Joe Rogan Experience #2371 - Fedor Gorst

Narrator 0:00 (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience.

Joe Rogan 0:06 Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music) We're up. Yeah, this is, uh, a company called M Theory sent this to me. And, uh, this was when Efren Reyes snuck into America under the nickname Cesar Morales.

Fedor Gorst 0:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:22 And, uh, won some big tournament at Red's. Wherever that is. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 0:26 Probably in, uh, Chicago?

Joe Rogan 0:28 I don't know. Put the headphones on, dog. Let's get rolling.

Fedor Gorst 0:30 I don't know. I was like...

Joe Rogan 0:31 You don't have to. Or we could not have headphones.

Fedor Gorst 0:33 No, that's good.

Joe Rogan 0:33 Do they feel weird to you?

Fedor Gorst 0:34 That's good. No, no, that's good.

Joe Rogan 0:35 You're okay? (laughs) I don't care. It doesn't matter. It's just good if, like, we show a video or something like that.

Fedor Gorst 0:40 Right.

Joe Rogan 0:41 Dude, you came that close to being two year-in-a-row US Open champion. That fucking close.

Fedor Gorst 0:47 Yeah, two days ago.

Joe Rogan 0:48 How's that feel?

Fedor Gorst 0:48 I mean, I feel super tired because my schedule has been hectic lately.

Joe Rogan 0:52 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 0:52 You know, I played the World Championships in Saudi where I also lost in the finals. Uh-

Joe Rogan 0:56 Did you play the Florida Open too?

Fedor Gorst 0:58 Florida Open.

Joe Rogan 0:59 All right.

Fedor Gorst 0:59 And I played the tournament in between that, so basically I played back to back to back to back four events.

Joe Rogan 1:03 Wow.

Fedor Gorst 1:04 Uh, it's been over a month already. You know, staying on the road, constantly playing.

Joe Rogan 1:09 Dude, there's the- the real good argument you're the best player in the world. And if you're the best player in the world, I think you are, you got my vote. If you're the best player in the world today, you're the best player of all time.

Fedor Gorst 1:20 Well... (laughs) I mean, it's really tough to-

Joe Rogan 1:22 A lot of old guys talk a lot of shit, but I'm just saying.

Fedor Gorst 1:25 Always.

Joe Rogan 1:25 I mean, this guy on my shirt, he certainly gets the, like, as- as far as like the greatest of all time, most achievements of all time, Efren. The Z shot, like all the crazy stuff that he could pull off with the cue ball. It's amazing.

Fedor Gorst 1:35 Did you see the shot that I made recently?

Joe Rogan 1:37 Uh, which one?

Fedor Gorst 1:38 The three rail kick.

Joe Rogan 1:39 I did see that, yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:40 I mean, it- it is tougher. It- it is a tougher kick.

Joe Rogan 1:44 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 1:44 It wasn't as- as, uh ... It wasn't as, uh, you know, the situation wasn't like it was a Hill-Hill-

Joe Rogan 1:49 Right.

Fedor Gorst 1:49 ... that he played against Earl, you know, in the finals.

Joe Rogan 1:51 Right.

Fedor Gorst 1:51 So it's obviously it's a much, much, uh, different environment, but, uh, the kick that I made was sick. It was sick.

Joe Rogan 1:59 It was pretty sick. Well, you know what? The Filipinos put kicking on the map, right?

Fedor Gorst 2:03 Oh, for sure. They're the best.

Joe Rogan 2:04 Like, they, Efren, when he came over here, he- they changed the whole game. Jose Perico was really good at it too.

Fedor Gorst 2:09 Carlo Biancanoli-

Joe Rogan 2:10 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 2:10 ... is the best kicker.

Joe Rogan 2:10 Oh, so good. It's- it's amazing. Here it is.

Fedor Gorst 2:13 Yeah, that's the one. That's the one. Good thing I have a filmmaker traveling with me everywhere filming me now.

Joe Rogan 2:21 That's a crazy shot.

Fedor Gorst 2:22 Yeah, I was- I was- I actually lost that match to, uh, Duong Quach.

Joe Rogan 2:27 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 2:27 Almost made shape on the two ball too.

Joe Rogan 2:28 Yeah, that's what's horrible. When you make an amazing shot and then lose the match.

Fedor Gorst 2:33 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 2:35 (sighs)

Fedor Gorst 2:35 That's how it goes.

Joe Rogan 2:35 Yeah, look, it's a crazy game. And the game that you guys are playing right now, the reason why I said I think if you're the best player today, you're the best player of all time, because the conditions are very different. For people who don't know, who don't play pool, okay, if you're going to a regular bar and you're playing on like a bar table, th- those pockets might be five-and-a-half inches, right?

Fedor Gorst 2:55 Well, also in US, people are playing on seven-foot tables versus we play on nine.

Joe Rogan 2:59 Right, in a bar, sure.

Fedor Gorst 3:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:00 They're nine-foot tables and the pockets are four inches. And so when you get two cue balls, you try to put them next to each other-

Fedor Gorst 3:07 You can't even.

Joe Rogan 3:07 ... and try to st- you can't even get close to sticking them in a four-inch pocket. It's really tight conditions. And I think there's better players now than I've ever seen in my life. And I've been watching pool for 35 years and playing pool for 35 years. I've never seen better players than play today. And I think you're the best today. So in my book, that makes you the best of all time.

Fedor Gorst 3:28 Well, like you said, the conditions are completely different.

Joe Rogan 3:31 Yes.

Fedor Gorst 3:31 The game changed even in the last three years, I think the game changed drastically.

Joe Rogan 3:35 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 3:36 You know, we went, uh, we changed the breaking formats. It used to be one ball on the spot with the magic rack, no three-point rule, so...

Joe Rogan 3:42 All the people at home that don't play pool go, "What the fuck are they talking about?"

Fedor Gorst 3:45 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 3:45 We're talking about professional pool, ladies and gentlemen.

Fedor Gorst 3:48 Yeah. Yeah, we have, uh, all kinds of little, little rules.

Joe Rogan 3:51 Little lingo. Yeah. The nine ball on the spot made a big difference, right?

Fedor Gorst 3:55 Yeah, nine ball on the spot-

Joe Rogan 3:56 Because then you don't-

Fedor Gorst 3:56 ... break box.

Joe Rogan 3:57 Yeah. When you were showing me today how to break that way, I was like, "Oh, that's crazy." Like, you have to hit it with draw and you have to aim towards the back ball. Like, wow.

Fedor Gorst 4:06 Yeah, well, we- we can't really say that-

Joe Rogan 4:08 Oh. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 4:08 ... because the other- (laughs)

Joe Rogan 4:09 Too late.

Fedor Gorst 4:10 The others-

Joe Rogan 4:10 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 4:10 The others may- (laughs)

Joe Rogan 4:11 The others.

Fedor Gorst 4:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:13 Yeah. It's an insanely competitive, uh, game now. And- and shout out to Matchroom, right? Because Matchroom with, uh, DAZN, they've done an amazing job with boxing and a bunch of other sports. But what they're doing with pool is crazy. It's- there's so many events and it's all over... You can get it on the World Nine Ball Tour. It's WNT.tv, right?

Fedor Gorst 4:33 Yeah, they- so- so they moved-

Joe Rogan 4:34 That's the website. Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 4:35 I think they moved from DAZN to that- to there subscription-type, uh, platform.

Joe Rogan 4:39 Yeah. Amazing. It's amazing. And then there's also their Matchroom Pool YouTube channel, which has tons of stuff on it for free. It's like-

Fedor Gorst 4:46 Yeah, they are elevating the game for sure, and they are the reason why pool is where it's at today, you know, versus where it was five years ago, I think.

Joe Rogan 4:52 Yeah, it's huge. I- I have friends who send me videos now. Like, people just randomly-

Fedor Gorst 4:57 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:57 ... find videos on TikTok or on Instagram, you know.

Fedor Gorst 5:00 Pool is booming on social media. And, you know, I- I do my own social media. I have a filmmaker that follows me everywhere. We, you know, try to film as much stuff.

Joe Rogan 5:08 It's very funny what you did in New York City, or in Atlantic City rather, when you went to that pool hall and you went under disguise.

Fedor Gorst 5:13 Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that was Matchroom-

Joe Rogan 5:14 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 5:14 ... Matchroom's idea. I think, uh, it was pretty cheap budget. We could do it a lot better-

Joe Rogan 5:18 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 5:18 ... especially when we go to Asia, I think. You know.

Joe Rogan 5:21 You can't sneak around any pool hall though, dude.

Fedor Gorst 5:22 Well, if you put me and make me look like a grandpa or something.

Joe Rogan 5:26 Okay.

Fedor Gorst 5:27 You know.

Joe Rogan 5:27 Like you'd have to get into disguise.

Fedor Gorst 5:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:30 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 5:30 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:30 Well, their disguises are really good today. Have you ever seen those CIA disguises that they use?

Fedor Gorst 5:35 Uh-uh.

Joe Rogan 5:36 So apparently, this is a story. Apparently, um, and this was told to me by someone who I really trust, Obama was having a meeting with someone in, um, one of the rooms in the White House. And he's in the middle of having this meeting with someone who he's met before and had conversations with before. And then they inform him, "Mr. President, we just want to let you know this is not who you think you're talking to, and we just wanted to demonstrate how good the, uh, special effects makeup is and masks are."

Fedor Gorst 6:07 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 6:07 "This is not that person." And he was like, "What?"Now, I haven't confirmed this. I have ... I don't have Obama's number.

Fedor Gorst 6:13 Right.

Joe Rogan 6:13 I'm like, where I can call him up and go, "Bro, is that real?"

Fedor Gorst 6:16 (laughs) yeah.

Joe Rogan 6:17 But I believe it's real, because I've seen up close, like really in- ... Like, when, um, uh, Tony Hitchcock does Kill Tony, um, sometimes, uh, they have makeup artists that dress people up and make them different people.

Fedor Gorst 6:31 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 6:31 Like, they did a Biden one and, uh, Kyle Dunnigan played Elon Musk, and I didn't even recognize him. I was like, "Who's this guy?" Like, this is, this is this weird guy, like, acting weird. And they're like, "That's Dunnigan playing Elon Musk." I was like, "No way."

Fedor Gorst 6:46 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 6:46 Right in front of him. I thought it was just some ... Didn't look like Elon Musk. Looked like a weird guy.

Fedor Gorst 6:51 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 6:51 But it didn't look like him and it looked like a person. It didn't look like a guy in makeup. It didn't look like a mask. It looked like a real person. It just was weird looking. I was like, "This is crazy."

Fedor Gorst 7:00 Yeah, that's what we should do, and I think it's going to be-

Joe Rogan 7:02 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 7:02 ... really, really good if we do that in Asia, like Vietnam or Philippines.

Joe Rogan 7:05 You got to work on that voice, though, son. You can rush all day with that voice (laughs) .

Fedor Gorst 7:09 (laughs) I know, I know. I can only be like an undercover, I don't know-

Joe Rogan 7:14 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 7:15 ... somebody from...

Joe Rogan 7:16 And for people that, at home, they go, "How could he be the number one in the world if he just lost?" Aloysius Yap should be the number one in the world. He should be the number one of all time. It's like long races are really what's up, right?

Fedor Gorst 7:28 Well, it's, uh, by the rankings, I'm number one.

Joe Rogan 7:30 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 7:30 By the rankings, and what we have now with Matchroom, it's two years of prize money combined throughout all the tournaments.

Joe Rogan 7:37 But I think the real matches that you play, where you really get to see who's the best, and this is only for, like, hardcore pool nerds. The real ones, like the one you did with Shane, was like three days, race to 40 each day, 120 games total.

Fedor Gorst 7:52 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 7:53 That way there's no questions.

Fedor Gorst 7:55 No.

Joe Rogan 7:55 After three days and 120 games of pool, you know, possibly 239 games of pool.

Fedor Gorst 8:04 That's how I almost won the first time we played.

Joe Rogan 8:06 Really?

Fedor Gorst 8:06 'Cause I lost, I lost the first time.

Joe Rogan 8:08 That's right.

Fedor Gorst 8:09 I lost 120 to 116.

Joe Rogan 8:12 Wow.

Fedor Gorst 8:12 I was down and up, up and down.

