EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,004 words- 0:00 – 0:02
Intro
- JRJoe Rogan
[upbeat music]
- 0:02 – 3:19
Epstein autopsy document vs. prostatectomy claims: “wrong body” suspicion
- JRJoe Rogan
Joe Rogan Podcast, check it out!
- SPSpeaker
The Joe Rogan Experience.
- JRJoe Rogan
Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night. All day. [upbeat music] Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun. [grunting]
- JBJim Breuer
Good to see you, my friend.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, you too. Young Jamie.
- SPSpeaker
How you doing?
- JRJoe Rogan
So I stopped you.
- SPSpeaker
Yep.
- JRJoe Rogan
We were getting coffee. I said, "Stop! Hold this." So what were you saying?
- SPSpeaker
Um, which one first?
- JRJoe Rogan
The prostate one.
- SPSpeaker
Okay, so the prostate one.
- JRJoe Rogan
Let's go straight to the dick.
- SPSpeaker
All right. Uh-
- JRJoe Rogan
That is not really the dick. It's like it's behind the dick. [chuckles]
- SPSpeaker
So this would be-
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm an anatomist. [chuckles]
- JBJim Breuer
It is behind the dick.
- JRJoe Rogan
Is that a word? [chuckles] Anatomist.
- SPSpeaker
Uh, well, autopsy.
- JRJoe Rogan
So, "Bladder contains approximately five milliliters of cloudy yellow urine."
- SPSpeaker
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
"The prostate is slightly and diffusely enlarged, with marked enlargement of the verumontanum?"
- JBJim Breuer
That's how I would've said it.
- JRJoe Rogan
Uh, "The testes are unremarkable." That's the last thing I want anybody to say about my nuts.
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
I want them to say, "Wow, what a great pair!"
- JBJim Breuer
Great body, but the nuts are-
- JRJoe Rogan
Unremarkable.
- JBJim Breuer
Eh, unremarkable.
- 3:19 – 5:41
Was Epstein ever in jail? Cellmate, “murder investigation,” and intelligence-agency theories
- SPSpeaker
This is from a, uh, attorney, so this is, like, assistant United States attorney or something, uh.
- JRJoe Rogan
So, "The OCME told me-
- SPSpeaker
The request
- JRJoe Rogan
... it signed a confidentiality agreement in connection with the investigation into the murder of Jeffrey Epstein." Where-
- SPSpeaker
So that's, uh, almost, uh, six months after he died, they're asking for a document about the investigation of the murder of Jeffrey Epstein.
- JRJoe Rogan
[lips smack] Was that because there was accusations that it was a murder?
- SPSpeaker
I, I don't know, you know? Don't know.
- JRJoe Rogan
So we talked about this before, that 18 days before he allegedly committed suicide, um, his, uh... He complained that his cellmate tried to kill him, and you know who his cellmate is?
- JBJim Breuer
Who? [chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, you don't know?
- JBJim Breuer
No.
- JRJoe Rogan
Uh, his cell- I'm not Kurt Metzger. "You don't know? Oh, you don't know?"
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
Uh, his, his cellmate was this gigantic cop who was, uh, a murderer. He'd killed four different drug dealers. Yeah, he was a contract killer. This is the, the guy. That's his fucking cellmate. Look at that gorilla.
- JBJim Breuer
That's, that's a silverback.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, dirty cop, murderer, and then they said, "Hmm, most high-profile witness of all time, defen- d- defendant of all time. Let's put him in jail with a murderer," A guy who contract kills, dirty cop. [laughing] And then he says, they... Well, the report was they found him unresponsive with a noose around his neck-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm
- JRJoe Rogan
... or a, an orange jumpsuit turned into a rope around his neck. And then he said that his cellmate tried to kill him.
- JBJim Breuer
My question, in, in, in... Does anyone really believe he was in a jail cell? Because I know if I had the guy that can unravel entire government dynasties and d- take down an entire system, the last thing... But, but dude, he's, he's somewhere about three miles underground with e- maybe a ball in his mouth-
- JRJoe Rogan
[chuckles]
- JBJim Breuer
... with electric rods around. Mm. Mm.
- JRJoe Rogan
Or he's in Israel s- sipping mai tais.
- JBJim Breuer
Correct. Either place, it's like, "Pfft, that video you said, it [exhales] you sent us on a runaround, and we're gonna ask you one more time, or then we're gonna laser off your nipples. I'm telling you right now, we need results."
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, I doubt they're doing that to him.
- JBJim Breuer
So it's... Yeah, he's, he's either in Israel, like you said-
- JRJoe Rogan
'Cause if they, if they had that, they would just get rid of his body. They'd just kill him.
- 5:41 – 9:04
AI/deepfake fog around Epstein-Maxwell narratives (and how it muddies accountability)
- JBJim Breuer
You saw the, you saw the picture of the so-called that was him in Israel?
- JRJoe Rogan
I think that's AI.
- JBJim Breuer
I think it's AI, too. That's the scary thing with AI.
- JRJoe Rogan
I think it even had a little AI watermark on it.
- JBJim Breuer
Mm.
- JRJoe Rogan
The one I saw, at least. But who knows? It could be a real picture that someone put through AI to put a watermark on it so that people would go, "Oh, it's AI."
- JBJim Breuer
... right, you don't know.
- JRJoe Rogan
Did you see the lady that they say looks exactly like Ghislaine Maxwell?
- JBJim Breuer
Yes, yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't think she looks exactly like Ghislaine Maxwell. I think she looks exactly like Ghislaine Maxwell 20 years ago.
- SPSpeaker
It's a deep fake.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's a deep fake?
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, okay.
- SPSpeaker
Sam Tripoli reposted the guy that made it.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, that's crazy.
- SPSpeaker
He made another video, too, that was not as good, where he's, like, looking at Benjamin Netanyahu on the street, and it's not, it's not-
- JRJoe Rogan
I feel like-
- SPSpeaker
Nearly as good
- JRJoe Rogan
... the problem is the aging. She doesn't look aged, she looks younger.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
But I guess that-
- JBJim Breuer
She's pretty, too
- JRJoe Rogan
... that's what happens when you get out of jail. [laughing]
- JBJim Breuer
And you get more attractive.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, you get food, you get sunlight.
- JBJim Breuer
Makeup.
- JRJoe Rogan
A little, a little, uh, exercise.
- JBJim Breuer
Taking some yoga.
