Joe Rogan Experience #2393 - Bryan Callen

Joe Rogan 0:00 (drumming music) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

Narrator 0:04 The Joe Rogan Experience.

Bryan Callen 0:06 Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music) Let me tell you, I was at- I was at, uh- I was at Tarren Tactical, and I was shooting, and I- I ... and Logan Paul was there, and I'd just met him. And, uh-

Joe Rogan 0:22 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 0:22 ... I hit a dove.

Joe Rogan 0:24 No.

Bryan Callen 0:24 I grazed a dove somehow, right?

Joe Rogan 0:26 Oh, no. Yeah, they do fly around there. Oh, no.

Bryan Callen 0:27 And the dove is dying, but ... yeah, and I ... so, um, Logan and I come up, and I grab the dove, and I'm gonna wring its neck so it doesn't suffer.

Joe Rogan 0:35 (sighs)

Bryan Callen 0:35 And Logan, Logan goes, "Wait. Hold. Let me just see it." And he takes it in his hands, and-and-and instead of me wringing its neck, 'cause I don't want it to suffer, I swear to God it was all ... you know how your- the wing is like this?

Joe Rogan 0:49 Uh-huh.

Bryan Callen 0:49 His-his Jesus energy (laughs) , his-wh-his whatever his energy is, he held it in both hands, I swear to God, the thing kind of just went (clicks tongue) just kind of put its wing back in and just fucking flew out of his hands. (laughs) And I was like, "All right, well-"

Joe Rogan 1:04 Thought you were gonna kill it.

Bryan Callen 1:05 I was gonna kill it. I was like, "All right."

Joe Rogan 1:07 They are delicious.

Bryan Callen 1:08 Maybe that's Logan's celebrity powers.

Joe Rogan 1:10 Do you know that it's, like, the most hunted bird in North America?

Bryan Callen 1:13 Listen, pigeon's delicious.

Joe Rogan 1:15 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 1:15 And I was just hunting them in London, sir. On the outskirts of London. I just got back.

Joe Rogan 1:19 Oh, because, like, in the city, I don't think you're allowed to do that.

Bryan Callen 1:22 Um, this is why-

Joe Rogan 1:24 But, uh-

Bryan Callen 1:24 ... this is why I can't do anything. Look at me.

Joe Rogan 1:25 Wh-what's the matter?

Bryan Callen 1:26 I'm the ... "I don't know how to do this, help me."

Joe Rogan 1:28 It's like a door. Y- you open the-

Bryan Callen 1:30 Oh, you open it.

Joe Rogan 1:30 ... yeah, like that. I know, it's weird.

Bryan Callen 1:32 All right. Yeah, but, you know, I should be able to-

Joe Rogan 1:33 They're all different.

Bryan Callen 1:34 I- I get pissed when I can't figure out little shit like that.

Joe Rogan 1:36 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 1:36 Like a child seat. I'm like, "I got it." And I go, I look at my wife, I go, "You- you do it."

Joe Rogan 1:40 What is-

Bryan Callen 1:40 And I just throw my hands up.

Joe Rogan 1:41 What is it about men that we don't read directions?

Bryan Callen 1:44 I don't know.

Joe Rogan 1:44 I- I never read directions.

Bryan Callen 1:46 Never. Never.

Joe Rogan 1:46 I open the box, I go, "Look at this fucking bullshit." (laughs) Put that aside. I don't need this.

Bryan Callen 1:51 Just-

Joe Rogan 1:51 No, I'll figure this out.

Bryan Callen 1:52 My- my-my wife ... remember one time, when my kid was really young, I had to put together a child's bed. And I'm like, "I can do it." And I go to put the bed together, and-and, um, well, I couldn't. I- I couldn't 'cause there were directions. And I was like ... the screws, you know how they number the screws?

Joe Rogan 2:10 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Bryan Callen 2:11 And I'm sitting there like this, and I- I'm making noises, I'm going, "Ah! Ah!"

Joe Rogan 2:14 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 2:15 My wife is like, "What's wrong with you?" I'm like, "Stay out of the room!"

Joe Rogan 2:17 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 2:18 And apparently, apparently she can't even ... "Get out of the room! I got this!" So-

Joe Rogan 2:21 You should do hard cardio before you put together any child's-

Bryan Callen 2:24 Dude, no, this is what I did.

Joe Rogan 2:25 (laughs) Just get calm first.

Bryan Callen 2:27 I call, I called my buddy, and I go-

Joe Rogan 2:28 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 2:28 ... "I'll give you $300 to come over here right now and put this bed together." He- he builds houses. He comes over, he goes-

Joe Rogan 2:33 Oh, that's-

Bryan Callen 2:33 ... "It's four slats and a frame. What kind of a moron are you?" Yeah, he couldn't believe it. And I was like, "Oh, shut up." But I-

Joe Rogan 2:39 Well, that's different though. That's a guy who's used to using his hands.

Bryan Callen 2:41 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 2:41 Not a delicate man like yourself.

Bryan Callen 2:43 That's correct, sir.

Joe Rogan 2:44 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 2:44 I have soft, I have soft hands. I have, um, by the way, fresh ... if I have some marks on my face, I'm fresh-fresh from the, uh, from the mat of doing take-downs at 58. That's a good time.

Joe Rogan 2:56 Yeah?

Bryan Callen 2:56 Oh, it's a great time.

Joe Rogan 2:56 How's your back? You all right?

Bryan Callen 2:57 You know what, dude? My back is actually good because I- I've mastered the art of warming up.

Joe Rogan 3:02 Oh, that's good. That's smart.

Bryan Callen 3:04 I'm pedantic about it.

Joe Rogan 3:05 Got it.

Bryan Callen 3:05 Like, they make fun of me, and I'm like, "Fuck off."

Joe Rogan 3:07 Yeah, you should.

Bryan Callen 3:08 I do my bird dogs, my fire hydrants, all that shit.

Joe Rogan 3:09 You know Muhammad Ali used to work out for, uh ... well, he used to warm up, rather, for an hour before he worked out?

Bryan Callen 3:14 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 3:16 Yeah, I watched Manny Pacquiao-

Bryan Callen 3:17 I didn't know that, but that's how you stay from getting injured.

Joe Rogan 3:19 I did this thing with, uh, Tosh, Daniel Tosh and I, um, at-the-at, uh, Wild Card Gym where Tosh was getting punched by Manny, and I was like, "Help."

Bryan Callen 3:28 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 3:28 It was like some silly sketch we were doing.

Bryan Callen 3:30 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:31 And, uh ... but Manny was there for a real workout day.

Bryan Callen 3:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:34 And just kindly, uh, allowed Tosh, like, 20 minutes of his time, and they did this little thing. Um, but I got to see Manny work out, and it is very meticulous.

Bryan Callen 3:45 Yes.

Joe Rogan 3:45 It's all, like, these ... he's working out with rubber bands-

Bryan Callen 3:48 Yep.

Joe Rogan 3:48 ... where it's, like, short little movements.

Bryan Callen 3:50 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 3:50 And-and it's all these twisting and turning, and he's got guys stretching him, he's like, you know, he's moving around.

Bryan Callen 3:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:56 Like, everything's very slow.

Bryan Callen 3:59 Very slow.

Joe Rogan 3:59 Get the body warmed up first.

Bryan Callen 4:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:03 His first couple of rounds of even ... we watched him hit the mitts. His first couple of rounds of even hitting the mitts, it's like, "Tap, tap."

Bryan Callen 4:08 Tap.

Joe Rogan 4:08 "Tap, tap." It's-

Bryan Callen 4:09 "Just move."

Joe Rogan 4:09 Yeah, just get everything-

Bryan Callen 4:10 Yes.

Joe Rogan 4:11 ... get everything flowing.

Bryan Callen 4:12 I watched, uh, Olympic ice skaters. I was t- so I was doing a gig at Laugh Boston, and they had some bi- huge tournament. And this woman was in there, she was apparently an Olympian. Watching the way she warms up-

Joe Rogan 4:23 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 4:23 ... like-like-like her ankles rubbing down-

Joe Rogan 4:26 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 4:26 All these little details. I was like, "That looks boring as shit."

Joe Rogan 4:29 (laughs) It is.

Bryan Callen 4:29 But you have to do it.

Joe Rogan 4:30 You have to.

Bryan Callen 4:31 You have to.

Joe Rogan 4:31 Yeah, otherwise you wind up all busted up and broken, yeah.

Bryan Callen 4:34 But that ... it allows me to actually wrestle.

Joe Rogan 4:36 Did you-

Bryan Callen 4:36 Like, to be 58 and actually shooting single and double legs against the monsters-

Joe Rogan 4:41 Double leg.

Bryan Callen 4:41 ... in-

Joe Rogan 4:41 That's silly.

Bryan Callen 4:42 And I'm- I'm with a, you know, Shaun Apperson or Tyson Mendias, those guys that ... Archetype Boxing? They're just all muscle.

Joe Rogan 4:47 And you're wrestling with them?

Bryan Callen 4:49 Yes, sir.

Joe Rogan 4:49 Okay.

Bryan Callen 4:50 And then Tim Kennedy, those guys-

Joe Rogan 4:51 Are you planning on getting hurt?

Bryan Callen 4:52 Well-

Joe Rogan 4:52 Are you trying to get hurt?

Bryan Callen 4:53 Well- well, (laughs) I- I usually-

Joe Rogan 4:55 Looking for an excuse to why different- why you feel pain? (laughs)

Bryan Callen 4:58 My- my advantage is I- I just go ... I make a- I make a- a weird noise, and then I fall-

Joe Rogan 5:02 Like a gay woman?

Bryan Callen 5:02 Yeah, I go like this, "Ah!" And I tap or I fall down.

Joe Rogan 5:06 Did you see that video I sent you of that 80-year-old woman who completed an Ironwan?

Bryan Callen 5:10 Yes.

Joe Rogan 5:11 80 years old, she completed an Ironman Triathlon.

Bryan Callen 5:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:13 Which is, I think it's 120 miles on a bike, and then it's a marathon-

Bryan Callen 5:19 It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 5:19 ... and how ... what is ... how long is the swim? Did I send it to you, Jamie?

Bryan Callen 5:22 I think it's two miles, 2.6 miles.

Joe Rogan 5:24 That is-

Bryan Callen 5:24 It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 5:24 ... so crazy.

Bryan Callen 5:27 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:27 She's 80 years old.

Bryan Callen 5:29 Yeah. Yeah. But I think if you keep ... if you do something every day like that, I- I actually think you can-

Joe Rogan 5:36 Yes.

Bryan Callen 5:37 It's- it's just true.

Joe Rogan 5:37 You keep a lot.

Bryan Callen 5:38 Like- like, what people never do is they- they don't do the sprints.

Joe Rogan 5:41 Natalie ... I don't know how to say her last name. Gribau? Gribau?

Bryan Callen 5:44 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:45 Either way.

Bryan Callen 5:45 Dani Gribau.

Joe Rogan 5:45 Natalie, you're a monster. Amazing. 80 years old.

Bryan Callen 5:50 So nuts.

Joe Rogan 5:50 She became the oldest woman to finish the Ironman World Championship.

Bryan Callen 5:54 God.

Joe Rogan 5:55 That is so incredible.

Bryan Callen 5:56 A 3.8 kilometer swim.

Joe Rogan 5:57 Wow.

Bryan Callen 5:58 180 kilometers.

Joe Rogan 5:58 So, whatever that is in miles.

Bryan Callen 5:59 180 ... that's, like, 180 kilometers in miles is, like, 5,000 miles. I'm not go-

Joe Rogan 6:04 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 6:04 I'm not going there. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 6:05 Uh, I think what ... they're doing this killing me ... this must be a UK website. It's-... covering this 'cause I think it's all done in miles-

Bryan Callen 6:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 6:14 ... I believe.

Bryan Callen 6:15 I've, I've never had an interest in endurance stuff. Do you? (smacks lips) I still can't find out.

Joe Rogan 6:19 Um, I have an interest in it, but here's the thing. Um, it doesn't matter, Jamie. It's a lot.

Bryan Callen 6:25 Yeah, it's- (laughs)

Joe Rogan 6:26 You know, this, whatever this lady did is-

Bryan Callen 6:27 It's a lot. It's fucking incredible.

Joe Rogan 6:29 ... is too fucking incredible. We don't need to break it down exactly to miles, but I'm pretty sure it's like 120-mile bike ride and a full marathon, I mean, at 80.

Bryan Callen 6:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 6:37 All in a day.

Bryan Callen 6:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 6:38 And a thr- two-mile whatever swim. What the fuck?

Bryan Callen 6:42 I, I don't know.

Joe Rogan 6:42 Hillie's a beast.

Bryan Callen 6:43 Yeah. You're- it's a beast. That's crazy.

Joe Rogan 6:45 That's just will. That's just having a fucking iron will. The problem with that is it will consume your life.

Bryan Callen 6:53 Yep.

Joe Rogan 6:54 That, w- that, that obsession with endurance will consume your life. Um, and you can let it do that if that's what you're into, if, like, you wanna find peace in the punishment that you give yourself like David Goggins does.

Bryan Callen 7:08 (exhales deeply)

Joe Rogan 7:08 When I talk to him, he s- he's so crazy 'cause he's doing all this stuff by himself for no reason.

Bryan Callen 7:12 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 7:13 Uh, uh, he goes, "I'm getting lessons."

Bryan Callen 7:15 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 7:16 He's telling me he's, like, learning things, and he's not bullshitting.

Bryan Callen 7:19 No.

Joe Rogan 7:19 Like, he's- he really- it's like he's like a strange type of a monk that we've never had before.

