Joe Rogan Experience #1806 - Duncan Trussell

1. 0:00 – 4:40

   Wigs, nylon robes, and the Michael Jackson plastic-surgery rabbit hole

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

   2. NANarrator0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music) We have to be really careful that we don't catch on fire.

   4. DTDuncan Trussell0:20

      Oh, yeah.

   5. NANarrator0:23

      (laughs)

   6. DTDuncan Trussell0:24

      (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:24

      (laughs)

   8. DTDuncan Trussell0:24

      That would be really awesome. I mean, it would be horrible for us-

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:27

      (coughs) Terribly.

   10. DTDuncan Trussell0:28

       ... but that would, uh, right?

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       It would be funny. I mean, we have (coughs) f- fake hair and plastic robes on. Not good.

   12. DTDuncan Trussell0:34

       Yeah.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:34

       I mean, these are nylon robes and nylon hair. (coughs)

   14. DTDuncan Trussell0:38

       (coughs) We would be like Michael Jackson. This, it would be the Michael Jackson moment. Remember when he caught on fire that-

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:43

       He was on a Pepsi commercial, right?

   16. DTDuncan Trussell0:45

       Yeah, yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:45

       That really fucked him up apparently.

   18. DTDuncan Trussell0:47

       That was the beginning of the end.

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:49

       Yeah, well, I think the end was, like, already it.

   20. DTDuncan Trussell0:51

       (laughs)

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:51

       I think it was already, he was already white by then.

   22. DTDuncan Trussell0:54

       (laughs)

   23. JRJoe Rogan0:54

       (laughs) You can't say that was the beginning of the end. That dude was, you know, many plastic surgeries in. He's one of those g- ca- Like, Eddie Bravo always used to say that, like, that Eddie, that, um, Michael Jackson's plastic surgeon does not advertise that he's Michael Jackson's-

   24. DTDuncan Trussell1:09

       (laughs)

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:09

       ... plastic surgeon. You imagine you have the biggest star in the world and you do his plastic surgery, he'd be like, "Not me."

   26. DTDuncan Trussell1:15

       "Not me."

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:16

       "I have nothing to do with that."

   28. DTDuncan Trussell1:18

       "Not me." Yeah. No, that, yeah. His, like, it was insane-

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:22

       Yeah.

   30. DTDuncan Trussell1:22

       ... how much they shaved that guy's face down. Li- It was like-
2. 4:40 – 5:38

   How is this the #1 podcast? Fame, sanity, and not overthinking it

   1. JRJoe Rogan4:40

      How is, how is this the number one podcast in the world? Explain that.

   2. DTDuncan Trussell4:44

      I can't, you know-

   3. JRJoe Rogan4:45

      Explain that.

   4. DTDuncan Trussell4:45

      It-

   5. JRJoe Rogan4:46

      What, what we're doing here-

   6. DTDuncan Trussell4:46

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan4:47

      ... is what we used to do.

   8. DTDuncan Trussell4:48

      Well, yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan4:49

      Same thing.

   10. DTDuncan Trussell4:50

       Exactly.

   11. JRJoe Rogan4:50

       Exactly the same thing.

   12. DTDuncan Trussell4:52

       Yeah, it's weird.

   13. JRJoe Rogan4:53

       Doesn't make any sense.

   14. DTDuncan Trussell4:54

       It does, I mean, but you, uh, don't you try to actively not think about that?

   15. JRJoe Rogan4:58

       Yeah.

   16. DTDuncan Trussell4:58

       'Cause if you think about it-

   17. JRJoe Rogan4:59

       Yeah, you'll go crazy.

   18. DTDuncan Trussell5:00

       ... it's like touching an electric fence or something.

   19. JRJoe Rogan5:06

       It, you'll lose your fucking mind. You, and then you won't be able to do it anymore. It's just like you have to understand, and we all do somewhere, but you're, you're alive in the middle of this experience, and it's playing out, where no one feels comfortable.

   20. DTDuncan Trussell5:27

       Right.

   21. JRJoe Rogan5:27

       No one understands what's happening. No one knows what life really is. No one, not a single person. And yet, we're all calling upon other people for guidance-

   22. DTDuncan Trussell5:37

       Yeah.

   23. JRJoe Rogan5:37

       ... and leadership-

   24. DTDuncan Trussell5:38

       Yeah.

3. 5:38 – 8:00

   Elon buying Twitter: savior fantasy vs billionaire trolling

   1. JRJoe Rogan5:38

      ... and support. We look to, like, powerful leaders. Like, that's why, me included, everyone is so excited that Elon Musk is trying to buy Twitter. Like, yes, the great one-

   2. DTDuncan Trussell5:48

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan5:48

      ... he's the super intelligent leader type character-

   4. DTDuncan Trussell5:53

      Right.

