-

   18. JRJoe Rogan9:48

       We can't have that.

   19. JCJack Carr9:49

       That's right. He's not even named-

   20. JRJoe Rogan9:50

       There's no fucking way.

   21. JCJack Carr9:51

       Yeah, and Hollywood gave them-

   22. JRJoe Rogan9:52

       Change the script.

   23. JCJack Carr9:53

       (laughs) Yeah. Which, which they did.

   24. JRJoe Rogan9:55

       Yeah.

   25. JCJack Carr9:55

       Because they, because it tested very poorly with, uh, with audiences when they just rooted for this guy for this whole movie, and then all of a sudden he gets killed at the end.

   26. JRJoe Rogan10:01

       Oh, so they did do it in the first movie.

   27. JCJack Carr10:03

       They did, yeah.

   28. JRJoe Rogan10:04

       They had him die.

   29. JCJack Carr10:04

       And then, and then they came, they filmed it again. They filmed a different ending.

   30. JRJoe Rogan10:06

       Yeah.
5. 12:37 – 15:26

   New Characters

   1. JRJoe Rogan12:37

      though I started with the third one, it works.

   2. JCJack Carr12:39

      Awesome.

   3. JRJoe Rogan12:39

      Like you could just pick it up from the third one.

   4. JCJack Carr12:40

      Oh, thank you.

   5. JRJoe Rogan12:40

      But when I went back to the first one, I was like, "Hmm, maybe I should've started at the start."

   6. JCJack Carr12:44

      (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan12:44

      But-

   8. JCJack Carr12:44

      Yeah, much better, uh, I think you started with the first one because you understand the characters, you have this relationship built with them, that sort of thing.

   9. JRJoe Rogan12:49

      Yeah.

   10. JCJack Carr12:49

       So I think it works better that way, but, man, they're crushing. Aw, thank you.

   11. JRJoe Rogan12:52

       It works either way. And it, it worked since I enjoyed the third one so much, going back and listening to the first two were great too.

   12. JCJack Carr12:57

       That's so cool.

   13. JRJoe Rogan12:58

       And it, it filled it in. But do you, um, do you anticipate writing with new characters? Are you gonna keep Jack Reese? Like how, how are you gonna do this?

   14. JCJack Carr13:07

       Yeah, so James Reese-

   15. JRJoe Rogan13:08

       James Reese.

   16. JCJack Carr13:09

       Uh, yep, for this season-

   17. JRJoe Rogan13:09

       Why is Jack ... Jack is John, right?

   18. JCJack Carr13:12

       Sometimes, sometimes. Yep.

   19. JRJoe Rogan13:14

       Yep.

   20. JCJack Carr13:14

       So John F. Kennedy, Jack, you know, that sort of thing.

   21. JRJoe Rogan13:16

       I fuck that up all the time.

   22. JCJack Carr13:17

       Yep, yep. No, it's easy to do. And then you have Jack Reacher character, you have Jack Ryan, you know, he's really-

   23. JRJoe Rogan13:21

       Yeah.

   24. JCJack Carr13:21

       ... John Ryan from the Clancy stuff. So-

   25. JRJoe Rogan13:23

       So he's-

   26. JCJack Carr13:23

       It's, uh, yeah, James Reese the main character, former Navy SEAL sniper, background similar to mine. But right now it's so hard to, uh, get an audience to connect with your character. Uh, and I didn't even think about that as I started, but since that's happened, since he's resonating with people and the stories are resonating with people, um, that I think I'm gonna continue on with the same character, the same storyline. Um, building on it, building along his journey, 'cause we're all on this journey and people can relate to that as well, to transitions and move, different struggles and all that. So I'm gonna continue with this character for as, as long as people want to continue to read about him.

   27. JRJoe Rogan13:54

       So do you feel like you just hit gold? So you're, you're in a nice fucking vein of gold in this mountain-

   28. JCJack Carr14:01

       (laughs)

   29. JRJoe Rogan14:01

       ... you might as well just keep running?

   30. JCJack Carr14:03

       I think so. I mean, you could, uh ... I heard a story my, from my, um, from my editor, and she has another, another author that, uh, that had kind of the same thing, like people resi... his character was resonating, and he said, "I think I'm gonna do something different." And she's like, "What? No, you're not." (laughs)
6. 15:26 – 17:55

   Chris Pratt

   1. JCJack Carr15:26

      that virtual, the room was virtual.

   2. JRJoe Rogan15:27

      So, so you did a virtual meeting though?

   3. JCJack Carr15:29

      Mm-hmm.

   4. JRJoe Rogan15:29

      So you were at least, uh-

   5. JCJack Carr15:30

      Yeah.

   6. JRJoe Rogan15:30

      ... digitally in presence.

   7. JCJack Carr15:32

      Yeah.