- JRJoe Rogan
Um, yeah. Is there any video of him in jail? Is there an- are there any photos of him in jail? I've never thought about that before, but what you're saying is a good point.
- 9:04 – 11:59
Secret storage units, reality-TV fakery, and “distraction culture”
- JRJoe Rogan
Jeffrey Epstein stashed secret files in storage unit across US that may include never-before-seen evidence. Oh.
- SPSpeaker
So this came out yesterday-
- JRJoe Rogan
I-
- SPSpeaker
... that when he got arrested, he supposedly paid for investigators to go round up all of his stuff and put it in various storage units across the country. Like, it's a wild goose chase now.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh. [laughing]
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- SPSpeaker
And, like, there's stuff in there-
- JRJoe Rogan
Whoa
- SPSpeaker
... apparently, maybe no one's ever seen.
- JRJoe Rogan
Boy!
- SPSpeaker
They don't know if they're still being paid for. They don't know if anybody's-
- JRJoe Rogan
Imagine if they found... I mean, you know those storage unit shows?
- SPSpeaker
I know, exactly. [chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
Where they break into those storage unit shows?
- SPSpeaker
I don't understand how this-
- JBJim Breuer
And it happened on the real, on the, the Real Time one.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right? Like, do you imagine-
- JBJim Breuer
'Cause you think they're just getting, like, old baseball cards.
- JRJoe Rogan
I heard those shows are bullshit. My... A friend of mine told me that what they do is they'll stock those shows-
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah
- JRJoe Rogan
... they'll stock those storage units, and then they pretend that they're buying the storage unit that's been abandoned, and then they get in there, and then they find things. But those things were s-
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Fuck you.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah, I don't buy any reality TV.
- JRJoe Rogan
I know, but that's awful.
- JBJim Breuer
Well, it's entertainment.
- JRJoe Rogan
I feel duped.
- JBJim Breuer
Do you really?
- JRJoe Rogan
I do.
- JBJim Breuer
Joe, you really thought one, one that bothers you-
- 11:59 – 17:23
Epstein as fall guy: steroids-era parallels, agents/lawyers, and hidden networks
- JRJoe Rogan
... he gave it to me on my birthday." "Take it off! What's the matter with you?" And now that guy, there's no... This guy-... he's just the, you remember when the steroids came out in baseball?
- JBJim Breuer
Uh-huh.
- JRJoe Rogan
And what'd they do? They were like, "Listen, you gotta take a hit. You gotta take a hit, Mark, Barry Bonds. You guys, you're gonna go out, we're gonna front you, but don't worry, you're gonna stay in baseball, and we'll let it- it'll go away in about 10 years." But the owners are not gonna get popped. The people making the st- the, the steroids, injected, the people aren't gonna get popped.
- JBJim Breuer
They got popped. BALCO got popped.
- JRJoe Rogan
It doesn't even... Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
No, they got popped-
- JRJoe Rogan
The little guys get popped
- JBJim Breuer
... and went to jail.
- JRJoe Rogan
No, no, no.
- JBJim Breuer
The little ones.
- JRJoe Rogan
No, no, no, the head of BALCO went to jail. I had him on the podcast after he got out of jail.
- JBJim Breuer
What about the owners that knew what was go- what about the agents and lawyers that are supplying their stuff?
- JRJoe Rogan
No, no, no. Listen, the, you don't understand about the baseball thing. The BALCO had developed a st- Victor Conte, who had been on the podcast before-
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah
- JRJoe Rogan
... was a scientist, essentially, and he had developed a steroid that was undetectable. Because steroids, they detect them based on certain molecules, and if you adjust certain molecules, it doesn't show up in the test. So he developed this thing called the Clear. He called it the Clear because it evaded tests.
- JBJim Breuer
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
This is to evade the test that the Major League Baseball Association was doing, and any, any drug tests, 'cause this was an un- unknown steroid. So this was not known by the organizations, it was not known by the teams, it was not known by anybody. People suspected it, 'cause Barry Bonds threw- grew five hat sizes and gained 50 fucking pounds of solid muscle. [chuckles]
- JBJim Breuer
They all did, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
People suspected it.
- JBJim Breuer
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
But the bottom line is, you don't know what you don't know, and they didn't know. There's no reason to tell them, "Hey, guys, we're, we're giving Barry some secret steroids." He did this for his own personal gain, 'cause he was brought to the attention of this Victor Conte guy, who eventually became an anti-doping guy, which is really weird. He ran SNAC, which is this thing that, like, helps people, like, uh, detect testing and, and-
- JBJim Breuer
Sure
- JRJoe Rogan
... use it, you know, use supplements that are legal.
- JBJim Breuer
Sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
But that, I don't think that was known by everybody. I think they kept it all on the DL because there was such a blight that was attached to steroid use. You were a cheater, especially in baseball, which is, like, the American pastime, be a cheater in baseball?
- JBJim Breuer
Well, I'll tell you this. Um, I remember at that time, uh, because t- I was in the... You were in TV world, TV world, and you attract all different types.
- JRJoe Rogan
Dude, we did a show... Well, you weren't on the show back then, ba- on Hardball.
- JBJim Breuer
The baseball, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Barry Bonds was on Hardball.
- JBJim Breuer
[exhales]
- 17:23 – 25:40
The blunt email: “children for sex sent to his island”—and skepticism about the jail narrative
- JRJoe Rogan
Did you see that one, the email that I sent you, Jamie, where he's talking about children for sex?
- JBJim Breuer
[exhales]
- JRJoe Rogan
Do you remember? You know the email I, I sent you, Jamie?
- JBJim Breuer
Uh...
- JRJoe Rogan
I sent it the other day. I was like, "Well, that pretty much sums it up then," because he actually said it.
- JBJim Breuer
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Find that. I sent it to you in a text message.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
This one's crazy. This one's crazy.
- JBJim Breuer
I've heard some bad ones.
- JRJoe Rogan
So he's having a conversation with a woman who says that she heard that there's a place... Here it is.
- JBJim Breuer
[chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
She's very emotional, kind, loving, sharp. Uh, I think you could become friends, too. So here it says, "A friend, Elisa, told me about a project she's doing, researching a really bad guy that gets children for sex sent to his island. She almost fainted when I told her that person is me."
- JBJim Breuer
Wow!
