Joe Rogan Experience #1673 - Colin Wright

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast.…

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out.

   2. CWColin Wright0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:06

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. (rock music plays) Hello, Colin.

   4. CWColin Wright0:15

      How's it going, Joe?

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      W- well, first of all, it's going great. Thank you very much, first of all, uh, for this bottle of, uh, this is distilled honey, right?

   6. CWColin Wright0:25

      It's distilled mead.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:26

      Distilled mead.

   8. CWColin Wright0:26

      Yeah. So-

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:27

      So mead is like a beer made out of hon- well, kind of like-

   10. CWColin Wright0:30

       Yeah. It's like a honey wine. So when you make rum, that's basically just like a distilled, uh, fermented sugarcane product in beer, or i- and whiskey is a distilled beer. And then if you wanna have brandy, that's sort of a distilled fruit wine of some sort.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:46

       Mm.

   12. CWColin Wright0:46

       So this is sort of a unique thing. This is distilled mead, so straight from honey. So I think it's one of the most like crafty spirits there are, because like good luck replicating all the stuff that the bees did to, to make that honey and then the fermentation process. And then that was put in a pot still by myself.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:02

       Well, I had mead for the first time last weekend actually.

   14. CWColin Wright1:05

       Oh, okay.

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:06

       I was at, uh, Maynard Keenan's place in, um, Scottsdale, Arizona. M- um, uh, American Vineyards. You know Maynard from Tool?

   16. CWColin Wright1:13

       Yeah, yeah. For sure.

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:14

       You know, he's a, he's actually a wine guy. He makes wine. What would you call that? A... What is a wine producer?

   18. CWColin Wright1:21

       Viticulturist? Enologist?

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:23

       Wine maker? (laughs) I'm sorry. Well, uh, whatever he is, he makes mead as well. It was interesting. I was like, "Oh, this is tasty." Like a weird sort of wine-ish kind of thing.

   20. CWColin Wright1:35

       Yeah. I'm sort of halfway interested in actual drinking mead itself. Uh, I'm more into like distilling that product and making a spirit. And for some reason... So I w- the first time I had honey shine was in Wisconsin. I was at a conference there, and just something I never had before. And you can actually taste like the honey and the floral, uh, notes that come through at the very end.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:57

       And you made this?

   22. CWColin Wright1:59

       I did.

   23. JRJoe Rogan2:00

       Ooh. How'd you make it?

   24. CWColin Wright2:02

       Uh, I have a, a copper pot still, and you just basically make five gallons of mead, wait till it's really dry so all the sugars have been converted to alcohols, pour it in the pot still-

   25. JRJoe Rogan2:13

       I gotta taste this, brothers.

   26. CWColin Wright2:13

       ... and then there you go.

   27. JRJoe Rogan2:14

       How strong is it?

   28. CWColin Wright2:16

       It's 100 proof.

   29. JRJoe Rogan2:17

       Oh. Wow.

   30. CWColin Wright2:24

       There you go.
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   Yeah, well there's so…

   1. JRJoe Rogan15:00

      a thing today?

   2. CWColin Wright15:02

      Yeah, well there's so many different aspects to the ideology. So in the specific area of, I guess, the whole sex denial thing, I think there's this, sort of this allergy to, to the word discrimination in a way, where we're been told that discrimination is a terrible thing always. But, I mean it might sound controversial but discrimination just means that we're b- distinguishing between two different things in a certain context. They-

   3. JRJoe Rogan15:30

      Where we think of discrimination as like prejudice.

   4. CWColin Wright15:32

      Yeah, we can, yeah, "I'm, I'm discriminating in this certain-"

   5. JRJoe Rogan15:35

      Yeah.

   6. CWColin Wright15:35

      "... this certain thing." I mean if you, if you have a, a children's sports league, that discriminates against adults and most people would say that that's a good, that's a good type of discrimination.

   7. JRJoe Rogan15:43

      Right.