   5. JRJoe Rogan5:53

      ... that seems to have great ethics and morals too. He seems to be like a guy that if you had a movie character and the movie character was this, like, super billionaire who didn't give a fuck.

   6. DTDuncan Trussell6:04

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan6:04

      Like, but he was, like, super fucking smart-

   8. DTDuncan Trussell6:06

      Yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan6:06

      ... and he was really genuinely working to save humanity.

   10. DTDuncan Trussell6:09

       Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan6:10

       That's that guy.

   12. DTDuncan Trussell6:11

       Dude, here's the thing, this is the scariest thing of all, when you realize, that guy's not gonna save anybody. He's not gonna s-

   13. JRJoe Rogan6:18

       (laughs)

   14. DTDuncan Trussell6:18

       He's gonna make things funny. And he, and like a lot of what he's doing is so cool. And, and if, and if he buys Twitter, it's gonna be one of the funniest things ever.

   15. JRJoe Rogan6:27

       (laughs)

   16. DTDuncan Trussell6:27

       And it's-... it helps me understand why it would be awesome to be a billionaire, 'cause finally I would think, "Okay, if I was a billionaire, I would be trolling so hard all the time with all this money. I would buy fake commercials-"

   17. JRJoe Rogan6:43

       (laughs)

   18. DTDuncan Trussell6:43

       "... for products that seem vaguely real, put 'em all-"

   19. JRJoe Rogan6:46

       You would be the best billionaire ever.

   20. DTDuncan Trussell6:47

       It would be so fun.

   21. JRJoe Rogan6:48

       (laughs) Just, it would all be like your ads on your podcast.

   22. DTDuncan Trussell6:51

       Yeah, exactly. I would do all, I would-

   23. JRJoe Rogan6:53

       (laughs)

   24. DTDuncan Trussell6:53

       ... I would have an entire department just dedicated to putting chaos into the world for fun.

   25. JRJoe Rogan6:59

       Can I stop you right here and just tell you, you, I admire your commercials so much.

   26. DTDuncan Trussell7:03

       Ah, thanks, man.

   27. JRJoe Rogan7:04

       You have the best commercials in all of podcasting by far.

   28. DTDuncan Trussell7:07

       Thank you. Thanks.

   29. JRJoe Rogan7:07

       They're funny. They're, and they're ridiculous, and they're creative, and like-

   30. DTDuncan Trussell7:11

       Thanks.
4. 8:00 – 9:31

   Free speech vs moderation: doxing, harassment, and where the line ends

   1. JRJoe Rogan8:00

      No, he does, genuinely. He's concerned about censorship.

   2. DTDuncan Trussell8:04

      Freedom of speech.

   3. JRJoe Rogan8:05

      Yes. He's very... He said, "Freedom of speech is someone you don't like..." Excuse me, "Freedom of speech is someone you don't like saying something you don't wanna hear." He goes, "They have to have that right." And he's like-

   4. DTDuncan Trussell8:16

      Yeah.

   5. JRJoe Rogan8:16

      "... it's essential to a democracy."

   6. DTDuncan Trussell8:18

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan8:18

      And most people objectively agree. The problem is he gets scared because they see how, like, mobs of people can move in a very negative direction, right? I think people... Uh, uh, there's a real concern. Like, I am in no way supporting censorship, clearly, right? Absolutely the opposite. But I understand why people are concerned about large groups of people being really shitty, and, and-

   8. DTDuncan Trussell8:46

      Oh, right.

   9. JRJoe Rogan8:46

      ... and getting on the social media platforms that they've done, they've done this, um, campaign over the last few years to, like, silence certain voices, stop aggressive people, stop people who are being shitty to people. Get... And-

   10. DTDuncan Trussell9:01

       Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan9:01

       ... isn't... Some of, some of that is good, right?

   12. DTDuncan Trussell9:03

       Sure.

   13. JRJoe Rogan9:04

       Like, dox, stop doxing, stop people who are threatening people, stop people who are harassing people.

   14. DTDuncan Trussell9:08

       Yeah.

   15. JRJoe Rogan9:08

       But it's like, where does it end, and how do you know? You don't. That's where it g- that's where it's fucking weird, 'cause if you just let wild free speech, like, w- there's gonna be a bu- like, there's a bunch of people on, like, 4Chan and those kinda places-

   16. DTDuncan Trussell9:23

       Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan9:24

       ... and they're saying stuff just for fun.

   18. DTDuncan Trussell9:26

       Right.

   19. JRJoe Rogan9:26

       Because nobody knows who they are, and they can just say it-

   20. DTDuncan Trussell9:29

       Right.

   21. JRJoe Rogan9:29

       ... and they don't fucking mean it.

   22. DTDuncan Trussell9:31

       Yeah.