Bryan Callen 7:26 So, let me ask you, ah- um, the question is, (clears throat) is it a- is he a monk, which he probably is, or is he an addict? And, I don't- you- maybe you can be both. You know?

Joe Rogan 7:33 Yeah, you can be both. I think monks are addicts too-

Bryan Callen 7:36 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 7:37 ... 'cause they're addicted to being calm. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 7:40 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 7:40 They don't want any women in their life.

Bryan Callen 7:42 You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 7:42 They don't want any possessions. They're like, "Dude, I'm good."

Bryan Callen 7:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 7:45 "I'm addicted to just being like this."

Bryan Callen 7:47 Yeah, they, they were doing this r- this, um, neuroplasticity, kind of, like, these scans, and they found that the monks that sit around and meditate on joy-

Joe Rogan 7:56 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 7:56 You know, they, like, think of the joyous things, that that part of their brain expands. Okay. I mean ... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 8:01 They should talk to Charlie Sheen because he was telling me a story about how he got his dick sucked while he was smoking crack-

Bryan Callen 8:05 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 8:05 ... for the very first time, and it was the greatest-

Bryan Callen 8:08 That'll expand your brain.

Joe Rogan 8:08 ... experience of his life.

Bryan Callen 8:08 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:09 He said to this day nothing's topped it.

Bryan Callen 8:11 Nothing.

Joe Rogan 8:11 The greatest experience of his life-

Bryan Callen 8:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:13 ... was the first time he smoked crack, a girl was giving him head.

Bryan Callen 8:16 Yeah, well, you know.

Joe Rogan 8:17 So tell that monk to go fuck himself.

Bryan Callen 8:21 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 8:21 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 8:21 My friend who did- my f- friend who did heroin, he, he, he, um ... well, I might as well say it, Artie Lange. Artie said it. He sa- he said it on a podcast. He said, um, he did heroin the first time, and as his head hit the pillow, he went, "I'm in trouble."

Joe Rogan 8:34 Oh, yeah.

Bryan Callen 8:35 Like, this is just ... I'm gonna chase this dragon.

Joe Rogan 8:37 Yeah, Dave Landau said a very similar thing.

Bryan Callen 8:39 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 8:39 He did it once. Um, I think it was Dave, right? It was, right? Dave was telling. I'm pretty sure.

Bryan Callen 8:45 Yeah, man. That shit'll, that shit'll ... For some people, that shit'll grab you.

Joe Rogan 8:48 Oh, I think for most people, that shit grabs you.

Bryan Callen 8:50 Yeah. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:50 I think you have to be, like, averse to doing things that'll fuck your life up. Like, you have to have, like, an automatic ... Like, maybe you grew up around alcoholics or something like that-

Bryan Callen 9:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:00 ... or you saw ... I, I didn't ... None of my ... Like, I didn't have, like, uh, anyone in my family that ruined their life with alcohol, but I did have friends that had, uh, close relatives that I saw become addicted to cocaine.

Bryan Callen 9:13 (gasps)

Joe Rogan 9:13 And I saw this when I was in high school. So I got, like, really scared of addiction. And I also, when I was working construction, (smacks lips) there was this fucking dude that I was friends with who was really cool. He was, uh, an older guy. I mean, older than me, and I was, like, 16 at the time, 17. And, uh, he was probably in his early 30s, but he couldn't keep his shit together. He just couldn't stop drinking, and he would, he would be good for a while, and then he would start drinking again. And, um, man, he was so funny. He was so fun. He was, like, such a cool guy, and he was a drummer in a band. And the band just, you know, never kind of ... His name was Robby. And the band never kind of fucking got it together.

Bryan Callen 9:59 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:00 But he was, like, like, he could have been my best friend if, like, we were the same age-

Bryan Callen 10:05 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:05 ... and we were hanging out together.

Bryan Callen 10:07 It's just not sustainable.

Joe Rogan 10:08 But I was watching a man who was a carpenter. He was a Finnish carpenter and a, you know, very talented carpenter, but he would just ruin his life every few months.

Bryan Callen 10:17 With, with, with coke or with brew?

Joe Rogan 10:18 Both.

Bryan Callen 10:19 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:19 Both booze and coke.

Bryan Callen 10:21 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:21 But booze would start it off. It would be, you know, he'd all the sudden be drinking a Budweiser, and then it was off to the races.

Bryan Callen 10:28 I don't ... That's the thing about, uh, addiction. You know, I- I- or just anything in life, if you wanna be good at something, I actually don't think you can do it necessarily. I mean, some people can maybe, but I don't know how long ... When you say- when you talk about discipline, when you say, "I'm just not gonna do it," you- you- that works for some people, but I don't think it works for people like that. I think what they have to do is figure out-

Joe Rogan 10:52 Their brains were different.

Bryan Callen 10:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:53 Yeah. For sure.

Bryan Callen 10:53 They have to figure out a way to make sobriety more pleasurable than the other thing.

Joe Rogan 11:01 Maybe.

Bryan Callen 11:01 And that's fucking hard.

Joe Rogan 11:02 Well, Jimmy Norton, you know, his mom famously said when he was, like, hooked on hookers-

Bryan Callen 11:07 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:08 ... she's like, "Jimmy, you gotta take your addictions and channel it into something positive."

Bryan Callen 11:13 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:13 Like, it was really funny. He'd talk about, like, how fucking off the rails he was but how his mom would help him.

Bryan Callen 11:19 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 11:19 You know, like, with that p- piece of advice, but that is true. Like, so if you can all of a sudden become a marathon runner-

Bryan Callen 11:26 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 11:26 ... when before, you were just looking to score meth every day-

Bryan Callen 11:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 11:29 ... yeah, yeah, yeah. You definitely ... That's a better thing to be addicted to because it's not gonna ruin your life. It might ruin your ankles and your knees and shit.

Bryan Callen 11:35 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 11:36 But you- it's not gonna ruin your life where it, like, takes away all your money, and you, you wind up sucking dick for rocks, you know? Like, the-

Bryan Callen 11:44 It's kinda hot.

Joe Rogan 11:45 People do stuff.

Bryan Callen 11:46 They do.

Joe Rogan 11:47 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 11:47 But do you remember I said to you ... I, I remember we were talking, and I said ... I think you had gotten some ... You know, it was in the press, you made some- signed some deal or something. And I said, (clears throat) "You know, I've known you 30 years, (clears throat) and the one thing- the, the only thing that's changed about you is you've gotten more peace of mind. Like, you just haven't changed really. Like, you're just not ... You haven't changed." And, um, I said, "What do you think it is?"... which I'm always careful about talking about, 'cause I don't want anybody, any of my friends to get into their head about it, right? (laughs) Just like-

Joe Rogan 12:12 Right. You could get in your head.

Bryan Callen 12:12 ... shut the fuck up. You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 12:14 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 12:14 Like, don't start asking too many questions. But I was, like, gently kinda going, "I wonder..." We were kind of exploring what it is that keeps you grounded. And I, you said to me, "I like to do something really hard every day, so it reminds me of what a bitch I am." And what, that, that's the same thing I feel about the... I wrestle almost four days a week now-

Joe Rogan 12:32 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 12:32 ... which is ridiculous. It's actually embarrassing, right? But I do it because it r- it, it's hard.

Joe Rogan 12:39 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 12:39 And I don't want to, and I have to warm my frame up, and then I have to go wrestle around with these fucking monsters. But there's something about it, getting better at it, kind of s- slowly, the incremental-cremental getting better at something. And I do it because it's hard. That grounds me. No matter what, I know I did that today. And that's a really good starting point. That's a good place-

Joe Rogan 13:02 There is something-

Bryan Callen 13:02 ... to jump off of.

Joe Rogan 13:03 There's something th- that, you know, and, and if s- someone's listening and they're not into that, you don't, definitely don't have to do that. Just try to do yoga every day. Try to go to, uh, one of those Bikram 90-minute hot yoga classes. Some of the hardest shit I've-

Bryan Callen 13:16 Bro.

Joe Rogan 13:16 ... ever done physically in my life.

Bryan Callen 13:18 No shit.

Joe Rogan 13:18 So you don't have to, like, go wrestle.

Bryan Callen 13:20 No.

Joe Rogan 13:20 You can do something that more aligns with your political ideology. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 13:24 (laughs) No, I always say-

Joe Rogan 13:25 It's like-

Bryan Callen 13:25 ... that. If you're a, especially, I can't speak to women, but if you're a young man, you wanna find yourself, just get really good at something. Like, just get good at fucking the piano. I don't care what it is. I, I always used jujitsu or something like that, just 'cause it's hard. But it's, it's a, it's a placeholder for a lot of other things.

Joe Rogan 13:39 Well, it also lets you know that there's a process in life that you can apply, like, universally.

Bryan Callen 13:45 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 13:45 And that is, like, focus and attention, and, uh, you know, and this objective goal of getting better, and then you see progress. And then you realize, like, "Oh, this is kind of applicable to just being a human being." Like, you can get better at being-

Bryan Callen 14:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:02 ... a human being by, by thinking about, "Okay, I fucked that up. I fucked this up."

Bryan Callen 14:07 Yes.

Joe Rogan 14:07 "But I did that good. Uh, what did I do differently? Oh, okay, let's do more of that." And then-

Bryan Callen 14:12 That would get... Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:13 Over time, you get better at being a human being.

Bryan Callen 14:16 Yes.

Joe Rogan 14:16 Right? But if you don't ever try to get good at anything-

Bryan Callen 14:19 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:19 ... you're the same douchebag you were when you were in high school. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 14:22 It's true.

Joe Rogan 14:22 But now you're 48-

Bryan Callen 14:24 It's bad luck.

Joe Rogan 14:24 ... instead of 16.

Bryan Callen 14:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:25 Yeah, and you're, uh, you have the emotional maturity of a child.

Bryan Callen 14:29 Yeah, and also you didn't, you didn't-

Joe Rogan 14:29 And there's a lot of people out there running around like that-

Bryan Callen 14:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:31 ... that are just grown-up babies.

Bryan Callen 14:33 I know, right?

Joe Rogan 14:34 And they mask it with, w- t- th- they'll, they'll mask it with a good vocabulary, you know?

Bryan Callen 14:39 Yeah, or, or they'll mask it with, uh, like, um, you know, part of, like, everybody wants to be an individual, right? You wanna be a little mysterious. You wanna have a little, like, a skill set. And one of the great things about standup is you, you know, no matter where I am, I know I got that. Like, I'll... Put me in front of a group, a, a crowd of 100, 200, 300 people, doesn't matter, I don't care who they are. I'll ma- I'm gonna make 'em laugh. I know how to na- navigate that space for an hour. That's a nice thing to know. But if you don't have that, you don't have a skill set, if you don't have something-

Joe Rogan 15:04 Don't have anything, nothing.

Bryan Callen 15:05 ... what happens is you then negotiate individuality with, um, accoutrement, as they say-

Joe Rogan 15:11 Right.

Bryan Callen 15:12 ... in France, which means-

Joe Rogan 15:12 Might dye your hair blue.

Bryan Callen 15:13 ... with... Of course, and, and get all-

Joe Rogan 15:15 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 15:15 ... kinds of tattoos, and then-

Joe Rogan 15:16 Yeah. Wait a minute.

Bryan Callen 15:16 ... and then do some crazy shit. Yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:19 (laughs) I just tatted all my tattoos.

Bryan Callen 15:20 But you have no face tattoos.

Joe Rogan 15:21 Oh, fuck. Not yet. I've been thinking about it.

Bryan Callen 15:22 You're, but you're gonna do-

Joe Rogan 15:23 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 15:23 ... you're gonna do a lot of shit.

Joe Rogan 15:24 Get a heart-

Bryan Callen 15:24 You're gonna do-

Joe Rogan 15:24 ... on the tip-

Bryan Callen 15:24 ... a lot of shit.

Joe Rogan 15:25 ... of my nose.

Bryan Callen 15:25 Yes, yes.

Joe Rogan 15:26 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 15:27 Yes. Get your nipples.

Joe Rogan 15:29 (gags)

Bryan Callen 15:29 Get two hearts on your nipples.

Joe Rogan 15:30 Or get 'em pierced. That's-

Bryan Callen 15:31 That's-

Joe Rogan 15:31 ... the best.

Bryan Callen 15:32 ... that's hot. That's over looking.

Joe Rogan 15:34 That's what you need. You're definitely making good decisions.

Bryan Callen 15:35 58 years old.

Joe Rogan 15:36 Get rods through your nipples and you're a man.

Bryan Callen 15:38 It's a new look. I'm trying something out.

Joe Rogan 15:40 L-O-L.

Bryan Callen 15:42 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:42 Ugh.

Bryan Callen 15:42 But you know what I mean? You'll do that.

Joe Rogan 15:43 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 15:43 And then you'll attach yourself to some-

Joe Rogan 15:45 Ah.

Bryan Callen 15:45 ... political cause.

Joe Rogan 15:46 Some political thing. Yeah, all those people that are protesting on the streets, uh, uh, 99% of them are losers.

Bryan Callen 15:51 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:51 The other ones work for the Fed.

Bryan Callen 15:53 I have a whole joke about that. It's like a fucking, uh, you know, if I was-

Joe Rogan 15:56 It's FBI agents and losers.

Bryan Callen 15:57 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 15:57 That's all it is. The whole fucking... Every protest-

Bryan Callen 16:02 Dude.

Joe Rogan 16:02 ... is FBI agents and losers.

Bryan Callen 16:04 I talk about this all the time. I'm like, "For, for me, you want me to join a protest? You want me to get out on the street? First of all, to make a sign? The fuck outta here." And then I'm so-

Joe Rogan 16:12 You don't have to make the sign.