Joe Rogan 8:15 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 8:15 And last day I was up by almost 15 games, I remember, and he came back and beat me.

Joe Rogan 8:20 Yeah. It was super impressive, but it was even more impressive you coming back the next year and steamrolling him. Like, you, you won by quite a few games. How many did you win by?

Fedor Gorst 8:29 Uh, by, uh, 42, I think.

Joe Rogan 8:33 42 games is crazy.

Fedor Gorst 8:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:34 That's crazy.

Fedor Gorst 8:34 120 to 78, I think that's, that was the score.

Joe Rogan 8:37 And that was for ... Did you advertise how much that money was being gambled?

Fedor Gorst 8:43 We were ... Well, we were advertising that it was for 50, but it was a little bit more.

Joe Rogan 8:47 So you had a bunch of other people chumming in, throwing money in?

Fedor Gorst 8:50 Yeah. Yeah. Well, myself included.

Joe Rogan 8:53 So you don't want to say the actual total?

Fedor Gorst 8:56 Uh, I don't know (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 8:57 Okay. So (laughs) , okay.

Fedor Gorst 8:59 Are we allowed to (laughs) ?

Joe Rogan 9:00 I don't know. I mean, unless you're lying to the IRS, which as a new citizen, I would say don't do that.

Fedor Gorst 9:05 So yeah-

Joe Rogan 9:06 Don't lie (laughs) .

Fedor Gorst 9:06 ... we'll play for 50. We'll play for 50 (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 9:09 Oh, no. You're going to get in trouble.

Fedor Gorst 9:11 (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 9:11 Uh, you, you ... I don't think you were a citizen last time you were here, right?

Fedor Gorst 9:14 I'm not a citizen now. I have a permanent residency.

Joe Rogan 9:17 A green card, oh okay.

Fedor Gorst 9:18 Green card, yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:18 When do ... What do you have to do to become a citizen?

Fedor Gorst 9:19 I think, uh, you have to be a permanent resident for five years, and then you can apply if you, uh, follow certain rules. Like, you have to stay in the US for six out of ... Six months of the year, out of the calendar year, each year.

Joe Rogan 9:31 Well, you better stay away from Home Depot, 'cause those dudes are getting crazy.

Fedor Gorst 9:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:34 They're snatching people up left and right (laughs) .

Fedor Gorst 9:36 Yeah. Yeah. No, I think, I think I do everything right, you know. I pay my taxes.

Joe Rogan 9:40 (laughs) .

Fedor Gorst 9:40 I follow, I follow all the rules (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 9:44 Well, you got to play ... That's weird that you ... If you're not a citizen, but still you get to play for the Mosconi Cup. That's kind of crazy.

Fedor Gorst 9:49 Well, Matchroom, Matchroom changed the rules, you know, as soon as I got the green card and I wasn't able to play in any official tournaments back then.

Joe Rogan 9:56 Right, because you were Russian.

Fedor Gorst 9:58 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:58 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 9:58 So, the only-

Joe Rogan 10:00 Which is really crazy. It was really weird.

Fedor Gorst 10:02 Well, yeah, when you think about it, uh, even the first ban that we got as a Russian athlete, uh, happened because of hockey players. The W-A-D-A, WADA, Anti-Doping Association, they banned all the Russian athletes. Doesn't matter what sport you're in.

Joe Rogan 10:18 What?

Fedor Gorst 10:18 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:18 Really?

Fedor Gorst 10:19 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:20 Oh, so it had nothing to do with the war?

Fedor Gorst 10:22 The first one happened before the war. It was 2018 or '19, I think.

Joe Rogan 10:26 All Russian athletes competing in America.

Fedor Gorst 10:28 All Russian athletes competing everywhere.

Joe Rogan 10:30 That's crazy.

Fedor Gorst 10:30 It was everywhere.

Joe Rogan 10:31 That's-

Fedor Gorst 10:31 We played World Cup of Pool, I remember, in uh, UK, under no flag, but we were still able to compete. Like, when ... After the war, we were not allowed to compete anywhere.

Joe Rogan 10:40 Wow. Wow. You know what's interesting? It never stopped the UFC. Like, not only do Russian fighters fight in the UFC, but they're celebrated. No one cares.

Fedor Gorst 10:51 Because they're not under the Olympic Committee, I think.

Joe Rogan 10:56 Well, they're definitely not. It's a professional sport, right?

Fedor Gorst 10:58 Well, and that's what happened with Matchroom too.

Joe Rogan 11:00 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 11:00 You know, it's a private company.

Joe Rogan 11:02 Right.

Fedor Gorst 11:02 It's not, uh, a federation or, uh, association. They're just a private company and they basically make their own rules.

Joe Rogan 11:09 I was just glad that they didn't make it political. I'm like, "You think fucking this guy is out there causing trouble?" Like, he's just a fighter. He's just a-

Fedor Gorst 11:19 Right.

Joe Rogan 11:19 ... professional MMA fighter, you know. This is, this is what he does. And let's think about that. Let's not think about what these other people are doing that are in the same country as him. It's not him.

Fedor Gorst 11:30 Yeah. So it's 2000-

Joe Rogan 11:30 And so the USA didn't ... They didn't care. Like, they let a bunch of F- Like, for the entire time of the war, Ukrainian guys and Russian guys were fighting on the same card sometimes.

Fedor Gorst 11:38 Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm glad that just, you know, Matchroom, Matchroom went out of their own way to make an offer to me and say, you know, "You can represent United States." And at the time, we were playing the US Open in Atlantic City two years ago. Or was it ... Yeah, two years ago. And the crowd is cheering for me, you know. I'm living in the United States already.

Joe Rogan 11:57 Nice.

Fedor Gorst 11:57 Everybody's treating me like I'm one of their own. And now it's obviously completely different, you know. If you watch the US Open from last week-... everybody supporting me-

Joe Rogan 12:07 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 12:07 ... everybody's cheering for me, everybody that are used to me living here.

Joe Rogan 12:10 Well, that's the cool thing about America, is that it's a nation of immigrants.

Fedor Gorst 12:13 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 12:14 It's like, you can come over here and just say, "I'm American now," and everybody's like, "All right." (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 12:18 (laughs) Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 12:19 Like, try that in Poland. They're like, "You're not Polish. Get the fuck outta here."

Fedor Gorst 12:23 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

Joe Rogan 12:23 You know, there's a lot of countries like that, that are like, "No, you're not one of us." But America's like, "We don't have, like, a nationality. We're all kinds of shit. So anybody can come over here, as l- ... And if you do it the right way, we, we get super happy."

Fedor Gorst 12:37 Yeah, yeah. I think, I think it's great. And I'm, uh, I'm really, really glad that people really welcomed you w- the way, the way they welcomed me.

Joe Rogan 12:44 Yeah. Well, th- it's also the way you play. You know? There's, there's this thing in pool, um, it gets ... When people play a lot, and are people really into pool, it's almost like that's the only thing that matters. The only thing that matters is how good you play. You know, there was a ... Do you ever read that book, uh, McWhi- McGurdy? It was a Robert Burns book on, uh, a guy who lived during the Depression who was a billiards hustler, would travel around the country.

Fedor Gorst 13:09 No.

Joe Rogan 13:10 There was a, a scene in that where they were looking at the television, and Nixon was on TV. And he goes, "Look at that guy. President of the United States, and he can't make a ball."

Fedor Gorst 13:20 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 13:21 Isn't that funny? 'Cause i- w- you and I know what that means.

Fedor Gorst 13:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 13:25 Like that, in the pool world, that really means something. Like if you c- you can't play at all, like, pff, he's the fucking president, he can't even play.

Fedor Gorst 13:34 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 13:35 Like, (laughs) it's, it's real. It's weird. So if you come t America, all that they care about is if you pl- since it's a melting pot already, and then it's like, all they care about is how good you play. And you play pretty fucking good. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 13:48 So far.

Joe Rogan 13:49 So people just take in. So far? Well, you're playing better now than ever before, and you're only like-

Fedor Gorst 13:55 Yeah, I think I'm on top of my career right now.

Joe Rogan 13:56 What are you, 25?

Fedor Gorst 13:57 25.

Joe Rogan 13:57 Yeah. Come on, man. You're not even in your prime.

Fedor Gorst 14:01 No, yeah, I think I'm not in my prime. I think, uh, you know, I'm getting better every year.

Joe Rogan 14:05 I think so. Y- you were, you ... The match that you had with that Filipino gentleman before the match in the finals, wha- what is that guy's name? Michael Bo-

Fedor Gorst 14:15 Yep. Uh, that was, uh, Michael Bouna in quarterfinals.

Joe Rogan 14:18 Bouna. Quarterfinals.

Fedor Gorst 14:18 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 14:19 Yeah. So, in that match, I was watching some of those outs, and I was like, "Jesus," like, it doesn't get better pool than that. Like, four-inch pockets, tight competition, really good player, a lot of pressure, everybody's there, single elimination at that point.

Fedor Gorst 14:36 Yup.

Joe Rogan 14:36 And you're just getting out, man. It's-

Fedor Gorst 14:38 Yeah, the pressure, the pressure is really high. I'm not gonna lie. The, sometimes even, uh, you can watch it on TV and you don't see the emotions.

Joe Rogan 14:46 Oh, I-

Fedor Gorst 14:46 You know?

Joe Rogan 14:47 I get it, I'm sure.

Fedor Gorst 14:48 It's your bridge is shaking sometimes, your backhand is shaking sometimes, and you just gotta, you just gotta manage it. You just gotta handle it.

Joe Rogan 14:54 Well, you have such a process when you play, like, eh, when I watch you set up for a ball, it's always uniform. It's- it's- that's what I really enjoy watching, when a guy, it's like every shot, it's like siuuu, ooh.

Fedor Gorst 15:11 Some people find it boring.

Joe Rogan 15:13 It's nice and smooth. Oh, those people are assholes.

Fedor Gorst 15:14 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:14 Those people are assholes, if they think your style is boring.

Fedor Gorst 15:17 They say, they say it's, they say it's, like, you know, robotic.

Joe Rogan 15:19 They'll go, "They're all pussies. They can eat shit." Those guys, all- all they are is jealous. That's all it is.

Fedor Gorst 15:25 I, I think so, too.

Joe Rogan 15:25 Everybody wants to play like that. Everybody wants to play like that. If they say 'cause you play too good it's not fun to watch, shut up.

Fedor Gorst 15:33 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 15:34 I know. Y- that guy, whoever that guy is that says that, I don't wanna listen to his opinion on anything. I guarantee you he li- he likes shows that suck. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 15:41 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:42 He could get in his car and listen to his music. It probably sucks.

Fedor Gorst 15:45 Probably. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:46 How do you, how do you not wa- like watching someone play perfect? That's crazy.

Fedor Gorst 15:52 Well, I g- I'll have to agree. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:53 Doesn't make any sense. But then there are guys who play wild that it is fun to watch, like Mohamed Soufie.

Fedor Gorst 15:59 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 15:59 That guy, he gives me anxiety.

Fedor Gorst 16:02 Yeah, very unique.

Joe Rogan 16:02 He's-

Fedor Gorst 16:02 You know, sidearm.

Joe Rogan 16:03 Sidearm, barely holding onto the cue, and he just fires balls in.

Fedor Gorst 16:08 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 16:08 He runs around the table. He, like, one-strokes everything, and he's just getting out from everywhere. You're like, "Aah!"

Fedor Gorst 16:14 Yeah, he's very, very talented, and you- we have a few-

Joe Rogan 16:16 He's so good.

Fedor Gorst 16:16 ... few, few guys like that. You know Oliver Ortman?

Joe Rogan 16:19 Yeah. Yes, I remember him.

Fedor Gorst 16:20 So, so he used to win, you know, world championships. There's multiple world tit- titles.

Joe Rogan 16:24 Uh-huh.

Fedor Gorst 16:24 Uh, he was on Mosconi Cup and won, uh, probably five-

Joe Rogan 16:27 Tony Drago.

Fedor Gorst 16:28 Yeah, Tony Drago, same.

Joe Rogan 16:29 That guy was crazy. He would just-

Fedor Gorst 16:31 Flying around the table. Flying around.

Joe Rogan 16:32 ... run around the table. Fireballs in, he couldn't miss.

Fedor Gorst 16:34 Exactly.

