EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,011 words- 0:00 – 1:39
Why Wu-Tang Worked: Nine alphas, one vision
- NANarrator
(drum roll) Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out.
The Joe Rogan Experience. (energetic music) Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.
- RARaekwon
Joe Rogan, this way.
- JRJoe Rogan
What up?
- NANarrator
You need to stay.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's it. The Chef is in the building, ladies and gentlemen.
- RARaekwon
What's up? What's up?
- JRJoe Rogan
Pleasure to meet you, man. You are a part of the most iconic band in all of hip hop. There is no question.
- RARaekwon
Mm.
- JRJoe Rogan
There's one Wu-Tang. There's only one Wu-Tang. Nothing else is even close. You guys were so different than every other band that ever existed.
- RARaekwon
Crazy.
- JRJoe Rogan
It was a giant group of you.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
And everybody was a killer.
- RARaekwon
Fucking mob, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's a crazy band, man. It- like-
- RARaekwon
Fucking mob.
- JRJoe Rogan
... no one has ... It's... If you think about it, there's been a lot of hip hop duos.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
There's been a lot of producers and MCs. There's been a lot of people to get together in, like, small groups. But there's only one-
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
... Wu-Tang. There's only one group of nine assassins.
- RARaekwon
I tell niggas that all the time. Like, you ain't gonna-
- JRJoe Rogan
It's kinda crazy.
- RARaekwon
You ain't gonna get another one of these.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's, it's crazy that it-
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... worked.
- RARaekwon
Yeah. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
'Cause it's so hard to keep all those alphas together.
- 1:39 – 3:17
RZA as the organizer: recruiting talent like a “mob” structure
- RARaekwon
I tell people all the time, it was like, when RZA ... You know, he came with this whole philosophy of wanting to do it, it was like hitting the lotto for him. Like, he didn't know what to expect. It was more a reputation thing for us. It was like, "Yo, I wanna do this." And, you know, he came to blocking. He talked to some real dudes that was really had other shit planned in their life. You know, but hip hop was always, like, that backpack that we wore every day. But everybody had different plans, so he really literally came in and started to pick motherfuckers that he felt had potential. So it's like the mob. It's like, you know, you know, Lucky Luciano, prime example. You know, he knew that motherfuckers had potential, right? He knew dudes had potential in any way. He's from a different part, he's from a different part, he's from a different part. But yo, what we could do right here is we can make money. So put your fucking feelings down or whatever the case may be, and let's talk about some money.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
And that right there, kinda like, "Yo." He started shaking hands across the table. "Yo, I know you ain't really fuck with me like that, y'all. I never had anything against you like that, though." But it just ... It was just something that he felt like, at the end of the day, "Let me try this shit."
- JRJoe Rogan
Uh, well, RZA's a genius.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
And it's, it's amazing that he was able to coordinate that.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
Because that's often the case, right, with o- other killers. Like, w- when, when a dude's a bad motherfucker, they always assume that everybody else doesn't like them.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
They always assume that everybody else is the enemy or competition.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
So to have nine of you guys together like that-
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... as one group.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- 3:17 – 5:37
Protect Your Neck, police escorts, and the Rikers Island concert story
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, we always ... I told you, uh, when I wa- when I sent you a message, I said that we play Protect Your Neck. It's like-
- RARaekwon
I know.
- JRJoe Rogan
Whenever we have-
- RARaekwon
I know.
- JRJoe Rogan
... a police escort-
- RARaekwon
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
... that's what's the most hilarious thing. So we're doing arena shows-
- RARaekwon
It's so good.
- JRJoe Rogan
... we, we hire a police escort.
- RARaekwon
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
So it's like fucking sirens and shit.
- RARaekwon
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
Protect Your Neck. (laughs)
- RARaekwon
Oh my God.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, all the time. (laughs)
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
The whole ... It's like the perfect song to play when you're-
- RARaekwon
Ah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... when you're getting a police escort. (laughs)
- RARaekwon
Oh my God. Nah, I know, I know. Trust me.