Bryan Callen 16:13 Oh.

Joe Rogan 16:13 There's g- there's a guy with a van who's paid by George Soros-

Bryan Callen 16:16 Yes.

Joe Rogan 16:16 ... and he's got stacks of-

Bryan Callen 16:17 He's handing them out?

Joe Rogan 16:17 ... signs that were made at Kinko's.

Bryan Callen 16:20 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 16:20 Okay? They're not homemade at all. And you can just fucking, just pass those bad boys out.

Bryan Callen 16:24 Y- I'm never leading a revolution. My problem is my sign would say, "Ugh," or, "It's complicated."

Joe Rogan 16:30 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 16:30 You know? That's-

Joe Rogan 16:31 Well, if you're really trying to get your life together... But there's some things, you know, that people feel need to be protested, like-

Bryan Callen 16:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 16:38 ... people in the UK. Like, they're a polite group. There's a polite society in England, for the most part, you know? And they've gotten to the point where they're like, "Okay, this is kinda nuts."

Bryan Callen 16:48 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 16:49 Like, "What are you guys doing?" Uh, they've arrested 12,000 people this year-

Bryan Callen 16:54 Correct.

Joe Rogan 16:54 ... for social media posts.

Bryan Callen 16:55 Isn't that insane?

Joe Rogan 16:55 Yeah, so-

Bryan Callen 16:56 And, and counting.

Joe Rogan 16:56 Yeah. And they're arresting people for just saying things in public, like, "I like bacon," around, uh, m-

Bryan Callen 17:03 Muslims?

Joe Rogan 17:04 ... Muslims. Yeah.

Bryan Callen 17:05 Wow.

Joe Rogan 17:05 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 17:05 Is that true?

Joe Rogan 17:05 Yes. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 17:06 'Cause you're inso- you're, you're being annoying? I looked up-

Joe Rogan 17:08 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 17:08 ... that, that, um, it's some kind of a, an information act that, uh... And if you, uh, one of the things is if you're, if you post annoying, annoying-

Joe Rogan 17:16 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 17:16 I was like, "Uh, what?"

Joe Rogan 17:17 That's everything I've ever posted.

Bryan Callen 17:19 What the fuck are you talking... That's like-

Joe Rogan 17:19 (laughs) I'm annoying.

Bryan Callen 17:20 And then, the Brits are, the Brits-

Joe Rogan 17:21 And-

Bryan Callen 17:21 ... are famously sarcastic.

Joe Rogan 17:23 Right. And also, it depends entirely on who you are. Because, like, what's annoying to me might not, not be remotely annoying to other people.

Bryan Callen 17:31 I mean-

Joe Rogan 17:31 So I get to decide whether or not you've committed a crime?

Bryan Callen 17:34 They would've, they would've arrested Trump 50,000 times, you know?

Joe Rogan 17:37 At least.

Bryan Callen 17:38 But, uh, th- that's, that's, uh, I, I always say that the Brits, they... The Brits, I, I... Don't wake 'em up.

Joe Rogan 17:44 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 17:44 Because they come alive.

Joe Rogan 17:46 They conquered the world. Yeah.

Bryan Callen 17:46 They, that small island of pale people conquered the fucking world.

Joe Rogan 17:50 Yeah. And, uh-

Bryan Callen 17:50 Don't, don't be, like, 'cause I think that there's a... The Irish too, like, eh-

Joe Rogan 17:54 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 17:54 ... be careful now.

Joe Rogan 17:55 Same thing.

Bryan Callen 17:55 Be careful-

Joe Rogan 17:56 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 17:56 ... because they're very comfortable in a couple situations. They come alive and when it, when it comes to soccer, i.e. football, and-

Joe Rogan 18:02 And fist fights.

Bryan Callen 18:02 ... and fucking war. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 18:04 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 18:04 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:05 And fist fights.

Bryan Callen 18:05 Correct, sir.

Joe Rogan 18:06 Uh, well, just a long history of warriors-

Bryan Callen 18:08 And knifing.

Joe Rogan 18:09 ... out of both Ireland and-

Bryan Callen 18:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:11 ... the UK.

Bryan Callen 18:11 Yes.

Joe Rogan 18:11 Yeah. And great, they make great mob movies. Boy-

Bryan Callen 18:13 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 18:13 Guy Ritchie's fucking show, Mob Land.

Bryan Callen 18:15 Oh, dude.

Joe Rogan 18:16 Have you watched that-

Bryan Callen 18:16 No.

Joe Rogan 18:16 ... show on Netflix?

Bryan Callen 18:17 No, but I love his movies. It's-

Joe Rogan 18:18 Oh, my God, it's good.

Bryan Callen 18:19 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 18:19 It's so... Is Mob Land on Netflix? No, it's Paramount Plus?... they're, it's all the same. One of them streaming serv-... it's not all the same, I'm sorry.

Bryan Callen 18:27 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:27 One of those streaming services has it, but it's-

Bryan Callen 18:29 How dare he?

Joe Rogan 18:29 ... fucking great.

Bryan Callen 18:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:31 It's fucking great.

Bryan Callen 18:33 No, they don't, they don't, you can-

Joe Rogan 18:33 And it just shows you, like, how crazy, like, the UK mob scene is.

Bryan Callen 18:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:38 It's, like, it's probably pretty accurate.

Bryan Callen 18:40 Yeah. Yeah. It's, uh, they always said the SAS and stuff-

Joe Rogan 18:44 What is it, Jimmy?

Narrator 18:44 Paramount.

Joe Rogan 18:45 Paramount. Paramount+.

Bryan Callen 18:46 Oh, it's Paramount.

Joe Rogan 18:46 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 18:47 It's good, though, huh?

Joe Rogan 18:47 It's real good. One of the best shows ever.

Bryan Callen 18:49 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:50 Like, as far as, like, you know, dramas where you follow them along, which really ruined movies. This episode is brought to you by Visible. You know that one friend who's always the first to know about everything? They've got a dozen tabs open constantly on their phone and in their head? To be that friend, you need wireless that can keep up. Visible is the ultimate wireless hack that lets you live in the know, so you can follow a rabbit hole as long as you want. Get one line wireless with unlimited data, talk and text for $25 a month, taxes and fees included. Plus, Visible runs on Verizon's 5G network, so you get great coverage and a reliable connection without the premium cost. Ready for wireless that lets you live in the know? Make the switch at visible.com. Terms apply. See visible.com for plan features and network management details.

Bryan Callen 19:48 Uh, dude, how, they're so sarcastic. I'm sitting there with my, my friend. We're, we're in a shoot, we're doing a shoot, which would mean you wear a, a, you wear a collar and tie, sir, with, with, n- those knickers, those, uh, those-

Joe Rogan 20:00 Are you talking about, like, a, a shoot with a gun?

Bryan Callen 20:02 I did a, I did a pheasant shoot.

Joe Rogan 20:04 Oh, you went hunting?

Bryan Callen 20:05 Sir, yes.

Joe Rogan 20:05 Yeah. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 20:05 And now, at night, we shot deer. But in the mo- in the morning time, you have, w- they do drives. And please follow along. We, we, we wake up, we have a, a wonderful breakfast at the estate, and, uh, I'm paying for none of this, and then we, uh, we go out and we have a loader. I had a loader 'cause I can't load my own shells. I had a loader, who's a British guy, and that's what they do.

Joe Rogan 20:26 Oh, boy.

Bryan Callen 20:26 And then the villagers beat the bush to get the partridges that have been stocked in the-

Joe Rogan 20:30 Partridges or pheasants?

Bryan Callen 20:31 I'm sorry, uh, both. Sorry.

Joe Rogan 20:33 Oh, both. Okay.

Bryan Callen 20:33 Both. Now, it's a- a huge business. It, it supports an entire community. So these shoots are, you know, they're very expensive, so the person sponsoring it pays, essentially, all these... Everybody's making money. It's-

Joe Rogan 20:42 Rich people recreation. I get it.

Bryan Callen 20:43 It's a hu-... Rich people recreation. And, um, but, uh, there's something, there's something... I don't know what I was... W- what were we talking about? W- I lost my train of thought. (crashing sound) Fuck.

Joe Rogan 20:53 (laughs) You're talking about English people.

Bryan Callen 20:55 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. They're so sarcastic. So I've got this loader, um, who's next to me, and, uh, I'm missing the birds. I'm not good with a shotgun, and I just... They're coming right at us, and I'm fucking literally just missing all of them. And at one point, he looks at me and goes, "Are you a vegan?" (laughs)

Joe Rogan 21:12 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 21:12 I was like, "Fuck you, dude." Like-

Joe Rogan 21:15 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 21:15 ... he just quietly said that to me.

Joe Rogan 21:17 That's hilarious.

Bryan Callen 21:17 He goes, "Swing your barrels."

Joe Rogan 21:20 Oh, you have to learn how to do that. I, um, actually in the UK learned how to do it. I learned how to do it in Scotland.

Bryan Callen 21:26 Oh, you did that there. You did that-

Joe Rogan 21:27 Yeah. No, I did clay pigeons.

Bryan Callen 21:29 Okay.

Joe Rogan 21:29 You know, the, the, the-

Bryan Callen 21:30 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 21:30 Those were really fun.

Bryan Callen 21:31 Yeah, those are fun.

Joe Rogan 21:31 And, uh, you learn how you have to lead them, and you learn, like, how to shoot with a, a, a shotgun where you're, you're kind of like, you kind of... It's almost like feel, like you feel where the pellets-

Bryan Callen 21:46 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 21:46 ... are gonna go and you want the disk to hit the pel-

Bryan Callen 21:48 Well, you gotta swing your barrel.

Joe Rogan 21:50 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 21:50 Right? So, so when the bird is coming, you, you, you go belly, you go tail, belly, beak, and you keep... You pull the trigger as you lead the bird.

Joe Rogan 22:01 Get it to beak, yeah.

Bryan Callen 22:01 So it's like throwing a football.

Joe Rogan 22:02 Right.

Bryan Callen 22:03 And then they run into the pellets-

Joe Rogan 22:04 Right.

Bryan Callen 22:04 ... and they, they perish.

Joe Rogan 22:05 So different than any other shooting that I've ever done, because all the shooting that I've ever done, you have to be dead still.

Bryan Callen 22:11 Right.

Joe Rogan 22:11 Like, everything I've shot with a rifle, rather. So rifle shooting, you, you don't move at all, and it's just about control and controlling yourself-

Bryan Callen 22:20 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 22:20 ... and staying calm and not flinching when you pull the trigger. But this is so different. It's like, you know, they used to say that, like, the Comanche, one of the things that was crazy was the, some of 'em weren't even really accurate with a bow.

Bryan Callen 22:33 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 22:33 If you just gave them a bow and told them to shoot it at, like, a target-

Bryan Callen 22:36 Right.

Joe Rogan 22:37 ... they weren't accurate.

Bryan Callen 22:38 Really?

Joe Rogan 22:38 But on a horse-

Bryan Callen 22:39 Uh-huh.

Joe Rogan 22:40 So on the horse, the gallop, and they had this fucking zap!

Bryan Callen 22:43 Wow.

Joe Rogan 22:43 They knew where that arrow was going.

Bryan Callen 22:45 Wow.

Joe Rogan 22:45 So they're using the chaos, so what, the movement-

Bryan Callen 22:50 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 22:50 ... and all the, like, the darting around, like they just n- guide the arrow, like, in the middle of chaos and war.

Bryan Callen 22:57 So you love archery. Do you know what, what was a game changer with art- with, with shooting? Shooting o- or a bow from a horse, you know, you know what invention changed everything?

Joe Rogan 23:07 Probably it's the stirrups.

Bryan Callen 23:08 Thank you.

Joe Rogan 23:09 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 23:09 Stirrups.

Joe Rogan 23:09 Because they can hang over the side.

Bryan Callen 23:10 That's right. Well, you can also stand up and br-

Joe Rogan 23:12 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 23:13 You know, so it's like-

Joe Rogan 23:13 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 23:14 ... you can stay steady and then shoot. The Mongols-

Joe Rogan 23:16 The Comanche used to run, uh, like very similarly. Like, that guy is fucking badass.

Bryan Callen 23:20 That d-... That's a m-... That's a mongol boss.

Joe Rogan 23:22 That guy is so badass.

Bryan Callen 23:23 That's where that guy Shavkat comes from, I think. Look at that.

Joe Rogan 23:26 Yeah. But the kind of-

Bryan Callen 23:27 Jesus.

Joe Rogan 23:27 ... core strength you have to have-

Bryan Callen 23:29 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 23:29 ... to do what that guy was just doing... Go back to that first one, Jimmy.

Bryan Callen 23:32 They live on horses.

Joe Rogan 23:33 Oh, is it a-

Narrator 23:34 Oh my God.

Joe Rogan 23:34 ... YouTube or something?

Bryan Callen 23:34 You know who can ride horses like that? Who's that, who's that good at horses?

Joe Rogan 23:38 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 23:38 Sylvester Stallone.

Joe Rogan 23:39 Look at this.

Bryan Callen 23:39 He grew up on horses.

Joe Rogan 23:40 Look at this.

Bryan Callen 23:40 Oh my God.

Joe Rogan 23:41 Bro, that kind of strength to be able to hang completely sideways-

Bryan Callen 23:45 Oh my God.

Joe Rogan 23:45 Like, when it starts in the beginning, that's not as impressive as the very first frame.

Bryan Callen 23:48 Dude.

Joe Rogan 23:48 Go to the very first frame. Look, look what he's... Look at his positioning. That-

Bryan Callen 23:53 That's, that's ridiculous.

Joe Rogan 23:53 ... is bananas. That's bananas. Like his spine and his core are so... It must be so fucking strong.