Joe Rogan 16:34 Yeah, those, those guys are fun to watch. But what are we here for? Right? You're h- you're here to win. You're here to run out. You're here to get perfect position. You're here to dominate this very difficult table.

Fedor Gorst 16:46 Yeah, everybody's different.

Joe Rogan 16:47 Right.

Fedor Gorst 16:47 Everybody has their own style.

Joe Rogan 16:48 But under extreme pressure, it's better to have your style. Like, or coping Chung-style or coping Yi-style. Like, methodical backstroke, it's always looks the same, smooth delivery. And, you know, I play half-assed pool, but I understand what's going on. It's such a mind fuck.

Fedor Gorst 17:08 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:09 Every game is such a mind fuck. Every time you're about to pull the trigger, you're like, "Now? No. One more stroke. Now? No. One more backstroke. Now? No. Not yet.

Fedor Gorst 17:19 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 17:19 Not ... Okay, we're ready. Uh! I hope we're ready. Go!" (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 17:23 Well, you don't really have that, 'cause we play-

Joe Rogan 17:25 No.

Fedor Gorst 17:25 When we play, we have shot clock, yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:27 Shot clock. Yeah, shot clock is brutal.

Fedor Gorst 17:28 Shot clock. Shot clock is a game-changer, for sure.

Joe Rogan 17:31 It's hell.

Fedor Gorst 17:32 Because you gotta, you know, make the decision basically right, right out of the gate, right out of the chair. When you're in chair, you already know what you're gonna do-

Joe Rogan 17:39 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 17:39 ... because you only have 30 seconds-

Joe Rogan 17:41 Right.

Fedor Gorst 17:41 ... and one extension per rack-

Joe Rogan 17:42 That's crazy.

Fedor Gorst 17:43 ... which gives you an extra 30 seconds. And, uh, sometimes the pressure is really high, and when you get completely brain-dead, you don't wanna be in that position.

Joe Rogan 17:52 I think the derby's a little bit better. They give you a little 10 more seconds, I think, that 10 more seconds.

Fedor Gorst 17:55 Well, derby, the rule is where you're, eh, as long as you stay down on the shot, the shot clock doesn't, doesn't-

Joe Rogan 18:01 That's good, too.

Fedor Gorst 18:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:02 The other thing that's brutal is the beeps.

Fedor Gorst 18:05 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:05 Doot! Doot!... down." When it gets down to five seconds before you gotta pull the tri- ... And you pulled the trigger on a nine ball with one second to go.

Fedor Gorst 18:13 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:13 I was watching, I was like, "Oh, my God. I would h- I would be having a heart attack right now."

Fedor Gorst 18:18 I almost had. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 18:19 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 18:21 I almost had.

Joe Rogan 18:22 (coughs)

Fedor Gorst 18:22 Mosconi Cup is definitely, when it comes to pressure, it's the highest pressure you can ever-

Joe Rogan 18:26 Well, everyone's screaming and cheering.

Fedor Gorst 18:27 Every- everyone is screaming.

Joe Rogan 18:28 For people that haven't seen it before, most pool tournaments are very, very respectful. People will clap after you make a m- an out, or sometimes in the middle of a m- game, like if you make a really good shot, they'll clap. If you get great position, they'll clap. But as soon as you drop down to shoot the next ball, everybody gets quiet.

Fedor Gorst 18:46 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:46 Mosconi Cup, those rules are d- those rules are off the table.

Fedor Gorst 18:49 Off the table.

Joe Rogan 18:50 People are hammered. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 18:50 And sometimes they shark you, you know.

Joe Rogan 18:52 Oh, yeah.

Fedor Gorst 18:52 They would be super loud, and you have a super tough nine ball, and the- everybody would like ... For example, you play in UK-

Joe Rogan 18:58 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 18:58 ... and, uh, 95% of the crowd is European, so everybody's cheering for Europe.

Joe Rogan 19:03 Yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 19:04 So let's say I'm on a tough nine ball, and everybody's loud, and then everybody will go like, "Shh, shh, shh, shh, shh," and everybody will go quiet just in a second. And, uh, it's really, really tough to pull the trigger in that situation.

Joe Rogan 19:16 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 19:17 So it's a, it's a tough environment to play in, but, uh, it- that's what makes this tournament special.

Joe Rogan 19:22 Well, it's fun to watch, though.

Fedor Gorst 19:24 Oh, yeah, for sure.

Joe Rogan 19:24 I- I'm so glad that all tournaments aren't like that, though, where you encourage people to be assholes.

Fedor Gorst 19:28 Oh, yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 19:29 It's kinda weird, though, that they've agreed to only be an asshole for one tournament.

Fedor Gorst 19:34 Uh ...

Joe Rogan 19:35 'Cause people yell out in the middle of, like, you str- stroking a ball.

Fedor Gorst 19:39 Honestly, you see, uh, the crowd getting more engaged and more now.

Joe Rogan 19:43 Hmm.

Fedor Gorst 19:43 Like, you watch the US Open finals, it was loud. When I played Michael Bowden in quarterfinals-

Joe Rogan 19:47 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 19:48 ... it was kinda like that because half of the crowd was Filipino.

Joe Rogan 19:50 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 19:51 Well, not half, but there was a lot of- a lot of guys that were loud.

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Joe Rogan 20:54 to get 50% off your first box plus free shipping. This offer is for new customers only. Yeah, let's talk about that, because one thing that happened is, there's a rule where you're not allowed to soft break, but soft breaking is basically very subjective. Like, a referee can decide to call someone on it or not call someone on it, and you thought this guy was soft breaking.

Fedor Gorst 21:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 21:16 So you said something and the Filipinos went crazy.

Fedor Gorst 21:18 Yeah, everybody went crazy. I had to delete my Facebook-

Joe Rogan 21:20 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 21:20 ... for a couple of days because it was just bothering me. I get- I was getting notifications every second, you know, "Crazy Filipino goes-" ... "Yeah, you were sharking our player. You did that." But yeah, I thought the guy was soft breaking, and the rules state that you gotta make your best effort to make a forceful break. So that's really subjective, and it's up to the referee to make that call.

Joe Rogan 21:41 I have a solution to that.

Fedor Gorst 21:43 Yeah, what are-

Joe Rogan 21:43 And it makes it more interesting, too. Radar.

Fedor Gorst 21:45 Radar, yes. Speed gun.

Joe Rogan 21:46 Yeah. It's a, uh, e- e- easy solution.

Fedor Gorst 21:49 I agree.

Joe Rogan 21:50 Easy solution, and it makes it interesting. It's a new element that you think about.

Fedor Gorst 21:54 But then, then you also have, for example, juniors or girls. Do you make the rules the same for them, or no?

Joe Rogan 22:00 No, it's a good ... Well, you don't pl- they're not playing guys, right?

Fedor Gorst 22:03 Well, we have-

Joe Rogan 22:03 Girls are playing girls.

Fedor Gorst 22:04 W- well, yeah, but on W and T Tour, we- it's an open tournament, for example.

Joe Rogan 22:08 Oh, right, right, right. Oh, I see what you're saying.

Fedor Gorst 22:10 Ladies can join, juniors can join.

Joe Rogan 22:11 I see, but I w- I thought you were talking about young kids. Um, no. For young kids, you'd have to have an exception.

Fedor Gorst 22:16 Exactly.

Joe Rogan 22:16 And for girls, you'd have to have an exception. But you would just change it, just like, you know ... So whatever the speed is, like what is-

Fedor Gorst 22:25 18 miles an hour.

Joe Rogan 22:26 ... what's a, what's a good- what's a good break speed?

Fedor Gorst 22:28 18.

Joe Rogan 22:28 Like, what, what do you think you break at? Like, Bustamante in his prime, what was he, like 30 miles an hour?

Fedor Gorst 22:33 Well, back in the day, it was different. Back in the day, everybody was breaking over 20, 23, 24, 25, yeah.

Joe Rogan 22:39 But Bustamante had the craziest breaking of all time.

Fedor Gorst 22:40 Yeah, Bustamante-

Joe Rogan 22:41 When he would let the cue go out of his fingers and then throw his whole body into it, his timing was crazy.

Fedor Gorst 22:46 You ever watch the Russian player, his name was, uh, Evgeny Stalev?

Joe Rogan 22:50 No.

Fedor Gorst 22:51 Oh, you- you gotta, you gotta watch that stroke. It was, it was even crazier.

Joe Rogan 22:55 Really?

Fedor Gorst 22:56 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 22:56 That's nuts.

Fedor Gorst 22:56 It's like, uh, Roberto Gómez.

Joe Rogan 22:58 Oh, he has a crazy breaking.

Fedor Gorst 22:59 Same thing, same thing. He's up-

Joe Rogan 23:00 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 23:00 ... goes up.

Joe Rogan 23:01 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 23:01 Way up.

Joe Rogan 23:01 Way up. Yeah. That's so hard to be accurate and do that.

Fedor Gorst 23:06 Oh, yeah. I don't know how they do it. I have no idea.

Joe Rogan 23:07 You have to have the most insane, smooth delivery. And again, what a mind fuck, because you're about to-

Fedor Gorst 23:15 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 23:15 ... you- you're trying to hit this one ball square on the face, and you're throwing all of your might into it.

Fedor Gorst 23:21 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 23:22 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 23:22 That's how, uh, Shane- Shane's breaking the same way, you know, his body moves first-

Joe Rogan 23:26 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 23:27 ... and then, and then he delivers.

Joe Rogan 23:28 I'd like to know how fast he breaks when he breaks, like, 10 ball. Because when he 10 ball breaks, it's pretty crazy.

Fedor Gorst 23:33 He breaks pretty hard, you know.

Joe Rogan 23:35 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 23:35 I- I like to break with a softer speed and with more control, but he- he just whacks them.

Joe Rogan 23:39 So what do you think would be, like, a reasonable mile per hour that you would impose, where you'd say anything l- slower than that is soft breaking? Is it, like, 15 miles an hour? Or tw-

Fedor Gorst 23:50 I think it has to be higher, maybe-

Joe Rogan 23:51 Higher.

Fedor Gorst 23:52 ... 18.

Joe Rogan 23:52 18.

Fedor Gorst 23:52 And that will also push the players to practice. For example, you wouldn't want to break borderline 18, because it might be under.

Joe Rogan 24:00 Right.

Fedor Gorst 24:00 So players will try to break harder.

Joe Rogan 24:02 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 24:02 19, closer to 19, maybe harder than 19.

Joe Rogan 24:05 Well, they used to do that three-point rule where they would d- w- well, that was very annoying.... where-

Fedor Gorst 24:10 You think it was very annoying?

Joe Rogan 24:12 Yes, it was very annoying. Because sometimes guys would break hard, but the referee didn't rack them that good.

Fedor Gorst 24:18 Right.

Joe Rogan 24:18 And they made a ball, and then the, the opponent gets to shoot. I'm like, "That's crazy."

Fedor Gorst 24:23 That's, yeah. I mean, in that case, yes, I agree. But that's, uh, another simple solution. It's better than what we have now-

Joe Rogan 24:29 Yes.

Fedor Gorst 24:29 ... I think.

Joe Rogan 24:30 I think the radar is the way to go.

Fedor Gorst 24:32 Yeah, the radar is definitely the way to go.

Joe Rogan 24:33 Yeah. I mean, and also it's kind of cool, you know? When you get to-

Fedor Gorst 24:36 Yeah, and extra stats you have, you know.

Joe Rogan 24:37 Well, and some guys play, like Shane, even in nine-ball when he does the cut break, he breaks really hard.

Fedor Gorst 24:43 Kocie. Kocie's the one who breaks the hardest.

Joe Rogan 24:45 Kocie breaks really hard. Well, he's a big fucking dude.

Fedor Gorst 24:46 Oh, yeah. He breaks the hardest.

Joe Rogan 24:48 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 24:48 I don't know how he keeps the cue ball on the table, to be honest, with that speed.

Joe Rogan 24:51 And it doesn't even look like he's trying that hard, you know, 'cause he's such a big dude.

Fedor Gorst 24:54 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:54 He just whoosh.

Fedor Gorst 24:54 Last time he was breaking open bridge, which is even crazier.

Joe Rogan 24:57 Yeah. People, that's one thing about pool though, if you wanna get spectators, you want hard breaks.