   8. JRJoe Rogan15:32

      So was it weird having people talk about your creation and sort of move it around? And did they-

   9. JCJack Carr15:38

      Well-

   10. JRJoe Rogan15:38

       ... keep all the main characters like Katie and his-

   11. JCJack Carr15:41

       Yeah, they morphed it a little bit.

   12. JRJoe Rogan15:42

       ... ex-wife and his daughter and all that stuff? Is-

   13. JCJack Carr15:44

       Yeah. They, so Chris wanted to keep it, so Chris optioned it right out of the gate, Chris Pratt. And so January of 2018, before it even hits shelves, Chris Pratt options it 'cause my dear friend Jared Shaw gives him a copy and says, "This is your next project." Which is just crazy.

   14. JRJoe Rogan15:55

       By the way, who's better than Chris Pratt?

   15. JCJack Carr15:58

       I can't think of anybody. He's my favorite Chris. I tell you.

   16. JRJoe Rogan16:00

       (laughs) He's great. He's, he's just such a great guy.

   17. JCJack Carr16:04

       He is. He's so nice.

   18. JRJoe Rogan16:05

       And for him, like it's, he's perfect for that role.

   19. JCJack Carr16:07

       So perfect. And he's, uh-

   20. JRJoe Rogan16:09

       Perfect.

   21. JCJack Carr16:09

       ... you know, he's done, you know, he had a small role in Zero Dark Thirty where he plays a Navy SEAL.

   22. JRJoe Rogan16:12

       Mm-hmm.

   23. JCJack Carr16:13

       Um, and very small part, but, uh, you know, his, his other stuff hasn't been as violent, hasn't been as visceral, hasn't been as primal. And so people are gonna be surprised.

   24. JRJoe Rogan16:20

       How graphic is this gonna be?

   25. JCJack Carr16:22

       Pretty graphic.

   26. JRJoe Rogan16:23

       Pff, well I was-

   27. JCJack Carr16:24

       Yeah.

   28. JRJoe Rogan16:24

       The books are so graphic.

   29. JCJack Carr16:26

       There we are.

   30. JRJoe Rogan16:27

       Oh, wow.
7. 17:55 – 25:18

   John Wick

   1. JCJack Carr17:55

   2. JRJoe Rogan17:55

      Yeah, you h- you knocked it out of the park with those guys.

   3. JCJack Carr17:57

      Yeah.

   4. JRJoe Rogan17:57

      And it's just also like the, the idea of doing it the way you're doing it as a series is so brilliant. I, I just, I love like Ozark and all these ... These series are almost better than movies, because you get to follow it along. And like realistically, you're not gonna read this book in an hour and a half or two hours or even three hours.

   5. JCJack Carr18:19

      Yep.

   6. JRJoe Rogan18:19

      I mean, how-... pages a day.

   7. JCJack Carr18:21

      This is a long one, so this is longer. So you can use it as a, you know, blunt force object, weapon if you need to, or a doorstop. It's the longest one.

   8. JRJoe Rogan18:28

      Like John Wick?

   9. JCJack Carr18:28

      Yeah, exactly.

   10. JRJoe Rogan18:28

       In John Wick 3-

   11. JCJack Carr18:29

       Exactly. John Wick. (laughs)

   12. JRJoe Rogan18:29

       ... he killed that guy with a book.

   13. JCJack Carr18:30

       Did he really in three?

   14. JRJoe Rogan18:31

       Yeah.

   15. JCJack Carr18:31

       I didn't, I forgot. I gotta go back and watch that part.

   16. JRJoe Rogan18:33

       He shoves it in the dude's mouth and-

   17. JCJack Carr18:34

       Oh, nice.

   18. JRJoe Rogan18:34

       ... and, and bang. And then he put 'em over, put the dude's, uh, while it's in the dude's mouth, he put, he took, took it out of his mouth, put it on the dude's neck, and, and slammed him over a table.

   19. JCJack Carr18:46

       Nice. Oh, I love it.

   20. JRJoe Rogan18:46

       And snapped, snapped his neck. It was pretty ridiculous.

   21. JCJack Carr18:48

       Wow. That's a, one of those GIFs I gotta-

   22. JRJoe Rogan18:49

       But we're pretty bad at that. (laughs)

   23. JCJack Carr18:49

       Oh, here, look at that. Jamie, how do you do that?

   24. JRJoe Rogan18:51

       Jamie's the best.

   25. JCJack Carr18:52

       How's he do that so fast? Incredible.

   26. JRJoe Rogan18:54

       Just go to the end, 'cause it's a long-ass scene.

   27. JCJack Carr18:56

       Oh, nice. This might be my new favorite scene in a movie.

   28. JRJoe Rogan18:59

       Oh, it's, it's great.