Bryan Callen 24:01 Think about fighting him. If you've got a sword and you have to deal with a group of those dudes, enjoy that shit.

Joe Rogan 24:05 There's a lot of bad motherfuckers from that part of the world, bro.

Bryan Callen 24:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:09 A lot of bad motherfuckers.

Bryan Callen 24:11 Yeah. Where they hunt with eagles?

Joe Rogan 24:12 Shavkat is actually from the place that Borat used to always make fun of.

Bryan Callen 24:15 Kazakhstan?

Joe Rogan 24:16 Kazakhstan.

Bryan Callen 24:17 Oh, Kazakhstan.

Joe Rogan 24:18 Kazakhstan. Like, and they hate him. They're like, "If he comes there, they're gonna kill him."

Bryan Callen 24:21 My bad, yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:22 You know, like, they, 'cause they made everybody look like a goat fucker and a retard.

Bryan Callen 24:26 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 24:26 And, and meanwhile they're, like, some of the fiercest fucking human beings on earth.

Bryan Callen 24:30 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:31 You know?

Bryan Callen 24:31 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 24:31 Like, Shavkat unfortunately just injured his knee again.

Bryan Callen 24:35 He did?

Joe Rogan 24:36 Yeah, man. He had surgery on his knee, he was rehabbing his knee, and blew it out again.... and now he has to have another surgery, and now-

Bryan Callen 24:44 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:44 ... it's 10 months. There's a few guys that I know who have done that, where they got ACL reconstruction. I don't know if Shavkat had ACL. But any kind of reconstruction of the ligaments, you, um, you feel better before you're better.

Bryan Callen 24:58 He should, he should do my-

Joe Rogan 24:58 And you gotta be real careful.

Bryan Callen 24:59 ... he should do my work.

Joe Rogan 25:00 You gotta be real careful-

Bryan Callen 25:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 25:01 ... because what happens is, y- y- when you get a, a reconstruction of your knee, so like say if they use a cadaver, that does not become your new tendon. What that does is becomes a scaffolding for your new-

Bryan Callen 25:14 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 25:14 ... tendon. And so your body has to proliferate that scaffolding of the c- dead guy's tendon-

Bryan Callen 25:20 Wow.

Joe Rogan 25:20 ... with fresh tendon meat.

Bryan Callen 25:22 Really?

Joe Rogan 25:22 And eventually, it becomes your tendon.

Bryan Callen 25:24 But you have to wait for it to do that.

Joe Rogan 25:24 You have to wait. But it feels good right away, but you've got a rotten old piece of meat in there that your body is taking over with its own tissue.

Bryan Callen 25:33 Wow.

Joe Rogan 25:34 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 25:34 Did you, didn't you have that done?

Joe Rogan 25:35 I had that done, yeah.

Bryan Callen 25:35 And, and how long did it take you?

Joe Rogan 25:37 Six months.

Bryan Callen 25:38 Really?

Joe Rogan 25:38 Yeah. Six months, I was doing jujitsu again.

Bryan Callen 25:41 But you couldn't do anything until then?

Joe Rogan 25:42 No. I was being really smart.

Bryan Callen 25:43 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 25:44 I, I was really smart about it because I had, that was my second knee reconstruction. I had my left knee reconstructed too. That was a patella tendon graft, and that one took a lot longer to heal.

Bryan Callen 25:54 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 25:54 Because y- you're taking a chip out of your bone, a chip out of your shin, and a slice of your patella tendon, which is a very thick, large tendon. And then they open you up like a fish and screw both of them in place. It's very invasive. Whereas the one on the right knee, um, the ACL reconstruction with a cadaver was a really easy recovery. Like, uh, I was, I went to a party, like, six days later with just a brace on, just walking around.

Bryan Callen 26:18 Damn.

Joe Rogan 26:19 Yeah. It was not bad at all. I mean, I was careful with it, you know, but I was very diligent with the rehab, like, every day. I was doing rehab every day, and, like, really doing it. Like, not bullshitting around. I was doing, like, I would go in the steam shower and do deep squats and ...

Bryan Callen 26:36 Wow.

Joe Rogan 26:37 I was really making sure that I-

Bryan Callen 26:37 You know what protects me?

Joe Rogan 26:38 ... re-

Bryan Callen 26:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:39 ... rebuilt all the tissue before I ever even thought about doing jujitsu again. But jujitsu, six months later, no problem at all.

Bryan Callen 26:46 Wow. What protects me is my, um, moderate temperament.

Joe Rogan 26:50 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 26:50 I'm, I'm good at, like, you being like, "Hmm, I can feel a little something. I'll be stopping now." You know? You probably don't have that gene. You just keep going.

Joe Rogan 26:57 (laughs) I'm terrible at that.

Bryan Callen 26:58 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 26:58 That's why I get hurt sometimes.

Bryan Callen 26:59 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 27:00 Because I meathead my way through things.

Bryan Callen 27:02 Fuck. And then you're out.

Joe Rogan 27:03 I just decide to push through the pain, and next thing-

Bryan Callen 27:05 Right.

Joe Rogan 27:05 ... you know, you've got something legitimately wrong.

Bryan Callen 27:07 Well, that's it. Like, I was doing toes to bar where you-

Joe Rogan 27:10 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 27:10 ... and, and hanging, and I, my wrist has never been the same. Like-

Joe Rogan 27:14 Oh, you hurt your wrist?

Bryan Callen 27:15 Yeah, I pulled, I broke something or did something where I, it's al-, you know, there's a certain angles-

Joe Rogan 27:19 Just get it checked out.

Bryan Callen 27:19 I know. But the pro- problem is you're way more fragile than you realize.

Joe Rogan 27:24 You are, for sure.

Bryan Callen 27:25 Yeah. Well, I unfor- ... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 27:27 (laughs) Unfortunately.

Bryan Callen 27:27 Unfortunately.

Joe Rogan 27:28 You know what I've been doing every day?

Bryan Callen 27:29 All I wanna be is tougher.

Joe Rogan 27:30 Every day, I hang for two minutes.

Bryan Callen 27:31 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 27:32 Every day. Every day.

Bryan Callen 27:34 That's really good.

Joe Rogan 27:34 And it's new. It's, I've only been doing it, like, a- the last few weeks.

Bryan Callen 27:37 Well, what do you get out of it?

Joe Rogan 27:39 I think I feel better, like my spine feels better.

Bryan Callen 27:42 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 27:42 I've been doing a bunch of things at the same time, so it's hard to tell what has the most impact. I think they all have a lot of impact. But one of the things I've been doing is, like, I go to this guy and get trigger point work.

Bryan Callen 27:53 Right.

Joe Rogan 27:53 Trigger point massage. It's f- it's so painful.

Bryan Callen 27:56 Really?

Joe Rogan 27:56 It's some of the most fucking ... It's not massage. You can call it massage. It's this guy's digging elbows and knuckles-

Bryan Callen 28:02 Ooh.

Joe Rogan 28:02 ... into, like, your IT band and y-

Bryan Callen 28:05 Oh, fuck.

Joe Rogan 28:05 Yeah, like different parts you're s-

Bryan Callen 28:06 My calves. He gets my calves.

Joe Rogan 28:07 Uh-huh.

Bryan Callen 28:07 I'll fucking cry.

Joe Rogan 28:08 Different parts of your spine, different parts of your calves, your-

Bryan Callen 28:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:12 ... your legs, your, your lower back, all that stuff. But also hanging every day. And the more I ha- in the beginning, I was like, "I wonder if this is gonna, like, really help anything or if it's just me trying to see how long I can hang."

Bryan Callen 28:24 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:25 Uh, and so now I do two minutes. I just hang there for two minutes.

Bryan Callen 28:29 That's a long time, by the way.

Joe Rogan 28:31 Yeah. Um, I can go to 2:37. That's the longest-

Bryan Callen 28:34 Wow.

Joe Rogan 28:34 ... I've gone. Right now, I'm at 2:02.

Bryan Callen 28:37 But I wonder, p- probably first of all, it makes your hands really strong.

Joe Rogan 28:40 It makes my hands real strong.

Bryan Callen 28:41 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:42 They're very calloused now, like maybe more calloused than they've ever been. They've always been kinda calloused from kettle bells, but now I'm getting different ones, like on the front-

Bryan Callen 28:50 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:51 ... fingers. The, the, the pointer fingers. I always get my callouses on the, right where the ring finger is for some reason-

Bryan Callen 28:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:56 ... on both hands. It's the biggest callouses. I guess that's where I grip the hardest or where it grinds around the most. But my back feels better. It just feels, like, looser.

Bryan Callen 29:05 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 29:06 Like, it's got, it's like it's ... And I'm like, "Okay, well, I've only done this for a few weeks every day. Like, what if I do this every day for a year? Like, what happens?" Does it, can you actually decompress your spine? Well, it turns out you can.

Bryan Callen 29:16 I think you can, yeah.

Joe Rogan 29:17 So I started going on YouTube and following people's, uh, hanging journeys.

Bryan Callen 29:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 29:22 There's this one lady. She, I guess she broke the world record. She hung for 23 minutes.

Bryan Callen 29:29 What?

Joe Rogan 29:30 What?

Bryan Callen 29:30 Isn't it funny-

Joe Rogan 29:31 What?

Bryan Callen 29:31 ... how the human body, if you can, you can train yourself to do almost any, how you can adapt? But that's nuts.

Joe Rogan 29:36 There's people out there that are just different than you. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 29:38 There are people-

Joe Rogan 29:39 They, they have-

Bryan Callen 29:39 ... I know that.

Joe Rogan 29:40 They have, not just you, like everybody listening, they have a different will.

Bryan Callen 29:43 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 29:44 Their will is different. The wi- the kind of will that you have to have to hang from a bar for 23 fucking minutes is so crazy. This guy does it for two hours and 22 minutes.

Bryan Callen 29:54 What?

Joe Rogan 29:54 He keeps switching arms, obviously, but- Yeah. That's the whole, the whole thing is just-

Bryan Callen 29:57 You know what? Life is too long-

Joe Rogan 29:58 Oh, I think that lady has the ladies' record.

Bryan Callen 30:00 Life is too short to hang from a bar that long.

Joe Rogan 30:03 Two hours and 22 minutes. That's pretty crazy, though.

Bryan Callen 30:05 It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 30:06 That guy must be a fucking, some kinda crazy rock climber, right?

Bryan Callen 30:10 But his body, and his body looks pretty, uh, pretty normal.

Joe Rogan 30:13 Well, it's all really about your hands and your grip if you are a, a rock climber. I mean, you have to have leg strength and flexibility and a bunch of other things as well, for sure.

Bryan Callen 30:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:23 But, God, your grip is what keeps you alive.

Bryan Callen 30:25 Fuck, yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:25 Without your grip, you don't have jack shit.

Bryan Callen 30:26 Right.

Joe Rogan 30:28 But, um, this lady that was doing it, I was just watching her do it, and she was doing the same thing. She was, like, switching hands and shit. So you give your left hand a break, and then you hold on with your right hand, give your right hand a break-

Bryan Callen 30:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:38 ... hold on with your left.

Bryan Callen 30:39 I think your body... Uh, I do it... I, I find that the game changer for me was when I stopped stretching and started strengthening, right? So you can stretch. You should do some stretching, but my routine before I wrestle or something is to strengthen. So I'll warm it up. So I do, I do strengthening exercises for my lower back-

Joe Rogan 30:56 Oh, okay.

Bryan Callen 30:57 ... and all that stuff, right?

Joe Rogan 30:57 Like planks and stuff like that?

Bryan Callen 30:58 Yeah, or just, no, just like bird dogs and fire hydrants and-

Joe Rogan 31:02 Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Bryan Callen 31:02 ... you know, all that shit. And, uh, that stuff is, that, that's been the game changer. Like with my shoulders, I was getting tendonitis, right? And then I just started doing all these different shoulder things with bands.

Joe Rogan 31:12 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 31:13 Right before I do it. And sure enough, you get stronger. My neck, same thing. My, n- People don't work their neck, like, as they get older at all. I think your neck is really important.

Joe Rogan 31:23 Oh, for sure. What do you do?

Bryan Callen 31:25 I do that iron, you know that, uh-

Joe Rogan 31:26 Yeah, I got that thing. Iron neck.

Bryan Callen 31:27 And then I get a band sometimes and I'll just turn like that. Like, I'll be on my-

Joe Rogan 31:30 The best thing about the iron neck, in my opinion, is there's other stuff that you could do, like harnesses where you do like chin-ups with your n- or like, not chin-ups like, like you think of. But you have this harness around your head and then there's a chain. At the end of the chain is a dumbbell. And then what you're doing is just using your neck to lift the weights. The guy from Iron Neck had a real good point, he's like, "That, that puts like weird stress on your, all those different discs." And-

Bryan Callen 31:56 It does?

Joe Rogan 31:57 Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a lot of pain.

Bryan Callen 31:57 Wait, so when you're doing this?

Joe Rogan 31:58 When you're... Yeah.

Bryan Callen 31:59 Huh.

Joe Rogan 32:00 And he's like, "You can really get hurt." Whereas what you want to do is strengthen your neck so that it doesn't do that, right? In all sports. In sports it's very rare that you use your neck like that.

Bryan Callen 32:11 Wrestling.

Joe Rogan 32:12 I used to use my neck in jujitsu, and I actually started developing a problem. I had a bulging disc for a while. And that, it was, one, it was also definitely getting caught and not tapping, like a dumbass. But two, it was arm triangles. I was, I had a really good arm triangle, head and arm choke. So if I got mount on someone and I was able to isolate that arm, that I'm, I have a really good head and arm choke. But in that head and arm choke, I'm using my neck.