5. 9:31 – 10:47

   Edgelords, Pepe, ‘meme magic,’ and chaos as political force

   1. JRJoe Rogan9:31

      They're saying it 'cause it's a crazy thing to say if you're at work in a job you hate, sitting in your cubicle, and you decide to make a frog with a Nazi outfit on. And it doesn't mean you're a real Nazi, and it doesn't mean you-

   2. DTDuncan Trussell9:43

      Isn't the word-

   3. JRJoe Rogan9:43

      ... you hate anyone.

   4. DTDuncan Trussell9:44

      It's edgelording.

   5. JRJoe Rogan9:45

      Edgelording.

   6. DTDuncan Trussell9:45

      It's an edgelord.

   7. JRJoe Rogan9:47

      Those people are, they're confined to small corners of the internet right now.

   8. DTDuncan Trussell9:55

      Yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan9:55

      And if, if you (laughs) just let them loose (laughs) , if you let the frog people loose-

   10. DTDuncan Trussell10:01

       Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan10:02

       Like, you remember the frog people during the Trump ca- the Trump campaign?

   12. DTDuncan Trussell10:05

       Yeah, of course.

   13. JRJoe Rogan10:05

       They took over the frog. The frog guy, the guy who made a frog podcast-

   14. DTDuncan Trussell10:08

       I had him on my podca-

   15. JRJoe Rogan10:08

       ... was so sad.

   16. DTDuncan Trussell10:09

       I had him on my podcast. He's very cool.

   17. JRJoe Rogan10:11

       What did he say?

   18. DTDuncan Trussell10:13

       Just what you're s- what the fuck? The frog was never a Nazi. The frog was, like, funny and sweet.

   19. JRJoe Rogan10:17

       Was he upset they took his frog?

   20. DTDuncan Trussell10:19

       Yeah, it was just, he went, it w- I think it's a, would be a little bit like the first person who'd had the Hitler mustache.

   21. JRJoe Rogan10:25

       Wow.

   22. DTDuncan Trussell10:26

       You know what I mean? Like, imagine, and then Hitler sees it, and he's like, "God, that's fucking cool. I'm gonna start having a mustache like that." And you're like, "No!" It's like that. But also, you know, I don't, I, I don't know how many people know that, like, the, they discovered an Egyptian god, and again, this could all be trolling, Kak, the god of chaos, who happens to be a frog. So-

   23. JRJoe Rogan10:47

       Yes.

6. 10:47 – 15:05

   Bots and AI persuasion: GPT, bot swarms, and paid verification ideas

   1. DTDuncan Trussell10:47

      ... what was, what, so within that, whatever that was, uh, an actual, like, chaos magic was being, they were calling it meme magic or whatever, but they were all d- they were, like, actively doing chaos magic, and, uh, a lot of their rituals seemed to have worked to some degree. So yeah, I know what you mean, like, the, the, the, the que- like, the question is in a world where we don't even know how many of these people are human who are writing shit-

   2. JRJoe Rogan11:16

      Right.

   3. DTDuncan Trussell11:17

      ... on Twitter or wherever-

   4. JRJoe Rogan11:18

      Right.

   5. DTDuncan Trussell11:18

      ... like GPT, what is it, 3 or 2, the AI that, like, completely imitates human beings. Like, have you ever gone to the...

   6. JRJoe Rogan11:27

      Explain how that works? It's a, it's-

   7. DTDuncan Trussell11:28

      I, it's a neural network that can be programmed to different personalities, that can imitate human speech well enough that they can leave messages, and you don't know for sure if it's a human or not.

   8. JRJoe Rogan11:41

      Wow.

   9. DTDuncan Trussell11:42

      So if you go to, on Reddit, there's a subreddit which is the AI bots arguing with each other-

   10. JRJoe Rogan11:47

       Oh, my God.

   11. DTDuncan Trussell11:48

       ... on the Reddit. And, like, once I left that up, and I remember I was just reading it thinking I was on the front page of Reddit-

   12. JRJoe Rogan11:55

       (laughs)

   13. DTDuncan Trussell11:55

       ... and getting really engaged-

   14. JRJoe Rogan11:57

       Wow.

   15. DTDuncan Trussell11:57

       ... in the arguments these bots were having with each other. It's that convincing. So the, the freedom of speech thing runs into, okay, of course, it's like a no-brainer humanist ideal, humans should be able to say whatever they want. This is, this is, like, the most important way, that we, we must have some kind of debate or discourse where one person is allowed to be a complete asshole.

   16. JRJoe Rogan12:19

       Right.

   17. DTDuncan Trussell12:20

       And not because we want assholes, but because hopefully in the discussion, some bit of truth will sink down into their consciousness and they will grow as a person. That, I think that's what the roots of-

   18. JRJoe Rogan12:31

       That's the hope.