Fedor Gorst 25:04 Yep.

Joe Rogan 25:05 You know, like people love it from like The Color of Money when Tom Cruise breaks and Paul Newman goes, "Who's that kid with the sledgehammer break?"

Fedor Gorst 25:13 Uh-huh.

Joe Rogan 25:13 It's a dumb American thing. But if you wanna get, like American people to tune in, you gotta break hard.

Fedor Gorst 25:18 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 25:18 Like, well, that's why Earl Strickland still gets mad, you know?

Fedor Gorst 25:21 (laughs) He gets mad at, at everything.

Joe Rogan 25:23 I heard Mike Segal talk about it too. He's like, "Why don't they just hit it straight on the one ball and hit it as hard as you can?"

Fedor Gorst 25:29 Because it's no fun. You get zero control that way.

Joe Rogan 25:31 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 25:31 It's no skill, really.

Joe Rogan 25:33 I just think he doesn't, he hasn't had someone lay it out to him, like, like the way you just did with me, where you explained it to me. This is the first time that I had anybody explain to me that particular break. I'm like, "Oh." And you, you did it dead on, and you knew that the cloth was a little worn 'cause it's a year-old cloth. So you're like, "Okay, because of that, I'm gonna have to hit it here, and it'll go on the side." And you smashed it, and it went right in the side. I was like, "Oh, shit."

Fedor Gorst 25:58 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 25:58 Like it's not, it's, it's very, it's not risking. You're not like gambling. The only thing you're gambling with is that the ball's going across the table. But it seems like you guys ha- kind of have that mostly worked out too.

Fedor Gorst 26:10 Well, that's the thing. Everybody on the tour is figuring out the break really fast. Doesn't really matter what you change in the format, the players will figure it out.

Joe Rogan 26:18 The fun thing to me, uh, about your life is, uh, that you're traveling all over the world playing, and then occasionally you have these marathon gambling sessions that they stream online. And, uh, I've got a, a good buddy of mine, Tommy, uh, from Connecticut. Shout out to my boy Tommy. And you know, he and I, w- we'll like be fucking texting each other, you know, like for three days in a row while these matches are going on. And, uh, I get so juiced up for him. I get so excited about him. But it's like that's the part of the game that has always been the most romantic, the gambling part of the game. And I'm glad that people aren't shying away from that, because it, there was a long, for a long time gambling was thought to be negative for professional pool. That's not the case anymore.

Fedor Gorst 27:06 Well, it could be. It could be.

Joe Rogan 27:08 It could be, sure, 'cause you're bringing in shady people.

Fedor Gorst 27:11 For sure.

Joe Rogan 27:12 Well, if you, if you're gambling $100,000, where'd you get it?

Fedor Gorst 27:14 Well... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 27:14 Where'd you get it, you know? Bob the drug dealer came over and-

Fedor Gorst 27:17 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 27:18 ... you know, he wants in. He's staking me, and I, if I win I get 40%.

Fedor Gorst 27:21 But in our case, it's different.

Joe Rogan 27:23 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 27:23 Like our matches that we make, uh, you know, there's only a couple of them that we did. We played twice with Shane, and, uh, there's also a few one-pocket matches we did. But the biggest ones were with Shane, and, uh, it's only a small group of people. It's basically just, uh, you know, few guys, my managers, me, and same th- same thing from Shane's side. So everybody knows each other.

Joe Rogan 27:44 Yeah, for sure in your case. But in the case of like high-level gambling in pool-

Fedor Gorst 27:50 Oh, yeah, for sure.

Joe Rogan 27:50 ... there's a lot of, there's a lot of shady characters.

Fedor Gorst 27:52 For sure.

Joe Rogan 27:52 There's a lot of shady characters.

Fedor Gorst 27:53 A lot.

Joe Rogan 27:54 How often do you gamble just in regular life playing pool? Do you... 'cause, uh, does anybody ask for like giant spots or anything like that?

Fedor Gorst 28:01 Well, everybody's asking for ridiculous games all the time, but, uh, I think my gambling game, my gambling days are over, and, uh, now I'm a tournament player really. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 28:10 Well, you got too good.

Fedor Gorst 28:12 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:12 Like I w- played you when you were here like two years ago, and, uh, I definitely play better now than I played two years ago, but you play way better. You play even better than you would, were playing then, which is crazy. But you were banking out and making shots. I was like, "This is so humiliating, it's so humbling." (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 28:31 Yeah, yeah. I do play a lot better than I did, uh, two years ago, you know.

Joe Rogan 28:35 Which is hard to believe 'cause you're the best player in the world and you're getting better. That's, that's one of the coolest things to me about any game or any sport, anything, is that... And especially today because there's so much data that's available. Like say if you're a young player and you're learning how to play, you can watch pool on your iPad-

Fedor Gorst 28:54 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:55 ... till 3:00 in the morning. You watch matches, and you learn. You learn how to play things. You learn like what, w- why did he do it that way? Like, "Oh." Then you rewind it and you go, "Oh." That, none of that was available to like Mike Segal back in the day or Nick Varner, those guys.

Fedor Gorst 29:09 Yeah, there's tons of videos on YouTube, uh-

Joe Rogan 29:11 There's so much, so much, so much information.

Fedor Gorst 29:14 Yeah, and you can also, I mean, you can also watch it on TV. I think Metrium. Metrium is showing all those tournaments, all of the majors-

Joe Rogan 29:21 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 29:21 ... on TV everywhere except US I think.

Joe Rogan 29:24 Yeah, yeah. And so it's just like everything else with the new generation, the, the level just gets higher and higher with everything, unless there's physical limitations. And with pool, it doesn't seem like, it's not like, you know, running a four-minute mile or, you know, running the fastest 100 meter.

Fedor Gorst 29:42 No, but we always... We're all crooked. All of our backs are crooked.

Joe Rogan 29:45 Oh, yeah. For sure.

Fedor Gorst 29:46 You know, we're always bent over. It's always one-sided sport. Every one-sided sport is kind of like that I think.

Joe Rogan 29:51 Archery's like that.

Fedor Gorst 29:52 Archery, golf-

Joe Rogan 29:53 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 29:53 ... shooting.

Joe Rogan 29:54 Yeah. Yeah, your, your back must be fucked up. I know your fu- your neck was fucked up. We brought you a waist-to-waist last time you were here.

Fedor Gorst 30:00 Yeah, yeah. It did help. It did help for like six to eight months, I think, and then, uh...

Joe Rogan 30:05 And now it's fucking with you again?

Fedor Gorst 30:06 No, now I actually found the, the way, you know, I have my pre- pre-match routine. I stretch every single day. I do work a lot with like rubber bands, resistant bands.

Joe Rogan 30:15 What do you do with them?

Fedor Gorst 30:16 ... uh, basically, you know, I work on my upper back.

Joe Rogan 30:20 Oh, the ... So, like, certain workouts-

Fedor Gorst 30:22 Certain workouts-

Joe Rogan 30:22 ... with resistance bands?

Fedor Gorst 30:23 ... that will take some pressure off my neck.

Joe Rogan 30:25 Hmm.

Fedor Gorst 30:25 'Cause my neck is where I really feel it, like my upper back, shoulder blades here.

Joe Rogan 30:28 You probably have a heavy head. That's what it is.

Fedor Gorst 30:31 Yeah. (laughs) Yeah, maybe.

Joe Rogan 30:31 (laughs) All the-

Fedor Gorst 30:32 When I did all the MRIs and I, uh, did have, like, a bulging disc.

Joe Rogan 30:36 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 30:36 C4, C5.

Joe Rogan 30:37 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 30:38 Uh, that started to progress and was, uh, getting worse. I went to Russia for that. Uh, I think I was reaching out to you at the time.

Joe Rogan 30:46 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 30:46 And, uh, I found a guy that helped me a lot with the, like, routines that we built. And since then, knock on wood, everything was good.

Joe Rogan 30:54 Oh, nice. Did you ever get one of those, uh, things that I was talking to you about? Those decompression things, where you put your head in a harness and you, like-

Fedor Gorst 31:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:01 ... pull on the door-

Fedor Gorst 31:02 Yeah, yeah. I did that.

Joe Rogan 31:03 ... you set it on your door and you can, like, hang by the ... a little bit?

Fedor Gorst 31:05 I did.

Joe Rogan 31:05 Those are nice.

Fedor Gorst 31:06 Yeah. And I also ... How do you call that, uh ...

Joe Rogan 31:10 Inversion table?

Fedor Gorst 31:11 Yeah, inversion table.

Joe Rogan 31:11 Yes.

Fedor Gorst 31:11 I bought that as well.

Joe Rogan 31:13 Yeah. Those are great too.

Fedor Gorst 31:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:14 Everybody should be doing that. Everybody should be decompressing. 'Cause you get to ... You get to a certain age and everybody's back is just like ... You're carrying all this weight your whole life and your back just gets smooshed.

Fedor Gorst 31:26 Yep.

Joe Rogan 31:26 And your posture starts to suck, and then you start to get these weird pains, and... Decompression. And if you could do it and just be real vigilant with it, you can stop a lot of problems dead in their tracks.

Fedor Gorst 31:37 For sure. And I felt that, you know, I haven't really paid attention to, like, stretching as much as I did before this year. And I can, you know, I can play a lot longer even though I'm not younger. You know, I was practicing-

Joe Rogan 31:49 You're a little baby, shut up.

Fedor Gorst 31:51 I know.

Joe Rogan 31:51 You're 25 years old. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 31:52 But I was, I was, for example, 16, 18, I was practicing a lot more, a lot more than I did now.

Joe Rogan 31:56 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 31:57 And, uh, I never really had any issues. Then 2022, I'm practicing the same, but I always leave the pool hall with some type of pain and I don't want to go practice the next day because of that.

Joe Rogan 32:09 Right. Do you, um ... The problem is, it's hard to get access to a cold plunge when you're on the road.

Fedor Gorst 32:15 Yeah, it's really difficult.

Joe Rogan 32:16 But-

Fedor Gorst 32:16 I do have the cold plunge at home.

Joe Rogan 32:18 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 32:18 Sauna and all the good stuff.

Joe Rogan 32:20 Cold plunge is the thing, man. It just r- alleviates so much s- inflammation. Especially if you can do it first thing in the morning. If you could force yourself to do it first thing in the morning, it is the way to go, man. It sucks every day. But if you just do it, oh, you get out of there, you're just like, oh, I just feel loose and free.

Fedor Gorst 32:40 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 32:41 'Cause ... And as long as you don't do it within, like, two hours of you playing, you have to wait, like, probably two hours for your body to, like, fully warm back up again. Because if you are cold, it will kind of mess with your-

Fedor Gorst 32:52 Right, with the muscles-

Joe Rogan 32:52 ... coordination.

Fedor Gorst 32:53 ... being way too tight.

Joe Rogan 32:54 Yeah. I was telling you, the worst thing ever for pool is lifting weights. There's nothing worse.

Fedor Gorst 32:59 I found that myself. For sure.

Joe Rogan 33:00 It's terrible.

Fedor Gorst 33:01 For sure.

Joe Rogan 33:02 You know, you know Willie Hoppy, the, uh, old school billiard player? You never heard of him?

Fedor Gorst 33:06 Willie Hoppy? No.

Joe Rogan 33:07 Never heard of him?

Fedor Gorst 33:08 Uh-uh.

Joe Rogan 33:08 You know what a, a Hoppy cue is?

Fedor Gorst 33:10 Hopy-cue, no.

Joe Rogan 33:11 No? Okay. A Hoppy butt is like a type of butt that doesn't have a rubber bumper on the bottom of it. It is the way to go, man. It sucks every day. But if you just do it, oh, you get out of there, you're just like, oh, I just feel loose and free.

Fedor Gorst 33:16 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 33:16 'Cause ... And as long as you don't do it within, like, two hours of you playing, you have to wait, like, probably two hours for your body to, like, fully warm back up again. Because if you are cold, it will kind of mess with your-

Fedor Gorst 33:16 Right, with the muscles-

Joe Rogan 33:16 ... coordination.

Fedor Gorst 33:16 ... being way too tight.

Joe Rogan 33:16 Yeah. I was telling you, the worst thing ever for pool is lifting weights. There's nothing worse.