Bryan Callen 32:39 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 32:40 It's part of the reason why it's good, because I have a thick neck. So because if I can get your arm right here-

Bryan Callen 32:45 Right.

Joe Rogan 32:45 ... I got another weapon.

Bryan Callen 32:47 Yes.

Joe Rogan 32:47 Like you're thinking about my arms holding onto you, but I'm holding onto you with this, and this is strong as fuck. If I get you in this position and I'm holding that arm there. But the problem was, I was developing like a real pinched nerve and then it wound up making my fingertips numb.

Bryan Callen 33:02 Ugh.

Joe Rogan 33:03 And then that's when I found out that chiropractors are quacks. I went to a chiropractor for like a year and just gave this guy money to bullshit me.

Bryan Callen 33:09 Dude.

Joe Rogan 33:09 It was like, Goddammit.

Bryan Callen 33:11 Did he, did he-

Joe Rogan 33:11 It made me so mad.

Bryan Callen 33:12 Did he press on your foot?

Joe Rogan 33:13 He pressed on the top of my head to see if I had a bulging disc.

Bryan Callen 33:16 Oh. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 33:16 I'm not kidding. I go, "Uh, maybe I have a bulging disc." And like, I just thought this guy was cool. I thought he was a doctor as well. I didn't know that chiropractors go to zero days of medical school and they get to call themselves a doctor.

Bryan Callen 33:27 Mm.

Joe Rogan 33:27 I also didn't know that chiropractic, the whole idea of it was founded by a magnetic healer.

Bryan Callen 33:33 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 33:33 Who, uh, w- like, it came to him, like a seance or some shit.

Bryan Callen 33:37 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 33:37 He was a complete fraud. And his son, who was a con artist, took over the business.

Bryan Callen 33:42 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 33:42 His son ran over him with a car, by the way. Killed that guy.

Bryan Callen 33:45 Really?

Joe Rogan 33:45 Yeah. His son killed the dad, ran over him with a car.

Bryan Callen 33:47 Social path.

Joe Rogan 33:48 And then took over his business and then started saying that, you know, cracking people's backs can fix leukemia and all kinds of shit.

Bryan Callen 33:55 Sure.

Joe Rogan 33:55 Uh-

Bryan Callen 33:55 You have to-

Joe Rogan 33:56 (clears throat)

Bryan Callen 33:56 ... you have to align your meridian points.

Joe Rogan 33:57 Oh, yeah. The horse shit.

Bryan Callen 33:59 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 33:59 It's all made up stuff. But there is something beneficial about manipulating your spine though. This is what's interesting, right? There's something beneficial about, um, massage and a lot of the other things that they're doing. They're, they're essentially loosening up, like this trigger point shit that I told you I've been doing, that's the extreme version of it, which I think is way more effective. But there's something to the manipulation.

Bryan Callen 34:20 Well, it releases muscles.

Joe Rogan 34:21 But there's al- but there's also a lot of people that have had fucking serious consequences of getting their neck cracked.

Bryan Callen 34:27 Correct.

Joe Rogan 34:27 Where they have strokes.

Bryan Callen 34:28 Correct.

Joe Rogan 34:28 And like things fuck, like this, uh, this is a guy I just saw on, um, the news the other day that had compartment syndrome.

Bryan Callen 34:35 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:35 Where he's like, he can't move his-

Bryan Callen 34:37 Locked in.

Joe Rogan 34:37 ... body anymore-

Bryan Callen 34:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:38 ... because he went to a chiropractor and before he is like this, like smiley happy guy.

Bryan Callen 34:43 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 34:44 Like-

Bryan Callen 34:44 Nightmare.

Joe Rogan 34:44 And again, this is not all chiropractors. A lot of chiropractors, I'm sure give you benefit because I think there's something too, like loosening you up.

Bryan Callen 34:52 Well, no, it's not just that.

Joe Rogan 34:52 And pushing on you and there's a physical therapy aspect- This episode is brought to you by SimpliSafe. The world can be scary sometimes. I mean, take the news for example. It feels like we hear about something outrageous happening every week. Now more than ever, it's more important to have a security system for your safety and peace of mind. And SimpliSafe is one of the best options out there, partly because of how proactive it is. It can help stop and prevent crime in real time. AI powered cameras can detect suspicious activity and alert security agents who can immediately take action. They can speak to intruders, warn them away, flash lights and sirens and dispatch police. With how great a job it does, no long-term contracts and no hidden fees, it's easy to see why SimpliSafe continues to be named Best Home Security Systems by US News & World Report. Try it out right now. My listeners can get 50% off a SimpliSafe home security system at simplisafe.com/rogan. That's 50% off at simplisafe.com/rogan. There's no safe like SimpliSafe.

Bryan Callen 36:04 Some chiropractors know what you're talking about, so when they go into it, they study physical therapy. So-

Joe Rogan 36:09 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 36:09 ... I had a chiropractor say to me, "Your hips are, your, your, your (clears throat) atrophying, your ass is atrophying on the bottom. So you have to strengthen that part 'cause it'll bring your hips into alignment." And he was dead, he was right on.

Joe Rogan 36:21 Yeah, so he's a physical therapist.

Bryan Callen 36:21 So those guys have studied that. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:23 But that's what he really is.

Bryan Callen 36:24 Correct.

Joe Rogan 36:24 He shouldn't be saying he's a doctor.

Bryan Callen 36:26 Correct.

Joe Rogan 36:26 That's what's crazy.

Bryan Callen 36:27 Right.

Joe Rogan 36:27 It's not that there's no benefit to it. It's like they all want to call themselves doctor too. You know, "I'm Dr. Rogan." Like, come on.

Bryan Callen 36:34 Yeah. You know who the, um, you know Squat University? You ever follow that, that account?

Joe Rogan 36:39 Mm-mm.

Bryan Callen 36:40 Oh, dude.... that guy, everybody I know who, like, he trains Olympic weightlifters and real Olympians, and he'll show you what, what he's, he knows the body so well, and this is the greatest. I, I DM him 'cause people I respect were talking about how they, they follow him, like, I know a lot of trainers who follow him and stuff. And if you, if you go to his thing, you'll see, he demonstrates how somebody will have an impingement, this is an Olympic weightlifter or something, p- pain for two years, and then he'll give them an exercise, literally an exercise, and it will actually change them almost instantaneously or within a couple of days, right? And because he really understands the body. So I had heel pain, really bad heel pain. I would wake up and I couldn't walk, so it's like, "Was it plantar fasciitis? What's going on?"

Joe Rogan 37:24 You had gout, son.

Bryan Callen 37:26 Yeah, right? (laughs) And so I go to a couple of podiatrists and they make me the implants, it's like, "You just need arch support and all that." I DM him, I can't remember his name, and he, um, he said, "You know, I'm gonna send you a video on a guy, your shoes may be too narrow, and what's going on-"

Joe Rogan 37:45 You do wear those fucking goofy ass-

Bryan Callen 37:47 No, not anymore, bro.

Joe Rogan 37:48 ... fucking dress shoes.

Bryan Callen 37:48 No, hold on-

Joe Rogan 37:49 What are you wearing today?

Bryan Callen 37:49 ... one second. I got my Nikes on. But I did, I would wear those kind of, you know, you want to be cool, and-

Joe Rogan 37:54 That doesn't look cool.

Bryan Callen 37:54 ... what was happening is my big toe's being pushed... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:57 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 37:57 Every time I would wear a blazer-

Joe Rogan 37:59 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 37:59 ... every time a blazer w- I would, sometimes I'd be like, "I'm gonna wear a blazer and a collared shirt," and I'd walk in and you'd go, "Hey, you teaching substitute school? You a substitute teacher again?" I'd be like, "Fuck this, man," and take it off. So much for that.

Joe Rogan 38:10 (coughs)

Bryan Callen 38:10 Any time I wear a collared shirt, it's you.

Joe Rogan 38:12 Well, you were wearing slippery shoes.

Bryan Callen 38:14 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 38:14 You were wearing those weird dress shoes that are slippery.

Bryan Callen 38:17 I try to, I try to, I try to change it up. I'm, I'm like, "I'm gonna dress like an adult, I wanna be like Jordan Peterson," but it never lasts.

Joe Rogan 38:21 (laughs) "I wanna be an adult."

Bryan Callen 38:22 I can't do it.

Joe Rogan 38:23 Yeah, you gotta give up on that.

Bryan Callen 38:24 But he told me, he goes, he said, "I think what's happening is your sh- your big toe's being pushed in, and sometimes that cuts blood off to your heel. So your-

Joe Rogan 38:35 Whoa.

Bryan Callen 38:35 ... heel is actually atro- is actually getting necrosis, it's actually dying. You're not getting blood there."

Joe Rogan 38:40 But wait a minute, the blood has to go through-

Bryan Callen 38:43 (clears throat) So ...

Joe Rogan 38:43 ... the heel to get to the-

Bryan Callen 38:44 Yeah, so there's an artery.

Joe Rogan 38:45 ... big, it's not like ... does it go-

Bryan Callen 38:46 There's an artery.

Joe Rogan 38:46 ... that way?

Bryan Callen 38:46 Yep, there's an artery.

Joe Rogan 38:47 It goes all the way to the end-

Bryan Callen 38:48 When you push here.

Joe Rogan 38:49 ... which is the end of the line.

Bryan Callen 38:50 Yep.

Joe Rogan 38:50 ... which is your toes.

Bryan Callen 38:51 As a doctor, I can tell you, as you push here-

Joe Rogan 38:53 And then it turns around?

Bryan Callen 38:54 Yep.

Joe Rogan 38:54 And goes through the heel?

Bryan Callen 38:55 It, whatever this hap- when this happens, it blocks blood flow, the, it, it blocks the, the, the artery that's taking blood there.

Joe Rogan 39:01 Mm.

Bryan Callen 39:01 I wore wide toe shoes like that, within five days, all my, my pain was gone.

Joe Rogan 39:05 That's crazy.

Bryan Callen 39:06 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:06 That makes sense though.

Bryan Callen 39:07 And no podiatrist knew that. He did 'cause he studies the body, 'cause he works with-

Joe Rogan 39:11 Right.

Bryan Callen 39:11 ... the top athletes and if he doesn't get results, he doesn't get paid. That's, that's, that's what you have to look at.

Joe Rogan 39:15 Also, do podiatrists ever tell you should do foot exercises?

Bryan Callen 39:18 Mm-mm.

Joe Rogan 39:18 Well, do you go to a podiatrist and they say, "What you really need to do-"

Bryan Callen 39:22 No.

Joe Rogan 39:22 "... is wear barefoot shoes and pull a sled?"

Bryan Callen 39:26 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 39:26 You know? Like, you wanna do f- foot exercises? Do you ever, use some of those, like, bare- like, Vivo barefoot shoes-

Bryan Callen 39:32 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:32 ... and pull a sled.

Bryan Callen 39:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:34 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 39:35 You'll get stronger.

Joe Rogan 39:35 You'll, you'll feel every little part of your foot, like, pushing and, and that's how they're supposed to engage. You know, traditional shoes are essentially like a cast.

Bryan Callen 39:47 Right.

Joe Rogan 39:47 There's this hard thing that, th- that separates you from the ground, so your toes don't articulate and push and everything is just like from the leg into this cast, and that pushes down 'cause there's, like, this big, spongy, hard surface-

Bryan Callen 40:01 That's right.

Joe Rogan 40:02 ... that you put your fucking foot into.

Bryan Callen 40:04 How much do you d- how, how often, like, how many are, you work out, like, how long a day?

Joe Rogan 40:08 Every day, at least an hour. Um-

Bryan Callen 40:10 That's a lot.

Joe Rogan 40:11 I like to do a couple hours though, because I like to have, like, especially when I'm strength training, I like to have long weights in between, um, exercises. It allows you to fully recover before you do it again.

Bryan Callen 40:24 How heavy do you go?

Joe Rogan 40:25 That's, uh, it's all based on, uh, Pavel Tsatsouline, um, his, um, it's all from the Russians, like, how they would train, kettle bells. He, and his philosophy is that strength is a skill, and you should never do a skill when you're tired. (clears throat) So if you're-

Bryan Callen 40:41 Huh.

Joe Rogan 40:41 ... if you're doing, like, power cleans, like if I'm doing, uh, cleans and presses, I'm waiting five minutes in between each set. I'm waiting a long time.

Bryan Callen 40:49 Really?

Joe Rogan 40:49 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 40:49 Really?

Joe Rogan 40:49 At least.

Bryan Callen 40:50 Damn.

Joe Rogan 40:50 Sometimes 10.

Bryan Callen 40:51 So you're doing Olympic-

Joe Rogan 40:52 And I don't care.

Bryan Callen 40:53 ... Olympic weightlifting.

Joe Rogan 40:53 No, no, kettle bell stuff.

Bryan Callen 40:55 Oh, okay.

Joe Rogan 40:55 So I'm cleaning and pressing, like, uh, in a m- the heaviest I usually use is like 70 pounds. Every now and then I'll fuck around and I'll have like a-

Bryan Callen 41:03 That's pretty heavy.

Joe Rogan 41:03 ... I have a Bigfoot one that's like 92. I'll bust out some reps with the Bigfoot. But most of the time, I'm doing 70 pounds. That's my heavy, my heaviest weight.

Bryan Callen 41:11 And what is that for you? Like, like, uh ...

Joe Rogan 41:13 So I do sets, three sets of 10 cleans and presses.

Bryan Callen 41:17 And by the tenth, how tired are you?

Joe Rogan 41:18 Not tired at all. That's the whole thing. The whole thing is you get all the reps that you would get if you smashed them all together, if you only took like a minute off in between each set and went through it.

