Joe Rogan Experience #2238 - John McPhee

This episode is brought to you by The Farmer's Dog. Get 50% off your first box by heading to http://thefarmersdog.com/rogan today! John McPhee, widely known as “The Sheriff of Baghdad” or “SHREK,” is a retired U.S. Army Special Operations Sergeant Major with over 20 years of distinguished service. He is the owner of SOB Tactical, a supplier of specialized training and tactical gear to civilians, military, and law enforcement. www.sobtactical.com

Joe RoganhostJohn McPheeguest

Dec 4, 20242h 57mWatch on YouTube ↗

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150 min read · 30,238 words

0:00 – 3:23
Meeting John McPhee + how hard childhoods forge “an extra gear”
1. NANarrator
  (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience.
2. NANarrator
  Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music) Good to see you, brother.
3. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, how are you, man?
4. NANarrator
  Great, great. It was nice meet you at, uh, F1. And, uh-
5. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
6. NANarrator
  ... I really loved your episode with Sean Ryan. I fucking love that dude.
7. JMJohn McPhee
  Thanks, man. Yeah, Sean is-
8. NANarrator
  He's the man.
9. JMJohn McPhee
  ... he's awesome. I love Sean.
10. NANarrator
  I'm so glad there's guys like him doing this, that there's, there's more people like him that are, like, finding new ways to, like, you know ... Media's, it's so wide open now.
11. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
12. NANarrator
  And it's not, you don't have to get hired by a television station anymore. You could just start your own shit. And Sean's show is fucking great.
13. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, he's great. Sean's ... I love him as a person, so.
14. NANarrator
  Yeah, I love him too. He's great. He's an awesome dude. And I loved you on that show, but God damn, man, that show was crazy. Like, your childhood was so nuts, dude.
15. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
16. NANarrator
  Hearing about you living in a brothel when you were 12 years old.
17. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, me and my brother. (laughs)
18. NANarrator
  Fuck, dude. Your whole story was so nuts, man. I was listening to it in the sauna this morning, and I was like, "Oh my God." So I'm there cooking at-
19. JMJohn McPhee
  (laughs) Yeah.
20. NANarrator
  ... 195 degrees listening to you struggle.
21. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. (laughs)
22. NANarrator
  (laughs) I was in there for half an hour.
23. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
24. NANarrator
  Which, I usually do 20 minutes-
25. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
26. NANarrator
  ... but I kept going. I'm like, his, his life was so fucked up, I feel like I shouldn't bail right now. I should keep listening.
27. JMJohn McPhee
  I f- I feel like, like, um, but I'm not the only one. You know what I mean?
28. NANarrator
  No.
29. JMJohn McPhee
  I f- I feel like where I was in the army is full of guys just like that.
30. NANarrator
  100%
3:23 – 4:58
Finding belonging in Ranger Battalion, jiu-jitsu, and the ‘meditation’ effect
1. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. Well, I'll tell you, that was the army for me. Like, the first time I ever felt like, like I fit in or I was with people like me-
2. NANarrator
  Right.
3. JMJohn McPhee
  ... was when I was, you know, in Ranger Battalion.
4. NANarrator
  Yeah. I, I think fighting is the same way.
5. JMJohn McPhee
  Mm-hmm.
6. NANarrator
  A lot of those guys, the only time they ever feel normal is when they're in a gym with a bunch of other savages.
7. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
8. NANarrator
  It's like, it's guys who wanna do that for a living, you know, y- generally, something fucking terribly wrong happened when you were young-
9. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
10. NANarrator
  ... that put this anger, this monster inside of you.
11. JMJohn McPhee
  Well, I tell ya, the, I tell people all the time, jujitsu's my sanity.
12. NANarrator
  Yeah. Oh, jujitsu's meditation, man. Because if you are doing jujitsu, you can't be thinking about anything else.
13. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
14. NANarrator
  So it cleans your mind up. You know, we were talking-
15. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
16. NANarrator
  ... about bow hunting.
17. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
18. NANarrator
  I think that's the same thing. I think in a s-
19. JMJohn McPhee
  Agree.
20. NANarrator
  ... in a different way. It's just, y- when you're doing that, it's so difficult, you can't think about anything else.
21. JMJohn McPhee
  Right. I, I love when I'm ... I don't even care if I get or see an elk today. The places I go to get these elk-
22. NANarrator
  Right.