   8. CWColin Wright15:43

      But we've just sort of adopted this idea that discrimination is really bad and so now when we talk about, uh, trans women in sports or something, w- you know, they think they're being discriminated against and what you'll see in the headlines is, you know, "Women and girls are not able, who are trans are not able to play in sports for women and girls." What they fail to mention is that it's not the fact that they're trans (laughs) that is the reason why they're not being able to compete. It's the fact that they're, you know, biologically male and that's the, the thing that's being kept, uh, that we're trying to discriminate against, not the fact that they're trans, because trans is just like a state of mind that they can have. They declare if th- that they're trans, you know, you can't verify it empirically in any way and, um, so there's just, there's no reason to segregate sports by just a, a state of your mind basically anymore that you would want to segregate sports by political ideology or something else that's completely irrelevant. So I think an aversion to the, the concept of, uh, the, the idea that discrimination is bad just across the board is, is holding us back from having more productive conversations, and then I know you've had people like James Lindsay on and they, they talk about just the, the critical theory, the queer theory that's out there where it's just meant to just pick apart anything. Anytime there's, they see a binary they need to deconstruct it and deconstruct it, and there's, it's based on this, uh, epistemology of, of relativistic, um, you know, w- relative truth, um, blurring borders between other things, systems of power. This is sort of the ideology that has, is taking root in a lot of different areas in society and, and it's really been coming to a head in the last few years on, on many topics too, on the whole sex and gender debate. We have the critical race theory stuff, we have the postcolonial, you know, uh, decolonize the curriculum and you know, it's just, it's spreading out of control.

   9. JRJoe Rogan17:36

      (laughs)

   10. CWColin Wright17:36

       And then people who, who are not, who are, who are not the postmodern type, people who are, you know, have the enlightenment values and, and we're modernists in the way we approach the world, we think that, you know, if something's true if it corresponds to reality and there's certain truths that, uh, can't really be denied by anybody. A lot of us are pushing back and because we've seemed to have lost a lot of, uh, uh, foothold in the institutions, it's now resulting in, you know, people getting canceled.

   11. JRJoe Rogan18:04

       Yeah, it's a strange time in that regard where it just, it seems like no one knows exactly what our, our cultural framework is anymore for discussing things and every time the, the, it gets pushed further and further along you have to kinda catch up with what you're allowed to say and what you're allowed to talk about and w- what's okay. Like, it didn't used to be controversial to say there are two genders. There's only two genders. But if you say it today, you could get fired from your job. I mean, that's a real thing. You can get discriminated against. You can die.... not that discrimination's bad-

   12. NANarrator18:39

       (laughs)

   13. CWColin Wright18:40

       (laughs)

   14. JRJoe Rogan18:40

       ... as we've discussed. But you know what I mean? It's like, it's ... This is a new thing, th- to, to get to a position where, uh, uh, talking about biological facts, you really shouldn't. You have to discuss the societal agreement, the cultural agreement we have about, like, how we view or, you know, this is what, what the, the push is, or what, you know, this idea of, uh, compliance, forced compliance into this ideology. You have to, you have to accept what we view now as sex and gender.

   15. CWColin Wright19:13

       Yeah. Th- there's, like, a language takeover.

   16. JRJoe Rogan19:15

       Yeah.

   17. CWColin Wright19:16

       And even when you said just earlier, a second ago, that there's, you know, there's two genders. Well, they've just co-opted the, that word gender.

   18. JRJoe Rogan19:24

       Mm-hmm.

   19. CWColin Wright19:24

       And so what used to be the case, and this was something that I was on board with, I was a good, you know, I considered myself progressive, was a lot of people would say that sex and gender are different things. Sex referred to your reproductive anatomy, your biology. And gender referred to just the way you identify. You know, you can identify as a man or a woman, or, you know, if they wanna expand that, whatever that means. Um, it has to do with identity. It's sort of like sex is your hardware, uh, gender is your software.

   20. JRJoe Rogan19:52

       Right.