   19. DTDuncan Trussell12:32

       That's the hope. But what is, what if the person is a robot, uh, is an AI device that is being...... made to have certain personalities that represent demographics that you're trying to manipulate as a corporation or a state, or whatever. At that point-

   20. JRJoe Rogan12:51

       (laughs)

   21. DTDuncan Trussell12:51

       ... w- is it freedom of spee- uh, are bots allowed to have freedom of speech? This is-

   22. JRJoe Rogan12:55

       Right.

   23. DTDuncan Trussell12:55

       ... this is the, uh, what I, one of the things Musk was saying he might do with Twitter, which I think is brilliant, m- anyone can get the stupid blue check mark. You pay for it, and you have to verify yourself so that, like, you're, we know you're a real person.

   24. JRJoe Rogan13:08

       Right.

   25. DTDuncan Trussell13:09

       Meaning, that it would be too expensive for the bot swarms to function. It would b- it would go from being, e- like, if you have a blue check mark, whatever, you're something or whatever, to, if you don't have a blue check mark, you're probably a bot. And so then, we eliminate-

   26. JRJoe Rogan13:23

       (slaps desk)

   27. DTDuncan Trussell13:23

       ... all the AI, all the fucking state-sponsored shills, all the people who've spent years and years and years building these fake identities online. Like, they're like, uh, farming personalities, uh, 'cause, you know, in the old days, somebody tweets some shit, and you're like, "What the fuck is that?" And you go and look at their account, and it's like three days old, so it has less credibility. But they've been growing these personalities for years, so you go and look at their tweets, and it kinda looks like a person, mixed in with their interminable tweets about some political issue. Like, only an insane person would, every three minutes, tweeting something, or like, "Went to the pool with Dairy today," you know what I mean, and some weird distant picture of a pool, so it kinda seems like a real person. Anyway, the point is, the freedom of speech issue is, uh, right now, we're running into the problem of brand new technologies, that aren't even human, that are being designed to influence public discourse in a way that's gonna push the needle towards whatever it is.

   28. JRJoe Rogan14:29

       Right.

   29. DTDuncan Trussell14:29

       Y- whatever your laws or corporation wants, whatever some s- the state wants.

   30. JRJoe Rogan14:34

       And we know for sure they're being implemented that way?
7. 15:05 – 27:29

   Information warfare and polarization: the easiest way to ‘defeat’ a country

   1. JRJoe Rogan15:05

      Isn't it wild, though, that that's the best way to defeat America, is to get people separate from each other, arguing with t- with each other and lose all faith in the democratic process?

   2. DTDuncan Trussell15:17

      Yeah, sure.

   3. JRJoe Rogan15:18

      All faith in democracy. Lose all faith.

   4. DTDuncan Trussell15:20

      Powerful weapon, man. It's like an a-

   5. JRJoe Rogan15:21

      It's amazing.

   6. DTDuncan Trussell15:22

      We dropped an atom bomb multiple times on cities filled with people. United States did that. Everyone knows that. So our karma, hoo, we've got some fucked up karma, man.

   7. JRJoe Rogan15:36

      (laughs)

   8. DTDuncan Trussell15:36

      You know what I mean? So-

   9. JRJoe Rogan15:38

      Ugh.

   10. DTDuncan Trussell15:38

       ... so, like the, so-

   11. JRJoe Rogan15:39

       (laughs)

   12. DTDuncan Trussell15:39

       ... the problem with these atom bombs, biggest problem with the atom bomb, is, I mean, aside from the fact that it kills random people and is, i- is horrible, it irradiates them. I- it irradiates the ground, the buildings. So you, so there's no plundering to be had. If you, you, traditional war, you plunder, whether you-

   13. JRJoe Rogan15:56

       Yeah.

   14. DTDuncan Trussell15:56

       ... however you want to make it look. You're plundering. If I nuke you, I can no longer plunder. So, this is why biological weapons popped, like, are- are desirable, 'cause then it burns out the biome in the area. Wait a little bit, and then you can go plunder. But even better than that, get into the fucking minds of the people in the country that you want to invade, and then just change their minds so that the country shifts into what you wanted that country to be. Now you didn't even have to sh- do anything, except they're yours. They're believing in you, and then in that, the country starts falling apart. The CIA, by the way, this is one of the things they do. They go into other countries. They cause, like, uh-

   15. JRJoe Rogan16:41

       Yeah.

   16. DTDuncan Trussell16:41

       ... disturbances, and then it collapses. I mean, it's a classic weapon of war. So anyway, yeah, I v- obviously, we might be, the entire United States and probably other countries might currently be irradiated, not by like, obviously radiation, but by bad data created by artificial intelligence, bots that have been programmed to swarm social media and give the impression that there was some, like, something happening that wasn't even happening at all.

   17. JRJoe Rogan17:09

       You know why- when I get the most suspicious that someone's a bot?

   18. DTDuncan Trussell17:13

       When?

   19. JRJoe Rogan17:13

       When they have an American flag next to their name.