23. JMJohn McPhee
  ... I could just sit there all day anyway.
24. NANarrator
  I know.
25. JMJohn McPhee
  You know what I mean?
26. NANarrator
  Yeah, it's amazing.
27. JMJohn McPhee
  The fact that, like, one of these majestic beasts is gonna walk 20 yards from me, fucking bonus. You know what I mean?
28. NANarrator
  (laughs)
29. JMJohn McPhee
  Like, I just, you know what I'm saying?
30. NANarrator
  Yeah, yeah.
4:58 – 9:46
Getting humbled by Gracies: why technique changes your worldview
1. NANarrator
  You know, I remember when I was first starting jujitsu, I was, like, 30 years old and I thought I was a badass. I had kickboxed, I had won a bunch of TaeKwonDo tournaments. I thought I knew how to fight. And I remember one day when I was at white belt, this purple belt just raped me.
2. JMJohn McPhee
  (laughs)
3. NANarrator
  I mean, he was my size. This was what drove me crazy. He wasn't bigger than me, and he just destroyed me. Just destroyed, just did whatever he wanted. Triangled me, arm barred me, choked me. And I remember walking out of there going, I can't ... First of all, what a, like, shift of, like, who you are in the world, knowing that someone can just do that to you. Not a bigger guy, like someone your size can just ... You're helpless. And then I remember thinking, I gotta get good at this. Like, that, having that as a skill-
4. JMJohn McPhee
  Mm-hmm.
5. NANarrator
  ... that's like one of the greatest things you could ever have. Like, 'cause that's what martial arts was supposed to be when we were kids, like that the smaller person could beat the larger person just with technique.
6. JMJohn McPhee
  Correct.
7. NANarrator
  ... until Royce Gracie came along, you never really saw that.
8. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
9. NANarrator
  The bigger guys always won.
10. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
11. NANarrator
  And then Royce Gracie, all of a sudden, he's killing people from his back and we're like, "What is going on?"
12. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
13. NANarrator
  This is crazy.
14. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. He's losing. He's not losing.
15. NANarrator
  All of a sudden, he's like (choking sound)
16. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
17. NANarrator
  some guy-
18. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
19. NANarrator
  He's strangling-
20. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
21. NANarrator
  ... some guy with his legs. We're like-
22. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
23. NANarrator
  ... "What the fuck is this?"
24. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, I agree. I agree. I tell you, uh, I met Royce, like, we, you know, in the early days, we'd bring Royce and Rorion was actually the first Gracie I met before Royce, right? But we'd bring Royce in, and, like, watching these guys, like, you know, we'd get, like, 60 guys up on the mat. And this is hard to do. And this is a lot of guys because it's Royce, you know, and he would run through every dude.
25. NANarrator
  Yeah.
26. JMJohn McPhee
  E-ve-ry dude. And it was like, not like, not like it was a close match. It was like whatever dude from the defo stepped in front of him was the 12-year-old child against the fucking, an adult.
27. NANarrator
  Yeah.
28. JMJohn McPhee
  You know what I mean?
29. NANarrator
  Yeah.
30. JMJohn McPhee
  Like he just fucking handled everybody. And I remember one of those times, he just fucking, I did something and he cinched down on me like a spider and I couldn't fucking move.
9:46 – 13:48
MMA evolution: wrestling as the base + fixing round resets
1. NANarrator
  Yeah. Well, I think wrestling is kind of th- there's like so many elite wrestlers now that have learned submissions. And that extra skill of being able to throw bodies around is another level.
2. JMJohn McPhee
  I agree.
3. NANarrator
  'Cause wrestlers can learn jujitsu pretty easy.
4. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
5. NANarrator
  An elite wrestler, you take a guy like a Bo Nickal or a Daniel Cormier, teach them jujitsu, they're gonna... Khamzat Chimaev's the best-
6. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
7. NANarrator
  ... example of that.
8. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
9. NANarrator
  You get a, you teach a guy like that submissions, he already knows how to ragdoll people. So he has this ability to take everybody down, and then on top of that, he's gonna break your neck. Like, he, it's like that extra sk- I think wrestling is like the foundation.
10. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
11. NANarrator
  That's the one thing 'Cause then you can dictate whether the fight goes to the ground or stays up, you know?
12. JMJohn McPhee
  Yes.
13. NANarrator
  And then once you learn submissions, which is pretty easy for a wrestler to learn-
14. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
15. NANarrator
  ... it's pretty similar.