   21. CWColin Wright19:52

       Where you can be a male and identify as a woman. And that was something that I was sort of willing to get on board with, and I was like, "Okay, why do we need to have the same ... You know, we ha- already have male and female to refer to sex, why do we need to also use man and woman?" Maybe we can just let, you know, the, those people have, have that. Because as a biologist, it didn't really ... I, my, my, my defense didn't really go up because as long as we're, we know what sex is, then that's fine. I can ... I'll be willing to manage that. And then slowly over time, that distinction became more and more blurry where now they would say instead of, "Identify as a man or a woman," they say, "Identify as a male or a female." And they're using the sex terms where they used to use gender terms. And then I'd started seeing on my Facebook popping up people with PhDs in biology sharing articles like there are five sexes, or there's seven different sexes, or sex is a social construct. And, I mean, this was ... A- a- as I started pushing back against that, I, I thought they must have been talking about gender identity, but it became very clear that, no, they're talking about actual sex itself and that there's, you know, every different chromosomal arrangement that someone can have. Like if you're a Klinefelter male or something, you have XYY, uh, chromosomes, that you're a, your own unique sex now rather than just, you know, variation within, within the male, the male sex.

   22. JRJoe Rogan21:15

       Do you have a theory as to w- what caused all this, or as to why it's, it seems to be progressing? It's not, it's not like they reached a point and they went, "Okay, I think we made our point. Let's, uh, let's sort of normalize this and have it be accepted into the, the common g- you know, thoughts of people." But that's, that's not what's happening. It's just like it keeps getting weirder and weirder and weirder. It's like they keep pushing the envelope about what it means.

   23. CWColin Wright21:42

       Yeah. There's no one to put on the brakes, really.

   24. JRJoe Rogan21:45

       Right.

   25. CWColin Wright21:45

       I mean, they've, they're within the institutions, and the people who would normally wanna speak up, um, like, like I did, they get called names. They, you know, I was looking for tenure track positions and I had people post on, on job boards in my field that thousands of biologists look every day that I was a transphobe and a race scientist, that they just threw in on top of things just to, you know, throw a bunch of slurs at me and see what sticks and try to, uh, poison the well for my, my, my potential hiring. And so people see that that happens, and then they just, they just don't wanna do it. They stay quiet.

   26. JRJoe Rogan22:20

       Right.

   27. CWColin Wright22:20

       And then, so all you hear is the, the loudest voices, the most activists, uh, they come out and they'll, they'll just say this type of stuff. And then a lot of people don't wanna say anything because they're generally confused because of the jargon that's being used. Um, and then they'll kind of do a human shield aspect where they're, they're portraying themselves as sort of the next evolution of LGBT rights, or in the terms of critical race theory, well, then this next civil rights movement. And so no one wants to be on the wrong side of history, even though they don't understand what people are saying. Sounds nuts, but who are they to really judge what this is? They just, they don't wanna be called a racist because that's the worst thing you can be called. They don't wanna be called a transphobe because we all wanna be accepting people. And, uh, fortunately I think a lot of people are (laughs) sort of beginning to see that and they're willing to stand up a little bit more now and at least call it like it is, saying that these people have a really bad concept of what biological sex actually is. No, there's not seven sexes. No, sex isn't a, you know, a bimodal distribution where we're just varying degrees of maleness and femaleness. You know, we can, we can definitively say for, you know, 4,999 people out of, out of 5,000 that they are unambiguously male or female, uh, and, you know, we can account for the 1% that's not, but, um, that doesn't make all of us sort of in question of what, what our sex is.

   28. JRJoe Rogan23:42

       So did you start ... You s- you, you're saying you were a progressive. You started out thinking in, in terms of, like, a progressive ideology, but then-

   29. CWColin Wright23:51

       I was pro the gay rights movement and, yeah, for sure.

   30. JRJoe Rogan23:54

       And what, if anything, has changed?
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   So, what is happening…

   1. CWColin Wright30:00

      a- a woman who would have been there. Like, I'll- I'd get last place in a power lifting competition, um...

   2. JRJoe Rogan30:05

      So, what is happening though? Like, why do you think the- the International Olympic Committee is choosing to do this? Because it seems to me that if I was a biological woman, I would be furious. Uh, I would- I would be thinking, "I can't believe I spent so many years training for this and preparing my body for this, and now a biological male is gonna take my spot."

   3. CWColin Wright30:27

      Inclusion, that's just the buzzword of the day.

   4. JRJoe Rogan30:29

      Inclusion.