- JRJoe Rogan
These young kids-
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
... that I have at the club, like, I was explaining Wu-Tang Clan to them the other night. I go, "You have to understand how wild this band was." I go, "When Ol' Dirty Bastard was in Rikers, they went to Rikers and performed in Rikers."
- RARaekwon
You remember that?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yes!
- RARaekwon
How the fuck you remember that?
- JRJoe Rogan
I told everybody. I was like, "Do you know how crazy that is?"
- RARaekwon
Word, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You're talking about, like, the biggest rap band in the fucking world.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- 5:37 – 7:30
How fast hip-hop took over: from early exposure to a global obsession
- JRJoe Rogan
The 90s for hip hop, it was like, people need ... Y- you have to understand. For young people, you grew up with hip hop, you're only 20 years old, I get it.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
But you have to understand from my perspective. In the 19- in 1980, there was no hip hop.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
In 1992, that was all anybody gave a fuck about.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
That is crazy.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
For a new art form, it was-
- RARaekwon
To, to emerge, right?
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
I mean, there was like Sugarhill Gang. There was some hip hop, but it wasn't-... the thing until the '90s.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And '90s hip-hop has been-
- RARaekwon
It got big, it got big, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, it got-
- RARaekwon
'Cause look-
- JRJoe Rogan
... so big.
- RARaekwon
... I remember, I remember. It's so crazy you said that because I tell people all the time, like, disco, to me, was hip-hop before hip-hop was. You know, um, disco, um, R&B, everything was a mixture. It was a mixture. So really when hip-hop came, like you said, it came, like, maybe, um, I'm gonna say '80s, '85. The Beat might have touched-
- JRJoe Rogan
It had to be '84- ... '84, '85.
- RARaekwon
... 'cause I was in junior high school.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, yeah. We was young boys, right? So I would definitely say you, you heard something and it was like, "Oh, shit. Motherfuckers is rhyming. Wow. I ain't... You know, this shit sound cool though." You know what I mean? "It sound cool." But really it, it was a way to bring people together, you know, that was going through different shit in they life. You know what I mean?
- RARaekwon
Yeah. And you know what? It was earlier than that- Cruises as well.
- JRJoe Rogan
... because in '84 I was in high school.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
So it had to be '80.
- RARaekwon
'80.
- JRJoe Rogan
Because-
- RARaekwon
'82, maybe.
- 7:30 – 10:47
Sponsor break: AG1 and Rocket Money
- JRJoe Rogan
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- 10:47 – 12:20
Raekwon’s origin story: Sugarhill Gang, cousins, and the sound of the streets
- RARaekwon
Um, the first shit that, that grabbed me was, like how you said, Sugarhill Gang, you know. Um, Rap Is Delight.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
Rap Is Delight (singing) .
- JRJoe Rogan
(singing) .
- RARaekwon
That was the shit, you know.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh my God.
- RARaekwon
Now look, I had cousins-
- JRJoe Rogan
It was everywhere.
- RARaekwon
I had cousins, I had wild cousins and shit. They was, you know, they was wild. They was selling drugs. They was, you know, smoking weed and sniffing coke and, you know what I mean, doing whatever they was doing. And, um, they used to live two, they used to live two floors above me and, um, I used to sneak up there and shit and, you know, just be in they business, be in they world and they would be playing music. They had the record player, you know, you see coke on the table and-
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow.