16. JMJohn McPhee
  It's the same sport.
17. NANarrator
  Yeah.
18. JMJohn McPhee
  I used to wrestle and it's like the cradle for the pin-
19. NANarrator
  Mm-hmm.
20. JMJohn McPhee
  ... versus an arm bar, right?
21. NANarrator
  Sure.
22. JMJohn McPhee
  In my opinion.
23. NANarrator
  Darce chokes.
24. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, yeah.
25. NANarrator
  All these different things come from similar positions. But then standup. You know, you have to have standup today because every-
26. JMJohn McPhee
  Have to.
27. NANarrator
  ... I think, you know, I've been talking about this a lot. I don't think... I think whe- when you have a fight and it's five rounds, let's say you have a fight, if a guy's mounted on top of a guy at the end of the first round, I think the second round should start with that guy mounted on top-
28. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
29. NANarrator
  ... of you. I don't think they should start standing up 'cause it doesn't make any sense. Like you didn't earn that standup.
30. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
13:48 – 16:51
Military combatives in the ’90s: weapons retention, wrist locks, and ‘hocus pocus’
1. NANarrator
  So you started training martial arts in- when you were in the military?
2. JMJohn McPhee
  In the unit, yeah.
3. NANarrator
  In the unit.
4. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
5. NANarrator
  So did they have- like, was it, like, technical training? Did they-
6. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
7. NANarrator
  ... teach you- did you- did they have, like, real instructors or was-
8. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
9. NANarrator
  How does it work?
10. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, so, uh, in training when you kind of make it to the unit, there's a hand-to-hand program. A lot of the hand-to-hand program is, like, traditionally, like, you gotta cuff people. You know what I mean?
11. NANarrator
  Mm-hmm.
12. JMJohn McPhee
  Like, which is all Japanese wrist locks, which is a foundation for a lot of shit, right? But, uh, you know, you learn that stuff, like, how- if you have a weapon, how to, like, approach somebody. If they grab your weapon, what to do. So it was all, like, uh, weapon focused, like, more like self-defense. But I think back then in my day, right, in the '90s, it was still, "Bro, come at me like this." You know what I mean?
13. NANarrator
  (laughs)
14. JMJohn McPhee
  And you're like, "Why the fuck would I stand like this, ever? Like, what the fuck was I doing that got me here?" You know what I mean?
15. NANarrator
  Right.
16. JMJohn McPhee
  Like, so it was always some- back then there was a lot of hocus pocus.
17. NANarrator
  Ah.
18. JMJohn McPhee
  So we kind of had our own training program, and then as my years, the training program got better because we started getting hoist. We started ground fighting, you know? I think the- the premise for everything they taught in my day when I was a student was, like, uh, you know, weapons retention, Japanese wrist lock to get someone cuffed, you know, two-man cuffing procedures, searching, and then, like, how to defend yourself if someone grabbed your weapon or if you went to the ground, right? But-
19. NANarrator
  Right. Which is all stuff you have to know.
20. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
21. NANarrator
  But there wasn't a lot of, like, just-
22. JMJohn McPhee
  No.
23. NANarrator
  ... one-on-one.
24. JMJohn McPhee
  No. No. It's like, you know, you're in the- (laughs) you're in the gym, they roll out the wrestling mat, and it's like, "Okay, come at the guy, like, with your rifle, ah."
25. NANarrator
  Ah.
26. JMJohn McPhee
  You know- you know, a bunch of fucking white belts basically, like, out there fucking around basically.
27. NANarrator
  W- did- does it- wasn't, like, uh, there- was there a system, like, a training system?
28. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
29. NANarrator
  Was there like a- a-
30. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. There was a- there was a system back then, and the system was really, um, I c- I think kind of four things without, uh, really knowing what they did back then. I went through the training, but I don't really know what the hand-to-hand was back then until later when I was, like, in the hand-to-hand program or fighting with guys, you know what I mean?
16:51 – 24:05
Muay Thai’s leg-kick lesson + how martial arts evolve via real competition
1. NANarrator
  D- how did the Filipinos develop that stick fighting? Like, where'd that come from?
2. JMJohn McPhee
  I don't know, man. Like-
3. NANarrator
  Isn't it weird, weird that, like, one culture's known for their stick fighting?
4. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, yeah.
5. NANarrator
  Kinda odd, right?
6. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. But hey, I love all that, uh, that- the stick fighting. What do they call it? Panutukan or whatever, the dirty boxing they do, like, all very make your opponent off balance at the same time you can strike.
7. NANarrator
  Mm-hmm.
8. JMJohn McPhee
  Or if they are trying to strike you, knock them off balance. Stuff like that.
9. NANarrator
  I'm just- I've always been so fascinated how different cultures have a completely-
10. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
11. NANarrator
  ... different approach to fighting. Like, the Thais figured out the best way to fight stand up.
12. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
13. NANarrator
  Kick the shit out of the legs.
14. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, fucking kick his legs.
15. NANarrator
  Elbow the fuck out of people in the clinch or-
16. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
17. NANarrator
  ... plong, knees.
18. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, the clinch.
19. NANarrator
  Knees to the body, knees to the face. They figured out striking in a way that nobody else had.
20. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
21. NANarrator
  It's weird that they did it.
22. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
23. NANarrator
  And I think it's just because of the competition all the time and the betting.
24. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, yeah.
25. NANarrator
  Because, like, they were fighting so often and they had so much money on the line for fighting that they developed a very pragmatic way of fight- 'cause they were fighting all the time.
26. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
27. NANarrator
  As opposed to, like, karate or any of these-
28. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
29. NANarrator
  ... other things. I don't think they were really fighting as much.
30. JMJohn McPhee
  Well, we don't- I mean, think about America, like, prior to Mike Tyson, boxing was kind of like Americans... If they would have seen, like, Rickson Gracie. You know, if Rickson Gracie would have been popular in, like, the '70s or '60s, people would have been like...... well, that's not civilized fighting. You know what I mean?
24:05 – 33:26
Roofied at the NRA show: a wild night and the reality of drugging-for-robbery
1. JMJohn McPhee
  I'll fucking shred that shit. The NRA...
2. NANarrator
  Let's shred.
3. JMJohn McPhee
  I go to all... I speak at the NRA shows. Like, the NRA hires me, I speak at all, uh, the NRA show this year. I actually got roofied in fucking Dallas-
4. NANarrator
  What?
5. JMJohn McPhee
  ... at the NRA show. Yeah, no shit.
6. NANarrator
  Do you know who did it?
7. JMJohn McPhee
  Uh, so...... is fucking- this is crazy, right? But, uh, okay, I have an assistant, right? Um, I don't know, she's like 30, blonde girl, pretty girl. Her and her husband are, are with me and I'm with, like, this Surefire representative. Like, "Yo, sorry we got you roofied, by the way." Uh, and then, like, some other guys, right? And we get done with the show and we just go have a drink or two, and we're going into, like, the hotel restaurant to eat a nice steak dinner. You know what I mean? So we get a round of drinks and it was, uh, like, well old-fashioned, is what it was. Well old-fashioned. And my assistant's like- I was sitting next to her, she's like, "I just can't drink anymore." You know what I mean? Like, "These are horrible old-fashioned. I just can't- I just can't drink these anymore." And I was like, "Hey, we'll be at dinner in a minute. They got good booze at the good restaurant. We'll get anything you want," right? So she's like, "Okay." So I was like, "Here, I'll take it." So I held my cup up, and then I kinda held my cup up, the Surefire guy, her husband, and she kind of fills us all up equally. And so...
8. NANarrator
  So somebody was trying to roofie her?
9. JMJohn McPhee
  Her, right? So, yeah. This is in Dallas, right? So, okay. So we go to dinner. I don't know, I get this Wagyu burger, it's fucking delicious. I'm kinda buzzed. I'm drinking good whiskey, you know what I mean? We're having a good time, right? I love good food, right? So, uh, I'm having a great time. Her husband's at the end of the table and all of a sudden, and now this is, like, within 45 minutes of that drink, which I also didn't know, right? So, uh, his head hits the table, bump, and I look at him and I'm like, like, like, "Is he okay?" And then, like, uh, hey, you know how, like, uh, you know them blow up pools where you pull down the side and the water just kinda-
10. NANarrator
  Yeah.
11. JMJohn McPhee
  ... glides over the top? Yo, his mouth opens and it was just like, whoa, across the table.
12. NANarrator
  (laughs)
13. JMJohn McPhee
  You know what I mean? And I was like, I pushed away from the table, like, so it didn't leak on me and I was like, "We gotta go." You know what I mean? "It's time to leave." You know what I mean? "I'll get the check by the front door or something." You know what I mean? But it's-
14. NANarrator
  Right.