Bryan Callen 41:27 Right.

Joe Rogan 41:28 So you get all the strength, but what you're not doing is you're not operating under fatigue. So it's not ...

Bryan Callen 41:35 So you're not pushing to failure?

Joe Rogan 41:36 It's not a ... no.

Bryan Callen 41:36 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 41:36 And it's not a muscular endurance thing. No, you're not pushing failure at all, which is also I thought was crazy. The philosophy is it's not the failure that gets you strong, it's the amount of repetitions. The whole thing is the amount of repetitions. Now, if you do three sets of 10 and you do them back to back, boy, you get to that third set, you might barely be able to get up that 10th rep, right? Because you're exhausted.

Bryan Callen 42:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 42:01 'Cause you've done cleans and presses, you gave yourself like a minute rest in between sets and then you went and did it again, and a minute rest in between the third set, and then you went ... you're fucking tired as shit.

Bryan Callen 42:12 You're right.

Joe Rogan 42:13 But if you're waiting 10 minutes in between each r- each set, you're doing the same amount of work, but easily. So you l- you have a less of a chance of getting hurt, and your goal is not muscular endurance. Your goal when you're doing strength training is just strength. That's what you're trying to do. So the whole way to get strong is not going to failure. This is their philosophy. You can argue it if you want, and especially body builders I'm sure would argue with it 'cause it's a different thing, we're just trying to get massive. But his thought is...... if you can do, say, 20 reps to failure, don't do that. Do 10. And then wait a long time, and then do another 10, and it's just as good-

Bryan Callen 42:54 Really?

Joe Rogan 42:54 ... as doing 20 sets to failure.

Bryan Callen 42:55 Really?

Joe Rogan 42:56 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 42:56 Wow.

Joe Rogan 42:56 The whole thing that gets you strong-

Bryan Callen 42:58 (clears throat)

Joe Rogan 42:59 ... is just work. It's just the numbers.

Bryan Callen 43:02 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 43:02 And it allows your body to fully recover so that you can, you, when you lift it up, like, if you go to clean the second set, you're, you're fully engaged, you feel good, you feel rested, you feel strong-

Bryan Callen 43:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:16 ... and then you bust out those sets, and then you wait again. I wait fucking maybe 10 minutes. I'm just sitting around.

Bryan Callen 43:23 Wow.

Joe Rogan 43:23 I'm-

Bryan Callen 43:23 10 minutes?

Joe Rogan 43:23 Yeah. I watch a YouTube video. Maybe I stretch. And then I get out, and I do it again. So that's, those are the long days. So when I have a lot of time, uh, that's how I like to work out. I like to work out in these long two-hour chunks.

Bryan Callen 43:36 I got small kids, bro. It's never happening.

Joe Rogan 43:38 Yeah, but if you get up in the morning, you can do it. If you get up before everybody else, or if you do it when everybody's asleep, you could do it.

Bryan Callen 43:44 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:44 But the, the point is, if you want to have, like, that, that's a way to get strong that I think you lessen your chances of injury. You always got a chance of injury. You're lifting heavy things. But I don't lift things that are that heavy, and, um, the heaviest thing I lift, really, is my body. I do a lot of body weight squats.

Bryan Callen 44:02 Right.

Joe Rogan 44:02 A lot of-

Bryan Callen 44:03 Pull-ups?

Joe Rogan 44:03 ... body weight stuff, pull-ups, dips, chin-ups.

Bryan Callen 44:05 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:05 You know, I do a lot of stuff.

Bryan Callen 44:06 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:06 Ls, L chin-ups. You know, when your feet are extended and you're doing chin-ups like this?

Bryan Callen 44:10 Right, right, right, right.

Joe Rogan 44:11 I j- I do a lot of those. And I do those toe-to-bars. Um, I do those, what you were talking about.

Bryan Callen 44:16 Oh, they fucking suck. They'll suck. They're good.

Joe Rogan 44:17 But they're really good for your abs.

Bryan Callen 44:19 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:19 I do a lot of ab stuff. I've like a, a heavy core ab routine. But I've always kind of done that. It's like really important for kicking.

Bryan Callen 44:28 Right.

Joe Rogan 44:28 Like kicking, you know, uh, people think it's in the legs, and it certainly is, but a lot of it is you, in the torque that you generate with your core. That's really where the power comes from. It comes from here. A real powerful kick is all vwores (gasp) .

Bryan Callen 44:43 Ugh.

Joe Rogan 44:43 It's all hwuh (gasp) , and the leg kind of follows-

Bryan Callen 44:46 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:46 ... through with it. But when you dig into it, if you have a weak core, there's no way you're gonna generate enough force to even get that-

Bryan Callen 44:53 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 44:54 ... leg moving correctly.

Bryan Callen 44:55 I love that we're 58 and talking about the importance of kicking and torque.

Joe Rogan 45:00 I could think that way. I could think-

Bryan Callen 45:01 No, I know. I just-

Joe Rogan 45:01 ... "Oh, I'm 58. Why do I think like that?"

Bryan Callen 45:03 No, I love it. I love it.

Joe Rogan 45:03 But I just think what I like.

Bryan Callen 45:04 I was just working on my double leg.

Joe Rogan 45:05 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 45:05 What are you talking about? Who are you talking to? Right now.

Joe Rogan 45:07 But also, more importantly, I do the work to make sure that my body can still do this at 58. If you're like 58-

Bryan Callen 45:11 That's how I feel.

Joe Rogan 45:12 ... and you're a mailman, and you've been drinking every night, and you haven't gone to the gym in six months-

Bryan Callen 45:17 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 45:17 ... you're like, "I'm gonna go kick the bag," like slow down.

Bryan Callen 45:20 Yes, slow down.

Joe Rogan 45:20 Slow down. You're gonna get hurt.

Bryan Callen 45:21 Start, start at five minutes.

Joe Rogan 45:22 Yeah. You gotta build, like, you say, "Oh, Rogan hangs for two minutes. Oh, I'm gonna go hang for two minutes." You p- first of all, you're not.

Bryan Callen 45:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:28 And you're gonna hurt yourself.

Bryan Callen 45:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:29 Like, don't. If you want to start hanging, hang for 15 seconds. Just do that every day-

Bryan Callen 45:33 I tell people that.

Joe Rogan 45:34 ... for 15 seconds, and then one day, you'll be able to do 30 pretty easy. And then next thing you know, you'll be doing a minute.

Bryan Callen 45:39 I always say that to people. I say, "Don't worry. Hey, hey, you're gonna get back to working out. You don't have to do an hour."

Joe Rogan 45:42 Yeah. If you're getting back to working out-

Bryan Callen 45:43 Actually, start with 10 minutes. Start with 10 minutes, man.

Joe Rogan 45:46 ... super light.

Bryan Callen 45:46 Literally 10 minutes.

Joe Rogan 45:47 Yeah. You don't want to do much.

Bryan Callen 45:49 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:49 Push-ups.

Bryan Callen 45:50 Keep it, keep it fun.

Joe Rogan 45:50 S- sit-ups, body weight squats. That's it. Just-

Bryan Callen 45:53 Feel, feel the difference so you feel, like, stimulated. You have energy.

Joe Rogan 45:57 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 45:57 Right?

Joe Rogan 45:58 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 45:58 Instead of like, uh, my, my old trainer, I love him, Lou Perotta, he would say, "Stimulate, don't annihilate." He was the same way.

Joe Rogan 46:04 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 46:04 He's 60, he's 70 now. Same thing.

Joe Rogan 46:07 Yeah, because that's the thing about being a meathead. It's like your meatheadedness can actually get in the way of progress.

Bryan Callen 46:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 46:14 Like, you can actually l- learn better if you're not exhausted, right? But there's, like, a lot of jujitsu schools that have you do shit like, like, when I used to train at Carlson Gracie's, the warmup was so brutal-

Bryan Callen 46:27 Ugh.

Joe Rogan 46:27 ... that by the time you got to actually training, that was like a break.

Bryan Callen 46:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 46:31 It was a break. It was at least I can hold onto this guy.

Bryan Callen 46:34 Ugh.

Joe Rogan 46:34 You know? I don't have to fucking do somersaults over and over again.

Bryan Callen 46:38 No.

Joe Rogan 46:38 You would do all these different body weight things. They would do, like, duck walks and bear claw- crawls. But the, their idea was, hey, you should be fit enough that you could do all this shit and it's easy, and then you start training, and then you're fit to train-

Bryan Callen 46:53 Right.

Joe Rogan 46:53 ... and it'll help your training. And there's, they're right. They're right. However, if you're trying to teach people something, the worst way to teach them is when they're exhausted.

Bryan Callen 47:04 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:04 So if you can say, like, Karl Gotch, famously the, he's a famous catch wrestling guru who was a, a great wrestler back in like, God, I think it was like the '50s and '60s, back when catch wrestling was legit. Like, they would, they would rest-

Bryan Callen 47:17 What is catch wrestling?

Joe Rogan 47:19 It's an American-style submission wrestling that a lot of these submissions actually, you know, when you, you think about, um, sh- sh- to.

Bryan Callen 47:27 Is that Ken Shamrock and stuff?

Joe Rogan 47:29 No, Ken Shamrock, Ken Shamrock had a little bit of that, for sure. You know, Ken Shamrock was m- he was a hybrid. You know, he did a lot of training in Japan.

Bryan Callen 47:38 Combo, yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:39 And he did, he was a leg lock guy before anybody was. Like, Ken Shamrock won some of the early UFCs with heel hooks.

Bryan Callen 47:44 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:44 Nobody even knew what the fuck was going on.

Bryan Callen 47:46 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:46 Um, and it was, he was also a massive human being too. That was part of it. Like, Ken Shamrock was fucking jacked.

Bryan Callen 47:52 Strong shit.

Joe Rogan 47:52 He was so strong. Um, but their whole thing was all about conditioning. Like, the Lion's Den, they had this famous crucible they would put recruits through. Like, if you wanted to train with the Lion's Den-

Bryan Callen 48:03 You had to go through that.

Joe Rogan 48:03 ... you had to go through hell. They had this crazy, like, Bud-style strength and conditioning routine, then you had to spar everybody.

Bryan Callen 48:12 Fuck, yeah.

Joe Rogan 48:12 You had to spar the whole team. They beat the fuck out of each other.

Bryan Callen 48:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 48:15 Because back in those days, nobody knew what s- sparring light was all about.

Bryan Callen 48:19 No.

Joe Rogan 48:20 Like, everybody, like-

Bryan Callen 48:21 Knock each other out and shit.

Joe Rogan 48:21 Everybody beat the fuck out of each other. So it's like, but that's not... You produce animals when you do that. But you're not gonna produce the most technical guys.

Bryan Callen 48:32 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 48:32 For most of the people. Most of the most technical guys, what they, they think of, there's two, you have to compartmentalize two different things. Like-... toughness, like in training, if you're doing cardio, if you're doing hill sprints, if you're doing, you know, live drills. There's toughness, but then there's also you, you gotta really know technique. And technique is the king of all-

Bryan Callen 48:56 That's boxing. That's boxing.

Joe Rogan 48:56 ... when it comes to MMA, sure.

Bryan Callen 48:58 You know?

Joe Rogan 48:58 But in jujitsu-

Bryan Callen 48:59 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 48:59 ... it's even more important.

Bryan Callen 49:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:00 In MMA it's even more important, 'cause there's more aspects to the game. And if you are like... Did you see the UFC this weekend?

Bryan Callen 49:06 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:06 Did you see Oliveira versus Gamrot?

Bryan Callen 49:08 No.

Joe Rogan 49:09 Bro, it was a tour de force of jujitsu.

Bryan Callen 49:13 Really?

Joe Rogan 49:13 The moment Gamrot... 'Cause Gamrot is a sick wrestler. Mateusz Gamrot, he's a nasty wrestler, like-

Bryan Callen 49:18 Where is he from?

Joe Rogan 49:20 (inhales deeply)

Bryan Callen 49:20 Like Kazakhstan?

Joe Rogan 49:22 That part of the world that you're terrified of?

Bryan Callen 49:23 Yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 49:24 Um, I don't wanna mis-

Bryan Callen 49:25 (laughs) The-

Joe Rogan 49:26 ... speak.

Bryan Callen 49:26 The, the, the old country, the hills.

Narrator 49:28 Poland.

Joe Rogan 49:29 Poland.

Bryan Callen 49:30 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 49:30 There you go. Hard-ass motherfucker.

Bryan Callen 49:32 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 49:32 Beast, beast of a wrestler. I mean, just a fucking animal.

Bryan Callen 49:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:35 He took Charles Oliveira down right away, and was immediately in terrible trouble, like every step of the way. He was get- he was getting omoplataed and triangled-

Bryan Callen 49:45 Oh.

Joe Rogan 49:45 ... and this and that. And, and Oliveira just dominated him on the ground.

Bryan Callen 49:51 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:51 And then when it comes to stand-up, well, Oliveira's better at stand-up than him.

Bryan Callen 49:54 Yeah, monster.

Joe Rogan 49:54 So they go on the feet and Gamrot's fucked. He's getting lit up on the feet by Oliveira, and then Oliveira takes him down and strangles him. Takes his back and chokes him out, and so it was-

Bryan Callen 50:02 Wow. I'm so glad my brother didn't...

Joe Rogan 50:03 ... the first guy to ever finish Gamrot. But it just showed the importance of technique.

Bryan Callen 50:08 Yes.

Joe Rogan 50:08 Technique, finishing technique, not just holding technique and taking a guy down technique, which Gamrot has a fuckload of.

Bryan Callen 50:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:15 But he doesn't have the jujitsu technique that Oliveira has. But he could have.