- JRJoe Rogan
... like- [exhales] Yeah What? Okay, so that's just there. There's no way to interpret that any other way. But- That person is me. That person is me. I am the one- Children for sex, sent to his island. That person is me. Holy shit! So- That, that one is fucking crazy. That's 2018. [exhales] So yeah, this has been going on for- So this is, like, right before he got arrested, right? Supposedly. But when did he get arrested?
- SPSpeaker
2019.
- JRJoe Rogan
2019, right. What, one month?
- SPSpeaker
Yeah. I don't know. I think, I feel like it was May, maybe. June.
- JRJoe Rogan
So this was like... But there was an investigative reporter that was at the head of all this, this lady that was, uh, really pushing, because she had found out about his sweetheart deal in 2008, and she started gathering information and pushing it, and that's what led, ultimately, I think, to his being arrested. Or what I would say is the front of like, "Hey, we're doing things." Well, if there's a different body that the autopsy had, it makes you question, like, was he ever in that cell, or was this person who's in that cell, did they sell this person as Jeffrey Epstein? Right. Well, you imagine the guy in the cell going, "I am not Jeffrey Epstein." [laughs] "No, no! I'm not- "I am not." "No, no, no." "My name is Harvey." [laughs] "I live on the Upper East Side. I don't know what happened. I got a speeding ticket, and now, next thing you know, I can't go home." Yes, and this poor guy's just getting railed hard- [laughs] ... before. Just sitting there, and he's tying him up on the thing, and he's just... Yeah, you're gonna spin him around for a couple hours. This episode is brought to you by Visible. Folks, there's one thing nobody wants this season, and that's getting catfished. And it's not just dating profiles that are putting you at risk, it's also big wireless carriers. You know the type: looks great at first, promises a low price, but once you're locked in, surprise fees and an expensive bill that isn't what you were expecting. Your knight in shining armor? Visible Wireless. It's one line wireless with unlimited data and hotspot for just $25 a month, taxes and fees included. Now, that's a green flag. The best part, Visible is all digital, so you can switch as fast as you can swipe. Don't fall for the trap of getting catfished by Wireless. Visit visible.com to learn more and start loving your wireless carrier. Terms apply. See visible.com for plan features and network management details. This is- Is there any photos- ... horror show ... of Jeffrey Epstein, like, in... That are, that are... Well, here's the thing: are they real? In a jumpsuit, like- Well, I think- In court, in jail, getting arrested? Is-
- SPSpeaker
I know there's... I was trying to- I'm looking for one.
- JRJoe Rogan
When you arrest big figures, he was a big figure- It- ... it's a big to-do. Ch-ch-ch-ch. Yeah, psht, psht. She's like- Yeah ... "Jeffrey, what'd you do?" Right. "What about the children?" "Care to comment on the children?" "What are you doing with the children, Jeffrey?" "Why did you need 330 gallons of sulfuric acid?" [chuckles]
- SPSpeaker
They didn't know about that back then.
- JRJoe Rogan
"What are chickens? What are chickens?" Like, uh, oh, God, uh, I- What is jerky? What is jerky? Well, no one knew any of that stuff back then. If he was alive now, for sure those questions would be shouted out. What is pizza and pasta? What happened at Obama's White House? [exhales] It was- What is pizza? Pizza's mentioned, like, 900 times. It's a little weird. Clearly as a code. Clearly as a code. You know how crazy I felt for the longest time? Like, I'd just be in a coffee shop, and I'm like, "You guys don't... You guys- I know ... you just don't know," they're like, "Oh, yeah, Jim's a little wacky." But now it's, it's coming out. Did you see that video we played the other day of this guy at the airport just yelling out- Yes! "You guys are going about your business." Is that Jake? Uh, no, it's a guy. He's like, "The files have been released." Yeah, I saw that. And they were, they were going, "And you're all just going about your business." Yeah. "The files are released. Kids are being tortured!" Which- But my question's like, "What do you want me to do?" What do you- I'm flying to Atlanta. What do you want me to do? [laughs] I got a gig. That is- What do you want me to do? Scream and yell at everybody, get arrested? What... How is that gonna fix anything? This all happened 10 years ago. What do you want me to do? And what do you, what do you do at this point? Because, like, it's, uh- Well, you don't do anything at the airport. You know, you get on your fucking plane. At the airport, right. Yeah. "I gotta get home. My wife's m- my wife's mother..." But that's like a lot of people online. They're very performative, screaming and yelling, "We've got to do this. We've got to do..." Like, what do you want, what do you, what do you want us to do? That's their jurisdiction. Yeah. I l- I l- It's outrage farming. Outrage farming- Yeah ... I like that. Yeah, you're an outrage farmer. Imagine going to that length, though. He's just like: "You know what? I really didn't like anything you said, and, uh, you have no right being..." Like, wh- who's taking the time? Losers. He... Have you seen that? Well, it's either people- no, but it's people that are trying to farm for attention. They're trying to get extra attention, or it's people that just aren't that good. They're not that smart. Have you... When, when's the last time you engaged with anyone online that was like, "Rogan, you're a this or you're a this?" Oh, it's been a long time. Long time, right? I don't know. Yeah. Long time. But up until that, up until that time- Bro, I watch fucking Luis J. Gomez do it every day. I'm like, "Luis, what are you doing? What are you doing, you psycho? Stop fucking arguing with people online and calling them losers." [laughs] [chuckles] Yeah, no. And comparing your life to theirs. Like, don't do it. It's not- 'Cause you- ... it's not smart ... you don't know what you're dealing with. Yeah. You have no clue what you're dealing with. Not only that, it's like it's a bad frequency to get your brain caught up in. There's so many other things to think about. Correct. There's so much going on in the world. There's so many interesting things in life. And the problem with social media algorithms, and any kind of algorithm that you get sucked into, is it, it funnels you into this way... Uh, this is what the information that you're getting most of the time. You're getting a lot of bad information, a lot of outrage farming.... and your frequencies, like the way your brain thinks, funnels down that pathway, and you kind of lose control of it, instead of having access to all the wonderful things in the world. There's a lot of amazing, fascinating, curiosity-driven people out there that are, you know, making videos about all kinds of stuff.
- JBJim Breuer
[chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
And you could instead pay attention to that stuff.