- RARaekwon
... weed and everything. And my cousins, they was cool. They were like, "Yo, come in, man. We don't give a fuck. Like, just don't tell your mother that you-"
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
"... that you was around and shit." You know what I mean? "Nah, nah, I ain't gonna say nothing. I ain't gonna say nothing." And I would just be watching and, you know, I would see weed on the album covers and, you know what I mean, just more fuckers running back and forth in the room and, you know, they into shit, but they always was playing music. And a lot of the music was R&B, you know, disco, um...... you know? And then, next thing you know, I heard this fucking record, um, Sugarhill Gang, and I'm like, "The groove was dope." I'm like, "Holy shit." Like, "This is what I want to be." You know what I mean?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
I'm looking at the whole vibe. I'm like, "This is who I am right here," you know? But-
- JRJoe Rogan
It's so crazy-
- RARaekwon
... it was a wild time.
- JRJoe Rogan
... how it emerged. I mean, it-
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... emerged.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know?
- RARaekwon
Nobody expected that, bro.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, it's, it was a totally new thing.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, definitely.
- 12:20 – 13:18
Censorship backlash and why raw rap won (Tipper Gore era)
- JRJoe Rogan
And there, there was a lot of resistance. I mean, th- for people that don't know, those little warning labels on your, uh, y- when you used to have CDs-
- RARaekwon
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
That all came from Al Gore's wife.
- RARaekwon
Get the fuck outta here.
- JRJoe Rogan
Al Gore's wife, Tipper Gore, she wa- was a Democrat.
- RARaekwon
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
She wanted to censor rap music-
- RARaekwon
Oh, shit.
- JRJoe Rogan
... because this is the first time anybody heard like Ice-T, you know, like that, Six in the Morning."
- RARaekwon
Yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Everybody was like, "What the-"
- RARaekwon
Yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
"... fuck is this?"
- RARaekwon
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
You know? And that kind of explicit lyrics, they wanted to put a stop to it.
- RARaekwon
Wow.
- JRJoe Rogan
And that's why they p- And these dumbasses, they didn't even understand-
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
... it sold way more albums-
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... because that's what kids were looking for.
- RARaekwon
And that's what made people go, "Yeah, exactly."
- JRJoe Rogan
Where the fucking ... This ... They don't even swear?
- RARaekwon
Yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Get this shit outta here.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Once the flood gates-
- RARaekwon
Once it got the label on it, it's like, "I want it." It ... Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Exactly.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- 13:18 – 20:19
Crime, crack, and survival: why authenticity powered Wu-Tang’s voice
- RARaekwon
Nah, it definitely didn't last. But like you said, though, everybody wanted the raw shit. And you gotta remember, at that time, it was a tough time, man. Too much shit was going on. I mean, it was to the point where it's like, yo, in our neighborhood, we has, we had like crazy people, like if they catch you at night, they'll kill you. Like, they'll be dressed up like a fucking drag or whatever, all this makeup on. And, you know, I remember one time going to the incinerator room, my moms made me go, she made me go to the, um, to the, um, take out the garbage and shit. I forgot to take it out and she came home later that day and I was laying down and she fucking smacked me in the head with a broom, like, "Yo, didn't I tell you to take out the fucking garbage?" So now, I'm going down to the incinerator room, you know, walking. It's, it's on the same floor. And I remember when I cut the corner, I seen a motherfucker sticking his head out and he had his hair all wild, his shit was like green and red and all this, and he had lipstick on all crazy and his eyes was all fucking bugged out looking. And he looked at me, and when ... And I got the garbage pail with me and it's like, yo, once I seen him, I just turned, I just dropped the shit and ran, "Ma! Ma!"
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
You know what I mean? Back then, you know, you yell your mother name and shit. You'd think that, that that was something cool back then. They, you know, she's your hero at that time. Came back, that nigga was gone. But I think, if he woulda caught me in that incinerator door when it was closed-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- RARaekwon
... he was gonna probably try to run in there and probably try to fucking kill me or something.
- JRJoe Rogan
Ugh.