Fedor Gorst 33:16 I found that myself. For sure.

Joe Rogan 33:16 It's terrible.

Fedor Gorst 33:16 For sure.

Joe Rogan 33:16 You know, you know Willie Hoppy? The, uh, old school billiard player? You never heard of him?

Fedor Gorst 33:16 Willie Hoppy? No.

Joe Rogan 33:16 Never heard of him?

Fedor Gorst 33:16 Uh-uh.

Joe Rogan 33:16 You know what a, a Hoppy cue is?

Fedor Gorst 33:16 Hopy-cue? No.

Joe Rogan 33:16 No? Okay. A Hoppy butt is, like, a type of butt that doesn't have a rubber bumper on the bottom of it. It's just flat.

Fedor Gorst 33:17 Flat.

Joe Rogan 33:17 And, for whatever reason, Willie Hoppy used to prefer that kind ... Or, I think. Or it's named after him, for some reason.

Fedor Gorst 33:25 Okay.

Joe Rogan 33:25 Anyway, he was a famous billiards player, like the turn of the century. And, uh, the turn of the other one, like the early 1900s. And he wouldn't even drive a car. He refused to do anything with his arms. He wouldn't drive a car because it would mess up his pool game.

Fedor Gorst 33:40 Mm-hmm. Yeah. I mean, some, some players are super superstitious about this stuff, you know?

Joe Rogan 33:45 Cars back then, though, didn't have, uh, power steering. So you have to think, it's probably really difficult to steer them. See if you can find a photo of Willie Hoppy. He had the weirdest sidearm too.

Fedor Gorst 33:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 33:55 He ... Totally sidearmed.

Fedor Gorst 33:57 Like Keith, Keith McCready?

Joe Rogan 33:58 Exactly.

Fedor Gorst 33:59 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 33:59 'Cause, like, these guys start playing when they're five years old and they can't really reach the table correctly.

Fedor Gorst 34:03 That's, that's exactly the reason why, uh, for example, when I started, I, I played Russian pyramid in the beginning. And I was always sidearmed because, uh, you know, I wasn't tall enough. They sent me to the pool table.

Joe Rogan 34:13 Yeah, look at him. Isn't that crazy sidearm?

Fedor Gorst 34:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:17 Like, that's nuts.

Fedor Gorst 34:18 Just like Mohamed Sufi.

Joe Rogan 34:20 Yeah. That's him when he was an old man. Yeah, just like Sufi. Weird, right?

Fedor Gorst 34:25 Yeah. It's crazy that-

Joe Rogan 34:27 Like, if you ever saw someone play like that, you'd be like, "Look at this lemon."

Fedor Gorst 34:31 Yeah, you would want to play that guy if you watched-

Joe Rogan 34:32 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 34:33 ... him over the ball.

Joe Rogan 34:34 But meanwhile, if ... As long as he figured out how to do it consistently, well, that's a-

Fedor Gorst 34:39 That's the thing in pool, you know, there's so many different variations-

Joe Rogan 34:41 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 34:42 ... of the stance, stroke, that you can overcome everything if you practice just, you know, hundreds of hours.

Joe Rogan 34:49 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 34:50 So it wouldn't really matter. You know, you can play by the book, but in the end, all that matters is how much t- pa- time do you spend at the table.

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Joe Rogan 36:24 ... like Shane.

Fedor Gorst 36:25 Yeah, exactly.

Joe Rogan 36:25 Like, when Shane del- he's a- arguably the greatest of all time. One of the... it's in the conversation for the greatest of all time. Five-time US Open player. Hits the ball in a way that everybody tells you, "Don't ever do it that way."

Fedor Gorst 36:35 Yep, exactly.

Joe Rogan 36:36 He stops at the cue ball. Instead of following through, like s- and letting the cue ball, like, slide through, he stops at the cue ball.

Fedor Gorst 36:43 He's very unique. Same as Filipinos. You know, Filipino players, they have a unique style of play. They're super fluent. They're, like, dancing around the table.

Joe Rogan 36:51 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 36:51 But nobody plays like that. Nobody else plays like that.

Joe Rogan 36:54 Yeah. It's, it's interesting. It's, uh, again, as long as it's repeatable.

Fedor Gorst 36:59 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:00 It's like, there's a lot of things like that. If you, you're, if it's repeatable, if you can do it over and over and over again, it does... There are no rules.

Fedor Gorst 37:08 No. I mean, they are written in a book.

Joe Rogan 37:11 But how could you say that, like, Shane van Boeding is doing it wrong? Like-

Fedor Gorst 37:13 Exactly.

Joe Rogan 37:14 ... it doesn't even make any sense.

Fedor Gorst 37:14 Exactly. It doesn't.

Joe Rogan 37:16 I mean, he's probably won more tournaments than anybody ever, right? Who, who's won the most tournaments of all time?

Fedor Gorst 37:21 Pfft. I mean, that's a good question. We were just talking about it this morning. I think, uh, Shane is definitely one of the-

Joe Rogan 37:27 It might be Shane.

Fedor Gorst 37:28 It might be Shane. Shane might be the greatest-

Joe Rogan 37:29 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 37:29 ... of all time right now.

Joe Rogan 37:30 Yeah. I mean, uh, that's what Jeremy Jones says, the greatest of all time.

Fedor Gorst 37:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:35 That's his pick. It's, uh, what's cr- crazy with him too is the d- the deaf aspect, that he shuts his hearing aids off when he plays. That must be amazing.

Fedor Gorst 37:45 That should be illegal, by the way.

Joe Rogan 37:48 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 37:48 (laughs) I mean, it should be.

Joe Rogan 37:51 Really? I mean, that's... Listen, man.

Fedor Gorst 37:53 I mean, like, it's really bad.

Joe Rogan 37:54 Life gives you lemons-

Fedor Gorst 37:55 Yeah, I know.

Joe Rogan 37:55 ... you make lemonade.

Fedor Gorst 37:56 I know, I know.

Joe Rogan 37:56 The dude was born deaf. That's fucked up.

Fedor Gorst 37:58 It is. It is. But it's, uh...

Joe Rogan 38:01 That's the advantage he gets. He can shut them bitches off.

Fedor Gorst 38:04 I mean, yeah, I guess (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 38:06 Come on, man. You can't check to see if he has it on. Like, "Shane? Shane?"

Fedor Gorst 38:10 I mean, do you think we're not checking? We are checking.

Joe Rogan 38:12 Are you checking?

Fedor Gorst 38:12 Of course.

Joe Rogan 38:13 Do you say things to him?

Fedor Gorst 38:14 Motherfucker has it off, off all the time.

Joe Rogan 38:16 How do you know when he has it off?

Fedor Gorst 38:17 Well, because just before his match, he goes through his phone and puts it all the way down.

Joe Rogan 38:21 Oh, so his phone, it's Bluetooth?

Fedor Gorst 38:24 He can... Yeah, he can-

Joe Rogan 38:25 So his hearing aid is Bluetooth?

Fedor Gorst 38:26 Oh, yeah. He can control it by his phone.

Joe Rogan 38:29 Oh, that seems dirty. 'Cause you're not allowed to wear, like, noise-canceling earbuds.

Fedor Gorst 38:34 No, you're not. Earl, Earl always wants that, but, uh-

Joe Rogan 38:38 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 38:38 ... they're not allowing him.

Joe Rogan 38:40 Yeah, I remember when Earl used to wear, like, gun sight glasses. He used to wear glasses, like the kind you wear at the range.

Fedor Gorst 38:46 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 38:47 And then he, he was wearing headphones for a while-

Fedor Gorst 38:50 Like a pilot.

Joe Rogan 38:50 ... so they told him not to. Like a pilot.

Fedor Gorst 38:51 Pilot. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 38:52 Like, complete noise-canceling headphones.

Fedor Gorst 38:54 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 38:54 Ones that look like they weigh five pounds.

Fedor Gorst 38:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 38:58 (laughs) And then he had... He's got weights that he wears around his waist sometimes. He puts-

Fedor Gorst 39:03 I mean, he's definitely a character.

Joe Rogan 39:04 He puts weights on his elbow. He puts tape around his fingertips, and then he makes his cue as fat as my forearm with, like, whatever kind of tape he's using on it.

Fedor Gorst 39:15 Yeah. He runs five miles every day. He does-

Joe Rogan 39:17 Does he?

Fedor Gorst 39:18 ... hundreds of squats. Oh, yeah, he's fit.

Joe Rogan 39:21 Wow.

Fedor Gorst 39:22 Well, I mean, he's not... He doesn't look very fit, but he works out every day, or does something.

Joe Rogan 39:28 He's... Is he the oldest guy that's still super competitive? Like, how old is Ralf Suquet? Ralf Suquet's still pretty competitive.

Fedor Gorst 39:34 No. Earl is w- older than-

Joe Rogan 39:36 Is he?

Fedor Gorst 39:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:38 Right. So I think Ralf Suquet is actually, like, my age.

Fedor Gorst 39:41 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:42 And Earl is, like, in his 60s. So he's probably the oldest guy that's, like, playing competitively and winning.

Fedor Gorst 39:47 Yeah. For sure.

Joe Rogan 39:49 Yeah. It's a fucking game for young people, son. You gotta have them young eyes to cut that ball in.

Fedor Gorst 39:55 For sure. The eyes is everything.

Joe Rogan 39:57 Yeah. Um, how many guys do you know that got LASIK surgery?

Fedor Gorst 40:03 A few. A few. A lot of players wear qu- contacts when they play. Uh, but LASIK, LASIK has been the game-changer for them, for sure.

Joe Rogan 40:11 Now, are these young players that are coming up, are these guys embracing, like, a healthier lifestyle? Because one of the things about pool is, like, it's always been connected, at least when I was young, it was always connected to, especially the gambling, connected to a lot of partying, a lot of, uh, amphetamines.

Fedor Gorst 40:29 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 40:30 Cocaine. And then, you know, just...

Fedor Gorst 40:34 Well, it's just changing. It used to be just a game played at the bar. Now it's a sport, you know. Uh, I think, uh, now in the US, uh, everybody's taking the European approach.

Joe Rogan 40:46 Hmm.

Fedor Gorst 40:46 More methodical, more disciplined, and they treat it as a sport.

Joe Rogan 40:50 Right.

Fedor Gorst 40:51 Especially the younger generation, you know. They see who is more successful on the tour, and if you look at top 10 right now, every one of us, we try our best at everything, you know, when it comes to food, uh, pre-match routines, how we practice, how we treat, uh, pool as a sport. So, uh, I think, yes, definitely, it's changing. And that's, that's why the pool is in a different place where it was.

Joe Rogan 41:14 Well, it's, it's only because of the promotions, and they n- they deserve everything. Uh, and then, of course, the players. But without the promotions, like putting these events on and making them a big deal-

Fedor Gorst 41:25 Oh, for sure.

Joe Rogan 41:25 ... they wouldn't get all over YouTube, they wouldn't get all over these social media sites. But p- what pool really needs is something, like... You know, like, they had The Hustler in the 1960s made pool explode, and then they had The Color of Money in the 1980s made pool explode. They need something like that, like some thing.

Fedor Gorst 41:42 Two days ago, trailer on Netflix. You haven't seen it?

Joe Rogan 41:45 No. What is it?

Fedor Gorst 41:46 Yeah, Net- Netflix made a documentary about, uh, Eddie and Barry Hearn. Uh, I think it's about their family and their, their business, and-

Joe Rogan 41:54 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 41:54 ... I think two or three episodes are about pool.

Joe Rogan 41:56 Oh. Well, that's good. That'll help.

Fedor Gorst 41:59 Yeah, that's really good.

Joe Rogan 42:00 That'll help.

Fedor Gorst 42:00 Most of it are... is about box- I think boxing, darts, and how they started the company.

Joe Rogan 42:04 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 42:04 But pool is a big part of it.

Joe Rogan 42:05 Oh, they do darts, too?

Fedor Gorst 42:06 Darts, snooker, uh, fishing, I think, and, uh...

Joe Rogan 42:12 Fishing?

Fedor Gorst 42:13 Yeah (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 42:13 Really?

Fedor Gorst 42:14 Yeah (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 42:15 Like, fishing tournaments?

Fedor Gorst 42:16 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 42:16 Like that kind of shit?