15. JMJohn McPhee
  We'd definitely, it's time for us, like...
16. NANarrator
  And you weren't feeling it yet?
17. JMJohn McPhee
  No. I wasn't f- I didn't, I didn't feel anything yet, right? So, okay. So it was like, I never seen this happen to this guy, ever, right? So he, this isn't him, like, so it's kinda weird, right? So my assistant's like, "Hey, I'll take him up to the room." I was like, "Okay, well, we're gonna go have a few more drinks at the bar, right?" So me and the other guy go to the bar. She goes up to her room, right? I don't know any of this is happening, but as soon as they get to the room, the head of security's knocking on the door. So my assistant answers and then I guess the guy was like, "Is, is there a guy that threw up in the restaurant here?" And she's like, "He's in the bathtub naked right now," like, and then the head of security, like, "Hey, we watched the tapes." Ton of info comes out. Right? So, so-
18. NANarrator
  I don't know who did it?
19. JMJohn McPhee
  I think so. But, like, uh, and then-
20. NANarrator
  Did it tell you?
21. JMJohn McPhee
  No. No, no. They, they talked to my assistant and then her husband, right? Like, so, uh, I go down to the bar, right? I put my credit card on the bar and, like, I fucking partied till all hours of the night, yo. What did I learn? If you roofie me, like, you're gonna wait six hours to get that booty, 'cause once you give me drugs, I wanna party, baby.
22. NANarrator
  (laughs)
23. JMJohn McPhee
  You know what I mean? Like... So I'm out, like, I don't know what the fuck that, the Surefire guy fucking petered out on me and I'm probably just in the lobby alone, like, uhnth, uhnth, uhnth fucked up. I don't know what the fuck-
24. NANarrator
  Do you know what was in it?
25. JMJohn McPhee
  Fuck no.
26. NANarrator
  So it was just something? It wasn't-
27. JMJohn McPhee
  (coughs)
28. NANarrator
  ... it wasn't necessarily roofie, Roofenol.
29. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. I-
30. NANarrator
  It was probably something...
33:26 – 41:08
‘Old evil’ is real: Iraq/Afghanistan, Gettysburg, and places that feel haunted
1. JMJohn McPhee
  I'm telling you, that's one of the things I wanted to talk about today is like, there's fucking real evil in the world and in Iraq or in A- Afghanistan. You go into these fucked up places where they've been like, I don't know, fucking raping, beheading people, fucking-
2. NANarrator
  Forever.
3. JMJohn McPhee
  ... tribal shit forever.
4. NANarrator
  Forever.
5. JMJohn McPhee
  Like, there was buildings I didn't even wanna fucking go in. Like, you'd, you'd go and you'd be like... Every fucking hair on my body'd just be standing up. And I mean, at the doorway. I'd be like, "I don't even wanna clear this fucking building." You know what I mean? And I don't know fucking why, but uh, I know there's fucking old evil in this world, man.
6. NANarrator
  Evil's real.
7. JMJohn McPhee
  It's fucking real.
8. NANarrator
  And if you've never experienced it, you could walk around delusional and think, "Oh, come on."
9. JMJohn McPhee
  It's real.
10. NANarrator
  It's real.
11. JMJohn McPhee
  You can feel it like... When I'm around real evil shit... Only two places I've felt real evil shit in my life is Gettysburg and fucking in Iraq and-
12. NANarrator
  Gettysburg?
13. JMJohn McPhee
  ... Afghanistan. Yeah. I f- I felt that like... I did... Because I've felt evil before and it like, makes me wanna throw up. It hurts my stomach. Like-
14. NANarrator
  You mean, in the area of Gettysburg?
15. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. Yeah, on the battlefield.
16. NANarrator
  My, my stepfather felt the same thing. And he's not woo-woo at all.
17. JMJohn McPhee
  Fuck.
18. NANarrator
  He's like a real straight edge guy.
19. JMJohn McPhee
  Fuck, man. And then-
20. NANarrator
  And he said it felt so creepy.
21. JMJohn McPhee
  I was almost gonna... Me and, uh... Me and my, my son were out there ghost hunting, right? And we were both gonna throw up and I didn't tell him, but like, I had felt that feeling before.