- RARaekwon
And that shit was going on back then because the drugs, the drugs was crazy back then, so you know-
- JRJoe Rogan
Right. That's the big shift, is crack.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, crack.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's also in the '80s.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, but see, but see, before crack, you had that dope, that dope, that dope. So motherfuckers was mixing dope and coke together and getting high and shooting it-
- JRJoe Rogan
Speedballs.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, everything.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
You know what I mean? It was, it was a serious time back then, man. But, you know, uh, that's how far, to me, music went back, you know, listening to Ladies Night. You know what I mean? I had, I had people at my store that had a candy store right on the same floor, but it wasn't a candy store. They just had a bunch of penny candy just to make kids feel cool, but really, they were selling coke in the back.
- JRJoe Rogan
Uh-huh.
- RARaekwon
Coke and dope, though. So, you know, all this was going on in the community, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow.
- RARaekwon
It was a, it was a serious time. It was scary times back then. Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
Y- But if it's not for those scary times, you don't get the kind of band that Wu-Tang was. Like, that, that has to emerge from an authentic experience.
- RARaekwon
Absolutely.
- JRJoe Rogan
It has to.
- RARaekwon
Absolutely.
- JRJoe Rogan
And that's part of the appeal of it, is that everybody kinda knew that.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, it was part of the appeal. It was like, it w-
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
There's never been like a genre of music like that, that's so connected to, like, the grind and poverty-
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
... and crime and ghettos.
- 20:19 – 25:55
How the Clan formed: RZA, GZA, ODB, and early deal momentum
- JRJoe Rogan
When ... Was it ... So was it RZA that tried ... Did, did, did ... Was it initially all nine guys? Like how did it gets formed?
- RARaekwon
Hmm. (swallows) Well, number one, um, it was RZA, his cousin JZA, and his other cousin Ol' Dirty Bastard, that they were super close. Now Ol' Dirty Bastard and JZA, they were from Brooklyn. RZA was from Staten Island. Um, you know, we all, we all Brooklyn babies too, majority of us in the clan. We all, you know, resided in New- in Staten Island but majority of us grew up in Brooklyn. But anyway, it was those three that were close as shit. So RZA, back then, RZA, he had knowledge of self which was, you know, being involved with the Nation of Islam. And also JZA and Ol' Dirty, they were a part of the Nation at that time so they would go to a lot of rallies. This is a place where everybody go and they build. They talking about mathematics and all of this. But it was JZA and Ol' Dirty who instilled the hip hop into RZA. So RZA was a DJ back then but he knew how to rhyme too, and he knew how to rhyme because of his cousins. So they kinda had this gang called ... Not a gang, but they had this thing called the All & Together Now Crew, which was them three and they would run around and they would battle, you know, different guys from different cities and move around. So, you know, some of us kinda knew what they were about, you know, a lot of us, you know, found out later w- who they were. But when JZA and Ol' Dirty came to Staten Island, they came and they hang out with their cousin. So, you know, we started to see them a little bit more and know that, you know, "Yo, I heard about your rhymes." And, you know, and Dirty, he was just a crazy motherfucker back then.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
He was crazy. But, um, yeah, they, they had their own little thing going on. And then, you know, next thing you know, JZA caught a record deal. He caught a record deal, which was rare back then. Like if you had a ... If you fucking caught a record deal that mean that you had to have relationships, you had to know where to go, you had to have some ki- some type of connects. So that's what gravitated RZA into wanting to, to do it because he seen that his cousin had, had, was able to, you know, crack the code on making a record. So when that happened, it was almost like it magnet- it magnetized RZA to be like, "Yo, I gotta make a record now too."
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- RARaekwon
You know? And the next thing you know that's ... They had they movement going on. So us from the outside looking, it was like, "Oh, shit. Yo, we know them. We know they super passionate about, you know, being in a game and doing whatever they gonna do." But we wasn't thinking that far. We just loved the music in general.
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
So, and then so RZA is essentially the mastermind to put all the pieces together and to bring all of you killers-
- RARaekwon
Absolutely.
- JRJoe Rogan
... into one, under one roof.
- RARaekwon
Absolutely. Absolutely.