   5. CWColin Wright30:29

      Everyone...

   6. JRJoe Rogan30:30

      Yeah. But, I mean...

   7. CWColin Wright30:31

      Diversity, equity, inclusion.

   8. JRJoe Rogan30:32

      I- is it, if we had an overall vote though, I mean...

   9. CWColin Wright30:35

      Oh, that'd be done.

   10. JRJoe Rogan30:35

       ... is the- is the issue that more people who, um, support these things are in the camp of "activists," people that will complain and write letters and emails and call and- and do something to try to cancel or get rid of something versus people that disagree with it...... and they don't do much about it. They just, they just go, "Well, I don't think it's right that a biological male competes against a female, but what am I gonna do?" You know? Like, they're not organized-

   11. CWColin Wright31:08

       If it was-

   12. JRJoe Rogan31:08

       ... in that regard.

   13. CWColin Wright31:08

       ... if it was a vote, it would, it'd be pretty unanimous. It'd be-

   14. JRJoe Rogan31:13

       It'd be pretty close.

   15. CWColin Wright31:15

       I don't think it'd be pretty close. I think... I, I don't, I don't think you-

   16. JRJoe Rogan31:17

       No, that's what I meant. I meant-

   17. CWColin Wright31:18

       Oh.

   18. JRJoe Rogan31:18

       ... close to unanimous.

   19. CWColin Wright31:19

       Yeah, yeah, yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan31:20

       Yeah.

   21. CWColin Wright31:20

       Um...

   22. JRJoe Rogan31:20

       I think there's would be a few knuckleheads in there that are in denial.

   23. CWColin Wright31:24

       Yeah. I mean, you're gonna get all the, all the woke activists are gonna vote for yes, but most of the people who are outside of that small percentage are not going to. But-

   24. JRJoe Rogan31:32

       But the result of ad hominems too, or they, um, they just, they can't... The, the idea is that you have to be a bigot if you think this is unfair. Like, that's the only, the only solution, or the only possible explanation for why-

   25. CWColin Wright31:47

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan31:47

       ... why you don't think it's fair.

   27. CWColin Wright31:48

       Well, I mean, unfortunately it's not up for a vote. And they found a way to sort of get their ideology through without people voting on it by, again, manipulating the language behind it.

   28. JRJoe Rogan31:59

       Mm-hmm.

   29. CWColin Wright32:00

       Where you look at the WNBA, that's the Women's National Basketball Association, and you know, they, they'll talk about what a woman is, is a gender identity.

   30. JRJoe Rogan32:09

       Hmm.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   Hm. …

   1. CWColin Wright45:00

      of this ideology, "What is a woman?"

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:03

      Hm.

   3. CWColin Wright45:03

      And you will get just insanity back. "Anyone who lives and identifies as a woman." "Okay, how do you live as a woman?" "Well, you know, a woman can live any way she wants to as long as..." Then I have as long as they identify as a... "Well, what are you identifying with?" "With womanhood." What is, it, it just, it spirals down, and it really comes down to... 'Cause when you see how they're presenting then, it's usually extremely feminine, and it's like, okay, you're basing what a woman is on just stereotypes of femininity.

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:32

      Right.

   5. CWColin Wright45:32

      And same thing with, with being a man. That's what they're doing. They will just deny that that's what they're doing, but there's just no other, there's no other option. That's clearly what's going on in these situations. And then you, so you get these gender-nonconforming kids that are, you know, being told that, "Oh, you're behaving very boy-like." You know, maybe, and you're a female, maybe, you know, you're a tomboy. Maybe you're actually, you know, trapped in the wrong body or something. And it's just completely insane the way this is infecting a lot of, of kids minds who are just confused about what their sex is. It's-

   6. JRJoe Rogan46:06

      Yeah.

   7. CWColin Wright46:06

      I mean, that's why, I mean, I, I talk a lot about this stuff and the whole, uh, sex spectrum and stuff on, on my Substack, Reality's Last Stand, because, I mean, I do feel like if we can't get these questions right on what sex is, that there's only two sexes, male and female, like there's just not many more levees after this that can hold back the, the flood of insanity. That, I mean, what, what, what's gonna be, what's after male and female aren't real? I mean, what, what's-

   8. JRJoe Rogan46:35

      Yeah. That's my question.