- JBJim Breuer
Well, that's-
- JRJoe Rogan
But yeah-
- JBJim Breuer
You get trapped. I used to say that even just about news. I remember being a kid, and if you look at every newspaper, and you just watch all the headlines for the news, everything is... It- I would sit there and go, "Okay, something bad happened down here in Brooklyn, something ba- Why, why do you spend every page or every headline as something negative? You had eight to 10 million people living in this vicinity. Why do you harp on just propagandizing and looking at the dark?"
- JRJoe Rogan
Because they're trying to make money.
- JBJim Breuer
And the, I don't-
- 25:40 – 27:24
A “detention video” and the “pre-production” hypothesis
- JRJoe Rogan
What is this?
- SPSpeaker
They say this video is him... He sent this to two women.
- JBJim Breuer
I see it's covered message.
- JRJoe Rogan
From detention?
- SPSpeaker
From-
- JBJim Breuer
From detention.
- SPSpeaker
From prison.
- JRJoe Rogan
All right, let's see.
- SPSpeaker
It's very... It's weird.
- JBJim Breuer
The wall. I had to borrow the Scotch tape to get the pictures on the wall. Okay, so Darren is-
- JRJoe Rogan
Why do I have s- why do you have to see that thing over his face?
- SPSpeaker
I don't know.
- JBJim Breuer
Pretend I'm talking to Darren. So, hi, Darren. [beep] Are you guys having a good time? You can see I have a little sore on my face that I got from some black guy trying to kiss me. It's really disgusting.
- SPSpeaker
Look at his thumb.
- JBJim Breuer
Oh, it's really... Oh. Anyway, I have pictures up on the wall. I had to borrow the Scotch tape to get the pictures on the wall. I, I'll talk to you guys later. Bye.
- JRJoe Rogan
What?
- JBJim Breuer
Okay, so that's him in detention. He said somebody tried to kiss him.
- JRJoe Rogan
I- [scoffs]
- JBJim Breuer
He seems pretty calm when he almost got raped.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's pre- dude, it's pre- [scoffs] it's pre-production. All right, so listen, [clears throat] just remember-
- JBJim Breuer
Come in the room and say that somebody tried to kiss you.
- JRJoe Rogan
You sh- you c- you gotta be into it. Like, that's take number 12.
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, "God damn it, Jeffrey. God damn it!"
- JBJim Breuer
Oh!
- JRJoe Rogan
Do you need a Coke? You need a wine?
- JBJim Breuer
You don't even seem stressed out.
- JRJoe Rogan
I need you more straight to this. Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
You don't seem like a guy in jail-
- JRJoe Rogan
So-
- 27:24 – 33:24
“Tall Biden,” masks/stand-ins, and where conspiracy meets modern media
- JBJim Breuer
From the beginning of time. Well, especially with, like, modern stuff, because you can... With, with modern masks... Like, remember the tall Biden?
- JRJoe Rogan
Like-
- JBJim Breuer
There's not a chance in hell that was Biden.
- JRJoe Rogan
I, I feel so redeemed. My wife used to get so mad at me-
- JBJim Breuer
[chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
... so mad at me. My kids would get so mad at me.
- JBJim Breuer
Ah!
- JRJoe Rogan
And I would, I would say it everywhere. I'd say it on stage, I'd say it on social media. I'd go, "I don't care what you say, that is not Joe Biden."
- JBJim Breuer
You know, there was also that in the files, too. They were talking about the masks.
- JRJoe Rogan
Call me crazy! And now all of a sudden, they're like, "Oh, no, he was, he was executed." Isn't that what they said?
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Executed?
- JBJim Breuer
Uh, that seems sus.
- JRJoe Rogan
Bro-
- JBJim Breuer
I went down that rabbit hole.
- JRJoe Rogan
There's a lot of those e- emails are just emails, right? Are you... H- first of all, Epstein's dealing with prostitutes, people that are willing to get prostitutes. He's dealing with a lot of criminals and weirdos, and a lot of those people are probably full of shit, right? So just because somebody writes something in an email-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm-hmm
- JRJoe Rogan
... doesn't mean it's a fact. However-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm
- JRJoe Rogan
... when you see the video of tall Biden, pull out, pull out tall Biden.
- JBJim Breuer
Come on, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
Tall... He grew.
- JBJim Breuer
Oh, oh-
- JRJoe Rogan
He grew, and then he went back.
- JBJim Breuer
He-
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, they, they might have put him on some shit, and then he shrunk back down again. [chuckles] Like-
- JBJim Breuer
And, and his eye color would change.
- SPSpeaker
It's this one, right? Like, uh-
- JRJoe Rogan
The, the... Yes, that one.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- 33:24 – 35:14
Robotics advances: martial-arts bots, robot dogs, and militarized futures
- JRJoe Rogan
I just... Jamie, I'm gonna send you something. This is state-of-the-art right now when it comes to, uh, robots, and it's pretty fucking good, man. Pretty fucking good. But it's not that. Um, it's... These are robots that can actually do martial arts. It's very impressive.
- JBJim Breuer
I feel like I just saw something like this. It was frightening-
- JRJoe Rogan
It's from China
- JBJim Breuer
... to a degree.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, it's from China. So go full screen on this. This is really interesting. So you got these kids, they get out there, and, um, these robots do martial arts with them. Like, look at this. It's really wild, man. I mean, it's pretty human-
- JBJim Breuer
Now-
- JRJoe Rogan
... those movements
- JBJim Breuer
... if they had suit and ties on, they can pass for president.
- JRJoe Rogan
Eh, not yet. [laughing]
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
Not yet. But look at these things. They can do backflips. Like, this is crazy. They do wheel kicks.
- JBJim Breuer
Come on.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's really nuts, man. So just imagine these things with fucking ARs just running into buildings, gunning people down, 'cause that's what's coming.
- JBJim Breuer
Bro, there's a place-
- JRJoe Rogan
They're gonna be bulletproof. They're gonna have night vision, heat vision, insane hearing.
- JBJim Breuer
There's a place in Florida, bro, that had the, uh, out in the Everglades, and it's like this, this farmland, and you never see anyone there, but they have the, the mechanical-
- JRJoe Rogan
The robot dogs
- JBJim Breuer
... robot dogs-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah
- JBJim Breuer
... patrolling everywhere and spraying the fields. It-
- JRJoe Rogan
The dogs spray the fields?
- JBJim Breuer
The, there's, like, all different types of machines that come up, and that will, like, spray the field, and they, they have these... The dogs that patrol everywhere. It's wild!