Fedor Gorst 42:16 Fishermania, I think that's what it's called.

Joe Rogan 42:18 Fishermania? It's like bass tournaments or something like that?

Fedor Gorst 42:20 I have no-

Joe Rogan 42:21 What are they catching?

Fedor Gorst 42:21 I have no idea how it works.

Joe Rogan 42:23 Hmm. I know Shane's a big fisherman, right?

Fedor Gorst 42:25 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 42:25 He goes... Ice fishing.

Fedor Gorst 42:26 Lake trout fishing. Ice fishing-

Joe Rogan 42:27 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 42:27 ... is his thing.

Joe Rogan 42:29 ... you know, that's, that's South-

Fedor Gorst 42:31 That's the most-

Joe Rogan 42:31 ... Dakota mentality.

Fedor Gorst 42:32 The most boring thing I think you can do. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 42:34 It's not that bad.

Fedor Gorst 42:35 Sitting on the ice all day long.

Joe Rogan 42:37 It's, it's actually kind of fun.

Fedor Gorst 42:38 Freeze your ass off.

Joe Rogan 42:39 I did it a couple years ago. I caught a trout. I was pretty jazzed up.

Fedor Gorst 42:42 Yeah, if you catch, if you catch something, then yeah, for sure.

Joe Rogan 42:44 It's pretty cool. You know, like, you're standing on ice, so you're kind of freaked out that you're standing on ice, and they use a drill to drill through the ice, and then you know exactly how much is separating you from drowning.

Fedor Gorst 42:56 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 42:56 So, you only need a few inches, but w- when I was doing it, it was about seven, eight inches of ice.

Fedor Gorst 43:02 So, what do you do? Like, a, you put a tent ar- a tent around you?

Joe Rogan 43:04 Mm-hmm. Yeah. Most the times, that's what guys do.

Fedor Gorst 43:07 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 43:07 They put some kind of a tent around them, and then they get a, like a, a drill, and they-

Fedor Gorst 43:11 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:11 ... go (drilling sound) . They go right into the ground.

Fedor Gorst 43:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:15 Right through the ice, rather, and then you, uh, have, like, a little net where you scoop out new ice that forms, and you just drop your line right down there in the hole.

Fedor Gorst 43:24 That sounds real fun. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 43:26 It's exciting.

Fedor Gorst 43:27 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 43:27 It's exciting when you catch one. (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 43:29 Yeah. I did, I did fish a couple times in my life, but, uh, nothing-

Joe Rogan 43:34 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 43:34 ... nothing really (laughs) exciting for me.

Joe Rogan 43:36 The problem when you can play really good pool is really good pool is about as fun as anything. Like, really good... Which is, I've always said that pool is like an art form that only the people that practice it can appreciate. When you watch someone who plays really good, you're like, "Wow, that's beautiful." Like, "That was beautiful." But to an average person, like, "Oh, he just made a bunch of easy shots."

Fedor Gorst 43:56 Exactly, exactly.

Joe Rogan 43:56 Like, meh.

Fedor Gorst 43:57 You can't really see, you know-

Joe Rogan 43:58 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 43:58 ... the beauty of fundamentals and-

Joe Rogan 43:59 Exactly. Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 44:01 ... positional play, you know.

Joe Rogan 44:03 At least with... If you're explaining jujitsu to someone, at least people kinda get it, "Oh, he's gonna break his arm." Like, "Oh, he's, he's, he's choking him. Oh, he's got his neck."

Fedor Gorst 44:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:15 But when you, when you watch someone play pool and you don't understand how difficult that three-rail position was to get perfect on the four ball, you're like, you're watching, you go, "Oh my God, that was amazing."

Fedor Gorst 44:25 Yeah, or when they say, you know-

Joe Rogan 44:26 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 44:26 ... he's in jail.

Joe Rogan 44:27 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 44:27 He's hooked. He just ha- doesn't have a shot. You know, just people, regular people, they probably don't understand.

Joe Rogan 44:32 They don't get it. They don't get it, and they never will. It's just like, you, you're gonna have to play it to understand how hard it is what that person did.

Fedor Gorst 44:40 Yup.

Joe Rogan 44:40 The casual person doesn't understand, unfortunately. So, what we need is more people playing. If more people played, then more people would watch people playing.

Fedor Gorst 44:48 I think more people start playing.

Joe Rogan 44:50 I think so, too.

Fedor Gorst 44:50 I think so, too. I think, I think the game grew up quite a bunch the last couple years.

Joe Rogan 44:54 Well, uh, I know that the Topgolf people are gonna do something like that for pool. That might be the thing. You know those Topgolf guys? Do you know what Topgolf is?

Fedor Gorst 45:04 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:04 Yeah. So, Topgolf, you know, where they have this thing where you just whack the balls out into the-

Fedor Gorst 45:10 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:10 Well, they're gonna set something like that up for pool, where they have, uh, you know, some sort of a business where you go in and play pool, and it's more attractive to young people.

Fedor Gorst 45:21 Really?

Joe Rogan 45:21 I don't know exactly what their model is 'cause it's still going to be pool. I mean, I don't think you're, it's not gonna be a bunch of people just breaking the balls.

Fedor Gorst 45:29 Right.

Joe Rogan 45:29 You know, like, like, 'cause that's what they're doing when they were doing Topgolf. They're just driving the ball, right? Um, I don't know exactly what their idea is, but the same guys who... They realize, like, a lot of people play pool, a lot of people play pool in bars, and if we had a really attractive place for people to play. And they're, it's probably correct. It's probably an untapped business 'cause people are always looking for something fun to do on date nights, you know?

Fedor Gorst 45:51 Yeah, so what they do in China, for example, or somewhere. I've, I've seen it in Asia. They put, like, a projector above the table, and it ki- it gives you, like, all kinds of different games and interactions while you're playing.

Joe Rogan 46:02 What does it say again? The venue, which is being backed by investors including US-based venture capital firm Sharpe Alpha Advisors and the Daily Mail investment arm DMG Ventures, uses pool tables, balls, and cues from the traditional game but adds tracking technology and video projections to add bonus targets and obstacles in an attempt to appeal to larger groups. Bonus targets and obstacles, huh? Alongside its own venues and those operated by franchise partners, Pool... It's called Pool House. Pool House plans to sell its equipment to pubs, bars, and other venues that want to update their existing pool tables. Hmm.

Fedor Gorst 46:38 Hopefully they can create a speed gun too.

Joe Rogan 46:40 Yeah. So, it says, Steve... I don't know how to say his name, Jolife, Jolify, Jolify? Said, uh, "More people play at Topgolf than on traditional golf courses in the US, and we aim to make an even greater impact on the world, world of pool. We have a strong track record. This project has been our most challenging endeavor yet." Hmm. Oh, that's exciting. Maybe that'll do it.

Fedor Gorst 47:02 Yeah, for sure. I'd never even heard of it.

Joe Rogan 47:03 Well, if you get a bunch of guys that are already really successful at doing that with go-... The thing about golf, though, is, like, whacking a golf ball is really fun.

Fedor Gorst 47:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:13 You know, it's... And then, if you have, like, a big open pit where you could just whack a golf ball, you got, like, 100 yards, you could see how far people could whack a golf ball, and then you get a net at the end of it.

Fedor Gorst 47:22 Yeah, especially if you get a straight.

Joe Rogan 47:23 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 47:24 That's the most exciting thing.

Joe Rogan 47:25 A lot of people are gonna do that. Pool is like, you don't know how to make a bridge, you're holding your hand funny, and it's like-

Fedor Gorst 47:31 Right.

Joe Rogan 47:32 ... moving weird, your arm and eh. I wonder how many people are gonna get frustrated. I wonder if it's the same... Actually-

Fedor Gorst 47:40 It, it is kinda the same.

Joe Rogan 47:40 ... it's probably... Yeah, because I suck at driving a golf ball. You know? I don't, I'm not good at it. I've done it, I've played Topgolf a couple of times. I've gone to a driving range once. It was fun, but I'm not good at it.

Fedor Gorst 47:53 Yeah, same as me.

Joe Rogan 47:53 But, like, fuckin' Jamie over here, that dude's out in the garage every day whacking balls. Every time I come here, he's out there whacking balls.

Fedor Gorst 48:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 48:01 And so you realize, like, there really is, like, uh, there's a lot of technique just to the drive. There's, it's very similar, probably to a break shot in that regard.

Fedor Gorst 48:13 Yeah, for sure. Same, absolutely the same.

Joe Rogan 48:15 And I wonder if they can make something like that really marketable for pool. That might be it.

Fedor Gorst 48:22 It has to be some, some type of interaction 'cause I think it's, I think it would be kind of boring-

Joe Rogan 48:29 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 48:29 ... to just, you know, whack balls, pool balls.

Joe Rogan 48:32 The other thing that might make pool really big is big money. Like, if the Saudis get involved and they get crazy and they start saying, "Okay, this, this tournament's for $3 million."

Fedor Gorst 48:41 Well, we have. We have now. The World Championships is the biggest tournament we have on tour, it's in Saudi.

Joe Rogan 48:46 Right. What's the- what's the first place?

Fedor Gorst 48:49 250,000.

Joe Rogan 48:50 Pretty good. 25 million would be better.

Fedor Gorst 48:52 Yeah, for sure.

Joe Rogan 48:53 Imag- imagine that.

Fedor Gorst 48:54 For sure.

Joe Rogan 48:54 So, th- those guys have so much money. They could spend 25 million bucks, it'd be like nothing. They probably spent more than that on production.

Fedor Gorst 49:01 Mm... (laughs) I don't know.

Joe Rogan 49:03 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 49:03 I don't know. I don't know if they spent more on production.

Joe Rogan 49:05 They throw so much money around in boxing, it's kind of bananas.

Fedor Gorst 49:08 Oh, boxing, for sure. For sure. And that's where Matchroom is really helping, uh, 'cause they have those deals for multi-sports.

Joe Rogan 49:15 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 49:16 They make a deal for boxing and they have a wolf snooker in pool.

Joe Rogan 49:19 Right.

Fedor Gorst 49:19 So, they have the snooker tournament in Saudi, they have the boxing event going on in pool.

Joe Rogan 49:24 Yeah, you gotta get that oil money involved, son.

Fedor Gorst 49:26 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:26 Those- those dudes throw some money around. 'Cause it's like, when people talk about the richest people in the world, they're like, "Hmm, really?" Because their money isn't public. Like, they don't have to disclose how much money they make.

Fedor Gorst 49:38 Yep.

Joe Rogan 49:39 They're kings, okay? Like, they probably laugh, like, "Oh, silly Elon thinks he's number one," you know?

Fedor Gorst 49:46 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:48 With his paltry $400 billion, you know? He's basically a pauper-

Fedor Gorst 49:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:54 ... to those people. So, like, they've- they've thrown an insane amount of money into boxing. I think, um, it- it hasn't been confirmed, so I need to know whether this is true or not, but I think Usyk made 100... More than $100 million in his last defense against, uh, Daniil Dubois. And I think Dubois made in the 70s. He made somewhere around 70. I think they said Usyk made like 130-something, which is crazy. $130 million for a fight.

Fedor Gorst 50:22 That's crazy.

Joe Rogan 50:23 Bananas.

Fedor Gorst 50:24 What do you think if pool goes that route? Just one-on-one matches?

Joe Rogan 50:27 (sighs) That would be exciting, if it's for big, big, big, big, big money like that. I mean, have you ever saw a pool match... Can you im- can you imagine shooting a nine ball hill-hill for 100 million?

Fedor Gorst 50:38 No, I can't.

Joe Rogan 50:39 Could you imagine? I mean, I don't know.

Fedor Gorst 50:41 I was shooting an animal for 250,000 once too.

Joe Rogan 50:44 (laughs) Yeah, that's right.

Fedor Gorst 50:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:46 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 50:46 Glenn, I was straight in.

Joe Rogan 50:47 Yeah. That was crazy. What was that like?

Fedor Gorst 50:51 I mean, it was a crazy match against Khachi-

Joe Rogan 50:53 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 50:53 We played, uh, World Championships Finals. He went in the hill first.

Joe Rogan 50:57 And it was... Yeah, it was hill-hill. That's right.

Fedor Gorst 50:58 Hill-hill, he scratches, I get ball in hand. Shaking like a leaf.