- JRJoe Rogan
Amazing how he saw that.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Because, again, that's not something that existed.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's like Eric B. & Rakim. You know, there was, uh, you know, there was a few p- EPMD.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
There was a few people-
- RARaekwon
You know your shit, dog.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
You know your shit. You saying the right people.
- JRJoe Rogan
Gang Starr. There was a few people that were together-
- RARaekwon
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
... but it wasn't like you guys.
- RARaekwon
Nah. Nah, because that was-
- JRJoe Rogan
It was kinda scary. (laughs) It was like-
- RARaekwon
That ... Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... Goddamn when you guys had a show.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- 25:55 – 37:08
Industry contracts, sacrifice, and Wu’s blueprint for collective uplift
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, the dangerous thing for young artists in every industry is when you have potential and you're young, you sign a fucking contract-
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... and you don't know what's going on. And then you get locked into these people. And then a lot of times, you're getting fucked. And you don't even know you're getting fucked-
- RARaekwon
Oh, it's mandatory.
- JRJoe Rogan
...'cause it's-
- RARaekwon
It's mandatory.
- JRJoe Rogan
... mandatory.
- RARaekwon
Mandatory. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You're getting fucked, which is how they make their money.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
They make money by fucking young artists who don't know any better. And by the time someone gets to, like, a Prince's level, he's like-
- RARaekwon
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
... "Oh, you owe me? I'm, I'm a fucking squeaky line."
- RARaekwon
Exactly.
- JRJoe Rogan
"Suck my dick."
- RARaekwon
Yep, exactly.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
Yep, yep.
- JRJoe Rogan
And like, he performs as a symbol.
- RARaekwon
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I mean, that's why he performed as a symbol.
- RARaekwon
As a symbol, right.
- JRJoe Rogan
Because they owned him.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, exactly.
- JRJoe Rogan
And that... It's crazy.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You take, like, the most talented people in the world and they get owned by people who provide no value.
- RARaekwon
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Especially today.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, yeah.
- 37:08 – 52:23
Lyrics as education: Geto Boys, NWA, Public Enemy, and “the news” in rap
- JRJoe Rogan
You know? I mean, it's just ... Hey, did you ever listen to, uh, any of the shit where, um, the Brand New Heavies got together with a bunch of rappers?
- RARaekwon
The Brand New Heavies. I know the name, but I'm trying to think of what the music-
- JRJoe Rogan
The Brand New Heavies is like a jazz band. They did, they did a collaboration with Gang Starr, Kool G Rap-
- RARaekwon
Oh, yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... a bunch of guys back then.
- RARaekwon
Of course, yeah, Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Some of my favorite shit of all time.
- RARaekwon
Yeah, they was more musical though, like you said.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
They was more musical, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Have you ever heard Kool G Rap's Death Threat?
- RARaekwon
Nah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh my god.
- RARaekwon
Nah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Jamie, play that.
- RARaekwon
Look, you're schooling me this shit here.
- JRJoe Rogan
Play that.
- RARaekwon
Play that, bro. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Find that. We'll put, we gotta put on the headphones for this.
- RARaekwon
Come on, yeah, sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
This is in my, uh, along with a bunch of Wu-Tang. This is in my, um-
- RARaekwon
Right, let me hear this shit. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
This is in my, uh, Spotify playlist.
- RARaekwon
Okay.
- JRJoe Rogan
This is Kool G Rap in like, I wanna say '92. Yeah, '92.
- RARaekwon
Ooh.
- JRJoe Rogan
Listen to this.
- NANarrator
(singing) Some think that I'm a flake but I'm no fake, nigger, 'cause I take a bitch, make a meal with you, burn his ass at the stake. With the .44 mag, it's so simple. Put it to his temple. Fuck it, I give a nigger permanent dimples. Easing up on a fast flow but I'll let you ass know.
- RARaekwon
I never heard this shit before.