Bryan Callen 50:21 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 50:21 He could have had that.

Bryan Callen 50:22 Right.

Joe Rogan 50:22 As good a wrestler as he is-

Bryan Callen 50:24 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:25 ... if that guy just dea- And Eddie Bravo used to say this years and years and years ago. He was like, "If these wrestlers, they all wanna study like anti-jujitsu. They all wanna take everybody down and have, you know-"

Bryan Callen 50:35 Stay on top.

Joe Rogan 50:36 "... just avoid the jujitsu-"

Bryan Callen 50:37 Right.

Joe Rogan 50:37 "... avoid the submissions. That's what they concentrate on the most."

Bryan Callen 50:40 Just smash.

Joe Rogan 50:40 He's like, "Instead of just learning all those submissions and just annihilating people." But they, in their mind, they were competing against jujitsu.

Bryan Callen 50:51 Oh, that's interesting.

Joe Rogan 50:51 So it's like the wrestlers-

Bryan Callen 50:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:52 ... at a show. "We're the toughest."

Bryan Callen 50:54 Yes.

Joe Rogan 50:54 "We're gonna get on top and ground 'em down."

Bryan Callen 50:55 "My tribe is better than your tribe."

Joe Rogan 50:56 100%.

Bryan Callen 50:57 Wow.

Joe Rogan 50:57 And Eddie was like, "If they could just abandon that and fall in love with jujitsu, they'd be the most dangerous people alive."

Bryan Callen 51:03 Wow.

Joe Rogan 51:04 Because they're already the best at grappling.

Bryan Callen 51:06 That's so interesting. That's so interesting, and that makes total sense.

Joe Rogan 51:08 Total sense.

Bryan Callen 51:09 Learni- learning, l- learning your enemy.

Joe Rogan 51:12 Yes.

Bryan Callen 51:12 Like really learning. Really, and, and-

Joe Rogan 51:14 Well, just stop being on a team.

Bryan Callen 51:16 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:17 You're, you're trying to be a fighter.

Bryan Callen 51:19 Right.

Joe Rogan 51:19 If you're an MMA fighter, stop this, "I represent taekwondo" shit.

Bryan Callen 51:22 Right.

Joe Rogan 51:23 No, you don't. You're just, you know, you have some skills.

Bryan Callen 51:24 Well, you and I talk about that. Don't, don't let the fact that you have an idea in your head... See, we all have the, we, we've, we've bo- formed these ideas. A lot of those ideas are informed by where I am emotionally to begin with. I'm defending something.

Joe Rogan 51:38 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 51:38 Typically I'm gonna be defending, uh, how I grew up, my parents, uh, what's worked for me.

Joe Rogan 51:44 My city. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 51:44 All that shit, you know? Yeah, my culture. And, uh-

Joe Rogan 51:48 Ew. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 51:48 ... what happens is you get a, you, you start identifying with your ideas. And it's just an idea, so be open to having your mind changed based on evidence, right?

Joe Rogan 51:55 Well, just don't be married to your ideas.

Bryan Callen 51:57 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:58 That's for sure. But the most important thing is like, think about Bruce Lee, right?

Bryan Callen 52:01 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 52:01 What did he figure out? He figured out before anybody, absorb what is useful.

Bryan Callen 52:07 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 52:07 Take from all martial arts.

Bryan Callen 52:09 Yes.

Joe Rogan 52:09 You know, you don't have to call it a new thing-

Bryan Callen 52:11 Be agnostic.

Joe Rogan 52:11 ... anymore because jeet kune do is what we're all doing really.

Bryan Callen 52:15 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 52:15 Or if you're doing MMA, you're doing jeet kune do and you're doing what he, he's, he just said, "Take a little bit of everything that works."

Bryan Callen 52:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 52:22 No matter what it is.

Bryan Callen 52:23 But also like technique, like when you watch how they bring boxers up, like Virgil Hunter, you know, in his camp with Andre Berto-

Joe Rogan 52:31 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 52:31 ... and Andre Ward. Man, tho- to watch how they, like the, the old school boxers, I love watching them. I love watching how they train. Like, they will, they do stuff like, like everything you do, like this guy Coach Anthony, people like that, if you watch them, everything is considered. And you work on your jab. You work on, uh, how to set that jab up. Gordon Ryan talks about that too, like with jujitsu, start on the bottom. Start on the bottom. How's your half guard? What's it like? How do you get out of h- a mount? Get, start your, your, your entire, uh, repertoire, your technique at the worst part and understand that. But with, with boxing, when you watch like footwork, it's all footwork, man. It's such a different thing. It's like how you step, where you punch from. It's not all punching.

Joe Rogan 53:16 That was Canelo Alvarez versus Terence Crawford.

Bryan Callen 53:17 Ugh.

Joe Rogan 53:18 Crawford always had-

Bryan Callen 53:19 Dude.

Joe Rogan 53:19 ... his foot on the outside.

Bryan Callen 53:20 Ugh.

Joe Rogan 53:20 He was in perfect position.

Bryan Callen 53:22 But his defense.

Joe Rogan 53:22 Defense was flawless.

Bryan Callen 53:23 Ah, fuck. I love watching that.

Joe Rogan 53:24 That was a masterclass.

Bryan Callen 53:25 It was a masterclass.

Joe Rogan 53:26 It was a masterclass because there was one point in the fight where Terence was pity patting him.

Bryan Callen 53:31 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 53:31 So what he'll do is he'll pity pat you and then load up with big shots. But he was so dominant-

Bryan Callen 53:37 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 53:38 ... that he could stand in front of Canelo Alvarez, who's one of the most feared boxers in the history-

Bryan Callen 53:42 One of the greats of all time.

Joe Rogan 53:43 ... of the sport, no doubt. And Terence Crawford is sitting in front of him going pat, pat, pat, pat, pat, rip, pat, pat, pat, pat, bip.

Bryan Callen 53:50 Damn.

Joe Rogan 53:50 Just it was crazy.

Bryan Callen 53:52 I know. I know.

Joe Rogan 53:52 I was like, "Look at, he's pity patting him." Which is almost disrespectful.

Bryan Callen 53:55 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 53:55 Almost disrespectful. (laughs)

Bryan Callen 53:55 Well, you know what, you know what Alvarez, Alvarez said? He goes, "I couldn't figure him out."

Joe Rogan 53:59 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 53:59 How about that?

Joe Rogan 54:00 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 54:00 "I couldn't figure out..." That's what I think fighting is at the highest level. It's, it's two people trying to solve-

Joe Rogan 54:06 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 54:06 Like what are these patterns you're doing? How can I cut you off that, uh, before you finish that pattern? And w- Duran used to... People would say when they fought Duran, they would say, "He's f- he's reading my mind."

Joe Rogan 54:17 Yeah, or-

Bryan Callen 54:17 And they would say, "He's reading my mind" because he knew, he could see what you were doing. He'd been there.

Joe Rogan 54:21 Oh, yeah.

Bryan Callen 54:21 He's like, "I know where you're going with this."

Joe Rogan 54:22 'Cause he was also so raw, he might have been reading your mind.

Bryan Callen 54:25 Fuck.

Joe Rogan 54:25 He was such a savage. In his early days, like people see Duran, you see Duran like when he fought Davey Moore and Iran Barkley and those guys. That's a Duran that's 30 plus pounds over his best fighting weight. His best fighting weight was 135.

Bryan Callen 54:43 Dude, he fought, and Barkley was a, Iran Barkley was, I think, uh, fought at 67, maybe even bigger, and he fought him at that weight.

Joe Rogan 54:51 Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Bryan Callen 54:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:52 He, and he knocked him out.

Bryan Callen 54:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:53 Go, see if you can find Roberto Duran versus Ken Buchanan. This is when he won the lightweight title, when he was young and like super skinny, bef- way before he fought Leonard.

Bryan Callen 55:03 It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 55:04 It's probably a black and white fight, actually.

Bryan Callen 55:05 He's as, he's as close to a human pit bull as possible.

Joe Rogan 55:07 He was a fucking badger, dude.

Bryan Callen 55:09 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 55:09 Just a ferocious man with excellent technique.

Bryan Callen 55:13 Yeah. That's what poverty-

Joe Rogan 55:14 Just tearing people apart.

Bryan Callen 55:15 ... that's what not having enough f- food, literally-

Joe Rogan 55:17 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 55:17 ... in Panama does to you.

Joe Rogan 55:18 Yeah. And also a long history of combat sports in Panama as well.

Bryan Callen 55:23 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 55:23 It's just like, it's not like a, a unique thing to be a boxer in Panama. So you're dealing with iron sharpens iron, excellent technique. Oh, that is in color.

Bryan Callen 55:32 He was so beautiful.

Joe Rogan 55:33 But boy, look how shitty it looks.

Bryan Callen 55:34 He is.

Joe Rogan 55:34 What year is this? '72? It's upscaled, so it's-

Bryan Callen 55:37 This is, this is-

Joe Rogan 55:37 Oh, it's upscaled.

Bryan Callen 55:38 ... this is what every UFO video is.

Joe Rogan 55:40 Bro, he was so good.

Bryan Callen 55:41 And this, they use this camera.

Joe Rogan 55:42 Look how skinny he is.

Bryan Callen 55:43 I know.

Joe Rogan 55:43 Wow. It's crazy.

Bryan Callen 55:44 Yeah, bro, when you, when you, when you are a real boxer like that, that's what you do. You just, you don't look muscle-bound.

Joe Rogan 55:50 Well, in his defense, I mean, he was a young man and he was... But he was a lot thicker when he fought Leonard at 47 and he looked a lot better.

Bryan Callen 55:56 He's got a Bryan Callen body, that's what I like about it.

Joe Rogan 55:59 Uh... But he hit him low a lot as well.

Bryan Callen 56:03 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 56:03 He was very rough, like in the infighting, occasionally he would...

Bryan Callen 56:07 Yeah. Great, great in-fighter.

Joe Rogan 56:08 Probably knew where the referee was too (laughs) . You know, back then there was no instant replay.

Bryan Callen 56:15 You ever see-

Joe Rogan 56:15 Ken Buchanan was very good too.

Bryan Callen 56:17 You ever see me getting a boxing lesson from Sugar Ray Leonard in, in Sylvester Stallone's house? You ever see that? I haven't put it on Instagram.

Joe Rogan 56:25 No. No, we're watching really good boxing. I don't know why you're even bringing that up.

Bryan Callen 56:29 Sorry about that. Sorry.

Joe Rogan 56:30 (laughs)

Bryan Callen 56:30 Oh, he got caught there.

Joe Rogan 56:32 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 56:32 Whoa.

Joe Rogan 56:32 Oh, Ken Buchanan was legit.

Bryan Callen 56:34 Damn. Wow.

Joe Rogan 56:36 I mean, it was crazy fight, but these f-

Bryan Callen 56:38 Was this at 35?

Joe Rogan 56:39 Mm-hmm. And this was for the lightweight title.

Bryan Callen 56:41 35.

Joe Rogan 56:42 It's, it was a crazy scrap of a fight, man. Scoot ahead so you can watch some of like the later action.

Bryan Callen 56:48 Geez. Buchanan was something else, huh?

Joe Rogan 56:49 Oh, yeah. He was world champion.

Bryan Callen 56:50 You know, I never heard of him until just now.

Joe Rogan 56:52 He was a tough guy.

Bryan Callen 56:53 Wow. Is he wearing a kilt?

Joe Rogan 56:54 I'm pretty sure that's how Duran won the title. I don't think Duran was defending the title. I think Dura-

Bryan Callen 56:59 Ooh. Look at that shot. Dude.

Joe Rogan 57:02 Bro, when you watch these guys and you think about like how long it takes to get this good at boxing.

Bryan Callen 57:10 Yeah, 30 years.

Joe Rogan 57:11 How much time had... No, he wasn't that old yet.

Bryan Callen 57:12 No, I'm saying, I'm saying...

Joe Rogan 57:13 But how much time spent like trying to under fire figure out when to connect to someone's face.

Bryan Callen 57:21 No, I was saying-

Joe Rogan 57:21 When to rip to the body.

Bryan Callen 57:22 ... what's his name? Uh, Crawford said, "This, this has been a 30-year career." He's been fighting for 30 years.

Joe Rogan 57:28 Oh, yeah, if you think about it.

Bryan Callen 57:29 Like, think about it.

Joe Rogan 57:29 Well, and also Terence Crawford has been fighting smart for 30 years.

Bryan Callen 57:33 Mm.

Joe Rogan 57:33 He doesn't get hit a lot.

Bryan Callen 57:34 That's like, um-

Joe Rogan 57:35 Which is nuts.

Bryan Callen 57:35 ... that's why Hopkins, Hopkins never got hurt.

Joe Rogan 57:38 Mm-hmm. I mean, until he s- fought Joe Smith and got knocked out of the ring.

Bryan Callen 57:41 That was, he was 50.

Joe Rogan 57:41 Fell on his head.

Bryan Callen 57:42 50 with a gray beard.

Joe Rogan 57:43 I know. Crazy.

Bryan Callen 57:45 50, uh, by the way, fought from 40 to 50. What, nobody could beat him in a, in a division that required speed.

Joe Rogan 57:52 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 57:52 Never got hit. He's a genius.

Joe Rogan 57:54 Yeah, he's one of the all-time greats as well.

Bryan Callen 57:56 He's, to me, like people talk about the greatest athletes and stuff. They never talk about what he was able to accomplish at his age in that division. That's, that has to be part of the conversation.

Joe Rogan 58:05 Well, by the time he fought Felix Trinidad, people thought he was done already.

Bryan Callen 58:08 Unbelievable.