   29. JCJack Carr19:00

       Well-

   30. JRJoe Rogan19:00

       Uh, it's, this is in John Wick 3-
8. 25:18 – 27:33

   FJ62

   1. JRJoe Rogan25:18

      it's just ... They- they- they're so beautiful.

   2. JCJack Carr25:20

      So nice.

   3. JRJoe Rogan25:20

      There's something about that design, too, that FJ 62.

   4. JCJack Carr25:24

      Mm-hmm.

   5. JRJoe Rogan25:24

      It's, um, it's one of those things that everybody doesn't appreciate.

   6. JCJack Carr25:28

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan25:29

      Like, I pointed out to my wife once-

   8. JCJack Carr25:30

      And she's like-

   9. JRJoe Rogan25:31

      ... and she's like, "It looks like a station wagon."

   10. JCJack Carr25:32

       Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan25:32

       I go, "What the fuck are you saying?"

   12. JCJack Carr25:34

       "Get out of the car." Yeah.

   13. JRJoe Rogan25:35

       "How dare you?"

   14. JCJack Carr25:35

       Exactly.

   15. JRJoe Rogan25:36

       "How dare you, woman?"

   16. JCJack Carr25:37

       (laughs) Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan25:37

       "That's a FJ. It's a '62."

   18. JCJack Carr25:40

       My wife's the same way.

   19. JRJoe Rogan25:41

       That's the, the four headlights. You don't know shit.

   20. JCJack Carr25:42

       Ugh, I know.

   21. JRJoe Rogan25:43

       (laughs)

   22. JCJack Carr25:43

       My wife says the same thing. She's like, "Which kind do you have again?" I'm like, "Ugh."

   23. JRJoe Rogan25:46

       Ugh.

   24. JCJack Carr25:46

       "FJ 62."

   25. JRJoe Rogan25:47

       I know.

   26. JCJack Carr25:48

       But, uh, yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan25:49

       But that's specifically one, because regular people don't think they look cool. Like, if you see an, like, and FJ 40, regular people think they look cool.

   28. JCJack Carr25:55

       Yeah. It's like Jeep-looking one, for those listening.

   29. JRJoe Rogan25:57

       Regular people.

   30. JCJack Carr25:57

       It's like, for not people that aren't, like, totally into those communities.
9. 27:33 – 30:18

   Gear

   1. JRJoe Rogan27:33

      Like, y- everything w- w- ... You talk about all the, the, the various gear and the different aspects of it and what's great about these different things. You could tell that this is coming from not just ... You're not d- ... It's not you ... Not doing research on this stuff. This is shit that you're already really familiar with.

   2. JCJack Carr27:50

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan27:51

      Very intimate with.

   4. JCJack Carr27:51

      Oh, yeah. Yeah. I was that ... I, I was that way before the military, into gear, uh, during the military, of course, and just ... And today, it's just, it's just a part of who I am. I always wanted to be ... go farther and faster into the back country growing up, so external frame packs became internal. And I remember my first one in, like, 1988 or something like that. So I've, I've always been about that, and I didn't really know how much it was gonna, you know, help-

   5. JRJoe Rogan28:09

      See, what you just did there, external frames-

   6. JCJack Carr28:11

      (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan28:11

      ... versus internal frames for backpacks.

   8. JCJack Carr28:13

      Yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan28:14

      Most people are like, "What the fuck does he say?"

   10. JCJack Carr28:15

       "What the hell is he talking about?"

   11. JRJoe Rogan28:15

       Yeah.

   12. JCJack Carr28:15

       Go back to the Land Cruiser stuff. Uh, but like-

   13. JRJoe Rogan28:18

       But that is ... That's very detail-oriented because-

   14. JCJack Carr28:20

       Yeah.

   15. JRJoe Rogan28:20

       ... you know, when you're d- dealing with, like, really high-tech, you know, really well-made-

   16. JCJack Carr28:26

       Mm-hmm.

   17. JRJoe Rogan28:26

       ... backpacks.

   18. JCJack Carr28:27

       Yeah.

   19. JRJoe Rogan28:27

       That's, that is where things get ... That's where the rubber meets the road, right?

   20. JCJack Carr28:31

       Oh, yeah. I mean, showing up in the military, we still had these ALICE frame packs that they gave us.

   21. JRJoe Rogan28:34

       Mm-hmm.

   22. JCJack Carr28:34

       I was like, "What on Earth? You guys are like 20 years out of date on these things." It's ridiculous.

   23. JRJoe Rogan28:37

       Well, there's a lot of these guys that you w- you'll hunt with some guides and they have these old school packs.

   24. JCJack Carr28:43

       Yeah, yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan28:43

       Like, real old school with the metal tubes-

   26. JCJack Carr28:45

       Yeah, yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan28:45

       ... and, and-

   28. JCJack Carr28:45

       That's it. That's it.