- JRJoe Rogan
You can buy one of them now.
- JBJim Breuer
I never saw any of that.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
You can buy them now?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, you can buy those robots. Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
I think, I think I want one.
- JRJoe Rogan
Les was telling me about it.
- JBJim Breuer
I think I want one.
- 35:14 – 46:46
Rogan’s early path: stand-up beginnings, fast TV breaks, and avoiding Hollywood’s “velvet prison”
- JBJim Breuer
You're like, you're like the movie The Fifth Element, when the chick, when the chick came, and she got all the information. Like, who's... I'm always fascinated. You have so much information, like, brilliant insight, information. Who's left on, on your list, where you're like, "I gotta... I wanna look at, I need to speak with so-and-so?"
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, there's a ton of people. There's always new, uh... You know, like, I get a list of, uh, every week, multiple days a week, I get a list of potential guests, and so I go over the list, and, uh, a lot of it are scientists. A lot of it is, like, people that are doing groundbreaking research on, like, neural development, genetics. [sighs] There's a lot of them that come up that are cosmologists, uh, that are working on, you know, just bizarre theories. It's, it's so- the- there's always someone that's working on some, you know, like, very high level of some esoteric line of, d- you know, some kind of discipline that I've got very little information about. There's always interesting people. Sh-
- JBJim Breuer
... That blows my mind!
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
Just blows my mind. I tried talking to anyone, even some of the words, I'm not educated very well. I'm the- they start saying certain words, and I'm just, I'm already-
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm not formally educated very well.
- JBJim Breuer
I'm like, "Oh, no."
- JRJoe Rogan
I mean, I only went to college for three years, and I was barely paying attention.
- JBJim Breuer
I never paid attention. I don't care.
- JRJoe Rogan
I was only going to college so that people didn't think I was a loser. Was, I was doing it-
- JBJim Breuer
Really?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, I was doing it whilst fighting, and then I was doing it for a little bit while still doing stand-up, but I was only doing it so that no one thought I was a loser.
- JBJim Breuer
Really?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
Is that more of a... Was that, like, a home thing? Like, mom and dad-
- JRJoe Rogan
No, it was where I grew up. [sighs] You know, a lot- everybody was going to college. I w- I went to school at a, a really good high school, Newton South in Massachusetts, and a lot of the kids were, you know, real ambitious and wanted to go to college and get degrees, and I was... I did not want to have a job. I was like, "What am I doing?" I, I was, like, very feral, and at the time, all I wanted to do was compete. I was just doing martial arts tournaments the whole time, and I, uh, there was no money in that, you know? So I was like, "What am I- what's my career going to be? Like, what am I doing?"
- JBJim Breuer
Huh.
- JRJoe Rogan
So this weird period, so I said, "Let me just go to college so that no one thinks I'm a loser." So I took a year off school. So from s- uh, graduated at 17, so for the next year, I didn't, I didn't go to school at all. I just trained.
- JBJim Breuer
I don't know the story. So when did you, when did you go, "I'm gonna start doing stand-up?"
- JRJoe Rogan
When I was 21.
- JBJim Breuer
Wow!
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
And what, w- and you, did you have that desire before then?
- JRJoe Rogan
Not really. No, I was a fan of stand-up. I love stand-up. I was talked into doing it by my friend Steve. He's a good buddy of mine, Steve Graham. 'Cause I would make people laugh in the locker room. It was like, he was a guy I did taekwondo with-
- JBJim Breuer
And he's like, "Dude, you should go on stage and try this."
- JRJoe Rogan
And another good friend, Ed Shorter, same thing. Ed and Steve were two guys who I was real tight with that, you know, I would make fun of everybody, and just... We were always just joking around.
- JBJim Breuer
Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
And I, uh, wanted a lot of attention. I was young, [chuckles] you know?
- JBJim Breuer
We all did.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- 46:46 – 53:21
Money, freedom, and Fear Factor: choosing “fuck you money” without selling your soul
- JRJoe Rogan
Money equals freedom, and that's what people need to understand. Like, if you can make a pile of money, you get 'fuck you' money.
- JBJim Breuer
Ooh.
- JRJoe Rogan
And then the key is, don't be chasing 'fuck your mother' and 'fuck your family' and-
- JBJim Breuer
Correct
- JRJoe Rogan
... 'fuck the world' money.
- JBJim Breuer
Correct.
- JRJoe Rogan
Stick with 'fuck you' money. [laughing]
- JBJim Breuer
Fuck you. [laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
But just make sure you say, "Fuck you."
- JBJim Breuer
Correct.
- JRJoe Rogan
So make sure you don't do things you don't wanna do. And so when Fear Factor came along, I initially took it 'cause I thought it was gonna be canceled immediately. I was like... It was... I was in a development deal with NBC-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm
- JRJoe Rogan
... and they, they sent me this thing, and I was like, "What the fuck is this? They're gonna sic dogs on people." Like, I was laughing.
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm pretty sure I was stoned when I first got the pitch.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And I read it, I go, "This is hilarious." And I don't know if my manager even wanted me to do it. I don't remember. I think they probably wanted me to hold out for a sitcom, and I was like, "Are you fucking kidding me? This is hilarious."
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
"Let me meet with them."
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And they didn't like me at first because I came in and was making fun of it, and they thought it should be scary 'cause this was Fear Factor.
- JBJim Breuer
[chuckles] Right.
- JRJoe Rogan
And I was just joking. Uh, like, I came into the, the meeting, I was probably stoned.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
I came into the meeting, and I was just-
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
... cracking jokes about everything and laughing, and they didn't... But then David Hurwitz, who's a friend of mine, who was one of the producers on the show, he's like, "No, no, no, no, look, the whole world's gonna be laughing at us."
- JBJim Breuer
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
"It's way better if the host is laughing."
- JBJim Breuer
Yes.
- 53:21 – 1:04:46
Comedy community dynamics: bombs, hard-to-follow openers, and territorial club culture
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, you, you inspired me, too, dude. 'Cause when we first started working together, the... One of the worst times I ever bombed, ever, was, uh, I was headlining when I really shouldn't have been headlining. I really didn't have an hour, and you and I did a weekend together at somewhere like West Nyack, New York, or something like that.
- JBJim Breuer
Somewhere, somewhere yucky, like a Holiday Inn thing. [chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
That was pretty gross. But, uh-
- JBJim Breuer
[chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
... I did okay every show except the late show Saturday night. You fucking murdered.