   9. CWColin Wright46:36

      What's downstream from that? I don't even-

   10. JRJoe Rogan46:36

       'Cause it does seem to be going in that direction where it's not... It's getting more crazy and more frantic, right? It doesn't, it doesn't seem like it's getting better, like we've reached some sort of a-

   11. CWColin Wright46:46

       Yeah.

   12. JRJoe Rogan46:47

       ... a plateau, and we're like, "Yeah, you know what? Maybe we're wrong about this, and maybe there are some people that are on this, uh, weird biological spectrum." But for the most part, it's clear, male versus female or, you know, there's, there's v- two clear distinct differences.

   13. CWColin Wright47:04

       Yeah. I, I usually try to liken it to a, a coin flip 'cause that seems to help in people's minds 'cause if you get... There's been studies like how many times can you flip a nickel before it lands on its edge? And it turns out to be about one out of 6,000 flips you'll get a nickel that lands on its edge 'cause they've got like the flat edge to them. And that's very close to the percentage or the, the p- probabilities of someone who's born intersex. And so, yeah, you can have people land on an edge. They can be sort of an ambiguous case, but for the most part, a coin flip is unambiguously heads or unambiguously tails. Tails doesn't come in percentages. It's either 100% or 0%, and that's just kind of how human bodies are, are, are put together. Most of us are just unambiguously male or female. And just because we have an edge case doesn't mean that male and female are just sort of these ambiguous categories anymore.

   14. JRJoe Rogan47:56

       But the thing is people don't want you to say that because they feel like somehow or another you saying that is eliminating progress. And my question is where's it progressing to? Like where does this... Where's, where does reality completely dissolve?

   15. CWColin Wright48:13

       That's what I'm, I mean, that's what I'm trying to hold back, hold back the levy there.

   16. JRJoe Rogan48:16

       (laughs)

   17. CWColin Wright48:16

       I mean, have you seen, have you seen the, the genderbread person?

   18. JRJoe Rogan48:21

       No.

   19. CWColin Wright48:22

       Oh, my.

   20. JRJoe Rogan48:22

       I'm scared.

   21. CWColin Wright48:24

       Pull it up, Jake.

   22. JRJoe Rogan48:26

       Ugh.

   23. CWColin Wright48:26

       The, uh, actually if you go-

   24. JRJoe Rogan48:28

       The genderbread person.

   25. CWColin Wright48:28

       There's an article. There, there's a version of it that's... But if you go to, um... It's an article I wrote on Quillette. It's called "JK Rowling is Right, Sex is Real and Not a Spectrum." I have a good, a good version on there. They've updated the version a little bit, but they're still, this is being shown in classrooms.

   26. JRJoe Rogan48:45

       Hf, it's amazing how aggressive people are if they disagree with you on this stuff too. This is like one of the most aggressive subjects. You got it? If it's not... Okay, it is. The genderbread person.

   27. CWColin Wright49:01

       Okay, yeah. So this is my article in Quillette that basically debunks the sex spectrum. Now it starts off, it's a, it starts off with JK Rowling on this thing, but actually I have another version on my Substack, Reality's Last Stand, that doesn't start off with JK Rowling because I got... People told me that...... they can't show this to their relatives because they hate J. K. Rowling because she's a transphobe.

   28. JRJoe Rogan49:21

       (laughs)

   29. CWColin Wright49:21

       So, can you write me another version that doesn't have-

   30. JRJoe Rogan49:23

       God.
5. 1:00:00 – 1:15:00

   Especially if they have…

   1. CWColin Wright1:00:00

      actually d- wreck a lot of havoc on people because they've just never had that mechanism before, where people are actually somehow paying attention to what they're getting back on Twitter.