- NANarrator
How good is this? Brand New Heavies on the track. G Rap on the west coast, bummer got motherfuckers doing jumping jacks. You motherfuckers lost it. I bake your ass like a cake and all you flakes get frosted.
- 52:23 – 57:58
Wu-Tang’s kung fu mythology: Shaolin, Staten Island identity, and symbolism
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
But nah, but you know what's so crazy? I tell people this, like, when RZA, when they was on their Wu Tang shit, we wasn't on that. I grew up watching more, like, Scarface and Mafia movies.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
Once Upon a Time in America.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, yeah.
- RARaekwon
One of my favorite movies.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, it's a great one. People forget about Once Upon a Time in America.
- RARaekwon
That's my fucking movie right there.
- JRJoe Rogan
Woo.
- RARaekwon
That's my, that's my movie. So, we were like, we were living in this, we were living around a lot of hustlers.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- RARaekwon
A lot of, a lot of drugs was being sold in my community at that time, right? So, when RZA came with the whole Wu Tang philosophy, it was almost like, yeah, we loved karate flicks. We would watch them. You know about the karate flicks? 3:00 AM, 3:00 AM.
- JRJoe Rogan
Sure. Yeah.
- RARaekwon
We'd come home from school, them shits is on Channel 5, all of that shit, but if you notice and you look at those karate movies, it was about a place that, you know, was filled with a lot of crime and aggressive people that were doing things that bothered other people, and you either had to protect your people, or you had to make a name for yourself. Now, when you think about Wu Tang, I'm gonna just give you a quick lesson on what Wu Tang was. Wu Tang was a school that was in Shaolin. This particular school, these niggas was crazy. They was fucked up. They got kicked the fuck out of Shaolin.
- JRJoe Rogan
Really?
- RARaekwon
They got kicked out. Yo, y'all bugged out, y'all wilding, y'all.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
But these guys were very good, but they just couldn't sit in Shaolin, because they had a different way of looking at shit and doing shit. So, when RZA came with the whole philosophy of it, it's this movie that's called Shaolin versus Wu Tang, right?
- JRJoe Rogan
Ah.
- RARaekwon
Check it out whenever you get a chance. So, whatever was going on in that movie, he made a reality of it, 'cause really, at the end of the day, that's how we were living back in Staten Island, you know? So, we wind up changing the name and calling it Shaolin, because we were the forgotten borough, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Ah.
- RARaekwon
When you think about Brooklyn, Bronx, Queens, Manhattan, why you don't really talk too much about fucking Staten Island? That bothered us. So we didn't... We felt rebellious, like, "Yo, you come out here, you ain't from here? You better know somebody."
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
You're not fucking coming in the projects thinking you going to fucking act like you going over to your friends. I remember we used to see UFOs come through. We called them UFOs, under- unidentified flying objects. "The fuck he doing here? Yo, follow him. Go, w- yo. Yo, what you, what you came to see?"
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
You know what I mean? Because we had so much to prove, but it was the same thing that was going on in the karate flicks. Like, yo, you go to a new neighborhood. "Who is this guy?"
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- RARaekwon
Either he's coming to play you, he's coming to play you, or, or you gonna play him. This is all the shit that's going on in the karate movies. You know, the brotherhood. "Yo. Oh, shit. My brother got hurt." "What happened?" "Oh, hold up. Let's go-"
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- RARaekwon
"... We gotta go get back to that."
- 57:58 – 1:02:16
From Wu-Tang texts to bowhunting: discipline, focus, and clearing the mind
- JRJoe Rogan
Want to hear something crazy? Whenever I kill an elk, you know I go, uh, bowhunting every year.
- RARaekwon
Oh, shit.
- JRJoe Rogan
Whenever I kill an elk, when I text my friend Cam, I text "Wu-Tang".
- RARaekwon
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, whenever I kill something... I'll show you.
- RARaekwon
Oh, my God.