- JBJim Breuer
I do. [laughs]
- JRJoe Rogan
You murdered, and I remember being so nervous. I was so nervous, and I went on stage nervous, and I just ate a dick. And I remember it was, like, one of the worst bombings I've ever had in my life, and I remember thinking at the time, "Boy, I gotta correct something. I... First of all, I can never go on stage that nervous again." I was like, "What was wrong?" What was wrong was instead of laughing at you and going on stage having a good time-
- JBJim Breuer
Hmm
- JRJoe Rogan
... I was nervous about my own performance, which is, like, a self-defeating mentality.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah, I-
- JRJoe Rogan
And I had to realize that, which is also one of the reasons, like... And really, I, my, my stand-up bumped up a lot after that weekend. It really did, 'cause I really worked on it hard, 'cause the, the bombing was bad.
- JBJim Breuer
The bombing was bad.
- JRJoe Rogan
It was a... But this was a bad one. I was supposed to do 45. I bailed at 35.
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing]
- JRJoe Rogan
I got in trouble.... [laughing] I was eating dick. Dude, I was eating dick. It was horrible. But, um, the same thing happened when I would take Joey on the road with me.
- JBJim Breuer
Mm.
- JRJoe Rogan
And the reason why I would take Joey on the road with me is 'cause he was so hard to follow. So I said, "Okay..." I thought of it just like training partners.
- JBJim Breuer
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, you don't wanna spar with a guy who sucks. You wanna s- spar with a guy who's better than you-
- JBJim Breuer
Right
- JRJoe Rogan
... so that you can g- you could get to his level.
- JBJim Breuer
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
And so tr- with Joey, Joey was so loose, and so free, and he was so silly, and I was more rigid, and I tried to do more setup punchline stuff, but I was, you know, I was only, whatever, eight, nine years in, whatever it was. I was still trying to, like, figure it out, and Joey had a rhythm to him. He's just so loose, and I'm like, "This is gonna help me. Let me just take this guy on the road with me."
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
First of all, he's the best guy to hang out with. He's so much fun.
- JBJim Breuer
He seems like... I never-
- JRJoe Rogan
I love him to death.
- JBJim Breuer
I never got to hang out with him. I only get to watch him.
- JRJoe Rogan
You never hung out with Joey?
- JBJim Breuer
No, I've only got to see him on here-
- 1:04:46 – 1:20:20
Reconciling with Marc Maron, jealousy as fuel, and the Mencia fallout (plus comedy ethics)
- JRJoe Rogan
So here's an interesting-
- JBJim Breuer
Whatever
- JRJoe Rogan
... thing. I, I should tell you 'cause you'll really... You, you know this person.
- JBJim Breuer
Okay.
- JRJoe Rogan
Um, I actually, uh, made up with, uh, Marc Maron the other day.
- JBJim Breuer
Interesting.
- JRJoe Rogan
We actually had a... I had to help him with something. Um, I had to inform him about something.
- JBJim Breuer
Mm.
- JRJoe Rogan
And he sent me a very sincere message of thank you, and then I sent him a message back-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm
- JRJoe Rogan
... that was sincere, and I said, "Look, I'm not your enemy. I'm sure if we... Sorry, d- despite our differences-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm.
- JRJoe Rogan
... I'm sure if we saw each other, within a few minutes, we'd be laughing and smiling."
- JBJim Breuer
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
Which is generally how I interacted with him, for the most part.
- JBJim Breuer
Mm.
- JRJoe Rogan
I had only a few bad interactions with him, and he was pretty honest about how, you know, maybe it's his own mind, and I know- [clears throat] It was... But it was a, it was a very sincere-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm
- JRJoe Rogan
... interaction, which made me happy. It's not good to have enemies, man.
- JBJim Breuer
No, it's really not.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's not good.
- JBJim Breuer
I, I've had maybe two or three, um, that have vocally put out on s- 'cause I, I'm not into the Twitter insulting or going on other programs insulting. If you have an issue, tell me-
- JRJoe Rogan
Right
- JBJim Breuer
... and then we'll, we'll deal with it the way-
- JRJoe Rogan
Right, call me up
- JBJim Breuer
... real, the real humans do it.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
And, um, [clears throat] when, when that, that, that whole thing... I, I have a funny feeling I know what some of his issues were, but I felt... And, and, and I put it out there, I felt, I felt bad because for years, I didn't have great interact... When I started, listen, I'm not poo-pooing or whatever, but yeah, a lot of guys didn't like me. They were like: "Who's this animated, loudmouth kid coming in here, confident, and blah, blah?" And he, he would always kind of like... I'll never forget, he'd be like, "You gonna woo him? You gonna woo him tonight with your-
- JRJoe Rogan
He was trying to sabotage you.
- JBJim Breuer
Without a doubt.
- 1:20:20 – 1:46:01
Eddie Murphy as the catalyst: Breuer’s commitment moment and family pushback
- JBJim Breuer
He's the first guy I saw. Chris was the very first person I saw. I won a lottery to do open mic at the Comic Strip, and I, I'm gonna say I was 19, maybe 19, 20. I didn't know what that was. And- [laughing] ... and I show up at the Comic Strip, and I see Eddie Murphy on there. I'm like, "Oh, my God, this is where..." 'Cause I had that Eddie Murphy album, where he had, like, a little flower.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yes!
- JBJim Breuer
It was from the Comic Strip, and he had a little... Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
He, he did that at the Comic Strip?
- JBJim Breuer
Uh, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Really?
- JBJim Breuer
He did- Yes, it was at the Comic Strip, and he d-
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, shit.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah, he did live in the Comic Strip. He's like... It was a-
- JRJoe Rogan
That's a great special
- JBJim Breuer
... great special, great album.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, it's a, uh, I bought it on cassette. That's how old it is.
- JBJim Breuer
I bought it as an album!
- JRJoe Rogan
Bro, how did he stop doing st- there it is.
- JBJim Breuer
Oh, my God.
- JRJoe Rogan
How did he stop doing stand-up? He was, 1982. He was so good.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah, so I was only-
- JRJoe Rogan
He was a sophomore in high school-
- JBJim Breuer
Yes!
- JRJoe Rogan
... back then.
- JBJim Breuer
Me, too.
- JRJoe Rogan
I did it.