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:00:09

      Especially if they have multiple accounts. But one, one of the things that I've been thinking of lately is like, um, the, the ability to sway people one way or the other in terms of the, the way they feel about either a political issue or a social issue. A lot of times it's based on the, you know, the way the crowd is reacting. It's based on what, what you're seeing from your peers or from the people that follow you or the people that are in your mentions. If China wanted to do this, and I'm sure they're doing it, just like the Russian Internet Research Agency was doing it, they would create a gigantic amount of fake accounts, use those fake accounts, and, uh, they can shift the public narrative on a lot of different issues. Just by attacking people and by getting multiple other people to attack people in a really personalized way, where, where it's per- personal, where you, you, these people feel terrible, and then you don't want that to happen to you. So again, self-censorship. But if they just decide to do this as a concerted effort, like, you can erode a democracy. You really can.

   3. CWColin Wright1:01:12

      Yeah.

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:01:12

      You can erode the way people communicate with each other. You can erode our culture. And it's-... you don't wanna be cynical, but you gotta wonder, like, what starts, what i- what are the wings of the butterfly that start the storm? Like, where... Is this engineered? Because if someone was gonna engineer some sort of a deterioration of society, boy, you couldn't really do any better than what's going on, 'cause morale is at an all-time low in a lot of places. The way people communicate is really weird right now.

   5. CWColin Wright1:01:40

      Yeah.

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:01:40

      And it's just, uh, it doesn't show any signs of, uh, there being, uh, a, like an end to this road. Like, where does this road stop?

   7. CWColin Wright1:01:49

      Yeah. I mean, the, the institution's getting captured, and once you get to a certain threshold, it just sort of spirals down where, you know, the institution's 50% ideologically based, that might, you know, it's pretty sustainable. But once it gets past, like, it's 90%, you know, Democrat or something-

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:02:07

      Yeah.

   9. CWColin Wright1:02:07

      ... then, if they're, especially if they're i- influential on who gets hired, they can sort of self-select, and it's never been easier to go on social media and Google someone you're hiring and saying, you know, "Does this person... What's their politics like?" You know, that happens in academia all the time, um, where people are actually googling who they're hiring in their departments. And if you were wearing a Trump hat, you know, I'm not a Trump supporter or anything, but good luck ever getting a job in, as an academic scientist if you have a Facebook picture of you wearing a Trump hat and you're not being ironic about it. Even if you're joking about it, you probably wouldn't want to keep it.

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:02:37

       Yeah, you can't even have it ironically. You actually get paid for that hat?

   11. CWColin Wright1:02:40

       Yeah. And so, they, they take... Once the institutions sort of get captured in this way, man, there, there's not a way to get 'em out. I mean, I talk about when I used to argue in, a- against the creationism and intelligent design. It was so easy, because I was in universities. None of the biologists around there are creationists. Eh, sometime- at my community college, we had one, and he was, you know, he didn't teach carbon dating because it was like the devil or something.

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:03:05

       Really?

   13. CWColin Wright1:03:06

       Yeah, yeah. He was completely young Earth creationist. Uh-

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:03:09

       I would stay in touch with that guy.

   15. CWColin Wright1:03:11

       (laughs) Yeah.

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:03:11

       Let's see how his life keeps going.

   17. CWColin Wright1:03:12

       But for the most part, if I'm, if I'm arguing against creationists and intelligent design people, this is like, you know, you're getting support from your colleagues. They're like, "Oh, yeah, get him." You know, no one says you're too strident when you're writing an essay against them. But then, when I started seeing a lot of this ideology bubble up around my colleagues, and then I started pushing back a little bit, well, now, like, the, the craziness is inside the walls of the university where... 'Cause before, Christians didn't have any major presence in the university, at least not the ones who were creationists and intelligent design people, so there was no chance of them taking over the university and now creationism is in all the textbooks and that type of stuff. But now this sort of, this thing is happening within the universities, and then, you know, I would just make my straightforward argument about there's two sexes and it's important to acknowledge them in certain situations, and then it's just a, a wave of hate. And it's not even a, "You're, you're wrong." At least the creationists and intelligent design people told me, "Collin, you're wrong," maybe they called me stupid, whatever. But now it's, "You're not even wrong, you're just a bigot. You're a horrible person. You're literally leading to the lives of, of trans people getting killed. You're making students on Penn State when I worked there feel unsafe on campus," because I'm working on my ant experiments there or something, and I had a, I had an opinion that got published somewhere. Like, that's, that's the situation in the universities, and-

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:04:37

       It's like it's been infiltrated by a religion.