Joe Rogan 58:08 That was, I think he was 36 at the time when he knocked out Trinidad. People thought he was over. And then, you know, he just-

Bryan Callen 58:15 Have, have you had him on this podcast?

Joe Rogan 58:16 Yeah, yeah. He's awesome.

Bryan Callen 58:18 Yeah, man. Love the...

Joe Rogan 58:18 I'm a huge fan of that guy.

Bryan Callen 58:19 God. So smart.

Joe Rogan 58:21 And, um, you know, his lessons from prison too.

Bryan Callen 58:24 Mm.

Joe Rogan 58:25 He's like, "I'm never going back."

Bryan Callen 58:27 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:27 And they, they said to him when he's leaving-

Bryan Callen 58:28 He'll be back. Uh-huh.

Joe Rogan 58:28 ... "We'll see you soon." He's like, "No, no, no. Not me, bitch." And just lived a very-

Bryan Callen 58:32 He used to run with a tennis ball, apparently (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 58:34 Yeah, yeah.

Bryan Callen 58:35 That's obsession, right?

Joe Rogan 58:36 Yeah. Well, that's how you become a Bernard Hopkins.

Bryan Callen 58:39 That's how you get out of where you are too.

Joe Rogan 58:41 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 58:41 Right?

Joe Rogan 58:41 Exactly.

Bryan Callen 58:42 You gotta plan your escape.

Joe Rogan 58:43 Exactly. The thing about Terence though is like, Terence is like an artist. Like what he did in there is like, God, I could watch clips from that fight over and over again, probably for decades. He's an artist.

Bryan Callen 58:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:53 Like what he's doing in there is like, he's like not just beating you. He's b- he's beating Canelo Alvarez and kind of making him look a little silly and doing it with the highest stakes humanly possible, with a guy that can break your face with one punch.

Bryan Callen 59:09 Oh. Oh.

Joe Rogan 59:09 And these missiles are headed his way.

Bryan Callen 59:12 Fuck.

Joe Rogan 59:12 And he is like, "Nope."

Bryan Callen 59:13 I know.

Joe Rogan 59:13 "Nope."

Bryan Callen 59:14 Catching the shots.

Joe Rogan 59:15 "Uh-uh, not here, but I'm here." Bam. He hit him so many times where Canelo would whiffed and then he would counter. It's like, "God, that's so pretty." That's so pretty because like to be in the f- in the fire... So like there's guys that could move real good and they were really hard to hit, like Willie Pep. You know, Willie Pep had crazy footwork.

Bryan Callen 59:34 Mayweather.

Joe Rogan 59:35 Mayweather, but stand right in front of you though. It's a bad example.

Bryan Callen 59:38 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 59:38 Because what I'm saying is like these guys that are hard to hit that aren't moving-

Bryan Callen 59:41 Right.

Joe Rogan 59:41 ... they're right in front of you and you can't hit them.

Bryan Callen 59:43 God.

Joe Rogan 59:44 That's Mayweather. Like, but there's guys that were, they were hard to hit, but they were real mobile.

Bryan Callen 59:49 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 59:49 Like Michael Venom Page in MMA is a great example. You can't hit that dude.

Bryan Callen 59:52 So beautiful.

Joe Rogan 59:53 He's moving in and out so fast. Like you can't...

Bryan Callen 59:57 I heard he was at the Mothership.

Joe Rogan 59:58 Yeah. He was.

Bryan Callen 59:58 I was there, but I missed him.

Joe Rogan 1:00:00 See, look at this. Boom.

Bryan Callen 1:00:02 Ah.

Joe Rogan 1:00:02 I mean, look at these, there's missiles coming his way.

Bryan Callen 1:00:04 Look, look.

Joe Rogan 1:00:04 He's like, nope, pop.

Bryan Callen 1:00:05 Uh, oh. Oh my God.

Joe Rogan 1:00:06 Bro, he's so slick. Like every time Canelo would sh- throw such a-

Bryan Callen 1:00:10 Look at that. You see him catch that?

Joe Rogan 1:00:11 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 1:00:11 You see him catch that body shot with his elbow?

Joe Rogan 1:00:12 Yep.

Bryan Callen 1:00:13 You're not touching that.

Joe Rogan 1:00:13 Catch it and then fire right back.

Bryan Callen 1:00:15 Look at that body. Oh, there we go. All right.

Joe Rogan 1:00:15 And he did get tagged a couple times.

Bryan Callen 1:00:17 Yeah. But-

Joe Rogan 1:00:18 Even there as Canelo rushes in, he gets popped.

Bryan Callen 1:00:20 You make one mistake with Canelo though, you're, you're going out. Like that's-

Joe Rogan 1:00:22 Oh, yeah.

Bryan Callen 1:00:23 That margin for error is like... (smacks hands)

Joe Rogan 1:00:24 Look at this. Look at this. This is so pretty.

Bryan Callen 1:00:25 And he, he catches it. Bop, bop, bop.

Joe Rogan 1:00:26 Look at that. That is so pretty.

Bryan Callen 1:00:28 Look at that. He-

Joe Rogan 1:00:28 And to do that two weight classes above-... his, the normal weight. That, that is one weight class above-

Bryan Callen 1:00:36 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:00:36 ... the previous world championship that he held.

Bryan Callen 1:00:38 Right. Meanwhile, he was 187. (laughs) Did you know that?

Joe Rogan 1:00:41 Yeah. Oh, no. Listen, man, when I talked to him, it was... I talked to him on the podcast a couple of years ago, bef-... and he wanted this fight really bad. And-

Bryan Callen 1:00:49 How thick was he?

Joe Rogan 1:00:50 He was normal size-

Bryan Callen 1:00:51 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:00:51 ... you know? But he did it the right way. He took a long time in between-

Bryan Callen 1:00:55 To build.

Joe Rogan 1:00:55 ... fights. He did a lot of deadlifts and a lot... There's a lot of, like, strength and conditioning videos of him where you see him, like, really working hard-

Bryan Callen 1:01:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:02 ... and really, like, put on quality mass, where he did it slowly over the... You know, he didn't get roided up and then just gained-

Bryan Callen 1:01:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:11 ... a bunch of muscle that's useless. He did it smoothly and slowly, so he kept all of his skills, but now he had more size, and now he had more strength. All skills, all speed, everything was still there, 'cause that's an illusion too. People think you're gonna get slower if you get bigger. That's not real. That's, d- it depends. You're not gonna get... unless you get really crazy, bodybuilder big, like Mr. Olympia big. But Evander Holyfield didn't slow down when he moved up to heavyweight.

Bryan Callen 1:01:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:37 He actually got more fit and picked up his punching power. You know, it's like, you can put on muscle and y- you can get stronger and still be fast, and Terence totally showed that in that fight.

Bryan Callen 1:01:50 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:01:51 That fight was just... That's, uh, that fight was what-

Bryan Callen 1:01:53 Which is why I love boxing.

Joe Rogan 1:01:54 ... what boxing is really all about.

Bryan Callen 1:01:55 Yeah, I love... It's like, boxing is one of the few... It's such an honest place in this crazy world where I don't know where the fuck the truth is. Like, I don't know if you-

Joe Rogan 1:02:02 Until you get the judge's decision.

Bryan Callen 1:02:04 Yeah, well, that's true.

Joe Rogan 1:02:05 That's a problem.

Bryan Callen 1:02:06 That's true. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02:06 That's a problem with MMA too.

Bryan Callen 1:02:07 It is. But that's, that... even that is a little bit, like... I've been pretty good at predicting after the fight, kind of going, "I think this guy won." You know? It used to be-

Joe Rogan 1:02:17 Well, Terence almost got-

Bryan Callen 1:02:18 ... Terence bad.

Joe Rogan 1:02:18 ... fucked in that fight. He was only-

Bryan Callen 1:02:20 Yeah, that's true.

Joe Rogan 1:02:20 If he didn't win the last two rounds, he would have lost that fight.

Bryan Callen 1:02:24 Well, Canelo so loved him, you know?

Joe Rogan 1:02:26 That's not good.

Bryan Callen 1:02:27 No.

Joe Rogan 1:02:28 I mean, in terms of, like, a judge.

Bryan Callen 1:02:30 Right.

Joe Rogan 1:02:30 You, you, you shouldn't be looking at how much someone's loved. You should be looking at... Of course, everybody loves Canelo.

Bryan Callen 1:02:34 I wonder though, I wonder-

Joe Rogan 1:02:35 I love Canelo.

Bryan Callen 1:02:35 But I wonder if the judge-

Joe Rogan 1:02:36 But once he gets into the ring-

Bryan Callen 1:02:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02:38 ... you have to judge him on his performance in the ring, period. That's it.

Bryan Callen 1:02:42 I know, but, you know human beings. You love somebody, you, you already have them in your mind.

Joe Rogan 1:02:45 I know corruption, Brian.

Bryan Callen 1:02:47 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02:47 I know Vegas odds.

Bryan Callen 1:02:49 That's true.

Joe Rogan 1:02:49 I know gambling.

Bryan Callen 1:02:50 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:02:50 There's a lot.

Bryan Callen 1:02:51 There is, huh?

Joe Rogan 1:02:51 There's a lot you have to take into consideration.

Bryan Callen 1:02:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:02:53 A lot of these people live in Vegas. You don't think they know fucking-

Bryan Callen 1:02:59 They know some people.

Joe Rogan 1:02:59 ... degenerate gamblers?

Bryan Callen 1:03:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:01 You don't think they owe money? You don't think maybe something's going on?

Bryan Callen 1:03:04 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:04 Like, a lot of these guys, like, and gals, by the way.

Bryan Callen 1:03:06 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:03:07 They were connected to super shady people back in the day, and decisions were fucked with-

Bryan Callen 1:03:13 Do you remember that fight-

Joe Rogan 1:03:14 ... because of gambling odds.

Bryan Callen 1:03:15 Yeah. What was that one? Bradley? Remember, uh, was it Tim Bradley?

Joe Rogan 1:03:18 Manny Pacquiao. Tim Bradley.

Bryan Callen 1:03:20 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:20 Yeah.

Bryan Callen 1:03:20 Wow.

Joe Rogan 1:03:21 Yeah, that same lady, she also... She, she'd scored a few that were like, "What?" But that was a big one.

Bryan Callen 1:03:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:03:28 That was a big one. But that's also... You have to think of that when you see a g- a big fucking decision like that where it's funky. You gotta go... If I was a gambler... Look, all you have to do is get one person. Say if you're betting on a split decision, you have to get just one person in the bag. You just got one person that scores it the other way no matter what.

Bryan Callen 1:03:48 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:03:49 And you give that person $200 grand, and now you're gonna make $20 million. That's real. Like, people do stuff like that. At least they-

Bryan Callen 1:03:56 Of course.

Joe Rogan 1:03:56 ... have in the past.

Bryan Callen 1:03:57 Of course, they have.

Joe Rogan 1:03:59 Of course, they have.

Bryan Callen 1:03:59 Well, let me ask you this. As you, you know, as... with, with AI and as, as we get better and better at these videos, that you can't tell whether it's real or not. You know, I really wonder-

Joe Rogan 1:04:10 Maybe it's good. Maybe you just stop looking.

Bryan Callen 1:04:12 That's, that's what I was thinking.

Joe Rogan 1:04:13 Because I think half of-

Bryan Callen 1:04:13 That's what I was thinking.

Joe Rogan 1:04:14 ... we're wasting our fucking lives staring at our phones.

Bryan Callen 1:04:15 I was... That's right. And my... mine... That's what my whole special is about. It's called False Gods because that be-... that has become... That is what we're bent over in prayer with. We're always looking at it all the time.

Joe Rogan 1:04:25 Yeah, it's, it's-

Bryan Callen 1:04:25 That, that dopamine scroll.

Joe Rogan 1:04:27 ... a drug.

Bryan Callen 1:04:27 Right? We're just a nation of drug addicts.

Joe Rogan 1:04:29 If there was a drug that made you stare at your hand all day-

Bryan Callen 1:04:31 Fuck, dude.

Joe Rogan 1:04:32 ... you'd, you'd avoid that drug like the plague.

Bryan Callen 1:04:33 That's why... That's literally the theme of what I wrote about, because I was like... I, I'm... I find myself... Like, I, I find myself going, "I'm not gonna look at my phone," and then I get sucked in. And there's fun-

Joe Rogan 1:04:42 Mm-hmm.

Bryan Callen 1:04:42 ... good things to watch, whether it's old interviews, whether it's snippets of this, but it's a highlight reel, man.

Joe Rogan 1:04:47 It's like mining for gold, though, in a really shitty spot.

Bryan Callen 1:04:51 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:04:51 Like, you're not getting a lot of gold.

Bryan Callen 1:04:53 No, you're not.

Joe Rogan 1:04:53 Every now and then you get a little gold flake.

Bryan Callen 1:04:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:04:55 Some funny meme. Ah, ha, ha.

Bryan Callen 1:04:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:04:57 And then I'll send it to all my friends. But I find out the really funny ones, they make it to me anyway.

Bryan Callen 1:05:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:05:02 Like, the... That's what I really want.

Bryan Callen 1:05:04 (laughs) Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:05:04 I really want the funny things. So, the funny things, like funny memes and shit like that, they'll make it to me no matter what.

Bryan Callen 1:05:10 You know what I've done? I was, I was listening to a political podcast. My buddy walked by, said something so cool, 'cause he's done really well in life, and he goes, he goes, "Are you listening to the weather again?" And I was like, "Fuck, man. I am." I'm either listening 'cause I want somebody to confirm my bias, or I'm listening because I w-... maybe want to hear something I kind of already know, or it'll be a different twist that somehow in my mind I can use as an argument against