   29. JRJoe Rogan28:46

       ... all around it. Yeah.

   30. JCJack Carr28:46

       Yeah, and there's some like that that are actually really good, obviously, for carrying out weight.
10. 30:18 – 31:36

    The FJ40

    1. JRJoe Rogan30:18

       friend who had an FJ 40 when I was, like, f-... 16 years old. Uh, there was this guy named Skip Hakala.

    2. JCJack Carr30:24

       (laughs)

    3. JRJoe Rogan30:24

       He was a black belt at this, uh-

    4. JCJack Carr30:26

       Nice.

    5. JRJoe Rogan30:26

       ... Taekwondo place that I went to, and he was, like, this sort of rugged, older dude.

    6. JCJack Carr30:30

       Mm-hmm.

    7. JRJoe Rogan30:31

       And he had this, uh, car and I was like, "What the fuck is that?" And it was a Toyota Land Cru-

    8. JCJack Carr30:34

       Yeah, you didn't realize how cool it was.

    9. JRJoe Rogan30:36

       Well, it looked cool.

    10. JCJack Carr30:37

        (laughs)

    11. JRJoe Rogan30:37

        But it just was, I'd never seen one before.

    12. JCJack Carr30:39

        Yeah.

    13. JRJoe Rogan30:39

        I was like, "What is this thing?"

    14. JCJack Carr30:41

        Mm-hmm.

    15. JRJoe Rogan30:41

        But it was that kind of a deal. I never forgot it.

    16. JCJack Carr30:43

        Yeah.

    17. JRJoe Rogan30:43

        And then when I saw one later, I recognized like, "Oh, that's what Skip used to have."

    18. JCJack Carr30:47

        Yup, and now there's this whole subculture of people that-

    19. JRJoe Rogan30:49

        There it is.

    20. JCJack Carr30:50

        Oh, there it is right there. Yup, nice, nice.

    21. JRJoe Rogan30:51

        He was a, a lawyer too. He was, like, this-

    22. JCJack Carr30:53

        Oh, really? (laughs)

    23. JRJoe Rogan30:54

        ... interesting character.

    24. JCJack Carr30:55

        Nice.

    25. JRJoe Rogan30:55

        He was like a, this rugged, interesting character.

    26. JCJack Carr30:58

        Yup, yup, there it is.

    27. JRJoe Rogan30:59

        Yeah.

    28. JCJack Carr31:00

        So, yeah, I saw that in a-

    29. JRJoe Rogan31:01

        Those are dope.

    30. JCJack Carr31:01

        Yeah.
11. 31:36 – 36:28

    Rolex Explorer

    1. JCJack Carr31:36

       like that.

    2. JRJoe Rogan31:36

       What people don't realize is-

    3. JCJack Carr31:36

       Same thing with this.

    4. JRJoe Rogan31:37

       ... Rolex was a tool watch. You know, like when people think of Rolexes today, they think of Rolex as being this like luxury thing-

    5. JCJack Carr31:44

       Mm-hmm.

    6. JRJoe Rogan31:45

       ... that you, you know, you're flossing. You're showing everybody you got a Rolex. But Rolexes originally were tool watches.

    7. JCJack Carr31:50

       Interesting.

    8. JRJoe Rogan31:51

       It was a watch that you wore because you wanted to go to 300 meters under the, under the sea.

    9. JCJack Carr31:56

       Yeah.

    10. JRJoe Rogan31:57

        It was, you know, you wore i- submariners.

    11. JCJack Carr31:59

        Sure.

    12. JRJoe Rogan31:59

        And-

    13. JCJack Carr31:59

        Yeah.

    14. JRJoe Rogan31:59

        ... you know, Jacques Cousteau, I think wore one.

    15. JCJack Carr32:02

        Yeah, I'm sure he did. I'm sure he did.

    16. JRJoe Rogan32:03

        I'm pretty sure he did.

    17. JCJack Carr32:04

        Yeah.

    18. JRJoe Rogan32:04

        I think he wore one of the first, and there's like, between them and, you know, the Omega Sea Masters-

    19. JCJack Carr32:10

        Mm-hmm.

    20. JRJoe Rogan32:10

        ... like those watches were tool watches.

    21. JCJack Carr32:12

        Yup, and when you go look at the prices for them back in the day, oh my gosh.

    22. JRJoe Rogan32:15

        Yeah, there it is. Look at that.

    23. JCJack Carr32:15

        There we go. Yeah, there's one out there that, that if you put in like, Rolex ad plus hunting or something like that, it'll, it should pop up, but they had-

    24. JRJoe Rogan32:21

        See, that's a classic. That's the Explorer.

    25. JCJack Carr32:24

        There you go, yeah.