   19. CWColin Wright1:04:39

       Oh, yeah. I mean, I'm all there.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:04:42

       It really does, it does seem like a religion.

   21. CWColin Wright1:04:43

       And ha- and h- having argued with creationists and intelligent design people for a good part of my life, I mean, that's what got me into wanting to be an evolutionary biologist in the first place, is knowing that these people are nuts (laughs) and not really knowing, having the knowledge and tools to, to sort of combat this in- the insanity I was seeing, so I just decided to read a bunch about evolution, and, and I just made it my job, basically.

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:05:05

       But again, I'll ask you, where does this go?

   23. CWColin Wright1:05:08

       I don't know.

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:05:09

       Like, wh- how's it end?

   25. CWColin Wright1:05:10

       That's why I'm, that's why I'm here talking to you. That's why I wanna let people know that this is, this is scary stuff. This is like... Where do you go, where do you go? I, I mean, I don't know. It's, uh, we go to scary places, (laughs) I think, and I, I don't, I don't wanna find out where that is, because if we don't have a f- if we lose this foothold, like, there's just no more footholds to have, I don't know, you just-

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:05:27

       Well, it's like-

   27. CWColin Wright1:05:28

       ... we're just gonna be scraping down as we fall.

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:05:31

       There doesn't seem to be an alternative model to what, what, what we're going through. You know, it's n- it's not like they're saying, "What we'd like society to look like is this." No, it's just they wanna break down all of the systems that are in place. Where there's the, our monetary system, they wanna break down capitalism itself, they wanna dr- break down the patriarchy, they wanna break down male-dominated blank and this and that and toxic male that and this and female stereotypes and gender stereotypes and just like, oh my God, Christ. Where does this go? Like, where is this going? Like, you, you keep-

   29. CWColin Wright1:06:06

       Yeah.

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:06:06

       ... breaking things down. Do you have an alternative model?
6. 1:15:00 – 1:16:35

   Yeah, they got a,…

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:15:00

      him just to make a stink for publicity and to virtue signal and let everybody know they're on the right page.

   2. CWColin Wright1:15:05

      Yeah, they got a, a whirlwind of hate though 'cause people like Steven Pinker and a couple other people who had also won the Humanist Award, uh, from the same Humanist Association, they wrote these letters just blasting-

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:15:17

      Did they?

   4. CWColin Wright1:15:18

      ... the Humanist Association saying-

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:15:19

      What does that mean?

   6. CWColin Wright1:15:20

      "This is the most anti-humanist thing ever." Like, this could've been a teaching moment or something if you wanna actually put your argument of what is the difference between-

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:15:28

      Yeah.

   8. CWColin Wright1:15:29

      ... transracialism or transsexualism.

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:15:31

      And it is an interesting conversation because, look, I believe in transgender people. I think there are, b- for sure there are people that, for whatever reason, they feel way more comfortable being a different gender other than their biological sex would indicate.

   10. CWColin Wright1:15:45

       Oh, yeah. Absolutely.

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:15:46

       It's real.

   12. CWColin Wright1:15:46

       And they-

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:15:47

       It's 100% real.

   14. CWColin Wright1:15:47

       And th- they should be able to transition and-

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:15:49

       Yes.

   16. CWColin Wright1:15:49

       ... make themselves feel better-

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:15:51

       Right.

   18. CWColin Wright1:15:51

       ... if that's what they need.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:15:53

       But what is going on with race? Like, if anything, that's a more slippery one because we're all from Africa. Like-

   20. CWColin Wright1:16:03

       Yeah. I mean, the, the-

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:16:05

       We, we, it's hu- they think primates, the mo- the latest information is they think primates originated in Asia, made it over to Africa, evolved into humans. So every single human being has an origin in Africa. So if someone just decides that they identify with African American and they're American and they hang out with a bunch of African American people and they just decide, you can't do it. But it's like there's, there's one bridge that we will not let you cross. You cannot-

Episode duration: 2:43:09