Joe Rogan 51:02 Were you?

Fedor Gorst 51:03 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:03 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 51:04 It was incredible. I mean, that's the biggest earn we've ever had.

Joe Rogan 51:07 Right.

Fedor Gorst 51:08 Biggest earn I've ever had in my career. You know, we only have so many tournaments that pay those kind of money. And it's really difficult not to think about it when you're playing.

Joe Rogan 51:17 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 51:18 And, uh... Yeah, that's definitely the highlight of my career, you know, making that tough eight ball. I mean, it wasn't tough, but the positional- positional play was tough, 'cause I had to go up and down with the cue ball.

Joe Rogan 51:29 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 51:29 And I landed right where I wanted to be, so I was straight in the nine ball, no pressure at all.

Joe Rogan 51:34 That's a good one for people to watch. They're like, "What is this all about?" Watch that one. Watch that one and know that they're playing for $250,000.

Fedor Gorst 51:43 Yep. And then second place paid 100, so it was 150,000 difference.

Joe Rogan 51:48 That's a lot.

Fedor Gorst 51:49 It is a lot, for one rack of pool.

Joe Rogan 51:52 That's... And for one nine ball.

Fedor Gorst 51:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:53 That's the beautiful thing about nine ball, you can run everything and then chunk that nine.

Fedor Gorst 51:58 Yeah, game over.

Joe Rogan 52:00 (sighs) It's, uh... It's such a mental game. Really-

Fedor Gorst 52:04 It's a game of millimeters, really.

Joe Rogan 52:05 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 52:05 You know, single roll this way, that way, and you're hooked.

Joe Rogan 52:09 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 52:10 Or you're on the right side of the ball, wrong side of the ball.

Joe Rogan 52:13 I was listening to John Schmidt do commentary once, and he was saying how crazy it is, if you really think about it, every other sport that involves a ball, it's like something is hitting the ball. It's like you have a bat hitting the ball, or th- it's like no other sport has a ball hitting a ball, and then trying to be, like, really accurate over distance.

Fedor Gorst 52:33 That's right.

Joe Rogan 52:33 And then making that ball move around and get perfect for the next ball. Like even golf, you're hitting a ball. It's very difficult, but you're hitting a ball.

Fedor Gorst 52:42 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 52:42 You're not hitting a ball with a ball. That's- it's a whole 'nother element.

Fedor Gorst 52:47 So, you think pool is the most difficult sport? In that regard?

Joe Rogan 52:52 It might be snooker. Excuse me, snooker.

Fedor Gorst 52:56 Snooker is boring.

Joe Rogan 52:57 Oh, I don't think it's boring. I think when you get a guy who's really good, who plays, you know...

Fedor Gorst 53:04 I think it's really difficult when it comes to, like, how difficult is it to execute the shot because th- the balls are smaller.

Joe Rogan 53:11 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 53:11 The cues are thinner, the ball... Uh, the pockets are tinier, you know?

Joe Rogan 53:15 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 53:15 The table is bigger too.

Joe Rogan 53:16 If you watch Ronnie Sullivan play, you can't think that that's boring.

Fedor Gorst 53:19 Of course. I mean, if- of course you have players...

Joe Rogan 53:22 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 53:22 Like Ronie, I mean, you can never- you can never th- say that it's boring.

Joe Rogan 53:26 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 53:26 But I think the game itself, it's just too much safety, there's nothing shots here and there.

Joe Rogan 53:31 Mm-hmm. Yeah, bu- but it's because it's so hard and because it's so big, it's a 12-foot fucking table, which is crazy.

Fedor Gorst 53:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 53:39 And the pockets are tiny and the balls are tiny. It's a really hard game. But when you got... Watch a guy like Ronnie and he doesn't miss for like 30, 40 shots in a row, you're like, "This is crazy."

Fedor Gorst 53:49 What's really crazy about snooker is there's only, you know, four or five countries that really play that game, but it's a lot bigger than pool.

Joe Rogan 53:57 Really?

Fedor Gorst 53:58 Pool is, pool is a lot more international. If you look at the majors that Matchroom have, look at the last 64 or the last- the last 32, you will have, you know, 20 different countries represented.

Joe Rogan 54:08 So, that's interesting that snooker's bigger. Like, how much do they make? With like a... I know they were making, like, gigantic money in- in the UK. Is that still happening or has it died down a little?

Fedor Gorst 54:19 Well, the... Most of... The majority of tournaments are in the UK, I think. Uh, there's a lot of them happening now in China as well. Uh, but I think really Scotland, Ireland, Wales, UK, China, that's about it, and a few European players. And they make, I would say, you know, the top, top guys, they make over 2, 3 million a year.

Joe Rogan 54:41 Do you remember the scandal? There was a scandal with one of the players a few years back where they got him on hidden camera saying that he'd be willing to dump a match.

Fedor Gorst 54:50 ... oh, yeah. There was a lot of Chinese guys that got banned for it, too.

Joe Rogan 54:53 Oh, really?

Fedor Gorst 54:53 For, uh, dumping a match.

Joe Rogan 54:55 That's the problem with gambling.

Fedor Gorst 54:57 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:58 Right? When gambling gets involved, and you realize, like, if you get your friends to bet on the other guy ...

Fedor Gorst 55:04 That's the problem with, uh, I guess, getting the bookies to be involved in tournaments as well.

Joe Rogan 55:10 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 55:10 Because when the prize money are not big, you will have players-

Joe Rogan 55:13 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 55:14 ... thinking, you know, "Winning the tournament is nice, but-"

Joe Rogan 55:17 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 55:17 "... I don't have to win that. I could just lose my round one, go through the loser's side and take a free shot at those-"

Joe Rogan 55:24 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 55:24 "... 100,000 real fast."

Joe Rogan 55:26 (sighs) Yeah. That's unfortunate. But is that part of the thing of not having the kind of money that golf has? 'Cause I doubt that people that play golf are dumping on purpose.

Fedor Gorst 55:38 (gulps)

Joe Rogan 55:40 'Cause there's so much money on the line.

Fedor Gorst 55:41 Yeah. Uh, uh, they don't have to.

Joe Rogan 55:43 Yeah, they don't have to. But when you ... The difference between, like, winning and losing is so huge, and then you can gamble on it, and then you have friends, and you tell your friends, like, "Listen, bet on him."

Fedor Gorst 55:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 55:56 "And I'm gonna make sure I lose." It's like-

Fedor Gorst 55:59 I think they-

Joe Rogan 55:59 It's too easy to make money that way.

Fedor Gorst 56:00 Yeah, but also, I'm pretty sure they're always investigating. Every, every big bet is investigated, I'm pretty sure.

Joe Rogan 56:08 I'm sure. But you don't have to do big bets.

Fedor Gorst 56:11 No, you don't have to. Could be multiple f-

Joe Rogan 56:12 And you can have-

Fedor Gorst 56:13 Could be multiple friends.

Joe Rogan 56:13 ... some offshore accounts.

Fedor Gorst 56:15 Yeah, could be. You can always find ways, I'm sure.

Joe Rogan 56:17 Especially if you do it online, you use a VPN. I'm, I'm gambling from Vietnam, you know?

Fedor Gorst 56:20 Yeah. Yeah, you can find ways, I'm sure. But yeah. I mean, it's, uh, it's the problem.

Joe Rogan 56:25 Yeah. Shady businesses, man.

Fedor Gorst 56:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 56:30 But that's k- also kind of the fun part of pool, too, is that places are kind of shady. Like, they're, they're like the, the outcasts of society. You know? If you go and you watch, like, the finals of the Florida Open, you look in the crowd, there's a lot of outcasts in there, a lot of Android phones, lot of ... (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 56:50 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 56:50 Yeah. There's a lot of outcasts. There's a lot of people who've spent a, a giant chunk of their life in pool rooms. And the thing about pool is, if you really get into it, you're playing it eight hours a day.

Fedor Gorst 57:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:02 And-

Fedor Gorst 57:02 You have to.

Joe Rogan 57:03 Yeah. It's-

Fedor Gorst 57:04 If you want to get good at it, you have to.

Joe Rogan 57:06 It's the only way. Yeah. And it makes a giant difference.

Fedor Gorst 57:11 And a lot of people fall in love with the game really fast. And if you do, then you don't want to quit.

Joe Rogan 57:16 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 57:17 And then you just, you just hit balls for hours and hours and hours.

Joe Rogan 57:19 I was playing with my friend, Jake, the other day, and I said, "To get really good at pool, you kind of have to be a piece of shit."

Fedor Gorst 57:24 (laughs) Why is that?

Joe Rogan 57:25 Because ... This is why, this is why. You don't have to. I mean, obviously, you're not. And, you know, and y- you're lucky that your wife plays pool, which is huge as well.

Fedor Gorst 57:35 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:35 Because if she didn't, like, you know where to find me, 'cause I'm gonna be playing-

Fedor Gorst 57:41 Right.

Joe Rogan 57:41 Sorry.

Fedor Gorst 57:42 Right.

Joe Rogan 57:42 Like, you, you're gonna ignore most of your responsibilities, if you're gonna be really good at pool.

Fedor Gorst 57:47 But it's also tough. It's really tough.

Joe Rogan 57:48 Oh, yeah.

Fedor Gorst 57:48 Personal life, especially w- with the schedule that we have now, like first half of the year was okay. But now it's just back-to-back. Like even after this tournament, I have Texas Open starting on Wednesday. From then, I go to China, then I go to Vietnam for three weeks. From there, I go to Philippines for two weeks, and-

Joe Rogan 58:04 Do you think the people in the Philippines gonna be mad at you still when you get there?

Fedor Gorst 58:06 Oh, for sure. For sure. Reyes Cup, that's gonna be another one.

Joe Rogan 58:10 Oh, no.

Fedor Gorst 58:10 Reyes Cup is now is the rest of the world against Team Asia, and that's happening in Manila.

Joe Rogan 58:15 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 58:16 So they're already ... All the comments-

Joe Rogan 58:17 Delete that Facebook.

Fedor Gorst 58:18 All the comments, if you see, like, "Yeah, wait until you come to Manila. We're gonna welcome you with open arms."

Joe Rogan 58:23 Oh, no.

Fedor Gorst 58:24 (laughs) Yeah. I'm gonna get it, but, uh, that's gonna be fun, I'm sure.

Joe Rogan 58:29 (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 58:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 58:31 Yeah. Hopefully, he doesn't ... Someone he doesn't get crazy. But yeah, that, that schedule's nuts.

Fedor Gorst 58:37 Yeah. So it's really tough to balance, you know, pool, personal life, family.

Joe Rogan 58:43 Family, it's almost impossible. If you have kids and you have to take them to softball games and stuff, like, that's why I said, "You want to be really good at pool? You have to be a piece of shit." (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 58:52 Well, hopefully, I don't have to.

Joe Rogan 58:54 You don't. I mean, listen, obviously there's examples of people that keep it together that are really good that still have a family and ... But ... And, you know, spend time with their family and spend time with their kids. But you're gonna have to manage your time, because you're gonna have to ... You have to get those hours in. If you're not playing, like, le- legitimately, realistically, if you want to be a top-flight, world-class player, what is the minimum amount of hours you think you have to play every day?

Fedor Gorst 59:21 I think somebody said that you have to spend 10,000 hours to get good at anything. But I think in pool, it probably is more.

Joe Rogan 59:28 Yeah. I think it's probably a little more because it's, it's really comple- complex.

Fedor Gorst 59:36 Yeah. 'Cause if you're talking about, like, top, top professional player, it's not just practicing, you know. You, and you will have to start traveling and playing tournaments. You will have to start playing and sparing with somebody. Uh ...

Joe Rogan 59:48 Sparring.

Fedor Gorst 59:49 Sparring. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 59:49 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 59:50 And, uh, then, uh, you, you have to gain experience from those tournaments. It's gonna, it's gonna take a lot of time.

Joe Rogan 59:59 Yeah. And ... But I guess it's like anything that's worth doing, you know, if you want to get good. It ... That's one of the reasons why it's so fun, is 'cause you know how hard it is to do.