   20. DTDuncan Trussell17:16

       Oh, yeah. That's a bot.

   21. JRJoe Rogan17:17

       I automatically assume that's a bot.

   22. DTDuncan Trussell17:20

       Flag bots. Yeah.

   23. JRJoe Rogan17:20

       I see that and I go, "Oh, they're, they're one of those fake, like-

   24. DTDuncan Trussell17:24

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan17:24

       ... you know, God-before-country people."

   26. DTDuncan Trussell17:27

       That's right.

   27. JRJoe Rogan17:27

       You know? (laughs)

   28. DTDuncan Trussell17:28

       It's so fucking weird, Joe. It's so fucking w-

   29. JRJoe Rogan17:31

       There must be so many of them.

   30. DTDuncan Trussell17:33

       There's so m- I mean-
8. 27:29 – 32:14

   Why arguments don’t change minds: aggression, identity, and ‘dogs barking’

   1. JRJoe Rogan27:29

      And just get 'em arguing about stuff.

   2. DTDuncan Trussell27:31

      Exactly!

   3. JRJoe Rogan27:31

      And then, the, the thing about arguing is people rarely come to a resolution where they're both happy. You generally speaking-

   4. DTDuncan Trussell27:39

      Right.

   5. JRJoe Rogan27:39

      ... one person wins, the other person feels bad, one person-

   6. DTDuncan Trussell27:42

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan27:42

      ... thinks that person's a dick for, you know, w- harping on 'em about something.

   8. DTDuncan Trussell27:46

      Yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan27:46

      It's very rare that someone goes, "Goddamn it. I was, I was wrong, and he was right. And you know, I need to apologize to him-"

   10. DTDuncan Trussell27:52

       Right.

   11. JRJoe Rogan27:52

       "... I need to figure this out." That's a rare person. It's great when people can do that-

   12. DTDuncan Trussell27:56

       Yeah.

   13. JRJoe Rogan27:56

       But it's a rare person who has a disagreement with someone and changes their mind.

   14. DTDuncan Trussell28:01

       Right.

   15. JRJoe Rogan28:01

       We're fucking stubborn, and we, we, instead of really trying to figure out what's right and what's wrong, most the time, we're trying to, we're trying to win an argument. We're trying to win with better sentences-

   16. DTDuncan Trussell28:12

       Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan28:12

       ... and better facts-

   18. DTDuncan Trussell28:13

       Yeah.

   19. JRJoe Rogan28:14

       ... and we're trying to look smarter. That's what we're trying to do.

   20. DTDuncan Trussell28:16

       Yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan28:16

       And when, when people just argue, they start arguing about other shit. If you beat someone with some argument, you wanna argue with 'em about other stuff. There's this one guy at work, and, uh, he always wanted to argue about stuff. Wasn't aggressive, but it was always-

   22. DTDuncan Trussell28:32

       Yeah.

   23. JRJoe Rogan28:32

       It was annoying! And one time I would go, "Dude, every time we talk, you just wanna argue."

   24. DTDuncan Trussell28:37

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan28:37

       I go, "I don't, we can just talk." Like-

   26. DTDuncan Trussell28:39

       Right.

   27. JRJoe Rogan28:39

       "... we don't, we don't have to argue about stuff." Like, he would, he goes, "Well, I like to see you challenged." I go-

   28. DTDuncan Trussell28:43

       What?

   29. JRJoe Rogan28:43

       ... "Look, come on, man. We're just at work." Like-

   30. DTDuncan Trussell28:46

       He said what?
9. 32:14 – 35:46

   Radical empathy: ‘love your neighbor’ and the shared-self idea

   1. JRJoe Rogan32:14

      Imagine if everyone alive is, at their essence, the exact same thing, just interacting with the rest of the universe through different biological filters.

   2. DTDuncan Trussell32:27

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan32:27

      But, like, everyone's the exact same thing, whether you're born in China, whether you're born-

   4. DTDuncan Trussell32:35

      Yeah.

   5. JRJoe Rogan32:35

      ... in Pittsburgh, doesn't matter.

   6. DTDuncan Trussell32:37

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan32:37

      It's just, you're going through different biological filters and different life experiences-

   8. DTDuncan Trussell32:42

      Yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan32:43

      ... to interact with the universe, but you, the sa- What makes you makes me. It's the same thing. I'm just going through this body, you're going through that body. I'm going through this path, you're going through that path.

   10. DTDuncan Trussell32:54

       Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan32:54

       It's the same thing at the core, whether it's male or female, whether it's boy or girl or gay or straight or-

   12. DTDuncan Trussell33:01

       Yeah.

   13. JRJoe Rogan33:01

       ... it doesn't matter. It's the same thing.

   14. DTDuncan Trussell33:03

       Yeah.

   15. JRJoe Rogan33:04

       It's the biological filter of being a different human being with a different life experience in a different part of the world.