- JRJoe Rogan
I'll show you that that's true.
- RARaekwon
I've seen some of the pictures of that. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
I know, but I want to show you that that's true. I'm not making this up.
- RARaekwon
Holy shit.
- JRJoe Rogan
It goes back years. It goes back years. This is, like, our tradition. Whenever I kill a elk ... Well, I'm gonna find this.
- RARaekwon
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm gonna find the last time I said "Wu-Tang". I text him every day, so it's gonna take a second-
- RARaekwon
Right, right.
- JRJoe Rogan
... to get back into some pictures. But whenever I get one, I say, "Wu-Tang", and then I send him a picture.
- RARaekwon
Oh, shit.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- RARaekwon
Crazy. Crazy.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's gonna take a while because I do scroll.
- RARaekwon
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
But this is important to show you this is real. Come on, motherfucker. Go back and search Wu-Tang. It'll show you. Oh, it will show you? Yeah. Oh, okay. Oh. It'll show you, though. Oh, look at Jamie. All the times he texted you. Under Cam Hanes or just Wu-Tang? It'll show ... You just ... When you ... Then when you find Cam Hanes, it'll show you. Oh, look at Jamie telling me how to do it. Sorry. (laughs) Here we go. See all. Here it is. Right there. Wu-Tang.
- RARaekwon
Holy shit. Holy ... (laughs) Holy shit.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs) And then the L's down.
- RARaekwon
Wow.
- JRJoe Rogan
And that was from October.
- RARaekwon
Okay.
- JRJoe Rogan
But I got- I go back, like, five years of doing that.
- RARaekwon
Wow.
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, every time I shoot an elk, I text "Wu-Tang". (laughs)
- RARaekwon
Wow.
- 1:02:16 – 1:10:46
Longevity, Europe’s love, and ‘classic hip-hop’ becoming real
- JRJoe Rogan
You know what, what's another cool thing about today is that, um, it used to be thought at one point in time, I think it was, like, the early 2000s-
- RARaekwon
Oh, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... that rap had, that hip-hop had, uh, a shelf life.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
And that there wouldn't be classics.
- RARaekwon
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know what I mean? Like, the Rolling Stones were still touring. You know, they were 58 years old-
- RARaekwon
I love the Rolling Stones.
- JRJoe Rogan
... back then. I'm like, "This is crazy. The Rolling Stones are back on the road." But that was like a new thing. It was like old rock and roll guys out touring was a new thing. But with hip-hop artists, like, if you weren't in now, if you weren't new now, it kinda-
- RARaekwon
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
... people weren't into going to see you.
- RARaekwon
Right. Yeah. Well, when I see guys like LL and Kane and them perform, and Slick Rick and Ice Cube, it, it kinda, it, it gives me more leverage and more strength to wanna do it, because I see some of my legends still doing it today. But, um, yeah, man, like you said, just to, um, see a lot of guys like the Rolling Stones and Mick Jagger and them still performing, it's like, why not? Why-
- JRJoe Rogan
Why not?
- RARaekwon
... why not?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- RARaekwon
Why, why give up on it, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
But with hip-hop, it wasn't really a thing for a long time.
- RARaekwon
Nah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, older hip-hop-
- RARaekwon
Because you didn't think-
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- RARaekwon
... you didn't think that it would last.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- RARaekwon
You know what I mean? So you felt like you would get a five-year run. They say any artist that was coming out back in the '90s, they was already putting a cap on how long or how far they felt you was gonna go. So even for us, we was like, "Yo, hey, we do this shit for like three or four years, we good."
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm.
- RARaekwon
"Yo', we'll be cool with that."
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow.
- RARaekwon
So they always put us in a... What's the word I wanna say? What's that? What's-
- JRJoe Rogan
A box?
- RARaekwon
Put us in a box.
Episode duration: 2:02:17
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Transcript of episode HXg71gE_cZU