    26. JRJoe Rogan32:24

        "We built the Rolex Explorer because there isn't any w- watch repair shop at the top of the Matterhorn."

    27. JCJack Carr32:29

        Yeah.

    28. JRJoe Rogan32:30

        That was the sh- they made that watch to, uh, it was sort of an homage to the guy who climbed Everest the first time.

    29. JCJack Carr32:38

        Ah.

    30. JRJoe Rogan32:38

        'Cause they did it, but they didn't, he didn't do it with a, uh, an Explorer. They did it with a different watch.
12. 36:28 – 38:55

    Technology

    1. JRJoe Rogan36:28

       time goes on-

    2. JCJack Carr36:28

       ... about that person.

    3. JRJoe Rogan36:28

       ... I'm trying to get more of... I l- I appreciate technology, but I want-

    4. JCJack Carr36:32

       Yeah.

    5. JRJoe Rogan36:32

       ... its grip to be more and more away from me.

    6. JCJack Carr36:34

       Yeah.

    7. JRJoe Rogan36:34

       I have no apps on this phone. This is my main phone.

    8. JCJack Carr36:37

       Oh, nice. Okay.

    9. JRJoe Rogan36:38

       I u- I occasionally have Instagram on and Twitter on it-

    10. JCJack Carr36:42

        Yeah.

    11. JRJoe Rogan36:42

        ... but I, I also delete them.

    12. JCJack Carr36:43

        Oh, do you?

    13. JRJoe Rogan36:43

        But I don't have anything else other than that.

    14. JCJack Carr36:45

        Okay.

    15. JRJoe Rogan36:46

        This, this thing is just... I c- I can get my email on it, but I rarely do.

    16. JCJack Carr36:50

        Nice. Yeah.

    17. JRJoe Rogan36:50

        And I have another phone that has fucking everything on it.

    18. JCJack Carr36:53

        Okay. Yeah. I've got the two phones after we talked last time-

    19. JRJoe Rogan36:56

        Yeah.

    20. JCJack Carr36:56

        ... about that. So I have the two phones going now trying to figure all that out more of this-

    21. JRJoe Rogan36:59

        Got to cut people out, man.

    22. JCJack Carr37:00

        It's crazy.

    23. JRJoe Rogan37:01

        (laughs)

    24. JCJack Carr37:01

        It's crazy. I was talking to you about it, talking to Chris. I mean, what a great problem to have though. I mean-

    25. JRJoe Rogan37:05

        Yeah.

    26. JCJack Carr37:05

        ... I feel so fortunate. And I still even... uh, I was thinking about you last night 'cause it's, uh, so many people reaching out 'cause the book launches and, uh, so many people were, were reaching out and I try to get back to everybody normally and there was just no way. And then this morning-

    27. JRJoe Rogan37:16

        There's no way.

    28. JCJack Carr37:16

        ... I woke up and it was like boom. And I try to, like, repost people's things and stories just as a thank you to them 'cause I sincerely appreciate them taking a risk on me and telling a friend. But it... I woke up this morning, it was like ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.

    29. JRJoe Rogan37:26

        Mm-hmm.

    30. JCJack Carr37:26

        It was just... It was insane.
13. 38:55 – 41:38

    The Timeline

    1. JCJack Carr38:55

    2. JRJoe Rogan38:55

       ... just... But it's a good problem to happen.

    3. JCJack Carr38:56

       Good problem to happen.

    4. JRJoe Rogan38:57

       It happens so quickly with you from getting out of the military to starting this book and then having this book take off and then writing the second, the third, and now the fourth.

    5. JCJack Carr39:07

       Yeah.

    6. JRJoe Rogan39:07

       What is the, the entire timeline?

    7. JCJack Carr39:09

       So I got out in 2016. Got the book to Simon & Schuster in the fall of 2016. They called me in December. Wanted to, wanted option- or wanted to publish it. And then, uh, we started that process and then it came out in 2018. So-

    8. JRJoe Rogan39:20

       So four books, five years.

    9. JCJack Carr39:22

       Yes.

    10. JRJoe Rogan39:22

        Boom.

    11. JCJack Carr39:23

        Bang.

    12. JRJoe Rogan39:23

        And killing it.

    13. JCJack Carr39:24

        There we go. I mean-

    14. JRJoe Rogan39:25

        Pretty wild.

    15. JCJack Carr39:25

        It's crazy. It's crazy.

    16. JRJoe Rogan39:26

        But they're great, man. They're great. They're, they are fucking... They're... They lock you in.

    17. JCJack Carr39:31

        Ah, thank you.

    18. JRJoe Rogan39:32

        They're gripping.