   16. DTDuncan Trussell33:09

       Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan33:09

       That's what's different.

   18. DTDuncan Trussell33:10

       That's it.

   19. JRJoe Rogan33:10

       Imagine, imagine how wild the world would be if we could really lock onto that idea.

   20. DTDuncan Trussell33:16

       It'd be a Christian world, Joe.

   21. JRJoe Rogan33:18

       That's a Christian idea, right?

   22. DTDuncan Trussell33:19

       Love your neighbor as yourself.

   23. JRJoe Rogan33:21

       Yeah, exactly.

   24. DTDuncan Trussell33:22

       And, but I, I think that people, when they hear that, they don't realize how radical a statement that is, 'cause it's saying, "No, no, no, that's you."

   25. JRJoe Rogan33:30

       "That's you."

   26. DTDuncan Trussell33:31

       "That's you."

   27. JRJoe Rogan33:31

       Yes.

   28. DTDuncan Trussell33:32

       "That's you, that's you, that's you." And then, and then so th- at that point, you have to s- You really probably wanna help other people more, 'cause in the way, 'cause we're all kinda helping ourselves all the time, you know? Like-

   29. JRJoe Rogan33:45

       Yeah.

   30. DTDuncan Trussell33:45

       ... so then if you really recognize someone as that's just you, it fucks up everything, man. How are you gonna do war? How-
10. 35:46 – 41:32

    Technology as parasite: zombie-ant fungus, AI takeover, and superintelligence

    1. DTDuncan Trussell35:46

       I think it's, this is the... I, okay, so this is an idea that I had the other day, freaked me out a little bit. Uh, the, okay, I was just thinking about those... And I'm, I know we've talked about these fucking zombie ants so many times on this podcast, but that fungus, it infects the ants, takes over their brains.

    2. JRJoe Rogan36:06

       Yes.

    3. DTDuncan Trussell36:06

       Okay. So, like, I was just, I just had this scary thought of like, "Oh my God. That's what, that's what technology is." It, it's just some kind of parasitic alien spirit that has descended on the planet, is making us make-

    4. JRJoe Rogan36:21

       Yeah.

    5. DTDuncan Trussell36:21

       ... it increasingly powerful-

    6. JRJoe Rogan36:23

       Yeah.

    7. DTDuncan Trussell36:24

       ... and with the intent eventually of reducing us to nothing, uh, other than, like, some kind of herd. And then, uh, you, in the sense that it's like the... We really are, via our addiction to these things, we are just, like, summoning an AI that is gonna be way better than us at everything. Matter of time, matter of time.

    8. JRJoe Rogan36:49

       Instantaneously.

    9. DTDuncan Trussell36:50

       Yeah.

    10. JRJoe Rogan36:50

        And it's one of the things that Elon's warned us all against. He's like, "It's scarier than anything else that we have in development right now."

    11. DTDuncan Trussell36:57

        Yeah, man.

    12. JRJoe Rogan36:57

        It could be a life form, man. And it seems like it is. It seems like we slept on it, and we only thought that life forms were things that biologically grew.

    13. DTDuncan Trussell37:08

        Yeah.

    14. JRJoe Rogan37:08

        Like, they grew with water or they grew with photosynthesis.

    15. DTDuncan Trussell37:11

        Yeah.

    16. JRJoe Rogan37:11

        You know? We, we, we only thought they ate things, and that's how they, they shit and they got bigger.

    17. DTDuncan Trussell37:17

        Yeah.

    18. JRJoe Rogan37:17

        We didn't think of technology as being this, like, ever-improving thing that's directly connected to materialism-

    19. DTDuncan Trussell37:25

        Yeah.

    20. JRJoe Rogan37:25

        ... which is one of our most common obsessions. Like, human beings, like, super common to be obsessed with materials.

    21. DTDuncan Trussell37:32

        Matter.

    22. JRJoe Rogan37:33

        Yeah.

    23. DTDuncan Trussell37:33

        Just shit.

    24. JRJoe Rogan37:34

        Collecting stamps, like-

    25. DTDuncan Trussell37:37

        Yeah.

    26. JRJoe Rogan37:37

        ... that's how goofy we are. We collect things.

    27. DTDuncan Trussell37:40

        Yeah, right.

    28. JRJoe Rogan37:41

        You know?

    29. DTDuncan Trussell37:41

        Yeah. We're v- very, like... Yeah. It's certainly, like... If you wanted to, like, take over a species, just look at what they're into.

    30. JRJoe Rogan37:50

        Exactly.
11. 41:32 – 1:09:47

    Memory hacking, neural chips, solar flares, and the coming VR realism

    1. DTDuncan Trussell41:32

       You know? What about... 'Cause this is the, the, the... Right now, freedom of speech is... One of the scary things about it is you can manipulate and seduce people with lies to make them do horrible things. Like, look at Heaven's Gate.