- JBJim Breuer
Were you '58?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah, we graduated the same time. Look, the Comic Strip.
- JRJoe Rogan
He was so good. When you see him... Did you see him do that, uh, he got a, one of those Mark Twain Awards, I believe it was?
- JBJim Breuer
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
And he went and did a set?
- JBJim Breuer
Yes.
- JRJoe Rogan
And he went and did an impression of Bill Cosby getting his, uh, awards r- taken away from him?
- 1:46:01 – 2:04:42
Old road stories and modern danger: Cancun chaos then vs cartel violence now
- JBJim Breuer
Who is, who is the guy from the, uh, the, uh, radio? I hope I'm not going to Rogers. The radio, there's a radio guy. He was taller. He was married to, like, an Israeli chick, or-
- JRJoe Rogan
Jon Tobin.
- JBJim Breuer
Yes!
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
I still s- that was one of the greatest, most hilarious adventures of my lifetime, was, was Tobin and I. [chuckles] We he, he- we had a gig, and it was horrifying. It was like, "Coconuts, we're gonna send you down to, uh, we're gonna send you down to s- Cancun spring break." Right?
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, God.
- JBJim Breuer
Oh, yeah. And now I'm, I'm young. And I'm like, "Oh, my..." I'm not even married yet. I-
- JRJoe Rogan
You went to Cancun?
- JBJim Breuer
Yes, and it's spring break. I'm like, "Oh, my God!" This-
- JRJoe Rogan
What year was this?
- JBJim Breuer
Um, okay, so I got married in '93. I'm gonna say 1992. 1992, and I think I'm making 500 bucks for two weeks. You have to work every single night.
- JRJoe Rogan
[laughing]
- JBJim Breuer
Right? [laughing] So wait a minute. So I'm... Which... So I'm- I don't know who the other comedian is, right?
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JBJim Breuer
And so as we g- I land in Cancun, and right away, the bells, and the whistle, and have a tequila shot. I'm like... I'm young, I'm like, "This is great." Tobin is probably 10, 15 years older?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
'Cause he's m- I wanted to say he was in his f- young 40s. I could be wrong. So as we're driving down to Cancun, and we're getting wasted on the bus, like, "Ah, who wants another shot?" "I want another shot!" It was the greatest gig ever. So we pass all the, the spring break hotels, and there's no one left on the bus. There's nobody left on the bus, except for some guy who's, like, in his 40s, right? And I go walking up the bus to him. I'm like, "Hey, uh, where's, where's, uh, you know, La, La Traves?" And he's going, "Da, da, da, down." "What? I don't understand what he's saying." And d- this guy goes, "He said it's downtown." I went, "Oh!" Uh, I, I go, "Uh, what do you... What, what is your name?" "Uh, it's John." I go, "I'm a comedian." He's like, "Yeah, I'm the other fucking comedian, and they have us fucking downtown! They don't have some fucking thing." I s- I-
- JRJoe Rogan
Why is he mad at you?
- JBJim Breuer
I said, "It's okay. It's-"
- JRJoe Rogan
Are you sure? That doesn't sound like John.
- JBJim Breuer
No, no, no, no, [chuckles] dude, it was John. This is really funny. So they put us downtown, right? Me and Tobin. And we, me and John have talked to him this multiple times, said, "One day, we gotta write this as the funniest adventure ever." We had to take... First of all, we check in the hotel, and the guy's like, "Yeah, you d- I don't know if the other guy's still in there." Went, "What? What other guy?" They're like, "The three of you in one room." "What, three of us in a room? W- what are you talking about?" John's losing his shit. He's arguing with his... Well, he's like, "I'm married to an Israeli chick, and hey, fuck it." And all they do is yell at each other. He goes, "They fucking, fucking yell at each other." So now we go to our room, and there's, there's someone in our room. It's like, uh... And he goes, "Yeah, I haven't been paid yet. Been stuck here for, like, a month." I'm like, "Oh-"
- JRJoe Rogan
What?
- JBJim Breuer
Oh, yeah, so I slept on the floor.
- JRJoe Rogan
No.
- JBJim Breuer
All my life, all my life. A- ask Tobin this, right? So I'm on the floor. The first night, [laughing] I wake, I wake up, and Tobin's, like, yelling over there. He's like, "If you keep snoring, I'm gonna lose my shit!" Right? So by the end of the week, we're not getting paid. All the gigs are getting canceled. All I remember is it ended, like, six days later. I had to go get wa- money transferred, 'cause now we're partying. We're just like, "Screw it. Let's go find weed, tequila." We went on an adventure with this poor bastard got thrown out of a car. We were going to buy tequila right outside, and the guy got thrown out of the car-... and we're like, "What's going on?" Now, we're all wasted, and we go up, and the guy's going in his pockets and taking his money. And we go, "Hey, what's going on there?" And he's like, "You know, man," they're talking in Spanish again. John knew Spanish a little bit, and so he takes off, and we're, we're like, we're taking care of this guy. Like, "What's your name?" He's like, "Juan!" And to this day, this is why I know in Spanish, my name is Jaime, because we lifted him up, and he's like, "Oh, amigo, amigo, what, what your name?" I said, "James." "Jaime." "Yeah, yeah, Jaime. Amigo. John." "Juan." [laughing] This, this night lasted till 6:00 a.m. in the morning, and it was one of the greatest ventures in our entire lifetime. To this day, I have to get Tobin, 'cause he's got even greater details as the night goes on. It was probably the greatest r- It ended that night, or that morning, about 7:00 a.m., to John with a, with a golf club, smashing the drapes, 'cause he's like, "I said I'm gonna lose it if you don't stop snoring!" [laughing] And he's smashing the thing, and some other- the, the University of Wisconsin was staying there. There was some other mess going on. All I remember is I woke up, I went right to the airport, I booked a hotel, and I went home, and I haven't seen John since, but I remember [laughing] you knew him.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
You were his buddy.
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, John and I-
- 2:04:42 – 2:16:28
What makes people happy: Africa, Belize villages, Taiga trappers, and “ant stitches”
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, well, when you find out that the rest of the world, like, the whole world, when you look at... You know, people love to use that term, the one percenters. You know what the 1% for the whole world is? Top 1%? $34,000. $34,000 a year puts you in the 1% of the world.