    19. JCJack Carr39:33

        Thank you. And this one actually, each one has a distinctly different theme and I wanted to make sure that I stayed on theme for each book, which actually helped out a ton because when it got to Simon & Schuster, I thought they were going to change it big time. I was like, "Oh, it's, it's, it's, it's the big leagues now." They're gonna... If they want to put exploding robots from outer space in, guess what's going in? Exploding robots from outer space.

    20. JRJoe Rogan39:48

        Did they actually give you those kind of suggestions-

    21. JCJack Carr39:50

        No.

    22. JRJoe Rogan39:50

        ... as to what... No.

    23. JCJack Carr39:51

        Nothing.

    24. JRJoe Rogan39:52

        That's great.

    25. JCJack Carr39:52

        So I've had no... Yeah, they changed al- or, uh, or they asked me to change almost nothing. Um, and I think that's 'cause I had that theme. I had it on a, a yellow sticky pad 'cause I heard Steven Pressfield on your podcast talking about... And I misinterpreted him. He... Uh, what I thought he said was that he took a yellow sticky and put it on his typewriter with a one-word theme for his novels.

    26. JRJoe Rogan40:09

        Oh.

    27. JCJack Carr40:09

        That's what I... And so I was like, "Yes."

    28. JRJoe Rogan40:11

        What was he actually saying?

    29. JCJack Carr40:11

        So that's... What he actually did, he told you a story about a playwright who wrote a one-sentence theme for his plays and then somehow, in... I translated that through whatever filters I have going.

    30. JRJoe Rogan40:21

        (laughs)
14. 41:38 – 43:22

    synchronicity

    1. JCJack Carr41:38

    2. JRJoe Rogan41:38

       I want to get to that and I want to get to that bear hunt too.

    3. JCJack Carr41:41

       (laughs)

    4. JRJoe Rogan41:41

       But it's crazy the synchronicity of you writing this book about a pandemic while a pandemic hit.

    5. JCJack Carr41:49

       Yep.

    6. JRJoe Rogan41:50

       Like you wrote the book. You were way deep into the book and then COVID-19 hits-

    7. JCJack Carr41:55

       Yep.

    8. JRJoe Rogan41:56

       ... towards the end of your writing.

    9. JCJack Carr41:58

       ... top, well, like, middle, yeah, ish.

    10. JRJoe Rogan41:59

        Middle?

    11. JCJack Carr41:59

        Yeah, yeah. Yeah, middleish.

    12. JRJoe Rogan42:00

        So but you were- already had the concept-

    13. JCJack Carr42:02

        Mm-hmm.

    14. JRJoe Rogan42:02

        ... you had already outlined it-

    15. JCJack Carr42:04

        Yeah.

    16. JRJoe Rogan42:04

        ... you started the writing-

    17. JCJack Carr42:05

        Yep.

    18. JRJoe Rogan42:05

        ... you're in the middle-

    19. JCJack Carr42:06

        Exactly.

    20. JRJoe Rogan42:06

        ... of the book?

    21. JCJack Carr42:07

        Yep. I mean, like, when I talked to you last time, when we were here in early May of last year, I was in the middle of it. And, you know, some authors I heard talking about how they didn't want to incorporate COVID-19 into, into their writing, because they want people to have an escape and that sort of thing. But for me, the book is about what the enemy is learning from us. And they're watching our response to COVID-19. They are watching our response to this virus. And they're watching our response to the civil unrest of the summer. They are watching our response-

    22. JRJoe Rogan42:30

        Yeah.

    23. JCJack Carr42:30

        ... to a very contentious political season and a, uh, a- an election cycle. And they're taking those lessons, and they're applying them to those future battle plans. And I ran into a problem. This is the problem I ran into. In Au- uh, in October or November, I had myself in the enemy's shoes for over a year as I'm writing this thing, looking at things from their perspective. And I'm like, "You know what? If I was the enemy, I might just sit back and watch. We're doing a pretty good job of destroying ourselves from the inside out."

    24. JRJoe Rogan42:54

        Hmm.

    25. JCJack Carr42:54

        "We're doing a pretty good job of tearing ourselves apart right now, with all these what seem like irreconcilable political differences, all this cancel culture, all this violence. Like, we're doing a pretty good job of messing up this amazing thing that we have here in the United States." Uh, so I had to figure out a tool that would, uh, allow the enemy to actually need to strike while we're kind of on our knees right now. So, but it's- you have to solve those problems as you're, as you're writing. But it was a serious problem, because we're in some dire straits right now, I think.

    26. JRJoe Rogan43:19

        It's a very strange time.

15. 43:22 – 51:33

    internet research agency

    1. JRJoe Rogan43:22

    2. JCJack Carr43:22

       Yeah.

    3. JRJoe Rogan43:23

       It's a, It's a very strange time, is, uh, because we haven't done this before, and then it's being accentuated by social media.

    4. JCJack Carr43:31

       Mm-hmm.