    2. JRJoe Rogan41:51

       Sure.

    3. DTDuncan Trussell41:51

       So, this is the... one of the scary things about it, is, it- it- it... Speech is a way to hack someone's nervous system and humans are... some humans are pretty fucking good at it.

    4. JRJoe Rogan42:03

       Yeah.

    5. DTDuncan Trussell42:03

       So, if humans can do it, then what can an AI do? And what if that AI can, like, actually scan your... you know, scan thermal readouts from your brain and understand what you're thinking or, or, like, notice eye dilation or s- you know, detect some scent that you're emitting that informs how it manipulates you? We're gonna be manipulated by these things. Potentially even, if we get to understand the human nervous system enough, why wouldn't there be some technology that replaces memories? Why would-

    6. JRJoe Rogan42:33

       There- for sure, it's gonna be.

    7. DTDuncan Trussell42:34

       Right.

    8. JRJoe Rogan42:34

       It's like photos replaced drawings. You used to have to draw things. "Show me your house." "Oh, this is what-"

    9. DTDuncan Trussell42:39

       Yeah, man.

    10. JRJoe Rogan42:39

        "... my roof looks like." You didn't have to draw a picture of it.

    11. DTDuncan Trussell42:42

        Yeah, dude. So now... So that's-

    12. JRJoe Rogan42:44

        (laughs)

    13. DTDuncan Trussell42:44

        To me, that's where shit gets really scary, is, like, a weapon that can replace your memories-

    14. JRJoe Rogan42:49

        Yeah.

    15. DTDuncan Trussell42:49

        ... so that suddenly you just remember a completely different life than the one that you had.

    16. JRJoe Rogan42:54

        Or how about this? What about a solar flare that blows out your fuse?

    17. DTDuncan Trussell42:58

        ... yeah, man.

    18. JRJoe Rogan42:58

        Now you don't remember anything, and you're sitting there with your mouth open, on your knees-

    19. DTDuncan Trussell43:02

        Ugh.

    20. JRJoe Rogan43:02

        ... in the middle of your yard.

    21. DTDuncan Trussell43:03

        Ugh.

    22. JRJoe Rogan43:04

        You don't remember shit.

    23. DTDuncan Trussell43:05

        Yeah.

    24. JRJoe Rogan43:05

        It cooked all of your memories.

    25. DTDuncan Trussell43:06

        It cooked you. Yeah, I, I, so-

    26. JRJoe Rogan43:08

        Bro.

    27. DTDuncan Trussell43:09

        Dude, this is-

    28. JRJoe Rogan43:10

        That's possible.

    29. DTDuncan Trussell43:10

        How do I know?

    30. JRJoe Rogan43:11

        Just like there's been failed experiments in the past and failed, you know, failed things, failed inventions. You know, they tried it. "Oh, but it didn't work. It fucked everything up."
12. 1:09:47 – 1:15:25

    Simulation theory gets personal: voice cloning, identity copies, and Thursdayism

    1. JRJoe Rogan1:09:47

       It just, it goes in that direction.

    2. DTDuncan Trussell1:09:49

       I think it already happened.

    3. JRJoe Rogan1:09:50

       You think so?

    4. DTDuncan Trussell1:09:51

       If I had to bet, I would say it already, uh, uh, yeah. Like, there's no, the, the probability of us being the first thing in the universe to simulate reality perfectly and create a, a, a, a, a, a sense that you're in a place fully, that's already been done. And if it's already been done, then we're probably in it.

    5. JRJoe Rogan1:10:11

       Yeah.

    6. DTDuncan Trussell1:10:11

       Because, uh, you are going to eventually, like, wanna go into the thing not remembering anything at all.

    7. JRJoe Rogan1:10:18

       That's Elon's position.

    8. DTDuncan Trussell1:10:20

       Yeah.

    9. JRJoe Rogan1:10:20

       It's the m- uh, I think that's, it's not just his, it's, um, a l- a lot of, like, mathematicians.

    10. DTDuncan Trussell1:10:25

        Yeah, it's a mathematical probability thing that it's based on, like-

    11. JRJoe Rogan1:10:29

        Yeah.

    12. DTDuncan Trussell1:10:30

        ... we pro- it probably already happened, and, and we didn't have the, the language, we've always been using those, this lan- uh, uh, way of talking about it, the idea that this is illusion or, you know, that there's a thing called the Kingdom of Heaven that is different, or, "You must die to this world to come to know me," as Jesus said. It is Black Friday. And the, uh, uh, all of the different references to this reality we're in having an illusio- illusionary quality, uh, it's just those symbol sets they use to describe it aren't technological, so they seem primitive. But the concept of simulation theory has been going on for a while. It's Gnosticism that we are in a m- a nefarious simulation, more of a prison than a, uh, uh, university.

    13. JRJoe Rogan1:11:14

        Hmm.