22. NANarrator
  It's crazy that you said that-
23. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
24. NANarrator
  ... about Gettysburg 'cause my stepdad's never said anything like that before. And he said just the feeling. It was so sad and creepy and you just wanted to get out of there immediately.
25. JMJohn McPhee
  Makes me wanna throw up, that feeling.
26. NANarrator
  I think places have memory. I really believe that.
27. JMJohn McPhee
  Well, it's e-
28. NANarrator
  I-
29. JMJohn McPhee
  I think it's energy and I don't think it-
30. NANarrator
  Yeah.
41:08 – 1:05:49
Hard childhoods, fatherlessness, and why ‘beasts’ rarely come from comfort
1. NANarrator
  You know, it's fucked up that I don't want that to happen to my kids. Like, I don't want my k-... I mean, my life was nothing like your life, but I was definitely, like, let loose in the world, you know?
2. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
3. NANarrator
  And not really given any guidance.
4. JMJohn McPhee
  Tona- (laughs) -tona let loose with no guidance.
5. NANarrator
  But that's how you make a person like you. Like, a person like you doesn't come from a home that has, like-
6. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
7. NANarrator
  ... you know, you're coddled, you're taken care of, you're always protected.
8. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
9. NANarrator
  Like, the only way you make like a legit beast of a man is that that man has to go through a lot of shit through their life-
10. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
11. NANarrator
  ... and then they come out on the other end hard.
12. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
13. NANarrator
  It's the only way.
14. JMJohn McPhee
  Right.
15. NANarrator
  Like, you don't... You know, I've never met, like, a world champion fighter that came from, like, the happiest of childhoods.
16. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
17. NANarrator
  It's just doesn't exist.
18. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah, but I don't... A lot of, a lot of unit or special forces or ranger guys, like, uh, I used to call it the fatherless, you know what I mean? And it, it works kinda two ways. Either you had a dad, but he worked and he came home and he passed out and he woke up and he was gone before you got up. And when you got home, he was asleep on the couch or already out for the night 'cause he fucking works, fucking, a lot of hours. Or you kinda just didn't have a dad, you know what I mean?
19. NANarrator
  Right.
20. JMJohn McPhee
  Those people make special forces soldiers. Just like, you know, dad issues for a chick will put her on a pole.
21. NANarrator
  Right.
22. JMJohn McPhee
  Those same issues in a dude puts him in special forces, I think.
23. NANarrator
  Yeah. Yeah.
24. JMJohn McPhee
  And I'll take the fatherless all day long.
25. NANarrator
  ... yeah.
26. JMJohn McPhee
  You know?
27. NANarrator
  Yeah.
28. JMJohn McPhee
  For sure.
29. NANarrator
  Well, those are the world champions. I mean, that's Mike Tyson, right?
30. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
1:05:49 – 1:14:21
Building mental toughness in training: parachute cutaways and CQB progression
1. NANarrator
  Is there anything, like, you as a leader, when you see a guy who's maybe ...... crossed over in that way. Is there anything that you would do to try to bring them back? Or is there nothing that can be done?
2. JMJohn McPhee
  That's a great question. Uh, define bring him back. Define what's wrong with him.
3. NANarrator
  Right. I guess a confidence thing, or just-
4. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
5. NANarrator
  ... being terrified.
6. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
7. NANarrator
  So like new fear being introduct-
8. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
9. NANarrator
  You know, a lot of guys think they're indestructible-
10. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah.
11. NANarrator
  ... until they're not.
12. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. Yeah.
13. NANarrator
  And then all of a sudden now this is a new factor.
14. JMJohn McPhee
  Yeah. Uh, I used to teach, uh, tandem jumping and bundle jumping in the military, and I don't know if you've ever seen my social media but like I'm in the sky flying and there's that huge barrel under me. Uh, I used to teach that and what would happen is if you had a bad jump, a b- you know, bundle jump, um, you would have to cut away and, uh, we called it the nightmare, right? And you gotta end the nightmare and this thing starts spinning you out of control, it'll be so many Gs that like you'll pass out, parachute will open later, right? You'll be fine. Uh, but we used to tell guys, right, like, "Fucking end that nightmare." Make sense? Now, you're the captain of the ship so a guy would have to end this nightmare however he ended the nightmare, right? Uh, and then what would happen is afterwards we'd review the video and I'd have to show a guy, right, and then we'd leave them in the classroom for a minute and we'd tell them, "Hey, gather your emotions, whatever you need to do, and then get on the next plane."