    5. JRJoe Rogan43:31

       You know, there was the civil rights unrest of the 1960s. But what we're in now is different, because there's opportunists now, in, in not just, uh, abroad- at home, but also abroad, that are engaging with the social media thought bubbles and m- poisoning the water.

    6. JCJack Carr43:48

       Uh-huh.

    7. JRJoe Rogan43:48

       And so, y- you're, you're aware of the Internet Research Agency from Russia? Do you know about all that?

    8. JCJack Carr43:53

       No, I don't.

    9. JRJoe Rogan43:54

       It's really fascinating, right? There's this woman named Renee DiResta, and she came on the podcast, uh, a little over a year ago. And she outlined what she learned from watching the, uh, social media use from Russia from the 2016 election.

    10. JCJack Carr44:11

        Oh.

    11. JRJoe Rogan44:11

        And what they do is they have untold numbers of accounts that are coming from this company called the Internet Research Agency. It's Russia-funded.

    12. JCJack Carr44:21

        Okay.

    13. JRJoe Rogan44:22

        And it's, it's a state thing, where they, they basically are trying to get people in America to argue with each other.

    14. JCJack Carr44:28

        Oh, okay.

    15. JRJoe Rogan44:29

        And they do crazy shit like, one, they had a Texas, uh, like a pro-Texas, like Texas secession-

    16. JCJack Carr44:35

        Oh, my God.

    17. JRJoe Rogan44:35

        ... meeting, and they scheduled it across from a, uh, pro-Islam-

    18. JCJack Carr44:40

        Right.

    19. JRJoe Rogan44:41

        ... meeting, like on the same block.

    20. JCJack Carr44:43

        Yeah. Right.

    21. JRJoe Rogan44:43

        Like, they do it on purpose. And it was like, like, and these memes.

    22. JCJack Carr44:47

        Mm-hmm.

    23. JRJoe Rogan44:47

        One of the things they do is they write funny memes. She reviewed thousands and thousands and thousands of memes, and she said some of them are really funny.

    24. JCJack Carr44:55

        Yeah.

    25. JRJoe Rogan44:55

        And they're really well-made.

    26. JCJack Carr44:57

        Uh-huh.

    27. JRJoe Rogan44:57

        And they're done by these Russian agents, and their job is to sow unrest.

    28. JCJack Carr45:03

        There we go.

    29. JRJoe Rogan45:03

        So their job is to start... And she would... She also outlined how they would start one page, and they would build it up and get a bunch of followers. And then once they got followers, like, you know, they'd get, like, 20,000, 30,000 followers, then they would switch the theme and make it a Black Lives Matter page-

    30. JCJack Carr45:20

        Oh.
16. 51:33 – 54:08

    covid passports

    1. JRJoe Rogan51:33

       th- they're doing it-

    2. JCJack Carr51:33

       Ugh.

    3. JRJoe Rogan51:33

       ... in a way that they think they're doing the right thing. Like, there's a lot of people that are calling for COVID passports, and a lot of people are freaking out and going, "Hey, listen. This is gonna be abused because this is not something you're gonna be able to pull back." If they do have COVID passports, what's gonna happen is they're just gonna apply that to all kinds of other things. Once you, you have a passport that says you need something in order to go here, you need to make sure that you have a vaccination in order to go here, in order to move around, you have to have something, that means they're gonna be tracking you. So if they're tracking you, if they're, they're not just tracking you like they are because of your cellphone, like, you can-

    4. JCJack Carr52:11

       Right.

    5. JRJoe Rogan52:11

       ... if you go in tower to tower, they can track you no matter what. But what if it's required that they track you? 'Cause right now, it's not required that you have a phone.

    6. JCJack Carr52:18

       Yeah.

    7. JRJoe Rogan52:18

       Right? If you have a driver's license and you go to the airport, you don't have to have a phone on you. But what if you do? And that could happen-

    8. JCJack Carr52:25

       Mm-hmm.

    9. JRJoe Rogan52:25

       ... if you need a p- a COVID passport. We could get to a point-

    10. JCJack Carr52:28

        Yeah.

    11. JRJoe Rogan52:28

        ... where everyone needs to have some sort of a smartphone with a GPS in order to be able to travel freely and you have to be able to do the right thing. Well, then something comes along and they decide, "Well, now we have the flu," or, "Now we have this," or, you know, "You can't do that because you've supported X or you supported Y."

    12. JCJack Carr52:45

        Yep.

    13. JRJoe Rogan52:46

        Like, there's a lot of people that after Trump was out of office, they wanted to find people who had supported Trump and put them on a list-

    14. JCJack Carr52:53

        Oh, yeah.

    15. JRJoe Rogan52:53

        ... and blackmail or, uh, blacklist those people-

    16. JCJack Carr52:56

        Yep.