Fedor Gorst 1:00:10 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:00:11 If it was easy to master, I think people would probably pick it up and then they'd eventually quit. But the problem ... The thing about pool is that you take a week off and then play again, and your arm's like, "What do we do here?" Like, "Wha-"

Fedor Gorst 1:00:23 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:00:23 It seems all screwy. It doesn't want to listen for the first hour or so, and then you finally get back in the groove again. It's because it's so difficult that it makes it so attractive. That's why people get stuck playing it eight, 10 hours a day. If it was easier to play, you wouldn't play it as much.

Fedor Gorst 1:00:39 Right, right. And I mean, the ... For me, the big thing is I just always have to do something. I have to always hit balls because there is so many good players now. So many good players. And if I just stop for a moment or if I focus on something else for, I don't know, a short period of time even, they'll just catch me.

Joe Rogan 1:00:58 Isn't that nuts?

Fedor Gorst 1:01:00 It is. It's- it's driving me crazy, but I just can't-

Joe Rogan 1:01:03 Is it?

Fedor Gorst 1:01:03 ... stop, I just can't stop.

Joe Rogan 1:01:04 How does it drive you crazy? Like, do you wake up in the morning and feel like people nipping at your heels?

Fedor Gorst 1:01:09 Well, like for example, now, I know that Yap, for example, Osius Yap, he won the UK Open. He-

Joe Rogan 1:01:14 Florida Open.

Fedor Gorst 1:01:15 ... Florida Open.

Joe Rogan 1:01:15 And the US Open.

Fedor Gorst 1:01:16 Won the US Open. He won the three out of the last four big tournaments we've had, so...

Joe Rogan 1:01:21 Which is crazy.

Fedor Gorst 1:01:22 Yeah, which is, it's really, really tough to be dominant in our sport, almost impossible. Uh, but he's just, he's just proven that it is possible, you know?

Joe Rogan 1:01:32 And he was on the losing end of the match that I think I've probably watched the most over the last year. And if you Google it, you can find it on YouTube, just google "nine ball perfection". And it's Ko Ping Chung, who's one of my favorite players, outside of you, of course, to watch. He, that guy is so smooth. There's something about those guys from Taiwan. I don't know what their methodology is and their training, but they- they have this, like, smooth, kind of, effortless stroke that's, like, hypnotizing to watch. And that dude never missed a single ball in an 11 match defeat. He w- he beat him by 11 to nothing, never missed a ball, pocketed every shot he aimed at, and never gave him a shot, other than the opening shot.

Fedor Gorst 1:02:24 Yep.

Joe Rogan 1:02:25 He had one shot at the beginning of the match, a long ass two ball, he didn't make it, and then he was fucked.

Fedor Gorst 1:02:32 Yeah. (laughs) I was-

Joe Rogan 1:02:33 Which is crazy. And that's Yap, that's the guy who just won the last three tournaments, which is so nuts about this sport, is that, if the guy's winning, and the- it's winter break, you might not ever play.

Fedor Gorst 1:02:45 For sure, you never know.

Joe Rogan 1:02:46 Like, look at today, you and me, there's, like, five or six games where I'm just, like, standing there.

Fedor Gorst 1:02:50 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02:50 I'm just waiting for you to miss. You're not missing, and so I don't play. You're not missing, and then I don't play. You know? Like, but at a world-class level, when you're doing that in the US Open, and it's on TV, and people are cheering every time you pocket a nine ball, that's bananas.

Fedor Gorst 1:03:04 Yeah, that's- that's, uh, rarely happens.

Joe Rogan 1:03:07 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:03:08 But it was, it was a very, very special moment, I think, because the video went viral everywhere.

Joe Rogan 1:03:13 That dude got in the zone. And if you can appreciate the zone, you gotta watch that video. Even if you only played pool casually. Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:03:21 Is this the only shot the other guy missed?

Joe Rogan 1:03:22 Yeah, this is it, this is Yap. And he, boy, he chunked it, too.

Fedor Gorst 1:03:25 Yeah, he did.

Joe Rogan 1:03:25 He fucked it up. But when you watch this guy, this guy, Ko Ping Chung, who weighs 100 pounds...

Fedor Gorst 1:03:32 This is not an easy opening shot either.

Joe Rogan 1:03:34 No, it's got-

Fedor Gorst 1:03:34 You have to play rail first.

Joe Rogan 1:03:35 ... three-ball combination, rail first. It's crazy. But then, from this out, he just never misses. And you watch this guy, like, watch how fucking smooth his character is. And again, the dude weighs 100 pounds, soaking wet.

Fedor Gorst 1:03:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:52 The cue is half his body weight. (laughs) And he just kinda, like, gently hits everything, just so smooth and effortless.

Fedor Gorst 1:04:02 I remember this match, because I was waiting for- for this match in the finals.

Joe Rogan 1:04:06 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:04:06 Uh, I was watching it in the, um, in the steakhouse. And, uh, it was, it was pretty painful for me to watch it.

Joe Rogan 1:04:12 (laughs) Was it?

Fedor Gorst 1:04:14 Well, I mean, you don't- you don't wanna have somebody just not make a single mistake and play you in the finals, you know? It's just hurting your confidence a little bit.

Joe Rogan 1:04:23 And the reality is, you would think, "Well, this guy's gonna win everything from here on out." But, no.

Fedor Gorst 1:04:29 No.

Joe Rogan 1:04:29 That's what's so crazy about this sport. As good as this guy is, and as competitive as he... Look how he hit that with follow.

Fedor Gorst 1:04:35 Yeah, that's crazy.

Joe Rogan 1:04:36 To get out for the two in the corner, that's masterful shit.

Fedor Gorst 1:04:40 That was really dangerous to play that shot. I have no idea why would he even play it like this.

Joe Rogan 1:04:43 Well, he's got ice water in his veins, man. I'm telling you, the, we were talking about this before, but there's a match from 2018 where he plays Shane Van Boening at the Derby, and it's, Shane's on the hill, it's 10 to f- 10 to 6, and you think, "Oh, Shane's gonna win this." And he runs five games in out on him, and they're crazy outs. Like, he starts with this bananas cut shot on the four ball to get three rail position, and you're like, "What is he doing here?" Like, n- the commentators don't even know what he's doing. Is he ducking?

Fedor Gorst 1:05:14 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:05:14 And then he fires it in, and you're like, "No way." Like, that was n- that was John Schmidt was doing commentary for it, I was like, "How..."

Fedor Gorst 1:05:20 I'm a big fan of Ko brothers, you know, they're genuinely good people, and, uh, they're putting a lot of work. And, uh, it's just, uh, amazing to watch them play as well.

Joe Rogan 1:05:28 They play so good. They play so good. And it's also interesting to me that these guys still play with those solid wood shafts. Like, we were talking about that earlier. It's like, new technology has gotten into the game, and a lot of players, like yourself, play with carbon fiber. But it's interesting that a lot of these guys, from Taiwan in particular, they still go with those wooden shafts.

Fedor Gorst 1:05:53 Yeah. Yeah, well, I don't know. Uh, I know that the industry went to carbon fibers, maybe four, five years ago. And maybe some companies were, kinda, like, pushing the players, you know, "You kinda have to make a switch."

Joe Rogan 1:06:07 Right. Right, right, right.

Fedor Gorst 1:06:08 Uh, but I don't- I don't think that's the case now, because now... For example, I find that maybe advantageous to play with a wooden shaft when you're playing in, like, a sticky, sticky pool room in Asia, where the humidity level is super high.

Joe Rogan 1:06:26 Why is that?

Fedor Gorst 1:06:28 Just because, I don't know, you can move the cue ball around easier. Or at least, I found it easier.

Joe Rogan 1:06:33 Easier? Interesting. Why easier? 'Cause I've heard the opposite. I've heard it's carbon moves the ball easier.

Fedor Gorst 1:06:38 Not in the really sticky condition.

Joe Rogan 1:06:40 Hmm.

Fedor Gorst 1:06:41 I think when we play, for example, major tournaments, everything's brand new, cloth, brand new rails, brand new, um, balls, everything's slick, perfect conditions. Then I think, uh, carbon fiber is perfect. But I think that's the reason why, uh, the Asians prefer wood as well, because the humidity level is just over- over top. It's really, really bouncy.... and that's, that's what they, they used to play back in the day, I guess, and that's what they prefer to this day.

Joe Rogan 1:07:08 (smacks lips) It's such a mind fuck though, isn't it? Because it's like, it's all really what you have confidence with. Obviously, anybody can play really good with carbon fiber, or anybody rather who can play really good with carbon fiber can play really good with wood. It's just, get it into your head what this, this cue does, the way it feels, the kind of deflection it has, and-

Fedor Gorst 1:07:26 Oh, it's a lot of things.

Joe Rogan 1:07:27 ... you put it in the brain computer. After X amount of months of playing with that cue, and you know what it does.

Fedor Gorst 1:07:32 Yeah. I've been, you know, I've been experimenting with cues, (laughs) maybe not as much as you did, but (laughs) , uh, I've started, uh, testing cues for the company that I was working, I'm working with right now, Triple Sixty. We've d- we've been doing testing for three years, so it, I know everything about, like, the foams, the wall thickness, what the material of the ferrule, the hardness of your tip, the weight, the balance. So there's so many different things that will change the way the shaft plays, and then there's also butt. There's so many different things. It's like a magic wand, you know?

Joe Rogan 1:08:06 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:08:07 You have to try, you have to try so many things before you actually understand what you like and what you're looking for. And, uh, it's, uh, it's not a, not a easy process, I would say.

Joe Rogan 1:08:17 I remember I was, uh, going on one of my rucking hikes, where I put a weighted vest on and I, I go for a walk with the dog, and you and I were on the phone. And, uh, 'cause this is how I remember this, 'cause, uh, I was walking through this, this wooded area and you were telling me that the difference between your old cue and your new cue, you said, is a difference of about 5%. And I was like, "5%? Like, how do you know it's 5%?" You're like, "All the ball- balls that I've pocketed, when I, when I think about what it does and what it doesn't do, I think my game is about 5% off," like that-

Fedor Gorst 1:08:54 Well, I think, I think it actually... Well, with the new cue, I was winning a lot more. So I used to, I used to put-

Joe Rogan 1:08:59 This was, like, right when you first changed?

Fedor Gorst 1:09:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:09:01 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:09:02 Yeah. Well, since then, since then I was winning.

Joe Rogan 1:09:04 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:09:05 So I guess, I guess it was the truth.

Joe Rogan 1:09:08 Well, it's... You made it to your specifications.

Fedor Gorst 1:09:11 Yes.

Joe Rogan 1:09:11 Yeah, that's the thing about getting it to-

Fedor Gorst 1:09:13 Yes, I do play with a longer, longer shaft because I have longer arms.

Joe Rogan 1:09:15 Yeah.

Fedor Gorst 1:09:15 I have long fingers. Uh, I do prefer a longer taper, which doesn't really exist on the market, so I created a shaft with a longer taper, uh, especially for shots like off the rail. Let's say one, uh, the, the, the cue ball's one diamond distance off the rail. That's where you feel that change in, uh, the taper thickness. We have the straight taper in our shaft.

Joe Rogan 1:09:36 What is the difference in the feel? What do you feel differently?

Fedor Gorst 1:09:39 For example, the protaper or the conical taper-

Joe Rogan 1:09:42 Mm-hmm.

Fedor Gorst 1:09:42 ... you can feel the change of the thickness-

Joe Rogan 1:09:44 Right.

Fedor Gorst 1:09:45 ... the closer you go to the pin.

Joe Rogan 1:09:46 Right.

Fedor Gorst 1:09:47 We don't have that. Our, our shaft is straight.

Joe Rogan 1:09:49 And so that way, it doesn't give additional resistance as the, the shot gets further? Like, as your bridge gets longer?

Fedor Gorst 1:09:55 Right. You just don't feel the change in thickness.

Joe Rogan 1:09:58 Whispers ] It's mind fucky game.

Fedor Gorst 1:10:01 Yeah. It is.

Joe Rogan 1:10:04 It's a... (laughs)

Fedor Gorst 1:10:04 It is. And then even can go to deflection. Deflection is another thing. It's, uh ... there's so much science behind it that I don't, I don't even know where to start.

Joe Rogan 1:10:13 Well, deflection is interesting too, because some people use it to their advantage, certain deflection, like-

Fedor Gorst 1:10:18 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:10:18 ... like Koh, 'cause his cue has