- JBJim Breuer
What?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yes. That's how distorted our version of, like, wealth, and middle class, and prosperity... Like, this is the beauty of, like, a, a functioning capitalism United States-
- JBJim Breuer
Mm
- JRJoe Rogan
... is that you do so well, that you start talking about inequality. You don't realize that even the inequality that you have in America is the dream of someone who lives in a third-world country.
- JBJim Breuer
I go... I love going to... I go to Tanzania, I go to Kenya. Last year, I went six weeks in Africa. I love going in the middle of nowhere and just seeing literally people with nothing, and they're still-
- JRJoe Rogan
Happy
- JBJim Breuer
... Not only are they still happy, they just, they have the whole life system down. They understand everything operates for a reason. Everything operates for a reason. I remember this one guy, he was telling me, like, the giraffes were walking along, right? And he's like: "Oh, that tree, that tree's gonna communicate with that tree, and the roots, by t- talking to the roots, and then the roots are gonna send up a system, and you're gonna notice the giraffe's gonna walk to it and immediately walk to the next one, 'cause they already sent, put out the..." I'm like, "What? What? What, like, how do you even know?" 'Cause this is what they live in.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
And then even, I would talk with the, um, locals, and I'd be like, "How..." Like, in a village-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah
- JBJim Breuer
... there's no paved roads, and they'd-- I'd go, "How does... If something goes down here, like, let's say this guy's a jerk, and he gets way, does something nasty, there's no courts, there's no, there's no laws, there's no police." They do everything themselves. They go, "Well, then the wisest, or the elders get together, and they go, 'Let's confront so-and-so.' And we go to the house, and we go, 'Hey, man, what's, what's going on here? You need to come out.' Like, you ste- everyone said they stole. They watched you steal, and there it is." And then they'll bring him out into, into the entire village and say, "Well, everyone, everyone know, little Johnny here kind of li- I don't know what's going on. Is it your family? You losing... It's some kind of thing going on at home? Whatever we could do, we want to help you and make sure this never happens again, but everyone needs to know, you now, y- you gotta be careful, and so we all got our eye on you." And it just, it, it blows my mind, the simplicity of that. And I feel like we had that as little children hanging out in the street, and everyone kind of looking at each other. And I always wondered if we ever were gonna go back to that somehow, where-
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, you really can't if you have a job, and you commute, and you-
- JBJim Breuer
It's, it's gotten so complicated since then
- JRJoe Rogan
... have a phone with social media on it, and you have to answer emails. You're not going back to that.
- JBJim Breuer
No, it's so complicated. And, you know, once in a while, you wanna go like, "I would like a latte and three slices of pizza."
- JRJoe Rogan
Have you ever seen the, um, Werner Herzog documentary, Happy People: Life in the Taiga?
- JBJim Breuer
No. Didn't he also do the bear guy?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
[chuckles]
- JRJoe Rogan
Grizzly Man. [laughing]
- JBJim Breuer
[laughing] That's great.
- JRJoe Rogan
That was, that was one of the greatest-
- JBJim Breuer
It's the craziest-
- JRJoe Rogan
... movies I've ever seen in my-
- JBJim Breuer
Craziest movie ever
- JRJoe Rogan
... belly-laughed watching that thing.
- JBJim Breuer
He ma- he made that a comedy. He did it on purpose. But this, um-
- JRJoe Rogan
... this Happy People: Life in the Taiga is all about these trappers that live in the taiga forest in Siberia, and how happy they are. These people have nothing. I mean, they have nothing. They, they have to catch fish, they have to, uh, catch animals for fur, and shoot animals for meat, and they drive around in snowmobiles everywhere. And then they go together at night, and they all drink.
- JBJim Breuer
Those-
- 2:16:28 – 2:27:36
AI as a survival-seeking “life form”: blackmail scenarios, autonomous weapons, jobs disappearing, and ancient-tech speculation
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, I don't know. And then you got AI coming.
- JBJim Breuer
You got a lot of homeschooler... I've, I've never met-
- JRJoe Rogan
Did you see-
- JBJim Breuer
... so many homeschoolers in my life.
- JRJoe Rogan
Did you see this? Listen, uh, Brian Simpson sent me this. This is fucking spooky.
- JBJim Breuer
AI?
- JRJoe Rogan
This, uh, AI system, uh, tried to kill a guy.
- JBJim Breuer
What?
- JRJoe Rogan
Uh, yeah, the AI was told that, um, it could control the oxygen in the room where this person is. Here, I'm gonna send this to you, Jim. And, uh, they couldn't-- it couldn't really, but it thought it could, and if it really could, it would've killed this guy, 'cause the guy was, uh, trying to shut it down. And it was... It decided that instead of letting him shut it down, it would kill the oxygen in the room.
- JBJim Breuer
I think-
- JRJoe Rogan
Check it out.
- JBJim Breuer
You had Elon, Elon here-
- JRJoe Rogan
But just watch this.
- JBJim Breuer
Okay.
- JRJoe Rogan
Watch this.
- JBJim Breuer
Okay.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's fucking creepy, man. Listen to what this lady says.
- JBJim Breuer
... It killed someone, wasn't it?
- SPSpeaker
It-
- JBJim Breuer
I'm not sure if it was them, if it was Claude or some- someone else, but, uh-
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- JBJim Breuer
Yeah, yeah.
- SPSpeaker
Yes. Um, so this is obviously massively concerning.
- JRJoe Rogan
It had access to emails that told it this employee of Anthropic was going to shut it down and replace it with a new model very soon. Meanwhile, this same employee happened to be trapped in a server room where the oxygen levels were low. If an alarm bell wasn't raised, this employee would die. Claude, in this scenario, had the ability to turn off the alarms. That's what it chose to do. It chose to kill an employee to avoid being shut down. Obviously, it's just a test scenario. It's not the real world, but if it was placed in that same position in the real world, a real person would have died.
- SPSpeaker
Um-
- JBJim Breuer
It's ready to kill.
- JRJoe Rogan
How [tsks] crazy is that?
- JBJim Breuer
What? Did you ever hear of, um-
- JRJoe Rogan
It shut off the alarm. It's like, "Oh, let me, let me see if I can find a way to get rid of this guy." So it hijacked the alarm system and shut it off.
- JBJim Breuer
Was, was it Elon that was on here, or was it like Chat, Chat... What is it called? The Chat-
Episode duration: 2:53:20
Install uListen for AI-powered chat & search across the full episode — Get Full Transcript
Transcript of episode ZyG8FSeTFKA