    17. JRJoe Rogan52:56

        ... and keep those people from working, make sure those people are punished.

    18. JCJack Carr52:59

        Yep.

    19. JRJoe Rogan53:00

        Like, Jesus Christ, folks. Do you remember history?

    20. JCJack Carr53:02

        Yeah.

    21. JRJoe Rogan53:03

        Like, this has all been done before. You n- you guys need to read history.

    22. JCJack Carr53:05

        Yeah.

    23. JRJoe Rogan53:05

        Because you can't put people on a fucking list, and you can't make people held responsible for a political decision that may or may not have been correct or wise-... but then you can change your mind in the future. What you should be doing is trying to influence people's opinions by giving them better information, not putting them on a fucking list-

    24. JCJack Carr53:27

        Yep.

    25. JRJoe Rogan53:27

        ... and telling them, you know, like, "You're never gonna work again-

    26. JCJack Carr53:29

        Right.

    27. JRJoe Rogan53:29

        ... 'cause you were an enemy-

    28. JCJack Carr53:30

        No doubt.

    29. JRJoe Rogan53:30

        ... and now we won, so we're gonna do this, we're gonna do that." Like...

    30. JCJack Carr53:33

        Oh, yeah. It's all being, all being weaponized. And it's, uh, the, the marketplace of ideas and being able to express your opinions in this marketplace of ideas, that's what really this, the, w- is part of the foundation of this country, is having that, those best ideas then gravitate to the top, because that's where you're c- it's competition. It's out there.
17. 54:08 – 58:26

    police visit podcaster

    1. JCJack Carr54:08

    2. JRJoe Rogan54:08

       Do you-

    3. JCJack Carr54:08

       All about power and control.

    4. JRJoe Rogan54:08

       Do you, do you know the story about this guy who is a, a liberal journalist who... What did he do? He agreed with someone that said something? He liked something about Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.

    5. JCJack Carr54:21

       All right.

    6. JRJoe Rogan54:21

       And the police came to his house.

    7. JCJack Carr54:24

       I heard, yep.

    8. JRJoe Rogan54:24

       Did you, did you hear this story?

    9. JCJack Carr54:25

       I did.

    10. JRJoe Rogan54:25

        Pull this story up 'cause it's-

    11. JCJack Carr54:26

        Yep.

    12. JRJoe Rogan54:26

        ... so crazy-

    13. JCJack Carr54:28

        Crazy.

    14. JRJoe Rogan54:28

        ... that you, you go, "This can't be real."

    15. JCJack Carr54:30

        And here we are.

    16. JRJoe Rogan54:30

        Now, I don't think that it's AOC who's doing this. It's probably some fucking nutty AOC reporter, or, uh, supporter, rather. "Police visit the home of podcaster after he criticized AOC on Twitter." So, pull up the story because this is so crazy. This is like-

    17. JCJack Carr54:46

        So crazy.

    18. JRJoe Rogan54:47

        ... Communist China-type shit.

    19. JCJack Carr54:48

        Yeah. Act- uh, it's so crazy that I feel like there has to be more to it, when I heard about it the other night, but I mean-

    20. JRJoe Rogan54:53

        No, it's not. Go, sc- sc- please scroll down so I can s- read this. Here it goes. No, no, no. So I can read that tweet?

    21. JCJack Carr54:58

        Oh, yeah, it's about that interview-

    22. JRJoe Rogan54:59

        Yeah.

    23. JCJack Carr54:59

        ... that she had, which was (laughs) -

    24. JRJoe Rogan55:00

        See, yeah. The, the, to the interview was fucking insane.

    25. JCJack Carr55:02

        Oh, my gosh.

    26. JRJoe Rogan55:03

        And so ridiculous.

    27. JCJack Carr55:04

        Uh-huh.

    28. JRJoe Rogan55:05

        "On April 1st, AOC did a livestream with Michael Miller, the head of the Jewish Community Relations Council of New York. She was asked about peace between Israelis and Palestinians. Her response was incredibly underwhelming, to say the very least." Now, if you listen to her response, she's unprepared. She doesn't really have a thing to say about this, so she basically just sort of uses word salad, and it's a nonsense answer.

    29. JCJack Carr55:27

        Yeah. It's bad.

    30. JRJoe Rogan55:28

        Okay, no, but, uh, go back down. Go back. Right there. Um, "Really shaken up right now." Uh, she, so the guy puts this thing saying it's, uh, underwhelming. He puts it up on Twitter. Uh, "I'm really shaken right now." This is the next tweet. "I was just visited by two plainclothes police officers from California Highway Patrol at my home. They said they came here on behalf of the Capitol Police and accused me of threatening AOC on Twitter yesterday. This is provably false." So, you, go back up to what we just saw.

Episode duration: 2:55:26