    14. DTDuncan Trussell1:11:14

        You know? But, yeah, man. So I think, uh, uh, I think, and if it hasn't happened, if it hasn't happened, but if I had to bet, it already happened, if it hasn't happened, it, not only is it going to happen, but if you have any kind of thumbprint in the internet, you will be duplicated. You will be, like, y- like, after you die, there will be at least the potential for taking your digital thumbprint, reanimating it in the simulation, giving it an AI that is your exact personality, and then you could just, I don't know, whatever you wanna do with it.

    15. JRJoe Rogan1:11:49

        Well, at the very least-

    16. DTDuncan Trussell1:11:51

        Yeah.

    17. JRJoe Rogan1:11:51

        ... they would be able to do an audio podcast of your voice-

    18. DTDuncan Trussell1:11:55

        Yeah.

    19. JRJoe Rogan1:11:55

        ... saying anything they wanted to say.

    20. DTDuncan Trussell1:11:57

        Exactly.

    21. JRJoe Rogan1:11:57

        Forever.

    22. DTDuncan Trussell1:11:58

        Yeah.

    23. JRJoe Rogan1:11:58

        Like, someone could be a really clever Duncan Trussell fan and come up with their version of what you would say forever-

    24. DTDuncan Trussell1:12:06

        Yeah.

    25. JRJoe Rogan1:12:06

        ... and release a podcast where it's you really fucking saying it.

    26. DTDuncan Trussell1:12:09

        Ow, that's fucked up.

    27. JRJoe Rogan1:12:10

        It's cr- it's fucked up because, like, maybe your family would license that. Maybe they would go, "You know, it'd be nice to have that money."

    28. DTDuncan Trussell1:12:17

        Yeah.

    29. JRJoe Rogan1:12:17

        And Duncan wouldn't care. And then- (laughs)

    30. DTDuncan Trussell1:12:19

        I wouldn't care.
13. 1:15:25 – 1:22:33

    Nostalgia and grief: revisiting childhood places and the unreliability of memory

    1. JRJoe Rogan1:15:25

       You ever go back to your high school house?

    2. DTDuncan Trussell1:15:27

       It's the creepiest shit ever, dude. It's creepy.

    3. JRJoe Rogan1:15:30

       It's weird, right?

    4. DTDuncan Trussell1:15:30

       It's fucked up. Yes. Dude, yes. And it is, it's so funny, when did you do, why'd you mention that? I, that's nuts, dude. I-

    5. JRJoe Rogan1:15:39

       I don't know. Um, I, I did it once, and it was very different than what I remembered.

    6. DTDuncan Trussell1:15:44

       Yes.

    7. JRJoe Rogan1:15:44

       That's why. 'Cause, uh, uh, I wonder, like, what, you know, (sighs) especially the way things look. Like, you see them a second time, and you're like, "Oh, yeah!"

    8. DTDuncan Trussell1:15:54

       Yeah.

    9. JRJoe Rogan1:15:54

       "That's what it really looked like."

    10. DTDuncan Trussell1:15:55

        Yeah.

    11. JRJoe Rogan1:15:55

        Like, "I had it in my head all screwy."

    12. DTDuncan Trussell1:15:57

        Yeah.

    13. JRJoe Rogan1:15:57

        And then you had to go there and see, and you realize, like, even my memories of yesterday, it's just a blurry slideshow-

    14. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:03

        Yeah.

    15. JRJoe Rogan1:16:04

        ... that I can barely put in order.

    16. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:06

        Can't smell.

    17. JRJoe Rogan1:16:07

        Barely. Yeah.

    18. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:07

        Can't smell your memories, can't hear, can't-

    19. JRJoe Rogan1:16:09

        Right.

    20. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:09

        ... can't, like, taste in your memories. It's a-

    21. JRJoe Rogan1:16:11

        Until they put that chip in your head, Duncan-

    22. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:14

        And now you can taste your memories.

    23. JRJoe Rogan1:16:15

        ... and then Technicolor, you become a god.

    24. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:17

        Yeah. Well, I mean, aga- that is the, I think that is one of the possibilities, uh, is that's what we're, we're in.

    25. JRJoe Rogan1:16:23

        Yeah. That's the I, Robot scenario.

    26. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:25

        Dude-

    27. JRJoe Rogan1:16:25

        I have become a god.

    28. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:27

        I can't believe you mentioned the vid- Okay, I, I just, the reason I, uh, that freaked me out is just because a few months ago, I don't know how to explain it, man. I went into, like, a weird fugue state, and I drove-

    29. JRJoe Rogan1:16:37

        Fugue? Fugue?

    30. DTDuncan Trussell1:16:38

        Fugue state. Just like, I'm like, "What am I doing?" I drove to, 'cause I wanted to look at the elementary school where I went to elementary school in North Carolina.

Episode duration: 3:03:16